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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 0 post(s)
Plaetean Murder-Death-Kill	Posted - 2007.11.29 10:31:00 - [31] Stop bloody crying and just play the game. -----
Tom Gunn Caldari North Eastern Swat Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2007.11.29 10:35:00 - [32] The nerfs were to RSDs and a change to drones, and while it certainly affects Lolentte, it affects every other race too. RSDs were that good that most pvp raven setups would field a rack of them and go with an armour tank setup. Drones have needed looking at for a very long time. The very idea you could instantly heal drones shields was always more of an exploit than sensible. As for the torp change, that really depends who you are talking too - i certainly welcome it, but as a pvper i don't speak for the majority of caldari who are pve pilots and far outnumber pvp players. I'd wager they think its a bad change to their mission running setups.
Augeas	Posted - 2007.11.29 11:14:00 - [33] Quote: The nerfs were to RSDs and a change to drones, and while it certainly affects Lolentte, it affects every other race too. RSDs were that good that most pvp raven setups would field a rack of them and go with an armour tank setup. Absolutely - and a rack of RSD was a fine fit for the Drake also. Now the Drake and Raven will be seen more with HAM/torp gank fits and dodgy, EM-soft shield tanks. Resulting in a nice stealth boost for Amarr and lasers.
Brodde Dim	Posted - 2007.11.29 11:20:00 - [34] Yes, absolutely. Everyone can see the logic here. The nerf to tracking disruptors is really tough for Caldari, and a buff for Amarr. CCP should really get their act together and boost Caldari ships more.
arbalesttom Caldari Glauxian Brothers	Posted - 2007.11.29 11:26:00 - [35] Originally by: Phoenicia Originally by: Bellum Eternus Originally by: the thorn a blackbird with more then 4 multispec jammers is not cap stable a griffen with 4 multi spectracls is not cap stable Don't use multispecs. That sort of logic is how teen pregnancies happen. * * Nice hamster! - Mindstar Sorry, that hamster ate your sig.. - Random Guy123 Phear this sig! - Cortes
August Personage Caldari Clarf Inc	Posted - 2007.11.29 11:28:00 - [36] Originally by: Plaetean Stop bloody crying and just play the game.
Hydrogen Art of War	Posted - 2007.11.29 11:45:00 - [37] Well @OP: goal achieved You pointed out an issue of a one sided approach by CCP and your post and the replies show that you are right. Well done. If only it was not so sad to see such a biased approach by CCP... __ - click here -
Oam Mkoll Caldari HUSARIA Curatores Veritatis Alliance	Posted - 2007.11.29 11:56:00 - [38] Originally by: Brodde Dim Edited by: Brodde Dim on 29/11/2007 10:31:33 Edited by: Brodde Dim on 29/11/2007 10:31:00 Fellow contenders, we can finally give you the preliminary score from the last forum whining contest. To no suprise, its another victory for the veterans of the caldari whine squads, and this time it wasnt much of a fight. While we are still counting points, the results so far are: Caldari = +14 Minmatar = 0 Amarr = -5 Gallente = -15 And while the complete list of wins and losses would be to long for one post, I will just point out the ones that actually does matter to the final score. (Only nerfs/boosts where the ships role (bonuses) are affected, and general changes that affect most ships). Gallente: Eos: - drone bay - gun slots - drone bandwidth - scoop drone healing - Gang link, info superiority nerfed Myrmid: - drone bandwidth - scoop drone healing Ishkur - drone bandwidth - scoop drone healing Dominix - scoop drone healing Vexor - scoop drone healing Ishtar - scoop drone healing Celestis - RSD efficiency Arazu - RSD efficiency Lachesis - Lachesis RSD efficiency Amarr - Tracking computers nerfed Curse: - TD efficiency - drone bandwidth - scoop drone healing + neut cap use Pilgrim - TD efficiency - drone bandwidth - scoop drone healing + neut cap use Minmatar: - Tracking computers nerfed Typhoon: + Torp damage Caldari: + ship agility to most ships Raven: + Torp damage Scorpion: + ECM efficiency + ECM cap use Falcon: + ECM efficiency + ECM cap use Rook: + ECM efficiency + ECM cap use Blackbird: + ECM efficiency + ECM cap use Griffin + ECM efficiency + ECM cap use Nighthawk + Gang link cap use reduced (boost for passive tank) Vulture + Gang link cap use reduced (boost for passive tank) Once again CCP balances the game with the precission of a blind man performing