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Toastmaster
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Posted - 2004.04.13 13:07:00 -
[1]
As i get it Cap Relays are going to be nerfed cause they are to good with no really penelty... Well they have a small one but that doesnt matter because shield recharge is not a problem to loose...
Now how about Warp stabs ?? they aint to good with no penelty ?? not even a small penelty like takes 5 extra seconds to get in warp / module you use or something??
Things today is when travleing from deep 0.0 to empire, most is alliances and all thier members have instant BM all the way down to empire... Fine and while they use thier BM they dont need cap recharge at all so all low slots gets Warp core stabs instead just to be sure..
So as for an armageddon my though was if you fill it with warp cores it takes you 40 extra second to get into warp. That will prevent ppl from using them in overflow
Sure fit one and loose 5 sec each system thats no that much when thinking you dont have to go to the gate in that system anyway.
As it is now ppl just fill up low slots with them just because they dont loose anything from doing so and being as safe as they can..
Any thoughts ? Maybe a better penelty this is one i just thought of while writing the post
"viper zulu > toast has killed our whole corporation ships at least once"
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Xavier Belt
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Posted - 2004.04.13 13:08:00 -
[2]
Well, Electronic Warfare (incl. warp core stabilizers) is being revamped. We should see how that goes first.
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@BrerRabbit> you have to be the iron mallet of reason
@Quixzlizx> right now he's being the "stupid comedian" of reason |
Kipkruide
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Posted - 2004.04.13 13:16:00 -
[3]
Edited by: Kipkruide on 13/04/2004 13:20:35
Edited by: Kipkruide on 13/04/2004 13:18:53
pah elite frig mwd, 2 7.5k strength two dirsruptors, you die.
warp core stabs arent too good, since they cost you low slots and are easy to counter.
i'll sit at your jumpin and you can use your insta's , i'll laugh when you die.
now try to get a pod using insta's that's bloody hard
this is meant as a comment not because i have any particular wich to kill you btw 
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Athule Snanm
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Posted - 2004.04.13 13:29:00 -
[4]
I agree, if people filling lows with WCS is a problem fit a ship to counter it. Any nerf for WCS that you can think of would make them pointless as things stand at the moment, far better for them to be reviewed along with the rest of EW which is in fact what's happening. In the meantime just use teamwork instead of whining.
The real problem here is insta-BMs and the inability to follow people though warp. Insta-BMs are sadly here to stay it seems, but one of the new elite frigates will be able to follow though warp - although that seems to be a post-Shiva thing now :-(
_______________________________
Doomheim - EVE's only hygiene! |
Nwalmaer
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Posted - 2004.04.13 13:32:00 -
[5]
LOL. Yeah, good luck catching that Armaggedon with 8 warp core stabilizers with your 4 strength warp scrambling, and good luck surviving his 10 heavy drones.
People wonder why pirates run away all the time. Well it's because you need to have 12 sensor boosters, 10 warp scramblers and 15 microwarp drives to catch a single battleship at jump-in, and then pray your target doesn't fire back as he has shield hardeners instead of microwarp drives (who needs them when you have instajumps). That is, not a very optimal setup for combat.
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Cmdr Sp0ck
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Posted - 2004.04.13 13:47:00 -
[6]
It's as i've said before... the less you nerf the more you gain. Since CCP continues to nerf everything they can think about, even if it's working fine, they will continue to ruin their game....
The problem isn't necessarily the nerfing.. it's more the amount of nerfing done. When CPP finds something they think is unbalanced, either in favor or against the users, they don't simply do some slight ajustments. Rather, they turn the nerfed thing into something useless 
And then, since the previous nerf causes something else to become unbalanced, they go and nerf that too... and so on... and so on... and so on... It doesn't end...
Don't think increasing the time to warp will do the trick for the warp core stabs. It would cause an unbalance and would have every1 complaining... again
Here's a few ideas to choose from:
- More cpu/powergrid load
- Penalty on shields
- Penalty on cap
- Warp speed penalty (in-warp speed that is)
- MWD/Ab speed penalty
Note that this is a list of options where you could choose 1 (or at most 2). Just a slight modification on any one of these could make an enormous difference. But once again i say: the more you nerf the worse it becomes. I wouldn't really change anything.
Comments?
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"You humans are extremely irritant with your illogical behaviour and irrational thought"
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Nightfang
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Posted - 2004.04.13 13:49:00 -
[7]
Thank you, Nwaelmaer, I feel like I have met a soulmate.
