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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 2 post(s) |
HadHaFangs
The Collective
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Posted - 2008.06.20 05:09:00 -
[1]
Having recently upgraded my pc security to Zone Alarm internet security suite, last night when i opened eve, a warning message popped up from zone alarm warning me that CCP EXEfile is trying to monitor mouse movements, keystrokes on my computer. I will provide a screenshot later today, but can someone from CCP please explain whats happening as it is very worrying that a potential key logging attempt is being made by CCP, as this violates my personal information and security.
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Cmdr FlipFlop
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Posted - 2008.06.20 05:12:00 -
[2]
This is worrying indeed as I do my banking online and I do not have something like zone alarm, could CCP please explain?
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Surfin's PlunderBunny
Metafarmers
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Posted - 2008.06.20 05:12:00 -
[3]
oh noes! CCP is trying to get my account info! 
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Little JitaGirl
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Posted - 2008.06.20 05:13:00 -
[4]
Well no **** it watches mouse movements and keystrokes - how else would it know what you're doing!?
Did I just fall for a troll post? Could someone really be that daft?
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El Sombrero
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Posted - 2008.06.20 05:13:00 -
[5]
Yeah! How dare CCP do something as outrageous as keeping track of where your keyboard and mouse are! I mean, the computer should totally know what we want to do without us pressing any keys or moving the mouse!
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HadHaFangs
The Collective
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Posted - 2008.06.20 05:15:00 -
[6]
really, now. seeing as i've been running eve with zone alarm for over a month this is the first time that this warning has ever come up.
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Viktor Fyretracker
Caldari Provisions
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Posted - 2008.06.20 05:18:00 -
[7]
maybe they have done a minor patch? minor changes to an exe make programs like Zone Alarm go ape****. its why i dont run any monitoring or scanning programs on my MMORPG PC. they all flip out because MMOs change too much.
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Cmdr FlipFlop
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Posted - 2008.06.20 05:19:00 -
[8]
 Originally by: El Sombrero
Yeah! How dare CCP do something as outrageous as keeping track of where your keyboard and mouse are! I mean, the computer should totally know what we want to do without us pressing any keys or moving the mouse!
Ok so you are fine with people getting personal logon information for mmm... i dont know something like banking,paypal account etc....
And no they should not have to know , that is the operating systems job, and not the client exe
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El Sombrero
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Posted - 2008.06.20 05:21:00 -
[9]
Originally by: HadHaFangs
really, now. seeing as i've been running eve with zone alarm for over a month this is the first time that this warning has ever come up.
Right. Did the warning come up just after you patched? or right after you updated Zone Alarm? or right after you installed another program?
There are many reasons for this to happen, and the best way to find out the cause, is to pinpoint the moment when this happened. In your first post, you say "having recently updated to", in the post i quoted, you say you've been running Zone Alarm for over a month. So right there, there is a disparity on your time frame.
Further, Zone Alarm likes to keep track of program versions, and warns you that "program XYZ has been modified since it was last run" so it could be that as well right after a patch.
As i said, there are many reasons why the warning could have come up, including potential false positives from heuristic analysis, so your best bet is to first pinpoint the time and system state when the message 1st popped up.
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El Sombrero
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Posted - 2008.06.20 05:25:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Cmdr FlipFlop
And no they should not have to know , that is the operating systems job, and not the client exe
Without knowing the methodology of detection from Zone Alarm, and wihout knowing exactly what caused the error message, or the exact text of the message, knowing this is impossible. Also, without access to the source code of eve, you wouldn't know how the client is receiving it's input data, or how a program like Zone Alarm determines how whichever program is receiving said data. Hell, if ZA is listening to the hardware input, i'd be just as concerned as if Eve was.
but we don't know now, do we?
besides, you shouldn't be running anything but the browser window with your online banking information, and have no other active browser windows or tabs whenever you are using a secure connection anyway. That is, if you are so concerned about security.
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HadHaFangs
The Collective
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Posted - 2008.06.20 05:48:00 -
[11]
get your finger out your ***
"recently" doesnt necessarily mean with in the last day.my time frame has no discrepansies, stop looking for faults and lets deal with the issue at hand.
firstly, this is not the only online game i play, and some of which get updated a hell
of a lot more often than eve, during which at no point has ZA moaned about the programe having being changed. But to answer your question, there was no change that took place on my machine, as i also declined the optional patch that was released. neither was ZA updated within the last 24 hrs.
