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Balor Haliquin Amarr	Posted - 2008.12.07 07:00:00 - [601] GALLENTE Name: Athena Hull: Hyperion Role: Frontline Command Ship Developer: Roden Shipyards Unlike most Gallente ship manufacturers, Roden Shipyards tend to favor missiles over drones and their ships generaly possess stronger armor. Their electronics capacity, however, tends to be weaker than ships from their competitors. Gallente Battleship Bonus: 3% bonus to Large Hybrid Turrets damage per level, 7.5% bonus to armor repair amount per level Flagship Bonus: 5% bonus to fleet member's maximum Armor Hit Points per level, 5% bonus to Large Hybrid Turret falloff per level Role Bonus: 99% reduction in CPU cost for warfare link modules, 12.5% bonus to Sensor Booster and Remote Sensor Booster effectiveness Fitting slots: 8 high / 5 mid / 7 low / 2 rig Power Grid: 15650 CPU: 570 Hard points: 8 Turret/0 Launcher Shield HP: 7000 Shield Resistances: 0/50/55/32.5 Shield Recharge: 2500.00sec Armor HP: 8350 Armor Resistances: 50/10/50/47.5 Hull HP: 8900 Velocity: 110m/s Drone Bay: 100m^3 Drone Bandwidth: 100 MgBits/sec Cargo Bay: 675m^3 Capacitor Capacity: 7200 Capacitor Recharge: 1500.00sec Maximum Targeting Range: 65km Maximum Lock: 6 Sensor Strength: Magnometric 23 Signature Radius: 495m Scanner Resolution: 110 Inertial Modifier: 0.155 Propulsion Strength: Ion 8 Required Skills Primary Skill Required > Flagship I -> Command Ship IV --> Battlecruiser V --> Spaceship Command IV -> Fleet Command I --> Wing Command V ---> Leadership V -> Warfare Link Specialization IV Secondary Skill Required > Gallente Battleship V -> Spaceship Command IV -> Gallente Cruiser V --> Spaceship Command III ---> Gallente Frigate V ---> Spaceship Command I Tertiary Skill Required > Command Ship IV -> Heavy Assault Ship IV --> Assault Ship IV --> Mechanics V --> Engineering V --> Targeting V -> Gunnery V --> Weapon Upgrade IV Name: Artemis Hull: Hyperion Role: Theater Command Ship Developer: CreoDron As the largest drone developer and manufacturer in space, CreoDron has a vested interest in drone carriers. While sacrificing relatively little in the way of defensive capability, the Artimus can chew its way through surprisingly strong opponents - provided, of course, that the pilot uses top-of-the-line CreoDron drones. Gallente Battleship Bonus: 10% bonus to drone Hit Points and Damage per level, 7.5% bonus to armor repair amount per level Flagship Bonus: 5% bonus to fleet member's maximum Armor Hit Points per level, 3% bonus to Information Warfare Link module effectiveness per level Role Bonus: 99% reduction in CPU cost for warfare link modules, Activate 2 warfare link modules simultaneously Fitting slots: 8 high / 6 mid / 6 low / 2 rig Power Grid: 14150 CPU: 570 Hard points: 6 Turret/1 Launcher Shield HP: 7000 Shield Resistances: 0/50/55/32.5 Shield Recharge: 2500.00sec Armor HP: 8500 Armor Resistances: 50/10/50/47.5 Hull HP: 8750 Velocity: 110m/s Drone Bay: 175m^3 Drone Bandwidth: 125 MgBits/sec Cargo Bay: 675m^3 Capacitor Capacity: 7200 Capacitor Recharge: 1500.00sec Maximum Targeting Range: 65km Maximum Lock: 6 Sensor Strength: Magnometric 23 Signature Radius: 495m Scanner Resolution: 110 Inertial Modifier: 0.155 Propulsion Strength: Ion 8 Required Skills Primary Skill Required > Flagship I -> Command Ship IV --> Battlecruiser V --> Spaceship Command IV -> Fleet Command I --> Wing Command V ---> Leadership V -> Warfare Link Specialization IV Secondary Skill Required > Gallente Battleship V -> Spaceship Command IV -> Gallente Cruiser V --> Spaceship Command III ---> Gallente Frigate V ---> Spaceship Command I Tertiary Skill Required > Logistics IV -> Signature Analysis V --> Electronics V --> Mechanics V --> Engineering V -> Long Range Targeting V --> Information Warfare Link III
