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Zandaar	Posted - 2007.12.08 01:48:00 - [61] As someone that put the n00b in n00bness, even I agree. If that happened in another game where I play at the high end, I would seriously have to consider dumping it if they didn't take my losses seriously. I hope they don't roll back, but I do hope they replace all lost POS's. That's the weakest thing I've ever heard.
tyrol E X O D U S Imperial Republic Of the North	Posted - 2007.12.08 02:39:00 - [62] Edited by: tyrol on 08/12/2007 02:40:46 Originally by: CCP kieron In the interim, we do not think it prudent to take the entire server down due to issues which are affecting a smaller portion of the community. not that im bothered if they take the server down or not but, im still trying to figure out which portion of the community hasnt been affected....
Lord DerekSegan	Posted - 2007.12.08 03:16:00 - [63] Wow.. I did not realize the POS problems were this large. I agree. Take down the server. This is a ****ing. I would quit the game for good if I lost a POS. Hello
Banana Torres The Green Banana Corporation	Posted - 2007.12.08 03:20:00 - [64] Originally by: CCP kieron CCP is aware of the issue with certain game features and are working on resolving them. A patch will be deployed (to the server, client or both) when the issues have been resolved. In the interim, we do not think it prudent to take the entire server down due to issues which are affecting a smaller portion of the community. Yeah, I always knew you hated me...
Ryneter	Posted - 2007.12.08 03:28:00 - [65] Umm, CCP Stated that you should of taken all your modules out of your POS's before trinity went live. You should of listened. Ignorant..
SnakeByte86	Posted - 2007.12.08 03:34:00 - [66] Originally by: Ryneter Umm, CCP Stated that you should of taken all your modules out of your POS's before trinity went live. You should of listened. Ignorant.. Are you being sarcastic?
Mattikus	Posted - 2007.12.08 03:41:00 - [67] I need to get some of you babies your bottles. Cry cry because your POS is getting looted, etc. etc. You know what you do if someone steals your **? You go steal their's! Not quit ***ing and get out there and fight!
Kritinana Minmatar Dark Empire Fleet	Posted - 2007.12.08 03:51:00 - [68] Originally by: Mattikus I need to get some of you babies your bottles. Cry cry because your POS is getting looted, etc. etc. You know what you do if someone steals your **? You go steal their's! Not quit ***ing and get out there and fight! Unless you're gonna sit around and babysit every one of your pos's there's no way to know who blew it up. Hence you obviously don't know wtf you're talking about. Feel free to escort yourself outside.
SnakeByte86	Posted - 2007.12.08 03:56:00 - [69] Originally by: Mattikus I need to get some of you babies your bottles. Cry cry because your POS is getting looted, etc. etc. You know what you do if someone steals your **? You go steal their's! Not quit ***ing and get out there and fight! Noob. You cant tell who killed your stuff, why ? Cause ccp screwed up AGAIN.
Maxus Cynus Perkone	Posted - 2007.12.08 04:11:00 - [70] I love Kieron, setting new standards for CCP in ineptitude every month! I also love his bosses, showing the world how to be unprofessional to the extreme. I love this game! The computer game itself is naff.
Verlaine Glariant Knights of the Flame Knights Of the Southerncross	Posted - 2007.12.08 04:13:00 - [71] My dread is happier than ever. Verlaine Glariant. Tactical Weapons Specialist.
Amarria Black Clan Anthraxx	Posted - 2007.12.08 04:16:00 - [72] Originally by: ZerKar Originally by: SnakeByte86 Originally by: Andrue Originally by: NocturnalDeath The game is completely unplayable at the moment for those of us with POSes, Dreads, Jump Bridges, and a whole list of other things. That's a shame but it's absolutely fine for the other 80% of players. Can't you lot take a break and play nice until the problem is solved? You assume they will be fixing our destroyed POS, we havnt been told yet. So us low sec people may only represent 20% of the population, but with out us you have less high end minerals, no t2 items, no capital ships, no boosters. Uhh basicly you have nothing cool. If tons of POS continue to die, expect the eve market to be a scary place for a while. T2 items can be made in High Sec. Minerals can be farmed from Rogue Drones or Mission Loot. Boosters? Yeah...um...Right whatever. Capitals do nothing for High Sec folks. The only thing I dislike about Low Sec folks getting screwed (besides the fact that no one should get shafted) is that they buy lots of stuff and I do not want customers getting screwed and not buying because things do not work for them at the moment. The Isk MUST flow! So yeah, if there is a big issue here CCP needs to get on fixing that ASAP. You do realize that moon mining POSs are where you get the materials to create T2 mods, correct? Take the server down, fix the problem, and do a rollback. And this is from someone who has no vested interest in the 0.0 game and has done close to a bil in sales in the last day. Money's great on the short term, but trainwrecking my supply chain... nothx.
