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Alliance leaders care to comment?

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 0 post(s)
Ogodai John The Bakhunov Family	Posted - 2008.03.01 11:45:00 - [31] Haha, such a cute 2003 thread. Who necro'd it?
Masu'di Es and Whizz Hedonistic Imperative	Posted - 2008.03.01 11:46:00 - [32] people in eve vote by their feet. "wage slaves" that the topic implies, don't really exist in eve, because pilots don't tend to have to worry about mortgages, wives, children etc to support, and importantly if they get sick of something they can just leave, join someone else or go solo. Es and Whizz is recruiting
Centauris Thundercats RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2008.03.01 11:56:00 - [33] Join a DECENT corp and or alliance and you will see this isnt the case :) I fly and fit/have the same stuff available to me then any other member would. But ofc, there is some corps out there that treat their members as you suggest im sure. Thundercats 4 Life
Ishamel 1 Omega Fleet Enterprises Executive Outcomes	Posted - 2008.03.01 12:31:00 - [34] As most alliance leaders and ceos are only there because they are trusted by most of their members and because they do most of the work, i don't think people would mind if they gained from it in some way, though tbh i dont think most do. I know that with all the time my ceo spends on logistics etc i wouldn't mind. As for flying titans, have you any idea how restrictive being in one of those things is? You couldn't pay me to put my main in one.
sakana North Eastern Swat Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2008.03.01 13:18:00 - [35] So...some guy works out theres money to be made from moons in 0.0 and thinks he knows all about how every alliance works?
DrDevice Spartan Industries Triumvirate.	Posted - 2008.03.01 13:27:00 - [36] I think i can translate: Rise up in revolution against the oppressors of nations! Rise up against those who would take the sweat from your brow! Rise up with pitchforks and Torches. Viva la revolution
Shinigami Gallente Shinra Shinra Alliance	Posted - 2008.03.01 13:50:00 - [37] I think things would be much different if all members were able to see exactly where their taxes and donations are going. I'm sure there are a lot (at least 75%) of CEOs and directors abusing corp/alliance funds. That goes for empire corps and alliances too.
Malcanis R.E.C.O.N. Black-Out	Posted - 2008.03.01 14:23:00 - [38] I don't know jack about moon mining, but I know that I can make more than enough ISK to buy the ships I want to fly. What else matters? CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.
Tio 10	Posted - 2008.03.01 14:27:00 - [39] Gotta love the nerd rage in this thread. Im pretty sure there are lots of alliance grunt that have no idea that you can make 5b a month with just 1 hauler account and 5 posses, that you just have to visit 2 times a month. And Im sure they also have no idea that those moons allready are taken by alliance leadership. And Im also sure that they have no idea where those 75b a month goes to. Im not saying that this is the case in ALL alliances, but Im sure most alliance members have heard "You cant do that complex" or "That moon is allready claimed" and so on. Why Npc 10 hours to make 200m when you can log in your alt that is being payed for moon mining isk and do some hauling around for 2 hours and get 3b?
Jack Dubrow The Drekla Consortium	Posted - 2008.03.01 15:05:00 - [40] OP is the only one in this thread who isn't a fool. If everyone could see exactly where all the isk is going - you'd be surprised. And I mean a detailed account of all transactions. For those of you saying how "hard" it is to run an alliance etc. - that's why you hire managers. Hire enough managers and pay them well enough, then no one complains. Not to mention that leading an alliance is what they get a kick out of, so it's not necessarily WORK for them...it's FUN. To a business owner making money is the point of the business. The same can be said in EVE. You need the money to enjoy a lot of stuff =P In an economy with trillions flying all over the place...it makes you wonder where all that money actually is at and what it's going to be used for. You should just realize that you, the common member, are the income of the alliance/corporation/group. It makes its money off of you and it makes quite a bit. Not a very hard concept to understand. --- Let all of it fall to the ground and burn with what we can not smell!
