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Who is taking a break from EVE for Warhammer?

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Hieronimus Rex Minmatar Infinitus Sapientia	Posted - 2008.09.18 22:09:00 - [1] ...A supposedly pvp-centric game. I'm just hoping it won't be pay to play beta like AoC. I certainly am.
An Anarchyyt Gallente Battlestars GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.09.18 22:18:00 - [2] While I do believe Warhammer is a real good MMO, and would be playing it if I could, PvP in WAR is nothing like PvP in Eve. Originally by: CCP Wrangler Second, a gentile is a non jewish person
Danton Marcellus Nebula Rasa Holdings	Posted - 2008.09.18 22:29:00 - [3] Not me, was at the gates with AoC, learned from my mistake, will not be in the first wave this time around. Should/would/could have, HAVE you chav! Also Known As
Artemis Rose Varion Galactic Accord Corporate Enterprise Syndicate	Posted - 2008.09.18 22:38:00 - [4] Lulz Not me, doesn't quite have the starship captain feel. *** Currently Playing: Trolls from Outer Space Current Equipment: VISAcard chain mail, +2 Amulet of Epic Whine, Self Banstick +2 WTB: +666 E-peen killboard stats
Krecian Gallente United Trade Coalition	Posted - 2008.09.18 22:40:00 - [5] I will be, but I won't be canceling Eve either. Eve is too unique to give up easily. But yah, got my first taste of PvP in Warhammer and it brought back fond memories of DAOC... so I'm hooked already. --------- "The first rock thrown again, welcome to hell little saint. Mother Gia in slaughter, welcome to paradise soldier." -Nightwish, Planet Hell
Synapse Archae Amarr Demonic Retribution G00DFELLAS	Posted - 2008.09.18 22:44:00 - [6] So they added a little PVP to Wow and tried to resell it. Big deal. They didn't add half as much PVP as they should have. Market competition, industrial pvp, killing in towns, and player alliance wars are all notably missing. Even if they added ALL the PVP that eve has to WoW, that still wouldnt make it half the game Eve is, because it will never have the scale that eve has, or the players. Or the skill system, or the diversity in fittings. No, I'm staying right here. Originally by: CCP Garthagk While these forums may not give you everything that you want, they will usually let you post.
Ethen Bejorn Pestilent Industries Amalgamated	Posted - 2008.09.18 22:59:00 - [7] Maybe in 3 months if the game is still alive. I won't ever buy a new MMOG in the first few months after release. Too many of them suck terribly. At least most have betas these days so you can see the suck for yourself before it is even for sale.
Sheriff Jones Amarr Clinical Experiment	Posted - 2008.09.18 23:04:00 - [8] There are other MMOs in EVE? My opinions represent the opinions of my corporation completely. I'm the CEO damnit.
Banana Torres Look Ma I did a Test	Posted - 2008.09.18 23:08:00 - [9] Nope, very pretty and all that. But the combat was too slow paced, it is not good that I could read the forums while fighting to find out why I was doing so little damage. If you are into the Warhammer universe I am sure you will enjoy it. Like I enjoy even the crappiest of Star Trek Games, cause I'm a Trekkie.
Jack Gilligan THE MuPPeT FaCTOrY KIA Alliance	Posted - 2008.09.18 23:10:00 - [10] Warhammer is nothing more than another WOW clone. Pass. Give me something that is a Pre-CU Star Wars Galaxies clone, and I might be interested. My opinions are my own and do not necessarily represent those of my corp or alliance.
Lily Sarman Ratio Decidendi	Posted - 2008.09.18 23:10:00 - [11] It looks like a bad version of WoW. Its going to suffer from the same problem that WoW did by creating various roles in the game that all need to be filled for its content to be fully explored. This is a problem because there are always some roles that are going to be more popular than others and if its anything like WoW the damage dealers are going to be overly abundent and the healers/tanks are going to be few and far between. Enjoy sitting around for hours doing nothing much because you can't find the right people to get whatever done. ------------------------------------------- Cheerfulness in the face of adversity
Sidus Isaacs	Posted - 2008.09.18 23:17:00 - [12] Originally by: Hieronimus Rex ...A supposedly pvp-centric game. I'm just hoping it won't be pay to play beta like AoC. I certainly am. Warhammer told me to "pick a side" during the very first web page. I refuse to pick a side (like it was some stupid WoW allaince/hord clone). Besides, EVE is space, and space is awsome. not space = not awsome.
Pan Crastus Anti-Metagaming League	Posted - 2008.09.18 23:24:00 - [13] Edited by: Pan Crastus on 18/09/2008 23:24:22 I am installing it now because frankly, if one is as opinionated about stuff like that as I am, then one has to try everything. ;-P First impressions: the website is a bit empty, the character descriptions remind me very much of Requiem (a big disappointment), too much shiny stuff, too little substance. Let's hope the game has its strong points elsewhere (other than the class selection I mean). How to PVP: 1. buy ISK with GTCs, 2. fit cloak, learn aggro mechanics, 3. buy second account for metagaming
Grath Telkin Amarr The Illuminati. Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2008.09.18 23:53:00 - [14] Originally by: Sidus Isaacs Warhammer told me to "pick a side" during the very first web page. I refuse to pick a side (like it was some stupid WoW allaince/hord clone). So you didn't pick Caldari, Minnie, Amarr, or Galent? See how stupid you look right now??
Shagrath Neptune Series of Tubes	Posted - 2008.09.19 00:06:00 - [15] As much as I liked DAOC, what made me not want to play War was when i learned that the Devs caved to the whiners (already) and decided to not allow any stealth classes in the game. I like to play solo frequently and remember how difficult it was to pvp with a visible character in DAOC where everyone zergs or 8-man. Although Vamps were halfway decent at it once you got the hang of them.
Overseer Aliena Caldari Lord of Wars	Posted - 2008.09.19 00:12:00 - [16] Quote: Even if they added ALL the PVP that eve has to WoW, that still wouldnt make it half the game Eve is, because it will never have the scale that eve has, or the players. um..... Originally by: Shagrath Neptune As much as I liked DAOC, what made me not want to play War was when i learned that the Devs caved to the whiners (already) and decided to not allow any stealth classes in the game. I like to play solo frequently and remember how difficult it was to pvp with a visible character in DAOC where everyone zergs or 8-man. Although Vamps were halfway decent at it once you got the hang of them. I remember the people like you on the vn boards. Always complaining about being zerged down in a realm versus realm game because you were alone. My favorites though were the people who complained about losing because somebody used their class ability. If they hadn't done it, I would have beat their ass. The solo people in that game were a joke and the vn boards were loaded with punchlines.
Siberys Gallente Nebula Sharks	Posted - 2008.09.19 00:24:00 - [17] What we need is a 40k MMO.
Micheal Dietrich Caldari Terradyne Networks	Posted - 2008.09.19 00:29:00 - [18] Originally by: Siberys What we need is a 40k MMO. Bam! Your wish is granted!
Jane Vladmir Gallente Warmongers	Posted - 2008.09.19 00:34:00 - [19] Ahem..
Sidrat Flush Caldari Diversity 101	Posted - 2008.09.19 00:37:00 - [20] I'll be playing eve (or at least reading the forum :p ). Having looked at the FAQ, and being a fan of Warhammer in general (although obviously I prefer the 40K story), I find it virtually the same as every other MMO that's NOT eve. Heck it could be a repackaged Oblivion Clone for all the difference it would mean. Why has no other company copied the skill training devised by CCP that means characters learn things in real time rather than grinding all the hours god sends and then some? Why are they still forcing you to choose a career at birth with no hope (correct me if I'm wrong) of changing your mind later on. This is why I like Eve. I don't need to select a server from a list of thirty or so. I don't need to pick a class and be forced in that role forever (although some ice mining ops can feel that way) and I certainly don't need to log in to advance the character as long as I log in to change the skill once it's done. I don't have to use guns to be expert at using guns, no matter how many hours I mine I won't get better at mining if I'm training guns so it's all good. WHY OH WHY does the industry stick with the Level 1-40, Class, Roles, Secondary Profession and this is the loot and equipment you'll get to use. It's fine in single player games, as long as the story is good (I'm thinking oblivion of course), but in a MMO there should be something more. In a "Guild" of ten people, you should be able to say "don't worry guys, I'll go in as scout today" or even "Hey I'll bring in the cov op for a change". Oh the shame of it. Every time an MMO is released with the same grinding level schema that forces you to select a profession the better Eve gets. Thanks CCP. Life is about memories the more the better. http://lifeisexperience.freeforums.org (because it's a small corp)
Shagrath Neptune Series of Tubes	Posted - 2008.09.19 00:40:00 - [21] Edited by: Shagrath Neptune on 19/09/2008 00:45:22 Originally by: Overseer Aliena Originally by: Shagrath Neptune As much as I liked DAOC, what made me not want to play War was when i learned that the Devs caved to the whiners (already) and decided to not allow any stealth classes in the game. I like to play solo frequently and remember how difficult it was to pvp with a visible character in DAOC where everyone zergs or 8-man. Although Vamps were halfway decent at it once you got the hang of them. I remember the people like you on the vn boards. Always complaining about being zerged down in a realm versus realm game because you were alone. My favorites though were the people who complained about losing because somebody used their class ability. If they hadn't done it, I would have beat their ass. The solo people in that game were a joke and the vn boards were loaded with punchlines. I never once complained about being zerged down or playing alone or someone using a class ability. Link? I agree that VN was a big joke though. There were quite a few idiots who ran their mouths without having all of the facts or knowing who they were really talking to. Sort of like you just did here. btw you sound like someone who constantly died to the stealth zergs in DAOC and think all stealthers were bad people in real life. I bet you hate gatecamps in EvE too? See? I can make ignorant assumptions too.
