Hulks are a little tougher, but killing 3 per Tornado is not particularly difficult, especially if you know what their tank looks like.

Have anyone ever done it ?How ??
:)

This is UTTER BS. Show API verified kilmail or it's not real..........................

Oh, and YOU need better support after ganking my Mack last year and I was able to loot and salvage MY OWN MACK with Orca as they were way too slow or something. I came out 5 Mill on the POSITIVE side after Insurance.

BTW, the ONLY way you got me was hitting me while I was fighting rats and distracted.

"Let's kill...even obvious Non-bots".

DAAAMMMMMN.......look at how ENLIGHTENED you are now, Krixtal Icefluxor.

Unfortunately, the KB just flipped over to February and doesn't like linking directly to Buck Futz's January's total. Its all there though. Tornados rip through Exhumers like a knife through butter.

And like I said, when I ganked you over a year ago -you obviously don't know what you are talking about.

You were killed by a solo-Tempest, which I salvaged and looted after it was Concorded.

There were no 'other' ships involved - thats what a 'solo gank' means. Thus you couldn't have possibly come out positive and are making things up to make yourself feel better. Kind of sad, considering you were ganked.

You managed to scoop and salvage your own Mackinaw. Good for you - not too difficult since your Orca was literally right there, and the salvager was over 15km away (busy looting the Tempest after providing a warp-in point).

Your story simply doesn't hold water. Nice try though.

And who is going to believe whom ? The 'innocent' miner....or the padded KB monkey ????

No such thing as an innocent miner, they are all guilty of stupidity by default

It really depends on the fittings of the hulk.

A smart hulkaggedon hulk, with support, will have almost 25K EHP, which means you are lucking and in 0.5, you will not be able to kill him without blowing up.

Unfortunately, the KB just flipped over to February and doesn't like linking directly to Buck Futz's January's total. Its all there though. Tornados rip through Exhumers like a knife through butter.

Spank blew up my Hulk but he needed the help of 3 other people to do it...

inb4 Spank bans me from every ingame channel he has mod too.

Oh wait spank already did that when I pointed out he cant run for CSM.

if they have 2 Meta (X) Invulns and 5 Shield Rep Drones buzzing about from the support Orca, you'll need to bring more firepower and demonstrate the futility of their efforts.

No such thing as an innocent miner, they are all guilty of stupidity by default

A hulk can pull off more than 25K EHP if it is in fleet with a well-trained Orca pilot providing boosts from the following modules:

Armored Warfare Link - Passive Defense
Siege Warfare Link - Shield Hormonizing
Skirmish Warfare Link - Evasive Maneuvering

That's not taking overheat into account.

No such thing as an innocent miner, they are all guilty of stupidity by default

That mindset is THE major issue ingame. Not mining, not ganking, not PvP.

That MINDSET.

It's the same as people who kill innocent civilians during wartime. No difference.

Don't bother if they have 2 Meta (X) Invulns and 5 Shield Rep Drones buzzing about from the support Orca. ';;'

This actually applies to Macks as well, as 'someone' recently found out.

That mindset is THE major issue ingame. Not mining, not ganking, not PvP.

That MINDSET.

It's the same as people who kill innocent civilians during wartime. No difference.

**** miners, have NPC seed minerals at outragous prices to create a new isk sink and remove exhumers from game. Problem solved. No more lossing your expensive paper thin tank ships which the only reason to fly them is to act the part of a goat tied down to an asteroid field and just die (like that scene from Jurrasic Park), no more easier KM padding and you hurt their precious gamer score because they now have to play the game on more then Hello Kitty Mode for easy kills.

I wasn't even aware that Hello Kitty *had* a PvP mode....let alone one where you could easily rampage through and slaughter other players on a whim.....

Oh, you can easily do this in crowded 0.7 ice belts. In theory, things could get pretty ugly in 0.5. You could probably manage to kill 6+ per Tornado there, but finding enough targets can be difficult....

Well, you see..

One of them is in a video game about spaceships, the other is real life.

I'd ask you to stop being an idiot, but seeing as you think mining in high sec is a profitable activity... Probably not a good call.