life saving surgery with a chainsaw, with guidance from a blood thirsty audience. The question now is; Will the up and coming Gallente whining team take the challenge and try to recover? They have made a huge improvement and shown strong will the last couple of weeks. And will Amarr finally give up? Is this post a whine? Offcourse it is. If one thing is to be learned from this next patch, it is that whining works. More forum whining will give you good stuff. And for those who dont want to whine? Tough luck. Ok, Caldari whiners, show me your flaming skills. Edit: Added Neut cap use boost, and boosts for griffin. You sir are a baboon. While some of the nerfs are indeed ridiculous (like TD nerf and to a point SD nerf), this has nothing at all to do with Caldari Online. I agree, SD nerf affects Gallente recons badly but that doesn't mean that their Caldari counterparts just became powerful. They are simply better SUPPORT ships. The falcon still can't kill a light scout drone, the Rook set up for EW (the only sensible fitting) is much weaker than a Caracal. The agility nerf doesn't change the fact that Caldari ships are still heavy, slow and maneuverable like a pregnant stegosaurus. ECM is still useless on non-dedicated ships. The ONLY actual PvP boost for Caldari is the torpedo change. This introduces the ONLY heavy damage dealer for the race. Raven will be the only BS viable for killing stuff. The Rokh has range but no damage, the Scorp is a support ship. What does your oh-so-nerfed Gallente BS shop have left? Megathron, now the best fleet sniper in EvE, Hyperion with respectable DPS and a huge tank and the Domi, still powerful and very flexible. This post is nothing more than a whine about the nerf that takes I-WIN ships from you and turns them into something balanced. Cry more and stop pretending you care about the minor and well-deserved tweaks to Caldari. --- I am violence boat*
Stuart Price Caldari Havoc Inc	Posted - 2007.11.29 13:05:00 - [39] I dunno, Rokh with blasters seems to do enough dps for my needs. "I got soul but I'm not a soldier"
Daelin Blackleaf Aliastra	Posted - 2007.11.29 13:09:00 - [40] Caldari got candy and you didn't. Last few times we went shopping Caldari didn't get any candy. Maybe next time you'll get some. To be honest there's not all that much to see here, ECM got a buff, and we got our agility boosted. As mentioned you've managed to heavily skew those numbers and not even managed to do so with any degree of subtlety. -------- EVE Trinity: THE SKY IS FALLING!

Monticore D'Muertos Caldari United Society Starfleet	Posted - 2007.11.29 13:23:00 - [41] minmitar get the sabre nerf (
Juha85 Beasts of Burden YouWhat	Posted - 2007.11.29 13:29:00 - [42] Ok to summarize the upcoming patch: Eos gets brought back in line with the other fleet commands - check Myrmidon gets brought back in line with the other tier2 bc's - check Remote sensor damp gets it's I-WIN fit on all ships role removed - check The exploit of instantly healing drones gets removed - check Extremely slow and heavy caldari ships get just a bit more agile - check Caldari gets one BS able to deal damage - check Falcon might actually be worth flying - check Ok. The only thing that isn't justified is the heavy hit on the gallente recons. We will see but they will most likely get their bonus boosted in future patches. And perhaps they will introduce a low slot module to boost damp effectivenes. --------------------------------------- Please resize image to a maximum of 400 x 120, not exceeding 24000 bytes, ty. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] - Cortes
d026 THE LEGION OF STEEL WARRIORS.... R0ADKILL	Posted - 2007.11.29 13:54:00 - [43] Originally by: N1fty Energy neuts got a small cap need decrease. +1 to Amarr recons. +1 to caldari. i fit them on my raven to:)
Theron Gyrow Gradient Electus Matari	Posted - 2007.11.29 14:10:00 - [44] Originally by: Juha85 Ok to summarize the upcoming patch: Eos gets brought back in line with the other fleet commands - check False. After the patch, Eos is not just the worst fleet command (which would be ok, one of them has to be), but point-and-laugh worst one. Originally by: Juha85 Myrmidon gets brought back in line with the other tier2 bc's - check Might be. It will probably be the worst one out there, but that's ok. Originally by: Juha85 Remote sensor damp gets it's I-WIN fit on all ships role removed - check The exploit of instantly healing drones gets removed - check Agreed with these. Originally by: