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Almarez Setenta Corp	Posted - 2008.03.09 01:31:00 - [1] Okay this isn't a NOS nerf thread, thats long gone. What I want to see on the Curse is a larger cargo hold. This would put it in line with the Khannid ships. Why do I want this, well cap charges of course. What does everyone think? If the Amarr are a colony of ants then CCP is that mean kid with the magnifying glass trying to set the ants on fire.
Eugenie	Posted - 2008.03.09 01:33:00 - [2] i fly gallente ships, and i dont find it any threat to gallente ships that if you give the damn curse additinal cargo, also it will still die, but it will make your customers more happy /signed
Crazy Tasty Beyond Divinity Inc	Posted - 2008.03.09 06:33:00 - [3] Curse is fine as is. Fix the Pilgrim.
Ruah Piskonit Amarr PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris	Posted - 2008.03.09 06:57:00 - [4] Originally by: Crazy Tasty Curse is fine as is. Fix the Pilgrim. this ----
Julius Romanus Blood Corsair's Blood Blind	Posted - 2008.03.09 07:17:00 - [5] Originally by: Ruah Piskonit Originally by: Crazy Tasty Curse is fine as is. Fix the Pilgrim. this I dont think a ship that requires a snake set before it works is fine personally.
Ruah Piskonit Amarr PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris	Posted - 2008.03.09 07:29:00 - [6] Originally by: Julius Romanus Originally by: Ruah Piskonit Originally by: Crazy Tasty Curse is fine as is. Fix the Pilgrim. this I dont think a ship that requires a snake set before it works is fine personally. Care to explain? The curse is arguably the best solo killer in the game. . .and no it does not even need a nano to do its nasty work since nothing is going to move very fast around it. . . ----
Xequecal	Posted - 2008.03.09 07:38:00 - [7] The biggest problem with the Curse is you can't catch anybody. The second you show up in local, all the ratters will safe spot. So you'll never catch anyone off a gate. You can't gate camp because you don't have a web, they'll just run back to the gate.
Roemy Schneider BINFORD Solidus Alliance	Posted - 2008.03.09 07:45:00 - [8] reduce nos/neut bonus on the curse anyway... heck i wish i had a 200% bonus to my weapon systems. yes, neutralizers are weapons. cap is life. just because they're a lil less direct doesn't make it EW. recons are meant do support fleets: dampening long range bs with just one mod, slashing their optimal with just one mod, completely shutting them off with jammers or painting them for better hit-rates. they're not meant to solo-pwn battleships. alas, the curse already does that (with all turret based ones) - putting the gist back into logistics
Athanasios Anastasiou The Illuminati. Triumvirate.	Posted - 2008.03.09 08:23:00 - [9] Originally by: Xequecal The biggest problem with the Curse is you can't catch anybody. The second you show up in local, all the ratters will safe spot. So you'll never catch anyone off a gate. You can't gate camp because you don't have a web, they'll just run back to the gate. Every nano ship suffers from this problem...
Dromidas Shadowmoon Minmatar 54th Knights Templar Dark Matter Coalition	Posted - 2008.03.09 08:39:00 - [10] Oh thats odd, I thought this was a thread about how powerful the curse was and that it needed to be toned. Maybe you meant pilgrim, not curse. I can see that ship needing a bit of a boost. _______________________________________________ Minmatar will always go faster than you, get over it.
Riho Mercenary Forces	Posted - 2008.03.09 10:23:00 - [11] curse does not need a fix.. buy a clue and learn to fly this ship proper. you dont have to be nano for it to work ---------------------------------- This is Me, fighting stupidity one post at a time. PS: There are no computer BUGs, there is stuff called "Random Features"
Firkragg PREDATORS OF DESTRUCTION	Posted - 2008.03.09 10:59:00 - [12] curse is currently fine, doesnt need more cargo bay because it doesnt actually need cap boosters. pilgrim on the other hand is broken. Ive just got a new one and there are very few targets it can engage, it just doesnt have the staying power anymore so it cant slowly kill targets like it used to.
Kim kitori Caldari State War Academy	Posted - 2008.03.09 11:34:00 - [13] Originally by: Crazy Tasty Curse is fine as is. Fix the Pilgrim. Pilgrim is fine as is. Fix the arazu.
Amira Shadowsong Caldari	Posted - 2008.03.09 12:12:00 - [14] Originally by: Crazy Tasty Curse is fine as is. Fix the Pilgrim. But wait, how is it logical that ccp nerf the cap killing ability of curse and now forcing cap boosters to maintain neut drains but DONT increase the cargo for it? Sounds dumb to me and yeah it needs a fix.
arbalesttom Caldari Glauxian Brothers	Posted - 2008.03.09 12:27:00 - [15] Originally by: Crazy Tasty Curse is fine as is. Fix the Pilgrim. This And as of now the gallente recons are the most useless. Stop whining. *Sig* Originally by: Cpt Branko That is a JoJo, a forum troll used by Amarr whiners. Originally by: Mitnal Locked, one troll after another. Mitnal, Community Representative
Lyria Skydancer Amarr Home 0f Bored Occultists	Posted - 2008.03.09 12:30:00 - [16] Originally by: arbalesttom Originally by: Crazy Tasty Curse is fine as is. Fix the Pilgrim. This And as of now the gallente recons are the most useless. Stop whining. Gallente recons are better then pilgrim in gang support. Pilgrim sucks in gangs and it sucks solo. I think dual suck beats a single suck. -------------------------------------- [Video]Skirmish Warfare
Ryysa Caldari	Posted - 2008.03.09 14:21:00 - [17] Originally by: Athanasios Anastasiou Originally by: Xequecal The biggest problem with the Curse is you can't catch anybody. The second you show up in local, all the ratters will safe spot. So you'll never catch anyone off a gate. You can't gate camp because you don't have a web, they'll just run back to the gate. Every nano ship suffers from this problem... Say hello to mr. nanoed up huginn. EW Guide - KB Tool - My Music
Vanessa Vale	Posted - 2008.03.09 15:04:00 - [18] This thread is going to places.
Athanasios Anastasiou The Illuminati. Triumvirate.	Posted - 2008.03.09 15:51:00 - [19] Originally by: Ryysa Originally by: Athanasios Anastasiou Originally by: Xequecal The biggest problem with the Curse is you can't catch anybody. The second you show up in local, all the ratters will safe spot. So you'll never catch anyone off a gate. You can't gate camp because you don't have a web, they'll just run back to the gate. Every nano ship suffers from this problem... Say hello to mr. nanoed up huginn. . Damn you ryysa! I was so close in succeeding to making a overly-broad categorization!
arbalesttom Caldari Glauxian Brothers	Posted - 2008.03.09 16:23:00 - [20] Originally by: Lyria Skydancer Originally by: arbalesttom Originally by: Crazy Tasty Curse is fine as is. Fix the Pilgrim. This And as of now the gallente recons are the most useless. Stop whining. Gallente recons are better then pilgrim in gang support. Pilgrim sucks in gangs and it sucks solo. I think dual suck beats a single suck. Ok pilgrim needs a boost, but gallente ones need one even harder (since there both pretty useless nowadays). *Sig* Originally by: Cpt Branko That is a JoJo, a forum troll used by Amarr whiners. Originally by: Mitnal Locked, one troll after another. Mitnal, Community Representative
Crazy Tasty Beyond Divinity Inc	Posted - 2008.03.09 16:35:00 - [21] Originally by: Amira Shadowsong Originally by: Crazy Tasty Curse is fine as is. Fix the Pilgrim. But wait, how is it logical that ccp nerf the cap killing ability of curse and now forcing cap boosters to maintain neut drains but DONT increase the cargo for it? Sounds dumb to me and yeah it needs a fix. 2x Nuet 3x Nos. Single targets its not a prob, cycle the nuets on and off as you have cap for it, if they cap boost, you get their cap with the Nos. Multiple targets is a little more difficult, but Nos one so you can perma nuet another. With all the Nos kicking you can perma run 2 nuets, even run the MWD a while to. Even if you fit a cap booster you shouldn't need to use it very much, except in an emergency.
