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RuleoftheBone
Minmatar
Veto.
Veto Corp
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Posted - 2008.03.01 08:27:00 -
[1]
Edited by: RuleoftheBone on 01/03/2008 08:32:02
Edited by: RuleoftheBone on 01/03/2008 08:28:08
This was originally posted in General by Cipher7. I have lightly edited it and added a couple extra points. I just thought I would do my part to **** up your CAOD board as many of you seem to like ****ting in C+P and elsewhere. And perhaps the less-informed alliance slaves would enjoy reading this (cheers Cipher7 for an outstanding bit of ****-stirring material to brighten everyone's Saturday):
There is a subsection of the 0.0 population which exploits the other 90% who live there.
The average 0.0 dweller knows nothing about moon mining or POS. He barely knows of the existance of refine taxes. He doesn't know how much the CEO makes from taxes or how much the alliance leader makes.
Regular alliance guy is in a BS he bought with his own money, the money he was graciously allowed to farm from the belts.
Regular alliance guy doesn't know how much his leaders make. He figures since he lives in 0.0 he must be a mover and a shaker.
He doesn't understand that he's actually a sharecropper living on someone else's ranch.
Alliance boss flies a Titan, regular alliance guy aint never gonna have one unless he farms belts for the next 2 years.
Regular alliance guy routinely comes to the forums and complains about level 4 mission runners. Those damn carebears. Why should they be able to make money without the boss's permission?
Why shouldn't they have to pay taxes and a refine fee like him?
Why shouldn't they be at the boss's beck and call to defend the boss's ranch?
Why shouldn't they buy all their ships and t2 mods from the boss's industrial alt?
Why shouldn't they get bullied by the boss for not showing up 60 jumps away on Thursday at 4am?
All should demand more from your alliance leaders:
-Demand open accountability.
-Ever wonder how your alliance leaders support multiple accounts while sitting at home IRL unemployed?
-Ever wonder why they are flying T2 gear and YOU are stuck flying T1 pap?
-Ever wonder why you are paying tax? Where does it all go?
-How many alliance leaders actually give two ****s about you?
-Do you like being a pawn shuffled all over the 0.0 map to satisfy the ego's of the few?
-Do you like playing Powerpoint instead of an actual game?
Wake up slaves.
Free your minds.
Always question authority.
Would you like the red pill. Or the blue pill?
I cannot WAIT to see the responses  .
Cheers again Cipher7. I didn't want your post to be buried under the usual mountain of crap without being seen.
Happy Saturday!
**EDIT**Please feel free to post with alts. No shame in hiding from the boss 
"Lead Me..Follow Me..Or get the **** out of my way"
General George Patton USA
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Elo Knight
Victory Not Vengeance
Intrepid Crossing
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Posted - 2008.03.01 08:31:00 -
[2]
 Originally by: RuleoftheBone
Edited by: RuleoftheBone on 01/03/2008 08:28:08
This was originally posted in General by Cipher7. I have lightly edited it and added a couple extra points. I just thought I would do my part to **** up your CAOD board as many of you seem to like ****ting in C+P and elsewhere. And perhaps the less-informed alliance slaves would enjoy reading this (cheers Cipher7 for an outstanding bit of ****-stirring material to brighten everyone's Saturday):
There is a subsection of the 0.0 population which exploits the other 90% who live there.
The average 0.0 dweller knows nothing about moon mining or POS. He barely knows of the existance of refine taxes. He doesn't know how much the CEO makes from taxes or how much the alliance leader makes.
Regular alliance guy is in a BS he bought with his own money, the money he was graciously allowed to farm from the belts.
Regular alliance guy doesn't know how much his leaders make. He figures since he lives in 0.0 he must be a mover and a shaker.
He doesn't understand that he's actually a sharecropper living on someone else's ranch.
Alliance boss flies a Titan, regular alliance guy aint never gonna have one unless he farms belts for the next 2 years.
Regular alliance guy routinely comes to the forums and complains about level 4 mission runners. Those damn carebears. Why should they be able to make money without the boss's permission?
