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Emperor Salazar
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
24
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Posted - 2011.09.07 13:38:00 -
[1] - Quote
Originally posted this with my alt, xxSketchxx, here is my proposal for a Tech 3 Industrial Cruiser.
Subsystems
Industrial Subsystems:
Ore Yield GÇô 25% bonus to mining laser yield and +5,000m3 ore hold per level; 5/0/0 (5 turrets); 500m3 cargo
Covert Ops Reconfiguration GÇô 40% bonus to mining laser yield and 10% increased cargo capacity per level; 99.5% reduction in Cloaking Device CPU use; 90 second cloaking activation delay after deactivation of mining laser(s); 4/0/0 (3 turrets); 500m3 cargo
Deep Core Extraction - 7.5% bonus to Mercoxit Mining Crystal Yield multiplier and +2000m3 Mercoxit Storage Bay per level; 50% reduction in mining laser optimal range; 5/0/0 (5 turrets); 400m3 cargo
Harvesters Efficiency Optimizer GÇô 10% decreased duration of gas harvesters and +5,000 m3 gas chamber per level; 5/0/0 (5 turrets); 350m3 cargo
Defensive Subsystems:
Adaptive Shielding GÇô 5% bonus to all shield resistances per level; 1/1/0
Amplification Node GÇô 10% bonus to booster effectiveness per level; 0/2/0
Industrial Processor GÇô 5% bonus to effectiveness of mining foreman gang links per level; 99% reduction in CPU need for Gang Link modules; 1/0/1
Signature Optimizer GÇô 5% reduction in signature radius per level; 0/1/1
Engineering Subsystems:
Capacitor Regeneration Matrix GÇô 5% reduction in capacitor recharge rate per level; 0/0/3
Power Core Multiplier GÇô 10% bonus to power output per level; 1/0/2
Mining Laser Field Enhancement - 10% increase in range of Mining Lasers and Gas Harvesters per level; 1/0/2
Harvester Capacitor Optimization GÇô 10% reduced capacitor usage of Mining Lasers and Gas Harvesters per level; 0/0/3
Electronic Subsystems:
Harvester CPU Efficiency Gate GÇô 5% reduction in CPU penalties of mining upgrade modules per level; 20% bonus to survey scanner range per level; 0/3/1
Obfuscation Manifold GÇô 20% bonus to ECM target jammer strength per level; 0/4/0
Emergent Locus Analyzer GÇô 10% increase to scan strength of probes per level and 20% bonus to range and velocity of tractor beams per level; 0/4/0
Dissolution Sequencer GÇô15% bonus to ship sensor strength per level; 0/3/1
Propulsion Subsystems:
Interdiction Nullifier GÇô Immunity to non-targeted interdiction; 0/0/0
Intercalated Nanofibers GÇô 5% increased agility per level; 0/0/1
Hull Construction Reconfiguration GÇô 5% reduction in mass per level; 0/0/0
Chassis Optimization GÇô 10% bonus to max velocity per level; 0/0/1
Some hull info
Base: 50m3 drone bay and 50mbit bandwidth
O.R.E Industrial Cruiser Skill Bonus: Can deploy 1 additional mining drone per level.
Some key points to take away:
All numbers are rough figures just to give an idea of the possible bonuses. The mining bonuses have been fleshed out to some degree to make them competitive but not on par with that of a hulk. All configurations that emulate a role that has a specialized ship for the role will be inferior to their specialized cousins, though may have some unique features. For instance, the Industrial Command Processor gives a 5% bonus to effectiveness per level but can only fit 1 link without needing command processers to allow for more gang links.
Some potential unique features:
- covert ops miner (between retriever and covetor mining capabilities)
- ECM defense (strength equivalent to that of kitsune with current bonus)
- interdiction nullification
- potentially difficult to probe
Rough numbers for max skilled mining setups: (Modified to reflect yield bonus changes)
- Osprey = 656/min (3x MDCM II, T2 crystals)
- Retriever = 755/min (2x T2 strips and T2 crystals)
- T3 Covert Ops = 981m3/min (3x MDCM II, T2 crystals)
- Covetor = 1132m3/min (T2 strips and T2 crystals)
- T3 miner = 1226m3/min (5x MDCM II, T2 crystals)
- Hulk = 1302m3/min (T2 strips and T2 crystals)
Skill Requirements
O.R.E Industrial Cruiser [Rank 5]:
Advanced Spaceship Command 5 O.R.E. Industrial Subsystem 1 -Mining 5
-Astrogeology 3
O.R.E. Defensive Subsystem 1 -Shield Operation 5
-Shield Management 3
O.R.E. Engineering Subsystem 1 -Engineering 5
-Energy Management 3
O.R.E. Electronics Subsystem 1 -Electronics 5
-Survey 3
O.R.E. Propulsion Subsystem 1 -Navigation 5
-Evasive Maneuvering 3
In closing: I think these subsystems will allow for a unique and versatile ship. Furthermore, should T3 one day be able to change subsystems at POSs, the T3 industrial will truly come into its own in terms of versatility and adaptability. In addition to potentially being an industrialistGÇÖs wet dream, this ship will also provide yet another juicy target for pirates abound.
Link to original thread is here
I will post below with xxSketchxx to verify that he is my alt. |