The fact of the matter is that, there was suspicious code within the eve client that generated an alarm. this alarm needs to be addressed.
so according to you, it should just be ignored, so then whoever develops a game is in the perfect position to monitor whatever they like, as their software is already on your computer.
internet banking is just a concern raised by one individual, there are lots of other potential personal security risks that can arise from this.
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Furb Killer
USC Militia
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Posted - 2008.06.20 05:54:00 -
[12]
Every decent internet banking system is immune to keyloggers. (allthough i heard american banks use static passwords for internet banking, which is pretty stupid).
According to your logic we should also make a topic everytime a firewall blocks the access of eve to the internet, the firewall also detected something suspicious 
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Cmdr FlipFlop
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Posted - 2008.06.20 05:58:00 -
[13]
Originally by: El Sombrero
Originally by: Cmdr FlipFlop
And no they should not have to know , that is the operating systems job, and not the client exe
Without knowing the methodology of detection from Zone Alarm, and wihout knowing exactly what caused the error message, or the exact text of the message, knowing this is impossible. Also, without access to the source code of eve, you wouldn't know how the client is receiving it's input data, or how a program like Zone Alarm determines how whichever program is receiving said data. Hell, if ZA is listening to the hardware input, i'd be just as concerned as if Eve was.
but we don't know now, do we?
besides, you shouldn't be running anything but the browser window with your online banking information, and have no other active browser windows or tabs whenever you are using a secure connection anyway. That is, if you are so concerned about security.
mmmm...intresting so what you are saying is that, ignoring all messages from ZA or similar software is the way to go, and yes you are right we dont know how EVE.exe handle message etc and that was what the post is about (read the topic again) it asks for an answer from CCP denying\acknowledgeing this statement.
You can ignore messages from your anti-virus\malware software, that is if you have these software installed, but I will not.
BTW an .exe can exploit vunrabalities in IE and inject malicious code into IE even if the exe does not run IE will still be infected, what makes this scary is that the exe is a trusted exe.I am not saying this is the case with eve, I can think of one reason why they would want to log key\mouse strokes, but this is still invasion of privacy.
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InDa Hood
Forum Trolls Inc.
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Posted - 2008.06.20 05:59:00 -
[14]
Not only is CCP logging your keys and watching your mouse....
They are stealing food from your refrigerator too.
Jerks stole my leftover pizza 
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madjacket
A Few Good Men.
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Posted - 2008.06.20 06:00:00 -
[15]
Originally by: HadHaFangs
get your finger out your ***
"recently" doesnt necessarily mean with in the last day.my time frame has no discrepansies, stop looking for faults and lets deal with the issue at hand.
firstly, this is not the only online game i play, and some of which get updated a hell
of a lot more often than eve, during which at no point has ZA moaned about the programe having being changed. But to answer your question, there was no change that took place on my machine, as i also declined the optional patch that was released. neither was ZA updated within the last 24 hrs.
The fact of the matter is that, there was suspicious code within the eve client that generated an alarm. this alarm needs to be addressed.
so according to you, it should just be ignored, so then whoever develops a game is in the perfect position to monitor whatever they like, as their software is already on your computer.
internet banking is just a concern raised by one individual, there are lots of other potential personal security risks that can arise from this.
I would say take your computer to a qualifyed computer repair and have them clean the virus from your system
them **** sites are just not worth it :)
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Furb Killer
USC Militia
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Posted - 2008.06.20 06:02:00 -
[16]
Quote:
mmmm...intresting so what you are saying is that, ignoring all messages from ZA or similar software is the way to go, and yes you are right we dont know how EVE.exe handle message etc and that was what the post is about (read the topic again) it asks for an answer from CCP denying\acknowledgeing this statement.
That is what everyone does. Firewall/other protection asks: Do you want to allow eve to do stuff. Everyone says yes. Otherwise it doesnt work...
Wait, assuming this is CCP's evil plan for world domination (soon), you think they tell you they just installed a key logger on everyones computer?
Btw, what did you do, allow eve to continue?
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Asantte
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Posted - 2008.06.20 06:03:00 -
[17]
Originally by: InDa Hood
Not only is CCP logging your keys and watching your mouse....
They are stealing food from your refrigerator too.
Jerks stole my leftover pizza
oh hey! that explains the missing beer!
