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Dear north, time to show that you can help us as we helped you!

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Crackzilla The Shadow Order SMASH Alliance	Posted - 2008.06.18 17:54:00 - [181] Originally by: Swamp Ziro (keep shifting that blame while alt-tabbed evaccing assets, those fukken grunts don't know their place. They should just shut up and hold the line) Because most that are complaining don't know their place. Most should have been in empire a long time ago. Those that were active in the last 6 months to a year have secured most assets and left some pvp ships behind to have fun. The ones that were not active and rarely left a station system are the most likely to be hung out to dry. The only line they've known involved a belt. Otherwise just the usual amusing whining when something changes. Originally by: Captain Shocker "woes is me for not learning diplomacy" attitude. You and your lot are fail and are solely to blame for the fall of your alliance. The best diplomacy in game is to have bigger guns and more of them. In this regard after years in Geminate we have failed. Are you saying that we failed because our NAP list wasn't long enough? Are you saying that we should have paid tribute to someone else? Originally by: Captain Shocker You came, you saw, you (were)conquered. Yep. Thats how it goes. Regrets? None. We took others space and in this case had a foe that took ours. Well played. golf clap Originally by: Captain Shocker If my pvper was in your alliance i would have popped you and peoke and made sure you lost all the assets you know doubt have "secure" in empire. Popped them for what? If you can't deal with 0.0 life then stay in empire. If you can't manage your assets/logistics then stay in empire. If you haul out every last thing to a 0.0 station which anyone can take and lock you out and you somehow feel that it is your god given right to access this station at all costs then you should probably ... stay in empire. Originally by: Captain Shocker This story is played over and over again. Different people same outcome. That space is taken and space is lost? In a game where space is meant to be taken and lost? In an alliance that risks to take space or lose it? By the same group of people? This is news! Originally by: Swamp Ziro it's up to the leadership to make the members WANT to participate, and WANT to be in a fleet, Um, we took a significant portion of the drone regions doing just this. However taking space is different than attempting to defend + handle logistics + deal with whiners. Differences in organization etc help here. We were not prepared to handle an invasion on two fronts against us and allies. Simple.
Koi Yokuma Di-Tron Heavy Industries Atlas Alliance	Posted - 2008.06.18 18:30:00 - [182] LMFAO. Want some cheese with that wine? Its obvious that you have no clue at all what's going on in any of these alliances. Dastycakes? Leadership?!?!?! The day Dast makes a leadership role is the day I stop our bromance....it'll never happen. If you don't even know who's in charge, how could you possibly say they failed? I can only accurately speak for ATLAS, but we were well informed of our options and what would trigger specific actions weeks before anything happened. Not that I've seen anyone from ATLAS b*tching, but all one had to do is read our alliance mails or forum to be very well informed.
Brungar Best Path Inc. Ethereal Dawn	Posted - 2008.06.18 18:45:00 - [183] Originally by: Wallenberg Originally by: Brungar I find it intensely ironic that after all the smack when smashkill invaded ED space for all of a week, I have yet to see anything much of a resistance from those same parties. And to be honest I'm disappointed. I was hoping for some good fights, even if it would have a lot of boring stuff inbetween. Unfortunately those fights are sorely lacking. I'll miss the roaming gangs into eachothers space, having hostile neighbours 8 jumps out rocks! I find it ironic that while you cant defend your own space you still have some. We were invaded by hostile alliances several