You are the one that was obviously upset about it, as you scream about it everytime I post on the subject.

Linking V lets you still see the last 10 kills.

On 27-01 at 23:13 he seems to have killed three Mackinaws and a Bestower in one run.

Only Mackinaws, not Hulks, but still a nice achievement.

This is the FIRST time. Liar. As usual.

BTW, the Naga pops the Macks MUCH faster.

This is UTTER BS. Show API verified kilmail or it's not real..........................

Oh, and YOU need better support after ganking my Mack last year and I was able to loot and salvage MY OWN MACK with Orca as they were way too slow or something. I came out 5 Mill on the POSITIVE side after Insurance.

BTW, the ONLY way you got me was hitting me while I was fighting rats and distracted.

"Let's kill...even obvious Non-bots".

so i see your tactics. you are using groups of 2 guns? or getting a second volley off with groups of 4. although in a 0.7 you probably wont get a second volley which means you are more liely to be going 4 groups of 2 guns. and you pop stuff at the same time meaning volleys off within 5 seconds of eachother.

question is:

how are you making money off this? a nado fit up like yours is costing around 70-80m.

if you only pop 3 then you are still gonna lose a lot of isk simply because t2 salvage isnt guaranteed...

we popped 5 macks yesterday and not a single one dropped t2 salvage. my alt has t1 salvagers with salvage 4 and 3 rigs on though. do you get an increased chance of t2 salvage by having level 5 and t2 salvagers? or does it just make it faster to get the chance...

This is the FIRST time. Liar. As usual.

BTW, the Naga pops the Macks MUCH faster.

I want miners to burn brightly - especially after all the ****** up carebear-coddling mechanic changes lately.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5dYI_S0vDU8

Looks awesome...

Use a Velator:

http://eve.battleclinic.com/killboard/killmail.php?id=14858034

Right. Like Tier 3 Cruisers. I am SOOOOOOO coddled.

B S

Damage received: 4,486

So, with regards to soloing hulks, macks, and ganks in general, I'm curious about the following scenario:

Lets say I find a friend/alt in a salvage boat to come along with me. First, I get in a noobship and shoot them, causing concord to come destroy my reaper (sad day). Now, I warp to a BM in the middle of nowhere, where I have left a Tornado fitted for ganking hulks.

Since I already have GCC, will concord destroy me if I board my new ship?
If not, will they be slower to respond when I start ganking if I ALREADY have GCC?

To recap, once in a pod, can I switch ships with global aggression, and will that help my gank/allow me to gank more ships before getting blown up again?

Don't bother if they have 2 Meta (X) Invulns and 5 Shield Rep Drones buzzing about from the support Orca. ';;'

This actually applies to Macks as well, as 'someone' recently found out.

Am I the only one that finds it ironic that people criticize miners for doing something that makes little isk by engaging in an activity, IE ganking miners, that makes even less ISK per hour than the miners do?

Ok, I ran the test - you CANNOT BOARD A SHIP if you have GCC. Damn.

did you seriously just claim that isk/hour is what matters in ganking

this is why we murder you

Confirming that people that gank do so exclusively and certainly don't do it because this is a videogame and they find it entertaining.

Confirming that people that gank do so exclusively and certainly don't do it because this is a videogame and they find it entertaining.

The absurd logic is that something has to be profitable. Maybe some people take offense at miners for doing lowly work but it doesn't mean they shouldn't be treated as target practice just because that also doesn't make money (although it does). At any rate, mining is so disengaged an activity that a macro can do it better than a human being. Ganking at least means you are enjoying yourself.

If you enjoy mining then more power to you.

The absurd logic is that something has to be profitable. Maybe some people take offense at miners for doing lowly work but it doesn't mean they shouldn't be treated as target practice just because that also doesn't make money (although it does). At any rate, mining is so disengaged an activity that a macro can do it better than a human being. Ganking at least means you are enjoying yourself.

If you enjoy mining then more power to you.

This is all well and good except I didn't make the case that ganking is profitable or a wise use of time, the simpletons in this thread were the ones making a pathetic attempt at that. Complain to them if you don't like my post.