In my opinion warp core stabs aren't imbalanced because they can be countered with x amount of warp scramblers. (Besides, it's being revamped)
The REAL problem is dual MWD's - now there's something achieving acceleration no x amount of webs can ever stop...n
/Nightfang
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Mr Popov
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Posted - 2004.04.13 13:53:00 -
[8]
Inertial Stabilizers should be nerfed too. no penalty with those, right? 
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Karmic
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Posted - 2004.04.13 14:40:00 -
[9]
Inertial Stabs don't work (well they didn't last time I checked), I think thats enought of a penalty for anyone using them.
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Amox
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Posted - 2004.04.13 14:55:00 -
[10]
Actually if you think about it using warp core stabilizers should allow you to jump a little faster not slower.
Your Tachyon Beam Laser I perfectly strikes Blood Oracle, wrecking for 722.3 damage. |
PirateShampoo
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Posted - 2004.04.13 14:58:00 -
[11]
So let me get this straight... You tried to warp scramble someone and couldnt and now you are screaming about nerfing them? Did you realize that instead of putting warp core stabs they could have used those low slots for something else?
NERF THIS NERF THAT
STFU!
Do you like movies about Gladiators? |
PirateShampoo
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Posted - 2004.04.13 15:01:00 -
[12]
 Quote:
In my opinion warp core stabs aren't imbalanced because they can be countered with x amount of warp scramblers.
/Nightfang
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ that says it all right there. gg Nightfang.
Do you like movies about Gladiators? |
Nervar
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Posted - 2004.04.13 15:08:00 -
[13]
As i said before: If people want to sacrifice cap recharge, armor recharge, dmg mods, tracking puters and so on for warp stabs let them.
Just cause we pirates are having a hard time at camping a gate dosnt mean everything that enables our victims to flee to bee nerfed.
Try doin something else for a change, you might bee surprised how fun it is.
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What I look forward to is continued immaturity followed by death.
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PirateShampoo
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Posted - 2004.04.13 16:17:00 -
[14]
Edited by: PirateShampoo on 13/04/2004 16:24:34
Edited by: PirateShampoo on 13/04/2004 16:22:01
They sacrifice a low slot. thats the sacrifice. All it does is stop 1 warp scramble... Get more people on that gate or fit more scramblers on your ship. They are giving up low slots to fit those stablizers.. If you want to scramble them you are going to have to give up some more medium slots if you want to scramble them...
Besides, until tech 2 warp stabs come out the people doing the scrambling have the upper hand because warp scramblers do 2 scrambles and each stab only stops 1 of them. between all you uber pirates you should be able to get enough scramblers to stop any ship with stabs. If you cant figure that one out maybe you guys arent so uber after all.
Do you like movies about Gladiators? |
Athule Snanm
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Posted - 2004.04.13 17:08:00 -
[15]
Quote:
LOL. Yeah, good luck catching that Armaggedon with 8 warp core stabilizers with your 4 strength warp scrambling, and good luck surviving his 10 heavy drones.
People wonder why pirates run away all the time. Well it's because you need to have 12 sensor boosters, 10 warp scramblers and 15 microwarp drives to catch a single battleship at jump-in, and then pray your target doesn't fire back as he has shield hardeners instead of microwarp drives (who needs them when you have instajumps). That is, not a very optimal setup for combat.
And who is it that actually fits 8 of them? As someone mentioned in this or another similar thread people consistently overestimate how many stabs people are using. A while back I did an experiment involving an Armageddon and some members of your corp. Basically I warped back and forth to gate to see what would happen, in an Arma funnily enough. Your people there asked me how many wcs I was equipping. The actual answer was of course 2, not exactly the 4-8 most people flame about - and I was only equipping them to fetch some stuff for an agent.
_______________________________
Doomheim - EVE's only hygiene! |
dalman
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Posted - 2004.04.13 17:19:00 -
[16]
So f*n what.
It's only a problem for n00bish gatecampers.
M.I.A. since 2004-07-30 |
Sphalerite
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Posted - 2004.04.13 17:23:00 -
[17]
Quote:
And who is it that actually fits 8 of them? As someone mentioned in this or another similar thread people consistently overestimate how many stabs people are using. A while back I did an experiment involving an Armageddon and some members of your corp. Basically I warped back and forth to gate to see what would happen, in an Arma funnily enough. Your people there asked me how many wcs I was equipping. The actual answer was of course 2, not exactly the 4-8 most people flame about - and I was only equipping them to fetch some stuff for an agent.