times our size. Therefore we picked the small fights we could, whilst we had our friends moving to support us. It's what any intelligent alliance would have done. Let's have a quick look at the numbers (and I know number of toons are irrelevant, we all know how the carebear alliances are full of alts...) Numbers are based at the time of the invasion of ED space - numbers have changed dramatically the past 2 weeks, so current numbers are not representative. ED: 750 pilots IRC: 1600 pilots XdeathX: 500 pilots Solar Fleet: 300 pilots Solar wing: 500 pilots Goon: 5000 pilots Total: 8650 versus Smash: 1600 pilots Atlas: 1000 pilots Roadkill: 2400 pilots Fang: 400 Fix: 500 pilots Kano: 900 pilots Total: 5800 The above list is not complete, but should serve as a rough impression. If I have forgotten anyone on either side, it is not by intent. During the first days of the invasion, ED faced Smash, Atlas and Roadkill. Our allies were at the tie otherwise occupied, making the odds ED + IRC (2000) versus Smash + RK + Atlas (4000). As we had explained to us several times we are of course carebears, so of the 2000 in IRC and ED, a substantial part must be industrials and not at all capable of PVP. So depending on your estimate of the level of carebearism, numbers were either 2:1 against us or massively worse. We had been informed help would be available in a few days. So we did what we could to delay until we had our allies helping out. During this time a good many of us had a lot of fun in smaller skirmishes, whilst avoiding the larger confrontation. I know I did. The rest, as they say, is history. "War is a continuation of commerce by other means" - Unknown Caldari philosopher
Koronos Interstellar eXodus R0ADKILL	Posted - 2008.06.18 21:01:00 - [184] Originally by: Captain Shocker Its really sad to see people jerked around like RK and friends have done. They lead them like lambs to the slaughter all the while securing there assets in empire. Eve simulates real life like no other mmo. While people get rich(Exxon/RK leadership) the common man suffers to pay the bills(Everyone else/Rk members). I do not know what line of bs theywere feeding, actually i do as RK is not hard to infiltrate but its said to see 10k strong alliance crumble under false promises and rhetoric that reminds you of the big H(you know the one.) To all those alliances autorejecting these guys I ask of you to reconsider as that would be like rejecting the foot soldier for doing his duty. Mere pawns on the eve stage orchestrated by the biggest thieves and liars known to man. To those in leadership who led a small town into obscurity i say shame on you. Keep showing your epeen at the expense of the common man who bought into your system and believed in you. You can blame goons/IRC/Russians/Moon men and what have you but you are at fault. Its disgusting to hear the rhetoric of RK and pals and then see them tuck tail to empire only to continue to smack how life is unfair. No you are unfair dastommy, peoke, and whoever else. Not only do you fail at life but you failed 10,000 others. man up and accept your fate as unfitting to lead a horse to water and do everyone a favor and disapear from eve forever. Absolute total crap. LMFAO at the idea that RK leadership has run off with a bunch of isk at the expense of their members what a joke.
Yorda Battlestars GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.06.18 23:06:00 - [185] Originally by: Koronos Absolute total crap. LMFAO at the idea that RK leadership has run off with a bunch of isk at the expense of their members what a joke. Oh poor little grunt, just wait until your meeting tonight I'm sure they'll straighten everything out with another wave of lies while you sacrifice yourselves for some sort of supercap being built.
Venomire GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.06.19 00:36:00 - [186] Originally by: Koronos Absolute total crap. LMFAO at the idea that RK leadership has run off with a bunch of isk at the expense of their members what a joke. I know. It's really us running off with your towers and enjoying the firesales.