Lyria Skydancer Amarr Home 0f Bored Occultists	Posted - 2008.03.09 17:13:00 - [22] Originally by: Crazy Tasty 2x Nuet 3x Nos. Single targets its not a prob, cycle the nuets on and off as you have cap for it, if they cap boost, you get their cap with the Nos. Multiple targets is a little more difficult, but Nos one so you can perma nuet another. With all the Nos kicking you can perma run 2 nuets, even run the MWD a while to. Even if you fit a cap booster you shouldn't need to use it very much, except in an emergency. Single targets? LoL, yeah I know its not a prob to neut a ganked target 5 vs 1 or similar. Do you know how impossible and worthless your idea of nossing one targets cap to neut another in a 10 vs 10 situation? Youll fail. Curse fails and it needs cap boosters, therefor room in cargo hold. Its really that simple. -------------------------------------- [Video]Skirmish Warfare
Crazy Tasty Beyond Divinity Inc	Posted - 2008.03.09 18:27:00 - [23] Originally by: Lyria Skydancer Originally by: Crazy Tasty 2x Nuet 3x Nos. Single targets its not a prob, cycle the nuets on and off as you have cap for it, if they cap boost, you get their cap with the Nos. Multiple targets is a little more difficult, but Nos one so you can perma nuet another. With all the Nos kicking you can perma run 2 nuets, even run the MWD a while to. Even if you fit a cap booster you shouldn't need to use it very much, except in an emergency. Single targets? LoL, yeah I know its not a prob to neut a ganked target 5 vs 1 or similar. Do you know how impossible and worthless your idea of nossing one targets cap to neut another in a 10 vs 10 situation? Youll fail. Curse fails and it needs cap boosters, therefor room in cargo hold. Its really that simple. I did say it was difficult, but you can Nos/Nuet to almost 40k for a reason, if you really have that much trouble Nosing one target while you Nuet another, or managing multiple targets in general, then maybe the curse isn't for you. That said, in medium gang engagements + or in general gang fights the curse is already sub-par to other recons, but theres nothing wrong with that. Imo, it shines in solo or small gang work, I can't count the number of times managing my Nos/Nuet targets has kept me alive and made other people dead. Again, if all you want to do is hit orbit and pound the function keys, maybe you should try a Crow or something.
Rodj Blake Amarr PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris	Posted - 2008.03.09 19:12:00 - [24] I quite like the Curse, and the forthcoming tracking disruptor boost means that it will be excellent against turret boats. Dulce et decorum est pro imperium mori.
Lyria Skydancer Amarr Home 0f Bored Occultists	Posted - 2008.03.09 21:18:00 - [25] Edited by: Lyria Skydancer on 09/03/2008 21:18:05 Originally by: Crazy Tasty I did say it was difficult, but you can Nos/Nuet to almost 40k for a reason, if you really have that much trouble Nosing one target while you Nuet another, or managing multiple targets in general, then maybe the curse isn't for you. That said, in medium gang engagements + or in general gang fights the curse is already sub-par to other recons, but theres nothing wrong with that. Imo, it shines in solo or small gang work, I can't count the number of times managing my Nos/Nuet targets has kept me alive and made other people dead. Again, if all you want to do is hit orbit and pound the function keys, maybe you should try a Crow or something. Oh its about skill? Pff, you said it yourself, its subpar in gangs compared to the other recons. Solo? Dont make me laugh, a sacrilege and the new zealot are much better solo ships. Curse isnt half as good as people claim it to be. Even with the TD fix its just slightly better really. I suggest you try kill anything in a curse that is pvp combat fitted. You struggle even with injected zealots... -------------------------------------- [Video]Skirmish Warfare
Amira Shadowsong State War Academy	Posted - 2008.03.14 18:55:00 - [26] Curse sucks, fix it please.
Alyth Corp 1 Allstars Insurgency	Posted - 2008.03.14 19:03:00 - [27] Originally by: Amira Shadowsong Curse sucks, fix it please. I wouldn't quite call a ship that can kill pretty much anything that doesn't use missiles one on one sucky. I also wouldn't call the three of them in the nano gang we encountered last night sucky either. It's a great ship that fits several roles really well. ------------------------------------------- Sig removed, inappropriate content. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint
Amira Shadowsong State War Academy	Posted - 2008.03.14 19:05:00 - [28] Originally by: Alyth Originally by: Amira Shadowsong Curse sucks, fix it please. I wouldn't quite call a ship that can kill pretty much anything that doesn't use missiles one on one sucky. I also wouldn't call the three of them in the nano gang we encountered last night sucky either. It's a great ship that fits several roles really well. Wrong. There is NO USE for a curse in a gang that has access to minmatar and caldari recons. Long webs and long range ECM is all you need. Why cant a curse run its ew without cap mods? All other recons can. Amarr is getting the old scroochie again.
Meiyang Lee Azteca Transportation Unlimited Gunboat Diplomacy	Posted - 2008.03.14 19:09:00 - [29] Edited by: Meiyang Lee on 14/03/2008 19:09:18 Considering the Curse has tracking disruptors as its E-war, it can run those easily without cap mods. Its neutralisers and NOS are not E-war as such, they are weapons. In EVE Cap = Life, without Cap you're basically dead only your ship hasn't realised this yet. Weapons on the whole take cap. (projectiles and missiles excluded, but those have other drawbacks) So there's little wrong with the Curse. Its also quite lethal, it can nuke the cap of pretty much anything and stay alive while doing it against pretty much any turret based vessel, so i doubt it would need any "fixing". After disabling its target, it can pick it apart at leisure.
Amira Shadowsong State War Academy	Posted - 2008.03.14 19:13:00 - [30] Originally by: Meiyang Lee Its neutralisers and NOS are not E-war as such, they are weapons. OK if you want to be all A N A L about it let me explain it like this: Its stupid that a ship has mods that are bonused on said ship BUT the ship CANNOT RUN THE MODS WITHOUT CAP MODS. Doesnt that sound a bit stupid? Caldari recons have bonus to ECM, they can run full racks of it. Minmatar can run webs + TPs without probs. MWD all day and be happy. Why are amarr ships always so messed up that every damn ship needs a fitting mod to even work. Its bull****.
Alyth Corp 1 Allstars Insurgency	Posted - 2008.03.14 19:35:00 - [31] Edited by: Alyth on 14/03/2008 19:36:37 Originally by: Amira Shadowsong Originally by: Alyth Originally by: Amira Shadowsong Curse sucks, fix it please. I wouldn't quite call a ship that can kill pretty much anything that doesn't use missiles one on one sucky. I also wouldn't call the three of them in the nano gang we encountered last night sucky either. It's a great ship that fits several roles really well. Wrong. There is NO USE for a curse in a gang that has access to minmatar and caldari recons. Long webs and long range ECM is all you need. Why cant a curse run its ew without cap mods? All other recons can. Amarr is getting the old scroochie again. You're fully aware that a Lachesis with all it's ewar going caps out too if it uses anything in it's highs or turns on its MWD for even one cycle right? Funny also how that gang we ran into included recons from every race barring gallente right? Obviously ev0ke don't know what they are doing, I'll have a word with them next time. Jams can miss cycles, webs: well whoopie, everyone and their mum packs a web. Bonused tracking disruptors and nos/neuts will shut down any ship any time....in fact Amarr recons are now a minmatar and gallente blaster boat pilots worst nightmare. ------------------------------------------- Sig removed, inappropriate content. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint
Amira Shadowsong State War Academy	Posted - 2008.03.14 19:39:00 - [32] Originally by: Alyth You're fully aware that a Lachesis with all it's ewar going caps out too if it uses anything in it's highs or turns on its MWD for even one cycle right? Funny also how that gang we ran into included recons from every race barring gallente right? Obviously ev0ke don't know what they are doing, I'll have a word with them next time. Jams can miss cycles, webs: well whoopie, everyone and their mum packs a web. Bonused tracking disruptors and nos/neuts will shut down any ship any time....in fact Amarr recons are now a minmatar and gallente blaster boat pilots worst nightmare. If you have caldari and minmatar recons YOU DONT NEED AMARR NOR GALLENTE ONES. Curse needs a fix. Curse is half-azzed at best.
Amira Shadowsong State War Academy	Posted - 2008.03.14 19:40:00 - [33] Originally by: Alyth You're fully aware that a Lachesis with all it's ewar going caps out too if it uses anything in it's highs or turns on its MWD for even one cycle right? And caldari and minmatar recons how are their cap holding up einstein?
Alyth Corp 1 Allstars Insurgency	Posted - 2008.03.14 19:41:00 - [34] Originally by: Amira Shadowsong Originally by: Alyth You're fully aware that a Lachesis with all it's ewar going caps out too if it uses anything in it's highs or turns on its MWD for even one cycle right? And caldari and minmatar recons how are their cap holding up einstein? Well with that curse around I'm suprised they have any. ------------------------------------------- Sig removed, inappropriate content. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint
Amira Shadowsong State War Academy	Posted - 2008.03.14 19:42:00 - [35] Originally by: Alyth Well with that curse around I'm suprised they have any. This is about how recons can be fitted and used in gangs without capping out. Why can caldari and minmatar ones be fitted without cap mods and do just fine? Youre avoiding the question because you know this is broken. Curse needs higher neut bonus or more cap.
Grytok moon7empler Ev0ke	Posted - 2008.03.14 19:53:00 - [36] Learn how to freakin fit a Curse. You don't need a Cap Booster to run NOS/Neuts + MWD + Tracking Disruptors + Scram. .
Amira Shadowsong State War Academy	Posted - 2008.03.14 19:56:00 - [37] Originally by: Grytok Learn how to freakin fit a Curse. You don't need a Cap Booster to run NOS/Neuts + MWD + Tracking Disruptors + Scram. You cheating or how are you using neuts without cap mods? Why can minmatar and caldari recons use their bonused mods without capmods while curse cant? Fix it.