Synapse Archae Amarr Demonic Retribution G00DFELLAS	Posted - 2008.09.19 00:43:00 - [22] Originally by: Micheal Dietrich Originally by: Siberys What we need is a 40k MMO. Bam! Your wish is granted! If you can actually deep strike, like from orbit, I'll be interested. Originally by: CCP Garthagk While these forums may not give you everything that you want, they will usually let you post.
Mankirks Wife	Posted - 2008.09.19 00:52:00 - [23] Edited by: Mankirks Wife on 19/09/2008 00:53:03 Originally by: Sidrat Flush WHY OH WHY does the industry stick with the Level 1-40, Class, Roles, Secondary Profession and this is the loot and equipment you'll get to use. Two reasons that I can think of... First is that.. well.. all those things pretty much define (normal) RPGs. It's expected, especially from fantasy games. The second is that people are still trying to build a better WoW, though it seems the message seems to finally be getting through to devs and investors that MMOs aren't like other games where you can wait a month for it to get old, release your clone, and do just fine. In terms of longevity MMO games are more like the old pen-and-paper RPGs than video games, hell even Realms of Despair is still going and it's around fifteen years old now. Only MMO I ever played that actually closed was Underlight, and only because it was mismanaged into the ground. ---
Shagrath Neptune Series of Tubes	Posted - 2008.09.19 01:07:00 - [24] Originally by: Mankirks Wife Edited by: Mankirks Wife on 19/09/2008 00:53:03 Originally by: Sidrat Flush WHY OH WHY does the industry stick with the Level 1-40, Class, Roles, Secondary Profession and this is the loot and equipment you'll get to use. Two reasons that I can think of... First is that.. well.. all those things pretty much define (normal) RPGs. It's expected, especially from fantasy games. The second is that people are still trying to build a better WoW, though it seems the message seems to finally be getting through to devs and investors that MMOs aren't like other games where you can wait a month for it to get old, release your clone, and do just fine. In terms of longevity MMO games are more like the old pen-and-paper RPGs than video games, hell even Realms of Despair is still going and it's around fifteen years old now. Only MMO I ever played that actually closed was Underlight, and only because it was mismanaged into the ground. Back when they started development for War, it was obvious they were going to borrow ideas from WoW and try to improve on them. Mythic did the same thing with Everquest and built DAOC around improving an already existing game. Since WoW took a huge chunk out of DAOC's player base, it isn't that surprising that they would use WoW as a model or "base." These games copy from one another and try to imrove upon the basic ideas. The glimmer of light in War is that Mythic, {unlike Blizzard apparently} has a decent pvp model that has been tried and tested. As long as they don't repeat the mistakes they made in DAOC with nerfs and buffs and adding too many unnecessary classes, it should be fun.
Sidrat Flush Caldari Diversity 101	Posted - 2008.09.19 01:10:00 - [25] I wonder if there's a third way to achieve character progression and ranking/skills and abilities? You've got the basic grinding effort that's popular with the elves and dwarfs and then there's the must gain ISK to buy skills to upgrade character so I can spend 30+ days getting a 2%+2%+2%+2%+2% stacked bonus to a stat or two. All the new (and older) MMO's seem to like the first way, and haven't actually looked at Eve's method, so here's a third way. Buy skill from market. Train skill that effects x attribute. Do stuff that influences x attribute making the skill train a tad faster, in relation to NOT doing whatever it is....... Nope that's a stupid way. Any ideas? I've got none. We all have to grind ISK (or sell GTC's) for the next skill book, ship or uber-mod and I'm sure there's a more interesting way of increasing a characters abilities on a multiplayer....ohhh here's a thought. Maybe, in a corporation type of enclave members can train faster depending on CEO's age and Skill Points, Leadership points, Current DOCKED Location (station likes you, you feel comfortable in the surroundings thus the cerebral cortex works faster). Okay it's not a unique third way, more of a hybrid but it is getting the multi-player element into the MMO experience. And those solo wolves won't mind as there's plenty of corporations that offer that type of gaming style anyway, so it's all good. It is virtually the same as leadership bonus's when fleeted up anyway. Gonna enter the game before it's too late - have fun people. Life is about memories the more the better. http://lifeisexperience.freeforums.org (because it's a small corp)
Trathen Minmatar	Posted - 2008.09.19 01:17:00 - [26] You'll actually be offended at how familiar WAR tries to be to WoW players. _
Vaal Erit Science and Trade Institute	Posted - 2008.09.19 01:25:00 - [27] Warhammer looks fun and I bet some people will try it for a few months. However, just like Guild Wars/PotBS it will be buggy/broken upon release and since it lacks substance ala EVE with it's player driven market and death penalty most EVE players will row bored and come back to EVE or buy the next FOTM game. Frankly imo these pseudo-pvp games are all doomed to failure. For one, you cannot compete with the massive WoW that has battleground PvP and 4-5 years of expansions and a huge community, etc, etc. These new games cannot compete with EVE since they lack EVEs tough PvP. So they end up as mediocre games utilizing only a known name to get subscriptions instead of forming a new MMORPG with new ideas and dedicating themselves to a specific style of play. -- http://desusig.crumplecorn.com/sigs.html
Wrayeth Trans Eve Organization	Posted - 2008.09.19 01:25:00 - [28] Originally by: Jack Gilligan Give me something that is a Pre-CU Star Wars Galaxies clone, and I might be interested. This, only minus player Jedi. -Wrayeth n00b Extraordinaire "Look, pa! I just contributed absolutely nothing to this thread!"
Trathen Minmatar	Posted - 2008.09.19 01:32:00 - [29] Edited by: Trathen on 19/09/2008 01:33:29 Originally by: Vaal Erit Frankly imo these pseudo-pvp games are all doomed to failure. For one, you cannot compete with the massive WoW that has battleground PvP and 4-5 years of expansions and a huge community, etc, etc. WoW does not have a huge community; it has hundreds of pathetically small communities. It also has a whopping selection of 4 battlegrounds and arenas after 5 years, all of which are glaringly similar. WAR aimed to offer what WoW could not, it wasn't some sort of marketing stupidity that anyone can see through. Though I agree once you taste EVE PvP, other games seem so... distant. _
Mike's Salesman	Posted - 2008.09.19 01:52:00 - [30] Edited by: Mike''s Salesman on 19/09/2008 01:52:34 Not a chance.... The only game I heared of that might make me take a break from eve is World of Darkness, besides that I guess I will either stick to eve until the server goes offline or until I die in RL :).
Grath Telkin Amarr The Illuminati. Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2008.09.19 02:41:00 - [31] Originally by: Shagrath Neptune As much as I liked DAOC, what made me not want to play War was when i learned that the Devs caved to the whiners (already) and decided to not allow any stealth classes in the game. I like to play solo frequently and remember how difficult it was to pvp with a visible character in DAOC where everyone zergs or 8-man. Although Vamps were halfway decent at it once you got the hang of them. See, this is my biggest problem. It doesn't really matter at this point if the game is good or bad, because the ignorance is so ingrained here. I'm not sure where you "learned" that they decided not to allow "stealth" classes, but your wrong, they do in fact have them. Instead of following the herd, or reading some OTHER GUY'S experience with the game, wait for the 2 week free trials to hit, and give it a shot yourself. Your "knowledge" is wrong in most posts on this forum, because you read either A) old builds, or B) biased reports. So now you've formed these pre-conceived notions of what the game is like, and how it plays, and none of you have a clue as to the reality of it. The wow clone comments are the best, cause it's got elves in it right. Idiots.
Hopey Gallente L.O.S.T. Industries	Posted - 2008.09.19 02:49:00 - [32] Originally by: Hieronimus Rex ...A supposedly pvp-centric game. I'm just hoping it won't be pay to play beta like AoC. I certainly am. lol :) wait...were you serious? \|~~~~~~~~~~~~~\| Hopey \|~~\| \|~~~~\| CEO and Founder \|~~~~\| \|~L.O.S.T. Industries ~~~~~~~~\|
DigitalCommunist Obsidian Core	Posted - 2008.09.19 02:53:00 - [33] Nope, dislike fantasy games with a passion. Nothing against WAR, but if it was in space, I might care. To me its just another crap hack & slash in a long line stretching from UO. Jumpgate: Evolution and Black Prophecy I am keeping an eye on, though.