Graalum Foundation R0ADKILL	Posted - 2008.06.19 01:10:00 - [187] Edited by: Graalum on 19/06/2008 01:11:16 Originally by: Yorda Originally by: Koronos Absolute total crap. LMFAO at the idea that RK leadership has run off with a bunch of isk at the expense of their members what a joke. Oh poor little grunt, just wait until your meeting tonight I'm sure they'll straighten everything out with another wave of lies while you sacrifice yourselves for some sort of supercap being built. ahahahah koronos is just a grunt guys. Seriously. Seriously
Graalum Foundation R0ADKILL	Posted - 2008.06.19 01:19:00 - [188] Originally by: Captain Shocker Its really sad to see people jerked around like RK and friends have done. They lead them like lambs to the slaughter all the while securing there assets in empire. Eve simulates real life like no other mmo. While people get rich(Exxon/RK leadership) the common man suffers to pay the bills(Everyone else/Rk members). I do not know what line of bs theywere feeding, actually i do as RK is not hard to infiltrate but its said to see 10k strong alliance crumble under false promises and rhetoric that reminds you of the big H(you know the one.) To all those alliances autorejecting these guys I ask of you to reconsider as that would be like rejecting the foot soldier for doing his duty. Mere pawns on the eve stage orchestrated by the biggest thieves and liars known to man. To those in leadership who led a small town into obscurity i say shame on you. Keep showing your epeen at the expense of the common man who bought into your system and believed in you. You can blame goons/IRC/Russians/Moon men and what have you but you are at fault. Its disgusting to hear the rhetoric of RK and pals and then see them tuck tail to empire only to continue to smack how life is unfair. No you are unfair dastommy, peoke, and whoever else. Not only do you fail at life but you failed 10,000 others. man up and accept your fate as unfitting to lead a horse to water and do everyone a favor and disapear from eve forever. post with your main or else your just a goonie alt. Must be a stupid smash/tko isk farmer, if that. Seriously, you don't even know who ran smashkill do you? HINT: its not dasty (lol <3 dastycakes) or peoke. Also, dasty and peoke fail at life becauise they lost some 0's and 1's in internetspaceships. serious business.
dastommy79 Di-Tron Heavy Industries Atlas Alliance	Posted - 2008.06.19 01:22:00 - [189] Confirming i am a failure. Stop banning me please
Graalum Foundation R0ADKILL	Posted - 2008.06.19 01:25:00 - [190] Originally by: Swamp Ziro Edited by: Swamp Ziro on 18/06/2008 17:30:02 Edited by: Swamp Ziro on 18/06/2008 17:28:20 Originally by: TroNaaR Originally by: Captain Shocker quote]This story is played over and over again. Different people same outcome. -The Shocker Where were you in the fleets? How much did you participate? Get stuffed. Srsly. It's been 5 years and you idiots still don't realize that it's up to the leadership to make the members WANT to participate, and WANT to be in a fleet, I'm seriously mind blown that you still don't seem to realize this, after losing god knows how many alliances repeating the same mistakes It's your responsibility to have the membership having fun. If the membership is not having fun, you **** up. If it's not participating in fleet ops, you ** up. If it leaves your ty alliance to have fun elsewhere, guess what, you ** up. You guys seem to be confusing leadership with running a scam, because seriously, based on the principles you run your alliances on, that's what it looks like. membership wasn't having fun, so we are saying ** it and doing something most of us have wanted to do for a while. Also, good luck getting someone who has no intention of ever pvping into a fleet, these peopel shoudl be dealt with by a kick from their corps, or better yet no invite in the first place.
Plutonian Plutonian Shore	Posted - 2008.06.19 01:36:00 - [191] Not involved in this current conflict... Smashkill and Goons please forgive the intrusion. But this statement needs to be echoed... perhaps over and over until people finally get the point: Originally by: Swamp Ziro It's been 5 years and you idiots still don't realize that it's up to the leadership to make the members WANT to participate, and WANT to be in a fleet, I'm seriously mind blown that you still don't seem to realize this, after losing god knows how many alliances repeating the same mistakes It's your responsibility to have the membership having fun. If the membership is not having fun, you **** up. If it's not participating in fleet ops, you ** up. If it leaves your ty alliance to have fun elsewhere, guess what, you ** up. You guys seem to be confusing leadership with running a scam, because seriously, based on the principles you run your alliances on, that's what it looks like. Thank you** Swamp Ziro. It's about god-damn time someone said it. Personally, I've given up on alliances.