Dylan Rhade Caldari UK Corp Rare Faction	Posted - 2008.03.01 15:32:00 - [41] Posting ina RotB thread\o/ Lo Bone, hows life m8? D If my views represent the views of my corporation and alliance, then you, sir/madam, are a spoon
Jarvin Kell Kingdom of Kador	Posted - 2008.03.01 15:49:00 - [42] Originally by: Tio 10 Im not saying that this is the case in ALL alliances, but Im sure most alliance members have heard "You cant do that complex" or "That moon is allready claimed" and so on. Why Npc 10 hours to make 200m when you can log in your alt that is being payed for moon mining isk and do some hauling around for 2 hours and get 3b? I was in DMC with my corp for a couple of months. At first the alliance was a good temporary home for my corp: There weren't any taxes and few requirements other than everyone band together to defend the homeland (what a joke that turned out to be). I wanted a relaxed 0.0 setting to train some of my newer pilots so we decided to take advantage of the situation. As mentioned by a poster above, it quickly became apparent that someone was getting rich, and it wasn't just Unrah with the fated super-capital ship production. My corp was interested in starting some low-scale moon mining and started asking around for scan results. It turned out that they weren't available. Ok...interesting. So we started scanning some of the less inhabited areas of OASA...low and behold, all of the best moons were claimed...even though there supposedly weren't scan results available. Alliance leadership was screaming for corps to drop towers to protect sov...I started trying to safespot in some of the leadership's POS that I had previously bookmarked...and they were gone! Alliance leadership was yelling for everyone to put up billions of assets in POS, while at the same time tearing down their own! At the same time alliance leadership mostly avoided logging in on their mains, leading to mass confusion in the ranks. Overall I knew more or less what I was getting into so my corp didn't deploy a large amount of assets in the area. Our contribution came mostly in the form of lost ships and time spent defending the homeland and in turn my member base gained what I intended--more experience. On the other hand there were some corps that lost many billions of assets just because they were trying to help the cause. Live and learn I suppose
INZi coracao ardente Triumvirate.	Posted - 2008.03.01 15:55:00 - [43] aint that hard beeing a leader. tell your nobs what todo and they should do it and stfu otherwhise they'll get slained \o/ _
Gnulpie Minmatar Miner Tech	Posted - 2008.03.01 15:56:00 - [44] Originally by: RuleoftheBone You misunderstand the initial post. I am quite happy where I am. I am simply stimulating discussion and encouraging anarchist anti-authority thoughts . Okay, but if people fail to even ask most basic questions on their own and to make themselves competent then they deserve nothing better.
Plave Okice Gallente Red. Red Republic	Posted - 2008.03.01 16:09:00 - [45] Originally by: Jaggeh We're an anarcho-syndicalist commune. We take it in turns to act as a sort of executive officer for the week. But all the decision of that officer have to be ratified at a special bi-weekly meeting-- By a simple majority in the case of purely internal affairs,-- But by a two-thirds majority in the case of more major Be quiet! I order you to be quiet! Red CEORed Vs Blue
Skrypt Game-Over Insurgency	Posted - 2008.03.01 16:10:00 - [46] Fact. Agmar is the richest CEO in EVE. His exploitations of GAME are flawless.
Tzar'rim Minmatar Reckless Corsairs	Posted - 2008.03.01 16:12:00 - [47] Originally by: RuleoftheBone Edited by: RuleoftheBone on 01/03/2008 08:32:02 Edited by: RuleoftheBone on 01/03/2008 08:28:08 This was originally posted in General by Cipher7. I have lightly edited it and added a couple extra points. I just thought I would do my part to ** up your CAOD board as many of you seem to like ting in C+P and elsewhere. And perhaps the less-informed alliance slaves would enjoy reading this (cheers Cipher7 for an outstanding bit of -stirring material to brighten everyone's Saturday): There is a subsection of the 0.0 population which exploits the other 90% who live there. The average 0.0 dweller knows nothing about moon mining or POS. He barely knows of the existance of refine taxes. He doesn't know how much the CEO makes from taxes or how much the alliance leader makes. Regular alliance guy is in a BS he bought with his own money, the money he was graciously allowed to farm from the belts. Regular alliance guy doesn't know how much his leaders make. He figures since he lives in 0.0 he must be a mover and a shaker. He doesn't understand that he's actually a sharecropper living on someone else's ranch. Alliance boss flies a Titan, regular alliance guy aint never gonna have one unless he farms belts for the next 2 years. Regular alliance guy routinely comes to the forums and complains about level 4 mission runners. Those damn carebears. Why should they be able to make money without the boss's permission? Why shouldn't they have to pay taxes and a refine fee like him? Why shouldn't they be at the boss's beck and call to defend the boss's ranch? Why shouldn't they buy all their ships and t2 mods from the boss's industrial alt? Why shouldn't they get bullied by the boss for not showing up 60 jumps away on Thursday at 4am? All should demand more from your alliance leaders: -Demand open accountability. -Ever wonder how your alliance leaders support multiple accounts while sitting at home IRL unemployed? -Ever wonder why they are flying T2 gear and YOU are stuck flying T1 pap? -Ever wonder why you are paying tax? Where does it all go? -How many alliance leaders actually give two s about you? -Do you like being a pawn shuffled all over the 0.0 map to satisfy the ego's of the few? -Do you like playing Powerpoint instead of an actual game? Wake up slaves. Free your minds. Always question authority. Would you like the red pill. Or the blue pill? I cannot WAIT to see the responses . Cheers again Cipher7. I didn't want your post to be buried under the usual mountain of crap without being seen. Happy Saturday! EDIT**Please feel free to post with alts. No shame in hiding from the boss Add to that the possibly shady deals an alliance leader makes for personal profit while his cattle does the work and loses his ships for it. Guess why I gave up on my old chars, said adieu to 0.0 exploitation and am doing my own thing in high sec. If I can't understand, or agree with my leader's decisions and motives I can not hold him accountable, and I'm essentially used and milked. No more of that.