Why shouldn't they have to pay taxes and a refine fee like him?
Why shouldn't they be at the boss's beck and call to defend the boss's ranch?
Why shouldn't they buy all their ships and t2 mods from the boss's industrial alt?
Why shouldn't they get bullied by the boss for not showing up 60 jumps away on Thursday at 4am?
All should demand more from your alliance leaders:
-Demand open accountability.
-Ever wonder how your alliance leaders support multiple accounts while sitting at home IRL unemployed?
-Ever wonder why they are flying T2 gear and YOU are stuck flying T1 pap?
-Ever wonder why you are paying tax? Where does it all go?
-How many alliance leaders actually give two ****s about you?
-Do you like being a pawn shuffled all over the 0.0 map to satisfy the ego's of the few?
-Do you like playing Powerpoint instead of an actual game?
Wake up slaves.
Free your minds.
Always question authority.
Would you like the red pill. Or the blue pill?
I cannot WAIT to see the responses .
Cheers again Cipher7. I didn't want your post to be buried under the usual mountain of crap without being seen.
Happy Saturday!
which one is the red pill 
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RuleoftheBone
Minmatar
Veto.
Veto Corp
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Posted - 2008.03.01 08:34:00 -
[3]
Originally by: Elo Knight
which one is the red pill
The truth. Demand it.
"Lead Me..Follow Me..Or get the **** out of my way"
General George Patton USA
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Elo Knight
Victory Not Vengeance
Intrepid Crossing
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Posted - 2008.03.01 08:35:00 -
[4]
Originally by: RuleoftheBone
Originally by: Elo Knight
which one is the red pill
The truth. Demand it.
Ok,whats the blue pill
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Elo Knight
Victory Not Vengeance
Intrepid Crossing
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Posted - 2008.03.01 08:36:00 -
[5]
Edited by: Elo Knight on 01/03/2008 08:36:02
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TrippyX
The Syndicate Inc
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Posted - 2008.03.01 08:41:00 -
[6]
I am the boss, boss just doesn't know it yet. 
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Black Steel
Caldari
Asgard Schiffswerften
Ev0ke
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Posted - 2008.03.01 08:50:00 -
[7]
Edited by: Black Steel on 01/03/2008 08:50:00
Because its a game with doer and fellows .
Eve isnt a ponyranch.
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Dungar Loghoth
Caldari
Black Omega Security
Pandemic Legion
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Posted - 2008.03.01 08:55:00 -
[8]
You mean not everyone gets to play leader? Dear me, the peons are going to be upset when they realize this.
---
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Dhip C
Minmatubbies
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Posted - 2008.03.01 08:55:00 -
[9]
Some are meant to lead and some are meant to follow. Either STFU and lead or STFU and follow. The choice is ultimately yours.
My question is whats is Veto's agenda by posting such crap in CAOD. Personally, I think you need to take a break from forums.
2/10 on the mittani thread scale.
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kublai
Art of War
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Posted - 2008.03.01 09:00:00 -
[10]
You have NO clue how expensive and time consuming running an alliance is do you?
You speak of pos mining and refining taxes, pardon me but.
Pos fuel for sov
Logistics for creating a market in 0.0
Endless hours spendt recruiting, fc'ing, organicing, fueling, setting up new pos's.
This is the most ignorant forum post i've seen in a long long time.
I may not be an alliance CEO, but I do oversee a multi-billion corporate industrial section, I see very rich players dedicating large amounts of their fortune to aid those with less isk, why are they rich to begin with?
They're skilled at making isk, unlike 90% of eve.
------
Art of War is recruiting - Think you got what it takes?
Buying sig - eve-mail "Jonny 101" |
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Fred0
Cutting Edge Incorporated
RAZOR Alliance
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Posted - 2008.03.01 09:17:00 -
[11]
This is probably true for some corps but it depends and it'd be very wrong to generalize like that.
---
"Cutting Edge 4 Life" |
kublai
Art of War
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Posted - 2008.03.01 09:20:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Fred0
This is probably true for some corps but it depends and it'd be very wrong to generalize like that.