Trathen Minmatar	Posted - 2008.09.19 02:58:00 - [34] Edited by: Trathen on 19/09/2008 03:00:30 Originally by: Grath Telkin The wow clone comments are the best, cause it's got elves in it right. Idiots. Nope I tried it already. It has a full copy of WoW in it, including 3-directions for talent trees glaringly similar to WoW (do you want your bright wizard to focus on nuking, dots, or defense?), the melee DPS classes actually use combo points... you build accusations then your judgement does damage based on the number of accusations you have made (up to FIVE)! It even has the familiar "You are feeling rested" message verbatim in towns. But they did what Mythic does: beefed up the PvP options infinitely. That is what a lot of people are looking for, but there are also a lot of people trying to make it sound as if you'dtotally fail if you played a healer in WoW and tried to do it in WAR. _
Grath Telkin Amarr The Illuminati. Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2008.09.19 03:02:00 - [35] Originally by: DigitalCommunist Nope, dislike fantasy games with a passion. Nothing against WAR, but if it was in space, I might care. To me its just another crap hack & slash in a long line stretching from UO. Jumpgate: Evolution and Black Prophecy I am keeping an eye on, though. Black Prophecy looks good, Jumpgate, meh, but I'll try it like I try all games. Frankly, I think my opinion is a better source of what will make me happy, than the opinion of a stranger, so I try most games out personally, and form my own opinion. All I'm saying is stop commenting ignorantly about the game, when most of what they're saying is totally wrong, because they actually have NO idea what the game contains, or is about. I'm reading all the "LOL PVP" posts and laughing, because they just see elves and think WoW. The game actually is significantly based around PvP, not only that, it has places it can be forced on you, and it is rewarded. Also, the "choose a side" dumb*ss is cracking me up, cause you know, he didn't choose a side in EVE or any]thing...
Grath Telkin Amarr The Illuminati. Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2008.09.19 03:06:00 - [36] Originally by: Trathen Edited by: Trathen on 19/09/2008 03:00:30 Originally by: Grath Telkin The wow clone comments are the best, cause it's got elves in it right. Idiots. Nope I tried it already. It has a full copy of WoW in it, including 3-directions for talent trees glaringly similar to WoW (do you want your bright wizard to focus on nuking, dots, or defense?), the melee DPS classes actually use combo points... you build accusations then your judgement does damage based on the number of accusations you have made (up to FIVE)! It even has the familiar "You are feeling rested" message verbatim in towns. But they did what Mythic does: beefed up the PvP options infinitely. That is what a lot of people are looking for, but there are also a lot of people trying to make it sound as if you'dtotally fail if you played a healer in WoW and tried to do it in WAR. You would, most every class in the game is a melee class. Most classes have "points" like you saw. They affect each one different, but if you want to think of them as "combo" points, feel free. Your wrong. Some point build ups on some clases are BAD, resulting in backlashes that hurt you as much as your opponent. Some classes (healers) need to balance dealing damage with healing, or find that thier power in one or the other starts to get weaker. When they said "Test it", did you? Or did you make a guy and say "WoW clone", then turn off your computer?
Trathen Minmatar	Posted - 2008.09.19 03:08:00 - [37] Edited by: Trathen on 19/09/2008 03:08:49 Originally by: Grath Telkin I'm reading all the "LOL PVP" posts and laughing, because they just see elves and think WoW. The game actually is significantly based around PvP, not only that, it has places it can be forced on you, and it is rewarded. What a lot of EVE players usually don't realize (or get into) is that PvP can be meaningful without some sort of time-loss penalty on the victim but it is a bit harder to do. Top tiered PvP teams reach a point where almost every match puts their reputation at stake and that is usually enough for a good rush, like professional athletic championships; they don't get paid less if they lose. And yes I have played it for a while, it is extremely familiar. A couple of extra forms of micromanagement might be a revolution to you, but not to me. _
Grath Telkin Amarr The Illuminati. Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2008.09.19 03:11:00 - [38] Originally by: Trathen Originally by: Grath Telkin I'm reading all the "LOL PVP" posts and laughing, because they just see elves and think WoW. The game actually is significantly based around PvP, not only that, it has places it can be forced on you, and it is rewarded. What a lot of EVE players usually don't realize (or get into) is that PvP can be meaningful without some sort of time-loss penalty on the victim but it is a bit harder to do. Top tiered PvP teams reach a point where almost every match puts their reputation at stake and that is usually enough for a good rush, like professional athletic championships; they don't get paid less if they lose. I'm not for or against the game yet, but Its pretty bad watching them all attack something they have no clue about. Unlike WoW's PVP, you can actually level in WAR by killing players...like only players, you never have to kill a spawn in your entire career if you want, nor do you need to see them for any form of gear. It has massive open world PVP, as well as instanced PVP. Its just the base IQ of these forums creeping out thats bothering me
Trathen Minmatar	Posted - 2008.09.19 03:14:00 - [39] Originally by: Grath Telkin I'm not for or against the game yet, but Its pretty bad watching them all attack something they have no clue about. That happens with anything that might be related to WoW... It may sound like I'm bashing it; it does feel like a WoW II: PvP Time to me, but thats not necessarily a bad thing. Mythic tackles much of what makes PvP totally suck in WoW (like being a poor predictable healer).null _
Mike's Salesman	Posted - 2008.09.19 03:25:00 - [40] Edited by: Mike''s Salesman on 19/09/2008 03:26:16 Quote: What a lot of EVE players usually don't realize (or get into) is that PvP can be meaningful without some sort of time-loss penalty on the victim but it is a bit harder to do. Top tiered PvP teams reach a point where almost every match puts their reputation at stake and that is usually enough for a good rush, like professional athletic championships; they don't get paid less if they lose. Well... you are saying in world of sports ppl do not get payed less if they lose. But that is not really correct. Surely they get their pay check as usually. But take football players for example. Most professionals get a Bonus payment for winning a match, scoring goals, finnishing the game without a goal for the opponent, special bonus for winning a cup and so on. Tennis players get a lot less when they do not win a cup. And do not forget about other income sources like commercial contracts and so on. No one is gonna hire loosers to represent their company in a TV spot, on posters or whatever.
Mr M	Posted - 2008.09.19 03:34:00 - [41] I'll probably do a trial on Warhammer sooner or later, mostly because you can play as a goblin. I'd play WoW too if you could be a goblin there. Hell, I wouldn't mind some goblins in Eve. EVE Tribune \| EVEgeek
Pesky LaRue Minmatar L.O.S.T. Defence Force	Posted - 2008.09.19 03:36:00 - [42] Originally by: Grath Telkin Originally by: DigitalCommunist Nope, dislike fantasy games with a passion. Nothing against WAR, but if it was in space, I might care. To me its just another crap hack & slash in a long line stretching from UO. Jumpgate: Evolution and Black Prophecy I am keeping an eye on, though. Black Prophecy looks good, Jumpgate, meh, but I'll try it like I try all games. Frankly, I think my opinion is a better source of what will make me happy, than the opinion of a stranger, so I try most games out personally, and form my own opinion. All I'm saying is stop commenting ignorantly about the game, when most of what they're saying is totally wrong, because they actually have NO idea what the game contains, or is about. I'm reading all the "LOL PVP" posts and laughing, because they just see elves and think WoW. The game actually is significantly based around PvP, not only that, it has places it can be forced on you, and it is rewarded. Also, the "choose a side" dumbss is cracking me up, cause you know, he didn't choose a side in EVE or any]thing... i beta'd it and, your rather heated and self-righteous opinion notwithstanding, i found it too similar to WoW to enjoy - just like i found LotRO too much like WoW, Vanguard too much like EQ, ad nauseum. Sure, there are differences but it's another level-based fantasy-themed MMOG and, having been playing MMOG's since UO & EQ, i'm done with that whole genre, and i find it hard to believe that both the industry and the player-base don't feel the same way. to me it's like someone hating (say) jazz and someone else saying to them, "gawd, how can you even compare Duke Ellington with John Coltrane? you're so blind." ultimately you're right about the differences, but if someone hears a blaring trumpet (or sees an Elf) and it annoys them, the differences are moot. i'm interested in games in different genres and am looking forward to hearing more about both Black Prophecy and Jumpgate: Evolution but am reserving judgment until I find out more about the game beyond the glitzy front-end videos i've seen. for something to replace EVE in my gaming affections it'll need to have a lot more than just good graphics - it'll need a player-run economy and a host of features that'll give it significant depth. chances of it being a sandbox game are very slight, unfortunately. as i said above, i've been playing these games a long time and the only two that have ever really held my attention were EVE and SWG before that - not so much because of the sci-fi setting (although i'll take droids over dwarfs any day of the way) but more because they were the only two true sandbox game i've ever played that had good combat and great economic models as well as truly engaging social systems. if i want just fun combat, i'll stick with Battlefield (or similar games) - i play MMOG's for the social interaction/empire building/whatever-you-want-to-call-it aspect of the games - this is why games like CoH, AA and Tabula Rasa were fun for a few weeks (like a single-player) but couldn't hold my attention long-term. as for the "choose a side" comment that you seem so intent on banging on about - the main difference between a game like WoW or War and a game like EVE is that the side you pick makes next to NO difference here. You're not limited in ANY way here, unlike there. Unless they've changed things in the last few months, you pick a class and you stay with it till you hit the level cap (please feel free to correct me if i'm wrong on that, i'm not out to bash War for the hell of it), whereas in EVE your starter race, attributes, 'career choices' mean next to nothing. picking a side in a game like WoW means you can't even communicate with your enemy which in WoW was great, but it inherrently limits the game. like you, i try almost all games that come out, but given how much crap is released these days, a game has to really have something new or interesting to make me go beyond beta This message came from the Minmatar Messiah, accept no imitations* Pesky LaRue, Minmatar Messiah Bringing Salvation To Your System Soon! ++ PRAY FOR PESKY ++
Grath Telkin Amarr The Illuminati. Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2008.09.19 03:45:00 - [43] Originally by: Pesky LaRue decent discussion I actually agree with most of what you said there...trust me, I'm amazed. I actually looked for something to argue with you about. That being said, I'm passionately defending the ideals of self governance I guess. Your an obvious exception to most of those posting here, you actually tried the game. The rest of them are just filling lines of text with regurgitated crap.
rackhard HolyKnights	Posted - 2008.09.19 03:54:00 - [44] What is this warhammer ?? got a link ?? I know of crysis warhammer is that out yet ?? and that is no match to eve way to many hackers play that game
Digital Solaris	Posted - 2008.09.19 04:01:00 - [45] Originally by: Trathen Edited by: Trathen on 19/09/2008 03:00:30 Originally by: Grath Telkin The wow clone comments are the best, cause it's got elves in it right. Idiots. Nope I tried it already. It has a full copy of WoW in it, including 3-directions for talent trees glaringly similar to WoW (do you want your bright wizard to focus on nuking, dots, or defense?), the melee DPS classes actually use combo points... you build accusations then your judgement does damage based on the number of accusations you have made (up to FIVE)! It even has the familiar "You are feeling rested" message verbatim in towns. But they did what Mythic does: beefed up the PvP options infinitely. That is what a lot of people are looking for, but there are also a lot of people trying to make it sound as if you'dtotally fail if you played a healer in WoW and tried to do it in WAR. So, with what you have written above, WoW was the first MMO you ever played as you can't have played any MMO titles previous to WoW (like Mythic's DAoC) to come to a flawed conclusion like that? I'd hate to mean, but are you really that naive to believe that Blizzard "orginally invented" all the game mechanics for WoW? Or were you never good with the brain department to have an actual thought of your own?
