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SnakeByte86
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Posted - 2007.12.08 08:59:00 -
[91]
That is a great idea i mean you guys dont need t2 stuff do you? Of course not.
As someone posted earlier, this is the same as for example.
All gallente ships have 0 shields, 0 armor, and 10 hull.
I bet you might be whining if you flew gallente ships. Of course you would, even though it doesnt effect the majority, it is something that needs to be fixed now.
A Rollback could have been done 36 hours ago. But it wasnt, because money is important to ccp, not reputation.
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Amarria Black
Clan Anthraxx
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Posted - 2007.12.08 09:07:00 -
[92]
 Originally by: Andrue
Originally by: Mel Ionix
Even though I don't live in 0.0 these do sound like some major ****in bugs
...am amazed by the 'it doesn't affect me so STFU' attitude on these forums tbh
The thing is that at present 20% of people are affected. They are affected because some of that 20% are being jackasses and taking advantage of the situation. IOW the 20% who are affected are basically ****ing in their own backyard.
The other 80% of the players are currently completely unaffected. They are playing the game quite happily, enjoying the new content and graphics. Why should everyone have to suffer just because of a few idiots? That isn't fair. 0.0 residents need to get off their high horse and stop thinking that they are the most important players in Eve. Everyone has a right to play the game and if a problem only affects a few people then the rest should be allowed to carry on.
Bolded the important part.
Currently unaffected. However, that situation isn't permanent. Wait a month until the actual effects of a sudden and sharp reduction in T2 materials start manifesting in the market at-large.
How can anyone be so blind to the fact that almost every single tiny change has an effect on all of us, and big shakeups like this even more so?
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CHAOS100
Momentum.
The Reckoning.
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Posted - 2007.12.08 09:50:00 -
[93]
This patch has caused more bugs than ever. I consider it only partially playable. the UI cannot be dragged sometimes and completely locks its position(pinned or unpinned), leaving me only the option to minimize the offending screen that overlaps my MODS and WEAPONS. The ongoing buggy MAP has forced me to restart eve twice during a roaming up tonight, because I was unable to see any universe map as it was a black screen.
Not to mention that my premium client is crashing now often for no particular reason, making it unplayable and unreliable, and I have reverted back to the old version.
++ all the other bugs that are listed but less game critical.
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Ontaku Oroa
Minmatar
Masuat'aa Matari
Ushra'Khan
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Posted - 2007.12.08 09:59:00 -
[94]
No T2!? Oh noes! We might actually have to fight on equal terms, no more "I got expensive hardware, can't touch me with your T1 crap, nyah, nyah, nyah"! How can we possibly survive!
Just kidding. I know that it is a very frustrating situation for POS owners.
But I seriously doubt it is going to take a month to fix. So unless the nice 0.0 folk go completely berserk on each other an manage to annihilate majority of their assets in a mad frenzy of destruction, we shouldn't see the market fluctuate too much.
In the meantime, play nice. I know, it's 0.0, and you don't have to or want to, but hey - its temporary. Soon enough you will all be able to go back to your old e-peen waving selves, bragging about massive pwnage without anyone accusing you (too frequently) of being cheaters and exploiters... 
Well, that's enough sarcasm from me for one day. Seriously though, I hope that CCP will fix this soon.
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SnakeByte86
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Posted - 2007.12.08 10:06:00 -
[95]
Originally by: Ontaku Oroa
No T2!? Oh noes! We might actually have to fight on equal terms, no more "I got expensive hardware, can't touch me with your T1 crap, nyah, nyah, nyah"! How can we possibly survive!
Just kidding. I know that it is a very frustrating situation for POS owners.
But I seriously doubt it is going to take a month to fix. So unless the nice 0.0 folk go completely berserk on each other an manage to annihilate majority of their assets in a mad frenzy of destruction, we shouldn't see the market fluctuate too much.
In the meantime, play nice. I know, it's 0.0, and you don't have to or want to, but hey - its temporary. Soon enough you will all be able to go back to your old e-peen waving selves, bragging about massive pwnage without anyone accusing you (too frequently) of being cheaters and exploiters...
Well, that's enough sarcasm from me for one day. Seriously though, I hope that CCP will fix this soon.
Even if it only takes another day or two, we all know CCPs no reimbursing non destroyed items.