Balor Haliquin Amarr	Posted - 2008.12.07 07:01:00 - [602] MINMATAR Name: Lahar Hull: Maelstrom Role: Frontline Command Ship Developer: Boundless Creations Boundless Creation's ships are based on the Brutor tribe's philosophy of warfare: simply fit as much firepower onto your ship as possible. Defense systems and electronics arrays therefore tend to take a back seat to sheer annihilative potential. Minmatar Battleship Bonus: 3% bonus to Large Projectile Turret damage per level, 7.5% bonus to shield boost amount per level Flagship Bonus: 5% bonus to fleet member's Signature Radius reduction per level, 5% bonus to Large Projectile Turret falloff per level Role Bonus: 99% reduction in CPU cost for warfare link modules, 20% bonus to Target Painter effectiveness Fitting slots: 8 high / 6 mid / 6 low / 2 rig Power Grid: 18700 CPU: 610 Hard points: 8 Turret/0 Launcher Shield HP: 7650 Shield Resistances: 15/50/40/32.5 Shield Recharge: 2500.00sec Armor HP: 8100 Armor Resistances: 75/10/25/35 Hull HP: 7500 Velocity: 94m/s Drone Bay: 100m^3 Drone Bandwidth: 100 MgBits/sec Cargo Bay: 550 m^3 Capacitor Capacity: 6000 Capacitor Recharge: 1250.00sec Maximum Targeting Range: 75km Maximum Lock: 6 Sensor Strength: Ladar 21 Signature Radius: 470m Scanner Resolution: 90 Inertial Modifier: 0.155 Propulsion Strength: Plasma 9 Required Skills Primary Skill Required > Flagship I -> Command Ship IV --> Battlecruiser V --> Spaceship Command IV -> Fleet Command I --> Wing Command V ---> Leadership V -> Warfare Link Specialization IV Secondary Skill Required > Minmatar Battleship V -> Spaceship Command IV -> Minmatar Cruiser V --> Spaceship Command III ---> Minmatar Frigate V ---> Spaceship Command I Tertiary Skill Required > Command Ship IV -> Heavy Assault Ship IV --> Assault Ship IV --> Mechanics V --> Engineering V --> Electronics V -> Gunnery V --> Weapon Upgrade IV Name: Halberd Hull: Maelstrom Role: Theater Command Ship Developer: Core Complexion Core Complexion's ships are unusual in that they favor electronics and defense over the "lots of guns" approach traditionally favored by the Minmatar. Minmatar Battleship Bonus: 3% bonus to Large Projectile Turret rate of fire per level, 7.5% bonus to shield boost amount per level Flagship Bonus: 5% bonus to fleet member's Signature Radius reduction per level, 3% bonus to Skirmish Warfare Link module effectiveness per level Role Bonus: 99% reduction in CPU cost for warfare link modules, Activate 2 warfare link modules simultaneously Fitting slots: 8 High / 7 Mid / 5 Low / 2 rig Power Grid: 18100 CPU: 610 Hard points: 4 Turret/3 Launcher Shield HP: 8300 Shield Resistances: 15/50/40/32.5 Shield Recharge: 2500.00sec Armor HP: 7350 Armor Resistances: 75/10/25/35 Hull HP: 7600 Velocity: 94m/s Drone Bay: 100m^3 Drone Bandwidth: 100 MgBits/sec Cargo Bay: 550 m^3 Capacitor Capacity: 6000 Capacitor Recharge: 1250.00sec Maximum Targeting Range: 75km Maximum Lock: 6 Sensor Strength: Ladar 21 Signature Radius: 470m Scanner Resolution: 90 Inertial Modifier: 0.155 Propulsion Strength: Plasma 9 Required Skills Primary Skill Required > Flagship I -> Command Ship IV --> Battlecruiser V --> Spaceship Command IV -> Fleet Command I --> Wing Command V ---> Leadership V -> Warfare Link Specialization IV Secondary Skill Required > Minmatar Battleship V -> Spaceship Command IV -> Minmatar Cruiser V --> Spaceship Command III ---> Minmatar Frigate V ---> Spaceship Command I Tertiary Skill Required > Logistics IV -> Signature Analysis V --> Electronics V --> Mechanics V --> Engineering V -> Long Range Targeting V --> Skirmish Warfare Link III
Gantor Tesla	Posted - 2008.12.08 02:32:00 - [603] I still think these ships, especially the Caldari fail to be worth what is assuredly a HUGE build cost, and a long amount of training. I would not buy on of these ships if I already had the prereqs. I'd just go fly a CS.