That was me. 1 or 0 stabs for 3 weeks and every single time someone was close to me and I got away, I was told it was becuase of my 3-6 stabs.
The only reason to put a ton of stabs on is if you need to transport the ship itself somewhere. Any other cargo and you want a super fast frigate or an indy. I can't imagine anyone going into combat thinking that they would get scrambled 7 times and the last one would save them.
Its an extreme setup that you need to take extreme measures to counter. When pirates were putting 8 sensor boosters on a scorp to be able to lock a pod in .001 seconds, nobody called for a nerf on boosters. Just accept that if someone dedicates their setup to one thing, they're going to beat you at it.
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Nwalmaer
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Posted - 2004.04.13 18:02:00 -
[18]
But you must realize, fitting 8 sensor boosters or 8 warp scramblers will completely gimp your ship allowing you to do nothing else than that specific task you are fitted for. They also drain your cap and must be activated. Fitting eight warp core stabilizers will make you invulnerable to jump-in attacks unless it consists of 20 ships vs. you, which is unlikely as there will be no profit for the campers, and since you use insta-jumps to get to the gate, there is no where to catch you. You can just ignore any blockades... blockades are not to be ignored, they are to be overtaken, or avoided. And with these warp core stabilizers your ship can still perform a myriad of tasks, while that 8 sensor booster scorpion won't be able to do much at all without going up in flames.
The real issue here is that warp core stabilizers were already good when CCP decided to make them even better. When they were med-slot and activated modules they atleast gave the pirates a few more seconds to play, which is a good compromise as it would allow slower ships to get within range and put more warp scramblers on the target.
There was no complaints against warp core stabilizers, no one thought they were bad modules. But CCP buffed them anyway, and made them overpowered. Hell i'd be happy if they'd just make them non-passive again.
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PirateShampoo
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Posted - 2004.04.13 18:14:00 -
[19]
Edited by: PirateShampoo on 13/04/2004 18:17:53
Again... If someone fits a rack of stabs on his ship and you do not have enough people with scramblers to actually scramble him that his just good play on his part. He countered your scramblers with warp core stab's; oh no lets nerf them!
NERF NERF NERF
you guys are to much.
Do you like movies about Gladiators? |
Isonkon Serikain
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Posted - 2004.04.13 19:16:00 -
[20]
just another case of pirates wanting everything for nothing...
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Rizmordan Hillgotlieb
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Posted - 2004.04.13 19:29:00 -
[21]
People actually use those things? Why?
Posting for Numbnutz |
Joshua Calvert
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Posted - 2004.04.13 20:09:00 -
[22]
Let's just wait and see what the EW changes bring.
LEEEEERRRRRRRRRRROOOOOOOOOYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY! |
Nwalmaer
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Posted - 2004.04.13 21:07:00 -
[23]
Quote:
Again... If someone fits a rack of stabs on his ship and you do not have enough people with scramblers to actually scramble him that his just good play on his part. He countered your scramblers with warp core stab's; oh no lets nerf them!
NERF NERF NERF
you guys are to much.
Try actually reading what people say. I heard it works wonders.
Asstard.
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Sphalerite
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Posted - 2004.04.13 21:33:00 -
[24]
istajumps and to a lesser extent dual MWDs are lame becuase there isn't a balanced way to stop them. Stabs don't have this problem becuase they have several counter modules. You don't need 20 ships to stop a mythical 8 stab Apoc, you need either 2 friends in frigates or a brave blackbird pilot. Or a deployable jammer. Or enough firepower to kill the ship before he warps out. This is assuming you're running into enough 8 stab ships to make your job not pay. Otherwise, let the extreme stab guys go, and catch the ones fit for cargo space, or offense or nothing at all.
Tie goes to the runner in EVE. Defensive mods are always cheaper to fit and run. its just a fact you're going to have to deal with.
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Toastmaster
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Posted - 2004.04.14 02:24:00 -
[25]
I dont care about instant jumps cause i can jump after and try take them on the other side.... but when you jump after with a scorp with 2 x MWD and 6 warp jams and he still warps away....
That is the part i think is wrong... Thats why i think it should be some delay when using warp stabs so if its 5 sec / module i got 40 sec to blow his ship which is not much if you ant 4+ ppl
"viper zulu > toast has killed our whole corporation ships at least once"
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Jazz Bo
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Posted - 2004.04.14 09:01:00 -
[26]
Quote:
I dont care about instant jumps cause i can jump after and try take them on the other side.... but when you jump after with a scorp with 2 x MWD and 6 warp jams and he still warps away....