This could potentialy mean 100s of billion or more in losses to some alliances, depending on number and type of pos destroyed.
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Nemain Darru
Gallente
Sublime.
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Posted - 2007.12.08 11:03:00 -
[96]
See, what I don't get here, is that this issue was not present on the test server afaik.
What is the point of the test server, if it does not run the exact build you plan on implementing?
Shoot first. Think later. |
Turix
Interstellar eXodus
R0ADKILL
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Posted - 2007.12.08 11:08:00 -
[97]
Originally by: CCP kieron
CCP is aware of the issue with certain game features and are working on resolving them. A patch will be deployed (to the server, client or both) when the issues have been resolved. In the interim, we do not think it prudent to take the entire server down due to issues which are affecting a smaller portion of the community.
So the sum total of most territory controlling alliances constitues a "smaller portion of the community".
| Image Hosting | My Movies | |
xenoin
Racketeers
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Posted - 2007.12.08 11:24:00 -
[98]
Edited by: xenoin on 08/12/2007 11:26:11
Edited by: xenoin on 08/12/2007 11:24:48
First of all I cannot be bothered reading the rest of this thread so if what I have said has already been said, i don't care.
Anyways, I myself have not upgraded to the premium version because my computer does not support it. Im glad I didn't however as although everything may be nice and shiny some peoples frame rates were plummeting and memory usage rocketing. Then there was the boot.ini thing which I will not linger on as enough has been said.
After the patch the game has been a lot more buggy. First of all the ship scanner. It is completely fubar'd. You try and move it down to 5 degree and it shows it at the far left but still scan 360. You have to just shake it about and eventually it will gradually go down to 5 degrees.
Then there is that big purple cross in space. I dunno if that is intended or not but it looks crap.
Next when undocking or jumping I get multi-coloured *****s appearing all over my screen or sometimes just a flash of white light and no it is not from the stargate.
Finally I seem to be getting a lot more "session change in progress" messages, now if this is just coincidence or not I do not know.
This is just bugs experianced by me so far and we all know about the 0 ROF dreads etc. I'm sure a lot more of these bugs and going to be found.
Just my 2 pence.
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Majestik
Gallente
Freelancing Corp
Confederation of Independent Corporations
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Posted - 2007.12.08 11:40:00 -
[99]
Everything is normal in my part of empire. Business as usual....gate camps,chatter,scams,station hugging battles,mining,trading,etc...
More traffic than usual....must be Xmas.
There are still issues from the patch but all is good.
I know that some people in 0.0 put all their important stuff(like bpos) in cloak capable sceptors,transports,Recon,Transports,and freighters with alts and parked in safe spot and stay logged off until things are normal and only play their jump cloned mains character.
The did all of this during Thanksgiving weekend.
Don't know about the POSs but all of their critical stuff is safe.
I'm thinking how nervous paranoid they were about this big patch but it seem to have paid off from what I am reading here.
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Ashlan
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Posted - 2007.12.08 11:52:00 -
[100]
I think the server should be rolled back to before Trinity. Shiny graphics are useless, when the basic gameplay has been so totally screwed. We have the same POS and jump bridge problems mentioned here. The longer this situation continues with everyone exploiting the POS defense problems in 0.0, which have now become widely known. The jump bridges and warp disruptor being broken are also making this situation worse.
Take Trinity off the server, roll it back to before it was installed, and this time TEST it! I really don't understand how CCP could possibly have gone live with this update without running it on the test server.
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Amarria Black
Clan Anthraxx
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Posted - 2007.12.08 12:03:00 -
[101]
Originally by: Ashlan
I think the server should be rolled back to before Trinity. Shiny graphics are useless, when the basic gameplay has been so totally screwed. We have the same POS and jump bridge problems mentioned here. The longer this situation continues with everyone exploiting the POS defense problems in 0.0, which have now become widely known. The jump bridges and warp disruptor being broken are also making this situation worse.
Take Trinity off the server, roll it back to before it was installed, and this time TEST it! I really don't understand how CCP could possibly have gone live with this update without running it on the test server.
The crazy part is that they did run it on the test server. I don't know that they specifically tested this build to make sure they didn't break POS mechanics, but the build's been up on sisi for a few weeks.