Shagrath Neptune Series of Tubes	Posted - 2008.09.19 04:18:00 - [46] Originally by: Grath Telkin Originally by: Shagrath Neptune As much as I liked DAOC, what made me not want to play War was when i learned that the Devs caved to the whiners (already) and decided to not allow any stealth classes in the game. I like to play solo frequently and remember how difficult it was to pvp with a visible character in DAOC where everyone zergs or 8-man. Although Vamps were halfway decent at it once you got the hang of them. See, this is my biggest problem. It doesn't really matter at this point if the game is good or bad, because the ignorance is so ingrained here. I'm not sure where you "learned" that they decided not to allow "stealth" classes, but your wrong, they do in fact have them. Instead of following the herd, or reading some OTHER GUY'S experience with the game, wait for the 2 week free trials to hit, and give it a shot yourself. Your "knowledge" is wrong in most posts on this forum, because you read either A) old builds, or B) biased reports. So now you've formed these pre-conceived notions of what the game is like, and how it plays, and none of you have a clue as to the reality of it. The wow clone comments are the best, cause it's got elves in it right. Idiots. I got the idea that there were no stealth classes from the devs of Warhammer. They stated in their introductory videos of the game during development that they didn't want any stealth in the game. Period. Now if they changed that stance, that is fine. I admit that the videos and quotes I read regarding that issue were from about a year ago. I can now only assume that enough people complained and they reconsidered? I am not sure why you are going off on me however. I never claimed to have any pre conceived notions of the game except the mere assumption that the pvp would be similar to what DAOC had since it is made by the same company and some of the same dev team. I even praised that aspect of the game. My only complaint of the lack of stealth came from my preferred style of pvp which is solo. That is why I wouldn't want to bother with it if what i thought was true. It is a personal preference and not me ragging on the game itself. Next time you quote me, read what I actually type. Next time you decide to quote someone and vent on this issue, at least pick on a post where the author was saying something stupid and uninformed like "it is just a WoW clone" instead of someone who actually agrees with your views. BTW: The only thing keeping me from really going off on you right now is that I remember you from FW and you seemed like a cool guy then. What happened?
Pesky LaRue Minmatar L.O.S.T. Defence Force	Posted - 2008.09.19 04:33:00 - [47] Originally by: Grath Telkin Originally by: Pesky LaRue decent discussion I actually agree with most of what you said there...trust me, I'm amazed. I actually looked for something to argue with you about. That being said, I'm passionately defending the ideals of self governance I guess. Your an obvious exception to most of those posting here, you actually tried the game. The rest of them are just filling lines of text with regurgitated crap. funny, i came back to this thread half-expecting an argument too :P This message came from the Minmatar Messiah, accept no imitations Pesky LaRue, Minmatar Messiah Bringing Salvation To Your System Soon! ++ PRAY FOR PESKY ++
Trathen Minmatar	Posted - 2008.09.19 04:59:00 - [48] Originally by: Digital Solaris I'd hate to mean, but are you really that naive to believe that Blizzard "orginally invented" all the game mechanics for WoW? Or were you never good with the brain department to have an actual thought of your own? Blizzard did introduce talent trees, combo points, and rest experience. I've been playing MMOs since EQ. Sorry, try again. _
Grath Telkin Amarr The Illuminati. Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2008.09.19 05:24:00 - [49] Edited by: Grath Telkin on 19/09/2008 05:24:43 Originally by: Shagrath Neptune stuff Had to get rid of your reply, seems were both long winded. As for what happened, nothing really, Its the entirety of this kind of thread that just bothers me. Your post was based on old facts, but many others are just talking about things they don't know, probably one of my biggest annoyances. It's basically just a bunch of people talking, to read their own supposedly witty responses, when in truth, 80% of these posts make the poster look dumber than they really are, simply by them speaking from complete ignorance. And yea, the whole 'WoW' clone thing I've touched on. Also, yea, stealth classes are in it, some of the highest melee damage comes from them. The basic point of some of my ire is simple, don't trash it ignorantly, try it, and THEN come back and point out its flaws (it has more than a few, but hey, it was released yesterday). Don't come spouting rhetoric like some goose stepping EVE ***. Also, (not directed at you) some early beta testers are unaware that the game went through like 4 builds before they got one they were satisfied with. If any of you ever bothered to watch the development Pod casts, you may have gotten some joy from the developer flat out telling people that if PVE is your concern, you will probably be looking for a different game. Edit: to fix some of my spelling failures, which are normally numerous.
DigitalCommunist Obsidian Core	Posted - 2008.09.19 05:25:00 - [50] Originally by: Grath Telkin Originally by: DigitalCommunist Nope, dislike fantasy games with a passion. Nothing against WAR, but if it was in space, I might care. To me its just another crap hack & slash in a long line stretching from UO. Jumpgate: Evolution and Black Prophecy I am keeping an eye on, though. Black Prophecy looks good, Jumpgate, meh, but I'll try it like I try all games. Frankly, I think my opinion is a better source of what will make me happy, than the opinion of a stranger, so I try most games out personally, and form my own opinion. All I'm saying is stop commenting ignorantly about the game, when most of what they're saying is totally wrong, because they actually have NO idea what the game contains, or is about. I'm reading all the "LOL PVP" posts and laughing, because they just see elves and think WoW. The game actually is significantly based around PvP, not only that, it has places it can be forced on you, and it is rewarded. Also, the "choose a side" dumb*ss is cracking me up, cause you know, he didn't choose a side in EVE or any]thing... I don't know if you're addressing me or not, but a game with no PVP (rare) says more about the game than one with PVP being advertised. Being able to kill anyone anywhere is quite different from arenas, instancing, battlegrounds, pvp servers, pvp zones and other nonsense.
Veldya Guristari Freedom Fighters	Posted - 2008.09.19 05:25:00 - [51] I was in beta but I gave my account to a friend. WAR lacks the meaningful PvP and player driven content that is what makes EVE really enjoyable even if it is just as repetitive as any other game. Being able to build empires and bring them down is very different to the plastic treadmill of WAR.
Frances Ducoir Gallente Bounty Hunter - Dark Legion	Posted - 2008.09.19 05:26:00 - [52] Originally by: Artemis Rose Lulz Not me, doesn't quite have the starship captain feel. since when does eve have starship captain feel? eve is more like controlling a single person in a 3d environment than controlling a starship (where is my crew ect). snip Signiture remoted because it contained profanity - hutch
Florio Federal Defence Union	Posted - 2008.09.19 05:29:00 - [53] i'm gonna take a 'break' from eve when ambulation comes along. hope we'll be able to put our feet up on tables and smoke cigars.
Grath Telkin Amarr The Illuminati. Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2008.09.19 05:29:00 - [54] Originally by: DigitalCommunist Originally by: Grath Telkin Originally by: DigitalCommunist Nope, dislike fantasy games with a passion. Nothing against WAR, but if it was in space, I might care. To me its just another crap hack & slash in a long line stretching from UO. Jumpgate: Evolution and Black Prophecy I am keeping an eye on, though. Black Prophecy looks good, Jumpgate, meh, but I'll try it like I try all games. Frankly, I think my opinion is a better source of what will make me happy, than the opinion of a stranger, so I try most games out personally, and form my own opinion. All I'm saying is stop commenting ignorantly about the game, when most of what they're saying is totally wrong, because they actually have NO idea what the game contains, or is about. I'm reading all the "LOL PVP" posts and laughing, because they just see elves and think WoW. The game actually is significantly based around PvP, not only that, it has places it can be forced on you, and it is rewarded. Also, the "choose a side" dumb*ss is cracking me up, cause you know, he didn't choose a side in EVE or any]thing... I don't know if you're addressing me or not, but a game with no PVP (rare) says more about the game than one with PVP being advertised. Being able to kill anyone anywhere is quite different from arenas, instancing, battlegrounds, pvp servers, pvp zones and other nonsense. You CAN kill anyone anywhere, if that is your choice, they have open RVR servers, kill anyone, anywhere, any time you want. Its a simple choice you make when making an alt. Also, loading and instancing are very limited in this, as in, there are very few instanced dungeons, and yes, you can do instanced combat, but it pales in comparison to the non instanced combat. Think your 200 guys trying to get into my castle, and my 200 guys telling you no, complete with siege weaponry, and its non instanced.