Ok, be honest:
1. How often do you really have 2 MWDs and 6 warp jams on your Scorp? Never, because then you'd get your ass kicked by each and every combat fitted Bship. You wouldn't catch anyone with it anyway, since they'll be able to warp away without any stabs at all before you could even lock them.
2. How often have you really met people who have 6 or more Warp Stabs fitted? Never, because that ship would be totally useless for anything except travelling, since you normally need your low slots for grid upgrades/damage mods/armor tanking/cap power relays. And the Stabs actually use quite a lot of Cpu so it's be impossible to get a decent fit with that many anyway.
This whole thread is really just the whine cellar of a pirate who views the "carebears" as prey whose only function in-game is to provide income and entertainment to him.
Guess what, they're people just like you, and they don't want to be caught by you. If they can fit their ship so you can't catch them, more power to them.
Oh, and about those mythical ships that have 8 stabs? 99.9% of people have a maximum of two stabs fitted, and the vast majority of those only have one if any... it'd hardly make sense to nerf a perfectly balanced module because that tiny minority annoys you by managing to escape your clutches.
Originally by: DB Preacher
Celestial Apocalypse - Brave souls fighting the endless smak.
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qrac
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Posted - 2004.04.14 09:12:00 -
[27]
u whiners ever heard of mobile warp disruptors?
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Insanes numquam moriuntur! |
Jazz Bo
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Posted - 2004.04.14 09:16:00 -
[28]
Quote:
u whiners ever heard of mobile warp disruptors?
I'm sure they have, but they would lose a lot of isk every time they warp away when more than one ship warps in.
No, much more cheaper and easier to get Warp Core Stabilisers nerfed.
Originally by: DB Preacher
Celestial Apocalypse - Brave souls fighting the endless smak.
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Gween
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Posted - 2004.04.14 10:12:00 -
[29]
Yeah!
Nerf everything!
Warpcore stabs, mwd's, eccm, nanofibers - and improve warp disruptor to 150km and 15strength (maybe add bonus of -50 radar/ladar/gravimetric/magnetometric strength.. oh maybe energy drain too - all in one, ofcourse), while only need 1 tf and 1 mw tp fit it and 5 cap every 2 minutes to use...
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Coffee'n'Toffee makes Gween happy
Coffee'n'Toffee makes Gween happy
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Toastmaster
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Posted - 2004.04.14 10:34:00 -
[30]
Quote:
Quote:
I dont care about instant jumps cause i can jump after and try take them on the other side.... but when you jump after with a scorp with 2 x MWD and 6 warp jams and he still warps away....
Ok, be honest:
1. How often do you really have 2 MWDs and 6 warp jams on your Scorp? Never, because then you'd get your ass kicked by each and every combat fitted Bship. You wouldn't catch anyone with it anyway, since they'll be able to warp away without any stabs at all before you could even lock them.
2. How often have you really met people who have 6 or more Warp Stabs fitted? Never, because that ship would be totally useless for anything except travelling, since you normally need your low slots for grid upgrades/damage mods/armor tanking/cap power relays. And the Stabs actually use quite a lot of Cpu so it's be impossible to get a decent fit with that many anyway.
This whole thread is really just the whine cellar of a pirate who views the "carebears" as prey whose only function in-game is to provide income and entertainment to him.
Guess what, they're people just like you, and they don't want to be caught by you. If they can fit their ship so you can't catch them, more power to them.
Oh, and about those mythical ships that have 8 stabs? 99.9% of people have a maximum of two stabs fitted, and the vast majority of those only have one if any... it'd hardly make sense to nerf a perfectly balanced module because that tiny minority annoys you by managing to escape your clutches.
Ok thing is 99% of ppl travleing takes their good stuff off low slots and fill it with warp core stabs until they get the the closest station of thier destination where they change setup... So i would say its alot of ppl using 6 warp core stabs and i have been using my scorp with 6 warp scramblers to catch other BS on jump in..
Its sounds to me you are one of those who think you can fit like a fleet battle to do some pirating...
Wonder why most alliance dont catch the pirates in their areas??
You have to offer the good modules that make you surrvive to catch someone
And as from any other battle BS beat the **** out of my scorp is totally so true...
If they shoot back im in trouble
Well point is.... Warp stabs have no penelties and that was the reason Cap relay got nerfed..
"viper zulu > toast has killed our whole corporation ships at least once"
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