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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 13 post(s) |
Valeo Galaem
New Eden Advanced Reconnaissance Unit
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Posted - 2007.10.30 18:49:00 -
[31]
Originally by: Sertan Deras Soo, uhh, question. All this new pretty UI stuff is great, but is anything being done about the performance issues that the UI causes? For instance, when jumping with a fleet, the client will lock up for 10-15 seconds while the UI tries to catch up with all the people entering local. This is not cool.
I would rather have a minimal UI that doesn't lock me up, than a pretty UI that does (and no, it's not my system, my system is plenty fast enough and I am not the only one with this issue).
That has little to do with the UI. It is caused from the current graphics engine not allowing the game to do anything else until it has loaded all of the objects and models into memory. The new graphics engine (everyone gets it - engine =/= new models) fixes this.
Thar be Pirates
You are not authorised to hack into CONCORD's mainframe Your Wallet has been emptied!
CONCORD Encryption Methods |
Cannizza
BGG League of Abnormal Gentlemen
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Posted - 2007.10.30 18:50:00 -
[32]
Sounds very good!!
Just one question about eve voice though.
How are you going to manage it over several accounts? say 3-5 accounts on at the same time?
Also, can you make the locked targets moveable too?
Thanks
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QwaarJet
Gallente hirr Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2007.10.30 18:51:00 -
[33]
I still doubt that any alliance of note is going to bother with EVE Voice.
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blkmajik
ZiTek Deepspace Explorations Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2007.10.30 18:54:00 -
[34]
Edited by: blkmajik on 30/10/2007 18:58:49 A major improvement :) Here's a few additional suggestions, and big problems that may prevent adoption:
1) Can the voice client run as a program detached from the EVE client? Until this is done, I don't expect any major player organizations to make the switch. In the case of client crashes, node crashes, or when we are at places where we cant log in to game, but can still use our TS or Vent services, its very useful to have a voice client that is not bound to the EVE client. I know managing fleet membership/position will be a complicated issue to solve with respect of gangmembers game clients crashing and allowing them to still communicate, but that leads me to....
2) Saving gang membership state. If a gang member gets disconnected or crashes, they have log back in, ask for an invite, get put in the right position, etc; even if the disco was just for a minute or two. Why not have a grace timer to remember their fleet status if they log in during the next 5 mins or so? Similar to agro timers, but for fleet membership. This would have to be indicated in the fleet windows, obviously.
3) In the watch list and broadcast list, could the distance of the target be shown, if its on the grid? When someone broadcasts a target or requests assistance, sometimes I spend valuable time finding them in the overview (assuming they are there with my settings), just to realize they are +100km away. Seeing this up-front would be HUGE and would allow FC's to call targets on separate corners of the battlefield simultaneously, giving players with limited range more utility.
4) After every fleet engagement, the FC's spend lots of time assessing who is still alive and in what, who lost what, how fast they can get back in a new ship on the field, etc. Why not just have shiptypes shown in the fleet window? No need to assess damages verbally. All the info would be right there. This view would have to be limited to FC's, WC's and maybe SC's, obviously.
But over all, a big step in the right direction. Great work!
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Reticenti
The Antilles Legion Quantum Star Alliance
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Posted - 2007.10.30 19:01:00 -
[35]
Originally by: blkmajik Edited by: blkmajik on 30/10/2007 18:58:49 A major improvement :) Here's a few additional suggestions, and big problems that may prevent adoption:
1) Can the voice client run as a program detached from the EVE client? Until this is done, I don't expect any major player organizations to make the switch. In the case of client crashes, node crashes, or when we are at places where we cant log in to game, but can still use our TS or Vent services, its very useful to have a voice client that is not bound to the EVE client. I know managing fleet membership/position will be a complicated issue to solve with respect of gangmembers game clients crashing and allowing them to still communicate, but that leads me to....
2) Saving gang membership state. If a gang member gets disconnected or crashes, they have log back in, ask for an invite, get put in the right position, etc; even if the disco was just for a minute or two. Why not have a grace timer to remember their fleet status if they log in during the next 5 mins or so? Similar to agro timers, but for fleet membership. This would have to be indicated in the fleet windows, obviously.
3) In the watch list and broadcast list, could the distance of the target be shown, if its on the grid? When someone broadcasts a target or requests assistance, sometimes I spend valuable time finding them in the overview (assuming they are there with my settings), just to realize they are +100km away. Seeing this up-front would be HUGE and would allow FC's to call targets on separate corners of the battlefield simultaneously, giving players with limited range more utility.