Regardless, QA and internal testing really screwed the pooch on this one.
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umop 3pisdn
Minmatar
Fnck the blob.
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Posted - 2007.12.08 12:04:00 -
[102]
Pfff who cares.
Honestly.
POS's are ****, and other than the 0 ROF dreads we're back to rev 1.
No ***** cyno jammers to hide behind, no jump bridges to avoid hostiles.
The bit in the op about whiners is pretty funny for a whine thread...
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Carniflex
Caldari
Fallout Research
Fallout Project
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Posted - 2007.12.08 12:20:00 -
[103]
It's obvious that they dont plan to rollback. It's too late for that already.
It's pretty ****ty however if you lose stuff bcos CCP misplaced somehow your gun crews inside giant container and lost them somewhere in deep space. I think however that people exploiting that bug should get warnings/bans and people losing stuff to bugs should get fully reimbused (including taking away looted modules from looters and reversing any transaction if they have managed to sell them already). It's ofc ****ty thing to do, well take 48h downtime and do it manually if there is no scripts availabe to do it automatically. If you put all devs and GM doing it it should be possible to do it in reasonable timeframe.
It might me smaller portion of population, but every part counts. You can't just screw over approx 20% of your population and make face like all is correct.
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Amarria Black
Clan Anthraxx
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Posted - 2007.12.08 12:24:00 -
[104]
Originally by: Carniflex
It's obvious that they dont plan to rollback. It's too late for that already.
It's pretty ****ty however if you lose stuff bcos CCP misplaced somehow your gun crews inside giant container and lost them somewhere in deep space. I think however that people exploiting that bug should get warnings/bans and people losing stuff to bugs should get fully reimbused (including taking away looted modules from looters and reversing any transaction if they have managed to sell them already). It's ofc ****ty thing to do, well take 48h downtime and do it manually if there is no scripts availabe to do it automatically. If you put all devs and GM doing it it should be possible to do it in reasonable timeframe.
It might me smaller portion of population, but every part counts. You can't just screw over approx 20% of your population and make face like all is correct.
And worst of all, it's the "hardcore" 20% they're screwing over. Those are the people who will still be playing until the server goes dark, who have six and eight subscriptions, who are paying for CCP's kids to go to college. While you can't cater to their every whim, it's completely insane to tell them to go **** up a rope.
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Ontaku Oroa
Minmatar
Masuat'aa Matari
Ushra'Khan
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Posted - 2007.12.08 13:00:00 -
[105]
I think some people are confusing the graphics content upgrade with the real cause of these bugs and that would be the 20 or so Mb patch which was deployed separately from the premium content download.
The fact that you can toggle the new graphics on and off goes to demonstrate that it's not mandatory and therefore has nothing to do with the patch. Otherwise you'd just have to toggle it off and all your problems would go away.
And the fact that everyone was busy gawking at the new models and not wasting time with POS'es on Singularity might be the reason why these bugs were not caught before deployment. ;)
Anyway. Rollback would introduce way more problems than it would solve, especially since people have already started using the new content. The correct course of action, and the one I am sure CCP is following right now, is to work your arse off and deploy a hotfix as soon as possible.
This may be a frustrating situation for a portion of EvE's playerbase, but it will be solved. Train your Patience to V and relax.
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Shevar
Minmatar
A.W.M
Ka-Tet
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Posted - 2007.12.08 13:08:00 -
[106]
Edited by: Shevar on 08/12/2007 13:14:01
To everyone not understanding what the pos owners go through (and fyi posses aren't only in .0).
How would you feel if after a patch any group of 4 or 5 people could break into your hangar in stations take all your stuff and if you petitioned you would only get like half of it back?
That is the real issue, if CCP would FULLY reimburse pos owners affected (with reimbursing I mean replacing and reanchoring the pos with all items in it, not possible profits lost etc.) it wouldn't be a mayor issue.
But quite frankly pos guns not firing, shields not rechargign and insta rof dreads is just way to gamebreaking to allow it to happen.
(and no I don't run any pos, I can't stand the logistics involved)
Originally by: Ontaku Oroa
I think some people are confusing the graphics content upgrade with the real cause of these bugs and that would be the 20 or so Mb patch which was deployed separately from the premium content download.
