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Toastmaster
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Posted - 2004.04.13 13:07:00 -
[1]
As i get it Cap Relays are going to be nerfed cause they are to good with no really penelty... Well they have a small one but that doesnt matter because shield recharge is not a problem to loose...
Now how about Warp stabs ?? they aint to good with no penelty ?? not even a small penelty like takes 5 extra seconds to get in warp / module you use or something??
Things today is when travleing from deep 0.0 to empire, most is alliances and all thier members have instant BM all the way down to empire... Fine and while they use thier BM they dont need cap recharge at all so all low slots gets Warp core stabs instead just to be sure..
So as for an armageddon my though was if you fill it with warp cores it takes you 40 extra second to get into warp. That will prevent ppl from using them in overflow
Sure fit one and loose 5 sec each system thats no that much when thinking you dont have to go to the gate in that system anyway.
As it is now ppl just fill up low slots with them just because they dont loose anything from doing so and being as safe as they can..
Any thoughts ? Maybe a better penelty this is one i just thought of while writing the post
"viper zulu > toast has killed our whole corporation ships at least once"
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Xavier Belt
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Posted - 2004.04.13 13:08:00 -
[2]
Well, Electronic Warfare (incl. warp core stabilizers) is being revamped. We should see how that goes first.
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@BrerRabbit> you have to be the iron mallet of reason
@Quixzlizx> right now he's being the "stupid comedian" of reason |
Kipkruide
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Posted - 2004.04.13 13:16:00 -
[3]
Edited by: Kipkruide on 13/04/2004 13:20:35
Edited by: Kipkruide on 13/04/2004 13:18:53
pah elite frig mwd, 2 7.5k strength two dirsruptors, you die.
warp core stabs arent too good, since they cost you low slots and are easy to counter.
i'll sit at your jumpin and you can use your insta's , i'll laugh when you die.
now try to get a pod using insta's that's bloody hard
this is meant as a comment not because i have any particular wich to kill you btw 
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Athule Snanm
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Posted - 2004.04.13 13:29:00 -
[4]
I agree, if people filling lows with WCS is a problem fit a ship to counter it. Any nerf for WCS that you can think of would make them pointless as things stand at the moment, far better for them to be reviewed along with the rest of EW which is in fact what's happening. In the meantime just use teamwork instead of whining.
The real problem here is insta-BMs and the inability to follow people though warp. Insta-BMs are sadly here to stay it seems, but one of the new elite frigates will be able to follow though warp - although that seems to be a post-Shiva thing now :-(
_______________________________
Doomheim - EVE's only hygiene! |
Nwalmaer
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Posted - 2004.04.13 13:32:00 -
[5]
LOL. Yeah, good luck catching that Armaggedon with 8 warp core stabilizers with your 4 strength warp scrambling, and good luck surviving his 10 heavy drones.
People wonder why pirates run away all the time. Well it's because you need to have 12 sensor boosters, 10 warp scramblers and 15 microwarp drives to catch a single battleship at jump-in, and then pray your target doesn't fire back as he has shield hardeners instead of microwarp drives (who needs them when you have instajumps). That is, not a very optimal setup for combat.
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Cmdr Sp0ck
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Posted - 2004.04.13 13:47:00 -
[6]
It's as i've said before... the less you nerf the more you gain. Since CCP continues to nerf everything they can think about, even if it's working fine, they will continue to ruin their game....
The problem isn't necessarily the nerfing.. it's more the amount of nerfing done. When CPP finds something they think is unbalanced, either in favor or against the users, they don't simply do some slight ajustments. Rather, they turn the nerfed thing into something useless 
And then, since the previous nerf causes something else to become unbalanced, they go and nerf that too... and so on... and so on... and so on... It doesn't end...
Don't think increasing the time to warp will do the trick for the warp core stabs. It would cause an unbalance and would have every1 complaining... again
Here's a few ideas to choose from:
- More cpu/powergrid load
- Penalty on shields
- Penalty on cap
- Warp speed penalty (in-warp speed that is)
- MWD/Ab speed penalty
Note that this is a list of options where you could choose 1 (or at most 2). Just a slight modification on any one of these could make an enormous difference. But once again i say: the more you nerf the worse it becomes. I wouldn't really change anything.
Comments?
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"You humans are extremely irritant with your illogical behaviour and irrational thought"
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Nightfang
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Posted - 2004.04.13 13:49:00 -
[7]
Thank you, Nwaelmaer, I feel like I have met a soulmate.
In my opinion warp core stabs aren't imbalanced because they can be countered with x amount of warp scramblers. (Besides, it's being revamped)
The REAL problem is dual MWD's - now there's something achieving acceleration no x amount of webs can ever stop...n
/Nightfang
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Mr Popov
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Posted - 2004.04.13 13:53:00 -
[8]
Inertial Stabilizers should be nerfed too. no penalty with those, right? 
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Karmic
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Posted - 2004.04.13 14:40:00 -
[9]
Inertial Stabs don't work (well they didn't last time I checked), I think thats enought of a penalty for anyone using them.
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Amox
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Posted - 2004.04.13 14:55:00 -
[10]
Actually if you think about it using warp core stabilizers should allow you to jump a little faster not slower.
Your Tachyon Beam Laser I perfectly strikes Blood Oracle, wrecking for 722.3 damage. |
PirateShampoo
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Posted - 2004.04.13 14:58:00 -
[11]
So let me get this straight... You tried to warp scramble someone and couldnt and now you are screaming about nerfing them? Did you realize that instead of putting warp core stabs they could have used those low slots for something else?
NERF THIS NERF THAT
STFU!
Do you like movies about Gladiators? |
PirateShampoo
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Posted - 2004.04.13 15:01:00 -
[12]
 Quote:
In my opinion warp core stabs aren't imbalanced because they can be countered with x amount of warp scramblers.
/Nightfang
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ that says it all right there. gg Nightfang.
Do you like movies about Gladiators? |
Nervar
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Posted - 2004.04.13 15:08:00 -
[13]
As i said before: If people want to sacrifice cap recharge, armor recharge, dmg mods, tracking puters and so on for warp stabs let them.
Just cause we pirates are having a hard time at camping a gate dosnt mean everything that enables our victims to flee to bee nerfed.
Try doin something else for a change, you might bee surprised how fun it is.
------------------------------------------------->
What I look forward to is continued immaturity followed by death.
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PirateShampoo
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Posted - 2004.04.13 16:17:00 -
[14]
Edited by: PirateShampoo on 13/04/2004 16:24:34
Edited by: PirateShampoo on 13/04/2004 16:22:01
They sacrifice a low slot. thats the sacrifice. All it does is stop 1 warp scramble... Get more people on that gate or fit more scramblers on your ship. They are giving up low slots to fit those stablizers.. If you want to scramble them you are going to have to give up some more medium slots if you want to scramble them...
Besides, until tech 2 warp stabs come out the people doing the scrambling have the upper hand because warp scramblers do 2 scrambles and each stab only stops 1 of them. between all you uber pirates you should be able to get enough scramblers to stop any ship with stabs. If you cant figure that one out maybe you guys arent so uber after all.
Do you like movies about Gladiators? |
Athule Snanm
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Posted - 2004.04.13 17:08:00 -
[15]
Quote:
LOL. Yeah, good luck catching that Armaggedon with 8 warp core stabilizers with your 4 strength warp scrambling, and good luck surviving his 10 heavy drones.
People wonder why pirates run away all the time. Well it's because you need to have 12 sensor boosters, 10 warp scramblers and 15 microwarp drives to catch a single battleship at jump-in, and then pray your target doesn't fire back as he has shield hardeners instead of microwarp drives (who needs them when you have instajumps). That is, not a very optimal setup for combat.
And who is it that actually fits 8 of them? As someone mentioned in this or another similar thread people consistently overestimate how many stabs people are using. A while back I did an experiment involving an Armageddon and some members of your corp. Basically I warped back and forth to gate to see what would happen, in an Arma funnily enough. Your people there asked me how many wcs I was equipping. The actual answer was of course 2, not exactly the 4-8 most people flame about - and I was only equipping them to fetch some stuff for an agent.
_______________________________
Doomheim - EVE's only hygiene! |
dalman
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Posted - 2004.04.13 17:19:00 -
[16]
So f*n what.
It's only a problem for n00bish gatecampers.
M.I.A. since 2004-07-30 |
Sphalerite
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Posted - 2004.04.13 17:23:00 -
[17]
Quote:
And who is it that actually fits 8 of them? As someone mentioned in this or another similar thread people consistently overestimate how many stabs people are using. A while back I did an experiment involving an Armageddon and some members of your corp. Basically I warped back and forth to gate to see what would happen, in an Arma funnily enough. Your people there asked me how many wcs I was equipping. The actual answer was of course 2, not exactly the 4-8 most people flame about - and I was only equipping them to fetch some stuff for an agent.
That was me. 1 or 0 stabs for 3 weeks and every single time someone was close to me and I got away, I was told it was becuase of my 3-6 stabs.
The only reason to put a ton of stabs on is if you need to transport the ship itself somewhere. Any other cargo and you want a super fast frigate or an indy. I can't imagine anyone going into combat thinking that they would get scrambled 7 times and the last one would save them.