Shagrath Neptune Series of Tubes	Posted - 2008.09.19 06:47:00 - [55] Originally by: Grath Telkin Edited by: Grath Telkin on 19/09/2008 05:24:43 Originally by: Shagrath Neptune stuff Had to get rid of your reply, seems were both long winded. As for what happened, nothing really, Its the entirety of this kind of thread that just bothers me. Your post was based on old facts, but many others are just talking about things they don't know, probably one of my biggest annoyances. It's basically just a bunch of people talking, to read their own supposedly witty responses, when in truth, 80% of these posts make the poster look dumber than they really are, simply by them speaking from complete ignorance. And yea, the whole 'WoW' clone thing I've touched on. Also, yea, stealth classes are in it, some of the highest melee damage comes from them. The basic point of some of my ire is simple, don't trash it ignorantly, try it, and THEN come back and point out its flaws (it has more than a few, but hey, it was released yesterday). Don't come spouting rhetoric like some goose stepping EVE ***. Also, (not directed at you) some early beta testers are unaware that the game went through like 4 builds before they got one they were satisfied with. If any of you ever bothered to watch the development Pod casts, you may have gotten some joy from the developer flat out telling people that if PVE is your concern, you will probably be looking for a different game. Edit: to fix some of my spelling failures, which are normally numerous. I agree this thread is mostly full of garbage created by kids living still with mom and daddy trying to sound elitist. I never got the whole "WOW sucks" or "Carebears ruin EvE" crap that infests this board. This bagging of Warhammer is no different. Just play whatever you prefer and shut up about it. If it is true there is stealth in the game, I may check it out after all. I really miss DAOC but vowed to never go back since the game's populations were dwindling when I left and I basically was forced to have two accounts because a buff bot was mandatory on the TOA servers. I heard buffs are handled different in War unless they changed that too.
Aioa Planetary Assault Systems	Posted - 2008.09.19 06:51:00 - [56] I was just thinking we need another game with elves and goblins. How original! What will they come up with next? --
Sexiest Beast Caldari State War Academy	Posted - 2008.09.19 07:14:00 - [57] Originally by: Aioa I was just thinking we need another game with elves and goblins. How original! What will they come up with next? World of Warcraft (1994) Warhammer 40K (circa 1987) Although WH40K does have Orcs, Goblins, and various flavors of Elves it does have Tanks and Chainsaw Weilding Space Marines
Aioa Planetary Assault Systems	Posted - 2008.09.19 07:24:00 - [58] Couldn't care less for your lead figures and it makes no difference to the game who did what first. Its yet another elf game. You'll all be back. --
Jaketh Ivanes Amarr Imperial Servants	Posted - 2008.09.19 07:34:00 - [59] I would try it out, if it wasn't limited to america only [:/] But I would rather someone made a Fallout Online.
Demitria Fernir Caldari Science and Trade Institute	Posted - 2008.09.19 07:55:00 - [60] Just another challenger appearing to battle up with blizzard, about who's gonna make the most grind-intensive carebears-friendly enforced-pve game ever. 10100110010100101010011010100101001100101110101001 I will Conquer My Signature Somewhere in the future 10100110010100101010011010100101001100101110101001
Jack Thurner SPECTRE Ops Utterly Harmless	Posted - 2008.09.19 08:18:00 - [61] Tried it and got bored within a week or two...
Elena Morin'staal Minmatar Tau Online Explorator Corp	Posted - 2008.09.19 08:23:00 - [62] Would like to play it, them Elves in the trailer do look fun (or maybe I'm a sucker for chicks with pointed ears) but I can't see how its different to WoW, other than in style. Its still going to be the same old mindless grinding that has put me off every MMO bar EvE, hell, the main thing that attracted me here was the training system rather than grinding. Which gives me an idea - We need pointed ear chicks in EvE! Now, CCP :D
Adrielle Firewalker Minmatar WASTELAND MINERS Inc.	Posted - 2008.09.19 09:28:00 - [63] Originally by: Grath Telkin The wow clone comments are the best, cause it's got elves in it right. Idiots. I've been playing it for about a month (pre-order closed beta access), and it is, sad to say, pretty much like WoW. However, it has added stuff that makes it worthwhile, such as zone control through your interactions in the world - both PVP and PVE. Its also taken on board titles and achievements that I saw in LotRO (which could have come from elsewhere as well, but that's the first place I really saw it properly). I guess rather than being a totally new experience, or even a new take on an old one, WAR is more the evolution of a formula ================ ~Adrielle Original MinmatarT
Pan Crastus Anti-Metagaming League	Posted - 2008.09.19 09:32:00 - [64] First impressions (this thread belongs to OOPE really): - the crappy WAR website doesn't work properly with Firefox - Servers are down ;-P - choice of usernames/nicknames is very limited (no numbers?!) ... more when I am actually able to log in. How to PVP: 1. buy ISK with GTCs, 2. fit cloak, learn aggro mechanics, 3. buy second account for metagaming
Y Berion Minmatar	Posted - 2008.09.19 11:00:00 - [65] I wish someone just copy basics of Eve concept and put it in good old fantasy environment. I`d like to walk through some dark, open-ended, PvP/scam encouraging and skill based fantasy MMO. I hope Darkfall online will come to light since it looks very promising to me.
AltBier Minmatar Freelance Unincorporated	Posted - 2008.09.19 11:06:00 - [66] * Checks out Warhammer screenshots * Erm, no, far too cartoonish for my taste.
Rodj Blake Amarr PIE Inc.	Posted - 2008.09.19 11:14:00 - [67] Originally by: Mankirks Wife Edited by: Mankirks Wife on 19/09/2008 00:53:03 Originally by: Sidrat Flush WHY OH WHY does the industry stick with the Level 1-40, Class, Roles, Secondary Profession and this is the loot and equipment you'll get to use. Two reasons that I can think of... First is that.. well.. all those things pretty much define (normal) RPGs. It's expected, especially from fantasy games. No. They define RPGs based on D&D / D20. Now, I've not really been involved in pen and paper RPGs for about a decade, but to me the skill-based ones such as WFRP, Call of Cthulhu, Traveller and Cyberpunk 2020 all had far superior advancement mechanics to the restrictive levelling of D&D and its clones. Dulce et decorum est pro imperium mori.
Donkey facemoo	Posted - 2008.09.19 11:20:00 - [68] Originally by: AltBier * Checks out Warhammer screenshots * Erm, no, far too cartoonish for my taste. Yup I love messing around with my camera angle to take nice screenshots for my desktop background when playing Eve. Although I played WoW for over three years and had fun doing so that style of gameplay and all the problems that come with it has its appeal. Rather than play Warhammer I'll probably just give WotLK a go and reactivate my druid who's on ice in my gulid. Probably when I've got someone on long train.
Troezar Personal Vendetta Vendetta Alliance.	Posted - 2008.09.19 11:26:00 - [69] Personally waiting for Darkfall, the pvp sounds much more Eve like than any other game so far...
Kazang Gallente Arbitrary Freedom	Posted - 2008.09.19 11:37:00 - [70] Wont be taking a break from eve, but i will be playing WAR, got it today. I can play WAR in between shooting people in my internet spaceship. Its not like eve needs 100% attention. Kazang
Tippia Caldari School of Applied Knowledge	Posted - 2008.09.19 12:22:00 - [71] Originally by: Rodj Blake No. They define RPGs based on D&D / D20. To be fair, a good amount of RPGs used class/level systems without being D&D-based (Earthdawn, Rolemaster, MERP immediately come to mind). It also appears in some hidden or odd ways in other systems — Shadowrun had a fair bit of class/levellery snuck into it, for instance. Of course, the main problem is that RPG systems that promote actual role play tend not to translate as well into computer games as MMTG (min-max twink game) systems such as D&D, which mainly center around maths.
Dr Lmao TANK.	Posted - 2008.09.19 12:35:00 - [72] Originally by: Rodj Blake Originally by: Mankirks Wife Edited by: Mankirks Wife on 19/09/2008 00:53:03 Originally by: Sidrat Flush WHY OH WHY does the industry stick with the Level 1-40, Class, Roles, Secondary Profession and this is the loot and equipment you'll get to use. Two reasons that I can think of... First is that.. well.. all those things pretty much define (normal) RPGs. It's expected, especially from fantasy games. No. They define RPGs based on D&D / D20. Now, I've not really been involved in pen and paper RPGs for about a decade, but to me the skill-based ones such as WFRP, Call of Cthulhu, Traveller and Cyberpunk 2020 all had far superior advancement mechanics to the restrictive levelling of D&D and its clones. I always remember the Runequest rules system was good. It wasn't level based but instead used skills based on 100 with a use based advancement system e.g. if you used a skill and rolled a critical, the skill was flagged for advancement. You then rolled to see if your skill had advanced. When a skill reached 100 it basically meant that you would always score at least a basic hit (unless you fumbled), but your chance of a special/critical hit was increased. D&D always seemed like a very limited system compared to some of the more open ended/freeform rules systems.
blown away	Posted - 2008.09.19 13:02:00 - [73] Originally by: Jane Vladmir Ahem.. What he said :)
RayBanJockey	Posted - 2008.09.19 13:35:00 - [74] I've seen this countless times over the years - a new game comes out and people start comparing it, regardless of what it is, to EVE. EVE is better than WOW bacause of the pvp. EVE is better than AoC and WAR because of the community. EVE is better than Tetris Online because of the market system. Just because two games are multiplayer doesn't mean they can be compared. I play EVE, WOW, AoC (lol tbh, but whatever) and now I'll play WAR a bit. If I want to delve into fanatical and religious aspects I'll give jehova's a call, until then I'll enjoy these games for what they are. --- RBJ
Mordekai Bloodwake Gallente	Posted - 2008.09.19 13:37:00 - [75] Edited by: Mordekai Bloodwake on 19/09/2008 13:37:44 Originally by: Krecian I will be, but I won't be canceling Eve either. Eve is too unique to give up easily. But yah, got my first taste of PvP in Warhammer and it brought back fond memories of DAOC... so I'm hooked already. Same here! PvP in WAR is allot of fun, Eve PvP as become too much of a e-peen our group is bigger than yours ISK sink and not fun!