Grytok moon7empler Ev0ke	Posted - 2008.03.14 19:57:00 - [38] If you try running around with Neuts only, then it's your problem. Mix them NOS and Neuts and you're fine. .
Amira Shadowsong State War Academy	Posted - 2008.03.14 20:00:00 - [39] Originally by: Grytok If you try running around with Neuts only, then it's your problem. Mix them NOS and Neuts and you're fine. You know how nos works? It stops working when his cap percentage is below your own. This means either your cap goes dry or you wont get his cap dry. I know eft might show you something else, but you need to go play this game on tranquility mkay?
Alyth Corp 1 Allstars Insurgency	Posted - 2008.03.14 20:00:00 - [40] Originally by: Amira Shadowsong Originally by: Alyth Well with that curse around I'm suprised they have any. This is about how recons can be fitted and used in gangs without capping out. Why can caldari and minmatar ones be fitted without cap mods and do just fine? Youre avoiding the question because you know this is broken. Curse needs higher neut bonus or more cap. I'm not avoiding any questions in the slightest. It's not broken, it's a fine ship. Looking at a setup now for gang combat and....whats this? It DOESN'T cap out? z0mg! Just because you are in a gang you don't need to nano. Even if you do nano you can still fit it right and not cap out. Also, point at one Caldari, Gallente or Minmatar combat recon thats going to be doing anything else but jamming/webbing/pointing from 40k. A Huginn needs to get within 15k to do anything like serious damage, a Lachesis goes pop as soon as you look at it and same with a Rook as soon as it misses a cycle if you don't run away from it's lack of tackling first. And what happens if the Curse gets ahold of any one of those ships?. Now the Pilgrim, that may need a little love but the Curse is great as it is. ------------------------------------------- Sig removed, inappropriate content. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint
Alyth Corp 1 Allstars Insurgency	Posted - 2008.03.14 20:04:00 - [41] Edited by: Alyth on 14/03/2008 20:05:42 Originally by: Amira Shadowsong Originally by: Grytok If you try running around with Neuts only, then it's your problem. Mix them NOS and Neuts and you're fine. You know how nos works? It stops working when his cap percentage is below your own. This means either your cap goes dry or you wont get his cap dry. I know eft might show you something else, but you need to go play this game on tranquility mkay? I think you're the one that needs to look at TQ from time to time. You neut until your cap is low, stagger your neuts and turn on your nos. Oh look, you're sucking cap from him! It's a miracle! What? His cap is empty now? I only have to run one neut to keep it that way? Oh my god! Also, Egress Port Maximizer I. Look it up. ------------------------------------------- Sig removed, inappropriate content. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint
Amira Shadowsong State War Academy	Posted - 2008.03.14 20:05:00 - [42] Originally by: Alyth Just because you are in a gang you don't need to nano But huginn can nano and still be cap stable while running all its bonused mods. Originally by: Alyth A Huginn needs to get within 15k to do anything like serious damage You fail, because you need to fit arty on a huginn. Originally by: Alyth goes pop as soon as you look at it and same with a Rook as soon as it misses a cycle if you don't run away from it's lack of tackling first Yeah because rook cant ECM from 100-150km range? Fail. Ships like falcon have the highest survival rate together with rapiers. Go compare the survival rate to a pilgrim. Fail. Originally by: Alyth And what happens if the Curse gets ahold of any one of those ships?. Youre still avoiding the issue. Why can minmatar and caldari recons use their bonused mods without capmods but curse needs capmods to use its bonused mods like neuts.
Amira Shadowsong State War Academy	Posted - 2008.03.14 20:06:00 - [43] Originally by: Alyth I think you're the one that needs to look at TQ from time to time. You neut until your cap is low, stagger your neuts and turn on your nos. Oh look, you're sucking cap from him! It's a miracle! What? His cap is empty now? I only have to run one neut to keep it that way? Oh my god! Uhm, you still cant run it for very long. On tranq your cap wont start from 100% you know. Youll fail. It needs more cap or more bonus to neuts.
Grytok moon7empler Ev0ke	Posted - 2008.03.14 20:09:00 - [44] Edited by: Grytok on 14/03/2008 20:12:49 Edited by: Grytok on 14/03/2008 20:11:14 Originally by: Amira Shadowsong Originally by: Grytok If you try running around with Neuts only, then it's your problem. Mix them NOS and Neuts and you're fine. You know how nos works? It stops working when his cap percentage is below your own. This means either your cap goes dry or you wont get his cap dry. I know eft might show you something else, but you need to go play this game on tranquility mkay? I fly the Pilgrim and Curse since the NOS get changed, and I'm doing pretty fine actually. Maybe it's because you wanna go out there solo and kill everything in your Combat Recon. Well... i got news for ya: There is no solopwnmobile! And if you want to fit the Curse for beeing CapStable then this works as well, when you sacrifice some of your speed. ---- Overdrive Injector System II Overdrive Injector System II Nanofiber Internal Structure II Capacitor Power Relay II 10MN MicroWarpdrive II Warp Disruptor II Balmer Series Targeting Inhibitor I Large Shield Extender II Large Capacitor Battery II Cap Recharger II Medium Unstable Power Fluctuator I Medium Unstable Power Fluctuator I Medium Diminishing Power System Drain I Standard Missile Launcher II Standard Missile Launcher II Capacitor Control Circuit I Capacitor Control Circuit I There. You can run MWD + Scram + TD + 2x Neut indefinite. The NOS is only used, when you get neutralized yourself. ---- Come again? And oh.... no, a Huginn can't run it's MWD either without a Cap-Booster, and no other Recon aswell, besides the Curse. .
Amira Shadowsong State War Academy	Posted - 2008.03.14 20:13:00 - [45] Originally by: Grytok ... Thats alot of cap mods. If youd stick just half those cap mods on a huginn it would be able to perma mwd + use all modules forever. How is that fair again? Please explain.
Alyth Corp 1 Allstars Insurgency	Posted - 2008.03.14 20:14:00 - [46] Originally by: Amira Shadowsong Originally by: Alyth I think you're the one that needs to look at TQ from time to time. You neut until your cap is low, stagger your neuts and turn on your nos. Oh look, you're sucking cap from him! It's a miracle! What? His cap is empty now? I only have to run one neut to keep it that way? Oh my god! Uhm, you still cant run it for very long. On tranq your cap wont start from 100% you know. Youll fail. It needs more cap or more bonus to neuts. Errrr....nope, this is STILL running forever. Oh look, some more time has just gone by and it's still running forever. You don't NEED to run all your neuts forever, only until he caps out and then you only need 1 running because I'd like to see any non-capital in eve get more than 360 cap in 12 seconds without boosters. Even then you only need to run 3 neuts for 1 cycle to negate even a cap 800 booster which is where the nos in your other 2 highs come in to play by switching off one or two neuts and nosing his cap away instead. If the Curse needs anything it's more grid and thats it. ------------------------------------------- Sig removed, inappropriate content. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint
Grytok moon7empler Ev0ke	Posted - 2008.03.14 20:15:00 - [47] Edited by: Grytok on 14/03/2008 20:15:49 Originally by: Amira Shadowsong Originally by: Grytok ... Thats alot of cap mods. If youd stick just half those cap mods on a huginn it would be able to perma mwd + use all modules forever. How is that fair again? Please explain. Show me, how a Huginn runs 2x Medium Neitralizers (equal to 2x Heavy Neuts). The Damage a Huginn can do is laughable against a battleships tank. The Curse will nullify the Battleships tank within 1 Minute. .
Amira Shadowsong State War Academy	Posted - 2008.03.14 20:16:00 - [48] Originally by: Alyth If the Curse needs anything it's more grid and thats it. Id settle for that too. Because right now caldari and minmatar recon pilots are laughing it up.
Amira Shadowsong State War Academy	Posted - 2008.03.14 20:16:00 - [49] Originally by: Grytok Originally by: Amira Shadowsong Originally by: Grytok ... Thats alot of cap mods. If youd stick just half those cap mods on a huginn it would be able to perma mwd + use all modules forever. How is that fair again? Please explain. Show me, how a Huginn runs 2x Medium Neitralizers (equal to 2x Heavy Neuts). The Damage a Huginn can do is laughable for a battleship. The Curse will nullify the Battleships tank within 1 Minute. wth? huginn doesnt have neuts as bonused module has it? It can run all its bonused mods without capping out. Curse cant. Its not fair.
Kruel Beyond Divinity Inc	Posted - 2008.03.14 20:19:00 - [50] The Curse is still a good ship... I lose a lot more drones now thanks to the damp and drone nerfs, but it's still workable for solo & small gangs. Pilgrim on the other hand is good for killing frigs and t1 cruisers. That's about it.