XXSketchxx
Remote Soviet Industries
0
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Posted - 2011.09.07 13:40:00 -
[2] - Quote
Posting to confirm that I am the alt of Emperor Salazar. |

44000
A Black Spot
1
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Posted - 2011.09.08 13:48:00 -
[3] - Quote
nicely fleshed out idea,
it really comes into its own with the cov-ops, althought the mass reduction will **** ppl off with the whole wormholes are feeding to many minerals into the market problem!
however, the idea for gas mining is brillient, esp with the bonuses to scanning. nice work. although a bit of fine tuening needs doing. such as the 90 second delay to cloaking afeter mining lasor? it kind of negates the point of it, as ud just fit a normal cloak to a higher mining subsystem cuz ul be able to ninja better. |

Rek Seven
Zandathorn Industries
3
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Posted - 2011.09.08 14:00:00 -
[4] - Quote
The figures and precise details are irrelevant but the idea is sound. |

Emperor Salazar
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
24
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Posted - 2011.09.08 14:07:00 -
[5] - Quote
44000 wrote:such as the 90 second delay to cloaking afeter mining lasor? it kind of negates the point of it, as ud just fit a normal cloak to a higher mining subsystem cuz ul be able to ninja better.
This was a result of discussion in the original thread. The idea is that the covert cloak allows you to get to where you want to be and mine somewhat effectively. It was agreed that one should not be able to simply cloak and slink away at the first sign of danger, hence the 90 second delay. Without the delay, one would be able to sit >2k km away from an asteroid and cloak as soon as a potentially hostile ship got on grid and then leave at their leisure. This would simply be too safe. |

Twilight Runner
1
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Posted - 2011.09.08 14:17:00 -
[6] - Quote
I like this, also t3 frigates |

Rek Seven
Zandathorn Industries
3
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Posted - 2011.09.08 14:42:00 -
[7] - Quote
On closer examination, this is just a T3 mining barge...
I would also like to fit a t3 industrial ship to fit the role of a hauler, that is idea for traders to move goods in and out of null sec.
Also the cloaky sub needs 5 high slots for a probe launcher otherwise it's pointless for anyone using the ship outside of null sec.. Anyway i'm contradicting myself now as i'm sure CCP will be deciding the details  |

Emperor Salazar
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
24
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Posted - 2011.09.08 14:54:00 -
[8] - Quote
Rek Seven wrote:On closer examination, this is just a T3 mining barge... I would also like to fit a t3 industrial ship to fit the role of a hauler, that is idea for traders to move goods in and out of null sec. Also the cloaky sub needs 5 high slots for a probe launcher otherwise it's pointless for anyone using the ship outside of null sec.. Anyway i'm contradicting myself now as i'm sure CCP will be deciding the details 
Honestly there are already pretty good ship alternatives for traders to move goods with safety (Prorator has a covert cloak and can be fit for 10k+ m3).
The current design supports dedicated hauling. A 25k m3 ore hauler or a 25k m3 gas hauler or a 10k m3 mercoxit hauler could be created with this current design.
As for high slots, there are currently 4 subsystems (2 defensive, 2 engineering) that could each add 1 high slot. This means with a cloak fit T3 industrial, you could have 6 high slots pretty easily.
As an example, cloak fit, adaptive shielding, mining laser field enhancement, emergent locus analyzer, and interdiction nullifier would result in a 6/5/2 layout with 4 turrets. |