Its an extreme setup that you need to take extreme measures to counter. When pirates were putting 8 sensor boosters on a scorp to be able to lock a pod in .001 seconds, nobody called for a nerf on boosters. Just accept that if someone dedicates their setup to one thing, they're going to beat you at it.
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Nwalmaer
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Posted - 2004.04.13 18:02:00 -
[18]
But you must realize, fitting 8 sensor boosters or 8 warp scramblers will completely gimp your ship allowing you to do nothing else than that specific task you are fitted for. They also drain your cap and must be activated. Fitting eight warp core stabilizers will make you invulnerable to jump-in attacks unless it consists of 20 ships vs. you, which is unlikely as there will be no profit for the campers, and since you use insta-jumps to get to the gate, there is no where to catch you. You can just ignore any blockades... blockades are not to be ignored, they are to be overtaken, or avoided. And with these warp core stabilizers your ship can still perform a myriad of tasks, while that 8 sensor booster scorpion won't be able to do much at all without going up in flames.
The real issue here is that warp core stabilizers were already good when CCP decided to make them even better. When they were med-slot and activated modules they atleast gave the pirates a few more seconds to play, which is a good compromise as it would allow slower ships to get within range and put more warp scramblers on the target.
There was no complaints against warp core stabilizers, no one thought they were bad modules. But CCP buffed them anyway, and made them overpowered. Hell i'd be happy if they'd just make them non-passive again.
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PirateShampoo
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Posted - 2004.04.13 18:14:00 -
[19]
Edited by: PirateShampoo on 13/04/2004 18:17:53
Again... If someone fits a rack of stabs on his ship and you do not have enough people with scramblers to actually scramble him that his just good play on his part. He countered your scramblers with warp core stab's; oh no lets nerf them!
NERF NERF NERF
you guys are to much.
Do you like movies about Gladiators? |
Isonkon Serikain
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Posted - 2004.04.13 19:16:00 -
[20]
just another case of pirates wanting everything for nothing...
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Rizmordan Hillgotlieb
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Posted - 2004.04.13 19:29:00 -
[21]
People actually use those things? Why?
Posting for Numbnutz |
Joshua Calvert
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Posted - 2004.04.13 20:09:00 -
[22]
Let's just wait and see what the EW changes bring.
LEEEEERRRRRRRRRRROOOOOOOOOYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY! |
Nwalmaer
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Posted - 2004.04.13 21:07:00 -
[23]
Quote:
Again... If someone fits a rack of stabs on his ship and you do not have enough people with scramblers to actually scramble him that his just good play on his part. He countered your scramblers with warp core stab's; oh no lets nerf them!
NERF NERF NERF
you guys are to much.
Try actually reading what people say. I heard it works wonders.
Asstard.
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Sphalerite
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Posted - 2004.04.13 21:33:00 -
[24]
istajumps and to a lesser extent dual MWDs are lame becuase there isn't a balanced way to stop them. Stabs don't have this problem becuase they have several counter modules. You don't need 20 ships to stop a mythical 8 stab Apoc, you need either 2 friends in frigates or a brave blackbird pilot. Or a deployable jammer. Or enough firepower to kill the ship before he warps out. This is assuming you're running into enough 8 stab ships to make your job not pay. Otherwise, let the extreme stab guys go, and catch the ones fit for cargo space, or offense or nothing at all.
Tie goes to the runner in EVE. Defensive mods are always cheaper to fit and run. its just a fact you're going to have to deal with.
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Toastmaster
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Posted - 2004.04.14 02:24:00 -
[25]
I dont care about instant jumps cause i can jump after and try take them on the other side.... but when you jump after with a scorp with 2 x MWD and 6 warp jams and he still warps away....
That is the part i think is wrong... Thats why i think it should be some delay when using warp stabs so if its 5 sec / module i got 40 sec to blow his ship which is not much if you ant 4+ ppl
"viper zulu > toast has killed our whole corporation ships at least once"
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Jazz Bo
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Posted - 2004.04.14 09:01:00 -
[26]
Quote:
I dont care about instant jumps cause i can jump after and try take them on the other side.... but when you jump after with a scorp with 2 x MWD and 6 warp jams and he still warps away....
Ok, be honest:
1. How often do you really have 2 MWDs and 6 warp jams on your Scorp? Never, because then you'd get your ass kicked by each and every combat fitted Bship. You wouldn't catch anyone with it anyway, since they'll be able to warp away without any stabs at all before you could even lock them.
2. How often have you really met people who have 6 or more Warp Stabs fitted? Never, because that ship would be totally useless for anything except travelling, since you normally need your low slots for grid upgrades/damage mods/armor tanking/cap power relays. And the Stabs actually use quite a lot of Cpu so it's be impossible to get a decent fit with that many anyway.
This whole thread is really just the whine cellar of a pirate who views the "carebears" as prey whose only function in-game is to provide income and entertainment to him.
Guess what, they're people just like you, and they don't want to be caught by you. If they can fit their ship so you can't catch them, more power to them.
Oh, and about those mythical ships that have 8 stabs? 99.9% of people have a maximum of two stabs fitted, and the vast majority of those only have one if any... it'd hardly make sense to nerf a perfectly balanced module because that tiny minority annoys you by managing to escape your clutches.
Originally by: DB Preacher
Celestial Apocalypse - Brave souls fighting the endless smak.
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qrac
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Posted - 2004.04.14 09:12:00 -
[27]
u whiners ever heard of mobile warp disruptors?
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Insanes numquam moriuntur! |
Jazz Bo
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Posted - 2004.04.14 09:16:00 -
[28]
Quote:
u whiners ever heard of mobile warp disruptors?
I'm sure they have, but they would lose a lot of isk every time they warp away when more than one ship warps in.
No, much more cheaper and easier to get Warp Core Stabilisers nerfed.
Originally by: DB Preacher
Celestial Apocalypse - Brave souls fighting the endless smak.
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Gween
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Posted - 2004.04.14 10:12:00 -
[29]
Yeah!
Nerf everything!
Warpcore stabs, mwd's, eccm, nanofibers - and improve warp disruptor to 150km and 15strength (maybe add bonus of -50 radar/ladar/gravimetric/magnetometric strength.. oh maybe energy drain too - all in one, ofcourse), while only need 1 tf and 1 mw tp fit it and 5 cap every 2 minutes to use...
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Coffee'n'Toffee makes Gween happy
Coffee'n'Toffee makes Gween happy
... |
Toastmaster
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Posted - 2004.04.14 10:34:00 -
[30]
Quote:
Quote:
I dont care about instant jumps cause i can jump after and try take them on the other side.... but when you jump after with a scorp with 2 x MWD and 6 warp jams and he still warps away....
Ok, be honest:
1. How often do you really have 2 MWDs and 6 warp jams on your Scorp? Never, because then you'd get your ass kicked by each and every combat fitted Bship. You wouldn't catch anyone with it anyway, since they'll be able to warp away without any stabs at all before you could even lock them.
2. How often have you really met people who have 6 or more Warp Stabs fitted? Never, because that ship would be totally useless for anything except travelling, since you normally need your low slots for grid upgrades/damage mods/armor tanking/cap power relays. And the Stabs actually use quite a lot of Cpu so it's be impossible to get a decent fit with that many anyway.
This whole thread is really just the whine cellar of a pirate who views the "carebears" as prey whose only function in-game is to provide income and entertainment to him.
Guess what, they're people just like you, and they don't want to be caught by you. If they can fit their ship so you can't catch them, more power to them.
Oh, and about those mythical ships that have 8 stabs? 99.9% of people have a maximum of two stabs fitted, and the vast majority of those only have one if any... it'd hardly make sense to nerf a perfectly balanced module because that tiny minority annoys you by managing to escape your clutches.
Ok thing is 99% of ppl travleing takes their good stuff off low slots and fill it with warp core stabs until they get the the closest station of thier destination where they change setup... So i would say its alot of ppl using 6 warp core stabs and i have been using my scorp with 6 warp scramblers to catch other BS on jump in..
Its sounds to me you are one of those who think you can fit like a fleet battle to do some pirating...
Wonder why most alliance dont catch the pirates in their areas??
You have to offer the good modules that make you surrvive to catch someone
And as from any other battle BS beat the **** out of my scorp is totally so true...
If they shoot back im in trouble
Well point is.... Warp stabs have no penelties and that was the reason Cap relay got nerfed..
"viper zulu > toast has killed our whole corporation ships at least once"
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Jazz Bo
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Posted - 2004.04.14 11:03:00 -
[31]
Edited by: Jazz Bo on 14/04/2004 11:04:54
Quote:
Well point is.... Warp stabs have no penelties and that was the reason Cap relay got nerfed..
Why would Warp Core Stabilisers need a penalty?
It seems to me that only cap/shield power relays and cap/shield flux coils have a penalty that affects another attribute, most other modules have a stacking penalty, some modules have no penalty at all.
The problem with cap power relays is that the penalty they're supposed to have is meaningless.
Another way of solving the problem would have been to remove the shield recharge "penalty" and make them have a stacking penalty instead...
Originally by: DB Preacher
Celestial Apocalypse - Brave souls fighting the endless smak.
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Sun Ra
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Posted - 2004.04.14 12:29:00 -
[32]
Surely if they are nerfed your ass will be caught more?