Cailais Amarr VITOC	Posted - 2008.09.19 13:57:00 - [76] If it's a life of consequence you're after then nothing comes close to EVE. WAR looks like it could be idle fun - not too serious but enough to entertain for short periods. I'll probably give it a try - EVE is feeling a bit stale atm, with no new dev blogs and nothing concrete to look forward too. I can impatiently wait for some of the proposed features to come along whilst playing EVE - or patiently await those features whilst playing WAR. It'll probably be the latter. C. Originally by: Tarminic Your continued whining is somewhat diminished by your continued willingness to give your money to CCP.
Elena Morin'staal Minmatar Tau Online Explorator Corp	Posted - 2008.09.19 14:11:00 - [77] Is the leveling system the same grind fashion? I'm not a fan of killing hundreds of giant rats all day just to gain an extra level.
Vigilant Gallente Vigilant's Vigilante's	Posted - 2008.09.19 14:22:00 - [78] Originally by: Elena Morin'staal Is the leveling system the same grind fashion? I'm not a fan of killing hundreds of giant rats all day just to gain an extra level. It can be and can not be. You can quest or pvp for exp. And levels. So far I am very impressed by it compared to cartoon WOW. But hell I am having fun playing Tabula Rasa too.
Davich MacGregor Minmatar Stellar Products and Quality Resources	Posted - 2008.09.19 14:29:00 - [79] Just another hack and slash. No imagination. Been there, done that.
Broskies La'Poosie	Posted - 2008.09.19 14:41:00 - [80] WTF is Warhammer?
Balrokenx Caldari ANZAC ALLIANCE Southern Cross Alliance	Posted - 2008.09.19 14:57:00 - [81] Originally by: Jane Vladmir Ahem.. This is the only mmo i'm quitting eve for, all the "mainstream" crap is just a pve gay fest.
RaTTuS BIG Libertas Fidelitas	Posted - 2008.09.19 15:04:00 - [82] there are MMO's other than eve ? -- BIG Lottery, BIG Deal, InEve
Traidor Disloyal NightCrew	Posted - 2008.09.19 15:05:00 - [83] Originally by: Hieronimus Rex ...A supposedly pvp-centric game. I'm just hoping it won't be pay to play beta like AoC. I certainly am. Go right ahead big guy. I learned my lesson with AoC. If War turns out to be a flop my one hope is that its forums are like the AoC forums. Last three weeks of my sub on AoC was the most fun I had in that game and I spent em all on the forums. --------------------------------------------- Love is having a second account with a cov ops pilot
Faife Minmatar Kinda'Shujaa	Posted - 2008.09.19 15:13:00 - [84] does Warhammer work in the IGB? Please resize image to a maximum of 400 x 120, not exceeding 24000 bytes. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] - Saint
Hyveres Caldari	Posted - 2008.09.19 15:18:00 - [85] Originally by: Banana Torres If you are into the Warhammer universe I am sure you will enjoy it. Like I enjoy even the crappiest of Star Trek Games, cause I'm a Trekkie. Tbh if you are into the warhammer universe you despise it since its a total lore***. The basic rule of the warhammer universe from a tabletop PoV is that most races wont ally unless forced and then normally only for a short period of time. And while I dont play them the small fact that the darkelfs are allied to someone for more than a single battle(where they can either backstab midfight or wipe em out once victory is assured) is laughable in my eyes. "I dont need facts when I have the truth"*
DigitalCommunist Obsidian Core	Posted - 2008.09.19 15:23:00 - [86] Originally by: Grath Telkin You CAN kill anyone anywhere, if that is your choice, they have open RVR servers, kill anyone, anywhere, any time you want. Its a simple choice you make when making an alt. Also, loading and instancing are very limited in this, as in, there are very few instanced dungeons, and yes, you can do instanced combat, but it pales in comparison to the non instanced combat. Think your 200 guys trying to get into my castle, and my 200 guys telling you no, complete with siege weaponry, and its non instanced. A.. choice...? lol
Shagrath Neptune Series of Tubes	Posted - 2008.09.19 15:23:00 - [87] Originally by: Balrokenx Originally by: Jane Vladmir Ahem.. This is the only mmo i'm quitting eve for, all the "mainstream" crap is just a pve gay fest. This game looks interesting. I actually like the graphics. They sort of remind me of Morrowind. It appears that whatever you attack bleeds too. 500 spells and 500 abilities sounds like a balancing nightmare though.
Raymond Sterns Utopian Research I.E.L. The ENTITY.	Posted - 2008.09.19 15:42:00 - [88] Originally by: blown away Originally by: Jane Vladmir Ahem.. What he said :) cough vaporware cough hack choke die _
Neamus	Posted - 2008.09.19 16:22:00 - [89] Bleh, no. I'm staying right here, AoC made sure of that.
Highwind Cid	Posted - 2008.09.19 16:25:00 - [90] Originally by: Synapse Archae So they added a little PVP to Wow and tried to resell it. Big deal. They didn't add half as much PVP as they should have. Market competition, industrial pvp, killing in towns, and player alliance wars are all notably missing. Even if they added ALL the PVP that eve has to WoW, that still wouldnt make it half the game Eve is, because it will never have the scale that eve has, or the players. Or the skill system, or the diversity in fittings. No, I'm staying right here. Easy down, Easy down...
Highwind Cid	Posted - 2008.09.19 16:30:00 - [91] Originally by: Jack Gilligan Warhammer is nothing more than another WOW clone. Pass. Give me something that is a Pre-CU Star Wars Galaxies clone, and I might be interested. So from this day forward any MMO that contains swords, orcs, and humans is a WoW clone? Stunningly shallow.
Digital Solaris	Posted - 2008.09.19 16:33:00 - [92] Originally by: Trathen Blizzard did introduce talent trees, combo points, and rest experience. I've been playing MMOs since EQ. Sorry, try again. Oh, really? So you got any actual evidence to back that up or are you just talking out of your ass again?
Shagrath Neptune Series of Tubes	Posted - 2008.09.19 16:36:00 - [93] Originally by: Raymond Sterns Originally by: blown away Originally by: Jane Vladmir Ahem.. What he said :) cough vaporware cough hack choke die Yeah, I was excited when that guy posted the link but I just spent the past half hour reading up on it and this thing has been in development for eight years now..lol The last time a game took anything near that long to develop, it was "Dark and Light" which turned out to be a colossal failure when they finally opened the doors. A half baked game full of bugs and only a very small fraction of the features promised. Hopefully, Darkfall will be different but when a game has that many setbacks, it can't be a good sign.
Empyre Domestic Reform	Posted - 2008.09.19 16:41:00 - [94] Edited by: Empyre on 19/09/2008 16:41:47 I am for sure. My Warrior Priest is getting spanked left and right in RvR though. I love how they've seamlessly integrated public questing and RvR into the regular playing world. The combat is a little simplified so far but I also don't have a lot of abilities yet. The public quests rock, though. Last night I was at the burning windmill. As you approach it the quest objectives appear on your UI. First objective was to kill 50 specific mobs while these mages kept themselves protected in bubbles. Then the next stage the bubbles drop and you have to kill them. Third stage is two named mobs. When all were killed, the highest dmg/healing people got highest multipliers on a loot roll and the loot was auto distributed. I won the first won and picked up a bag from the chest and got to pick a loot item from that bag before it went poof. Now that's an awesome system. RvR seemed pretty seamless as well. You even get auto-level adjusted to the area as you enter. And everything seems to be tied together in terms of battling for control of areas. The only bad thing I've seen so far is that the pathing is a little skewed, for both npcs and my character. But that will work itself out in a patch or two for sure. Great game, no doubt. It might very well even be a WoW killer for me if my friends can make the leap. PS. Eve will still have my main subscription for a while. I still like logging on now and again. Destroy all that which is evil, so that which is good may flourish.