The fact that you can toggle the new graphics on and off goes to demonstrate that it's not mandatory and therefore has nothing to do with the patch. Otherwise you'd just have to toggle it off and all your problems would go away.
And the fact that everyone was busy gawking at the new models and not wasting time with POS'es on Singularity might be the reason why these bugs were not caught before deployment. ;)
Anyway. Rollback would introduce way more problems than it would solve, especially since people have already started using the new content. The correct course of action, and the one I am sure CCP is following right now, is to work your arse off and deploy a hotfix as soon as possible.
This may be a frustrating situation for a portion of EvE's playerbase, but it will be solved. Train your Patience to V and relax.
First off the player base isn't responsible for keeping track of bugs and reporting them. Yes it will make life easier for CCP and yes I would advice you to do so. But CCP's internal Q&A department is responsible. If they think the player base won't test a certain feature then they have to.
The problem is not so much pos owners demand a roll back but more that GM's rules prohibit them from fully giving back everything lost through these exploits (unless for this specific situation there are specific rules but since no announcement what so ever has been made I wouldn't count on it). And quite frankly waiting patiently while hundreds of millions upwards to billions worth of stuff getting looted/destroyed from your pos'es which you can't prevent doesn't really sound realistic now does it?
---
-The only real drug problem is scoring real good drugs |
Pseudo Ucksth
The Unpodable Supermen
Intrepid Crossing
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Posted - 2007.12.08 13:14:00 -
[107]
Originally by: Ontaku Oroa
Patience to V
I must say that this seems to be the only option we have.
______
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Andrue
Amarr
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Posted - 2007.12.08 13:27:00 -
[108]
Originally by: SnakeByte86
That is a great idea i mean you guys dont need t2 stuff do you? Of course not.
I have all the T2 I need, thank you. Mostly I use faction gear and I never lose it. In any case for all your inability to deal with this situation it won't last. Give it a few days or weeks and it'll be fixed then the game will continue as it did before.
This is the point you lot don't seem to understand and perhaps never do. Empire does not need 0.0. Most people do not need 0.0. The game does not stop just because 0.0 is having a bad week. we don't care.
Well..okay I do care. You pay your money and you have a right to a working game so I support you in that. The point is - so do I. And my game is working just fine, thanks.
Try and be sensible here:20% of people are ****ed with CCP. You are suggesting that they **** off the other 80%. How does that help?
--
(Battle hardened industrialist)
[Brackley, UK]
My budgie can say "ploppy bottom". You have been warned. |
Katharina Gorbacheva
Amarr
Soviet Star Federation
Celestial Frontier
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Posted - 2007.12.08 13:30:00 -
[109]
No one cares about 0.0 crap, fix the PC hang up bug upon warping to stargates FIRST. |
Kysab Senak
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Posted - 2007.12.08 13:43:00 -
[110]
Originally by: Andrue
Originally by: SnakeByte86
That is a great idea i mean you guys dont need t2 stuff do you? Of course not.
I have all the T2 I need, thank you. Mostly I use faction gear and I never lose it. In any case for all your inability to deal with this situation it won't last. Give it a few days or weeks and it'll be fixed then the game will continue as it did before.
This is the point you lot don't seem to understand and perhaps never do. Empire does not need 0.0. Most people do not need 0.0. The game does not stop just because 0.0 is having a bad week. we don't care.
Well..okay I do care. You pay your money and you have a right to a working game so I support you in that. The point is - so do I. And my game is working just fine, thanks.
Try and be sensible here:20% of people are ****ed with CCP. You are suggesting that they **** off the other 80%. How does that help?
We?
Here in Holland we have a saying that only the Queen is allowed to use that term when talking about something.
YOU don't care, and saying WE don't care without clear explanation who we are (and your authority that allows you to speak on behalf of them) doesn't add anything to the discussion.
Besides you can actually place posses in empire. But I guess you don't know enough about the game to make any good assumptions about anything like this.
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Jasmine Constantine
Gallente
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2007.12.08 13:46:00 -
[111]
There is a bit too much random panic in this thread to be honest. Yes the situation with the POS not working is pretty brutal but don't think for a minute that people are going to get away with exploiting this. Anyone who has played the game for a few years knows the score.