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Toastmaster
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Posted - 2004.04.14 12:56:00 -
[33]
Quote:
Surely if they are nerfed your ass will be caught more?
Yeah maybe... but thats not the point..
But this will get worse and worse until everyone is fitting as many warp stabs as they have slots for and it will be impossible to catch anyone and i dont think CCP ment for that to happen when they got warp stabs into low slots..
Maybe 1 - 3 but not 8 cant imagin that
"viper zulu > toast has killed our whole corporation ships at least once"
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Cmdr Sp0ck
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Posted - 2004.04.14 13:17:00 -
[34]
Anyway even if people do use them, they are sacrificing ALOT to use them. Anyone fighting wont use that many stabs because they wouldn't be able to do anything but run.
I don't agree with nerfing the warp stabs, just as i don't agree with the cap relay nerf and with the Apoc/laser weapons nerf.
The more you nerf the more imbalances you create and the more you ruin the game.
Warp stabs are fine the way they are. They are a EW countermeasure, and most of them are passive.
What could be a good idea is to create mid slot as well as low slot warp stab versions, just like the ECCM backup arrays. That would surely fix alot of other related problems
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"You humans are extremely irritant with your illogical behaviour and irrational thought"
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DREAMWORKS
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Posted - 2004.04.14 13:26:00 -
[35]
Last time we had 5 warpscramble strenth on a megathron and it warped...  Its used too much...
__________________________
http://www.nin.com/visuals/thtf_hi.html |
Heff
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Posted - 2004.04.14 15:21:00 -
[36]
Quote:
In my opinion warp core stabs aren't imbalanced because they can be countered with x amount of warp scramblers. (Besides, it's being revamped)
AGREED! A ship using stabilizers is sacrificing offensive capability for defensive capability. Who says that a single pirate should be able to catch an opponent who is geared toward getting away? If you want to catch a hyper-stabilized ship, then get more freiends with more scramblers.
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PirateShampoo
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Posted - 2004.04.14 15:27:00 -
[37]
Quote:
Quote:
u whiners ever heard of mobile warp disruptors?
I'm sure they have, but they would lose a lot of isk every time they warp away when more than one ship warps in.
No, much more cheaper and easier to get Warp Core Stabilisers nerfed.
absolutely I mean its to hard to haul a mobile disruptor out there and plus if you fit alot of warp disruptors in your medium slots you'll just get pwned by the people you disrupt. Yeah just nerf the Stabs... Much better for the people that arent smart enough to jam 1 guy with 4-5 stabs.
So what if your ship is crippled if you fit disruptors! THEY CRIPPLE THEIR SHIP BY PUTTING THE STABS IN THEIR LOW SLOTS!!! I know this is quite a concept but they could have fit cap relays or 1600mm plates or damage mods or tracking enhancers but instead they fit the stabs... why? BECAUSE THEY DONT WANT TO BE JAMMED. THEY ARE GIVING UP THEIR LOW SLOTS TO STOP 1 SCRAMBLE. EACH SCRAMBLER DOES 2 SCRAMBLES IF YOU CANT FIGURE A WAY TO BEAT WARP STABS STFU... EVERYONE JUST STFU ALL TOGETHER. jesus friggin christ mang. lol... Does anyone else understand this???
I'll explain it one more time just to make sure.
1 warp core stab = stopping 1 scramble
1 close range scrambler = 2 scrambles
Person you want to kill has 7 low slots. They put 5 warp stabs and 2 overdrives to take it somewhere.
YOU WOULD STILL ONLY NEED 3 SCRAMBLERS TO TAKE THEM DOWN!!!!
wow what a concept.... stop complaining.
Its balanced. If you dont have enough people or dont want to run the 3-4 scramblers yourself just dont camp gates and expect to stop someone with 4-6 stabs fitted. thats it.. simple... so simple...
Do you like movies about Gladiators? |
DeathBunny
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Posted - 2004.04.14 15:39:00 -
[38]
Even better if you want defense still and you can risk money drop a mobile warp disruptors around the gate. Whala instant warp scrambling field that all u gotta do is web the sorry bastard that went into the field.
Each way has its speciality, and no one person can guess someones config 100% correctly on a tempest, apoc, raven, or mainly a scorp. This is why the games so good. You don't know what others have and you risk everything every time you engage in battle.
Warp Core Stabilizer = 30CPU
Warp Scrambler = 30CPU
Warp Disruptor = 40CPU
Now who really pays more to not be scrambled in combat? Ones that scramble long distance because they can't get in close or don't want to, and the ones that want to warp out if they need too.
If you start nerfing some basic equipment might as well nerf the whole fricken line while your at it. Making Warp Scrambling/Disrupting even harder also.
Why don't you take your percious skill points and slight intellegence and do some good for the community. Slap some mining lasers and start selling ore/minerals at cheap prices.
Fear The Bunny
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Foomanshoe
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Posted - 2004.04.14 15:46:00 -
[39]
Quote:
Yeah!
Nerf everything!
Warpcore stabs, mwd's, eccm, nanofibers - and improve warp disruptor to 150km and 15strength (maybe add bonus of -50 radar/ladar/gravimetric/magnetometric strength.. oh maybe energy drain too - all in one, ofcourse), while only need 1 tf and 1 mw tp fit it and 5 cap every 2 minutes to use...
I LIKE IT!! 
_______________________________________________
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Teeth
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Posted - 2004.04.14 16:35:00 -
[40]
Stabs are fine. There's nothing wrong with a module that can be perfectly countered 1 for 1 with one module type and 2 for 1 with another. Their fitting requirements might be the one thing that you could argue is a bit too light, but that's debatable.
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Toastmaster
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Posted - 2004.04.14 22:55:00 -
[41]
Quote:
Anyway even if people do use them, they are sacrificing ALOT to use them. Anyone fighting wont use that many stabs because they wouldn't be able to do anything but run.
I don't agree with nerfing the warp stabs, just as i don't agree with the cap relay nerf and with the Apoc/laser weapons nerf.
The more you nerf the more imbalances you create and the more you ruin the game.
Warp stabs are fine the way they are. They are a EW countermeasure, and most of them are passive.
What could be a good idea is to create mid slot as well as low slot warp stab versions, just like the ECCM backup arrays. That would surely fix alot of other related problems
Okok they sacrifice alot when using them if they want to fight.... But as it is now its no danger for an Armageddon to travle in 0.0 space if it has its instant bookmarks and the low slots with warp stabs and you think that isnt a to good module?
"viper zulu > toast has killed our whole corporation ships at least once"
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Toastmaster
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Posted - 2004.04.14 22:56:00 -
[42]
Quote:
Anyway even if people do use them, they are sacrificing ALOT to use them. Anyone fighting wont use that many stabs because they wouldn't be able to do anything but run.
I don't agree with nerfing the warp stabs, just as i don't agree with the cap relay nerf and with the Apoc/laser weapons nerf.
The more you nerf the more imbalances you create and the more you ruin the game.
Warp stabs are fine the way they are. They are a EW countermeasure, and most of them are passive.
What could be a good idea is to create mid slot as well as low slot warp stab versions, just like the ECCM backup arrays. That would surely fix alot of other related problems
Okok they sacrifice alot when using them if they want to fight.... But as it is now its no danger for an Armageddon to travle in 0.0 space if it has its instant bookmarks and the low slots with warp stabs and you think that isnt a to good module?
"viper zulu > toast has killed our whole corporation ships at least once"
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Toastmaster
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Posted - 2004.04.14 23:10:00 -
[43]
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
u whiners ever heard of mobile warp disruptors?
I'm sure they have, but they would lose a lot of isk every time they warp away when more than one ship warps in.
No, much more cheaper and easier to get Warp Core Stabilisers nerfed.
absolutely I mean its to hard to haul a mobile disruptor out there and plus if you fit alot of warp disruptors in your medium slots you'll just get pwned by the people you disrupt. Yeah just nerf the Stabs... Much better for the people that arent smart enough to jam 1 guy with 4-5 stabs.
So what if your ship is crippled if you fit disruptors! THEY CRIPPLE THEIR SHIP BY PUTTING THE STABS IN THEIR LOW SLOTS!!! I know this is quite a concept but they could have fit cap relays or 1600mm plates or damage mods or tracking enhancers but instead they fit the stabs... why? BECAUSE THEY DONT WANT TO BE JAMMED. THEY ARE GIVING UP THEIR LOW SLOTS TO STOP 1 SCRAMBLE. EACH SCRAMBLER DOES 2 SCRAMBLES IF YOU CANT FIGURE A WAY TO BEAT WARP STABS STFU... EVERYONE JUST STFU ALL TOGETHER. jesus friggin christ mang. lol... Does anyone else understand this???
I'll explain it one more time just to make sure.
1 warp core stab = stopping 1 scramble
1 close range scrambler = 2 scrambles
Person you want to kill has 7 low slots. They put 5 warp stabs and 2 overdrives to take it somewhere.
YOU WOULD STILL ONLY NEED 3 SCRAMBLERS TO TAKE THEM DOWN!!!!
wow what a concept.... stop complaining.
Its balanced. If you dont have enough people or dont want to run the 3-4 scramblers yourself just dont camp gates and expect to stop someone with 4-6 stabs fitted. thats it.. simple... so simple...