Verlaine Glariant Knights of the Flame Knights Of the Southerncross	Posted - 2007.12.08 04:25:00 - [73] Originally by: NocturnalDeath PLEASE take the server down... No. Verlaine Glariant. Tactical Weapons Specialist.
Fanjita	Posted - 2007.12.08 04:30:00 - [74] Originally by: Turin Originally by: Jonny JoJo Lets give CCP the benifit of the doubt, especially with the boot.ini issue taking up a lot of their time. Till then, its time to fly the good old fashioned way..... thorugh these things call gates. Oh and Amarr still needs to be fixed! Then please find a way to allow my carrier to use a gate pls? K thnx. Post here when you can tell us how to do that. tried using a cyno? theyre really handy for moving caps around :)
F'nog Amarr Celestial Horizon Corp. Valainaloce	Posted - 2007.12.08 04:48:00 - [75] Originally by: Karlemgne Edited by: Karlemgne on 07/12/2007 22:44:18 Edited by: Karlemgne on 07/12/2007 22:40:25 Edited by: Karlemgne on 07/12/2007 22:39:47 Look, guys, I'm a PVPer and not a POS runner, but I actually understand where these guys are coming from (I don't necessarily think TQ should come down though.) You guys are failing to understand the magnitude of some of the stuff happening with the POSes. Someone was actually stupid enough to compare this to not being able to access the game at "work." The issue is a number of multi-billion isk POSes have been rendered completely helpless by losing their shields and the ability to shoot back at aggressors. Additionally, I have heard rumors the many of the construction structures have just stopped working. Think about it like this, if Trinity somehow reduced your combat ships armor and shields to 0 how would you feel? How about if someone could blow up your most expensive ships and items while you were offline? What if your ships' shields and armor were correct, but none of your guns, tank, or mods worked at all? Quite frankly, the game is broken. It doesn't matter that only 20% of the players are affected... if the 20% of the players who use lasers suddenly couldn't fire them, some of the same people ****ing about the pos "whiners" would all be demanding blood. And lets not forget it is actually way more than 20% of the people who play eve who are affected. Everyone who flies a tech 2 ship, builds their own stuff, or buys from the market will* feel this soon (if they haven't already.) -Karl I find your use of logic and common sense disturbing. It has no place here. Oh, and seconded, or Nth'ed. I lost count. Originally by: Kazuma Saruwatari F'nog for Amarr Emperor. Nuff said
Mecinia Lua Galactic Express Frontier Trade League	Posted - 2007.12.08 04:50:00 - [76] Originally by: Mattikus I need to get some of you babies your bottles. Cry cry because your POS is getting looted, etc. etc. You know what you do if someone steals your **? You go steal their's! Not quit ***ing and get out there and fight! Well it's a nice theory and folks would indeed do that except for one small problem. Due to another bug because of CCP you can't tell who attacked your POS, so there is no possibility of reprisals. We also all know that CCP is not going to reimburse everything. They never do. They also probably aren't going to punish those that are exploiting this game weakness as they have made no statement that they will. Thus the cycle continues. It ultimately affects everyone. The POSs being taken out are primarily industrial ones or moon mining ones. Without the moon minerals, which cannot be mined in .4 and above, you cannot make reactions. Without the reactions you have no materials to make t2 modules and ships. Kieron should realize that most of those in 0.0 also have characters in Empire. Which means it really affects more subscribers than would initially be seen. I fully support a roll back and I'm on dialup. I realize that if they did do a roll back I'd have to download the entire client which would take me a couple days probably. One thing is for certain whoever was in charge of QA for Trinity needs to be fired because they didn't do their job. CCP has a bad habit of just moving these people to other jobs where they keep screwing stuff up though. Thoughts expressed are mine and mine alone. They do not necessarily reflect my alliances thoughts.
