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Zirse
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
68
   |
Posted - 2011.09.08 06:55:00 -
[1] - Quote
Quote:No War But Rep War: The CCP/CSM Drama Explodes I seem to have underestimated the scope of my newfound (and, let's be honest, utterly ridiculous) e-celebrity. My CEO Update was intended to prepare this alliance for the release, in about a week, of a formal spotlight from the CSM on the topic of "FiS Neglect"; based on my experiences in the past, I assumed that if I wanted the gaming media to pay attention to what Some Guy Who Runs A Space Guild says about a niche MMO from a country surrounded by fart-water, I'd have to call in some favors and/or suck some dicks, as well as have the alliance ready to seize Slashdot/Digg/Reddit to even get the time of day from sites like PC Gamer or RPS. Oops. Without prompting, Eurogamer picked up the CEO Update, and then a viral media cycle kicked in - one site covered an issue and got a bunch of hits, which means every other site wanted to cover the CEO Update, and next thing you know we're in full drama mode. Rock Paper Shotgun, The Edge, Eurogamer, Gamespy, PC Gamer, Tentonhammer. I expected some in CCP to see the Update as a shot across the bow - but I expected them to hear about it on Kugu and have a chance to privately make some concessions before the CSM Spotlight came out. Instead, the media's attention means that we have launched a broadside into CCP seemingly out of nowhere, and everyone who has similar views about the downward course of EVE has looked upon what we did, judged it Good, and unloaded on CCP as well. The reason that this situation has escalated so rapidly is twofold. One, the chart that Jester drew up (the now-infamous PCU graph used in my update) illustrates something we have felt for some time with an icy clarity. Two, after the foolishness of the Incarna launch and Monoclegate, the media was eager to report on what has become a 'story arc' of sorts. The narrative plays well - "plucky players stand up to a corporation to prevent a Sony/NGE disaster". In an industry plagued with Bobby Koticks, I suspect the average gaming reporter gets a kick out of the CSM/CCP conflicts. So, here we stand, surrounded by a torrent of unplanned media attention. We can back off and let the dust settle, or we can increase the pressure on the suits to ensure that Flying In Space is once again something worth playing. If CCP chooses to be vindictive towards GSF or the CSM because we have dared to speak out against the neglect of spaceships in this spaceship game, we have already provided them with ample cause. After all, who would believe that this perfect storm of media coverage was an accident, not some conspiracy? I wouldn't believe it, even though it is actually the case. We must twist the knife. Now that we have found CCP's Achilles Heel, we must achieve some kind of victory for the players. Great, I don't run a gaming news site. How can I help prevent CCP alpha-testing World of Darkness in EVE?
You can do two things to help save EVE. First, and crucially, you can ensure that the truth gets out on the main Eve Online forums, which were recently converted to a new system that allows both rapid posting (no more 2 minute timer, thank god) and +rep. As a bonus, this involves tearing a cadre of fanatical pubbies into tiny strips of flesh. It seems that there are a few very vocal badposters who believe that the problem of FiS Neglect is literally a ~goon conspiracy~, and that everything would just be peachy in Eve Online if CCP just buffed hisec missions (again). We do not want to spam or obliterate the Eve-O forums; instead we must take stern control of the narrative there to ensure that the badposters in that cesspit are not heeded by anyone of consequence. Secondly, generate hits on media stories covering the FiS Neglect crisis. The gaming media functions on a shoestring budget and is desperate for traffic; we have learned since 2007 that the best way to get the media to pay heed is to give them the traffic they are so desperate for, rather than spamming forums indiscriminately and hoping someone deigns to write about the cacophony. A profit-driven scalpel is needed, rather than a sledgehammer. (I have a suspicion that being on the inside at TTH has taught me some useful methods to leverage gaming coverage, but we'll see if this works. No guarantees.) You can generate hits by linking articles that cover topics we favor on social media, or you could simply comment on their articles and provoke discussions. The following stories have broken thus far. Read them, spread them, ensure that the media learns that it's entirely to their benefit to listen to us and take our side: http://www.next-gen.biz/news/ccp-accused-running-eve-online-groundhttp://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2011-09-05-eve-csm-chairman-breaks-the-peace - This site scooped the story, and caused all this. http://www.pcgamer.com/2011/09/05/eve-online-stellar-council-head-hits-out-at-ccpPCgamer http://gamers.5starhot.info/news-eve-csm-chair-mittani-breaks-the-peaceGamerZone. http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2011/09/06/eves-csm-fight-back-and-some-thoughtsRock Paper Shotgun- This one is particularly good. Get it everywhere.
Vin Hellsing
52
|
Posted - 2011.09.08 07:01:00 -
[2] - Quote
I'm not one to directly support GSF, but I personally think CCP has been handling the matters with the CSM the wrong way, and trying to bullshit the people who are supposed to represent us.