Balor Haliquin Amarr	Posted - 2008.12.09 01:52:00 - [604] I'm not entirely happy wit the skill requirements and how they set players up for capital ships, as in they largely don't. Ill set to work on them ans see if i can come up with a better setup.
Noah Cyril	Posted - 2008.12.10 16:57:00 - [605] Originally by: Gantor Tesla I still think these ships, especially the Caldari fail to be worth what is assuredly a HUGE build cost, and a long amount of training. I would not buy on of these ships if I already had the prereqs. I'd just go fly a CS. Is a caldari ship, wat u expect? 8 launchers+ rof bonus??? just be glad is a missile ship that dont look as bad as the raven :p and btw, i think the Bastion should hav a 10% per lvl for optimal range per lvl same as the rokh.
Balor Haliquin Amarr	Posted - 2008.12.11 20:46:00 - [606] Right I will look into that. Thanks for pointing it out.
Balor Haliquin Amarr	Posted - 2008.12.13 00:10:00 - [607] bump this is the main page for the Flagships, please put opinions here.
Dhejay Centrix Caldari The Wailing Doom	Posted - 2008.12.13 21:32:00 - [608] Spaceship command lvl 5 should be a prereq for the flagships skill tbh. These should be hard to fly and the potential bonuses they would give to any fleet are worth it.
Illithid Caretaker Minmatar Illithid Technologies	Posted - 2008.12.14 07:19:00 - [609] These are a great idea. A lot of work has gone into these ideas and I think that they are worthy of either Dev input or CSM voting. Why has this thread been moved out of the CSM discussion folder? I think that these ships would plug the gap between BS and capitals quite nicely. They should be hard to train for and they are not an "I win" option. Cudo to Balor Haliquin for his hard work on this topic.
Dhejay Centrix Caldari The Wailing Doom	Posted - 2008.12.14 11:49:00 - [610] Bumped because this is a really good idea. It occurs to me that calling one of the Caldari ships "Tsunami" is not in fitting with the naming convention of Caldari ships, it sounds more like a Minmatar name to be honest to fit with Typhoon, Tempest, Maelstrom etc. Having said this, it's a good ship name and I can't think of anything better at the moment.