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Cmdr FlipFlop
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Posted - 2008.06.20 06:03:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Furb Killer
Every decent internet banking system is immune to keyloggers. (allthough i heard american banks use static passwords for internet banking, which is pretty stupid).
According to your logic we should also make a topic everytime a firewall blocks the access of eve to the internet, the firewall also detected something suspicious
you seem to be very naive, and according to your logic we should ignore all messages from anti-virus\malware software, hey thats cool virus`s doesnt exist, malware doesnt exist ....damn I am going to remove all anti virus apps from our servers at work ....thank you for clearing that up...
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Jonathos
The Scope
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Posted - 2008.06.20 06:10:00 -
[19]
I used Zone Alarms for just over 2 years before I ditched it.
Now,I didnt kill it with fire because it was crap,I got rid of it because it was TOO good,overkill so to speak.
Yes,not one virus/logger/bot ever traced its way into my system,but the constant warnings/blocks about everything you look at/play really gave me the ****s in the end.Its really good software,but not so good if you're online gaming,hell even IM's and TS/Vent constantly were blocked and quarantined.It seems to be more of a high end business type of antivirus more than for personal computer use.
As for the actual warnings you receive,yeah as others have stated,the game does need to know your mouse and key movements,and I think you'll find ZA has updated itself along the way or something similar and certain settings have changed.
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El Sombrero
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Posted - 2008.06.20 06:14:00 -
[20]
Originally by: HadHaFangs
get your finger out your ***
"recently" doesnt necessarily mean with in the last day.my time frame has no discrepansies, stop looking for faults and lets deal with the issue at hand.
I'm not looking for faults, i'm looking to see what has changed that caused the alert.
Quote:
firstly, this is not the only online game i play, and some of which get updated a hell
of a lot more often than eve, during which at no point has ZA moaned about the programe having being changed. But to answer your question, there was no change that took place on my machine, as i also declined the optional patch that was released. neither was ZA updated within the last 24 hrs.
So, out of the blue, an alert pops up, and nothing changed in the system in the last 24 hours?
Quote:
The fact of the matter is that, there was suspicious code within the eve client that generated an alarm. this alarm needs to be addressed.
There was an error message generated, out of the blue, in your system, and so far it's an isolated incident. But yes, i am interested on why it was generated, which is why i asked more questions.
Quote:
so according to you, it should just be ignored, so then whoever develops a game is in the perfect position to monitor whatever they like, as their software is already on your computer.
No, according to me, more data should be collected. You presented a small ammount of data, and so far no others have corroborated similar issues, so it's isolated to your machine, and you claim that no software changes whatsoever have ocurred within 24 hours of the error appearing.
Quote:
internet banking is just a concern raised by one individual, there are lots of other potential personal security risks that can arise from this.
Yes there are. And i haven't received any such warnings myself, so either something is funky with your system, or something funky with the detection on my system, or you are an isolated case, or other people haven't started reporting their issues yet.
Or perhaps Zone Alarm reported a false positive? is this error happening everytime you start eve? only one time? Has anybody else reported similar issues?
I'm not saying "you are freaking out over nothing" i'm saying "let's try and find out why this is happening, has X Y or Z been a factor?"
or is it that you are so important that CCP should open an investigation on your specific machine for an isolated case with no other supporting data?
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HadHaFangs
The Collective
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Posted - 2008.06.20 06:30:00 -
[21]
Well let me put it this way, the day before. eve was running fine, no alerts from ZA at all. yesterday, after the patch was released (which i never applied), ZA started complaining about the exe attempting to monitor mouse movements and log keystrokes.
so during the space of 24hrs, that is the only difference that i can see from one day to the next.
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Victor Valka
Kissaki Corporation
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Posted - 2008.06.20 06:39:00 -
[22]
Duh.
Of course and application will monitor your mouse and keyboard. Or rather, it will listen to the kernel (through WinAPI in case of Windows OS).
Suggestion: Ditch Zone Alarm.
Originally by: Roxanna Kell
You are insane.
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ZinderX500
RAZOR Alliance
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Posted - 2008.06.20 06:41:00 -
[23]
Thank god i installed Vista x64 and no Zone Alarm is available for it.
Finally i managed to get rid of this stupid bloatware.
_____________________
Shelley Godfrey: Have you lost your mind!?