Moon Kitten GoonFleet	Posted - 2008.06.19 01:51:00 - [192] Edited by: Moon Kitten on 19/06/2008 01:51:07 Originally by: Brungar Edited by: Brungar on 18/06/2008 20:06:13 Edited by: Brungar on 18/06/2008 19:15:25 Originally by: Wallenberg Originally by: Brungar I find it intensely ironic that after all the smack when smashkill invaded ED space for all of a week, I have yet to see anything much of a resistance from those same parties. And to be honest I'm disappointed. I was hoping for some good fights, even if it would have a lot of boring stuff inbetween. Unfortunately those fights are sorely lacking. I'll miss the roaming gangs into eachothers space, having hostile neighbours 8 jumps out rocks! I find it ironic that while you cant defend your own space you still have some. We were invaded by hostile alliances several times our size. Therefore we picked the small fights we could, whilst we had our friends moving to support us. It's what any intelligent alliance would have done. Let's have a quick look at the numbers (and I know number of toons are irrelevant, we all know how the carebear alliances are full of alts...) Numbers are based at the time of the invasion of ED space - numbers have changed dramatically the past 2 weeks, so current numbers are not representative. ED: 750 pilots IRC: 1600 pilots XdeathX: 500 pilots Solar Fleet: 300 pilots Solar wing: 500 pilots Goon: 5000 pilots Total: 8650 versus Smash: 1600 pilots Atlas: 1000 pilots Roadkill: 2400 pilots Fang: 400 Fix: 500 pilots Kano: 900 pilots Total: 6800 The above list is not complete, but should serve as a rough impression. If I have forgotten anyone on either side, it is not by intent. During the first days of the invasion, ED faced Smash, Atlas and Roadkill. Our allies were at the tie otherwise occupied, making the odds ED + IRC (2000) versus Smash + RK + Atlas (5000). As we had explained to us several times we are of course carebears, so of the 2000 in IRC and ED, a substantial part must be industrials and not at all capable of PVP. So depending on your estimate of the level of carebearism, numbers were either 2.5:1 against us or massively worse. We had been informed help would be available in a few days. So we did what we could to delay until we had our allies helping out. During this time a good many of us had a lot of fun in smaller skirmishes, whilst avoiding the larger confrontation. I know I did. The rest, as they say, is history. Those numbers are meaningless, hth.
pershphanie CyberDyne Industries Carpe Universitas	Posted - 2008.06.19 08:04:00 - [193] Originally by: Menellaix smash smack is the worst smack smash sobbing is pretty hilarious tho What's really hilarious is that when the north needed smash/rk to back them up they were always loyal to the north. Then when Smash/RK needed the favor returned you have halfwits from RZR making comments like "At the official leader of NAP fest 2008 Razor decline your request for help, camping pf- in syndicate it way more fun". Smash/rk was always backed you up in full force when the north was attacked. They whole-heartedly backed your anti-bob crusades as well. The least you could do is not smack them when they were dying. Real classy guys.... Peoke - I believe this is where I should be saying "I told you this is exactly what would happen".
xRevolveRx Masters of Mayhem	Posted - 2008.06.19 08:12:00 - [194] Originally by: pershphanie Originally by: Menellaix smash smack is the worst smack smash sobbing is pretty hilarious tho What's really hilarious is that when the north needed smash/rk to back them up they were always loyal to the north. Then when Smash/RK needed the favor returned you have halfwits from RZR making comments like "At the official leader of NAP fest 2008 Razor decline your request for help, camping pf- in syndicate it way more fun". Smash/rk was always backed you up in full force when the north was attacked. They whole-heartedly backed your anti-bob crusades as well. The least you could do is not smack them when they were dying. Real classy guys.... Peoke - I believe this is where I should be saying "I told you this is exactly what would happen". They are pets to RA and won't do anything to **** them off.