Gantor Tesla	Posted - 2008.12.14 22:34:00 - [611] Originally by: Balor Haliquin bump this is the main page for the Flagships, please put opinions here. Moving my points from the other thread here. 1. WTH do these ships require frigate V????? 2. I still think the Theater Command need the ability to run a 3rd link. I think this could be off set with a Warfare Link Specialization V requisite. It would also help justify buying a Battleship that costs more than a Carrier. 3. Why do the Caldari get half the drone bay of all the other ships? Even if we get half the bandwidth, 100m3 of bay would be nice. Originally by: Balor Haliquin I'm not entirely happy wit the skill requirements and how they set players up for capital ships, as in they largely don't. Ill set to work on them ans see if i can come up with a better setup. Perhaps a new Skill Suggestion Frontline Command Ship Required Skills Primary Skill Required > Flagship I -> Command Ship IV --> Battlecruiser V --> Spaceship Command IV -> Fleet Command I --> Wing Command V ---> Leadership V -> Warfare Link Specialization V * -> Spaceship Command V ** Secondary Skill Required > Caldari Battleship V Tertiary Skill Required > Command Ship IV > Heavy Assault Ship IV -> Assault Ship IV -> Mechanics V -> Engineering V > Targeting V > Advanced Weapon Upgrades IV -> Weapon Upgrades V * If we went with the current link config, added skill requirement for a Command Processor that should be built into the ship to accommodate for the built in bonus. The reason being, your Frontline Command Ship has its bonus, +1 link ,and the Theater Command Ship has its bonus +2 links. To keep the balance in link number between the roles even, the Theater need to run 3 links + its bonus. Here is why. As it sits currently Field CS (T2 BC) gets 1 link, Fleet CS (T2 BC) gets 3. The way you have it set up, the Frontline gets two and the Theater still only gets 3, thus nerfing it's role. So, in order to account for the extra bonus link being built into both ships, Command Processor style equipment is needed, and thus in my opinion, the skills to use it. These are sure to be the biggest sub capital ships. They need rightly should carry a SC V Requirement. In response to Originally by:** Gantor Tesla If we had to do a Field Com / Fleet Com style, why not: Field: 100% Role Bonus to BS sized weapon, 4 weapons Able to run 3 links 100% Per Flagship lvl to Link effectiveness Fleet: 500% Role Bonus to Cap Transport and ______ Rep Range Able to run 6 links 100% per Flagship lvl to link effectiveness. 20% per Flagship lvl to Cap Trans / Rep amount Originally by: Noah Cyril That is just overpowering 100% Per Flagship lvl to Link effectiveness??, This was a typo, It was meant to read 10%. Sorry I did not see this earlier.
Dhejay Centrix Caldari The Wailing Doom	Posted - 2008.12.15 10:34:00 - [612] Originally by: Gantor Tesla 1. WTH do these ships require frigate V????? Chances are that if you've already trained assault ships then you have frigate 5 in at least one race although I agree that the racial frigate skill at lvl 5 shouldn't be a prerequisite. I can drive a car just fine but don't have a motorcycle license. Originally by: Gantor Tesla 2. I still think the Theater Command need the ability to run a 3rd link. I think this could be off set with a Warfare Link Specialization V requisite. It would also help justify buying a Battleship that costs more than a Carrier. You shouldn't have to use ability to justify retail price, it's all about the build cost. I doubt that will be more than a carrier. Agreed on the 3rd link and warfare link specialization though, these should have all the command abilities of their smaller counterparts. Originally by: Gantor Tesla 3. Why do the Caldari get half the drone bay of all the other ships? Even if we get half the bandwidth, 100m3 of bay would be nice. Because Caldari ships with massive drone bays would become what we don't want, solo OMGWTFPWNBBQ monsters and we don't want to create them.
Balor Haliquin Amarr	Posted - 2008.12.15 22:21:00 - [613] The reason that the Theater Command ship does not have the 3rd warfare link on it is because of 2 reasons. First off, someone had pointed out that making the skip a carbon copy as far as command bonuses of the fleet command ship (the Command Ship) would make it a bit obsolete. Put on top of the effect of the fleet bonus from the ships, that would with the 3 warfare links, would give the ship effectively 4 fleet bonus. That would basicly overshadowed the fleet command ship. As for the Frigates requirement, I did all of the requirements and skills needed. So frigates 5 made it on to the list. It is a requirement for Assault Ships, Heavy Assault Ships, and Command Ships. And all of those are required for Flagships. But as i have said I'm not happy with how much time the skilling actually soaks up. I have to remember that the skilling for the ship must also include skilling up gunner/missiles and tanking skills and anything els that a person might want to do. So i will have to reduce the list. Noting also that the other T2 battleships are much less stringent on skill time. Caldari have s small drone bay simply because that is what the race is based around. Small drone bays and great missiles. So it is not going to change.