Amira Shadowsong State War Academy	Posted - 2008.03.14 20:20:00 - [51] Originally by: Kruel The Curse is still a good ship... I lose a lot more drones now thanks to the damp and drone nerfs, but it's still workable for solo & small gangs. Pilgrim on the other hand is good for killing frigs and t1 cruisers. That's about it. Yes pilgrim sucks. Cant belive they still havent given it a range bonus like ALL the other recons. Curse is workable but not in the same league as minmatar and caldari.
Camulos Redne No Quarter. Vae Victis.	Posted - 2008.03.14 20:21:00 - [52] 2 NOS on secondary targets, 1 neut + missiles + drones on primary 2 TDs on turret ships of choice, Sustained MWD flying you around @ 3750ms^1 @35k hows the curse not a good gang ship? I use to have an uba sig. Then it got wtfpwned!
Amira Shadowsong State War Academy	Posted - 2008.03.14 20:22:00 - [53] Originally by: Camulos Redne 2 NOS on secondary targets, 1 neut + missiles + drones on primary 2 TDs on turret ships of choice, Sustained MWD flying you around @ 3750ms^1 @35k hows the curse not a good gang ship? You think 1 neut can kill a 800 injected BC even? Hah. You need atleast 2 neuts or youll fail.
Alyth Corp 1 Allstars Insurgency	Posted - 2008.03.14 20:25:00 - [54] Originally by: Amira Shadowsong Originally by: Alyth If the Curse needs anything it's more grid and thats it. Id settle for that too. Because right now caldari and minmatar recon pilots are laughing it up. Huginn is unbelievably fricking hard to fit if you fit artillery because you have to settle for small launchers and if you fit dual LSE II in the mids, you need to drop down to dual 180mm II for solo work which aren't exactly brilliant. Caladri recons only have loads of grid because they fit bugger all in the way of propulsion, tank and (in general) weaponry. The sit at 150k and do lots of nothing. ------------------------------------------- Sig removed, inappropriate content. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint
Alyth Corp 1 Allstars Insurgency	Posted - 2008.03.14 20:27:00 - [55] Originally by: Amira Shadowsong Originally by: Camulos Redne 2 NOS on secondary targets, 1 neut + missiles + drones on primary 2 TDs on turret ships of choice, Sustained MWD flying you around @ 3750ms^1 @35k hows the curse not a good gang ship? You think 1 neut can kill a 800 injected BC even? Hah. You need atleast 2 neuts or youll fail. What BC is going to catch you at nigh-on 4km/s? He'll run out of boosters before he kills you with the warrior II's he'll have to use. ------------------------------------------- Sig removed, inappropriate content. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint
Amira Shadowsong State War Academy	Posted - 2008.03.14 20:27:00 - [56] Originally by: Alyth Originally by: Amira Shadowsong Originally by: Alyth If the Curse needs anything it's more grid and thats it. Id settle for that too. Because right now caldari and minmatar recon pilots are laughing it up. Huginn is unbelievably fricking hard to fit if you fit artillery because you have to settle for small launchers and if you fit dual LSE II in the mids, you need to drop down to dual 180mm II for solo work which aren't exactly brilliant. Caladri recons only have loads of grid because they fit bugger all in the way of propulsion, tank and (in general) weaponry. The sit at 150k and do lots of nothing. But huginn can fit it. And whats wrong with SMLs? They reach 40km dude.
Amira Shadowsong State War Academy	Posted - 2008.03.14 20:28:00 - [57] Edited by: Amira Shadowsong on 14/03/2008 20:28:20 Originally by: Alyth What BC is going to catch you at nigh-on 4km/s? He'll run out of boosters before he kills you with the warrior II's he'll have to use. What use are you to your gang then if you cant kill a BC cap. Youll get bullied ffs.
Grytok moon7empler Ev0ke	Posted - 2008.03.14 20:35:00 - [58] Originally by: Amira Shadowsong Edited by: Amira Shadowsong on 14/03/2008 20:28:20 Originally by: Alyth What BC is going to catch you at nigh-on 4km/s? He'll run out of boosters before he kills you with the warrior II's he'll have to use. What use are you to your gang then if you cant kill a BC cap. Youll get bullied ffs. If you fly in a gang, then my proposed Setup will work 100%. You kill the cap so the target can't tank and/or use it's turrets, and the others deal damage. .
Alyth Corp 1 Allstars Insurgency	Posted - 2008.03.14 20:41:00 - [59] Originally by: Amira Shadowsong Originally by: Alyth Originally by: Amira Shadowsong Originally by: Alyth If the Curse needs anything it's more grid and thats it. Id settle for that too. Because right now caldari and minmatar recon pilots are laughing it up. Huginn is unbelievably fricking hard to fit if you fit artillery because you have to settle for small launchers and if you fit dual LSE II in the mids, you need to drop down to dual 180mm II for solo work which aren't exactly brilliant. Caladri recons only have loads of grid because they fit bugger all in the way of propulsion, tank and (in general) weaponry. The sit at 150k and do lots of nothing. But huginn can fit it. And whats wrong with SMLs? They reach 40km dude. Only just, and it's rather sucky solo. And SML's unbonused are about 12dps each. Your drones will do more DPS than your entire ship and from further away. ------------------------------------------- Sig removed, inappropriate content. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint
Julius Romanus Blood Corsair's Blood Blind	Posted - 2008.03.14 20:43:00 - [60] Originally by: Kruel The Curse is still a good ship... I lose a lot more drones now thanks to the damp and drone nerfs, but it's still workable for solo & small gangs. Pilgrim on the other hand is good for killing frigs and t1 cruisers. That's about it. It's also good at killing the demios. Td's cutting falloff actually does help the pilgrim in this one specific instance, it hurts null very hard.
Alyth Corp 1 Allstars Insurgency	Posted - 2008.03.14 20:52:00 - [61] Originally by: Julius Romanus Originally by: Kruel The Curse is still a good ship... I lose a lot more drones now thanks to the damp and drone nerfs, but it's still workable for solo & small gangs. Pilgrim on the other hand is good for killing frigs and t1 cruisers. That's about it. It's also good at killing the demios. Td's cutting falloff actually does help the pilgrim in this one specific instance, it hurts null very hard. Barrage M is also as useful as marshmallow ammo if you stick a TD or two on a vaga or sleipnir. In fact projectiles full stop become the epitome of suck. ------------------------------------------- Sig removed, inappropriate content. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint
Amira Shadowsong State War Academy	Posted - 2008.03.14 21:13:00 - [62] Originally by: Alyth Only just, and it's rather sucky solo. Oh you can fly those solo? Curse sucks solo tbh.
Alyth Corp 1 Allstars Insurgency	Posted - 2008.03.14 21:21:00 - [63] Originally by: Amira Shadowsong Originally by: Alyth Only just, and it's rather sucky solo. Oh you can fly those solo? Curse sucks solo tbh. I sincerely beg to differ. If it's not nano'd, got missiles or heavy drones then it's dead. Turret boats can't hit it, T1 missile and drone boats smaller than battleships melt. I'm fairly confident it could even take on a mega and win, it would just take a while. In fact, pulling a Mega's drones away and killing them while you kill his cap leaves a megathron to slow and messy end. All you have to remember is a Curse is a mini nos/neut domi, only faster and with smaller drones. ------------------------------------------- Sig removed, inappropriate content. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint
Camulos Redne No Quarter. Vae Victis.	Posted - 2008.03.14 21:54:00 - [64] fine, fit 1 NOS and 4xHMLII, the one nos will keep your MWDII and TDs running. Jesus. I use to have an uba sig. Then it got wtfpwned!
Crazy Tasty Beyond Divinity Inc	Posted - 2008.03.15 00:16:00 - [65] Hi, my name is Amira Shadowsong, I will claim that various ships are uber/crap/unbalanced at my whim. I will also shout down any plausible counter to said uber/crap/unbalanced ship with an arbitrary unrealistic, unsubstantiated, or purely theoretical EFT style fit that I have little or no working knowledge of. I continue this series or arbitrary unrealistic/unsubstantiated/theoretical replies as I really think the original ship is crap/uber/balanced and want to see it nerfed/buffed to uber/crap/IWINBUTTON, or, I have no real knowledge of the original ship and will whine about it even though there are countless viable setups available. Obviously my time in State War Academy has endowed me with limitless knowledge of PvP in Eve and my opinions are irrefutable, further, CCP has recognized this and will forgo numerous other ship changes and balances that are infinitely more important to implement an emergence patch to my whim. Seriously, if you have that many problems with one of the best ships in game, contract it to me at half market price and get something else, I'll give it a good home with lots of KMs. ------ Originally by: Garmon people using warp core stabilizers are generally more skilled than people not using warp corer stabilizers
Julius Romanus Blood Corsair's Blood Blind	Posted - 2008.03.15 01:59:00 - [66] I want to amend my previous post regarding the curse. It is a brutally effective ship against turret users. However minus a snake set, it is easily scared off by any well skilled missile user, and in even more serious danger against a missile hac. That was my point, though poorly expressed.