Case in point: The lack of release on the Emergency CSM minutes, and the revelation on some CSM blogs that CCP has been trying to put words into the CSM's mouths (big no-no, huge disrespect for the playerbase).
Here's the thing, CCP: We want honest, open communication - NDA/politics/saving face be damned - and stop trying to gag the CSMs on the single most pivotal issue that has gripped the EVE Online community since T20.
It reflects poorly, y'know. See, I believe in something called R&R. No, not that R&R.
Respect & Results.
You cannot get results by being disrespectful to the people who are supposed to serve as the proxies representing the playerbase, and you certainly don't get respect by doing that, either. Respect is a two-way street, and when all parties abide by the rules of the road, results will come.
Until CCP's upper management understands that, they are screwed, PR-wise.
I don't agree with The Mittani's antics, but someone's gonna have to bend over backwards - and I don't think it's going to be the CSM. Not with the stakes this high.
The credibility of both CCP and CSM are at risk, and when you lose credibility, you lose the ability to sell your product effectively. |
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NUXI7
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
33
|
Posted - 2011.09.08 07:02:00 -
[3] - Quote
This copy pasta is missing something....
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v386/Numismancer/sitkamope.jpg
Much better. |
Zirse
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
68
|
Posted - 2011.09.08 07:06:00 -
[4] - Quote
To be fair my soul melted a little when :CCP: didn't let me [img] Mittens' puppy. |
Poetic Stanziel
Arrakis Technology
58
|
Posted - 2011.09.08 07:10:00 -
[5] - Quote
Did The Mittani set CCP to -5 or -10? Where are we at here in the impending rep war?
What God Wants, God Gets, God Help Us All |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
130
|
Posted - 2011.09.08 07:13:00 -
[6] - Quote
Apologies, but I'm missing the "declaration of war" in that. Could you highlight it for me?
Thanks in advance,
Malcanis' Law: Any proposal made on the basis that "it will benefit new players" is invariably to the greater advantage of older, richer players. |
Interstate LoveSong
Regional Park Services
Tactical Narcotics Team
20
|
Posted - 2011.09.08 07:14:00 -
[7] - Quote
EVE Online has nothing to do with internet spaceships and everything to do with avatars awkwardly walking around in a prison cell / captains quarters. When will us players finally admit to ourselves that we didn't want to play this game to fly spaceships but to pretend we are using IMVU hitting on fat guys / goth chicks (also fat guys). |
Vin Hellsing
52
|
Posted - 2011.09.08 07:16:00 -
[8] - Quote
Poetic Stanziel wrote:Did The Mittani set CCP to -5 or -10? Where are we at here in the impending rep war?
I'm guessing -5, because half of CCP is good, and the other half is bad. Still a valid wartarget, though. |
Zirse
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
68
|
Posted - 2011.09.08 07:16:00 -
[9] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:Apologies, but I'm missing the "declaration of war" in that. Could you highlight it for me?
Thanks in advance,
EVERYBODY LIKES GOOD SEMANTIC HEADLINES YOU TURBOAFRICANAMERICAN.
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Prince Kobol
27
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Posted - 2011.09.08 07:22:00 -
[10] - Quote
At the momet I find it very difficult to believe anything CCP and The Mittani say.
I do not believe that many of the online gaming publications simply discovered The Mittani blog by themselves. I suspect that they were tipped off, most likely by the The Mittani himself.
The Mittani is simply repeating what many people have been saying over the last couple of months and is now trying to claim credit for himself.
Wasn't it only a few months ago in iceland that he was supporting CCP?
Also this talk of The Mittani taking the War to CCP will not work, just like the last round of bad publicity and protests did not work.
If history tells us anything is that player protests have never succeeded changing the path of a developer.
Why?
Once a developer changes direction due to player demands then a door has been opened that can never be closed
I agree with many of things that were said in his blog but then again I agreed with them when other players posted them months ago.
The simple fact is no amount forum posts, blogs, protests etc etc will change anything.
The suits at CCP have set the course and they will either succeed or fail.
You have the choice of either to stick with them or leave.
Hilmar said it himself, we will act on what the players do, not say, i.e whether they stay or leave.
If the The Mittani and goons decide to disprute thing in games to the point where you have thousands of players complaining then CCP can just simply ban them.
Ban them I hear you say, Yes. Remember, only a very small percentage of players bother with the forums and a even smaller percentage bother with the CSM.
The majority of players simply do not care and just want to play the game. If the Mittani disrupt enough of those players all that will happen is he and along with his sheep will be hated to such an extend that most people will be asking CCP to ban them and CCP win. |
Living Dead Girl
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
40
|
Posted - 2011.09.08 07:30:00 -
[11] - Quote
Prince Kobol wrote: stuff
If CCP Just decides to ban the complaining players and i would assume the goons period, i get the feeling the media coverage so far would be nothing compared to the bad publicity CCP would get following that. and while your average player might not care, the INVESTORS will.