Ok so how will you warp jam someone on jumpin with a 7500m scrambler... Everyone use instant BM so that is it... Cant stand where they come out of warp and wait for them...
Also if you have luck you are 20 km from them when you jump after but no chance in hell can you get within 7500m... If no being in a interceptor but then you have a max of 4 warp strength so that 5 warp stab setup blows it....
I hear you aint camping gates... You look at a module and imagin some picture of how you can do it... But you cant
Samt thing with warp distruptors.... 5 km but the area to cover is 13 km radius on from the gate...
"viper zulu > toast has killed our whole corporation ships at least once"
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Clain Matta
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Posted - 2004.04.15 01:34:00 -
[44]
Perhaps to balance this we must balance both. Since WCS are low slot/passive modules, perhaps warp scramblers/disruptors should be an area effect (like the smartbombs)and/or low slot/passive module. Just my idea, what do you people think.
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Squirrel
|
Posted - 2004.04.15 02:42:00 -
[45]
this arguement has been going on for along time in many different threads....basically the biggest concensus is to either
A) make ship class specific stabilizers, that have req increases like the MWD's do now so u couldn't mass 8 on an armaggedon even if u tried or..
B) make them medium slots and make them activatable again..so u are actually sacrificing some defence or useful modules to give yourself the ability to possibly run when warp scrambled..
_______________________________________________
Carfax > guys, please dont pvp here, it messes up the avoid pd kill zones autopilot option |
Jim Raynor
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Posted - 2004.04.15 02:54:00 -
[46]
warpcore stablizers are okay.
i'd say make them medium slot again but that would kind of suck for a lot of ships with no medium slots, like armageddons and stuff.
its kind of annoying to see ships warp away but i guess fair is fair.
------
ROBBLE ROBBLE |
dalman
|
Posted - 2004.04.15 03:16:00 -
[47]
Edited by: dalman on 15/04/2004 03:27:06
*hint*
This guy isn't getting away:
Quote:
[ 2004.04.10 21:54:07 ] (notify) x [COL] has started trying to warp scramble the Battleship, "MoNuMeN [CRICE]"
[ 2004.04.10 21:54:08 ] (notify) x [COL] has started trying to warp scramble the Battleship, "MoNuMeN [CRICE]"
[ 2004.04.10 21:54:09 ] (notify) x [COL] has started trying to warp scramble the Battleship, "MoNuMeN [CRICE]"
[ 2004.04.10 21:54:09 ] (notify) x [COL] has started trying to warp scramble the Battleship, "MoNuMeN [CRICE]"
[ 2004.04.10 21:54:10 ] (notify) x [COL] has started trying to warp scramble the Battleship, "MoNuMeN [CRICE]"
[ 2004.04.10 21:54:20 ] (notify) Interference from the warp TONY1 VOTF is preventing your sensors from getting a target lock on them.
[ 2004.04.10 21:54:21 ] (notify) x [COL] has started trying to warp scramble the Battleship, "MoNuMeN [CRICE]"
[ 2004.04.10 21:54:22 ] (notify) x [COL] has started trying to warp scramble the Battleship, "MoNuMeN [CRICE]"
[ 2004.04.10 21:54:33 ] (notify) You have started trying to warp scramble the Battleship, "MoNuMeN [CRICE]"
[ 2004.04.10 21:54:34 ] (notify) x [COL] has started trying to warp scramble the Battleship, "MoNuMeN [CRICE]"
[ 2004.04.10 21:54:37 ] (notify) x [COL] has started trying to warp scramble the Battleship, "Zelota [VOTF]"
[ 2004.04.10 21:54:39 ] (notify) x [R-I] has started trying to warp scramble the Battleship, "MoNuMeN [CRICE]"
[ 2004.04.10 21:54:40 ] (notify) x [COL] has started trying to warp scramble the Battleship, "Nem3sis [NGRU]"
[ 2004.04.10 21:54:40 ] (notify) x [R-I] has started trying to warp scramble the Battleship, "MoNuMeN [CRICE]"
Your battleship has medslots because you're supposed to use them...
...and frigates has a purpose...
M.I.A. since 2004-07-30 |
Athule Snanm
|
Posted - 2004.04.15 08:54:00 -
[48]
Quote:
this arguement has been going on for along time in many different threads....basically the biggest concensus is...
in fact that they are fine.
The real problems in the scenarios given above are instajump BMs and, to a lesser extent, multi-MWD setups. They need a good going over, not WCS.
_______________________________
Doomheim - EVE's only hygiene! |
Artegg
|
Posted - 2004.04.15 11:47:00 -
[49]
Hehe this post is funny hey toast did someone get away
Guess what not every pilot who flys through pureblind is meant to be killed by you when you undock
Here are a few idea i have to help you out
1) How about you get a interceptor add some warp scramblers and hunt your prey down. If you have 2 -20 scramblers on then trust my you will catch 95% of your prey. But i guess that is not fair for you right because that other 5% can get away.
2) Use warp disruption fields, I guess that is to much risk for you to take now right.
3) Move to around in space so people do not know what system you are going to be in. I am not talking about jumping between j-c and x-7o go try some other area's were the locals will not be thinking everytime i go to empire i am going to pass the spang i had better load up with WCS.
any of the 3 above points will solve your problems. So lets stop crying NERF this and NERF that because 1 ship in 10 can not be stopped
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Nwalmaer
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Posted - 2004.04.15 12:09:00 -
[50]
Err, he has an Interceptor and I have lost 3 Crows catching Bships personally. Did I mention how much ass you all suck? The thing is, using a 10 million ISK ship that dies in one shot to catch a Battleship that will give you maybe 2-3 million in loot is madness, because the chance of your Interceptor living is very small... especially when you try to toll them and they stall your for ages.
It's probably the most effective way to catch people, sure, but how many battleships fly without FoF missiles and Drones? Both those will destroy your 10 million ship in no time at all, you won't have time to react.
And even then it's sometimes not enough time to get within scramble range. You usually end up 37km or so from your victim which means that flying at 3km/s will take you over 10 seconds to reach him. If your battleship don't warp in 10 seconds something is really wrong.
Yes, removing instajumps would solve the problem as they would have to run both MWDs and warp cores to get through, meaning their ship will be extremely vulnerable. But I was under the impression that CCP had no intention of removing instajumps this millenia, thus tweaking warp core stabilizers would be a logical choice.
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Gween
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Posted - 2004.04.15 13:15:00 -
[51]
..is all i see.
--------------
Coffee'n'Toffee makes Gween happy
Coffee'n'Toffee makes Gween happy
... |
Kipkruide
|
Posted - 2004.04.15 13:25:00 -
[52]
instajumps do nothing but relocate the camping spot from the jump out to the jump in point, it's still easy to catch them there providing they don't fly a pod. or happen to enter aligned at a celestial body, even then a good crew should be able to gank an indy or bship and most cruiser.
imo the peeps that complain prob need to find a new career.
besides less peeps then you think use inta's since it's a ***** to make em. an no one flies a armageddon with 8 stabs. since it kills any pvp outfit.
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officer
|
Posted - 2004.04.15 19:44:00 -
[53]
Quote:
Quote:
Anyway even if people do use them, they are sacrificing ALOT to use them. Anyone fighting wont use that many stabs because they wouldn't be able to do anything but run.
I don't agree with nerfing the warp stabs, just as i don't agree with the cap relay nerf and with the Apoc/laser weapons nerf.
The more you nerf the more imbalances you create and the more you ruin the game.
Warp stabs are fine the way they are. They are a EW countermeasure, and most of them are passive.
What could be a good idea is to create mid slot as well as low slot warp stab versions, just like the ECCM backup arrays. That would surely fix alot of other related problems
Okok they sacrifice alot when using them if they want to fight.... But as it is now its no danger for an Armageddon to travle in 0.0 space if it has its instant bookmarks and the low slots with warp stabs and you think that isnt a to good module?
No, its not to good a module. I think it has been explained several times. Warp stabs counter Warp scramblers. Warp scramblers are more powerful than the stabs and if you have several people with just 1 scrambler you will be able to stop them no matter how many stabs they have. If its just 1 frigate with 1 scrambler, why should you expect to scramble them anyway? Sorry if things arent going your way when you are trying to gank unarmed people lol. tard.
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officer
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Posted - 2004.04.15 19:50:00 -
[54]
Edited by: officer on 15/04/2004 19:54:28
Edited by: officer on 15/04/2004 19:52:45
Quote:
Err, he has an Interceptor and I have lost 3 Crows catching Bships personally. Did I mention how much ass you all suck? The thing is, using a 10 million ISK ship that dies in one shot to catch a Battleship that will give you maybe 2-3 million in loot is madness, because the chance of your Interceptor living is very small... especially when you try to toll them and they stall your for ages.
It's probably the most effective way to catch people, sure, but how many battleships fly without FoF missiles and Drones? Both those will destroy your 10 million ship in no time at all, you won't have time to react.
So basically nerf everything that kills interceptors? You try to scramble them so they shoot at you? Yeah nerf their ships... Moron.
An interceptor trying to scramble someone is obviously going to be the FIRST target in any battle. Use a vigil or a kestrel if you dont like the price of interceptors. stfu. lmao!