Aaron Mirrorsaver R.E.C.O.N. Black-Out	Posted - 2008.03.01 16:32:00 - [48] anyone who is in a corp in an alliance, chose to be there, if you dont wanna be there and want to buy tech 2 from the marker instead of your boss's alt? do level 4 missions? not be 60 jumps away at 4a.m on thursday? then go back to empire and join VETO. Go Hard, or go Home.
SATAN BURN EDEN	Posted - 2008.03.01 16:38:00 - [49] Every time we get involved with other corporations/alliances I get reminded just how many "leaders" there are out there that live of the hard work of their members. And the sad thing is their member base has no idea its even happening. Has nothing to do with being in 0.0, this happens in every empire based corps also.
Aaron Mirrorsaver R.E.C.O.N. Black-Out	Posted - 2008.03.01 17:12:00 - [50] exactly, people exploit people all over. anywhere in eve. anywhere in the world and since this game heh, resembles the world so much with cut throat politics...why not the rich exploiting the poor working class. Go Hard, or go Home.
Hymerus The Andromeda Directorate	Posted - 2008.03.01 17:19:00 - [51] The majority of Alliances fall into this category. The average player just simple doesn't understand how much isk is generated off moon mining towers at the alliance level. Most corp CEOs don't even really get it. People keep going on about the war in the south being about BoB being jerks. It's not. It's about controlling moons and making isk hand over fist by holding the moon mining rights to half of Eve. All the reasons that get thrown around here are crap. It's not about freedom, it's not about fighting them there so we don't have to fight them here, it's not about a new world order, it's about the Eve equivalent of oil. And 99.999% of the people who are losing battleship after battleship out there will never see a single isk in benefit out of it. Sure, they'll get to mine in their covetors or rat, but its a pittance to what their alliance leaders will be making off their work.
RuleoftheBone Minmatar Veto. Veto Corp	Posted - 2008.03.01 17:55:00 - [52] Originally by: Dylan Rhade Posting ina RotB thread\o/ Lo Bone, hows life m8? D Always ducky pal . Just tilting at a windmill or two today. Encouraging revolution...you know...casual Saturday stuff...that appears to have struck a few nerves. This forum whoring business is rather amusing...especially getting to watch certain people squirm a bit. I figure as folks seem to feel free to post much rubbish about outlaws....I'd fire a shot or two back and see how much they enjoy having some general alliance junk aired in public. And this is SUCH an interesting topic ain't it . "Lead Me..Follow Me..Or get the **** out of my way" General George Patton USA
RuleoftheBone Minmatar Veto. Veto Corp	Posted - 2008.03.01 17:55:00 - [53] Originally by: DrDevice I think i can translate: Rise up in revolution against the oppressors of nations! Rise up against those who would take the sweat from your brow! Rise up with pitchforks and Torches. Viva la revolution I like this guy "Lead Me..Follow Me..Or get the **** out of my way" General George Patton USA
RuleoftheBone Minmatar Veto. Veto Corp	Posted - 2008.03.01 18:00:00 - [54] Originally by: Aaron Mirrorsaver anyone who is in a corp in an alliance, chose to be there, if you dont wanna be there and want to buy tech 2 from the marker instead of your boss's alt? do level 4 missions? not be 60 jumps away at 4a.m on thursday? then go back to empire and join VETO. Huh? "Lead Me..Follow Me..Or get the **** out of my way" General George Patton USA
RuleoftheBone Minmatar Veto. Veto Corp	Posted - 2008.03.01 18:01:00 - [55] Originally by: Skrypt Fact. Agmar is the richest CEO in EVE. His exploitations of GAME are flawless. Hello Skrypt....glad to see you are still around. "Lead Me..Follow Me..Or get the **** out of my way" General George Patton USA
Masu'di Es and Whizz Hedonistic Imperative	Posted - 2008.03.01 18:05:00 - [56] Originally by: Plave Okice Originally by: Jaggeh We're an anarcho-syndicalist commune. We take it in turns to act as a sort of executive officer for the week. But all the decision of that officer have to be ratified at a special bi-weekly meeting-- By a simple majority in the case of purely internal affairs,-- But by a two-thirds majority in the case of more major Be quiet! I order you to be quiet! Order, eh? Who does he think he is? Es and Whizz is recruiting