Dhejay Centrix Caldari The Wailing Doom	Posted - 2008.12.15 23:31:00 - [614] Edited by: Dhejay Centrix on 15/12/2008 23:35:43 Frigate 5 isn't actually required to train the assault ships skill. I don't think adding the 3rd link would make the smaller command ships obsolete, they are considerably cheaper, more mobile and cost less to fit. Command ships also have less skill requirements than these monsters we are proposing. If I was running a large fleet of BS and other ships I'd want a flagship for the bonuses, if I was running a fleet of smaller ships I'd use a command ship. The 3rd link is important or these won't be used for the purpose they were designed for. I can understand your reasoning for not adding it but we could always leave it as an option for CSM/DEV discussion if it comes to that. In answer to another post in this thread, I agree completely that the frontline variant of the Caldari flagship should be the missile boat and the sniper should be the theatre command. Also, 4 fleet bonuses is awesome for all sorts of reasons, the ship would become a primary target in every engagement and so there would have to be considerable effort involved in fielding one since you'd need a few support vessels to ensure it didn't die in the first volly, or you'd be swapping safespots all the time and hoping that the guys you were fighting didn't have uber scanning skills and equipment.
Hettar Caldari C.R.I.M.E	Posted - 2008.12.16 03:21:00 - [615] probbally already been said, but i fly rohks and they dont need any more range on there turrets the damn things can already shoot further than they can lock, 3-5% dmg to L hybrids would be much more kewler
Balor Haliquin Amarr	Posted - 2008.12.16 04:08:00 - [616] Right sorry i keep forgetting that an Assault Ship skill requires Frigates 4 but the ship requires frigates 5. Or some screwed up thing like that. Ill be changing the skill trees soon. And I am going to change the bonus to the Bastion. I, like many others, would rather not have the ship have basicly a duplicate bonus. AS for the extra active warfare link module on the theater command ship. I would like to keep that off and see (if the people at EFT would be so nice) the effects of the ships fleet bonuses before boosting it even more. I can see the arguments for and against. And unfortunately without actual testing I have no way of knowing.
Dhejay Centrix Caldari The Wailing Doom	Posted - 2008.12.16 13:28:00 - [617] The assault ships skill itself has no requirement for a racial frigate skill to be trained but frigate 4 will in fact be a pre-requisite as you need it to train the cruiser and then the battleship skill.
Balor Haliquin Amarr	Posted - 2008.12.16 22:11:00 - [618] I have completely redone the skills for the ships. Both ships are now much more oriented in getting pilots into capital ships. Or by the same token for getting capital pilots into the fleet command role. Ill give the amarr example. Frontline Command Ship Primary Skills Required > Amarr Battleships V -> Spaceship Command IV -> Amarr Cruisers IV --> Spaceship Command III --> Amarr Frigates IV ---> Spaceship Command I Secondary Skills Required > Flagships -> Fleet Commander I --> Wing Commander V --> Warfare Link Specialization IV ---> Leadership V -> Advanced Spaceship Command IV --> Spaceship Command V Tertiary Skills Required > Command Ships IV -> Heavy Assault Ships IV --> Assault Ships IV ---> Engineering V ---> Mechanics V ---> Spaceship Command III -> Advanced Weapons Upgrades V --> Weapon Upgrades V Theater Command Ship Primary Skills Required > Amarr Battleships V -> Spaceship Command IV -> Amarr Cruisers IV --> Spaceship Command III --> Amarr Frigates IV ---> Spaceship Command I Secondary Skills Required > Flagships -> Fleet Commander I --> Wing Commander V --> Warfare Link Specialization IV ---> Leadership V -> Advanced Spaceship Command V --> Spaceship Command V Tertiary Skills Required > Logistics IV -> Spaceship Command III -> Signature Analysis V --> Electronics I -> Long Range Targeting V --> Electronics II -> Drone Interfacing V --> Drones V
Gantor Tesla	Posted - 2008.12.16 23:54:00 - [619] -> Advanced Spaceship Command IV This skill is reserved for capital ships as it subjects them to an additional agility bonus.