It's generally true for such alliances as DMC, KOS.
But really, that should be common knowledge, and the victim of this does not really read CAOD.
------
Art of War is recruiting - Think you got what it takes?
Buying sig - eve-mail "Jonny 101" |
RuleoftheBone
Minmatar
Veto.
Veto Corp
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Posted - 2008.03.01 09:36:00 -
[13]
Edited by: RuleoftheBone on 01/03/2008 09:45:10
Originally by: Dhip C
Some are meant to lead and some are meant to follow. Either STFU and lead or STFU and follow. The choice is ultimately yours.
My question is whats is Veto's agenda by posting such crap in CAOD. Personally, I think you need to take a break from forums.
2/10 on the mittani thread scale.
No agenda at all.
Nothing to do with Veto.
Just stimulating discussion on my part.
Simply asking questions that the drones really should have answered.
Perhaps they will read this and ask YOU?
**EDIT**Following blindly is never a good idea
"Lead Me..Follow Me..Or get the **** out of my way"
General George Patton USA
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RuleoftheBone
Minmatar
Veto.
Veto Corp
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Posted - 2008.03.01 09:40:00 -
[14]
Originally by: kublai
Originally by: Fred0
This is probably true for some corps but it depends and it'd be very wrong to generalize like that.
It's generally true for such alliances as DMC, KOS.
But really, that should be common knowledge, and the victim of this does not really read CAOD.
Is it common knowledge? Really? I doubt it.
And of course there are exceptions.
"Lead Me..Follow Me..Or get the **** out of my way"
General George Patton USA
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Wallenberg
Wallenberg's Investor
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Posted - 2008.03.01 10:14:00 -
[15]
This post does have a point. I mean, I remember when GoonSwarms Titan fund was stolen...
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Vagablonde
Minmatar
Ouruboros Trading
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Posted - 2008.03.01 10:33:00 -
[16]
Edited by: Vagablonde on 01/03/2008 10:33:12
I dunno rotb, but your sig (the patton quote) i think goes someway to explain the nature of eve, especially concerning space holding alliances in that some people will dedicate very large amounts of their time, and in that time be vry srs, to forging alliances, creating :politics:, along with the hulking endevour of logistics, whilst the majority of people just want to ride bikes, so they follow, there is no room for people who are not leading or following and simply put a good alliance leader, or the like, deserves to be the one in the biggest ship, etc, he/she is afterall one of the writers of the game people decide to immerse themselves in and go along with /longsentence. Whilst having a large ego isn't always a bad thing is does have the effect of magnifying a persons character and all the crap that comes with them, and people with large egos naturally seek authority, titles, status, etc...
not really sure what i'm trying to say 
________________
the way back home is always long, but if you're close to me i'm holding on. |
Keeves
Minmatar
Sexy Pirate Club
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Posted - 2008.03.01 10:44:00 -
[17]
This is such a bull**** topic. Has your CEO ever told you "OK guys, this is what Veto is doing this next X amount of days/weeks" and you just went and did it because you trusted your CEO? This is such a tinfoil cap conspiracy bull**** thread which makes you think that every 0.0 alliance CEO is pocketing isk made from their corp members.
What about the CEO who spent the countless hours delegating and organising to make this Alliance machine work properly and is still flying a T1 cruiser because he doesnt have the time to go out and pvp or rat or make isk in general? I for one am in that position (even in a generally small corp) and im sure there are many CEO's like me, even in large 0.0 alliances, who are in the very same position...
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Mighty Dredd
Daiwa.
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Posted - 2008.03.01 10:49:00 -
[18]
Edited by: Mighty Dredd on 01/03/2008 10:52:41
Originally by: RuleoftheBone
The average 0.0 dweller knows nothing about moon mining or POS. He barely knows of the existance of refine taxes. He doesn't know how much the CEO makes from taxes or how much the alliance leader makes.
The flip side of this is that very few of these same 0.0 dwellers know nothing of the work and eye-watering costs involved in running a 0.0 corp/alliance
They would run a mile if they knew how much effort it takes to earn, maintain and control that space.