Kalek Astroth A.N.A.R.C.H.I.C.A Tau Ceti Federation	Posted - 2008.03.15 03:25:00 - [67] as any ship you have to pick your targets , it still give the pilot the chance to fight outnumbered and came out on top , to engage turret bs with good hope to win , to engage a wide variety of bc and hacs with very good chance to kill em... taking into account that takling a curse is an hard task for fast ships the hopes to get out of troubles are also decent when thing go wrong... it looks fine to me give a fix at the pilgrim instead
Rawr Cristina Naqam	Posted - 2008.03.15 03:44:00 - [68] Curses are fine tbh, especially in small gangs. It's neuting bonus means you can kill pretty much anything except a pure-passive drake with little to no dps. ...
Amira Shadowsong State War Academy	Posted - 2008.03.15 05:15:00 - [69] Originally by: Julius Romanus I want to amend my previous post regarding the curse. It is a brutally effective ship against turret users. However minus a snake set, it is easily scared off by any well skilled missile user, and in even more serious danger against a missile hac. That was my point, though poorly expressed. Not only do missiles ships like sacri just face pwn it but even turret ships like injected zealots just destroy a nano curse. Curse needs to be able to run the mods it has bonuses to AS easy as the other recons can.
Alyth Corp 1 Allstars Insurgency	Posted - 2008.03.15 08:49:00 - [70] Originally by: Amira Shadowsong Originally by: Julius Romanus I want to amend my previous post regarding the curse. It is a brutally effective ship against turret users. However minus a snake set, it is easily scared off by any well skilled missile user, and in even more serious danger against a missile hac. That was my point, though poorly expressed. Not only do missiles ships like sacri just face pwn it but even turret ships like injected zealots just destroy a nano curse. Curse needs to be able to run the mods it has bonuses to AS easy as the other recons can. Nope, injected zealots are still dead zealots when you hit them with 2x optimal and 1x tracking speed scripted tracking disruptors because then they a: can't shoot past 10km b: find it hard to hit anything smaller than a BS within 10km ------------------------------------------- Sig removed, inappropriate content. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint
Depp Knight Evolution Band of Brothers	Posted - 2008.03.15 09:09:00 - [71] Edited by: Depp Knight on 15/03/2008 09:12:57 The curse is just about fine imo. It isnÆt the same ship as it was and it still blows as the larger the gang gets. Which is annoying because everyone and their dog knows like the domi, the curse blows in fleet and large gangs and become less important in medium gangs. ItÆs in small gangs and solo where it has thrived. This is why the curse was an amazing solo ship pre nos nerf where as now you have to select your targets a little more carefully and fit it with expensive gear. With a snake set itÆs still as deadly as before and will do the job. Now Caldari recons and the huginn/rapier are awesome fleet and larger gangs. They are amazing in their own role. In medium gangs they are just as good and even small but they both blow in solo but you know, people accept that because they are amazing in gangs. And that there annoys me. People say Recons are not meant to be solo ships. Maybe but who says that because the caldari and minmatar recons a perfectly made as they succeed as gangs where as the amarr ships do not. Everyone knows this but it gets ignored. Curse and especially the pilgrim blows in any gang larger than small. The pilgrim pre nos nerf was a good little solo killer but everyone called out for a nos nerf ignoring the fact that they blow in fleet. So answer that question. Why cant the curse and pilgrim be an amazing solo ship but still suck in fleet and why can the caldari and minmatar recon ships be amazing in everything bar solo? One is accepted while the other is not and that alone is unfair. Either beef the curse up a bit to make it more effective solo killer along with the pilgrim or go back to the drawing board and find away how to make it viable in fleets.
Gregoriuses Naughty 40 Triumvirate.	Posted - 2008.03.15 09:20:00 - [72] people, aren't u ashamed of posting threts like this ? wtf? Do u come form wow where are posting all the time...boost this...bost that... start flying ships for real not just f...ing *****ing all the time! Get skills to full cose recons are not for flying noobs anyway. Someone said about 200% range weapon and that neut is weapon LOL. Omg what a jurk. Read info if neutrals and u will see. And than we can say to all recons... nerf, ecm, nerf dampering, nerf web.... oh god. Curse is ok ship and no need to boost. ( I am amarr anyway). If any ship need boost is apoc (mining bonnus, cose this ship is just wasted) and pilgrim.
J Valkor Invicta.	Posted - 2008.03.15 09:27:00 - [73] Edited by: J Valkor on 15/03/2008 09:27:24 In a gang environment the curse is awesome for breaking active tanks. When your gang is made up of cruiser sized vessels and you need to bring down BS there are few better wingmen to have than a curse. The propensity of every idiot and his mother to fit an MWD on their ship makes nuking cap even easier. Now, as for the pilgrim... that is a different story.
dAn melax Beyond Divinity Inc	Posted - 2008.03.15 11:27:00 - [74] Go away! Features and Ideas Discussion Play Hard. Go Pro.
Tian Jade Panta-Rhei Phoenix Allianz	Posted - 2008.03.15 12:06:00 - [75] The Curse is an awesome Support Ship in small to medium sized Gangs. It can destroy any active tank in a very short while and can also reduce the DPS of Turret-Users with their TD. It's downsides are that their role of Tracking Disruption and destroying active tanks is not needed in a situation where to large fleets clash together. It can also fit only a weak tank on it's own and is difficult to nano.
No21 Hush.	Posted - 2008.03.15 13:47:00 - [76] The Curse might be fine, but not TD,s and the script ****. It's effectiveness up close(web range) got heavily affected with the introduction of scripts.
SirDanceAlot Federal Navy Academy	Posted - 2008.03.16 18:13:00 - [77] BOOST CURSE.
Jasai Kameron Hakata Group Blade.	Posted - 2008.03.16 18:41:00 - [78] Originally by: Amira Shadowsong Its stupid that a ship has mods that are bonused on said ship BUT the ship CANNOT RUN THE MODS WITHOUT CAP MODS. No, it's not. Just try looking at EVE. At the very least, 50% of ships fit cap mods to do what they do.
Amira Shadowsong State War Academy	Posted - 2008.03.16 18:44:00 - [79] Edited by: Amira Shadowsong on 16/03/2008 18:44:09 Originally by: Jasai Kameron Originally by: Amira Shadowsong Its stupid that a ship has mods that are bonused on said ship BUT the ship CANNOT RUN THE MODS WITHOUT CAP MODS. No, it's not. Just try looking at EVE. At the very least, 50% of ships fit cap mods to do what they do. Im pretty sure you made that up. Say high to Alice from me.
Alyth Corp 1 Allstars Insurgency	Posted - 2008.03.17 10:24:00 - [80] Originally by: Amira Shadowsong Edited by: Amira Shadowsong on 16/03/2008 18:44:09 Originally by: Jasai Kameron Originally by: Amira Shadowsong Its stupid that a ship has mods that are bonused on said ship BUT the ship CANNOT RUN THE MODS WITHOUT CAP MODS. No, it's not. Just try looking at EVE. At the very least, 50% of ships fit cap mods to do what they do. Im pretty sure you made that up. Say high to Alice from me. I'd like you to show me one combat ships that doesn't use at least a cap booster. Then I'll go and find you five more that do. ------------------------------------------- Sig removed, inappropriate content. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint
Rutefly Freedom-Technologies imPure.	Posted - 2008.03.17 11:07:00 - [81] If people havent figured it out yet. Amarr ships are only viable in gangs. In fleets and gangs they show their true nature. Also amarr ships are among the most skill intensive ships to get in par with other races ships. Picking Amarr as prime, means you dont want to pew anytime soon, and are going to stick with Eve for a long, long time.
deadmeet Star Blossom	Posted - 2008.03.17 12:06:00 - [82] Curse have the reputation to be one of the best (if not the best) recon ship in that game, and you want to fix it ? omg...
Amira Shadowsong State War Academy	Posted - 2008.03.17 12:18:00 - [83] Originally by: Alyth I'd like you to show me one combat ships that doesn't use at least a cap booster. Then I'll go and find you five more that do. Every combat ship fits cap booster because they want to run tank AND gank AND mods at the same time. Curse cant even run its mods. We are not even talking about running a tank at the same time. The other recons can run their mods easily while the curse cant. So yeah, youre making stuff up.
Brea Lafail Center for Advanced Studies	Posted - 2008.03.17 12:21:00 - [84] Originally by: Rutefly If people havent figured it out yet. Amarr ships are only viable in gangs. In fleets and gangs they show their true nature. You're thinking Caldari Originally by: Rutefly Also amarr ships are among the most skill intensive ships to get in par with other races ships. Now you're thinking minmatar. Originally by: Rutefly Picking Amarr as prime, means you dont want to pew anytime soon, and are going to stick with Eve for a long, long time. Now I don't know what you're thinking. Originally by: deadmeet Curse have the reputation to be one of the best (if not the best) recon ship in that game, and you want to fix it ? That's part of the problem, everyone has a fair idea what a curse can and cannot take, so they either stay the hell away or bonk it. Vaga? Run. Passive Drake? Bonk. If people think it's the best or if they just think it's potentially dangerous, I would argue the latter. Curse ain't too bad, but the pilgrim... unless Im mistaken, it's the only recon that has to go anywhere near web range. This is a problem for 100mil-isk ships that tank like t1.