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Nwalmaer
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Posted - 2004.04.15 21:45:00 -
[55]
Go and die in a dark corner, please. I merely responded to the guy who told us to use Interceptors. Been there, done that, wasn't profitable.
Btw, the ship with the most slots for warp scramblers is the heaviest, slowest and has the worst targetting systems. You will not be able to do anything with eight warpscramblers as you will not be in range nor lock them in time. You will need several sensor boosters and microwarp drives, and suddenly your warp scramble strength will be that of a frigates. A ship with eight warp core stabilizers however, can be AFK and still have no problems. Is it to much to ask that pilots are actually at their computers when they get away from people trying to kill them?
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DarkStar251
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Posted - 2004.04.16 00:23:00 -
[56]
Lets Nerf every module. Guns let you shoot too much. Warp stabs let you warp, boosters let you lock quicker.
If we give every module a larger penalty then it has a bonus, then it eliminates all this. hell, better idea, take all the slots of all the ships, so they are balanced.
In fact, lets remove all ships from the game other than shuttles, then its balanced! But lets make them slower as its not fair on the asteroids they go fast. And i have a friend thats been playing 5 years and he has better skills than me, so lets make all skill training instant so i can catch up.
.........
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Jazz Bo
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Posted - 2004.04.16 10:13:00 -
[57]
Quote:
Go and die in a dark corner, please. I merely responded to the guy who told us to use Interceptors. Been there, done that, wasn't profitable.
It wasn't "profitable"? You know, it isn't really "profitable" to lose your 100m isk ship to pirates either, which I suppose is why people try to avoid it by using Stabs.
And if you always gate camp in the same place, no wonder people fit some Stabs if they have to go through it. If they didn't know you were there, they wouldn't (at least they wouldn't fit as many).
It's called Survival of the Fittest... stupid pirates can't catch anyone, they get bored, they quit.
Quote:
A ship with eight warp core stabilizers however, can be AFK and still have no problems. Is it to much to ask that pilots are actually at their computers when they get away from people trying to kill them?
If you can't kill pilots who are travelling through 0.0 while AFK you must really well and truly suck.
Originally by: DB Preacher
Celestial Apocalypse - Brave souls fighting the endless smak.
|
Neil Crow
|
Posted - 2004.04.16 10:25:00 -
[58]
Quote:
A ship with eight warp core stabilizers however, can be AFK and still have no problems. Is it to much to ask that pilots are actually at their computers when they get away from people trying to kill them?
No offence, but did you actually think this though? I think not.
Sure, at jump-in he'll most likely get away. What do you do then?
Warp after him, of course.
Web him and kill him. Since he can't warp away when he's AFK, and can't use MWDs when he's AFK, you'll kill him.
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Toastmaster
|
Posted - 2004.04.16 13:05:00 -
[59]
Quote:
Quote:
Go and die in a dark corner, please. I merely responded to the guy who told us to use Interceptors. Been there, done that, wasn't profitable.
It wasn't "profitable"? You know, it isn't really "profitable" to lose your 100m isk ship to pirates either, which I suppose is why people try to avoid it by using Stabs.
And if you always gate camp in the same place, no wonder people fit some Stabs if they have to go through it. If they didn't know you were there, they wouldn't (at least they wouldn't fit as many).
It's called Survival of the Fittest... stupid pirates can't catch anyone, they get bored, they quit.
Quote:
A ship with eight warp core stabilizers however, can be AFK and still have no problems. Is it to much to ask that pilots are actually at their computers when they get away from people trying to kill them?
If you can't kill pilots who are travelling through 0.0 while AFK you must really well and truly suck.
Well thing is... If someone is travleing knowing there are pirates or not they fit as many warp stabs they can just to be sure...
So if im in X-7omu doesnt matter
"viper zulu > toast has killed our whole corporation ships at least once"
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Queldonus
|
Posted - 2004.04.20 14:24:00 -
[60]
Boo f***ing hoo.
Before you start screaming for nerfs, think about what you're asking. The problem is not warp core stabilizers, it's instant jump bookmarks. Without instant jumps, people have to actually run the blockade. Problem solved.
In fact that would open up a whole new angle of specialization, a blockade runner. |
PirateShampoo
|
Posted - 2004.04.20 14:34:00 -
[61]
Originally by: Toastmaster
Quote:
Quote:
Go and die in a dark corner, please. I merely responded to the guy who told us to use Interceptors. Been there, done that, wasn't profitable.
It wasn't "profitable"? You know, it isn't really "profitable" to lose your 100m isk ship to pirates either, which I suppose is why people try to avoid it by using Stabs.
And if you always gate camp in the same place, no wonder people fit some Stabs if they have to go through it. If they didn't know you were there, they wouldn't (at least they wouldn't fit as many).
It's called Survival of the Fittest... stupid pirates can't catch anyone, they get bored, they quit.
Quote:
A ship with eight warp core stabilizers however, can be AFK and still have no problems. Is it to much to ask that pilots are actually at their computers when they get away from people trying to kill them?
If you can't kill pilots who are travelling through 0.0 while AFK you must really well and truly suck.
Well thing is... If someone is travleing knowing there are pirates or not they fit as many warp stabs they can just to be sure...
So if im in X-7omu doesnt matter
isnt that just smart play toastmaster? If you know pirates may be there to gank your indy or unarmed battleship wouldnt you fit warp stabs on there? Makes sense to me. Especially if you are going to run into n00b pirates that dont fit enough scramblers.
HINT:::::::: The average pilot transporting a ship will fit 2-3 warp stab's. If you have JUST 2 F'ING SCRAMBLERS YOU WILL MOST LIKELY BE ABLE TO SCRAMBLE THEM... Crazy, I know.
Do you like movies about Gladiators? |
PirateShampoo
S.A.S
Euphoria Unleashed
|
Posted - 2004.04.20 14:34:00 -
[62]
Originally by: Toastmaster
Quote:
Quote:
Go and die in a dark corner, please. I merely responded to the guy who told us to use Interceptors. Been there, done that, wasn't profitable.
It wasn't "profitable"? You know, it isn't really "profitable" to lose your 100m isk ship to pirates either, which I suppose is why people try to avoid it by using Stabs.
And if you always gate camp in the same place, no wonder people fit some Stabs if they have to go through it. If they didn't know you were there, they wouldn't (at least they wouldn't fit as many).
It's called Survival of the Fittest... stupid pirates can't catch anyone, they get bored, they quit.
Quote:
A ship with eight warp core stabilizers however, can be AFK and still have no problems. Is it to much to ask that pilots are actually at their computers when they get away from people trying to kill them?
If you can't kill pilots who are travelling through 0.0 while AFK you must really well and truly suck.
Well thing is... If someone is travleing knowing there are pirates or not they fit as many warp stabs they can just to be sure...
So if im in X-7omu doesnt matter
isnt that just smart play toastmaster? If you know pirates may be there to gank your indy or unarmed battleship wouldnt you fit warp stabs on there? Makes sense to me. Especially if you are going to run into n00b pirates that dont fit enough scramblers.
HINT:::::::: The average pilot transporting a ship will fit 2-3 warp stab's. If you have JUST 2 F'ING SCRAMBLERS YOU WILL MOST LIKELY BE ABLE TO SCRAMBLE THEM... Crazy, I know.
|
DB Preacher
Reikoku
Band of Brothers
|
Posted - 2004.04.20 17:28:00 -
[63]
I disagree that there needs to be changes to the current warp core stabs.
Simple fact of the matter, there is a way to counter people using arma's filled with low slot Warp stabs at present in game.
It's called 2 scorps filled with warp scramblers OR 3 scorps filled with warp disruptors OR a mobile warp disruptor etc etc.
The key here is teamwork.
If my job in eve was a gate camper, I would sure as hell use something to actually catch the wee buggers with.
dbp
Caldari Alliance PVP Championship Winner
Current RKK Ranking: (PSCAL6) Proficient Short Tanto
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DB Preacher
|
Posted - 2004.04.20 17:28:00 -
[64]
I disagree that there needs to be changes to the current warp core stabs.
Simple fact of the matter, there is a way to counter people using arma's filled with low slot Warp stabs at present in game.
It's called 2 scorps filled with warp scramblers OR 3 scorps filled with warp disruptors OR a mobile warp disruptor etc etc.
The key here is teamwork.
If my job in eve was a gate camper, I would sure as hell use something to actually catch the wee buggers with.
dbp
Current RKK Ranking: (CAL4) Soldier
Drop by and say hi in Reikoku Forums.
|
Serret
|
Posted - 2004.04.20 19:12:00 -
[65]
Edited by: Serret on 20/04/2004 19:15:36
Quote:
an no one flies a armageddon with 8 stabs. since it kills any pvp outfit.
Most camping pirates aren't looking for PvPers to victimise. They're looking for the 75% of Eve-players who do everything they can to avoid PvP, all the while hauling expensive mins and trade goods in neutered "Battleships".
If the designers had intended for the game of Eve to contain essentially invulnerable, uncatchable ships, then why would anyone have even bothered to design/fit guns? All the factions would simply fly indies with nothing but 8 lowslots do away entirely with the problem of war and piracy.