Gantor Tesla	Posted - 2008.12.16 23:58:00 - [620] Originally by: Balor Haliquin -> Drone Interfacing V --> Drones V You can not seriously expect me to train these skills for Drone Bay: 50m^3 Drone Bandwidth: 50 MgBits/sec ??????????????????????????????
Balor Haliquin Amarr	Posted - 2008.12.17 00:18:00 - [621] The reason for those skills is to get people ready for capital ships. I know that some of the required skills seem out of wack but people have complained that the ships seem rather devoid of preparing pilot for the leap into capital ships. Yes Advanced Spaceship Command affords a bonus only to capital ships but their are no ships that currently require less then level 5 for the skill. So putting it in at a lesser level gives you a bit of a stepping stone on your way to capital ships. The drone requirement for the Caldari Theater Command Ship seems strange but think of it this way. I basicly makes you drones twice as effective at doing damage then if you had not trained the skill to 5. It is a required skill for carriers and the Theater comman ship is supposed to be a stepping stone of sorts for that ship. So why not get you most of the way there while training for the ship. And now you have a frighteningly good wave of drones form a Caldari ship.
Dhejay Centrix Caldari The Wailing Doom	Posted - 2008.12.17 13:31:00 - [622] I really don't think you should have a skill requirement for flying the ship that doesn't relate to the needs of the craft itself. I understand that you want something to "bridge the gap" between BS and caps but this is not the way to do it. Unless a ship is a dedicated drone carrier you really shouldn't need drone skills for it.
DeltaPhalanx Caldari Hordes Of Belial	Posted - 2008.12.17 20:45:00 - [623] Edited by: DeltaPhalanx on 17/12/2008 20:48:10 I had originally posted this in your other Flagships thread before it was moved here; I hadn't previously seen this thread. If I express a bit of ignorance please forgive me; being at work and not having time to read through 20+ pages of thread would take more time than my lunch break allows Given that I'm specialising in the Commandships line, I'd approve of this concept. However, being a Caldari wing commander with hybrid gunnery skills, I'm afronted by the suggested roles of the Bastion and Tsunami; I believe you have them reversed. The Tsunami, should, in keeping with the Nighthawk, be the Frontline, and the Bastion, in parity with the Vulture, be the Theater Flagship; tweaking your suggested fittings to represent this change in roles is acceptable. Antimatter out to 62KM before range enhancment modules from 450mm II's, sign me up!
Kweel Nakashyn Minmatar Brutor tribe	Posted - 2008.12.17 20:54:00 - [624] Originally by: Balor Haliquin Kweel, could you please explain what you mean by bugged? The problem is if it could fit 8 turrets, it can't use warfare modules. some players would use all turrets and the ship would lost his role, making it "only" a new bigbadaboom toy. If you want ppl to use it the role it's gave, you should make untradable for gank or tank caracteristics as it's basically the two primary caracteristics ppl try to optimise when fitting a ship. Else it would be another commandship without err... "caractFre" (DAMN MY ENGLISH SKILLS SUXXXXXXXXXX I can't find the word, both bablefish and googletranslation gives me character but character in french is "personnage" and "caractFre" is ?????) Fetchez la vache !
