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Kayosoni
Caldari
Destructive Influence
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2008.10.29 10:07:00 -
[1]
CCP you have my blessing for this patch. The changes to speed will do wonders for making fleet fights fun again.
just wait and see.
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Amira Shadowsong
Caldari
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Posted - 2008.10.29 10:12:00 -
[2]
 Originally by: Kayosoni
CCP you have my blessing for this patch. The changes to speed will do wonders for making fleet fights fun again.
just wait and see.
Totally agree.
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Nye Jaran
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Posted - 2008.10.29 11:18:00 -
[3]
I don't know about the massive fleet fights, but I know that the upcoming patch has actually got my corp active again in preparation. So much awesome stuff is coming out it makes up for EA.
The speed change is eh, too many things outside of nano still getting nerfed way too hard (my opinion) by the changes. The possibility of changing 0.0 local though.... *drools*
We might actually be able to play Eve the way we have all REALLY wanted to for a long time.
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Murina
The Scope
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Posted - 2008.10.29 11:36:00 -
[4]
I see nothing good about these changes unless you count encouraging blobbing to be a good thing, ppl will say screw that lets just bring a bigger blob and spam dps......crap changes and only good for ppl who play eve and pvp in their heads, paper tiger nerfing FTL.
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El Mauru
Amarr
Quantum Industries
RAZOR Alliance
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Posted - 2008.10.29 12:11:00 -
[5]
Actually agree with the op.
All the testing I did on sisi in the various setups so far has been more fun than i imagined it to be.
About the blobbing thing: We'll have to see I guess. BS blobs will still be too difficult to maneuver around with on a large scale and using dictors to hold up pursuing blobs will be as effective as never before.
-
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Crellion
Art of War
Exalted.
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Posted - 2008.10.29 15:09:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Kayosoni
CCP you have my blessing for this patch. The changes to speed will do wonders for making fleet fights fun again.
just wait and see.
No offence m8 but we are not all that into fleet fights, though I can't argue with you that it does buff blobing quite a bit.
Assuming you are the original Kayasoni though, with all the stuff your account has done in pvp I am somewhat surprised you still get kicks from blob v blob.
Arguably my opinions represent to an extent the opinions of my alliance and in particular circumstances give rise to a valid "casus belli" claim. |
Shard Merchant
Minmatar
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Posted - 2008.10.29 15:15:00 -
[7]
Wow, this thread couldn't be more ambiguous if it tried.
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lebrata
Hedion University
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Posted - 2008.10.29 15:22:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Shard Merchant
Wow, this thread couldn't be more ambiguous if it tried.
What do you expect lol, the anti nerf guys and gals are posting problems along with examples from the test server showing how screwed up this whole idea is, while the best we get from the pro nerfits is:-
Originally by: Amira Shadowsong
Originally by: Kayosoni
CCP you have my blessing for this patch. The changes to speed will do wonders for making fleet fights fun again.
just wait and see.
Totally agree.
Nothing like a detailed and highly technical report from the nerf hounds to boost support for this disgrace to gaming skill and ability.
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Shard Merchant
Minmatar
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Posted - 2008.10.29 16:41:00 -
[9]
You mean like the detailed and highly technical reports I posted all over?
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Marconus Orion
Amarr
Astroglide X
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Posted - 2008.10.29 16:47:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Murina
I see nothing good about these changes unless you count encouraging blobbing to be a good thing, ppl will say screw that lets just bring a bigger blob and spam dps......crap changes and only good for ppl who play eve and pvp in their heads, paper tiger nerfing FTL.
NOTHING will ever make people decide NOT to bring more numbers. People want to win, and no matter what game changes happen, superior numbers will always be a tactic.
Enough about the "(insert any change here) encourages blobbing!" Its getting really old. Players will always, always blog if they have the people to do it.