Juha85 Extremely slow and heavy caldari ships get just a bit more agile - check Er. If the numbers published by someone are correct, they are now as agile as the most agile corresponding Minmatar ships. This is a bit much. Originally by: Juha85 Caldari gets one BS able to deal damage - check ... and how. I worry about Megathron and Tempest getting marginalised by Raven. Too much of a boost. On the other hand, the indirect boosts to lasers (more shield tankers) and target painters (that torps require) are good things. Originally by: Juha85 Falcon might actually be worth flying - check ... might? Might?!? That thing is a stealthy force multiplier like no other. Originally by: Juha85 Ok. The only thing that isn't justified is the heavy hit on the gallente recons. We will see but they will most likely get their bonus boosted in future patches. And perhaps they will introduce a low slot module to boost damp effectivenes. Yes. Damps being useless also in specced ships = bad. -- Gradient forum
The Anointed Caldari Spartan Industries Triumvirate.	Posted - 2007.11.29 14:11:00 - [45] Edited by: The Anointed on 29/11/2007 14:11:36 Originally by: Brodde Dim Gallente: Eos: - drone bay bonus - Gang link, info superiority Celestis - RSD efficiency Arazu - RSD efficiency Lachesis - Lachesis RSD efficiency The way in which you count scoop drone healing as a nerf kind of spoils the attempt at logic. Scoop drone healing was an oversight and has needed attention for a while now, it also affects every ship with a drone bay. The Eos having some of its gun slots removed is also not a nerf, more of a balance, however I would agree that soemthing else needs to be done in order to bring its survivability in fleets up to the same level as other ships in its class. As for the iskur, give me an argument as to why an assualt ship should need to deploy more than 5 light drones, that in my book is a sensible amount for an assault ship and it still has room for spares. The same applies to the Myrmidon, Medium drones are acceptable especially with the bonus, or is it right that it should field 5 heavies and be on a par with the dominix for drone damage? The eos is on the same level, although the bonus to drone bay size is stupid, so give it a bonus to resists or armour hp instead. RSD Efficiency, thats a tough one, however I also feel that it was required, but i shall let you keep them as negative points. Originally by: Brodde Dim Caldari: + ship agility to most ships Raven: + Torp damage - Range Lets start with the bonus to agility as being something that is required, there is no reason for caldari ships to be the massive bricks they currently are, they shouldnt be the most agile/fast, but they should come in line with others. I will give you the + for torp damage, its nice to have somethign that packs a punch at close range to large targets, but I would also like to stick in a negative for the reduced range, mainly because I feel that the change is more of a balance again. As for the others, well clutching at straws to be honest. Jammers have had issues from day 1, nobody will ever agree on what should be done about it, but especially with the scorp and blackbird, the bonus change was needed as they because pretty useless, its a trade off, however the system we have at the moment works fine from my point of view and the efficiency and cap use in my opinion is on your little list to make up points. The gang link issue is also a slim argument, a single gang link to benefit a passive tank that uses less cap? Surely you can see that there is little to no point in arguing that point? I dont fly amarr or minny, so I wont comment, however I do feel that the changes coming to both gallente and caldari are being blown out of proportion, its not the end or the golden age of either race. A final point, if ccp simply went on whats posted on these forums and used that information to make changes then this game would be a complete cluster.
Lyria Skydancer Amarr Uninvited Guests Cult of War	Posted - 2007.11.29 14:19:00 - [46] Originally by: Steakkbone Originally by: Incantare It's unfortunate Amarr weren't given their oomph in this patch but the devs have stated they are looking at the issue. Amarr weren't given their oomph in this patch but the devs have stated they are looking at the issue. weren't given their oomph in this patch but the devs have stated they are looking at the issue. weren't given their oomph Oomph must be given. Yes in the allmighty oomph we trust and hope for.