Please Hold	Posted - 2007.12.08 05:08:00 - [77] Needs to be on the frontpage on ingame news as an exploit and those found exploiting get a perma-ban.
Chomapuraku Templar Republic R0ADKILL	Posted - 2007.12.08 05:13:00 - [78] are you "anti-whiners" ***** thick? CRITICAL PARTS OF THE GAME ARE SERIOUSLY BROKEN. people are losing months of work over this , and dumbasses are taking advantage of these crippling bugs. take your t2 e-peen and swing it somewhere else. given the consequences, these bugs are absolutely unacceptable and CCP can basically choose between a rollback or plowing through tens (if not hundreds) of thousands of petitions to fix everything that's ***** up (and ban the idiots stupid enough to take advantage of the bugs)
F'nog Amarr Celestial Horizon Corp. Valainaloce	Posted - 2007.12.08 05:23:00 - [79] Originally by: Mecinia Lua One thing is for certain whoever was in charge of QA for Trinity needs to be fired because they didn't do their job. CCP has a bad habit of just moving these people to other jobs where they keep screwing stuff up though. I wouldn't go that far. These problems may not have shown up on Sisi, so they would have had no way of knowing that anything was wrong. If there were bug reports from Sisi about it, however, I fully agree with you. Originally by: Kazuma Saruwatari F'nog for Amarr Emperor. Nuff said
No Wai	Posted - 2007.12.08 05:33:00 - [80] Originally by: SnakeByte86 Sure t2 items can be made in high sec. BUT MOON MATERIALS CANT. Oh wait, T2 items are made from moon materials. Snap! That means T2 root is low sec. Funny, I've always found moons in 0.0 were better than lowsec. Oh, and lets not forget the systems with dozens of moons. And the few with over 100 (god I'd hate to have to keep THAT production system going).
Becka Call	Posted - 2007.12.08 05:33:00 - [81] Quote: Imagine if the bug was that ships in peoples' hangars started disappearing. Even if it only affected 10% of the population, wouldn't you agree that the game should not continue while those 10% have their possessions arbitrarily destroyed? Of course its moot since they already said they won't be doing it. Dont forget that people ARE loosing stuff out of their heads; implants are also dissapearing during clone jumps. Anyone care to loose a full set of higend snakes? I hope and think that CCP is having some overtime this weekend and seriously discussing this FUBAR of a patch; Rollback is looking pretty promising but highly embaressing. Unfortunetly the current state of the game is more embarasing than a roll back would be. I really do feel for them; I've been on the other end of situations like this too; fortunetly for them if they roll this back its not like they'll have to scrap millions worth of defective product; they could do a 24 hour stand down and revert. At this point most players would probably not mind if EVERYONE lost a couple days training time and they continue. Right now I can't play it to do anything much since it crashes randomly. here's to hopin the game stabilizes soon and we can go back to doing our thing.
Kuzya Morozov Gallente Organized Combat Consortium	Posted - 2007.12.08 05:43:00 - [82] Originally by: NocturnalDeath whine Your boot.ini file WILL be deleted until morale improves!
cpu939 Gallente OffBeat Creations	Posted - 2007.12.08 05:44:00 - [83] well all i can say is fix the bug deploy the patch if you can make sure it 100% correct give the players back there lost items if not then try to work out what went missing give them that or prema-ban them for lieing and trying to exploit the game and yes perma-ban the people exploiting this bug too. there is no need to take the servers off line for this. taking the servers off line would end up hurting eve and ccp more then letter it run with this bug as it could take some time to fix the bug so no eve = people finding another game to play and not coming back to eve.