Amira Shadowsong State War Academy	Posted - 2008.03.17 12:34:00 - [85] Originally by: deadmeet Curse have the reputation to be one of the best (if not the best) recon ship in that game, and you want to fix it ? omg... Too bad it aint the best to begin with.
Biced North Face Force	Posted - 2008.03.17 12:59:00 - [86] Edited by: Biced on 17/03/2008 13:02:02 hmmm... ill start with this, To all the idiots that think the curse should be able to run neuts without some cap modules you guys just fail in eve. To all the idiots that compare neuts to ecm you too fail in eve. To all the others that say it sucks please sell them to me for 55mil like it was before the patch. This post has nothing to do with the pilgrim there is another place to talk about it somewhere here you guys should bump it. i dont fly it and i dont like it so i have nothing else to say about this ship. nos one target neut the other works but you still need the cap boosters to run both neuts mwd if you choose. fitting just one neut on the curse is bad this is just not how this ship works, cause you will be doing your job slow. in this case your gang would be better off with a hac or any other recon imo. Its not so good in large gangs cause things go pop before they are out of cap right? sorry i dont blob so i dont know Now in small gangs its an awesome ship if it kills the cap of a BS and it dies in half the time it would have without the curse there or when it kills the cap of that falcon in one sec. Now about matari recons you all cry about them being overpowered just cause of the web range bonus. and you know it so please stfu. its just one bonus they are hard to fit and the other ew bonus they get is TPs... Now Caldari recons you do know they have 0 tank right? and... 0 dps.. and they look ugly.. and there is a word i have for ecm which everyone use it for nanos.. To all the Gallente recon pilots i am really sorry for you guys but i used to use damps on my curse before the change... so something was really wrong with that module. Back on topic Cargo hold is fine. I would love it to have more though
Cpt Branko Surge. Night's Dawn	Posted - 2008.03.17 13:01:00 - [87] Hmmm. As a BC (Hurricane, in fact) pilot, there is practically no ship that is as scary as the nano-Curse, solo, and that's before the TD patch. Even the Huggin (with its worse DPS and has to stay between 20-24km range to not get its dual-LSE tank broken, and once you dispose of his very few drones you can permatank him for a very long time as long as you have cap boosters) is less scary. A Lachersis I'll laugh at solo, and you can't solo in a Rook anyway (it's a gang jamming ship). The Curse, on the other hand, does solid DPS, has replacement drones, removes any ability to rep/MWD/ewar (if you're not cap injected, you're not even going to be webbing the drones, lol), drops your range to total crap. It needs a fix how? It's awesome for any small gangs anyway, because it can both stop the really fast buggers/other recons by nuking their cap, can TD people, contributes solid DPS on top. Sig removed, inappropriate link. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint
Amira Shadowsong State War Academy	Posted - 2008.03.17 13:33:00 - [88] Originally by: Cpt Branko Hmmm. As a BC (Hurricane, in fact) pilot, there is practically no ship that is as scary as the nano-Curse, solo, and that's before the TD patch. Even the Huggin (with its worse DPS and has to stay between 20-24km range to not get its dual-LSE tank broken, and once you dispose of his very few drones you can permatank him for a very long time as long as you have cap boosters) is less scary. A Lachersis I'll laugh at solo, and you can't solo in a Rook anyway (it's a gang jamming ship). The Curse, on the other hand, does solid DPS, has replacement drones, removes any ability to rep/MWD/ewar (if you're not cap injected, you're not even going to be webbing the drones, lol), drops your range to total crap. It needs a fix how? It's awesome for any small gangs anyway, because it can both stop the really fast buggers/other recons by nuking their cap, can TD people, contributes solid DPS on top. We are not talking about solo here. I mean arent you more afraid of a rook? It can perma jam your silly hurricane from 100km away while his friends can kill you.
Omarvelous Destry's Lounge XIII Legio	Posted - 2008.03.17 13:55:00 - [89] How do you propose to boost a ship that excels in solo/small gang but not in fleet? The effects of NOS/neut is short ranged - which favors small scale engagements. ECM is long range and thsi favors large engagements. Boosting the Curse to excel at large scale combat would make it a bit overpowered solo/small gang would it not? If you could nuke cap at further ranges + fit 24km scram (or even faction scram) - you would completely and utterly dominate every active cap using ship out there. Just orbit outside of battleship NOS/neut range, nuke cap, kill with drones that don't need to worry about tracking. There's a reason why missile boats (trackless weapons) are super slow... I don't think the Curse is unbalanced (wish I had some my gangs, but my friends love dps over everything else ) - it does really well in small scale engagements, not so much at large fleet operations. You may as well complain that missiles need a boost because they suck for fleet ops. You can't have it all. __________________________________________________ Sup brosef! Destry's Lounge is looking for a few good drunks - contact me in game.
Cpt Branko Surge. Night's Dawn	Posted - 2008.03.17 13:59:00 - [90] Edited by: Cpt Branko on 17/03/2008 14:01:03 Edited by: Cpt Branko on 17/03/2008 14:00:36 Originally by: Amira Shadowsong We are not talking about solo here. I mean arent you more afraid of a rook? It can perma jam your silly hurricane from 100km away while his friends can kill you. In gang settings, yes. Solo, it is the top combat recon. The curse is still incredibly potent in small gang settings, however. If nothing, it's going to be on top of that rook in no time, and if it fails a cycle or doesn't jam the curse instantly (like, had all jammers busy),well, it's not jamming anything anymore due to instant capdeath, and he's dying very soon later because of quite solid drone DPS. Being able to nuke someone's cap is a very powerful ability tbh. Particularly paired with decent damage on top of things and very very good mobility. You obviously can't have it all, though - you can't get good solo/small gang capabilities and good fleet capabilities. The only recons which come close are Caldari ones (which are awesome for gangs of any size). Sig removed, inappropriate link. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint
Xaen Caritas.	Posted - 2008.03.17 14:15:00 - [91] Originally by: Amira Shadowsong Why cant a curse run its ew without cap mods? All other recons can. Originally by: CCP Recon Ships Skill Bonus: 40% bonus to Energy Vampire and Energy Neutralizer range and 20% bonus to Energy Vampire and Energy Neutralizer transfer amount per level Any other questions? - Support fixing the UI\|Suggest Jita fixes\|Compact logs
Amira Shadowsong State War Academy	Posted - 2008.03.17 14:20:00 - [92] Edited by: Amira Shadowsong on 17/03/2008 14:20:30 Originally by: Xaen Originally by: Amira Shadowsong Why cant a curse run its ew without cap mods? All other recons can. Originally by: CCP Recon Ships Skill Bonus: 40% bonus to Energy Vampire and Energy Neutralizer range and 20% bonus to Energy Vampire and Energy Neutralizer transfer amount per level Any other questions? You still need cap mods to use your neuts. Do you need it to run ecm or webs on caldari and minmatar recons? No. The whole point is that the bonus is too small, it needs bigger bonus per level.
Omarvelous Destry's Lounge XIII Legio	Posted - 2008.03.17 14:40:00 - [93] Originally by: Amira Shadowsong Edited by: Amira Shadowsong on 17/03/2008 14:20:30 Originally by: Xaen Originally by: Amira Shadowsong Why cant a curse run its ew without cap mods? All other recons can. Originally by: CCP Recon Ships Skill Bonus: 40% bonus to Energy Vampire and Energy Neutralizer range and 20% bonus to Energy Vampire and Energy Neutralizer transfer amount per level Any other questions? You still need cap mods to use your neuts. Do you need it to run ecm or webs on caldari and minmatar recons? No. The whole point is that the bonus is too small, it needs bigger bonus per level. Can't you run a NOS with your neuts to keep them going? Also the other recon ships you have mentioned have no solo capability that the curse has - so what if they can run their ewar without cap mods - they can't kill you by themselves. At least you can inflict decent damage while your ewar. Not flaming - just discussing. I'm increasingly using energy weapons myself, and I like discussing tactics about them. __________________________________________________ Sup brosef! Destry's Lounge is looking for a few good drunks - contact me in game.