Martin VanBuren GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.06.19 08:22:00 - [195] Originally by: pershphanie Originally by: Menellaix smash smack is the worst smack smash sobbing is pretty hilarious tho Smash/rk was always backed you up in full force when the north was attacked. They whole-heartedly backed your anti-bob crusades as well. no they didnt
pershphanie CyberDyne Industries Carpe Universitas	Posted - 2008.06.19 08:26:00 - [196] Edited by: pershphanie on 19/06/2008 08:26:05 Originally by: Martin VanBuren Originally by: pershphanie Originally by: Menellaix smash smack is the worst smack smash sobbing is pretty hilarious tho Smash/rk was always backed you up in full force when the north was attacked. They whole-heartedly backed your anti-bob crusades as well. no they didnt im not talking about GF/russians. I'm talking about them backing the north. they did. i was there. I saw it. Can't tell me otherwise.
arghy steelwill GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.06.19 08:57:00 - [197] Edited by: arghy steelwill on 19/06/2008 08:57:54 CCP..... why must you delete all my posts when i hit reply THIS IS DISCRIMNATION! I HAVE RIGHTS! AND VIEWS, I WISH TO SHARE THEM WITH OTHERS! Your signature exceeds the maximum allowed filesize of 24000 bytes -Navigator ([email protected])
hope3434 Federal Navy Academy	Posted - 2008.06.24 03:03:00 - [198] Originally by: xRevolveRx Originally by: pershphanie Originally by: Menellaix smash smack is the worst smack smash sobbing is pretty hilarious tho What's really hilarious is that when the north needed smash/rk to back them up they were always loyal to the north. Then when Smash/RK needed the favor returned you have halfwits from RZR making comments like "At the official leader of NAP fest 2008 Razor decline your request for help, camping pf- in syndicate it way more fun". Smash/rk was always backed you up in full force when the north was attacked. They whole-heartedly backed your anti-bob crusades as well. The least you could do is not smack them when they were dying. Real classy guys.... Peoke - I believe this is where I should be saying "I told you this is exactly what would happen". They are pets to RA and won't do anything to **** them off. this
Vinata GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.06.24 03:47:00 - [199] Originally by: ***zilla The best diplomacy in game is to have bigger guns and more of them. In this regard after years in Geminate we have failed The best diplomacy in game is to not have one of your most prominent members everyone off. Trust us, Goons know a lot about prominent members **ing everyone off.
Idaeus GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.06.24 03:50:00 - [200] Originally by: Vinata The best diplomacy in game is to not have one of your most prominent members ** everyone off. Trust us, Goons know a lot about prominent members **ing everyone off.
Darius JOHNSON	Posted - 2008.06.24 03:51:00 - [201] Originally by: pershphanie im not talking about GF/russians. I'm talking about them backing the north. they did. i was there. I saw it. Can't tell me otherwise. Who cares? Originally by: Jade Constantine You might be a big man on the internets Darius but prepare to be laughed at quite a lot in Europe. -- Illaria's CSM
Vinata GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.06.24 03:53:00 - [202] Originally by: Idaeus Originally by: Vinata The best diplomacy in game is to not have one of your most prominent members ** everyone off. Trust us, Goons know a lot about prominent members **ing everyone off.
Koronos Interstellar eXodus R0ADKILL	Posted - 2008.06.24 04:35:00 - [203] Originally by: hope3434 this Thanks so much for digging up this thread for your valuable contribution.
pershphanie CyberDyne Industries Carpe Universitas	Posted - 2008.06.24 05:05:00 - [204] Originally by: Darius JOHNSON Originally by: pershphanie im not talking about GF/russians. I'm talking about them backing the north. they did. i was there. I saw it. Can't tell me otherwise. Who cares? No one is forcing you to read anything. When someone says something that I know first hand to be incorrect I correct them. Don't like it? Don't read it or respond to it. It's really that simple. At the very least my point contained an account of something that happened. How many people do you think need to know that you don't care about what I wrote?
Tiger Delivery THE INTERNET.	Posted - 2008.06.24 05:40:00 - [205] Originally by: pershphanie Originally by: Darius JOHNSON Originally by: pershphanie im not talking about GF/russians. I'm talking about them backing the north. they did. i was there. I saw it. Can't tell me otherwise. Who cares? No one is forcing you to read anything. When someone says something that I know first hand to be incorrect I correct them. Don't like it? Don't read it or respond to it. It's really that simple. At the very least my point contained an account of something that happened. How many people do you think need to know that you don't care about what I wrote? who cares?