As for mining, it is a complete waste of my talent, I made more in the last two days in Jita than a miner can make in a month. Although being a right and proper stock jobber, I'd be happy to buy their ore and ship it wherever my clients like for a handsome profit.

Yeah, so what? Making ISK via trade is dead easy. Personally, I think there needs to be a big increase in the transaction Tax - from 0.5% up to at least 10-15%.

Yeah, so what? Making ISK via trade is dead easy. Personally, I think there needs to be a big increase in the transaction Tax - from 0.5% up to at least 10-15%. The question is, when you are sitting on hundreds of billions - what do you do with it, other than play for free via PLEX? Yeah, I could personally gank at a loss without any trouble. I even use that ISK to pay other TEARS members a 75M bounty - every time they kill a Mackinaw that hasn't paid tribute.

The point I was trying to make is you DONT have to gank at a loss. You can earn ISK doing it, and that makes the game of killing Exhumers affordable to FAR more players. And I want to see the maximum amount of participation from others as well....

I also noticed a tweet from CCP: apparently TEARS Alliance has killed the most hi-sec Exhumers in January with 169 down, with Smodab's crew posting in at 130 something. We hope to improve on that this month.

Hi,

I'm going to make a stupid off topic comment in this thread because im a massively sandy vag.

And we all know that 75M is veritable king's ransom! We have already drenched the mining profession with tears in this thread, now we are going to cry because station traders make money too. Never mind basic economics which says additional taxes will simply be added to the prices end users pay. Where does it all end? I'm calling CCP right now, I am ordering their programmers and engineers to work overtime this weekend to make sure you have a manhood of 15" added to your avatar, you obviously need it in order to feel better about yourself.

So, I am posting about how to gank miners, in a thread about how to gank miners.

You are posting off-topic about how space-rich you are, for what reason, I fail to grasp.

And I'm the one waving the e-peen?

Tard.

So, I am posting about how to gank miners, in a thread about how to gank miners.

You are posting off-topic about how space-rich you are, for what reason, I fail to grasp.

And I'm the one waving the e-peen?

Tard.

He's one of those close minded morons, convinced of their superior intellect.

I apologize that you feel intimidated by someone who posts above the third grade level. With that in mind, I have a four year old here, I asked him to tell me what I should call you in response to your assertion that I am a "close minded moron".

He said you are a "stinky pants doo doo head". I hope that is on your level and we can have further dialogue.

I apologize that you feel intimidated by someone who posts above the third grade level. With that in mind, I have a four year old here, I asked him to tell me what I should call you in response to your assertion that I am a "close minded moron".

He said you are a "stinky pants doo doo head". I hope that is on your level and we can have further dialogue.

So, if you aren't a miner and you aren't a ganker, why are you even posting here?

Its not 'how much' ISK you make - its HOW its made.

Some people like instapopping Hulks and Macks, and pulling ISK from their smoking wreckage - then selling those same miners brand new Hulks and Macks - then tracking and popping them again until they quit EVE.

Others like sitting in Jita and playing 0.01 ISK games all day long with the market bots.

Earning 120-150B+ via trade isn't particularly hard, or even worth bragging about. I know, because I've done it. It literally requires the brainpower of a chimp - so congrats. You are on par with a lower primate.

And ganking Exhumers doesn't require profit - only to generate tears and rage-quits. But earning some extra ISK in the bargain sure as hell doesn't hurt.

Boy, you really bent over something that happened a long-ass time ago.

a) not so difficult to loot your own Mack when the Orca is sitting right there.
b) I recovered my own Tempest wreck, you don't have to lie about it again to make yourself feel better.
c) coming out positive? nice try, nobody is going to believe that. Macks are expensive and have Retriever insurance.

But thats all ancient history, back in the sucky, one kill at a time, insured-Tempest era.

Oh, but if you don't think a Tornado can't wrack up multiple kills, you are an idiot.