Amira Shadowsong State War Academy	Posted - 2008.03.17 14:42:00 - [94] Originally by: Omarvelous Can't you run a NOS with your neuts to keep them going? No, because as soon as the target cap percentage drops below your cap percentage nos STOPS working. So you end up fueling neuts with your own cap, 100% in the end anyway.
starvoid Perkone	Posted - 2008.03.17 14:45:00 - [95] Originally by: Lyria Skydancer I think dual suck beats a single suck. this
Omarvelous Destry's Lounge XIII Legio	Posted - 2008.03.17 14:47:00 - [96] Originally by: Amira Shadowsong Originally by: Omarvelous Can't you run a NOS with your neuts to keep them going? No, because as soon as the target cap percentage drops below your cap percentage nos STOPS working. So you end up fueling neuts with your own cap, 100% in the end anyway. If you're running your neuts till you're really low on cap - and NOS still isn't working - then I'd say you've done your job and your target lacks any cap as well. I would pulse the neuts as I got a successful NOS cycle (faster cycle time so its a good way to check), and then I can maintain cap superiority over my target. Its not easy, but I've tested it out with other ships and with some practice its worked. __________________________________________________ Sup brosef! Destry's Lounge is looking for a few good drunks - contact me in game.
Amira Shadowsong State War Academy	Posted - 2008.03.17 14:52:00 - [97] Originally by: Omarvelous If you're running your neuts till you're really low on cap - and NOS still isn't working - then I'd say you've done your job and your target lacks any cap as well. I would pulse the neuts as I got a successful NOS cycle (faster cycle time so its a good way to check), and then I can maintain cap superiority over my target. Its not easy, but I've tested it out with other ships and with some practice its worked. You need more then 1 pulsing neut to keep a standard pvp ship capped out tank and gun wise. Problem is a vast majority of combat ships are injecting 800 cap charges and to neut that effectively you need to cycle neuts. If you dont he'll have enough time to activate both reppers, guns and mods for another round. But, curse cant do this because it will cap out himself if he tries. Thats why curse needs to be able to run its neuts a bit easier. The bonus per level needs an increase on both pilgrim and curse.
Xaen Caritas.	Posted - 2008.03.17 15:05:00 - [98] Originally by: Amira Shadowsong Originally by: Omarvelous Can't you run a NOS with your neuts to keep them going? No, because as soon as the target cap percentage drops below your cap percentage nos STOPS working. So you end up fueling neuts with your own cap, 100% in the end anyway. lol - Support fixing the UI\|Suggest Jita fixes\|Compact logs
Omarvelous Destry's Lounge XIII Legio	Posted - 2008.03.17 15:07:00 - [99] Originally by: Amira Shadowsong Originally by: Omarvelous If you're running your neuts till you're really low on cap - and NOS still isn't working - then I'd say you've done your job and your target lacks any cap as well. I would pulse the neuts as I got a successful NOS cycle (faster cycle time so its a good way to check), and then I can maintain cap superiority over my target. Its not easy, but I've tested it out with other ships and with some practice its worked. You need more then 1 pulsing neut to keep a standard pvp ship capped out tank and gun wise. Problem is a vast majority of combat ships are injecting 800 cap charges and to neut that effectively you need to cycle neuts. If you dont he'll have enough time to activate both reppers, guns and mods for another round. But, curse cant do this because it will cap out himself if he tries. Thats why curse needs to be able to run its neuts a bit easier. The bonus per level needs an increase on both pilgrim and curse. Hmm - I suppose so. Like I've said my experience with energy weapons is still new, I'm getting all the nuances figured out. If you just want to nuke your opponent's cap with the current Curse, I may opt to sacrifice dps and go with neut drones, with a split nos/neut high slot arrangement. That would eliminate solo work - but improve its gang use. Neut drones aren't impressive on their own, but combined with energy weapons they are very effective (constantly taking small chunks of cap in 6 second cycles). Maybe they make it hard for you to perma run neuts without cap mods to eliminate an overpowered solo ship? A Caldari ECM ship can't (nor should it) fight solo - maybe recons in general should stay as gang ships. __________________________________________________ Sup brosef! Destry's Lounge is looking for a few good drunks - contact me in game.
Amira Shadowsong State War Academy	Posted - 2008.03.17 15:21:00 - [100] Originally by: Omarvelous Hmm - I suppose so. Like I've said my experience with energy weapons is still new, I'm getting all the nuances figured out. If you just want to nuke your opponent's cap with the current Curse, I may opt to sacrifice dps and go with neut drones, with a split nos/neut high slot arrangement. That would eliminate solo work - but improve its gang use. Neut drones aren't impressive on their own, but combined with energy weapons they are very effective (constantly taking small chunks of cap in 6 second cycles). Maybe they make it hard for you to perma run neuts without cap mods to eliminate an overpowered solo ship? A Caldari ECM ship can't (nor should it) fight solo - maybe recons in general should stay as gang ships. It wont be overpowered. Each recon has its advantage: Caldari recons are the nr 1 for removing ANY ship from a fight. Thats their thing. Minmatar recons are the nr 1 for dealing with fast ships Amarr recons are nr 1 for crippling tanks with neuts. So please let the curse use em at the same ease as other recons use their weapons. Im not gonna comment on gallente ones, they need a little something too. You know why people dont solo much in recons anyway? HACs do this alot better.
Xaen Caritas.	Posted - 2008.03.17 15:24:00 - [101] Originally by: Amira Shadowsong Originally by: Meiyang Lee Its neutralisers and NOS are not E-war as such, they are weapons. OK if you want to be all A N A L about it let me explain it like this: Its stupid that a ship has mods that are bonused on said ship BUT the ship CANNOT RUN THE MODS WITHOUT CAP MODS. Doesnt that sound a bit stupid? Caldari recons have bonus to ECM, they can run full racks of it. Minmatar can run webs + TPs without probs. MWD all day and be happy. Why are amarr ships always so messed up that every damn ship needs a fitting mod to even work. Its bull**. lol @ ** tears - Support fixing the UI\|Suggest Jita fixes\|Compact logs**
Omarvelous Destry's Lounge XIII Legio	Posted - 2008.03.17 15:34:00 - [102] Originally by: Amira Shadowsong Originally by: Omarvelous Hmm - I suppose so. Like I've said my experience with energy weapons is still new, I'm getting all the nuances figured out. If you just want to nuke your opponent's cap with the current Curse, I may opt to sacrifice dps and go with neut drones, with a split nos/neut high slot arrangement. That would eliminate solo work - but improve its gang use. Neut drones aren't impressive on their own, but combined with energy weapons they are very effective (constantly taking small chunks of cap in 6 second cycles). Maybe they make it hard for you to perma run neuts without cap mods to eliminate an overpowered solo ship? A Caldari ECM ship can't (nor should it) fight solo - maybe recons in general should stay as gang ships. It wont be overpowered. Each recon has its advantage: Caldari recons are the nr 1 for removing ANY ship from a fight. Thats their thing. Minmatar recons are the nr 1 for dealing with fast ships Amarr recons are nr 1 for crippling tanks with neuts. So please let the curse use em at the same ease as other recons use their weapons. Im not gonna comment on gallente ones, they need a little something too. You know why people dont solo much in recons anyway? HACs do this alot better. OK so a gang setup is what you're talking about? If so, what about my suggestion for using split NOS/Neuts, and using neut drones to partially make up the cap drain difference between neut -> NOS? DPS isn't your role anymore, just cap killing. Neut drones, and a couple of NOS to cycle to run your neut cycles. I'd say that would effectively murder your target's cap. They'll be burning up their 800's - I doubt they will be able to sustain their active tank and cap-weapons, with a NOS/Neut Curse with Neut drones. Just my 2-cents on a gang role for a Curse (I use a similar philosophy on some pvp battleships). __________________________________________________ Sup brosef! Destry's Lounge is looking for a few good drunks - contact me in game.
Hunter Hughes Multiversal Enterprise Inc. Cry Havoc.	Posted - 2008.03.17 15:41:00 - [103] Edited by: Hunter Hughes on 17/03/2008 15:42:11 I agree the pilgrim needs a small fix but i would also like to see the sensor damps fixed for the gallente recons. Also, FORCE RECON ships are to be used for FORCE RECON. This means that they are able to scout out targets for the larger gang and then support if needed. They are NOT supposed to be all that effective. COMBAT RECON on the other hand is supposed to be effective IN GANGS with support. No Recon is made to be used solo so DO NOT compare the curse to the zealot and sac (pg 1) as they are COMPLETELY different classes of ships and are used for different roles. In conclusion, the curse is FINE but the pilgrim, arazu and lachesis are broken as hell. Originally by: GinoShin Edited by: GinoShin on 21/11/2006 11:41:44 whats evemon is it like a jamican wiseman?
SirDanceAlot Federal Navy Academy	Posted - 2008.03.17 16:52:00 - [104] Originally by: Hunter Hughes In conclusion, the curse is FINE but the pilgrim, arazu and lachesis are broken as hell. Curse just needs a small neut bonus tweak. but the rest is QFT.
Julius Romanus Viziam	Posted - 2008.03.17 17:18:00 - [105] Anyone else not hear a god damn thing about recons in the dev blog?