Fred0 Cutting Edge Incorporated RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2008.06.24 05:52:00 - [206] Originally by: pershphanie im not talking about GF/russians. I'm talking about them backing the north. they did. i was there. I saw it. Can't tell me otherwise. They did. Then again alot of us flew with goons and ra much later after that. And flying with the goons is something that alot of RZR actually liked. All this while Smash (Peoke) went after RAWR with a verbal sledgehammer saying BOB we're better friends and he was gonna get them to help Smash instead. At which point I think we all just sat back and laughed. The part that stings in this is ofcourse RK because they are pretty cool :( --- "Cutting Edge 4 Life"
pershphanie CyberDyne Industries Carpe Universitas	Posted - 2008.06.24 06:01:00 - [207] Originally by: Fred0 Originally by: pershphanie im not talking about GF/russians. I'm talking about them backing the north. they did. i was there. I saw it. Can't tell me otherwise. They did. Then again alot of us flew with goons and ra much later after that. And flying with the goons is something that alot of RZR actually liked. All this while Smash (Peoke) went after RAWR with a verbal sledgehammer saying BOB we're better friends and he was gonna get them to help Smash instead. At which point I think we all just sat back and laughed. The part that stings in this is ofcourse RK because they are pretty cool :( That's a pretty reasonable explanation. I take back all the bad things I said about you guys (in this thread only ). I wasn't aware of the internal stuff, just what I saw.
Zhula Guixgrixks Increasing Success by Lowering Expectations	Posted - 2008.06.24 09:26:00 - [208] Edited by: Zhula Guixgrixks on 24/06/2008 09:27:39 Drone regions are infamous for backstabing, whining and manufacturing. So backstab someone and sell more caps to hire guns. Whining on CAOD will not help.
Cat Funt	Posted - 2008.06.24 13:57:00 - [209] Edited by: Cat Funt on 24/06/2008 13:58:19 Originally by: pershphanie Originally by: Menellaix smash smack is the worst smack smash sobbing is pretty hilarious tho What's really hilarious is that when the north needed smash/rk to back them up they were always loyal to the north. Then when Smash/RK needed the favor returned you have halfwits from RZR making comments like "At the official leader of NAP fest 2008 Razor decline your request for help, camping pf- in syndicate it way more fun". Smash/rk was always backed you up in full force when the north was attacked. They whole-heartedly backed your anti-bob crusades as well. The least you could do is not smack them when they were dying. Real classy guys.... Peoke - I believe this is where I should be saying "I told you this is exactly what would happen". Are you the douche bag who backstabbed his alliance and changed sides during one of the conflicts up north?
Veldya Guristari Freedom Fighters	Posted - 2008.06.24 14:46:00 - [210] Edited by: Veldya on 24/06/2008 14:47:07 Originally by: Zhula Guixgrixks Edited by: Zhula Guixgrixks on 24/06/2008 09:27:39 Drone regions are infamous for backstabing, whining and manufacturing. So backstab someone and sell more caps to hire guns. Whining on CAOD will not help. Leadership is critical. Alliance relationships are quite complex, especially for a coalition of alliances. NC got on well with Roadkill but weren't very close with Smash for reasons already mentioned. Smash had to resolve their own issues with other entities and the NC isn't an iron girdle where you can fob off a lot of people and then expect the consequences of your actions to be everyone's problem. The coalition doesn't dictate over individual members, alliances are largely free to do what they want to do. Razor behaves differently to IRON to Pure, to MM to Hydra, etc. Issues that are important to the coalition as a whole are issues for the coalition to handle. Those facing the consequences of their individual choices are not the responsibility of the whole coalition. If say I was a coalition member and I decided to **** off say Red Alliance to the point they wanted to annihilate me, it would be an issue between me and them, that would be the consequences of my actions. I hate to see alliances get sodomized, especially good ones, but most of the critical failures are due to problematic leadership issues.

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