Meridius Dex Amarr Species 5618 R0ADKILL	Posted - 2007.11.29 14:42:00 - [47] I contend with the fundamental logic of the OP in that complaint (I refuse to call them 'whine') threads have any affect whatsoever on the developers of EVE Online. If that were true, Amarr and their ridiculous lasers would have been fixed long ago. CCP couldn't care less, and Trinity is further proof that those of us duped into choosing Amarr during character creation remain still the Joke Race of EVE. -- Meridius Dex -- Amarr = EVE on Hard setting
Leon 026 Caldari Veto. Veto Corp	Posted - 2007.11.29 14:45:00 - [48] OP forgot to mention how worthless the Flycatcher is. ------- Leon 026 Once I was fallen, now I have wings
Kerfira	Posted - 2007.11.29 14:47:00 - [49] I don't think I've EVER seen a more biased and ridiculous post on EO before! Not only does the OP count general boosts as Caldari only, he also counts general nerfs as Gallente only. Add to that the fact that the 2 ECM boosts are counted 5 times EACH in his +15 score. Specific Caldari nerfs (like the torp range) are also very conveniently left out. Congrats on your work of fiction! Maybe someone else without your obvious biased agenda can do the real calc..... Originally by: CCP Wrangler EVE isn't designed to just look like a cold, dark and harsh world, it's designed to be a cold, dark and harsh world.
Khyara	Posted - 2007.11.29 14:57:00 - [50] Once upon a time a co-worker of mine went to talk to the President of our company about a raise which was long overdue to him. He went to talk to the President because the Vice President, our boss, was giving him the run-around, anyhoo (and this is a true story), he later told me that he went into the meeting, and the President said to him the same thing the VP had said - "Well, Mr. X(psst thats not really his name - but he didnt say the psst part either), I see that you've had a 15% raise over the last year, and clearly that is above our % raise policy, so therefore, you cant have a raise" And he said "Thats interesting, because if you look at my base salary, obviously you got cheap labour when you hired me. Yes Ive already gotten a 15% raise this year, however that 15% raise doesnt even bring me in line with the base pay of this position, therefore you are going to give me a raise." Same thing with the Caladari. I love how EVE always relates to real life, dont you?

Alex Harumichi Gallente Gradient Electus Matari	Posted - 2007.11.29 15:08:00 - [51] Originally by: Juha85 Eos gets brought back in line with the other fleet commands - check I more or less agree with you on the other points, but the above is simply false. Eos is now total crap compared to the other fleet commands, as a fleet support ship. The latest kick in the teeth was the nerf to the infowar gang links, already easily the worst of the four. I won't repeat the arguments from the (long) previous threads here, look them up if you're interested in the reasons. And yeah, damps being close to useless even on the specialized boats (Celestis, Arazu, Lachesis) is bad. I don't think anyone (even the pure Caldari players) wants us to go back to ECM being the only EW ever worth using. (same can be said about tracking disruptors on specialized boats, they also seriously need a boost)
Khes	Posted - 2007.11.29 15:12:00 - [52] Edited by: Khes on 29/11/2007 15:12:50 Originally by: Brodde Dim And I am saying that, maybe because there are more caldari pilots than pilots from any other race, the caldari whine got attention from CCP again. So do you mean that Caldari didn't need for example a ship agility boost and it will instead making things unbalanced ???
Yakia TovilToba Halliburton Inc.	Posted - 2007.11.29 15:29:00 - [53] Ohh mommy mommy gallente babys cry whSSSS .. now another race is almost as good as gallente babys whSSS whSSS this can't be ! You fail, gallente, your points counting is corrupt. For example you give the caldaris a + for torp damge but no - for torp range nerf. Or you "forget" to give the Gallentes a + for new stronger drones (which gallentes profit the most of, with their drone-specced ships) and give a lot of - for the same thing (each ship one).
welsh wizard Celestial Apocalypse Insurgency	Posted - 2007.11.29 16:01:00 - [54] What a crock of ****e. Gallente have had it coming for a long time, 'adapt'. [Balance] The Caldari problem.
Xaldor	Posted - 2007.11.29 16:04:00 - [55] Caldari buffs = +1 Gallente nerfs = +1 Gallente and Amarr whining = priceless
Suitonia Gallente interimo A.F.K	Posted - 2007.11.29 16:27:00 - [56] Meta level 1 to 4 shield boosters now have the same duration as tech 1 shield boosters (meta level 0). Shield boost amount and capacitor need have been adjusted: The efficiency has been increased by +12.5% and the boost rate has been increased up to +12.5% for meta level 0 down to -10% for meta level 4. This ensures that the increase in boost rate and efficiency between tech 1 and tech 2 is in line with the values for armor repairers. You forgot this Caldari buff too. --- I've always wondered about those Vagabond pilots...