Take our example. Star Fraction is about the most famous POS-hating anti territorial force in Eve, we're involved in a war against a POS-deploying shield-hiding force at the moment and have been banging our heads against a cyno-jammer for the last 2 months. Patch hits, we discover their POS no longer work and we could cyno jump the fleet of dreads into their system any time we want.
Result? Ummm guys this is obviously broken, petition it and call off all anti POS ops and have some patience. Thats really the only rational and sporting thing to do. We're got a reputation as good and fair players to protect, we love and cherish the game of Eve, we'd like things fixed and theres no point adding to the already ludicrous petition queues and overworked GM's just to take an advantage that was clearly not meant to happen.
I think most significant 0.0 alliance leadership are having the same thoughts. Its not worth the potential warnings, hits to reputation, general damage to Eve itself to exploit this kind of glitch. And don't think for one moment that the GM's don't have access to logs you don't. Regardless of whether your interface shows who is attacking your inactive POS - the actual GM logs of the event will be available and I'd be very very surprised if these losses will not be fully compensated after the event.
It doesn't need a rollback. A good portion of the server population is enjoying the game in its current state, small scale pvp works fine, the new content by and large works fine.
Sure, POS content is utterly fubared but any aggression against these assets before the fix happens will likely be nullified by complete replacement where petitioned and its only going to be a minority of childish nonsense corps that authorize ongoing attacks in this obvious exploit. If these people continue to make attacks they will get warned and potentially banned.
These things have happened in the past, the responses are well known. Major patches have major problems but ultimately the responsibility for sportsmanship and good behavior resides in us the players and the corporate and alliance leadership.
War Diary : Operation Terminus Est
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tyrol
E X O D U S
Imperial Republic Of the North
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Posted - 2007.12.08 14:21:00 -
[112]
Originally by: Andrue
Originally by: SnakeByte86
That is a great idea i mean you guys dont need t2 stuff do you? Of course not.
I have all the T2 I need, thank you. Mostly I use faction gear and I never lose it. In any case for all your inability to deal with this situation it won't last. Give it a few days or weeks and it'll be fixed then the game will continue as it did before.
This is the point you lot don't seem to understand and perhaps never do. Empire does not need 0.0. Most people do not need 0.0. The game does not stop just because 0.0 is having a bad week. we don't care.
Well..okay I do care. You pay your money and you have a right to a working game so I support you in that. The point is - so do I. And my game is working just fine, thanks.
Try and be sensible here:20% of people are ****ed with CCP. You are suggesting that they **** off the other 80%. How does that help?
Well woopdydoo for you, you can have a chocolate cookie.
I think you will find YOUR the minority with your comment, just because you dont need t2 gear, doesnt mean everyone else in empire doesnt.
To put it into a perspective you will understand. imagine you log on one day to find all your shiny faction/t2 gear is gone, all of it, ships and mods all down a to a measly patch bug. All the time and isk you put into getting them is gone because the GM`s tell you cant have a reimbursement and you will have to start over - thats what 0.0 players are facing.
and no its not a threat or a maybe, some corps/alliances are losing it now, billions in fact.
so please, unless you actually know what your talking about, shut it
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Thargat
Caldari
North Star Networks
Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2007.12.08 14:22:00 -
[113]
Originally by: SnakeByte86
Originally by: Andrue
Originally by: NocturnalDeath
The game is completely unplayable at the moment for those of us with POSes, Dreads, Jump Bridges, and a whole list of other things.
That's a shame but it's absolutely fine for the other 80% of players. Can't you lot take a break and play nice until the problem is solved?
You assume they will be fixing our destroyed POS, we havnt been told yet.
So us low sec people may only represent 20% of the population, but with out us you have less high end minerals, no t2 items, no capital ships, no boosters. Uhh basicly you have nothing cool.
If tons of POS continue to die, expect the eve market to be a scary place for a while.
I thought you had cancelled your accounts ;p
There's only one sig that matters... and that's Radius. |
Tenebrion Darkness
Amarr
Viziam
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Posted - 2007.12.08 14:23:00 -
[114]
I'd suggest (no matter what course of action is taken, rollback, reimbursment, or nothing) that all those having these issues either cut off or scale back their production and exports to empire. Than we'll get to see just how "unimportant" 0.0/lowsec pos production operations are when these forums are flooded with whines on the prices of t2 mods and ships.