The Goal Isn't To live Forever, It's To Create Something That Does. |
Prince Kobol
27
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Posted - 2011.09.08 07:41:00 -
[12] - Quote
Living Dead Girl wrote:Prince Kobol wrote: stuff If CCP Just decides to ban the complaining players and i would assume the goons period, i get the feeling the media coverage so far would be nothing compared to the bad publicity CCP would get following that. and while your average player might not care, the INVESTORS will.
I didn't say ban the complaining players, just those who disrupt things in game to the point where people refuse to log in anymore.
Also, the media would care for what a day, maybe 2, after that its old news and nobody gives a crap.
Thats called the real world.
Everything passes over in time, why do think nothing changed after the last spate of bad press, because there will always been new news and peope have very short memories :)
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FeralShadow
NME1
1
|
Posted - 2011.09.08 07:47:00 -
[13] - Quote
God. they let us hide posters, for the love of god let us hide topics of posters who are constantly trolling. I want to read this forum again without seeing the 30,000 whine threads that i couldn't give a rat's ass about. |
Mara Rinn
Cosmic Industrial Complex
Cosmic Consortium
49
|
Posted - 2011.09.08 07:57:00 -
[14] - Quote
Gaming press says a lot of stuff, but what does it do? No publicity is bad publicity.
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Xercodo
Xovoni Directorate
42
|
Posted - 2011.09.08 08:00:00 -
[15] - Quote
I think what caused CCP to shoot themselves in the collective foot was their vow to themselves to always do two expansions a year. But CCP has grown and it is no longer as nimble, and can't handle fast development on so many features and game aspects with so many different "cooks" in the "kitchen" without the amount of bugs and errors getting exponentially worse. What we need to do is to demand that CCP take their time to coordinate and document everything, and demand that they pull back to one expansion in a year and to move back to the "one huge patch" deployment style. I think the biggest benefit of this would be the change of people's perceptions of how much content is put into an expansion because we'd be moving back to getting a boat load of awesome all at once.
The Drake is a Lie |
Mara Rinn
Cosmic Industrial Complex
Cosmic Consortium
49
|
Posted - 2011.09.08 08:03:00 -
[16] - Quote
Xercodo wrote:and demand that they pull back to one expansion in a year and to move back to the "one huge patch" deployment style.
Incremental release means they get to iron the kinks out of stuff one wrinkle at a time, rather than deploying a huge patch and having a much harder time of it due to the sheer volume of bug reports to deal with.
Of course, ensuring that there are no bug reports outstanding against Singularity would help keep the bug count on Tranquility down a little  |
Barbelo Valentinian
The Scope
Gallente Federation
31
|
Posted - 2011.09.08 08:04:00 -
[17] - Quote
I dunno, while I would agree that The Mittani is being disingenuous and that this is obviously some part of his fiendish junior social manipulator plot, and while I suspect he does want to hog the limelight and take credit for something that's already been rumbling along quite happily without him; nevertheless there is a sort of struggle going on right now for the soul of the game, and as far as I'm concerned his voice, and the power he has as leader of one of the biggest alliances in the game, is welcome on the right side. (What power is that? The fact that, ultimately, he could invoke a mass protest-unsubcription.)
The point re. developers being the ultimate "boss" - yes, well, that would apply with a standard "themepark" MMO, but it doesn't apply to sandboxes, as Sony Online Entertainment learned to their cost. The worst that would happen from developers' points of view would that they would take this scenario as a warning, and be less inclined to make sandboxes in the future, because they're probably more trouble than they're worth. (The counterweight to that is that sandboxes are the best type of MMO, and developers who are at least as concerned about art as they are about money will still want to make them, despite their problems. Are CCP stll that kind of developer? We'll see.)
But as far as EVE and CCP go, fortunately or unfortunately, this game is still a sandbox, and is the only thing they're doing that's actually making money at the moment; it's the foundation of their plans, so to a certain extent, the players have CCP by the balls, and can really make a difference if they show a united front. |
El'Niaga
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
40
|
Posted - 2011.09.08 08:05:00 -
[18] - Quote
Mara Rinn wrote:Xercodo wrote:and demand that they pull back to one expansion in a year and to move back to the "one huge patch" deployment style. Incremental release means they get to iron the kinks out of stuff one wrinkle at a time, rather than deploying a huge patch and having a much harder time of it due to the sheer volume of bug reports to deal with. Of course, ensuring that there are no bug reports outstanding against Singularity would help keep the bug count on Tranquility down a little
How's that working for you?
The incremental fixes?