4) After every fleet engagement, the FC's spend lots of time assessing who is still alive and in what, who lost what, how fast they can get back in a new ship on the field, etc. Why not just have shiptypes shown in the fleet window? No need to assess damages verbally. All the info would be right there. This view would have to be limited to FC's, WC's and maybe SC's, obviously.
But over all, a big step in the right direction. Great work!
This post wins
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Sertan Deras
Gallente Merch Industrial GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2007.10.30 19:04:00 -
[36]
Originally by: Valeo Galaem
Originally by: Sertan Deras Soo, uhh, question. All this new pretty UI stuff is great, but is anything being done about the performance issues that the UI causes? For instance, when jumping with a fleet, the client will lock up for 10-15 seconds while the UI tries to catch up with all the people entering local. This is not cool.
I would rather have a minimal UI that doesn't lock me up, than a pretty UI that does (and no, it's not my system, my system is plenty fast enough and I am not the only one with this issue).
That has little to do with the UI. It is caused from the current graphics engine not allowing the game to do anything else until it has loaded all of the objects and models into memory. The new graphics engine (everyone gets it - engine =/= new models) fixes this.
I hope you're right :)
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Louis DelaBlanche
Cosmic Odyssey YouWhat
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Posted - 2007.10.30 19:06:00 -
[37]
UI changes sound kewl. The right of my screen really does get crowded when u got fleet + drones + overview etc. One question though. Will the Ui boxes be minimiseable? & will the remember where they were placed on screen like with chat channels? Would be kewl if could collapse the boxes we dont need to the bottom of the screen then quickly reaccess them when needs be.
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Xaen
Caldari Caldari Provisions
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Posted - 2007.10.30 19:13:00 -
[38]
A good start. But as is evident in my sig link, there's a great deal of room for improvement in the UI as a whole.
I'll even give you an easy thing to start with: Remove all "OK" button-only dialogs. Replace them with say....a status window that you can dump all the combat/information to. Have you guys ever looked at WoW's chat/text window config? It's farking amazing. And it's not patented (hint, hint).
I checked out the changes the other day on Singularity, there are what - three new hotkeys? --
Support fixing the EVE UI
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Xaen
Caldari Caldari Provisions
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Posted - 2007.10.30 19:14:00 -
[39]
Originally by: Valeo Galaem That has little to do with the UI. It is caused from the current graphics engine not allowing the game to do anything else until it has loaded all of the objects and models into memory. The new graphics engine (everyone gets it - engine =/= new models) fixes this.
It has everything to do with the UI. The UI is operating in the same thread as the rest of the game. Get it in it's own thread and the problem is solved. MVC pattern, guys.
IAASE (I Am a Software Engineer) --
Support fixing the EVE UI
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Ztrain
Evolution Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.10.30 19:22:00 -
[40]
Originally by: Sir JoJo Some rly nice changes.
however the voice part is as u say sounding rly rly nice and for many it will be a great add. but as long as it cant be used while not logged in for enomorus reasons it wont replace ts or vent!
Agreed movable windows is a good thing. It's nice to see that EVE is starting to incorporate basic features other MMO's had over 5 years ago.
As far as voice, I tried it when they had the free trial. The lag with it was kinda anoying but the sound quality was decent. Have not tried it since they supposedly improved it so it may work out rather well.
Only issue is like stated above, if your not in game then your not on voice. So when the stability of the servers is in question no voice. During DT unexpected or not no voice. If you have multiple accounts you have to purchase it for each of them or guess what no voice. By having the voice communications tied in to the game itself I see it having way too many drawback implementation wise to make it useful. I guess it could be kinda useful in pickup groups..... Ohh wait do we have thoes in EVE?
Z
Originally by: CCP Zulupark That's the rough idea, yes. We still have in no way started thinking about what modules to introduce, what they would do or anything of the likes, but the idea is that.
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Breathing
The Edge Institute
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Posted - 2007.10.30 19:32:00 -
[41]
Originally by: Ztrain if your not in game then your not on voice. So when the stability of the servers is in question no voice. During DT unexpected or not no voice. If you have multiple accounts you have to purchase it for each of them or guess what no voice. By having the voice communications tied in to the game itself I see it having way too many drawback implementation wise to make it useful. Z
What he said, and:
For voice comms to be really useful then pretty much everyone in the op needs to be on them. As long as its a seperate charge / cost, then not everyone WILL be on them. Hence in order to get EVERYONE on voice comms its much easier just to get another server where most people can use it completely for free.
