Originally by: Commander OTG

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Out of curiosity last night i scanned every raven and mega that exited the Caldari Navy station in Motsu for an hour....only one of those ships had faction mods installed....in fact, most of them (navy ravens included) weren't even equiped with T2 mods and their accounts were over 1 year old.

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Originally by: Sendraks

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Further to the point that "suicide gankers can gank at no cost" because of insurance. Ofc this means that mission runners can suicide gank suicide gankers at no cost as well. But meh, why take matters into your own hands in one of the few games out there which will let you?

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Quote:

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One would assume that the normal precautions one uses in nullsec would apply.

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Originally by: Lex Tael

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I have a better idea:

1) Get a hauler or a fast frig (cloaked & stabbed & somewhat tanked preferably).

2) Add some gankers to your address book. (Hint: you can find some names in this very thread.)

3) When they go online, find them with a locator agent and park your ship near their gate camp.

4) When they gank someone, grab the loot and dock.*,**

5) Go to the forums to brag about being a great PvPer.

*Optional: offer them a one-time discount on the items you just obtained in Local chat for some funny comments (hint: you can use those comments later in Step 5).

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Originally by: Lex Tael

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Edited by: Lex Tael on 10/03/2008 19:15:15

Originally by: Sendraks

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Further to the point that "suicide gankers can gank at no cost" because of insurance. Ofc this means that mission runners can suicide gank suicide gankers at no cost as well. But meh, why take matters into your own hands in one of the few games out there which will let you?

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Let me guess, because you will not hurt them a single bit with such actions (they get insurance payouts anyway, remember?)and you can't profit from their trash T1 fits. Am I right?

You would also incur security status penalty, which YOU yourself call a major drawback, while gaining absolutely nothing.

So what was your point?



I have a better idea:

1) Get a hauler or a fast frig (cloaked & stabbed & somewhat tanked preferably).

2) Add some gankers to your address book. (Hint: you can find some names in this very thread.)

3) When they go online, find them with a locator agent and park your ship near their gate camp.

4) When they gank someone, grab the loot and dock.*,**

5) Go to the forums to brag about being a great PvPer.

*Optional: offer them a one-time discount on the items you just obtained in Local chat for some funny comments (hint: you can use those comments later in Step 5).

**Alternative idea: be in a sensor boosting destroyer and POD as many of them as you can after CONCORD pops them. <-- this can be done with a throw-away alt or even a trial acct, so no security status loss on your main! \o/

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Originally by: Hasak Rain

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lol I have to admit that was pretty funny Lex.

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Originally by: Lex Tael

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That is not only funny, but works pretty well too, judging by frustration of some ganker in some other eve forum ("how dare they steal MY loot! i worked so hard to earn it!" - lol). I guess I have to admit, the idea is not entirely mine. There are people that do it already.

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Originally by: Lex Tael

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Edited by: Lex Tael on 10/03/2008 19:15:15

Originally by: Sendraks

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Further to the point that "suicide gankers can gank at no cost" because of insurance. Ofc this means that mission runners can suicide gank suicide gankers at no cost as well. But meh, why take matters into your own hands in one of the few games out there which will let you?

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Let me guess, because you will not hurt them a single bit with such actions (they get insurance payouts anyway, remember?)and you can't profit from their trash T1 fits. Am I right?

You would also incur security status penalty, which YOU yourself call a major drawback, while gaining absolutely nothing.

So what was your point?



I have a better idea:

1) Get a hauler or a fast frig (cloaked & stabbed & somewhat tanked preferably).

2) Add some gankers to your address book. (Hint: you can find some names in this very thread.)

3) When they go online, find them with a locator agent and park your ship near their gate camp.

4) When they gank someone, grab the loot and dock.*,**

5) Go to the forums to brag about being a great PvPer.

*Optional: offer them a one-time discount on the items you just obtained in Local chat for some funny comments (hint: you can use those comments later in Step 5).

**Alternative idea: be in a sensor boosting destroyer and POD as many of them as you can after CONCORD pops them. <-- this can be done with a throw-away alt or even a trial acct, so no security status loss on your main! \o/

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Originally by: iudex

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I wonder what's the point of all those faction items in the LP store.
One does a lot of missions to be able to get those shiny caldari navy launchers, bcus and invuls, but at the end they only increases the danger for missionrunners.

Today i was ganked by 6 suiciding ravens (shinra corp) at a gate in Irjunen, after completing my mission. Pretty all of my modules were caldari navy items (except 3-4 maybe), but since the gankers get a full insurance payout, it only costs them 10-15mil to lose a raven. In my case that were 6 ships, which less than 100mil, so if someone has let's say items worth 300mil, he is already a profitable target for a 5 raven team. And there was nothing i could do, i already had 3 invuls, no big holes in the tank, but even with 3 invuls+overheat+damge control there is no way to survive this assault, so it's a pretty certain death. And since it's so profitable, it's getting more and more popular (i already complained about this in another thread before i was ganked).

Does that mean missions can be done with t2 items only ? What's the point then of all that officer and faction gear, who else should buy it ?

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Originally by: Lex Tael

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I have a better idea:

1) Get a hauler or a fast frig (cloaked & stabbed & somewhat tanked preferably).