I've been involved at a very high level of running a large capital capable 0.0 corp on another account and can tell you its not the carefree life of a lazy landowner as the OP put it. Burn out is a very real concern for the people who do this job and the game is not your own when you are doing a job like this. You cannot decide when you do things, you cannot decide to go and spend the money your corp makes (money you have decided how to make with the help of your corp) because you have to budget for events that may or may not happen.
Running succesful 0.0 corps is not an easy job and contrary to what you say here it doesnt make you rich without massive amounts of effort. Sure there will always be people who take advantage but generally corps with people like you describe at the helm will not stay in 0.0 for long because their corp will fail. These are the corps to avoid and people generally learn very quickly this is the case.
so to paraphrase your post
Originally by: RuleoftheBone
The average 0.0 dweller knows nothing about the effort it takes to initially finance moon mining or POS, have no clue about the effort and brainmelt involved in holding Sov. He barely knows of the existance of refine taxes and what they are used to fund. He doesn't know how much the CEO makes for the corp from the endless hours of effort behind the scenes while his guys are out having fun shooting at the enemy. Has no idea how much the alliance leader has to do to be sure his alliance doesnt run out of money at important times of heavy load on these hard won resources.
As i said, theres two sides to every story. Anyone who thinks the life of a 0.0 alliance leader, CEO or director is easy should try it for themselves and they will soon realise its not the tea party you and the OP make it out to be.
EDIT : many varied typo's
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RuleoftheBone
Minmatar
Veto.
Veto Corp
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Posted - 2008.03.01 10:56:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Vagablonde
Edited by: Vagablonde on 01/03/2008 10:33:12
I dunno rotb, but your sig (the patton quote) i think goes someway to explain the nature of eve, especially concerning space holding alliances in that some people will dedicate very large amounts of their time, and in that time be vry srs, to forging alliances, creating :politics:, along with the hulking endevour of logistics, whilst the majority of people just want to ride bikes, so they follow, there is no room for people who are not leading or following and simply put a good alliance leader, or the like, deserves to be the one in the biggest ship, etc, he/she is afterall one of the writers of the game people decide to immerse themselves in and go along with /longsentence. Whilst having a large ego isn't always a bad thing is does have the effect of magnifying a persons character and all the crap that comes with them, and people with large egos naturally seek authority, titles, status, etc...
not really sure what i'm trying to say
And what happens to leading by example? While the leader enjoys flying the epeen wagon the drones remain flying pap over and over again..in some cases scrambling to buy the "discounted" ships ever-so-kindly provided by same? Conflict of interest there eh?
Lets see how many leaders will step up and say they DESERVE things shall we?
The ability to lead is native...not usually something taught (except for how to apply it). And the respect that comes with it is earned...not deserved.
Absolute power-corrupts absolutely.
And ole Blood 'n Guts was no politician by any stretch of the imagination.
"Lead Me..Follow Me..Or get the **** out of my way"
General George Patton USA
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Is forporn
THE INTERNET.
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Posted - 2008.03.01 11:00:00 -
[20]
Sounds like ur corp sucks tbh
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RuleoftheBone
Minmatar
Veto.
Veto Corp
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Posted - 2008.03.01 11:00:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Keeves
This is such a bull**** topic. Has your CEO ever told you "OK guys, this is what Veto is doing this next X amount of days/weeks" and you just went and did it because you trusted your CEO? This is such a tinfoil cap conspiracy bull**** thread which makes you think that every 0.0 alliance CEO is pocketing isk made from their corp members.
What about the CEO who spent the countless hours delegating and organising to make this Alliance machine work properly and is still flying a T1 cruiser because he doesnt have the time to go out and pvp or rat or make isk in general? I for one am in that position (even in a generally small corp) and im sure there are many CEO's like me, even in large 0.0 alliances, who are in the very same position...
Nastiness aside....it appears you lead by example. Cool!
There is no tinfoil here. There is no agenda beyond stimulating interest and discussion.