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Kayosoni
Caldari
Destructive Influence
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2008.10.29 17:01:00 -
[11]
What I mean is, to put it kind of vaguely, the current fleet warfare of bringing all BSs and some token support + dictors/hictors will not work after the patch. It will require much more fleet diversification. It's pretty obvious why and what's going to happen in fleet battles if you think about it for 10 minutes.
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Ass Eels
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Posted - 2008.10.29 17:10:00 -
[12]
I have thought about it for 10 minutes.... everyone will sit in a bubble and get DD'd, that is what will happen. Alternately everyone will fight at 0km because of the boredom involved in moving :)
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Veldya
Guristari Freedom Fighters
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Posted - 2008.10.29 17:12:00 -
[13]
Good for fleet fights, absolute **** for everything else.
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Crackzilla
The Shadow Order
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Posted - 2008.10.29 17:15:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Kayosoni
...will require much more fleet diversification...
My guess is we'll see standard fleets with tacklers/dictors/hics, nanos, and battleships. Not much different than today.
Running gangs of pure battleships won't be as viable but lets face it. Pure battleship gangs are mostly a low sec thing. Gangs of just hacs might be viable still to gank ratters etc.
So the only difference is that the ratio of battleships/nanos change.
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Kayosoni
Caldari
Destructive Influence
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2008.10.29 17:17:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Veldya
Good for fleet fights, absolute **** for everything else.
honestly it's not really different from how it is now. battleships cannot hit frigs/cruisers, and since webs are 60% only, frigs webbed still have a chance to live, and cruisers webbed by battleships also still have a chance to live.
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Kayosoni
Caldari
Destructive Influence
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2008.10.29 17:19:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Crackzilla
Originally by: Kayosoni
...will require much more fleet diversification...
My guess is we'll see standard fleets with tacklers/dictors/hics, nanos, and battleships. Not much different than today.
Running gangs of pure battleships won't be as viable but lets face it. Pure battleship gangs are mostly a low sec thing. Gangs of just hacs might be viable still to gank ratters etc.
So the only difference is that the ratio of battleships/nanos change.
well, fact is nothing on sisi can hit assault frigs or interceptors except other assault frigs or inters. Even a vaga and ishtar can't hit my webbed hawk on sisi. hacs are useless against frigates now. interceptors will be for tackling targets with MWDs (dictors/hictors) and AFs will excel at killing hacs/recons. I dunno if hacs will even be useful at all since they have been relegated to a role in fleet fights that battleships do - killing bs and cruisers.
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Veldya
Guristari Freedom Fighters
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Posted - 2008.10.29 17:33:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Kayosoni
What I mean is, to put it kind of vaguely, the current fleet warfare of bringing all BSs and some token support + dictors/hictors will not work after the patch. It will require much more fleet diversification. It's pretty obvious why and what's going to happen in fleet battles if you think about it for 10 minutes.
People take BS and T2 ships because they are generally the only ships that can survive DDs, can shoot at long range.
Lack of range is the main reason why smaller ships aren't of much use.
If more smaller ships are going to be more common then fleets will just employ a few more tacklers. These changes do nothing really for fleet battles. Small ships still wont have range to do ****.
If frigate fleets become more common you will just see battleships load up with Warrior IIs instead of no drones and just use them for the small trash.
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lecrotta
lecrotta Corp
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Posted - 2008.10.29 17:33:00 -
[18]
Edited by: lecrotta on 29/10/2008 17:34:52
Originally by: Kayosoni
well, fact is nothing on sisi can hit assault frigs or interceptors except other assault frigs or inters.
Even a vaga and ishtar can't hit my webbed hawk on sisi.
In gang combat or are you preaching the ultra rare 1 v 1 scenario again?.
Originally by: Kayosoni
hacs are useless
Snipped abit off but this is the first accurate thing you have posted.
Originally by: Kayosoni
interceptors will be for tackling targets with MWDs (dictors/hictors) and AFs will excel at killing hacs/recons.
You think balance is AF's being i-win ships against 100mil + fittings ships?.