F'nog Amarr Celestial Horizon Corp. Valainaloce	Posted - 2007.12.08 05:52:00 - [84] Originally by: cpu939 well all i can say is fix the bug deploy the patch if you can make sure it 100% correct give the players back there lost items if not then try to work out what went missing give them that or prema-ban them for lieing and trying to exploit the game and yes perma-ban the people exploiting this bug too. there is no need to take the servers off line for this. taking the servers off line would end up hurting eve and ccp more then letter it run with this bug as it could take some time to fix the bug so no eve = people finding another game to play and not coming back to eve. I think you're being a little overdramatic. Considering the possible effects on the market that could last for a long time if nothing useful is done, it could actually be better to roll back and start over than continue. How many people would quit if they lost billions in POSes and couldn't get a response from GMs for weeks because of the backlog of petitions? Will it be worse than if the servers were taken down or rolled back? I don't know. But it's something CCP seriously needs to consider. Yes, a roll back is bad, but is it potentially worse than what could happen if things aren't fixed soon, or if enough isn't done to restrict the damages being done, or the remedies for these problems? Originally by: Kazuma Saruwatari F'nog for Amarr Emperor. Nuff said
cpu939 Gallente OffBeat Creations	Posted - 2007.12.08 07:33:00 - [85] Originally by: F'nog Originally by: cpu939 well all i can say is fix the bug deploy the patch if you can make sure it 100% correct give the players back there lost items if not then try to work out what went missing give them that or prema-ban them for lieing and trying to exploit the game and yes perma-ban the people exploiting this bug too. there is no need to take the servers off line for this. taking the servers off line would end up hurting eve and ccp more then letter it run with this bug as it could take some time to fix the bug so no eve = people finding another game to play and not coming back to eve. I think you're being a little overdramatic. Considering the possible effects on the market that could last for a long time if nothing useful is done, it could actually be better to roll back and start over than continue. How many people would quit if they lost billions in POSes and couldn't get a response from GMs for weeks because of the backlog of petitions? Will it be worse than if the servers were taken down or rolled back? I don't know. But it's something CCP seriously needs to consider. Yes, a roll back is bad, but is it potentially worse than what could happen if things aren't fixed soon, or if enough isn't done to restrict the damages being done, or the remedies for these problems? when i say the server being off line I'm not talking about another 24 hour I'm talking 48 and up for the server being off line for it to affect people/customers, i know this sort of thing for a fact from my job where we might need to send an out a person to look at the customer problem could be a few days before customer can get scene and even when its a free call out they still end up quitting. so if people quite when they get it for free how will they be when they have to pay for it. think of all the players that will whinne due to skill changes not being done. roll back is bad never scene a roll back in the game but if it is like another roll back players will loss isk, module and skill points. the markets will sort them selfs out in time in fact some people are saying thing are to cheep this will help put the price of things up and loads of us have stock piles to fall back on. also most of the people in eve do not have billions. the people at most risk are the space holder the big alliances this bug could turn the war or win it who knows.
SnakeByte86	Posted - 2007.12.08 07:36:00 - [86] Originally by: No Wai Originally by: SnakeByte86 Sure t2 items can be made in high sec. BUT MOON MATERIALS CANT. Oh wait, T2 items are made from moon materials. Snap! That means T2 root is low sec. Funny, I've always found moons in 0.0 were better than lowsec. Oh, and lets not forget the systems with dozens of moons. And the few with over 100 (god I'd hate to have to keep THAT production system going). Not really solid truth. I've found plenty of nice moons in empire, dysp for example. Point is, T2 comes from POS that reside in vunerable space, they are being made extremly vunerable with the bugs
Possessed Clown Amarr Spiced Wine Syndicate	Posted - 2007.12.08 07:38:00 - [87] Edited by: Possessed Clown on 08/12/2007 07:38:12 Originally by: Korran Minare Originally by: SnakeByte86 Originally by: Korran Minare this is just a freakin game, GET OVER IT But our game has been ruined. Just because you dont run POS, and dont live in 0.0, and dont rely on these type of things. Does not mean we have any less fun using them, and since what has taken many people years to build, or at very least days have been destroyed in minutes. Yes, Its a HUGE problem. no i dont have a POS or live in 0.0, but neither do i spend my entire life on this game like some players out there, i play to have fun and to relax after a long days work, i dont use too much t2 stuff, mostly blasters and railguns but thats about it. and if you think it has been ruined then quit playin and you wont have a reason to ***** about it anymore My POS is fine... So get over it Sig Removed. Please keep sigs to 400x120 pixels and 24000 bytes in size or less. -Kaemonn ^^^I got pwnt :(
