PS: What's up with the loss of love for the great General Sasa? His fanaticism finally taking its toll?

Next fanfest! FW panel in the main hall with all the devs! Hell make FW the theme of the fanfest with different corners and missions and plexes (bars) for every faction. YEAH BEER!

I've been flying with some plexing fleets recently - good fun with frigs and cruisers etc... If we could get some more people into the fleets, it would be great...

Shame the spawnign mechaincs make it harder for the late night guys....

I still think we need some sort of T1 minor plex for our new pilots to allow them to experience plexing without having a dram or faction frig land on them. Minor plexes were originally great pvp, but thrashers started to take over, and then with the easy mission isk they are now full of expensive ships.

Maybe a scale

T1 frig plexes (additional restrictions so high ranks can't enter i.e sasa etc who will **** any newer players)
T1 Dessies down
Minor plexes - as current
And then the same for med plexes. .

Maybe restrict majors to bc up so it takes a group effort rather than speed tanking.

This is pretty much where my antagonist Mr.Cearain and I differ, he believes that removing NPCs makes plexes into PvP havens whereas I believe the spawning of said plexing will have much greater effect.
I would love for meaningful (ie. not in ass-end of cluster) plexes throughout the day and thus the combat gangs rather than just in the hours after DT with the rest of the day filled with run-away frigates closing plexes in the hopes of moving them to an 'targeted' system.

Bottomline: The plexes, with their size restrictions, are what fosters the memorable fights .. there are good fights elsewhere but they tend to be generic blob slug-outs where the individual is just a cog in a machine (read: boring!)....

I believe that removing npcs *and* immediately notifying the militias when a plex is entered will make plexes pvp havens.

Of course, I *also* think CCP should not have more plexes spawn right after downtime. It is not "either or." CCP should do both.

The rest I, not surprisingly, agree with you.

Why the attachment to npcs? Let the miltias know when plexes are entered and decide for themselves if they want to fight for occupancy. If they don't want to send pvp ships to fight for it they will lose it. ItGÇÖs that simple.


In the meantime I think you will find huge numbers of players who will love being told where other solo or small gangs are sitting waiting for some pew pew. There will finally be a mechanic for pvp that doesn't amount to forming the biggest blob.

Since the notifications of plexes being entered will made to everyone in the militias you never know how many people will show up. (you would know of the size restrictions of the plex though) It would be mayhem like eve never saw.

Trying to balance the npcs and all that, is a waste of time for the devs. NPCs on the whole discourage pvp.

Hmm, I have never been hugely discouraged by the Amarr NPCs. Maybe a matter of balancing them so one faction doesn't have overpowered NPC assistance.

I don't like the idea of notifying the militia when a plex has opened. My immediate thoughts are that people will form gank squads to burn to any open plexes and this will make solo pvp/plex hunting even harder.

No disrespect to all three of you amarr that do try for fair fights, but I can't even get a fight in a frigate anymore even against the odds without it turning out to be a trap - not even frigs v frigs, but bc and all sorts waiting for me to aggress.

"I am here" beacons will mean that if someone comes into your plex, it is almost certain they already have someone(many) waiting on the other side of the gate.

I think it is much better to make people hunt plexers - pvp should be the reward for active players, not people that wait in station for an alert. It would get more people out and travelling and allow others that don't plex to chase or be chased.

Plexes used to be havens for pvp, but were killed off for two reasons really.

People realized there were no reasons to do them
Those that continue to do them are all flying expensive faction ships which make it difficult for people to compete.

If people want a big plex fight, they will get it, you can't conceal the build up of people into the area

[quote=Bengal Bob]

If faction war plexing had to do with small scale pvp instead of pve people might actually value those medals and fight for occupancy.

You make some interesting points in your posts, just a side note...

I would be annoyed by the number of mails informing me of people warping into the hordes of plexes throughout the warzone.. some more than once as they get kicked out and return.

On the quote above, I dont think PvP alone is an incentive to take or hold occupancy. We all can get that without plexing, even if against a third party (someone not in any militia).

Intrepid pilots of New Eden!

Over the past days and weeks, CCP has been doing extensive and intense introspection and revitalization. The result of this is a refocusing and reprioritization on a scale unheard of within our company.

These are indeed defining times.

TorfiGÇÖs most recent dev blog provides some indication of whatGÇÖs to come. We have decided, to focus our collective efforts on the areas you have asked us to focus on.

We will reveal more over the coming weeks. As certain details are prone to change, we want to make sure we have absolutely concrete information to give you. YouGÇÖve often told us that we promise too much and deliver too little, and this time we want to be certain that doesnGÇÖt happen. We are listening to you, we have heard you, and plans are already in motion.

Watch this space.