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Veldya
Guristari Freedom Fighters
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Posted - 2008.10.29 17:37:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Kayosoni
Originally by: Veldya
Good for fleet fights, absolute **** for everything else.
honestly it's not really different from how it is now. battleships cannot hit frigs/cruisers, and since webs are 60% only, frigs webbed still have a chance to live, and cruisers webbed by battleships also still have a chance to live.
At close range battleships moving at AB speed are going to take significantly less damage than they used to from BS class weapons. There is just going to be a whole lot of craptastic damage going on unless fleets are immobile.
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Esmenet
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Posted - 2008.10.29 17:42:00 -
[20]
The only eve patch that has made me consider quitting EVE.
I'll probably see a bit how it works out on tranq, but i'm leaning towards quitting atm.
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Dizeezer Velar
Caldari
League of Disgruntled Fast Food Employees
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Posted - 2008.10.29 17:55:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Esmenet
The only eve patch that has made me consider quitting EVE.
I'll probably see a bit how it works out on tranq, but i'm leaning towards quitting atm.
I agree, horrible patch with too many residual nerfs. Not sure how it is great for fleets. I see less diversification as everyone now will be training amarr for their turret range/dmg over the other races gimpy ships. The patch is devestating to solo/small gang warfare, with the web nerf hurting the most. That is unless you enjoy flying AF, which i consider to be less than fun.
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Veldya
Guristari Freedom Fighters
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Posted - 2008.10.29 17:59:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Kayosoni
well, fact is nothing on sisi can hit assault frigs or interceptors except other assault frigs or inters. Even a vaga and ishtar can't hit my webbed hawk on sisi. hacs are useless against frigates now. interceptors will be for tackling targets with MWDs (dictors/hictors) and AFs will excel at killing hacs/recons. I dunno if hacs will even be useful at all since they have been relegated to a role in fleet fights that battleships do - killing bs and cruisers.
Ammusingly the HAC that was the worst against fast ships is now the best, Cerberus using assault launcher will be able to take out AFs and Intys.
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Crackzilla
The Shadow Order
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Posted - 2008.10.29 18:01:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Kayosoni
fact is nothing on sisi can hit assault frigs or interceptors except other assault frigs or inters.
Maybe 1v1 at point blank. What I found was that if a hac could keep its distance then the af/ceptor would be torn up. A zealot and deimos did a number on my af's that I tested. And an ishtar with sentry drones setup for distance was murder at 100km. Just seems that frigs no longer pop nearly so quickly as they did before.
In fleet fights it is rarely 1v1.
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Murina
The Scope
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Posted - 2008.10.29 18:15:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Crackzilla
Originally by: Kayosoni
fact is nothing on sisi can hit assault frigs or interceptors except other assault frigs or inters.
Maybe 1v1 at point blank. What I found was that if a hac could keep its distance then the af/ceptor would be torn up. A zealot and deimos did a number on my af's that I tested. And an ishtar with sentry drones setup for distance was murder at 100km. Just seems that frigs no longer pop nearly so quickly as they did before.
In fleet fights it is rarely 1v1.
/signed
I just tested a BC vs a ceptor that was orbiting at mwd and afterburner speeds and at range to simulate a situation where a ceptor would be tackling a gang member.
The ceptor got owned with pulse and beams so bad it was painful to watch.
This patch sucks.
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Keflin Geard
Black Nova Corp
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2008.10.29 18:41:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Kayosoni
well, fact is nothing on sisi can hit assault frigs or interceptors except other assault frigs or inters. Even a vaga and ishtar can't hit my webbed hawk on sisi. hacs are useless against frigates now. interceptors will be for tackling targets with MWDs (dictors/hictors) and AFs will excel at killing hacs/recons. I dunno if hacs will even be useful at all since they have been relegated to a role in fleet fights that battleships do - killing bs and cruisers.