P.S.: I certainly am not in favour of nerfing warp cores hard. Perhaps the most reasonable compromise would be have a limit on the number of warp cores that can have an effect? Or, better yet, combine that with returning warp cores to their original status as an 'active' module.
|
Serret
Evolution
Band of Brothers
|
Posted - 2004.04.20 19:12:00 -
[66]
Edited by: Serret on 20/04/2004 19:15:36
Quote:
an no one flies a armageddon with 8 stabs. since it kills any pvp outfit.
Most camping pirates aren't looking for PvPers to victimise. They're looking for the 75% of Eve-players who do everything they can to avoid PvP, all the while hauling expensive mins and trade goods in neutered "Battleships".
If the designers had intended for the game of Eve to contain essentially invulnerable, uncatchable ships, then why would anyone have even bothered to design/fit guns? All the factions would simply fly indies with nothing but 8 lowslots do away entirely with the problem of war and piracy.
P.S.: I certainly am not in favour of nerfing warp cores hard. Perhaps the most reasonable compromise would be have a limit on the number of warp cores that can have an effect? Or, better yet, combine that with returning warp cores to their original status as an 'active' module.
--
<Coupo`Work> if i die illl gum you to death |
Serret
|
Posted - 2004.04.20 19:22:00 -
[67]
Originally by: Queldonus
Boo f***ing hoo.
Before you start screaming for nerfs, think about what you're asking. The problem is not warp core stabilizers, it's instant jump bookmarks.
Instajumps, instadocks, all the same can of worms. I sometimes wonder why people bother playing a space game in which they are hardly ever actually in space.
'TARGET IS INVULNERABLE. TARGET IS INVULNERABLE. TARGET IS INVULNERABLE. TARGET HAS DISAPPEARED FROM THE SYSTEM.'
Quote:
Without instant jumps, people have to actually run the blockade. Problem solved.
In fact that would open up a whole new angle of specialization, a blockade runner.
It certainly would make things more interesting if blockades (and therefore running blockades) had some real strategic value in Eve.
|
Serret
Evolution
Band of Brothers
|
Posted - 2004.04.20 19:22:00 -
[68]
Originally by: Queldonus
Boo f***ing hoo.
Before you start screaming for nerfs, think about what you're asking. The problem is not warp core stabilizers, it's instant jump bookmarks.
Instajumps, instadocks, all the same can of worms. I sometimes wonder why people bother playing a space game in which they are hardly ever actually in space.
'TARGET IS INVULNERABLE. TARGET IS INVULNERABLE. TARGET IS INVULNERABLE. TARGET HAS DISAPPEARED FROM THE SYSTEM.'
Quote:
Without instant jumps, people have to actually run the blockade. Problem solved.
In fact that would open up a whole new angle of specialization, a blockade runner.
It certainly would make things more interesting if blockades (and therefore running blockades) had some real strategic value in Eve.
--
<Coupo`Work> if i die illl gum you to death |
Serret
|
Posted - 2004.04.20 19:29:00 -
[69]
Originally by: PirateShampoo
HINT:::::::: The average pilot transporting a ship will fit 2-3 warp stab's. If you have JUST 2 F'ING SCRAMBLERS YOU WILL MOST LIKELY BE ABLE TO SCRAMBLE THEM... Crazy, I know.
Yup, 2 "F'ING" 7500 m, plus a MWD drive to actually get into scrambling range, plus a sensor booster or two to lock them in time, plus a webifier to prevent the target from MWD'ing away... Wait, what kind of ship do you fly again?
|
Serret
Evolution
Band of Brothers
|
Posted - 2004.04.20 19:29:00 -
[70]
Originally by: PirateShampoo
HINT:::::::: The average pilot transporting a ship will fit 2-3 warp stab's. If you have JUST 2 F'ING SCRAMBLERS YOU WILL MOST LIKELY BE ABLE TO SCRAMBLE THEM... Crazy, I know.
Yup, 2 "F'ING" 7500 m, plus a MWD drive to actually get into scrambling range, plus a sensor booster or two to lock them in time, plus a webifier to prevent the target from MWD'ing away... Wait, what kind of ship do you fly again?
--
<Coupo`Work> if i die illl gum you to death |
Nybbas
|
Posted - 2004.04.20 19:30:00 -
[71]
lol nerf warp core stabs, roflmao..... put more on, if you cant jam the apoc with 8 on, put 4 jammers on jerk, in my opinion warp core stabs are underpowered, it should always be easier to escape than it is to capture, give me a break... whining cuz you suck, get over it
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Nybbas
Guiding Hand Social Club
|
Posted - 2004.04.20 19:30:00 -
[72]
lol nerf warp core stabs, roflmao..... put more on, if you cant jam the apoc with 8 on, put 4 jammers on jerk, in my opinion warp core stabs are underpowered, it should always be easier to escape than it is to capture, give me a break... whining cuz you suck, get over it
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Estarriol
|
Posted - 2004.04.20 19:35:00 -
[73]
Edited by: Estarriol on 20/04/2004 19:36:52
Edited by: Estarriol on 20/04/2004 19:36:28
Originally by: Nybbas
lol nerf warp core stabs, roflmao..... put more on, if you cant jam the apoc with 8 on, put 4 jammers on jerk
I've noticed a lot of n00bs in this thread calling people jerks and telling them to stfu and blah blah... I wonder what it is about Warp Core Stabilizers that brings out the best in Eve?
BTW Nybbas, a ship with 8 warp core stabs will escape from a ship using 4 strength-2 scramblers. Not to mention that I'd love to get my hands on an apoc that can fit 8 warp cores... |
Estarriol
Evolution
Band of Brothers
|
Posted - 2004.04.20 19:35:00 -
[74]
Edited by: Estarriol on 20/04/2004 19:36:52
Edited by: Estarriol on 20/04/2004 19:36:28
Originally by: Nybbas
lol nerf warp core stabs, roflmao..... put more on, if you cant jam the apoc with 8 on, put 4 jammers on jerk
I've noticed a lot of n00bs in this thread calling people jerks and telling them to stfu and blah blah... I wonder what it is about Warp Core Stabilizers that brings out the best in Eve?
BTW Nybbas, a ship with 8 warp core stabs will escape from a ship using 4 strength-2 scramblers. Not to mention that I'd love to get my hands on an apoc that can fit 8 warp cores... |
Queldonus
|
Posted - 2004.04.21 15:28:00 -
[75]
Originally by: Serret
Originally by: Queldonus
Boo f***ing hoo.
Before you start screaming for nerfs, think about what you're asking. The problem is not warp core stabilizers, it's instant jump bookmarks.
Instajumps, instadocks, all the same can of worms. I sometimes wonder why people bother playing a space game in which they are hardly ever actually in space.
'TARGET IS INVULNERABLE. TARGET IS INVULNERABLE. TARGET IS INVULNERABLE. TARGET HAS DISAPPEARED FROM THE SYSTEM.'
Quote:
Without instant jumps, people have to actually run the blockade. Problem solved.
In fact that would open up a whole new angle of specialization, a blockade runner.
It certainly would make things more interesting if blockades (and therefore running blockades) had some real strategic value in Eve.
Exactaly. Since we have stations in 0.0 with refining capabilities, you can mine with whatever ship you want and leave it out there, then use a frigate or interceptor to run your refined minerals past the blockade. I'd love to do that for my corp. It'd be as fun as anything else I can think of, and add another level of strategy |
Queldonus
Minmatar
Contraband Inc.
|
Posted - 2004.04.21 15:28:00 -
[76]
Originally by: Serret
Originally by: Queldonus
Boo f***ing hoo.
Before you start screaming for nerfs, think about what you're asking. The problem is not warp core stabilizers, it's instant jump bookmarks.
Instajumps, instadocks, all the same can of worms. I sometimes wonder why people bother playing a space game in which they are hardly ever actually in space.
'TARGET IS INVULNERABLE. TARGET IS INVULNERABLE. TARGET IS INVULNERABLE. TARGET HAS DISAPPEARED FROM THE SYSTEM.'
Quote:
Without instant jumps, people have to actually run the blockade. Problem solved.
In fact that would open up a whole new angle of specialization, a blockade runner.
It certainly would make things more interesting if blockades (and therefore running blockades) had some real strategic value in Eve.
Exactaly. Since we have stations in 0.0 with refining capabilities, you can mine with whatever ship you want and leave it out there, then use a frigate or interceptor to run your refined minerals past the blockade. I'd love to do that for my corp. It'd be as fun as anything else I can think of, and add another level of strategy |
Negotiator
|
Posted - 2004.04.21 22:28:00 -
[77]
ok, people ***** when they get gang-banged by 2+ people because its unfair an pirates are cowards. and its impossible to catch anyone on your own usually. (at least the smarter part of the playerbase). plz decide what you wanna ***** about more now so then we can continue this discussion.
|
Negotiator
Coerce Inc
|
Posted - 2004.04.21 22:28:00 -
[78]
ok, people ***** when they get gang-banged by 2+ people because its unfair an pirates are cowards. and its impossible to catch anyone on your own usually. (at least the smarter part of the playerbase). plz decide what you wanna ***** about more now so then we can continue this discussion.
|
Ariya Arnaud
|
Posted - 2006.11.06 16:58:00 -
[79]
I'm out mining in 0.3 in my Armageddon. I have a full load of miner IIs on it - and as such just about every slot I have left - I need to fit with co-processors and all kinds of junk just to keep the ship online.