This is the primary drawback, and unless you find a way to integrate it in to the normal subscription charge it will be a slow long battle to make it standard for everyone.
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Matalino
Gallente Ki Tech Industries
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Posted - 2007.10.30 19:33:00 -
[42]
Please tell me that you have made the overview opaque to mouse clicks.
It is annoying to select a target in the overview only to find that it has targeted something else because it happened to be at that point in space behind your overview.
If I want to click on something in space, then I will move my camera so that it is no longer behind the overview. If I click in side the overview box then I want the click registered on that overview item, not on the item in space that happens to be located behind the overview.
Keep the transparent appearance, but lose the transparent mouse clicking.
************************** Datacore Harvesting IPO |
Xaen
Caldari Caldari Provisions
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Posted - 2007.10.30 19:36:00 -
[43]
Originally by: Matalino Please tell me that you have made the overview opaque to mouse clicks.
It is annoying to select a target in the overview only to find that it has targeted something else because it happened to be at that point in space behind your overview.
If I want to click on something in space, then I will move my camera so that it is no longer behind the overview. If I click in side the overview box then I want the click registered on that overview item, not on the item in space that happens to be located behind the overview.
Keep the transparent appearance, but lose the transparent mouse clicking.
I think they did, actually. Or at least you can clicke the opacity button on the overview and force it.
Check it out on singularity for yourself. --
Support fixing the EVE UI
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Mitchman
Omniscient Order Cruel Intentions
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Posted - 2007.10.30 19:41:00 -
[44]
The question I have in all this, which looks nice btw, is how much extra lag will this introduce? Currently, having a fleet adds so much extra lag that we often opt for using a normal gang without fleet bonuses just to be able to play at all! Fix the lag first, please.
New video: Pride, Honor & Retribution
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Carsidava
Ars ex Discordia GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2007.10.30 19:42:00 -
[45]
I don't know if this is a UI issue or not, but would it be possible to have a "rescind" type of broadcast? It's all too common to have someone broadcast that they need armor repaired, and then even after they're fully repped (and depending on how often broadcasts are used, well after they've left the fleet) their broadcast is still there. How about some kind of broadcast removal option? |
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CCP Zulupark
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Posted - 2007.10.30 19:44:00 -
[46]
To answer some questions that have risen:
Stand alone EVE Voice client: EVE Voice is in constant development (like all of EVE) and there is nothing that says we won't implement this feature sometime soon. For this iteration it would however have meant far too much programming time.
Locked targets overlap everything: We know, it's a bug, it'll get fixed :)
New UI and more lag?: The UI was re-written in parts and optimized so if there is any performance change, it should be for the better.
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Moraguth
Amarr Shiva Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2007.10.30 19:53:00 -
[47]
Hola Zulu, I think this dev blog will get a much better response than your last one, from me too. So, I remember way back in the day, YEARS ago, when we could move everything on the HUD. It got changed to it's current iteration in the UI in the name of lag.
Here's my question:
Is the new engine going to fix the problems of modal HUD UI windows that we had back in the day, or should we expect some new lag to appear because of this step back to the good 'ol days?
Thanks! good game
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Niccolado Starwalker
Shadow Templars
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Posted - 2007.10.30 19:55:00 -
[48]
OOOHHHHhhhhh... SHINY!!!!!!
Sarah McTeef: You all should really try and stay on topic. Which when I last checked, was my grocery list |
Udyr Vulpayne
Amarr PIE Inc.
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Posted - 2007.10.30 19:57:00 -
[49]
horrible arbitrator setup but other than that it looks pretty good.
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Icome4u
Caldari Dark and Light inc. D-L
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Posted - 2007.10.30 19:58:00 -
[50]
When i saw it had UI and Zulu in the same sentence i almost freaked out...
Still a lot of work to do CCP, but its a big step foward!
Thank You.
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CCP Zulupark
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Posted - 2007.10.30 19:59:00 -
[51]
Originally by: Shadowsword This sound pretty nice, but I have one suggestion: Allow fleet members to move themselves into empty positions. It would make fleet organisation so much easier and faster...
This is actually being implemented in this expansion :)
The fleet commander will be able to put his fleet in 'open' mode, and then all members can move themselves into any open squad, or any open squad commander position.
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Ztrain
Evolution Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.10.30 20:06:00 -
[52]
Originally by: Moraguth I remember way back in the day, YEARS ago, when we could move everything on the HUD. It got changed to it's current iteration in the UI in the name of lag.