Clavius XIV Auctoritan Syndicate Curatores Veritatis Alliance	Posted - 2007.11.29 16:31:00 - [57] Originally by: N1fty Energy neuts got a small cap need decrease. +1 to Amarr recons. Actually the patch note is misleading. The best named medium neut did not change in efficencey at all. The efficency of T2 medium neuts was brought in line with the best named T1, and the patch note if you read it with the comma, was ment to only address small neuts. It would be nice if they actually would make Neuts significantly more efficent... ECM got a 40% reduction in cap use... but I wouldn't hold your breath. It seems that ECM jamming is destined to be the only viable EWAR.
madaluap Gallente Mercenary Forces Exquisite Malevolence	Posted - 2007.11.29 16:41:00 - [58] Originally by: Leon 026 OP forgot to mention how worthless the Flycatcher is. Yeh totally wtf owned by the eris. _________________________________________________ Breetime A killmail!11!1 omgrawr: BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOYAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
Brodde Dim	Posted - 2007.11.29 16:49:00 - [59] Originally by: Oam Mkoll You sir are a baboon. While some of the nerfs are indeed ridiculous (like TD nerf and to a point SD nerf), this has nothing at all to do with Caldari Online. I agree, SD nerf affects Gallente recons badly but that doesn't mean that their Caldari counterparts just became powerful. They are simply better SUPPORT ships. The falcon still can't kill a light scout drone, the Rook set up for EW (the only sensible fitting) is much weaker than a Caracal. Even though it is beside my point, I agree recons EW ability should be a support to gangs. Amarr were allways more of solo ships, but the others are clearly gang orientet. The changes will not really make Amarr recons more viable for other than solo work, and the gallente recons will only be really usefull for the scram range bonus. (as long as the Keres isnt cheap enough to be a better choice). My point is still that whining seem to have made CCP overcompensate again. If Eos is overpowered, a nerf is needed. But 5 nerfs on one ship imho a bit harsh. If ECM is underpowered, give it a small boost. But nerfing all other kinds of EW and at the same time giving ECM a couple of buffs, will most certainly turn the table and make it overpowered. Originally by: Kerfira Not only does the OP count general boosts as Caldari only, he also counts general nerfs as Gallente only. Add to that the fact that the 2 ECM boosts are counted 5 times EACH in his +15 score. Specific Caldari nerfs (like the torp range) are also very conveniently left out. Yes, I only count how changes affect the specialized ships. How the general changes affect not specialized ships is not important since it will balance out. So I count how many ships got a role bonus buff or a role bonus nerf. If you really think the changes to torps is a nerf, I suggest you start a thread and ask CCP to not change it. I think you will get very nice response from your fellow caldari pilots. Originally by: Khes So do you mean that Caldari didn't need for example a ship agility boost and it will instead only make things unbalanced ??? I dont say anything about the changes, I just count them. There are plenty of people making comments, whines, suggestions and so on about changes needed/wanted for ships in this part of the forum. Some are really needed and well backed up by facts and examples. Others are luxury or just silly. Some have only a few pilots interested and supporting them. Others have a lot of people benefiting from the changes and get a lot of attention. What I tried to say in this thread is that this time the Caldari whine soldiers won. And by the replies I have gotten so far I can see why. The dedication and whine-fuu is really strong. Congratulations, keep up the good work.
Ogul Caldari ZiTek Deepspace Explorations Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.11.29 16:56:00 - [60] Originally by: Suitonia Meta level 1 to 4 shield boosters now have the same duration as tech 1 shield boosters (meta level 0). Shield boost amount and capacitor need have been adjusted: The efficiency has been increased by +12.5% and the boost rate has been increased up to +12.5% for meta level 0 down to -10% for meta level 4. This ensures that the increase in boost rate and efficiency between tech 1 and tech 2 is in line with the values for armor repairers. You forgot this Caldari buff too. I know you didn't put it like this, but who in his right mind used T1 shield boosters anyway? The T2 versions are cheap, have low skill requirements and have just been a lot better. --- This is a war declaration, issued from your alt corp. It is used to gank people in high sec.



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