Arnar Hrafn Gylfason
Senior Producer of EVE Online

I wonder if the latest dev blog will mean resources for FW???

We are after the same goal here.


If plexes are constantly being run throughout the 4 regions each front has, then the militias that refuse to split up their blobs will lose occupancy.

Consider this: Militia A and militia B both have 30 active pilots doing plexing. Militia A insists on keeping all of its pilots together in a large blob all doing one plex. Miltia B spreads their pilots out into 30 different systems each one doing a plex. ItGÇÖs easy to see that Militia B will have allot more plexes captured.

Even on a smaller scale this is true. If militia A must send 2 pilots to dislodge every single pilot from militia B then they better have at least 2xs as many pilots or they will not win the occupancy war.

If the plexing mechanic was really done right militias would use the minimum number necessary to take each plex.

People will also be encouraged to go plexing if there was an actual point to holding occupancy.

Hmmm, brain just farted --->

Militia wars have never in the history of mankind been about taking and holding land, because it can by definition not be done against an organized/superior entity.

Attrition, Attrition, Attrition. Kill so many enemies, destroy all his stuff and make his life unbearable in general until he collapses/withdraws on his own ..

Where FW is concerned this translates into:
- Denying access to station services (docking permits will never be revoked for NPC stations),
- Removal/restriction of income sources (missions go to 1 predefined system per constellation unless a system in the constellation is captured for instance).
- Decreased performance while operating on enemy militia turf (crude simulation of all the invaders who have died in bogs, swamps and forests throughout history).
- Etc.

PS: Sorry, my brain always develops gas when this thread slips to page 2+ for some unknown reason!

Don't you think this would lead to everyone joining winning side? If I can join any militia I want why would I join one that has decreased performce, removed and/or restricted of income, and is denied station services?

Nahh. The "joining the winning side" issue is hypothetically a concern for ANY advantage brought to either militia for winning systems, but that hasn't stopped "bring meaning to sov" from being the #1 demand of all of us who engage in Faction Warfare and desire some improvements.

It all boils down to good fights, after all. What is the fun in being blue to everyone? No fun for those of us that pew. Same with militia, its not fun when everyone is purple. In a game like Eve - being the underdog means more gameplay and pvp opportunities, so it self-balances. If you talk to many FW pilots, I think the consensus is that it sucks when your side has the highest activity level, because it means less targets to shoot when the opposing team is too intimidated to undock and roam. ....

How would frigates and cruiser fair if they were pwned by station guns in a hostile system?

I agree this acts as a counter balance for several pilots. In fact when I was in rvb I switched back and forth from red and blue several times for this very reason.

But I think there are several reasons to think this "pile on the winning team" mentality will have an effect:

1) it already happened even when there were no rewards. Around the time Caldari "won faction war" gallente had very few active pilots.
2)In FW its not quite as easy to switch sides as in rvb. You will be considered a spy, you have to move your stuff through low sec etc. It sucks to no longer fly with your friends and developing some sort of reasonable pretend hatred of the enemy makes the game more fun.
3)Role players won't change
4) Those new to pvp will likely want to be on the winning side not on the underdog side. Then all the reasons not to switch sides will kick in.
5) as far as income: I know players that explicitly said they went to caldari because the missions are easier. I know a player who missioned allot who went to minmatar (which also has easier missions than amarr). These players also pvp, its not the case that they just run missions. They figured if they prefer to pvp instead of missioning why join a faction where I have to mission longer to get the same isk. I can't (and don't) fault them.
6) if your talking about things that actually tip pvp battles one way or another like increased damage or resists or gate guns then I wouldn't do that, myself. If your just talking station guns at the enemy militias station then that would be fine and probably good by me.

That said I think if ccp did some things fw could be somewhat self balancing:
1) increased the number of fw lp items that are unique to each faction.
2) made the items that are unique to each faction worth something. (e.g. amarr plates should have lower fittings than meta 4 gallente plates should have the same fittings as meta 4)
3) require that plexes be run in order to get or cash in on the lps.

If you do not have number 3 then you will just ahve people farming the missions and not running plexes. But if they had to run plexes in order to cash in on the lp . Either by having only the plexes award lp or by having the plexes award something else you need to get the unique items. For example maybe the faction specific items required a different type of lp that you could only get by running plexes. Then the items would go up in value and economics would help balance things.

This would need to be tweaked over time. Even iterated on. But they could do something like that.

Moreover I think some effects from faction occupancy wouldn't directly impact the fw participants that much. Like a small percent chance npc stations will switching from an Amarr corp to a Minmatar corp if the minmatar take occupancy of the system.

.. agree this acts as a counter balance for several pilots...

That said I think if ccp did some things fw could be somewhat self balancing:...