15m ships slaughtering 120m ships on a level playing field makes no sense - the progression from cheap to expensive ships is what eve is about - People will just start flying lots of cheap ships and the people who get killed now will be the same people getting people killed after the patch - they just wont have much to aspire to and older players will die of boredom.
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Spurty
Caldari
D00M.
Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.10.29 18:48:00 -
[26]
if you want to do away with blobs, drop all ships hit points down so low that the first to fire gets the kill and everyone else is left twiddling their thumbs!
Like that idea right? No, didn't think so, thus there is no solution to blobs.
Blobs exist to make fights end fast so people can fight in relative safely.
People are people, you can't fix blobs with speeding ships up, its just forcing them to call on people in dedicated ships.
1 to 'ecm'.
1 to 'web'.
1 to 'neut'.
1 to 'tank'.
1 to 'dps'.
Yes, some freak 1v1 fights break out from time to time, but the large majority of those are corp mates 'testing' their skills.
Man goes to the doc, with a strawberry growing out of his head. Doc says "I'll give you some cream to put on it." |
Dizeezer Velar
Caldari
League of Disgruntled Fast Food Employees
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Posted - 2008.10.29 18:56:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Spurty
if you want to do away with blobs, drop all ships hit points down so low that the first to fire gets the kill and everyone else is left twiddling their thumbs!
Like that idea right? No, didn't think so, thus there is no solution to blobs.
Blobs exist to make fights end fast so people can fight in relative safely.
People are people, you can't fix blobs with speeding ships up, its just forcing them to call on people in dedicated ships.
1 to 'ecm'.
1 to 'web'.
1 to 'neut'.
1 to 'tank'.
1 to 'dps'.
Yes, some freak 1v1 fights break out from time to time, but the large majority of those are corp mates 'testing' their skills.
That is bang on true for 0.0 pvp but not the case for lowsec or empire engagements. Small fights happen all the time, and arguably they are the most fun. At least in my experience (blobs and fleet warfare sux, mainly due to lag). My worry is that I wont be able to hold a target with one web long enough before it reaches a gate to jump out of a fight.
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Dizeezer Velar
Caldari
League of Disgruntled Fast Food Employees
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Posted - 2008.10.29 18:58:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Keflin Geard
Originally by: Kayosoni
well, fact is nothing on sisi can hit assault frigs or interceptors except other assault frigs or inters. Even a vaga and ishtar can't hit my webbed hawk on sisi. hacs are useless against frigates now. interceptors will be for tackling targets with MWDs (dictors/hictors) and AFs will excel at killing hacs/recons. I dunno if hacs will even be useful at all since they have been relegated to a role in fleet fights that battleships do - killing bs and cruisers.
15m ships slaughtering 120m ships on a level playing field makes no sense - the progression from cheap to expensive ships is what eve is about - People will just start flying lots of cheap ships and the people who get killed now will be the same people getting people killed after the patch - they just wont have much to aspire to and older players will die of boredom.
agreed
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lecrotta
lecrotta Corp
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Posted - 2008.10.29 19:01:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Spurty
People are people, you can't fix blobs with speeding ships up, its just forcing them to call on people in dedicated ships.
1 to 'ecm'.
1 to 'web'.
1 to 'neut'.
1 to 'tank'.
1 to 'dps'.
What you have their is variety and versatility not blobbing.
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August Guns
Minmatar
Infinite ISK.
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Posted - 2008.10.29 19:10:00 -
[30]
All the nano patch does is move the FOTM from nanos to recons.
August Guns |
Kepakh
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Posted - 2008.10.29 19:44:00 -
[31]
Originally by: Murina
/signed
I just tested a BC vs a ceptor that was orbiting at mwd and afterburner speeds and at range to simulate a situation where a ceptor would be tackling a gang member.
The ceptor got owned with pulse and beams so bad it was painful to watch.
This patch sucks.
You mind to post the setup of your test?
My results are way different... Since they added reduced MWD sig penalty bonus, inty orbiting at 5km/s is untouchable by medium turrets.