Buck Futz for month of January:
http://y0ink.us/killboard/?a=home&y=2012&m=1

Thats nearly 40 Billion in damage in about a month of on and off ganking. Only a few Typhoon SB and dessie kills mixed in, the vast majority are Tornado kills, generally in 0.7, and generally at a rate of between 2 and 3 Exhumers per Tornado. (I've gotten better as I've improved my tactics - also, Gallente ice belts have tanked Exhumers due to the recent Goon interdiction - I'm sure I could post an even better ratio in Caldari space.

DAAAMMMMMN.......look at how stupid you are now, Krixtal Icefluxor.

ganking miners may not be overly challenging but it sure as hell is a lot more thought and skill intensive than trying to gank a rock

You don't have to take a loss. You can actually do this stuff profitably - without getting insurance.
I don't think CCP has quite realized the full ganking potential of the Tornado - or just how insanely destructive it is. FAR better than the old Tempests, and not just because they fit inside an Orca. Its like they are trolling miners or something.

Brutixes kind of suck because you can only realistically kill one target at a time. Thoraxes, same, but at least the are cheaper.
Use the Tornado and kill at least 2 or 3 Mackinaws on each run, and earn some ISK.
Kill 4 or more and make a lot of ISK. (provided you are able to loot and salvage effectively.)
Hulks are a little tougher, but killing 3 per Tornado is not particularly difficult, especially if you know what their tank looks like.

Oh, you can easily do this in crowded 0.7 ice belts. In theory, things could get pretty ugly in 0.5. You could probably manage to kill 6+ per Tornado there, but finding enough targets can be difficult....

I really like the Tornado, spent some time testing it on the test server. Can kill 2 machs. If your lucky it can alpha todeath an untanked hulk with a single shot vs a noob. I really like that fact. I am near maxed in the tornado. The max that is possible is about 20k damage with 2 shots. So even a decently tanked hulk will die. Max tanked hulks get up to about 25k, they can be killed with a gallente tear 3 BC. I also can do about 1500 DPS with that ship.

I've had a lot of success with the Talos. Hulks, even decently tanked ones, stood no chance. 8 T2 neutrons with void and 4 T2 mag stabs (maybe a point or two if you're going after a few ships) and you're done. Cost is around 70 mil to fit it out, but you can easily get 2 hulks with it in a 0.6. Fair warning, scan your prey to make sure they aren't uber tanked, just in case.

Also: http://poeticstanziel.blogspot.com/2011/10/goonswarm-guide-to-highsec-ganking.html

Mitten's guide to ganking things as brought to you by the one and only Poetic Stanziel

The whole reason to do it is several reasons. They are easy, people in highsec think they are safe, some people don't have a lot of time to roam for several hours to get some kills in 0.0, and most of the time it is just blobs online. The tears you get from ganking a miner can be better then most reactions. I have college so I can not be bothered to put several hours into a game in a fleet or to find somebody that doesn't want to die. Surprise kills are sometimes all we have time for.

Many times I have pirated, done 0.0, flown in gangs, gotten solo kills vs fleets. Sometimes you get tired of doing the same thing over again. Ever since the implants can now be seen in km's I have enjoyed that. Doesn't make me any more less skilled a few months ago when I use to solo people. Possibly a little more rusty at it. It just is not as fun anymore and I got tired of waiting all day just to find decent fights. Just because I have a page or 2 of just pods or somebody with several pages of exumer kills doesn't make them bad pilots. The point really is, a kill is a kill. If your good at it why stop if you don't like what they do?

Everybody is just objective because they don't like how somebody gets a kill. There is no wrong way in this game. Good luck stopping those sort of people who are above the law. I do it all, however and whenever I wish to play the game. Nobody tells me how to play a game to have fun. I just do what I feel like doing at the time and soon that will change too.

I've had a lot of success with the Talos. Hulks, even decently tanked ones, stood no chance. 8 T2 neutrons with void and 4 T2 mag stabs (maybe a point or two if you're going after a few ships) and you're done. Cost is around 70 mil to fit it out, but you can easily get 2 hulks with it in a 0.6. Fair warning, scan your prey to make sure they aren't uber tanked, just in case.l

i'm -10

ganking now, ganking forever

IMHO, the Talos is the most brutal suicide ganking vessel available today.