2) Add some gankers to your address book. (Hint: you can find some names in this very thread.)

3) When they go online, find them with a locator agent and park your ship near their gate camp.

4) When they gank someone, grab the loot and dock.*,**

5) Go to the forums to brag about being a great PvPer.

*Optional: offer them a one-time discount on the items you just obtained in Local chat for some funny comments (hint: you can use those comments later in Step 5).

**Alternative idea: be in a sensor boosting destroyer and POD as many of them as you can after CONCORD pops them. <-- this can be done with a throw-away alt or even a trial acct, so no security status loss on your main! \o/

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Originally by: faxtarious

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Originally by: iudex

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I wonder what's the point of all those faction items in the LP store.
One does a lot of missions to be able to get those shiny caldari navy launchers, bcus and invuls, but at the end they only increases the danger for missionrunners.

Today i was ganked by 6 suiciding ravens (shinra corp) at a gate in Irjunen, after completing my mission. Pretty all of my modules were caldari navy items (except 3-4 maybe), but since the gankers get a full insurance payout, it only costs them 10-15mil to lose a raven. In my case that were 6 ships, which less than 100mil, so if someone has let's say items worth 300mil, he is already a profitable target for a 5 raven team. And there was nothing i could do, i already had 3 invuls, no big holes in the tank, but even with 3 invuls+overheat+damge control there is no way to survive this assault, so it's a pretty certain death. And since it's so profitable, it's getting more and more popular (i already complained about this in another thread before i was ganked).

Does that mean missions can be done with t2 items only ? What's the point then of all that officer and faction gear, who else should buy it ?

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you got suicide ganked flying a mission ship ???

wtf were you fitting for tank ???

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Originally by: Waynetta Slob

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Originally by: faxtarious

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Originally by: iudex

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I wonder what's the point of all those faction items in the LP store.
One does a lot of missions to be able to get those shiny caldari navy launchers, bcus and invuls, but at the end they only increases the danger for missionrunners.

Today i was ganked by 6 suiciding ravens (shinra corp) at a gate in Irjunen, after completing my mission. Pretty all of my modules were caldari navy items (except 3-4 maybe), but since the gankers get a full insurance payout, it only costs them 10-15mil to lose a raven. In my case that were 6 ships, which less than 100mil, so if someone has let's say items worth 300mil, he is already a profitable target for a 5 raven team. And there was nothing i could do, i already had 3 invuls, no big holes in the tank, but even with 3 invuls+overheat+damge control there is no way to survive this assault, so it's a pretty certain death. And since it's so profitable, it's getting more and more popular (i already complained about this in another thread before i was ganked).

Does that mean missions can be done with t2 items only ? What's the point then of all that officer and faction gear, who else should buy it ?

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you got suicide ganked flying a mission ship ???

wtf were you fitting for tank ???

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This.

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Originally by: Durzel

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Wonder why they don't post their losses? Is this typical or not?

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Originally by: Carniflex

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Originally by: Durzel

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Wonder why they don't post their losses? Is this typical or not?

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It is standard practice to not post losses to NPC's. CONCORD is NPC's thus losses to concord are usually not posted.

As far as some statements go on the lines 'fofofo u did not tank well if you were ganked in mission ship'. Tanking ability during suicide gank is irrelevant (as is posted several times before). Let us look at some numbers. Let us say that gankers are using T2 sieges (Siege launchers are afterall dirt free nowdays) with Rage torps using setup

Hi: 6x Siege II
Med: 1x warp disruptor 3x sensor booster (lock speed script) 2x target painter I
Low: 2x BCU II 3x BCU I
Drones: 3x Bcouncer I

This setup does around 5300 burst damage with RoF of approx 6 seconds. There is 6 of those guys and they will get off 3 volleys . That means 31800 damage per volley or 95 400 raw damage over 12 seconds. 3x CN invul tank CNR has approx 89 000 hp (omni) after resists or 82 000 hp against EM. Assuming that pilot activates hardeners before first volley hits and activates also his tank it will still mean that he will recive 95 k damage but can tank only 92 k of it over the 12 seconds of action. He dies. Same goes for officer fits altho to make sure kill gankers might need one more Raven if it's some 'estamel all' guy.

So where exactly goes the line under what it is not reasonable to pop you for your modules assuming that 50% of them go pop. With current market prices raven + above posted setup will cost 111 mil isk. Raven insurance is 35 mil and yields 108 mil as insurance payout. So total cost is approx 40 mil per ganker. 6x40 = 240 mil and if we assume that half of your modules go pop then break even point for gankers will be around 480 mil. So as rough guideline, if you are fitting modules that are worth more than 500 mil all togehter you can expect to be killed for those modules.

So it is safe to say that with current market prices full CN fits, even if you are using just CN regular hardeners is not under that line. It is still however safe to fit 4x navy BCU's as they give you best bang for your isk. Well at least I have drawn my conclusions and downgraded to regular T2 launchers from CN ones. Stay under 500 mil line and you be safe(r). When CCP get's around implementing ammo change for all launchers at once they will be more effective than CN ones anyway.

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