Just in terms of raw chance to hit, not saying you can't kill it.
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Murina
The Scope
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Posted - 2008.10.29 20:40:00 -
[32]
Originally by: Kepakh
Originally by: Murina
/signed
I just tested a BC vs a ceptor that was orbiting at mwd and afterburner speeds and at range to simulate a situation where a ceptor would be tackling a gang member.
The ceptor got owned with pulse and beams so bad it was painful to watch.
This patch sucks.
You mind to post the setup of your test?
My results are way different... Since they added reduced MWD sig penalty bonus, inty orbiting at 5km/s is untouchable by medium turrets.
Just in terms of raw chance to hit, not saying you can't kill it.
As far as im aware the pilot was a med-high skilled amaar BC pilot fitted for anti support and tank although he did mix pulse and beams on the top rack to save refit time
I was flying the ceptor and the BC was fitted with beams and pulse as we were testing if it could hit regularly with each weapon type and a variety of ammo.
The ceptor was 5kms fitted orbiting a jettisoned container not the BC and while doing so the BC easily hit the inty. I never tested it orbiting the BC as it seemed irrelevant for a gang combat test as you cannot be at 0 to multiple ships.
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Roemy Schneider
BINFORD
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Posted - 2008.10.29 20:52:00 -
[33]
it's a new game, really. the basic combat mechanics are being shoved around quite a bit. i see lots of potential there.
however, if CCP's reaction time to obviously broken mechanics stays like this and we have to go through (re)balancing for the next 2-3 years because lasers are the FotM or the next ECM overhaul takes months or drones hit everything or whatever, then "history repeating" will outclass/~gun/~number the potential any time
-
putting the gist back into logistics |
oilio
Caldari
State War Academy
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Posted - 2008.10.29 21:15:00 -
[34]
Edited by: oilio on 29/10/2008 21:15:09
Originally by: Roemy Schneider
it's a new game, really.
Indeed. Seems we're all about to have a New Gaming Experience!  |
Fulber
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Posted - 2008.10.29 21:26:00 -
[35]
Originally by: oilio
Edited by: oilio on 29/10/2008 21:15:09
Originally by: Roemy Schneider
it's a new game, really.
Indeed. Seems we're all about to have a New Gaming Experience!
I see what you did there. |
Washell Olivaw
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Posted - 2008.10.29 23:01:00 -
[36]
Originally by: Fulber
Originally by: oilio
Edited by: oilio on 29/10/2008 21:15:09
Originally by: Roemy Schneider
it's a new game, really.
Indeed. Seems we're all about to have a New Gaming Experience!
I see what you did there.
That would also involve removing 90% of the skills and kill the industry and economy by making all the best equipment quest based and non-tradeable.
Originally by: Signature
Everybody has a photographic memory, some people just don't have film.
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oilio
Caldari
State War Academy
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Posted - 2008.10.29 23:19:00 -
[37]
Edited by: oilio on 29/10/2008 23:19:16
Originally by: Washell Olivaw
That would also involve removing 90% of the skills and kill the industry and economy by making all the best equipment quest based and non-tradeable.[/quote
SSSSHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!
Someone from CCP might be taking notes!
You might have set the roadmap for the next "re-balancing" |
Washell Olivaw
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Posted - 2008.10.29 23:24:00 -
[38]
Originally by: oilio
Someone from CCP might be taking notes!
You might have set the roadmap for the next "re-balancing"
As long as they're not bought by LucasArts I'm not worried.
Or EA, but that's for whole other reasons.
Originally by: Signature
Everybody has a photographic memory, some people just don't have film.
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Freakdevil
Phantom Squad
Axiom Empire
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Posted - 2008.10.29 23:59:00 -
[39]
This patch is really a boost to low sec if you think about it.
Webs are much weaker now. Blasterships have tracking issues. Transport ships might be able to fit covert ops cloaks.
Honestly, this patch sounds like a good recipe for more pew pew in low sec.