The patches are buggier and still aren't fixed 6 months later despite incremental patches. |
Jada Maroo
Mysterium Astrometrics
BRABODEN
151
|
Posted - 2011.09.08 08:09:00 -
[19] - Quote
Zirse wrote: I'd have to call in some favors and/or suck some dicks,
A convenient excuse for something he would have done anyway!  |
Xercodo
Xovoni Directorate
42
|
Posted - 2011.09.08 08:12:00 -
[20] - Quote
El'Niaga wrote:Mara Rinn wrote:Xercodo wrote:and demand that they pull back to one expansion in a year and to move back to the "one huge patch" deployment style. Incremental release means they get to iron the kinks out of stuff one wrinkle at a time, rather than deploying a huge patch and having a much harder time of it due to the sheer volume of bug reports to deal with. Of course, ensuring that there are no bug reports outstanding against Singularity would help keep the bug count on Tranquility down a little How's that working for you? The incremental fixes? The patches are buggier and still aren't fixed 6 months later despite incremental patches.
yup, too fast for their own good
weave the whole cloth and throw it down and iron it instead of weaving bits and pieces and try to sew those bits together WHILE ironing
The Drake is a Lie |
Cyzlaki
Interstellar eXodus
BricK sQuAD.
98
|
Posted - 2011.09.08 08:16:00 -
[21] - Quote
Yawn. This is old news. As for "taking stern control of the forums" here. If I see any goons making crap threads I will simply hide their posts. |
Florestan Bronstein
United Engineering Services
33
|
Posted - 2011.09.08 08:55:00 -
[22] - Quote
Prince Kobol wrote:The simple fact is no amount forum posts, blogs, protests etc etc will change anything..
forums did eat my original reply, so I will keep it short:
CCP is going to launch DUST in a very competitive market in summer 2012.
The success of DUST is extremely important to CCP.
The avenues CCP has to use to reach out to potential DUST players are not exclusive to game companies anymore.
Gone are the days of printed gaming media and selective printing of readers' letters to the magazine (~ -50% circulation over the last 5 years in Germany).
The highly organized EVE community can be a huge boon to CCP when it comes to marketing DUST or it can cause CCP endless headaches (by spreading messages like "CCP does not deliver", "lol, dust bunnies", "USP is tie-in to a dying mmo" all over the comments sections, community forums and in the web communities they are native to).
There is still a lot of time for CCP to change course, make commitments and show that they want to deliver on them.
This is not about CCP missing out on a handful of EVE subscriptions due to bad press, it is about making CCP think about how much they will have to rely on the EVE community's support (both in-game and OOG) to make DUST the success they are craving for. |
The Mittani
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
414
|
Posted - 2011.09.08 09:00:00 -
[23] - Quote
Mara Rinn wrote:Gaming press says a lot of stuff, but what does it do? No publicity is bad publicity.
It's a fair point. We'll have to see if media pressure gets results, as it has in the past. The CSM believes it's our most effective tactic, as well as the only one left available to us after the attempts to fiddle with the minutes of the emergency summit. |
The Mittani
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
414
|
Posted - 2011.09.08 09:02:00 -
[24] - Quote
Also, the thread title is completely misleading and the only thing redeeming about this repost is the picture of MY PUPPY~ |
The Mittani
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
414
|
Posted - 2011.09.08 09:06:00 -
[25] - Quote
mods plz retitle "The Mittani Declares His Puppy Owns", tia~ |
Andski
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
13
|
Posted - 2011.09.08 09:11:00 -
[26] - Quote
these threads always lead to a discussion about the mittani's puppy or his sabre or whatever and never really accomplish anything, says a lot about the inertia of your garden variety eve-o poster |
Andski
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
13
|
Posted - 2011.09.08 09:12:00 -
[27] - Quote
yo mittens should i aim for a maus or an is-7 |
Andski
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
13
|
Posted - 2011.09.08 09:14:00 -
[28] - Quote
i'm somewhat inclined towards the is-7 but i fear that the soviet tanks will just become the gallente of tanks v0v |
LittleTerror
Day Unhappy Security Inc.
4
|
Posted - 2011.09.08 09:20:00 -
[29] - Quote
Didn't read. |
Grateler
The People's Liberation Front of Offugen
0
|
Posted - 2011.09.08 09:26:00 -
[30] - Quote
I agree that CCP have focused on areas that have no benefit to spaceships. Ive thought all along Dust is a pointless add-on which is too far removed by platform and genre to benefit the spaceship game. Incarna and WIS so far looks pointless and I still dont see what it will be used for other than creating an Ironforge where you can /dance.
What Id like to see from the OP is rather than just stating this is to highlight what he deems important to be developed. This may have been detailed elsewhere so apologies if so.
There are lots of ant- CPP posts at moment but to be honest most people dont really seem to know what they are complaining about. At present it just comes across as complaining against the establishment and tantrums with no constructive criticism.
I want to hear what people believe needs to be worked on, not complaining about what has been.
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