I wrote a guide to fighting hulkageddon, that includes how to actually tank a hulk against suicide attacks.

It provides a lot of useful information, for both the ganker to gank, and the gankee to survive.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5dYI_S0vDU8

Looks awesome...

Perhaps you are feeding disinformation, but if you believe the Talos is the best ganking boat out there - you are WAY off base. Especially in context of Hulkaggedon. Talos excels at one thing - dropping three of them on a badly fit Orca, point blank range.

Tornados are far and away better. If CCP understood just HOW much better they'd probably break out the nerf bat, because they are only hugging carebear nutsak these days. Most Torandos don't get used to the most of their capabilities yet, and STILL outsell the Talos by a huge margin - what 5 to 1?

Perhaps you are feeding disinformation, but if you believe the Talos is the best ganking boat out there - you are WAY off base. Especially in context of Hulkaggedon. Talos excels at one thing - dropping three of them on a badly fit Orca, point blank range.

Tornados are far and away better. If CCP understood just HOW much better they'd probably break out the nerf bat, because they are only hugging carebear nutsak these days. Most Torandos don't get used to the most of their capabilities yet, and STILL outsell the Talos by a huge margin - what 5 to 1?

http://eve.battleclinic.com/killboard/combat_record.php?type=player&name=Trader+102
10 macks and a pod with 1 phoon in 0.7 system. sadly i miscalculated and only got 1 pod. useing a disco phoon fit witch takes less then 9 days to train and fit with a fresh minmatar char. total cost of phoon and fit when bought: 75m

Fair point. The Tornado DOES get extremely high alpha and single hulks (and most other indy ships) don't stand a chance. The cycle time on 1400's however is stupid long, so if you're going after multiple targets that are ******** enough to stick close together, the Talos does the job QUITE well. Overheated, the blasters get a damage bonus, and since they have a fast cycle time and high alpha to begin with, you can take out 2-3 targets no problem.

For single targets, though, the tornado is better.

No, the Tornado is better against multiple targets - and single targets. I routinely cycle my 1400MM (overheated) 3-4 times before Concord kills me in 0.7. I alpha at 13+K so thats roughly 36-48K damage per Tornado with average hit quality. You can distribute that damage amongst multiple targets spread 70-100KM apart.

Can't fly the Talos, but based on my knowledge of suicide ganking, I'm quite sure it can't even approach that.

I'm training Hybrids because I believe the Talos has a role in killing Cargo-fit Orcas, but the Talos just didn't grow up with all the advantages of the Tornado.

-30KM of optimal + very long falloff range of Tornado pushes your engagement envelope to 50KM or more.
-ammo switching (as Catalyst ganking is pushing miners to tank Kin/Therm)
-alpha + more raw damage.

Anybody who wants to be a dedicated ganker should max their Tornado/Arty skills first. Hybrid ganking is a distant second.

Alpha ganking >>>>> DPS ganking.

There are two ways to make Hulk/Mackinaw ganking profitable.
A) kill a single Mackinaw or Hulk with a single Catalyst. (Yes you can solo gank Hulks with Cats....)
B) kill at least 2 Mackinaws/Hulks per BC hull, but more is better. Kill 4, and you are rolling in cash.

This, by itself, is profitable.
The real money starts to roll in when you threaten the miners.
-Evemail them, demand 200M ISK or you'll track them down and blow them up repeatedly.
-Follow up on your threat using address books, tracking agents, and an Orca to easily move your op.

You'll either get tears, CCP petition threats, or ISK. All are good.
I find that most of them will pay after losing 2-3 Exhumers to the same ganking alt.
Try to identify bots/mining accounts that belong to the same group/person, and kill all at once. Quite effective.

The real money starts to roll in when you threaten the miners.
-Evemail them, demand 200M ISK or you'll track them down and blow them up repeatedly.
-Follow up on your threat using address books, tracking agents, and an Orca to easily move your op.