It will be good.
/signed
btw, I do think Rapier pilots are getting royally screwed and CCP should really look at changing the bonus of target painter to armor tanking. Sounds crazy but the ship has very little chance now. Other recons will shine best.
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Gypsio III
Dirty Filthy Perverts
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Posted - 2008.10.30 00:12:00 -
[40]
Yeah, because target painters won't be useful at all in a world of sig tanks... 
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Esmenet
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Posted - 2008.10.30 00:39:00 -
[41]
Originally by: Freakdevil
This patch is really a boost to low sec if you think about it.
It just means you need a (much) bigger blob.
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Kepakh
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Posted - 2008.10.30 22:36:00 -
[42]
Edited by: Kepakh on 30/10/2008 22:37:34
Originally by: Murina
As far as im aware the pilot was a med-high skilled amaar BC pilot fitted for anti support and tank although he did mix pulse and beams on the top rack to save refit time
I was flying the ceptor and the BC was fitted with beams and pulse as we were testing if it could hit regularly with each weapon type and a variety of ammo.
The ceptor was 5kms fitted orbiting a jettisoned container not the BC and while doing so the BC easily hit the inty. I never tested it orbiting the BC as it seemed irrelevant for a gang combat test as you cannot be at 0 to multiple ships.
OK, I see. Your statement is rather misleading, I would say. Even now on TQ, you can't tackle the target and being under fire from other ships. Basicaly once you are targeted by other ship than target you are supposed to tackle, it is high time to disengage.
If you want to tackle on Sisi, you can do it(it is much harder to hit an inty in some cases). No protection from missiles though.
EDIT: Typos
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Cpt Branko
Surge.
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Posted - 2008.10.31 02:23:00 -
[43]
Originally by: Freakdevil
This patch is really a boost to low sec if you think about it.
Webs are much weaker now. Blasterships have tracking issues. Transport ships might be able to fit covert ops cloaks.
Honestly, this patch sounds like a good recipe for more pew pew in low sec.
Like how?
More blobbing in low-sec, yeah. Since the only way to reliably get kills is bring ****loads of DPS given how weak webbing is... and how badly big ships which can tank sentries fare out of a blob (and how well within a blob) post patch.
Sig removed, inappropriate link. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint |
Cpt Branko
Surge.
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Posted - 2008.10.31 02:28:00 -
[44]
Originally by: Kayosoni
well, fact is nothing on sisi can hit assault frigs or interceptors except other assault frigs or inters. Even a vaga and ishtar can't hit my webbed hawk on sisi. hacs are useless against frigates now.
Yeah, because the 0.01 angular velocity which you will have vs people's gang mates will really make you speedtank. Of course.
Originally by: Kayosoni
What I mean is, to put it kind of vaguely, the current fleet warfare of bringing all BSs and some token support + dictors/hictors will not work after the patch. It will require much more fleet diversification. It's pretty obvious why and what's going to happen in fleet battles if you think about it for 10 minutes.
It will. See above.
Originally by: Marconus Orion
NOTHING will ever make people decide NOT to bring more numbers. People want to win, and no matter what game changes happen, superior numbers will always be a tactic.
Which is a valid reason to make other tactics unviable.
Sig removed, inappropriate link. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint |
Nian Banks
Minmatar
Berserkers of Aesir
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Posted - 2008.10.31 03:51:00 -
[45]
Well to combat blobs, CCP could always implement something similar to the warhammer 40k army rules.
Basically you have to have a balanced force, you must have a leader, infantry, then heavy and specialized... Class certain ships in different categories of combat. Then make is that gang bonuses only work in a fleet and the fleet must be structured as a fleet with the mix. Bring back gangs for those who want unbalanced blobs but gang bonuses won't work.
Then we can introduce more leadership skills that have an effect on damage, weapon range, tracking, sensor strength, drone damage - speed - hitpoints...
Make it that the balanced fleet gets the bonuses and it is unfavorable to just blob without a mix.