LaVista Vista Conservative Shenanigans Party	Posted - 2008.03.01 18:06:00 - [57] Well. I can see it from several angles. Yes, alliance leaders are elitist bastards. Just look at some of the old leadership of LV. But there will always be an elite class which will indirectly control the social classes without them realising. And in a sense, i think thats rightfully so, if people are stupid enough. Its rational for a human being to act in his own self-interest, and i would do that too. So from a personal point, since i do like elitism, its not that bad. But it does wreck my hearth to see all these slaves running around in 0.0, claiming to have a good time. Not only from a gameplay perspective with all the lag and boring capital fights. But the fact that people seem to act extremely irrationally to 0.0 is sad. The fact that people ALLOW the big alliance leaders to act on their own self-interest, rather than the interest of the alliance besides gaining space. But then again, if we look at the demography of eve, you will see that majority lives in empire. Smallest amount of people lives in 0.0. Go figure why these people dont move into 0.0. They have no interest to live there for one or another reason. One of these could be because of the points you make Bone. I frankly agree with the whole point of the thread. But unless people change their mind, which they wont due to pride, nothing will happen.
RuleoftheBone Minmatar Veto. Veto Corp	Posted - 2008.03.01 18:07:00 - [58] Originally by: Hymerus The majority of Alliances fall into this category. The average player just simple doesn't understand how much isk is generated off moon mining towers at the alliance level. Most corp CEOs don't even really get it. People keep going on about the war in the south being about BoB being jerks. It's not. It's about controlling moons and making isk hand over fist by holding the moon mining rights to half of Eve. All the reasons that get thrown around here are crap. It's not about freedom, it's not about fighting them there so we don't have to fight them here, it's not about a new world order, it's about the Eve equivalent of oil. And 99.999% of the people who are losing battleship after battleship out there will never see a single isk in benefit out of it. Sure, they'll get to mine in their covetors or rat, but its a pittance to what their alliance leaders will be making off their work. Bingo. Side note...Tom Clancy put it rather well in saying war is usually nothing more than grand theft writ large. I have a rather fun idea. But I'll hold off for a few more posts before putting it out there. Up the people...or something like that . "Lead Me..Follow Me..Or get the **** out of my way" General George Patton USA
Kaeten Hybrid Syndicate XIII Legio	Posted - 2008.03.01 18:28:00 - [59] so your complaining about leaders taking tax isk and using for their own ends? Yea they do fly around in titans, have you ever thought how boring it must be flying a titan? I'd never sit my ass in anything bigger than a battleship, thats why at 60+mill sp I'm still training battleship/inty related skills. Also about being an alliance leader, do you have any idea how much logistic work and planning goes into it for it to work? You make it sound like they are jsut leaders and pvp liek everyone else with the benefit of an extra buck. To be in 0.0 these days without risking your neck requires sacrafices. Iwish my corp would stop dieing...
Kaeten Hybrid Syndicate XIII Legio	Posted - 2008.03.01 18:33:00 - [60] Originally by: Hymerus The majority of Alliances fall into this category. The average player just simple doesn't understand how much isk is generated off moon mining towers at the alliance level. Most corp CEOs don't even really get it. People keep going on about the war in the south being about BoB being jerks. It's not. It's about controlling moons and making isk hand over fist by holding the moon mining rights to half of Eve. All the reasons that get thrown around here are crap. It's not about freedom, it's not about fighting them there so we don't have to fight them here, it's not about a new world order, it's about the Eve equivalent of oil. And 99.999% of the people who are losing battleship after battleship out there will never see a single isk in benefit out of it. Sure, they'll get to mine in their covetors or rat, but its a pittance to what their alliance leaders will be making off their work. This however is slighty true. Iwish my corp would stop dieing...

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