SirDanceAlot Federal Navy Academy	Posted - 2008.03.17 21:23:00 - [106] Originally by: Julius Romanus Anyone else not hear a god damn thing about recons in the dev blog? I sure didnt hear anything. Thats why we need to make ourselves heard here.
Angelic Eviaran University of Caille	Posted - 2008.03.19 17:27:00 - [107] Originally by: Omarvelous OK so a gang setup is what you're talking about? If so, what about my suggestion for using split NOS/Neuts, and using neut drones to partially make up the cap drain difference between neut -> NOS? DPS isn't your role anymore, just cap killing. Neut drones, and a couple of NOS to cycle to run your neut cycles. I'd say that would effectively murder your target's cap. They'll be burning up their 800's - I doubt they will be able to sustain their active tank and cap-weapons, with a NOS/Neut Curse with Neut drones. Just my 2-cents on a gang role for a Curse (I use a similar philosophy on some pvp battleships). Yada yada dude, curse still has huge fitting problems when you try to do a non-nano fit. It needs help.
Lil Mule Brand X Corp	Posted - 2008.03.19 17:57:00 - [108] Edited by: Lil Mule on 19/03/2008 17:57:47 I agree the curse does need some love, it is partially broken. My curse can perma run its 2 Neuts and the MWD doing 2.9 KM/s. This isnt super fast, and I could use some additional sp's in the navigation department so Im not going to blame that on the ship. In order to get it to run the 2 Neuts and MWD perma (1 Medium NOS and 2 Heavy Missile launchers round out my high's), I do have to put in 3 Cap recharger 2's in the Mids. This effectively limits any additional Ewar such as web or scram in the mids. This means that this ship has to team up with others in order to have any chance at killing anything. IMO it should run just fine with 2 Cap Recharger II's in the mids, instead of 3. Sure I could but in 2 NOS's in the high to balance out the 2 Neuts, but the problem with that is as other posters have indicated, it creates a situation where when your opponent is out of CAP, so are you. What good is that? The point of the weapon shouldnt be to drain my cap and yours too making us both crippled, that isnt a weapon. Thats like designing a gun that shoots my ship as well as shooting the opponent at the same time. Throttling the Neut at the end to ensure that you have some cap to finish off your opponent also isnt feasible. There is no indicator, its all guestimate as to whether your Neut module is working. Other Ewar mods get an indication that they are working, and what the status of the enemy is, but Neutralizers dont. Thats a second handi-cap against the curse. The ship isnt entirely broken, its just...incapacitated. Its like a person missing both of their legs. In this analogy, I currently have mine running a sweet electric wheelchair setup, and ya its sure fun to do some wheelies in it, but lets face it, its not as cool as having 2 legs. ----------------------------------------------- People enjoy flying Amarr for the same reason they like being tied up in leather, whipped and called names
Angelic Eviaran University of Caille	Posted - 2008.03.19 18:00:00 - [109] Originally by: Lil Mule Sure I could but in 2 NOS's in the high to balance out the 2 Neuts, but the problem with that is as other posters have indicated, it creates a situation where when your opponent is out of CAP, so are you. What good is that? The point of the weapon shouldnt be to drain my cap and yours too making us both crippled, that isnt a weapon. Thats like designing a gun that shoots my ship as well as shooting the opponent at the same time. Exactly. Its so utterly stupid to give a bonus to a weapon (in this case neuts) but without giving the ship the power to use it without crippling itself. Either the bonus per level needs to go up or curse and pilgrim need more inherent cap. Curse also needs more fitting.
Shira Rayborn Center for Advanced Studies	Posted - 2008.03.19 20:33:00 - [110] Fix curse please.
Lt Angus the united Sex Panthers	Posted - 2008.03.19 21:07:00 - [111] Lol can really spot the idiots that turn on all their neuts and just hope the other guy dies first, yea some ships require more than F1-F8 Shhhh, Im hunting Badgers
Nhi'Khuna Strife Mercenaries Inc.	Posted - 2008.03.19 21:35:00 - [112] Erm, Curse is my solo ship of choice, works just fine, thanks. Maybe if you weren't sporting cap booster 800s but instead the more cargo hold friendly 400s you'd have better luck with your cap management. Folks running away? Drop one of your nanofibers and chuck a CPU II on, lets you stick a recon probe launcher for safe spot probing goodness. I don't even bother with the tracking disruptors or ewar mods. Sticking a sensor booster with a speed script was the best thing I could have done for my curse's soloing ability. Nhi.
Nhi'Khuna Strife Mercenaries Inc.	Posted - 2008.03.19 21:36:00 - [113] Edited by: Nhi''Khuna on 19/03/2008 21:36:28 Originally by: Angelic Eviaran Originally by: Lil Mule Sure I could but in 2 NOS's in the high to balance out the 2 Neuts, but the problem with that is as other posters have indicated, it creates a situation where when your opponent is out of CAP, so are you. What good is that? The point of the weapon shouldnt be to drain my cap and yours too making us both crippled, that isnt a weapon. Thats like designing a gun that shoots my ship as well as shooting the opponent at the same time. Exactly. Its so utterly stupid to give a bonus to a weapon (in this case neuts) but without giving the ship the power to use it without crippling itself. Either the bonus per level needs to go up or curse and pilgrim need more inherent cap. Curse also needs more fitting. You and I are flying two very different ships... Nhi.
Madla Mafia The Dead Man's Hand	Posted - 2008.03.19 22:26:00 - [114] Fix them both!!! Curse and Pilgrim ------------------------------------------ Amarr - getting screwed since 2005.
Angelic Eviaran University of Caille	Posted - 2008.03.19 23:23:00 - [115] Edited by: Angelic Eviaran on 19/03/2008 23:23:32 Originally by: Nhi'Khuna I don't even bother with the tracking disruptors or ewar mods. Nhi. And thats why an injected zealot will destroy your crappy curse.
Storm Strike Ministry of War	Posted - 2008.03.20 01:22:00 - [116] Edited by: Storm Strike on 20/03/2008 01:23:25 Originally by: Angelic Eviaran Edited by: Angelic Eviaran on 19/03/2008 23:23:32 Originally by: Nhi'Khuna I don't even bother with the tracking disruptors or ewar mods. Nhi. And thats why an injected zealot will destroy your crappy curse. QFT, although IMO curse is fine! (pilgrim too)
Xequecal GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.03.20 01:28:00 - [117] Originally by: Angelic Eviaran Edited by: Angelic Eviaran on 19/03/2008 23:23:32 Originally by: Nhi'Khuna I don't even bother with the tracking disruptors or ewar mods. Nhi. And thats why an injected zealot will destroy your crappy curse. Do people actually do this? Nanozealot holds like five charges, total.
Storm Strike Ministry of War	Posted - 2008.03.20 01:30:00 - [118] Who said its nanoed......
Xequecal GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.03.20 01:36:00 - [119] Nano Zealot is the only way to fit a Zealot. It's way better than a single 800mm plate passive tank and the Zealot has neither the fittings nor the cap to active tank. Speed mods use no CPU or PG.
Storm Strike Ministry of War	Posted - 2008.03.20 01:41:00 - [120] And also gives you no staying power at all. I dont see how you can kill anything but t1 cruisers and frigs with a nanozealot.
Xequecal GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.03.20 01:59:00 - [121] Originally by: Storm Strike And also gives you no staying power at all. I dont see how you can kill anything but t1 cruisers and frigs with a nanozealot. No Zealot fit you can come up with can solo kill things. No web = you can't kill anything solo, doesn't matter what ship you're in. You can't camp gates because they'll just run back to the gate, and everyone in the belts will safe spot the second they see you in local.
Shira Rayborn Center for Advanced Studies	Posted - 2008.03.20 10:51:00 - [122] Originally by: Xequecal Nano Zealot is the only way to fit a Zealot. It's way better than a single 800mm plate passive tank and the Zealot has neither the fittings nor the cap to active tank. Speed mods use no CPU or PG. No its not, a semi nano works excellent. Itll have a decent tank go 2000+m/s and have good dps. It'll ***your crappy nano zealot. Tbh nano zealot cant solo jack **.
Zarin University of Caille	Posted - 2008.03.20 12:25:00 - [123] The curse is the best solo killer of all the recons by a mile, nerf the curse if anything. Ok it's probably fine, but it certainly doesn't need a boost. The pilgrim on the other hand.... (mind you if the Pilgrim was as good as the curse and could also use the cov ops cloak, then they'd both need to be nerfed).
Angelic Eviaran University of Caille	Posted - 2008.03.20 12:35:00 - [124] Originally by: Zarin The curse is the best solo killer of all the recons by a mile, nerf the curse if anything. Ok it's probably fine, but it certainly doesn't need a boost. The pilgrim on the other hand.... (mind you if the Pilgrim was as good as the curse and could also use the cov ops cloak, then they'd both need to be nerfed). No its not. If you dont nano it youll die many times. If you nano it injected ships with high optimals will destroy you.

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