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Cpt Branko
Surge.
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Posted - 2008.10.31 10:53:00 -
[46]
Originally by: Kepakh
My results are way different... Since they added reduced MWD sig penalty bonus, inty orbiting at 5km/s is untouchable by medium turrets.
Just in terms of raw chance to hit, not saying you can't kill it.
Which is sortof stupid since on TQ if you want to be untouchable by medium turrets, you can do it (and be successful in gang on gang situations too) if you're going to sink some ISK into your interceptor. Alternatively, you could just accept the fact that attempting to perma-tackle in a 15 mil T2 fit interceptor is very risky business. Personally, I always considered that to be quite fair/sensible - you could make a interceptor highly survivable if you were not a cheapskate, while cheapskate unrigged fits were semi-disposable tacklers.
I do not think a 15 mil ship should keep me perma-tackled and at the same time removing its ability to be pimped (and removing its ability to survive in gang situations, where 5km/s is not going to provide enough capability to get to places fast / gtfo / create enough transversal to all targets in gang to work) is good. But w/e, it's not like, if I can be bothered to play post-patch, that I'll fly any bigger ships without a gang to start with.
Why CCP are balancing ships like interceptors to be better for solo while sucking for gangs is beyond me, however. Interceptors don't need sig tanking. It does not work for gangs.
Sig removed, inappropriate link. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint |
sliver 0xD
exiles.
The Kadeshi
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Posted - 2008.10.31 11:02:00 -
[47]
Edited by: sliver 0xD on 31/10/2008 11:03:29
Originally by: Crellion
Originally by: Kayosoni
CCP you have my blessing for this patch. The changes to speed will do wonders for making fleet fights fun again.
just wait and see.
No offence m8 but we are not all that into fleet fights, though I can't argue with you that it does buff blobing quite a bit.
Assuming you are the original Kayasoni though, with all the stuff your account has done in pvp I am somewhat surprised you still get kicks from blob v blob.
agree, more players that did blob now moved on and decided to go solo / small gang. it has more tractics and will show skill in the game.
however this patch hits these persons directly and helps the players that only know how to blob.
i find it disapointing that small gangs get hit hard by this and big blobs get a boost.
i still think that eve should leve more choice and not leave u with only 1 choice that is good.
---
Somebody needs a hug! |
Jarne
Increasing Success by Lowering Expectations
Vanguard.
|
Posted - 2008.10.31 12:04:00 -
[48]
You still have tiki bmp helping you out at the Vlillirier Roden Shipyards station ;)
-
Success=Achievements/Expectations
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Crellion
Art of War
Exalted.
|
Posted - 2008.10.31 16:36:00 -
[49]
Originally by: Kayosoni
What I mean is, to put it kind of vaguely, the current fleet warfare of bringing all BSs and some token support + dictors/hictors will not work after the patch. It will require much more fleet diversification. It's pretty obvious why and what's going to happen in fleet battles if you think about it for 10 minutes.
I am not arguing here. Just saying:
If the enemy 30 are 10 BSs 10 Reckons and 10 AFs and friendly 30 are 10 BSs 10 Reckons and 10 BSs with small guns and drones who will win?
I am not actually saying I will fit Mega with 150IIs x 8 or Ravens with 6xassault launchers but if I did and your fleet had 1AF pilot for every 1 stupid boy me BS we had,who would win??? (counting tanks and Heavy Neuts and drones). I think the above is a rhetorical question innit?
Now I have only the outmost respect for whoever has rubbed my face or my alt's face in the dirt once or twice allready in alliance pvp tourneys but I am still fairly sure that (a) CCP did not go far enough to make anything smaller than a BS better than a BS capsule for capsule (as opposed to isk v isk) (b) I dont think they will ever go that far.
I for one dont envision as much diversification coming out of this patch as you do but ...meh...