Victor Kruger	Posted - 2008.09.19 16:51:00 - [95] It would be wise for some of the WAR bashers here to actually go and try the game. So far, the echo from the testers has been very positive. And if you played AoC and dropped the game, you should wait a bit and see how it evolves. The Game Director, Gaute Godager, who was previously handling the game has left Funcom and Craig Morrison has taken the role. For those who don't know that guy, he was the one who brought back AO from the grave. The latest patch seems to have fixed a number of issues already. So all in all, I'm expecting to have a choice of 2 excellent PvP games in maybe 3 months from now, when hopefully most of the starter bugs are fixed. Competition is good. --------------- Hey, where's my portrait
Shagrath Neptune Series of Tubes	Posted - 2008.09.19 16:51:00 - [96] Originally by: Empyre Edited by: Empyre on 19/09/2008 16:41:47 I am for sure. My Warrior Priest is getting spanked left and right in RvR though. I love how they've seamlessly integrated public questing and RvR into the regular playing world. The combat is a little simplified so far but I also don't have a lot of abilities yet. The public quests rock, though. Last night I was at the burning windmill. As you approach it the quest objectives appear on your UI. First objective was to kill 50 specific mobs while these mages kept themselves protected in bubbles. Then the next stage the bubbles drop and you have to kill them. Third stage is two named mobs. When all were killed, the highest dmg/healing people got highest multipliers on a loot roll and the loot was auto distributed. I won the first won and picked up a bag from the chest and got to pick a loot item from that bag before it went poof. Now that's an awesome system. RvR seemed pretty seamless as well. You even get auto-level adjusted to the area as you enter. And everything seems to be tied together in terms of battling for control of areas. The only bad thing I've seen so far is that the pathing is a little skewed, for both npcs and my character. But that will work itself out in a patch or two for sure. Great game, no doubt. It might very well even be a WoW killer for me if my friends can make the leap. PS. Eve will still have my main subscription for a while. I still like logging on now and again. Sounds like they improved the PvE over anything DAOC had. DAOC pve was pretty crappy and was a grind.
Davich MacGregor Minmatar Stellar Products and Quality Resources	Posted - 2008.09.19 17:03:00 - [97] Originally by: Victor Kruger It would be wise for some of the WAR bashers here to actually go and try the game. So far, the echo from the testers has been very positive. And if you played AoC and dropped the game, you should wait a bit and see how it evolves. The Game Director, Gaute Godager, who was previously handling the game has left Funcom and Craig Morrison has taken the role. For those who don't know that guy, he was the one who brought back AO from the grave. The latest patch seems to have fixed a number of issues already. So all in all, I'm expecting to have a choice of 2 excellent PvP games in maybe 3 months from now, when hopefully most of the starter bugs are fixed. Competition is good. Did try it. Opinion stands. Just another hack and slash. Boring after a couple of weeks.
Dirk Magnum Royal Hiigaran Navy	Posted - 2008.09.19 17:07:00 - [98] Originally by: Shagrath Neptune Sounds like they improved the PvE over anything DAOC had. DAOC pve was pretty crappy and was a grind. After level 35 or so DAoC was nothing but a race to level 50 for me. There was nothing worthwhile to do in between there except the battlegrounds for PvP. At least level 50 let you do RvR without being instaganked. But the nature of RvR was transitory anyway. The map got reset every week or whatever, so there were no lasting gains that could be made and not much reason to care if the opposing factions controlled your relics. But to give you an idea of how resounding my lack of interest in Warhammer Online was, up until a week ago I heard "Warhammer" and assumed Warhammer 40k. In other words, for the past however many months that I knew there was a Warhammer game being made, I never once bothered to check out its most basic details. But that's just me. I guess I'm past fantasy-themed MMOs or something. Visually and in terms of skill pathing the game looks pretty decent, from what I've seen/read in the past few days.
Davich MacGregor Minmatar Stellar Products and Quality Resources	Posted - 2008.09.19 17:07:00 - [99] BTW. Check out the player ratings for the games at MMORPG. Warhammer is 9.0 and everything else, everything, has fallen below 8.0. WH fanbois jacking up WH and giving everything else zeros. Nice.
Highwind Cid	Posted - 2008.09.19 17:10:00 - [100] Originally by: Sidus Isaacs Originally by: Hieronimus Rex ...A supposedly pvp-centric game. I'm just hoping it won't be pay to play beta like AoC. I certainly am. Warhammer told me to "pick a side" during the very first web page. I refuse to pick a side (like it was some stupid WoW allaince/hord clone). Besides, EVE is space, and space is awsome. not space = not awsome. Why is picking a side stupid? In fact I'm pretty sure you've done that quite a few times in Eve.
Hoshi Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2008.09.19 17:18:00 - [101] Edited by: Hoshi on 19/09/2008 17:17:57 Originally by: Empyre The public quests rock, though. Those public quests are probably the largest improvement they made to the mmorpg genre. Expect to see copies of that in most new mmorpgs released after this. ---------------------------------------- A Guide to Scan Probing in Revelations
Highwind Cid	Posted - 2008.09.19 17:38:00 - [102] Edited by: Highwind Cid on 19/09/2008 17:40:28 Originally by: Grath Telkin Originally by: Shagrath Neptune As much as I liked DAOC, what made me not want to play War was when i learned that the Devs caved to the whiners (already) and decided to not allow any stealth classes in the game. I like to play solo frequently and remember how difficult it was to pvp with a visible character in DAOC where everyone zergs or 8-man. Although Vamps were halfway decent at it once you got the hang of them. See, this is my biggest problem. It doesn't really matter at this point if the game is good or bad, because the ignorance is so ingrained here. I'm not sure where you "learned" that they decided not to allow "stealth" classes, but your wrong, they do in fact have them. Instead of following the herd, or reading some OTHER GUY'S experience with the game, wait for the 2 week free trials to hit, and give it a shot yourself. Your "knowledge" is wrong in most posts on this forum, because you read either A) old builds, or B) biased reports. So now you've formed these pre-conceived notions of what the game is like, and how it plays, and none of you have a clue as to the reality of it. The wow clone comments are the best, cause it's got elves in it right. Idiots. Praise this guy. It's just like the Mojava OS MS released... Funny how every one loved it with a simple name change. Same thing is happening here. Everyone's too lazy to make up their mind and just goes with whatever some other people say.
Winterblink Body Count Inc.	Posted - 2008.09.19 17:41:00 - [103] Yeah the public quests are certainly a blast. One of the neat bits of the game's design is how your regular quests will often overlap in areas where public quests are happening, so if you're doing your normal quest grinding, you'll be running into the public quests as well. That, and there's tangible rewards for completing them, and their associated storyline chapters. Pretty funky. warp drive active \| nature vraie
Highwind Cid	Posted - 2008.09.19 17:49:00 - [104] Originally by: Aioa I was just thinking we need another game with elves and goblins. How original! What will they come up with next? Another game with spaceships...oh wait, Star Trek, how original. Not sure about you but I determine whether or not a game is good by its mechanics, not based on graphics/appearance. Yea its getting a bit old with this theme but if the mechanics make it fun then by all means take it in.
Yeta Ky'ang Gallente	Posted - 2008.09.19 17:49:00 - [105] Regurgitated, formulaic, candy coated, bull droppings. There is nothing, repeat that, nothing innovative about WHO. All the video journal ravings of Paul "war War WAR geeYaAaArg!!! WAR IS EVERYWHERE" Barnett was just junk. Empty hype. It's watered down design that was given the Mark Jacobs famous, "Wait a minute! I have an idea! Let's water it down even more!" treatment. Throw on top of that they couldn't even release all of the watered down version of the game on time. Rip out classes and cities to make their late-late-latey-late release date. Need more? Their "awsome" graphics are on par with what they ended up with in DAoC-The Dying Years. It's pretty much the same look. Same 3 stage idle animation cycle. Same stretched texture look. Same friggen color palette. "It will be a no level system!" - actually, yeah there is levels "It's all open pvp!" - actually, you have to do instances to reach city objectives "It's harsh pvp!" - actually, there's no looting players... they drop random stuff to simulate the "harsh" It's Mythic. CBA to run their own forums, Mythic. It's Mark Jacobs. Bad jockey that lucked into a good horse with DAoC then ran it into the ground with exponentially worsening expansions. It's EA. Who will force the already Mediocre Mythic to run backwards when numbers turn south. It's just... soul crushingly sad. One of these days someone will try and break out of the current MMO formula trend. So far, CCP is the only one going their own way. I had hope for warhammer. That was shot to shit before they even got to beta. I'm sure they'll draw a large initial crowd. I give it about a 3 month run before they peak. So, I honestly hope you warhammer guys have fun. See you in a couple months.
Highwind Cid	Posted - 2008.09.19 18:04:00 - [106] Originally by: Jack Thurner Tried it and got bored within a week or two... I like steak and it is delicious...
Phaige Minmatar Reaver Construction Services	Posted - 2008.09.19 19:13:00 - [107] Originally by: Wrayeth Originally by: Jack Gilligan Give me something that is a Pre-CU Star Wars Galaxies clone, and I might be interested. This, only minus player Jedi. Hear hear ----------------------------------------------- You may be a King or a little Street Sweeper, but sooner or later you dance wi' de' Reaper!
Empyre Domestic Reform	Posted - 2008.09.19 19:31:00 - [108] Edited by: Empyre on 19/09/2008 19:32:39 Did DAoC have RvR? I never got into that game but I'm loving the RvR aspects in WH. I can't wait for the opportunity to pillage a Destruction capital city. I like how you can actually do that and force the other side to spawn at refugee camps outside the city. I also love that the public quests reset in 2 minutes and I have yet to wait for a spawn, despite the fact I'm one of many n00bs running around doing the same quests. No quest log limit that I can see, quests are implemented into mapping better than questhelper for wow.. it's a really great WoW-spawn, and I had my doubts about it going in. I think they have a long way to go. They have to endure the release of Wrath of the Lich King in November and that won't be any easy task. If they're smart they'll release a technical patch right around that time and then have a decent update to content after the new year. Any way you cut it, WHO is going to be around for a little while. I think they did testing right and the release was pretty issue-free for me. What that means is the development team can focus on enhancing the game rather than fixing it. The haters make me laugh, though. While I admit I may be seeing new things for me that were new in DAoC, there's enough obvious ingenuity to make anyone that tries the game out to realize the haters are just being over-sensationalist drama queens about it. Destroy all that which is evil, so that which is good may flourish.