Here's my question:
Is the new engine going to fix the problems of modal HUD UI windows that we had back in the day, or should we expect some new lag to appear because of this step back to the good 'ol days?
Thanks!
Having read this I think a little code Gnome just died somewhere. Having fixed vs floating window caused lag? We're *****ing up laughing over this one.
Z
Originally by: CCP Zulupark That's the rough idea, yes. We still have in no way started thinking about what modules to introduce, what they would do or anything of the likes, but the idea is that.
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Ephemeral Waves
The Nine Gates
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Posted - 2007.10.30 20:09:00 -
[53]
Just kill eve-voice and then the rest of your blog looks good.
Eph.
I make sigs |
Maaku
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Posted - 2007.10.30 20:13:00 -
[54]
Originally by: CCP Zulupark The fleet commander will be able to put his fleet in 'open' mode, and then all members can move themselves into any open squad, or any open squad commander position.
The sobs of joy you are now hearing are coming from fleet commanders all over EVE.
Might make for some security issues, but overall this will really help FC's get fleets set up quickly if it works.
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brinelan
Caldari Victory Not Vengeance Intrepid Crossing
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Posted - 2007.10.30 20:41:00 -
[55]
Edited by: brinelan on 30/10/2007 20:45:37 AWESOME changes. I do agree that there needs to be a warp scrambler / webber indicator and an ecm indicator.
Suggestion: make damage messages be movable also so we can see who is hitting us, and with what and for how much without having to learn to speed read. Maybe an option to have this go to its own window/windows as defined by the user. Leaving this up to the individual user would allow the people who want it minimal to have something like there is today, while others can have damage done / being done to you a bit more visible.
The addition of WHY you arent getting bonuses will rock as well. I see a ton of threads about that.
Keep up the good work, this trinity graphics engine update keeps getting better and better. --------------------------
Some days you're the bug, some days you're the windshield |
Landarian
Spaceways Provisioning Company
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Posted - 2007.10.30 20:44:00 -
[56]
Until EVE Voice is free and works outside of the game client when the servers are down, the chances of it replacing TS or Vent are as near to nil as makes no odds I'm afraid. I like the UI changes so far but I'm with one of the other posters - user modifiable UI skins would be spectacular
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Kweel Nakashyn
Minmatar Aeden Tau Ceti Federation
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Posted - 2007.10.30 20:48:00 -
[57]
Well it looks very complicated, we will see on the use... I may not be the first, but drones controls buttons are yet to be implemented in this UI, right ?
2isk
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Kweel Nakashyn
Minmatar Aeden Tau Ceti Federation
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Posted - 2007.10.30 20:49:00 -
[58]
Originally by: CCP Zulupark
Originally by: Shadowsword This sound pretty nice, but I have one suggestion: Allow fleet members to move themselves into empty positions. It would make fleet organisation so much easier and faster...
This is actually being implemented in this expansion :)
The fleet commander will be able to put his fleet in 'open' mode, and then all members can move themselves into any open squad, or any open squad commander position.
O M G...
CCP = heroes of modern times :) 2isk
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Torillan
Interstellar Cowards
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Posted - 2007.10.30 20:55:00 -
[59]
Interesting changes.
While at it it would be lovely to be able to un-pin the center controls (modules/shield/armor/cap-display) and ie. drag it off to the corner. And perhaps the ability to hide the left-most buttons like the autopilot/tactical-grid/etc buttons, I hardly ever use the buttons, much more the keyboard shortcuts.
With the UI revamp, my highest wish would be more keyboard control, or perhaps more precisely: Less mousing-around and right-clicking in all different places on the screen. Perhaps a way to navigate in overview and between locked targets with keyboard?
I can always dream! The changes so far on the test server looks promising, and in the right direction! *thumbs up*
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Frug
Zenithal Harvest
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Posted - 2007.10.30 21:04:00 -
[60]
I'm gonna be negative this time and say great, you've started to do some stuff to the eve UI. Why? Because of voice? Really? That's why you finally took a look at the UI?
And what about the rest of the usability issues with the eve interface? You surely must be aware of some of the most common complaints people have (modules hard to see when active).
This is nice but it's hardly sufficient.
- - - - - - - - - Do not use dotted lines - - - - - - - If you think I'm awesome, say BOOO BOOO!! - Ductoris Neat look what I found - Kreul Hey, my marbles |
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