Rek Seven
Zandathorn Industries
3
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Posted - 2011.09.08 15:19:00 -
[9] - Quote
Emperor Salazar wrote:
The current design supports dedicated hauling. A 25k m3 ore hauler or a 25k m3 gas hauler or a 10k m3 mercoxit hauler could be created with this current design.
As for high slots, there are currently 4 subsystems (2 defensive, 2 engineering) that could each add 1 high slot. This means with a cloak fit T3 industrial, you could have 6 high slots pretty easily.
As an example, cloak fit, adaptive shielding, mining laser field enhancement, emergent locus analyzer, and interdiction nullifier would result in a 6/5/2 layout with 4 turrets.
Okay, that sounds good then
Emperor Salazar wrote: Honestly there are already pretty good ship alternatives for traders to move goods with safety (Prorator has a covert cloak and can be fit for 10k+ m3).
Couldn't the same be said for this T3 mining barge idea? I think having a hauler that can cloak, scan it's way through WH space, have a good tank and the ability to defend it's self with things like ECM would be awesome... Maybe increase the align time if an expanded cargo sub is used. |

Emperor Salazar
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
24
|
Posted - 2011.09.08 15:25:00 -
[10] - Quote
Rek Seven wrote:Emperor Salazar wrote: Honestly there are already pretty good ship alternatives for traders to move goods with safety (Prorator has a covert cloak and can be fit for 10k+ m3). Couldn't the same be said for this T3 mining barge idea? I think having a hauler that can cloak, scan it's way through WH space, have a good tank and the ability to defend it's self with things like ECM would be awesome... Maybe increase the align time if an expanded cargo sub is used.
You could always fit an improved cloak to the ship if you use the 25k m3, higher efficiency mining subsystem. Or to the gas harvester or mercoxit setups as long as you have those 2 extra utility high slots (1 for cloak, 1 for probe launcher).
And in wh space, the sites are relatively easy to find so you don't really need the emergent locus analyzer, thus you could use one of the other electronic subsystems.
The covert cloak setup has the drawback of smaller cargo capacity because I do not want this ship to outshine any currently existing ships, especially T2 ones. If I gave it higher cargo capacity, it would simply be a better blockade runner (cargo + cloak + tank + other abilities). This is not something I want to do. |
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Sigras
Conglomo IMPERIAL LEGI0N
3
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Posted - 2011.09.08 18:04:00 -
[11] - Quote
well currently, the max cargo you could get on this ship that uses a covert ops cloak and interdiction nullifier would be 1437.50 m^3
500 m^3 base + 50% for level 5 industrial + 5 expanded cargo II @ 27.5% each
Any thought as to what the T3 industrial book itself would do because overheating is not all that useful in mining.
and yes I still think this is a great idea. |

Rek Seven
Zandathorn Industries
3
|
Posted - 2011.09.09 08:26:00 -
[12] - Quote
Yup, still not down with a T3 that's just a mining barge... |

Sigras
Conglomo IMPERIAL LEGI0N
3
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Posted - 2011.09.09 09:13:00 -
[13] - Quote
you know, I was gonna troll you for that post, but then I got to thinking about it . . . T3 is about being more versatile than T2 but not necessarily better, and you do have a point that it is essentially three iterations of a mining barge and a dedicated gas harvesting ship.
Do you have any suggestions for other industrial roles this ship could fill?
Maybe instead of the mercoxit miner which basically overlaps with the regular miner, it could mine ice or haul PI mats or something? IDK |