When I moved out into low-sec, I decided to remove my mining upgrade, webber and scrambler - all for one purpose: To be able to fit 2 warp stabs. Losing the ship will cost me 20 million in insurance + modules and whatnot. Thats a lot, and I need some measure of safety.
I mine in a quiet system - and even so I get attacked twice in less than 2 hours. One attacker is in a Battleship. I get away, because he doesn't have enough scrambling power. The second atatckers were a tag team of cruisers. Same story - I warp out.
The funny thing is the battleship pilot's comment. "<beep> <beep> noob, using stabs. Bet you got 4 of em on that ship. Can't wait until the nerf comes out."
My comment of course is: "There are several kinds of scramblers out there. I even think there are scrambling drones. Did it ever occur to you that you have fitted your ship without the necessary EW to kill miners?"
Reply: "Yeah, like I'm gonna nerf my tank to mount more scramblers!"
... WTF?
Now I have to suffer a warp stab nerf because the pirates are incompetent to mount scramblers? Ok, using 7 stabs on an armageddon is over the top, and may need some penalty - but do we need to make the lives harder for miners? How hard is it for a pirate in a battleship to fit a couple of scramblers? "Nerf his tank" !? -I'm in a ship with no resists, no armor, a medium repairer, no cap, and equipped with mining beams for crying out loud! How much tanking power does he NEED? I'm too hard to kill? Hell no!
Has anyone ever tried mining in low-sec? You know how often you get bloody attacked? With a financial loss of about 25 million every time I have my ship destroyed - I really need stabs, and I thank my lucky star that pirates are too DUMB to pack the EW modules needed to the job!
Stab nerf - no thanks. Let the pirates grow brains instead - or chase after worthy targets.
Ariya
|
Dark' Lord
Minmatar
Infinitus Odium
|
Posted - 2006.11.06 17:10:00 -
[80]
biggest. necro. ever.
|
Kunming
Amarr
adeptus gattacus
Lotka Volterra
|
Posted - 2006.11.06 17:14:00 -
[81]
Sorry but the op needs to get a clue about 0.0 alliances. Only thing we bring down from empire is pos structures/fuel, T2 ships/mods and scan probes, and last I checked we used this wonderful thing called "carrier" to.. u know, carry our stuff; the rest is built in 0.0.
The WCS nerf is balanced IMO, as long as a combat fitting wont work with it and a runner setup still makes good use of it...
|
Ariya Arnaud
|
Posted - 2006.11.06 17:16:00 -
[82]
As for the equation:
stabs + instas = bad
Am I the only one who feels that the problem isn't stabs - but the **** instas, a leftover exploit that CCP never bothered to fix? An exploit that now is lagging the servers to such a point, that CCP has put a bandaid on a mortal wound, by limiting the number of copies you can make at once.
What if you needed module slots to warp in closer to the gates, and the instas were removed? Well, there you go. You want to jump in close to the gate - you don't have room for all those stabs any more. And even betetr - the bigger the ship, the more modules you need to warp close to the gate. There will be no 'Geddons with 7 stabs then, will there? Have a look at this proposal on the forums, and tell em if this solves anything:
Insta Solution nr 589126663, or thereabouts
Nerfing stabs, because of the bad combination with instas, is like cutting of a leg to get rid of the problem of smelly feet. You are attacking the wrong end fo the problem. If an armageddon needs 5 or 6 modules to warp in at 0km from the gate - how many stabs will he have room for?
|
Kunming
Amarr
adeptus gattacus
Lotka Volterra
|
Posted - 2006.11.06 17:35:00 -
[83]
No I dont see a problem here at all. CCP wanted to move pvp away from the gates and they are doing it. CCP wants to break blob warfare and they are working on it. BMs are a liability to performance so CCP made them obsolete by adding a warp to 0km option.
Try to play the game sometime instead of sitting at a gate with your folks all day and wait for free kills, go try hunting that miner/npcer down, or probe out the mission runner and ambush him.. trust me its gonna be more fun than gate camping
|
Ariya Arnaud
|
Posted - 2006.11.06 17:43:00 -
[84]
Thay are countering the instas with a warp to 0 as well? Well. It's a solution I guess - though far from an elegant one. Hard-coding automatic instas. I would have preferred a solution more in line with the rest of the game, modules for warp accuracy, etc, and so on. Oh well...
|
goodby4u
|
Posted - 2006.11.06 17:56:00 -
[85]
Originally by: Toastmaster
As i get it Cap Relays are going to be nerfed cause they are to good with no really penelty... Well they have a small one but that doesnt matter because shield recharge is not a problem to loose...
Now how about Warp stabs ?? they aint to good with no penelty ?? not even a small penelty like takes 5 extra seconds to get in warp / module you use or something??
Things today is when travleing from deep 0.0 to empire, most is alliances and all thier members have instant BM all the way down to empire... Fine and while they use thier BM they dont need cap recharge at all so all low slots gets Warp core stabs instead just to be sure..
So as for an armageddon my though was if you fill it with warp cores it takes you 40 extra second to get into warp. That will prevent ppl from using them in overflow
Sure fit one and loose 5 sec each system thats no that much when thinking you dont have to go to the gate in that system anyway.
As it is now ppl just fill up low slots with them just because they dont loose anything from doing so and being as safe as they can..
Any thoughts ? Maybe a better penelty this is one i just thought of while writing the post
The reason the the penalty is if your going to fight,DONT FIND WAYS TO RUN AWAY,if not you can still use them,because if your running for your life in lowsec cas you dont want to pvp i dont think youll wanna lock anything either.
|
Kery Nysell
Caldari
Nysell Incorporated
|
Posted - 2006.11.06 18:08:00 -
[86]
That thread came back from APRIL 2004 !!!
Somebody call a Cleric, this need turning ASAP ...
|
Nicocat
Caldari
New Age Solutions
|
Posted - 2006.11.06 18:37:00 -
[87]
Originally by: Kery Nysell
That thread came back from APRIL 2004 !!!
Somebody call a Cleric, this need turning ASAP ...
I'm trying, I'm trying! *rolls d20s furiously*
----------------------------
Please don't try to troll in your signature -Eldo([email protected])
I tried? |
Vishnej
Demonic Retribution
Veritas Immortalis
|
Posted - 2006.11.06 19:03:00 -
[88]
Originally by: Dark' Lord
biggest. necro. ever.
|
Kharakan
Amarr
GREY COUNCIL
|
Posted - 2006.11.06 19:17:00 -
[89]
Originally by: Nicocat
Originally by: Kery Nysell
That thread came back from APRIL 2004 !!!
Somebody call a Cleric, this need turning ASAP ...
I'm trying, I'm trying! *rolls d20s furiously*
We need an old priest and a young priest!
Originally by: Joshua Foiritain (to Dark Shikari)
HAHAHA I KNOW YOUR ACCOUUNT NAME TIME TO DIE
this signature space is claimed in the name of eris, haha I got to him first. neeneer
|
Alex Harumichi
Gallente
Gradient
Namtz'aar k'in
|
Posted - 2006.11.06 19:18:00 -
[90]
Originally by: Nicocat
Originally by: Kery Nysell
That thread came back from APRIL 2004 !!!
Somebody call a Cleric, this need turning ASAP ...
I'm trying, I'm trying! *rolls d20s furiously*
"Shoot for the head! It's the only way to kill it!"
|
Statics
A.W.M
Ka-Tet
|
Posted - 2006.11.06 19:20:00 -
[91]
Originally by: Dark' Lord
biggest. necro. ever.
|
TheKiller8
Caldari
S.A.S
Euphoria Unleashed
|
Posted - 2006.11.06 19:30:00 -
[92]
Originally by: Kharakan
Originally by: Nicocat
Originally by: Kery Nysell
That thread came back from APRIL 2004 !!!
Somebody call a Cleric, this need turning ASAP ...
I'm trying, I'm trying! *rolls d20s furiously*
We need an old priest and a young priest!
The power of christ compels you!
The power of christ compels you!
I AM LEAVING AND SELLING MY LAST FLASH MOVIE! BID HERE!! |
xenodia
Gallente
RONA Corporation
|
Posted - 2006.11.06 22:31:00 -
[93]
Edited by: xenodia on 06/11/2006 22:34:32
Originally by: Toastmaster
As i get it Cap Relays are going to be nerfed cause they are to good with no really penelty... Well they have a small one but that doesnt matter because shield recharge is not a problem to loose...
Now how about Warp stabs ?? they aint to good with no penelty ?? not even a small penelty like takes 5 extra seconds to get in warp / module you use or something??
Things today is when travleing from deep 0.0 to empire, most is alliances and all thier members have instant BM all the way down to empire... Fine and while they use thier BM they dont need cap recharge at all so all low slots gets Warp core stabs instead just to be sure..
So as for an armageddon my though was if you fill it with warp cores it takes you 40 extra second to get into warp. That will prevent ppl from using them in overflow
Sure fit one and loose 5 sec each system thats no that much when thinking you dont have to go to the gate in that system anyway.
As it is now ppl just fill up low slots with them just because they dont loose anything from doing so and being as safe as they can..