General Xenophon Caldari Infinite Improbability Inc Mostly Harmless	Posted - 2007.12.08 07:52:00 - [88] Originally by: CCP kieron CCP is aware of the issue with certain game features and are working on resolving them. A patch will be deployed (to the server, client or both) when the issues have been resolved. In the interim, we do not think it prudent to take the entire server down due to issues which are affecting a smaller portion of the community. lol -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= "Now, we must all fear evil men. But there is another kind of evil which we must fear most, and that is the indifference of good men." - Boondock Saints
Mecinia Lua Galactic Express Frontier Trade League	Posted - 2007.12.08 08:06:00 - [89] Originally by: cpu939 when i say the server being off line I'm not talking about another 24 hour I'm talking 48 and up for the server being off line for it to affect people/customers, i know this sort of thing for a fact from my job where we might need to send an out a person to look at the customer problem could be a few days before customer can get scene and even when its a free call out they still end up quitting. so if people quite when they get it for free how will they be when they have to pay for it. think of all the players that will whinne due to skill changes not being done. roll back is bad never scene a roll back in the game but if it is like another roll back players will loss isk, module and skill points. the markets will sort them selfs out in time in fact some people are saying thing are to cheep this will help put the price of things up and loads of us have stock piles to fall back on. also most of the people in eve do not have billions. the people at most risk are the space holder the big alliances this bug could turn the war or win it who knows. It's not just the sov holding alliances that are being hurt. I agree with the other person though. A rollback might actually be the better solution. It would inconvenience everyone a little. However it would not destroy their hard game work they'd only lose what was done since the patch. It is obvious that Trinity was not ready and had not been thoroughly tested by the QA department. Had they done so they would have at the least learned of the ini error in testing. (Also note that many issues causing problems were raised during the test, not all but some of the big ones were and nothing was done). Leaving it up in its current state is going to basically destroy all their advertising dollars spent on attracting new people. I'm not sure they can adequately fix this on a live server, there is just a lot wrong. Rather than risk another patch on the live server that might even do more damage, I really think it would be better to rollback to say November 1st. Everyone would have to redownload the full version. Then take Trinity back to testing. Do a much more thorough testing and fix the major problems. If that takes until next February so be it. As much as you might say it is a small part of the game, it is that small part that most of the game depends on. SOE cried it was a minority that cried against the NGE patch for SWG, that minority in the end became a majority and destroyed SWG to the extent its basically a footnote now. SOE's overall reputation took a hit. That could happen here too. I hope they are working this weekend to find a solution they need one fast. Without it they might do a lot of damage to EVE's reputation and to themselves. Those of us asking for a rollback are not doing it to be spiteful or because we too would not lose things we've done the last couple days, it is because we see it as the best solution for the game, one that can help save it from what happened to SWG. Thoughts expressed are mine and mine alone. They do not necessarily reflect my alliances thoughts.
Andrue Amarr	Posted - 2007.12.08 08:53:00 - [90] Originally by: Mel Ionix Even though I don't live in 0.0 these do sound like some major **in bugs ...am amazed by the 'it doesn't affect me so STFU' attitude on these forums tbh The thing is that at present 20% of people are affected. They are affected because some of that 20% are being jackasses and taking advantage of the situation. IOW the 20% who are affected are basically ing in their own backyard. The other 80% of the players are currently completely unaffected. They are playing the game quite happily, enjoying the new content and graphics. Why should everyone have to suffer just because of a few idiots? That isn't fair. 0.0 residents need to get off their high horse and stop thinking that they are the most important players in Eve. Everyone has a right to play the game and if a problem only affects a few people then the rest should be allowed to carry on. -- (Battle hardened industrialist) [Brackley, UK] My budgie can say "ploppy bottom". You have been warned.**

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