Billy Sastard Amarr Life. Universe. Everything.	Posted - 2008.09.19 19:57:00 - [109] Originally by: Sexiest Beast Originally by: Aioa I was just thinking we need another game with elves and goblins. How original! What will they come up with next? World of Warcraft (1994) Warhammer 40K (circa 1987) Although WH40K does have Orcs, Goblins, and various flavors of Elves it does have Tanks and Chainsaw Weilding Space Marines I just want to clarify that WH40K was not the originator, and that the Warhammer tabletop game predates 40k by about 4 years, and is what Warhammer online is based off, Orcs Goblins Elves and all, in a fantasy setting etc.
Billy Sastard Amarr Life. Universe. Everything.	Posted - 2008.09.19 20:00:00 - [110] Originally by: Empyre Edited by: Empyre on 19/09/2008 19:32:39 Did DAoC have RvR?... DAoC had RvR, was built around RvR in fact. The game was built around 3 warring factions and the RvR combat was undertaken in a series of zones known as 'frontiers', RvR combat spilling over into the homelands was not possible.
AltBier Minmatar Freelance Unincorporated	Posted - 2008.09.19 22:02:00 - [111] Edited by: AltBier on 19/09/2008 22:02:28 If http://www.infinity-universe.com/ ever makes it out of development, I'll certainly give it a go.
Trathen Minmatar	Posted - 2008.09.19 22:54:00 - [112] Edited by: Trathen on 19/09/2008 22:55:51 Originally by: Digital Solaris Oh, really? So you got any actual evidence to back that up or are you just talking out of your ass again? Oh if I had a dime for every knee-jerk response the letters "WoW" can create. No, I'm not going to exhaust search engines and the internet to appease some rude anonymous forum poster who can't do it himself. I charge for that. You'd have to try WAR to see what I'm getting at. Every MMO has a particular feel and pace. Guild Wars, for instance, has a different pace and style than WoW, which has a different pace and style than DAoC, and so forth. WAR delivers the pace of war, down to the 1.5 second global cooldown timer, run speeds, and push-pull respawn nature of the scenarios. I know someone else who decided to try WAR with a shadow warrior and decided to roll a different class because he was a hunter in WoW for 2 years. It doesn't carry over in that manner if you try a Ranger in GW, for instance. Oddly enough, there also seem to be a few DAoC fans in a state of denial. I have also been playing with people who played DAoC and not WoW who are utterly confused about certain design decisions, such that players are only allowed to choose 2 trade skills, or that you need to purchase skills after you level. There is very little doubt that WAR aimed to take WoW - specifically - and fix the problems with worthless or boring classes (tanks can PvP tank, healers have to become more involved in combat), then multiply the PvP scenario options one thousand fold. In other words, to make WoW into a true Orcs vs. Humans game, instead of a PvE game with arenas. Its that knee-jerk response to the letters "WoW" that make people think I'm trying to say its a bad game. I am subscribed... _
Empyre Domestic Reform	Posted - 2008.09.19 23:50:00 - [113] ^^ well said Trathen! Destroy all that which is evil, so that which is good may flourish.
Shagrath Neptune Series of Tubes	Posted - 2008.09.20 00:51:00 - [114] Actually, tanks {especially pure ones} were pretty useless in DAOC too so I hope War fixed that. In DAOC's pve, they were fine but once you got into RvR, everything was about range, stealth and spell casting. A lot of fighting in DAOC were sieges where the defenders would be on top of these tall keeps or forts shooting at the defenders with spells and arrows and vice versa. If you were a class with no range {tank} you got to stand there and look stupid because there was really not much you could do. Sure, there were other types of rvr such as 8-man where you could get fights in open fields where a tank could excel but you had better be part of an elite RvR guild for that. If you wanted casual pvp for just an hour or two a night, you had to join the zerg or siege and it was mostly about range. You better have a second acct for a buffbot too if you don't constantly run with a group. Even if you do, support chars were hard to find as no one wanted to play them and prefered damage dealers.
Wendat Huron Stellar Solutions	Posted - 2008.09.20 00:52:00 - [115] Originally by: Sexiest Beast Originally by: Aioa I was just thinking we need another game with elves and goblins. How original! What will they come up with next? World of Warcraft (1994) Warhammer 40K (circa 1987) Although WH40K does have Orcs, Goblins, and various flavors of Elves it does have Tanks and Chainsaw Weilding Space Marines Warhammer Fantasy RPG (1986) These forums are FUBAR, upgrade this decade!
SoftRevolution	Posted - 2008.09.20 01:30:00 - [116] Edited by: SoftRevolution on 20/09/2008 01:34:01 Edited by: SoftRevolution on 20/09/2008 01:31:37 Originally by: Shagrath Neptune Actually, tanks {especially pure ones} were pretty useless in DAOC too so I hope War fixed that. In DAOC's pve, they were fine but once you got into RvR, everything was about range, stealth and spell casting. A lot of fighting in DAOC were sieges where the defenders would be on top of these tall keeps or forts shooting at the defenders with spells and arrows and vice versa. If you were a class with no range {tank} you got to stand there and look stupid because there was really not much you could do. Sure, there were other types of rvr such as 8-man where you could get fights in open fields where a tank could excel but you had better be part of an elite RvR guild for that. If you wanted casual pvp for just an hour or two a night, you had to join the zerg or siege and it was mostly about range. You better have a second acct for a buffbot too if you don't constantly run with a group. Even if you do, support chars were hard to find as no one wanted to play them and prefered 4damage dealers. Hehehe. Definitely had that experience while trying to take a keep. Crowded stairway, nothing but hunters and bright wizards spamming into it while I get to stay out of the way and heal at a much reduced rate because my char is supposed to be hitting people in melee. It also at times seemed like noone doing the PVP stuff on the other had rolled anything but a ranged damage dealer... but then with proper support our melee guys were quite capable of running amok in the middle of them. There's mechanisms to try and make tanking work in PVP so the tanks can share and reduce damage done to friendly targets and gain grudge/rage whatever and can also physically block you, snare you, knock you back etc. I also didn't find one of the two classes I played all that similar to anything I tried in WoW so I think that's not a fair claim. The other had some similarities but definitely wasn't 1:1.
Empyre Domestic Reform	Posted - 2008.09.20 03:56:00 - [117] Edited by: Empyre on 20/09/2008 04:03:31 Originally by: Shagrath Neptune Actually, tanks {especially pure ones} were pretty useless in DAOC too so I hope War fixed that. In DAOC's pve, they were fine but once you got into RvR, everything was about range, stealth and spell casting. A lot of fighting in DAOC were sieges where the defenders would be on top of these tall keeps or forts shooting at the defenders with spells and arrows and vice versa. If you were a class with no range {tank} you got to stand there and look stupid because there was really not much you could do. Sure, there were other types of rvr such as 8-man where you could get fights in open fields where a tank could excel but you had better be part of an elite RvR guild for that. If you wanted casual pvp for just an hour or two a night, you had to join the zerg or siege and it was mostly about range. You better have a second acct for a buffbot too if you don't constantly run with a group. Even if you do, support chars were hard to find as no one wanted to play them and prefered damage dealers. On the server I play there is an armada of Warrior Priests. Ranged classes seem on par with everything else except W-P. And while they have huge range, it seems other classes can counter pretty well. I was just in RvR and the destructos were chilling out of range of the siege vehicles trying to tag me. I was surprised that some of my defensive spells that are cast on enemies were able to reach (like the de-taunt/-50% dmg taken). I have yet to play a tank but they seem to pwn me on the battlefield enough. They look really freaking cool, too. PS. EA should die for forcing us to sit through their stupid intro credits every.single.time. At least they fixed it so you don't have to go through the EULA process every time you log in. (nm, still have to go through one of the EULAs) Destroy all that which is evil, so that which is good may flourish.
Pesky LaRue Minmatar L.O.S.T. Defence Force	Posted - 2008.09.20 04:16:00 - [118] Originally by: Shagrath Neptune Yeah, I was excited when that guy posted the link but I just spent the past half hour reading up on it and this thing has been in development for eight years now..lol The last time a game took anything near that long to develop, it was "Dark and Light" which turned out to be a colossal failure when they finally opened the doors. A half baked game full of bugs and only a very small fraction of the features promised. Hopefully, Darkfall will be different but when a game has that many setbacks, it can't be a good sign. precisely my feelings on Darkfall (to say nothing of it being yet ANOTHER swords & sorcery based game) but thank you for reminding me of the utter, tragic failure of Dark & Light - arguably the worst piece of shit i ever had the misfortune to try This message came from the Minmatar Messiah, accept no imitations Pesky LaRue, Minmatar Messiah Bringing Salvation To Your System Soon! ++ PRAY FOR PESKY ++
Lui Kai Better Than You	Posted - 2008.09.20 13:59:00 - [119] I've been giving it a go. So far, it's enjoyable - though I don't know if it has the staying power for a high-playtime gamer. Overall, it plays like a more polished, less cartoon-ish WoW, with a stronger emphasis on pvp and a stronger de-emphasis on pve. ---------------- Ambulation Answers

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