Emperor Salazar
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
24
|
Posted - 2011.09.09 11:20:00 -
[14] - Quote
Sigras wrote:you know, I was gonna troll you for that post, but then I got to thinking about it . . . T3 is about being more versatile than T2 but not necessarily better, and you do have a point that it is essentially three iterations of a mining barge and a dedicated gas harvesting ship.
Do you have any suggestions for other industrial roles this ship could fill?
Maybe instead of the mercoxit miner which basically overlaps with the regular miner, it could mine ice or haul PI mats or something? IDK
I'm not comfortable with having it mine ice due to the need for ice harvesters which are designed for larger ships than I intended this thing to be. If CCP were to introduce smaller ice miners and thus smaller pieces of ice then it might be feasible.
Hauling PI mats? meh.
And this ship really isn't just a mining barge. You have the potential for the following:
-25k m3 ore hauler -25k m3 gas hauler -10k m3 mercoxit hauler -Mining booster (with higher boosts than an orca) -Combat industrial (absolutely doable if you are creative - I can easily see an autocannon fit being quite possible with 5 drones as well, ECM and a mean tank. -Exploration platform
I don't know about you guys but...I don't see that as "just a mining barge." |

Firartix
Sense of Serendipity Echoes of Nowhere
2
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Posted - 2011.09.09 11:25:00 -
[15] - Quote
I don't really know about that 25,000 m3 gas bay (... it just sounds.... too op), but EVE sure could use a dedicated gas harvesting ship! And the idea of T3 Blockade Runner is nice too.
In my opinion though, it'd be too much work redoing the whole T3 system onto another ship class. It's just gonna make the game too complicated by having so many subsystems/classes (people have already been complaining about that regarding new addition of some ships) I'd rather ask for a subsystem addition to the current existing T3s then.. why would you want a specific Industrial T3 class and skill? Just make an "ORE Subsystem" pack.
Voted  |

Emperor Salazar
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
24
|
Posted - 2011.09.09 11:31:00 -
[16] - Quote
Firartix wrote:I don't really know about that 25,000 m3 gas bay (... it just sounds.... too op), but EVE sure could use a dedicated gas harvesting ship! And the idea of T3 Blockade Runner is nice too. In my opinion though, it'd be too much work redoing the whole T3 system onto another ship class. It's just gonna make the game too complicated by having so many subsystems/classes (people have already been complaining about that regarding new addition of some ships) I'd rather ask for a subsystem addition to the current existing T3s then.. why would you want a specific Industrial T3 class and skill? Just make an "ORE Subsystem" pack. Voted 
I personally think it would be more work to try and add them to the current T3 than simply create a new ship and mirror the subsystems over with some tweaks to the names/stats/abilities. And, the game should be more complicated. People complain about the addition of ships to the game when they overshadow existing ships. Each ability this ship has is designed to prevent this - to provide unique alternatives to existing ships with added versatility, much like the current T3 line.
As for the gas bay, this is more a result of gas harvesting in known-space. Ladars there have gas that is 10 m3 per unit, with thousands of units at a given site (low sec ones have up to 5k units, so this bay would support half of that). This bay would help alleviate some of the logistics with this, enabling people to actually harvest this gas efficiently. With combat boosters getting a look by CCP "soon" I think this is more and more essential. |

Emperor Salazar
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
27
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Posted - 2011.09.14 11:42:00 -
[17] - Quote
Bump to the top. |

Pattern Clarc
Aperture Harmonics K162
3
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Posted - 2011.09.14 12:18:00 -
[18] - Quote
Looks good, added here |

Emperor Salazar
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
31
|
Posted - 2011.09.16 16:37:00 -
[19] - Quote
Bumping. |

Tchal'la
Tachyon Training
0
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Posted - 2011.09.19 00:45:00 -
[20] - Quote
I really like this idea, but I would still rather see this as an extension of existing T3 cruisers. It would really give an option for a one-ship-does-it-all exploration option, being able to configure for probing, combat, radar, mag, ladar, and grav sites, as well as being able to haul out the spoils. |
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Rek Seven
Zandathorn Industries
4
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Posted - 2011.09.19 08:39:00 -
[21] - Quote
Tchal'la wrote:I really like this idea, but I would still rather see this as an extension of existing T3 cruisers. It would really give an option for a one-ship-does-it-all exploration option, being able to configure for probing, combat, radar, mag, ladar, and grav sites, as well as being able to haul out the spoils.
Agreed. Bonuses to hacking and analyzing would be nice. |