Balor Haliquin Amarr	Posted - 2008.12.17 21:15:00 - [625] Fair enough, i can see the point when you all say that Advanced Spaceship Command for this ship is rather useless. And that will be droping off the skill tree. I was just trying to make the skill tree a bit more toward the getting people into capital ships line. As for the bonus to the Bastion. Im not sure what els to put in its place. The vast majority of the Caldari rail ships have 2 bonuses to hybred range. And if i was to replace the one bonus with a damage on it would be better then that gallente ships at throwing fire and dealing damage. The Bastion and the Tsunami are reversed because it allows the Tsunami to fit warfare links and a full complement of weapons. I figured that made more sence then an under gunned Bastion and a standard gunned Tsunami that people were left scratching their heads about what to do with the last 2 slots. As for the minmatar ships, they may be allowed to fit 8 guns but I think that due to the restrictive fittings you might only be able to fit 6 or 7 which leaves more then enough room for warfare links. Though a proposal for an alternative is welcome.
Myrkala Minmatar Aurora Acclivitous	Posted - 2008.12.17 21:51:00 - [626] I think the 4/3 turret/launcher hardpoints on the halberd are a bit dull. Would 6/3 be unbalanced, what about 6/2? The maelstrom already had 8/3... I think 6/3 or 6/2 is a better choice, let the ship use the bonuses it gets a bit more. But then again it gets the TP bonus, but that doesn't help much for shooting the CAPs I imagine, fighters drones maybe. Just my thoughts. "Ruppie ain't no puppie."
Balor Haliquin Amarr	Posted - 2008.12.18 05:14:00 - [627] I can do 6/1 for the turrets and missiles for the Halbred. But I want to keep it in the theme of the others. Considering that the other Theater Command ships get a max of 7 missile and turrets combined. Thanks for pointing that out.
DeltaPhalanx Caldari Hordes Of Belial	Posted - 2008.12.18 20:09:00 - [628] Originally by: Balor Haliquin ... The Bastion and the Tsunami are reversed because it allows the Tsunami to fit warfare links and a full complement of weapons. I figured that made more sence then an under gunned Bastion and a standard gunned Tsunami that people were left scratching their heads about what to do with the last 2 slots. I feel that the roles are reversed not based on the suggested fittings, but because of how the vessels would most likely be used. Fitting issues aside, as this proposal can continue to be modified, you would most likely see in practice that the Tsunami would be on the front line, with the Bastion hanging back playing sniper. I base this off of the most likely fittings that both classes would see under PvP; Tsunamis would more often than not, be fitted with Torpedos, using their much higher damage and rate of fire to tear through a designated primary at close range. Whereas you'd likely see the Bastion fitted much like a Rokh currently is; with a full rack of 425mm II's and a hold of Spike L, some Antimatter L, and however many cap boosters the pod pilot can carry. Now, Spike L from Rokh with Caldari BS V can already be thrown to an Optimal of 194KM + 30KM of falloff; and assuming that same pod pilot trains Flagships to IV that optimal becomes 218KM. 218Km is well into sniping range, and its being accomplished with no addtional range enhancements; throwing in even one Tracking Enhancer II pushes that optimal out to 251KM, which is outside of the hardcoded Maximum Targeting range of 250KM. I'd hardly call 220KM, assuming a hostile fleet and friendlies operating within a 30KM sphere of a gate, the front line; yet you'd probably see a Tsunami operating within that same sphere. While both vessels are clearly in the theater, in practice you'd have your Theater Flagship on the front line, and the Frontline sitting out at extreme range.
Balor Haliquin Amarr	Posted - 2008.12.18 22:14:00 - [629] Right my fear though is that all the Tsunami would be used for is a sniper platform if it was moved into the Theater Command ship role and no one would ever use it for the position it was designed for. Propose an alternative to the second range bonus. And what is preveting pilots from fitting blasters instead of rails?
Gantor Tesla	Posted - 2008.12.18 23:14:00 - [630] Originally by: Balor Haliquin Yes Advanced Spaceship Command affords a bonus only to capital ships but their are no ships that currently require less then level 5 for the skill. So putting it in at a lesser level gives you a bit of a stepping stone on your way to capital ships. Freighters Require ASC 1. Somehow a Battleship needs 4?

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