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Andrue
Amarr
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Posted - 2007.12.08 15:01:00 -
[115]
Edited by: Andrue on 08/12/2007 15:01:11
Originally by: Tenebrion Darkness
I'd suggest (no matter what course of action is taken, rollback, reimbursment, or nothing) that all those having these issues either cut off or scale back their production and exports to empire. Than we'll get to see just how "unimportant" 0.0/lowsec pos production operations are when these forums are flooded with whines on the prices of t2 mods and ships.
Tell you what - I'll do you a deal.
Right now I and my friends can log on and play the game we like to play exactly as we want to play it. We did that last night as well. Our characters are progressing fine and we're enjoying it. If CCP did what you wanted we'd not be able to do that. Or else we'd lose everything we did last night.
Here's the deal:explain to me why I and my friends should suffer? Tell me what you're going to do to compensate me and my friends for not being able to play the game we love tonight.
--
(Battle hardened industrialist)
[Brackley, UK]
My budgie can say "ploppy bottom". You have been warned. |
Ki An
Gallente
Filiolus Of Bellum
The Church.
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Posted - 2007.12.08 15:01:00 -
[116]
Personally I hate POS warfare and feel they add nothing to the game (for me, mind you). That said, people losing billions of isk due to a bug that is well known and documented without hope for full reimbursement is unacceptable. Make exploiting the bugged POSes a bannable offence, like the time when you couldn't tell a difference between BPOs and BPCs. Make this a high priority fix, and consider reimbursement for all those who have lost anything.
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Andrue
Amarr
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Posted - 2007.12.08 15:03:00 -
[117]
Originally by: Ki An
Personally I hate POS warfare and feel they add nothing to the game (for me, mind you). That said, people losing billions of isk due to a bug that is well known and documented without hope for full reimbursement is unacceptable. Make exploiting the bugged POSes a bannable offence, like the time when you couldn't tell a difference between BPOs and BPCs. Make this a high priority fix, and consider reimbursement for all those who have lost anything.
Has anyone from CCP said that these people won't get reimbursed? If so please link to that posting.
--
(Battle hardened industrialist)
[Brackley, UK]
My budgie can say "ploppy bottom". You have been warned. |
Ki An
Gallente
Filiolus Of Bellum
The Church.
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Posted - 2007.12.08 15:08:00 -
[118]
Edited by: Ki An on 08/12/2007 15:08:07
Originally by: Andrue
Has anyone from CCP said that these people won't get reimbursed? If so please link to that posting.
Not that I know. I am sure they feel it is unacctptable too. The problem is that in previous cases reimbursement has only been offered for stuff that you are able to prove you lost, i.e. the stuff that got destroyed. Anything that survived would not be reimbursed. This is from previous experience, and that's why I am saying that in this case, that policy needs to be seriously looked at.
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Tenebrion Darkness
Amarr
Viziam
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Posted - 2007.12.08 15:17:00 -
[119]
Andrue - Umm.... where did I say what I think ccp should do? If I'm reading myself right, I stated what those having the problems should do.
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Macdeth
Ephemeral Misgivings
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Posted - 2007.12.08 15:27:00 -
[120]
Originally by: Andrue
Originally by: Ki An
Personally I hate POS warfare and feel they add nothing to the game (for me, mind you). That said, people losing billions of isk due to a bug that is well known and documented without hope for full reimbursement is unacceptable. Make exploiting the bugged POSes a bannable offence, like the time when you couldn't tell a difference between BPOs and BPCs. Make this a high priority fix, and consider reimbursement for all those who have lost anything.
Has anyone from CCP said that these people won't get reimbursed? If so please link to that posting.
No, most people are just overreacting as usual. At the same time, though, a lot of losses aren't really going to be the reimbursable material sort. I value a few hours of my time chasing after which starbases where had modules blown up more than billions of isk, and I don't mean that in the "I'll just buy GTCs" sense.
The patch issues may or may not (probably not, and I'm not bothering to petition it) have been involved in some recent losses I would estimate at somewhere between 20 - 50 billion (mostly unrealized and not my isk, conveniently), but even if they were, a straight 'what got blown up where' measure would compensate fewer than ten billion isk guaranteed.
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