Baltar: That's an interesting question, and one I pose to myself on a regular basis. |
Riho
Mercenary Forces
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Posted - 2008.06.20 06:42:00 -
[24]
Originally by: HadHaFangs
Having recently upgraded my pc security to Zone Alarm internet security suite, last night when i opened eve, a warning message popped up from zone alarm warning me that CCP EXEfile is trying to monitor mouse movements, keystrokes on my computer. I will provide a screenshot later today, but can someone from CCP please explain whats happening as it is very worrying that a potential key logging attempt is being made by CCP, as this violates my personal information and security.
lol... ofcourse the client is monitoring your mouse movements and keyboard strokes... how the **** are you supposed to play if your mouse and keyboard dont work ingame.
sheesh... some ppl :P
----------------------------------
Fighting for Minmatar o7
Yes... this is my main.
Extreme Troll Slayer...
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OnceUpon ATime
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Posted - 2008.06.20 06:43:00 -
[25]
lol you use zonealarm
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HadHaFangs
The Collective
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Posted - 2008.06.20 06:46:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Victor Valka
Duh.
Of course and application will monitor your mouse and keyboard. Or rather, it will listen to the kernel (through WinAPI in case of Windows OS).
Suggestion: Ditch Zone Alarm.
wow, the smart***'s just keep on crawling out the woodwork.. read the entire thread before you decide to impart your pearls of wisdom, or lack there of.
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DJ Geist
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Posted - 2008.06.20 06:47:00 -
[27]
I get this warning from zone alarm as well, and it concerns me as well. I think most people in this thread are being ridiculously glib: "Ignore what your firewall says!", etc. You folks are ridiculous. Some apps trigger such a response from zonealarm, yet many other apps do not (hence the whole "well you use your keyboard and mouse to use a program, any program" response becomes less convincing as a dsimissal: why does eve in particular trigger such a response from zonealarm out of the pool of many programs out there?
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TARG AK
State Protectorate
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Posted - 2008.06.20 06:48:00 -
[28]
It is called a false positive.
eve.exe is not a key logger, zonealarm is wrong. ZA defaults are not good for Internet gaming. Ditch ZA and buy a good router with a firewall and use good anti-virus software that is updated all the time and you will be fine.
Don't download crap and stay away from non trusted sites, common sense is your best friend on the Internet.
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Riho
Mercenary Forces
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Posted - 2008.06.20 06:48:00 -
[29]
Edited by: Riho on 20/06/2008 06:51:31
Originally by: HadHaFangs
Originally by: Victor Valka
Duh.
Of course and application will monitor your mouse and keyboard. Or rather, it will listen to the kernel (through WinAPI in case of Windows OS).
Suggestion: Ditch Zone Alarm.
wow, the smart***'s just keep on crawling out the woodwork.. read the entire thread before you decide to impart your pearls of wisdom, or lack there of.
you are using zonealarm... that thing is soo random no wonder it gives you a warning now. False positive.
unless you downloaded some crap from some random virus infested site then it might have hooked onto all of your .exe files.
CCP does not have keyloggers in their software to steal your info. if they did.. they would be out of business faster than a american can think mcdonalds
anyways zonealarm is rather useless anyways....
Originally by: TARG AK
It is called a false positive.
eve.exe is not a key logger, zonealarm is wrong. ZA defaults are not good for Internet gaming. Ditch ZA and buy a good router with a firewall and use good anti-virus software that is updated all the time and you will be fine.
Don't download crap and stay away from non trusted sites, common sense is your best friend on the Internet.
this man speaks the truth
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Fighting for Minmatar o7
Yes... this is my main.
Extreme Troll Slayer...
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Neddy Fox
Paxton Industries
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Posted - 2008.06.20 06:57:00 -
[30]
Originally by: TARG AK
It is called a false positive.
eve.exe is not a key logger, zonealarm is wrong. ZA defaults are not good for Internet gaming. Ditch ZA and buy a good router with a firewall and use good anti-virus software that is updated all the time and you will be fine.
Don't download crap and stay away from non trusted sites, common sense is your best friend on the Internet.
This.
Same as programs like Radmin (which I use to monitor my gameservers), which gets flagged and deleted repeatedly by all kinds of carebear anti-virus programs, which will delete it it even when it's set to "ignore".
False positives do happen.
* CCP puts themself to the grave if they even tried to do this, so they don't. They're not stupid.
* You should ditch ZA because it's a friggin annoyance.
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