You'll either get tears, CCP petition threats, or ISK. All are good.
I find that most of them will pay after losing 2-3 Exhumers to the same ganking alt.
Try to identify bots/mining accounts that belong to the same group/person, and kill all at once. Quite effective.

No, the Tornado is better against multiple targets - and single targets. I routinely cycle my 1400MM (overheated) 3-4 times before Concord kills me in 0.7. I alpha at 13+K so thats roughly 36-48K damage per Tornado with average hit quality. You can distribute that damage amongst multiple targets spread 70-100KM apart.

This is why we don't gank in EFT.
Do some actual ganking. Learn how the game works in practice.
Go kill some actual miners and actually learn something instead of just posting inaccurate info on your Ganker-geddon webpage.

Everything I've said is true, and the KB links have been posted.

MOST of what you said is true, except for the 'diverting' Concord and brown eyes accusations.

But....its well known that CCP only lets the miners cheat endlessly with macros, despite dozens of reports and petitions. Haven't seen a single one disappear yet.

I might come across as a no-experience EFT warrior, but I've done a little PvP here and there; certainly enough to boast a thorough understanding of most PvP mechanics. I understand how EFT differs from reality, but it also provides a good baseline.

I'm new to the suicide ganking scene, and haven't PvP'd on-the-clock. So, what I'm most curious about is the time-frame of a gank.

I compared my in-game module cycle times with EFT to look for a discrepency before I posted the above numbers, and I found none. I'll admit, I haven't stop-watched my Arty ships, and I'm not sure I'd notice a 2-3 s discrepency, but I'll be flabbergasted if it's that big.

As for my Concord Response times, I didn't just pull numbers from the Goon's wiki. I rolled up an alt, took him out to different systems on TQ, and shot people sitting in the belts. I repeated it well over a dozen times in different sytems and measured the concord response times with my logs. I have NEVER seen a concord response time above 24 seconds, despite a fair number of tests. I did most of my tests in a 0.5 system....

So, what I don't understand in your post, is your proclamation of FOUR volleys from 1400 arties. I would image acheiving 2 volleys Regularly, 3 Very Rarely, and not a chance in hell at four volleys.

If you say it happened to you, I'll believe you. I'm just really curious as to WHY it happened.

There isn't a thorough guide to Concord's response times, and I've been thinking of creating one. I'm fairly confident in my base concord response times, I'm just looking for the nuances and tricks that can be employed to increase/decrease the response times. If you have 30+ second responses, something else is diverting concord's attention, and I want to figure out how to purposely do it.

I went out with a destroyer and shot a mackinaw. Whether that's a smart move or not is trivial. What I want to know is how people are getting 20+ seconds of shooting time. I was popped by concord in like 2 seconds.

Killing Exhumers is now quite profitable. More people should do it. They just need to learn how to use Tornados to their fullest potential. Kill 1 Mack with a T2 Tornado, you take a small loss. Kill 2, you make a small profit. Kill 3 or more and you are making some real ISK.

Just.... no

It is not profitable to gank a hulk when you consider average drop of 5 million, when the 'nado costs about 50 mill+guns & ammo

Please consider posting after you realize there is no more insurance on concorded ships Thank you.


As for the talos, ive heard that 3 gank talos can an untanked orca (i.e. no Damage Control II)

I may mine, however im a darwinist miner, kill the miners who arent smart enough to avoid a gank, and ALWAYS pod the bots.

Personally, once WiS is up and running (no, walking in a closet-sized room doesn't count as WiS), I would love to shoot the players that are docked in station. Especially if I have to go all Splinter Cell on their ass.

http://test.true-sansha.com/?a=pilot_detail&plt_id=1796

Proof that it is possible to kill 4 exhumers in a 0.5 before getting concorded. Also tanked ones die at a average of 3 out of 4 sometimes 4 out of 4.

Edit WTF... their kb is gay. It will not let me link to my own kills. Sigh! Says ID not specified error.

http://test.true-sansha.com/?a=kill_related&kll_id=76206

I see, has to be copy pasted because of how ccp handles external links.

Did you get four consecutive shots off with the same turret, or did you split your weapon's fire? I think I'll test this with sisi tonight...