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"Guns are fine, boost players"

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"Players are fine, boost guns"

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Originally by: CCP Chronotis

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Since this thread continues to fight against the people who derail it into the macro miners witchhunt. I will move it to features and ideas discussion where ...

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Originally by: Gabriel Karade

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Void still works:

Higher optimal range than AM
Higher Thermal damage component

Plus slightly higher base damage. It's more situation specific, but those are definite advantages you can work with.

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"Guns are fine, boost players"

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"Players are fine, boost guns"

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Originally by: Anaalys Fluuterby

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Barrage is still hideously priced and fairly rare also. Mainly because of that nice bump in range you get with it.

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"Guns are fine, boost players"

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"Players are fine, boost guns"

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Originally by: Shadowsword

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Short range ammos indeed need a boost, but your third damage type is so small that it won't make any practical difference.

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Quote:

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"Guns are fine, boost players"

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"Players are fine, boost guns"

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Originally by: Ather Ialeas

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You're spot on, Amarr Navy Multifrequency M and L replaced Conflagration M/L in all my configs and I never bothered to use Gleam S/M/L either because of the tracking penalty (such does NOT belong to a short range BEAM laser lens!).

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Originally by: Grimpak

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Originally by: Shadowsword

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Short range ammos indeed need a boost, but your third damage type is so small that it won't make any practical difference.

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how about the double? (4/8/16)

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Originally by: Butter Dog

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I'd never pre-emtively load void. Ever. Faction antimatter is so much better and almost the same damage (inevitably higher when you factor in the better tracking).

All the short range ammo's are utterly useless. I cannot think of a single reason to use any of them over and above the faction alternatives.

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Originally by: Marcus Quo

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I think the real problem is how easy it is to get the faction ammo. This game has a very clear progression of how good a specific item is, Faction > T2 > T1. T2 is supposedly "average." Now, if faction ammo were super rare, this would all be fine, but it's not at all. In many cases it's hardly more expensive than the T2 version. If faction mods were about the same price as T2, would we see anyone fitting T2 anymore? Hell no.

In short, T2 shouldn't be as good as faction, but faction certainly shouldn't be the standard that everyone uses, so something needs to be done.

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Originally by: Shadowsword

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Originally by: Grimpak

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Originally by: Shadowsword

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Short range ammos indeed need a boost, but your third damage type is so small that it won't make any practical difference.

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how about the double? (4/8/16)

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I'd say it must be the primary damage type, and the pseudo-scientists saying that a laser can't do explosive or kinetic (as if they could do Em in the first place) can go to hell.


But imho, different damage types isn't the best way to make them usefull. Espescially for lasers, the problem of damage types isn't something you should have to skill for the use of T2 stuff, to see corrected. I'd rather see half the penalties inversed and converted into bonus, so you'd have a ammo that gives both bonuses and penalties. Having ammos increasing your speed would be insanely overpowered, but if, for example, they still slow you but increase your tracking...

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Originally by: Karyuudo Tydraad

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Originally by: Ather Ialeas

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You're spot on, Amarr Navy Multifrequency M and L replaced Conflagration M/L in all my configs and I never bothered to use Gleam S/M/L either because of the tracking penalty (such does NOT belong to a short range BEAM laser lens!).

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Really? In PVP I don't use faction ammunition in most scenarios. And I'll explain why.

Amarr Navy Multifrequency L - 32.2 EM damage, 23 Thermal damage

Conflagration L - 28 EM damage, 28 Thermal damage

Amarr Navy Radio L - 23 EM damage

Scorch L - 36 EM damage, 8 Thermal damage

Faction ammunition has higher concentrations of your racial damage type (and lower damage), which, in the case of the Amarr laser boats, is not something you want.

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Originally by: Nian Banks

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In regards to kinetic damage been caused with lasers, that actually is exactly what a particle beam laser is. Here's an old link on the theories of laser / energy weapons. Introducing the Particle-Beam Weapon

Basically its quite plausible to charge and propel atoms within a laser beam. I said several times in other threads that there should be t1 and t2 crystals with some kinetic damage. Naturally you must have EM and Thermal with those crystals. Another issue is that because of the nature of those lasers, your crystals would break down quickly and need regular replacement.

Another issue with the EvE lasers is that there is not one crystal with thermal as the dominant damage type, that needs to be fixed. If anything thermal is actually the more common damage in lasers, EM is more a by-product.


On Projectile ammunition, All I would ever want was to have the Depleted Uranium ammunition given a bonus to falloff +30%?. Its meant to be the most popular ammunition for minmatar, that to me says its made for autocannnons. Also its not exactly the most commonly used, who uses it? Carries it? Anyone?

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Originally by: Shadowsword

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Edited by: Shadowsword on 15/09/2007 08:54:57

Originally by: Nian Banks

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In regards to kinetic damage been caused with lasers, that actually is exactly what a particle beam laser is. Here's an old link on the theories of laser / energy weapons. Introducing the Particle-Beam Weapon

Basically its quite plausible to charge and propel atoms within a laser beam. I said several times in other threads that there should be t1 and t2 crystals with some kinetic damage. Naturally you must have EM and Thermal with those crystals. Another issue is that because of the nature of those lasers, your crystals would break down quickly and need regular replacement.

Another issue with the EvE lasers is that there is not one crystal with thermal as the dominant damage type, that needs to be fixed. If anything thermal is actually the more common damage in lasers, EM is more a by-product.


On Projectile ammunition, All I would ever want was to have the Depleted Uranium ammunition given a bonus to falloff +30%?. Its meant to be the most popular ammunition for minmatar, that to me says its made for autocannnons. Also its not exactly the most commonly used, who uses it? Carries it? Anyone?

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From a realistic pov, you don't even need to bring particles projection to have kinetic or explosive damage, because there is only two real forms of energy transfer: kinetic energy, and radiations. The so-called "explosive damage" is just a mix of kinetic (shrapnels and pressure waves caused by solid dilatation in a solid environment) and radiations (thermal ones, mainly).

Now, about lasers: They're thermal radiations. If you heat something, it dilates. But heat something fast enough, and the dilatation and melting won't have time to happen, it will vaporize explosively. There you have your explosion (projected gazes and thermal bloom) and your kinetic damage (gazes and schrapnels).

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Originally by: Butter Dog

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I'd never pre-emtively load void. Ever. Faction antimatter is so much better and almost the same damage (inevitably higher when you factor in the better tracking).

All the short range ammo's are utterly useless. I cannot think of a single reason to use any of them over and above the faction alternatives.

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