Emperor Salazar
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
116
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Posted - 2011.09.19 11:36:00 -
[22] - Quote
Rek Seven wrote:Tchal'la wrote:I really like this idea, but I would still rather see this as an extension of existing T3 cruisers. It would really give an option for a one-ship-does-it-all exploration option, being able to configure for probing, combat, radar, mag, ladar, and grav sites, as well as being able to haul out the spoils. Agreed. Bonuses to hacking and analyzing would be nice.
I see bonuses to hacking/analyzing as something an SoE ship would be good for. |

DetKhord Saisio
Unchained Potential Test Alliance Please Ignore
2
|
Posted - 2011.09.19 15:03:00 -
[23] - Quote
Rek Seven wrote:Yup, still not down with a T3 that's just a mining barge... Hulk is best for ore, Mackinaw for ice, and Skiff for mercoxit. Since no hull has gas harvesting bonuses, your idea could be perfect for gas.
|

tankus2
Endless Destruction Imperial Ascension
6
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Posted - 2011.09.19 20:54:00 -
[24] - Quote
I like the idea of a T3 hulk, though I would like to see two subsystems that do the following:
one would have bonuses geared toward ice harvesting; reduction in harvester duration primarly
the other would have bonuses geared toward drones; attack, defense, and yield bonuses Where the science gets done |

Emperor Salazar
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
116
|
Posted - 2011.09.19 21:04:00 -
[25] - Quote
tankus2 wrote:I like the idea of a T3 hulk, though I would like to see two subsystems that do the following:
one would have bonuses geared toward ice harvesting; reduction in harvester duration primarly
the other would have bonuses geared toward drones; attack, defense, and yield bonuses
The former of these two has an inherent problem. I designed this ship to use mining lasers/gas harvesters, i.e. modules that are not restricted to mining barges. The ship is designed to be smaller than bargers and thus cannot support these modules. If there were Ice Miners similar to mining lasers then I would add this subsystem but then there would also need to be smaller pieces of ice and thus an entire new table of refinement from said smaller pieces.
As for drones, the bonus to the ship itself is the allowance of more mining drones (and only mining drones). |

XXSketchxx
Remote Soviet Industries
4
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Posted - 2011.10.16 14:20:00 -
[26] - Quote
Bump. |

Jack Carrigan
Order of the Shadow The Revenant Order
41
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Posted - 2011.10.16 15:15:00 -
[27] - Quote
It is a very well thought out, and presented idea.
And I also do agree with a dedicated Exploration ship being more of SoE's territory, or SoCT. But either way.
Definitely useful, feasible, and quite well-researched.
Not to mention, imagine the tears if one got ganked.
Salazar, definitely +1 on this one. "War is not measured in terms of who wins or loses, who is right or wrong.-á It is measured in terms of who survives." |

XXSketchxx
Remote Soviet Industries
59
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Posted - 2011.10.26 17:02:00 -
[28] - Quote
Bump. |

el alasar
The Scope Gallente Federation
35
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Posted - 2011.10.26 18:10:00 -
[29] - Quote
Firartix wrote:In my opinion though, it'd be too much work redoing the whole T3 system onto another ship class. It's just gonna make the game too complicated by having so many subsystems/classes (people have already been complaining about that regarding new addition of some ships) actually to me, i cannot remember that any game ever had too much complexity. and i would love to see more options to be built in to eve. after all this is EvE, there is supposed to be new stuff to explore and advanced concepts to learn and use only after you have played for more than three years. we also want to challenge peoples' minds, no?
+1 for more T3. nicely written up, maybe a comment from CCP?
enjoying the order cancellation confirmation? sometimes CCP listens - there is hope after all :) www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1431503 more ideas that need your support: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=261507#post261507 |

Tanya Powers
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
61
|
Posted - 2011.10.26 22:32:00 -
[30] - Quote
Excellent idea.
-not game breaking (you forgot to add ice cyble or amount bonus)
-not relegating Exhumers to hangar queens
-mining ship of choice for low sec/null sec operations
-expensive enough but the possible reward there is something you can get, hardly, but you can
I'd train for one ASAP if he was there and for sure mine in null sec, I'd have a chance against agressors while right now, no. |
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