Any thoughts ? Maybe a better penelty this is one i just thought of while writing the post
This post is completely invalidated by the changes in kali.
1) WCS (at least on anything but travel setups) are getting kicked in the nards to the tune of a huge lock on range and speed nerf. Putting even 1 on your ship means you always have the equivilant of a sensor dampener on you.
2) There wont be any need for instajump bookmarks in kali, as there is now a 0km option on the "warp to" menu (but only for manual warping, as autopilot still brings you in 15km off).
3) If you really wanted to gank someone in 0.0, you should have brought an interdictor. This will be even more obvious after the above changes are made.
** edit... ah crap just noticed a class 10 Necro job a few posts above mine.
This signature space for rent |
xenodia
Gallente
RONA Corporation
|
Posted - 2006.11.06 22:32:00 -
[94]
Originally by: DB Preacher
I disagree that there needs to be changes to the current warp core stabs.
Simple fact of the matter, there is a way to counter people using arma's filled with low slot Warp stabs at present in game.
It's called 2 scorps filled with warp scramblers OR 3 scorps filled with warp disruptors OR a mobile warp disruptor etc etc.
The key here is teamwork.
If my job in eve was a gate camper, I would sure as hell use something to actually catch the wee buggers with.
dbp
or 1 alt in an interdictor ?
This signature space for rent |
Xoduse
Beasts of Burden
Veritas Immortalis
|
Posted - 2006.11.06 22:54:00 -
[95]
Originally by: Ariya Arnaud
Stab nerf - no thanks. Let the pirates grow brains instead - or chase after worthy targets.
Ariya
Well Mr. Lets Revive An Ancient Thread... it's time for you to go cry in the corner of a veldspar filled belt while you mine because STABS ARE GETTING NERFED. Now each stab you fit gives a hit to lock range and lock time.
The problem isnt pirates not being able to catch miners, its people who pvp with stabs fitted. They can engage, kill the target if they are winning, and if they are losing just run away. CCP is finally making the cowards commit to their fights.
---------------------
|
Nemain
Amarr
Obsidian Asylum
|
Posted - 2006.11.07 10:22:00 -
[96]
Lol, I got worried for a sec when I read the first post in this thread, I thought "WTF Cap relays are getting Nerf'd, Again", then I saw the shield recharge bit and happily realised someone was doing a bit of forum necromancy
|
Sun Ra
Brutor tribe
|
Posted - 2006.11.07 10:35:00 -
[97]
lol @ this thread
Arcane Frankologies - 'plz stop guys it's xmas' |
twit brent
Dark Centuri Inc.
Firmus Ixion
|
Posted - 2006.11.07 10:38:00 -
[98]
Originally by: xenodia
Edited by: xenodia on 06/11/2006 22:34:32
Originally by: Toastmaster
As i get it Cap Relays are going to be nerfed cause they are to good with no really penelty... Well they have a small one but that doesnt matter because shield recharge is not a problem to loose...
Now how about Warp stabs ?? they aint to good with no penelty ?? not even a small penelty like takes 5 extra seconds to get in warp / module you use or something??
Things today is when travleing from deep 0.0 to empire, most is alliances and all thier members have instant BM all the way down to empire... Fine and while they use thier BM they dont need cap recharge at all so all low slots gets Warp core stabs instead just to be sure..
So as for an armageddon my though was if you fill it with warp cores it takes you 40 extra second to get into warp. That will prevent ppl from using them in overflow
Sure fit one and loose 5 sec each system thats no that much when thinking you dont have to go to the gate in that system anyway.
As it is now ppl just fill up low slots with them just because they dont loose anything from doing so and being as safe as they can..
Any thoughts ? Maybe a better penelty this is one i just thought of while writing the post
This post is completely invalidated by the changes in kali.
1) WCS (at least on anything but travel setups) are getting kicked in the nards to the tune of a huge lock on range and speed nerf. Putting even 1 on your ship means you always have the equivilant of a sensor dampener on you.
2) There wont be any need for instajump bookmarks in kali, as there is now a 0km option on the "warp to" menu (but only for manual warping, as autopilot still brings you in 15km off).
3) If you really wanted to gank someone in 0.0, you should have brought an interdictor. This will be even more obvious after the above changes are made.
** edit... ah crap just noticed a class 10 Necro job a few posts above mine.
LMAO
|
Wotar
|
Posted - 2006.11.07 13:01:00 -
[99]
Necros used to be very occasional, now every other thread is dug up from the dead. Do you not really realise what a **** you are to unearth a thread from 2 years ago and respond to it like it was current?
Here's a clue, free of charge: Game mechanics are different now.
I always like the ones when some nub digs up a thread where people are recommending cruise missiles on a Kestrel, for instance, in order to post something like: '0mg!!! u n00b!!! u cant fit cruise missilez on a kestral!!'
Why not just make a new thread and say 'Hello everyone, I am of exceptionally low intelligence' and be done with it?
|
Hitomi Tagaki
|
Posted - 2007.03.20 17:05:00 -
[100]
Hello everyone, I am of exceptionally low intelligence
|
Waxau
Liberty Rogues
Coalition of Carebear Killers
|
Posted - 2007.03.20 17:07:00 -
[101]
Originally by: Hitomi Tagaki
Hello everyone, I am of exceptionally low intelligence
Hardly funny - you just show you're a retard
|
Marquis Dean
The Last Thing You'll Ever See
|
Posted - 2007.03.20 17:12:00 -
[102]
---
Originally by: Foopadoo
Hell hath no fury like an internet nerd scorned.
|
Mutant Caldari
Caldari
VSP Corp.
R0ADKILL
|
Posted - 2007.03.20 17:19:00 -
[103]
Someone kill the necromancer please.
Yeah I am a pirate.What are you gonna do about it? |
KillaGouge
Amarr
Dark Blade Incorporated
Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
|
Posted - 2007.03.20 17:39:00 -
[104]
Dose nobody know that WCS have drawbacks to them, increased locking times, and decreased locking range. Since my alliance is currently in a war with PA and I'm moving stuff into lowsec, every last one of my low slots have WCS in them. Sure I can warp out of the gatecamp, but I can't do anything else in the way of combat. Get somebody to bump them out of alignment, then keep attacking, problem solved.
|
Larkonis Trassler
g guild
|
Posted - 2007.03.20 17:40:00 -
[105]
Originally by: KillaGouge
Dose nobody know that WCS have drawbacks to them, increased locking times, and decreased locking range. Since my alliance is currently in a war with PA and I'm moving stuff into lowsec, every last one of my low slots have WCS in them. Sure I can warp out of the gatecamp, but I can't do anything else in the way of combat. Get somebody to bump them out of alignment, then keep attacking, problem solved.
Check the start date
DURRR DURRRR BRAIIIIIIIIINS
------------
Request for Privateer Sticky! Keep the forums clean!
|
Phish1
Liberty Forces
Ratel Alliance
|
Posted - 2007.03.20 18:24:00 -
[106]
my agents are hunting you down now, f*cktard
|
Majin82
Caldari
g guild
|
Posted - 2007.03.20 21:45:00 -
[107]
*Insert Doctor Orphious speach*
-------------------------------------
The difference between a Pirate and an Anti-Pirate is that an Anti-Pirate fights ships fitted with guns!
Passive Drake For The Win |
Woofsie
Minmatar
Shih Yang Tong
|
Posted - 2007.03.20 22:12:00 -
[108]
Originally by: Larkonis Trassler
Originally by: KillaGouge
Dose nobody know that WCS have drawbacks to them, increased locking times, and decreased locking range. Since my alliance is currently in a war with PA and I'm moving stuff into lowsec, every last one of my low slots have WCS in them. Sure I can warp out of the gatecamp, but I can't do anything else in the way of combat. Get somebody to bump them out of alignment, then keep attacking, problem solved.
Check the start date
DURRR DURRRR BRAIIIIIIIIINS
LMAO :D
|
Sicori Malaki
Caldari
Thundercats
RAZOR Alliance
|
Posted - 2007.03.20 22:14:00 -
[109]
kill the necro'
______________
Only in the Tales that humans tell, do the hunters kill the wolf in the end. |
dralid
Vortex.
Maelstrom Alliance
|
Posted - 2007.03.20 22:45:00 -
[110]
A Templar is an Amarr fighter, a drone used by Carriers
--
Do YOU know, the Whirlwind?
HERE |
NIkis
Minmatar
Hidden Agenda
Deep Space Engineering
|
Posted - 2007.03.20 22:50:00 -
[111]
Someone LOCK THIS PLEASE !!!
I refrained from posting on this thread 4 hours ago but seems others can't  . Let it rest in peace !
I'm starting to miss a 'report' feature on this forum.
|
Riho
Gallente
Magnificent Beavers
Exquisite Malevolence
|
Posted - 2007.03.21 07:31:00 -
[112]
lol... LOCK.... its the second time atleast when someone necrod it... kill it for good
Sig killed by MODs.... reworking it
Great being Gallente... aint it ?
-----------------
YARRRR, sig hijack! -HornFrog
----------------- |
|
Sahwoolo Etoophie
Forum Moderator
Interstellar Services Department
|
Posted - 2007.03.21 09:29:00 -
[113]
Thread locked for neeeeeeeecro *click*.
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