"Lead Me..Follow Me..Or get the **** out of my way"
General George Patton USA
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Jebidus Skari
Amarr
D00M.
Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.03.01 11:02:00 -
[22]
you forget as with the blue or red pill we have a choice, dont like the alliance or ppl from the corp your in - leave - simple as - your not forced to stay anywhere...
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Jaggeh
Thundercats
RAZOR Alliance
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Posted - 2008.03.01 11:05:00 -
[23]
We're an anarcho-syndicalist commune. We take it in turns to act as a sort of executive officer for the week. But all the decision of that officer have to be ratified at a special bi-weekly meeting-- By a simple majority in the case of purely internal affairs,-- But by a two-thirds majority in the case of more major
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Gnulpie
Minmatar
Miner Tech
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Posted - 2008.03.01 11:06:00 -
[24]
LOL - what a funny thread.
If you are not happy with your alliance then leave it. If you ask your alliance leadership questions and you don't get satisfying answers then leave the alliance.
If you think all alliance leaders are bad and that they would treat you all badly - well, make your own alliance and become a leader yourself.
You can't? No time? Bored with all the necessary stuff? There you are.
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Spoon Thumb
Caldari
Paladin Imperium
Curatores Veritatis Alliance
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Posted - 2008.03.01 11:18:00 -
[25]
Any alliance not based on teamwork is doomed to fail. If you have an "us and them" mentality then you're never going to get anywhere, or go down fast soon as the **** hits the fan.
What is sad is that there are a lot of stories I hear from empire corps where CEO's take on a bunch of bright eye'd newbie miners and mission runners, turn up to corp ops for the first few weeks then after a couple of months, take the money and run, leaving the corp members out in the cold and feeling bitter, betrayed and utterly disheartened
Khaldari
khanidpublic: RP channel for Kingdom loyalists
Recruiting |
Nocturnal Avenger
The Ankou
The Reckoning.
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Posted - 2008.03.01 11:25:00 -
[26]
The corp/alliance I am part of does not bully it's members.
Might be the reason I'm there :D
- Carebear Pirate - |
RuleoftheBone
Minmatar
Veto.
Veto Corp
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Posted - 2008.03.01 11:28:00 -
[27]
Edited by: RuleoftheBone on 01/03/2008 11:32:41
Edited by: RuleoftheBone on 01/03/2008 11:31:14
Originally by: Gnulpie
LOL - what a funny thread.
If you are not happy with your alliance then leave it. If you ask your alliance leadership questions and you don't get satisfying answers then leave the alliance.
If you think all alliance leaders are bad and that they would treat you all badly - well, make your own alliance and become a leader yourself.
You can't? No time? Bored with all the necessary stuff? There you are.
You misunderstand the initial post. I am quite happy where I am. I am simply stimulating discussion and encouraging anarchist anti-authority thoughts  .
**EDIT**And for the record the corps I was a part of prior to becoming outlaw were both excellent...with solid leadership that cared for it's members. It was the alliance aspect that spoiled it  .
"Lead Me..Follow Me..Or get the **** out of my way"
General George Patton USA
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Narciss Sevar
Caldari
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
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Posted - 2008.03.01 11:36:00 -
[28]
Shamis lives a millionaires lifestyle on the $$$ he makes from ebay sells, it's true.
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Johnny Gurkha
Wise Guys
Exquisite Malevolence
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Posted - 2008.03.01 11:42:00 -
[29]
I swallow both pills, when I get ****** off I go all bulimic and shove my fingers down my throat to spew them back out. Kind of explains why my corp history is a tad... long
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marakor
Gallente
Anti Lag Forum Smackers
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Posted - 2008.03.01 11:44:00 -
[30]
The last corp that tried to stick me with a 20% tax an a 10 mil a month per toon fee got the finger as i was sick of seeing the inner circle of guys flying seemingly inexhaustable T2 fitted battleships and capital ships.
I left them joined another alliance and helped remove them from the 2 stations they held and eventualy fully destroyed the alliance.
PS: It was the most satifying alliance kill i have ever been involved in.
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