Arguably my opinions represent to an extent the opinions of my alliance and in particular circumstances give rise to a valid "casus belli" claim. |
Dizeezer Velar
Caldari
League of Disgruntled Fast Food Employees
|
Posted - 2008.10.31 16:46:00 -
[50]
Let me tell you how I see this patch helping diversification, as intended by Nozh.
Amarr pulse boats. Anything less, is inferior. Some pretty good diversity there dont you think?
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Poast Warrior
Imperial Academy
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Posted - 2008.10.31 19:52:00 -
[51]
It really will be the best patch ever and will reduce lag 10 fold. Unfortunately that's because no one will be playing.
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Dizeezer Velar
Caldari
League of Disgruntled Fast Food Employees
|
Posted - 2008.10.31 20:51:00 -
[52]
Originally by: Poast Warrior
It really will be the best patch ever and will reduce lag 10 fold. Unfortunately that's because no one will be playing.
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Rexthor Hammerfists
Rage of Inferno
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Posted - 2008.10.31 20:53:00 -
[53]
I love this patch, puts a smile on my face the second i get todo anything eve related these days :)
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Boosters and PirateProfessions
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lebrata
Hedion University
|
Posted - 2008.10.31 20:58:00 -
[54]
Edited by: lebrata on 31/10/2008 21:04:32
Amaar BC fitted for range/tracking/dmg, gallente logistics, caldari ewar, and maybe a minmatar webber/tackler or two = The new "i-win" gang setup in eve.......
This nerf has reduced worthwhile ship options instead of expanding them.
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Dizeezer Velar
Caldari
League of Disgruntled Fast Food Employees
|
Posted - 2008.11.02 17:05:00 -
[55]
Originally by: Rexthor Hammerfists
I love this patch, puts a smile on my face the second i get todo anything eve related these days :)
To be honest, this is a great patch for the noobies because it really boosts frigs and mid sized ships that do not take a whole lot of time to train up to fly effectively. It is a nerf to the older players who have invested alot of time into speccing BS sized hull ships.
So if you are a noobie, i can see you loving this patch.
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Crode
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Posted - 2008.11.02 19:33:00 -
[56]
Originally by: Dizeezer Velar
To be honest, this is a great patch for the noobies because it really boosts frigs and mid sized ships that do not take a whole lot of time to train up to fly effectively. It is a nerf to the older players who have invested alot of time into speccing BS sized hull ships.
So if you are a noobie, i can see you loving this patch.
That seems very true so far with what I have been reading. And it would be a good change. It give people like me (4 months training) something useful to do in PvP. New players don't want to train for 5 years to become something other than a one-shot target.
Now.. I am not saying I want to take out cruisers or battleships, but to be able to survive an encounter (run away) from anything bigger than what I am flying.
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Virgo I'Platonicus
Ex Eventus Corpi
|
Posted - 2008.11.03 19:49:00 -
[57]
Totally agree with op :)
V.
<3 |
Q429
|
Posted - 2008.11.04 04:32:00 -
[58]
Edited by: Q429 on 04/11/2008 04:35:40
Originally by: oilio
Edited by: oilio on 29/10/2008 21:15:09
Originally by: Roemy Schneider
it's a new game, really.
Indeed. Seems we're all about to have a New Gaming Experience!
sounds vaguely familiar...like a bad dream or....ZOMg i'm having flashbacks
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Ezekiel Sulastin
Gallente
Art of War
Exalted.
|
Posted - 2008.11.04 05:13:00 -
[59]
Originally by: Crode
That seems very true so far with what I have been reading. And it would be a good change. It give people like me (4 months training) something useful to do in PvP. New players don't want to train for 5 years to become something other than a one-shot target.
Now.. I am not saying I want to take out cruisers or battleships, but to be able to survive an encounter (run away) from anything bigger than what I am flying.
... because certainly when I was new to PVP I would never take ships like my Thorax out against carriers and battleships regardless of what else was there. Oh wait, I DID.
If you feel you're able to do nothing even in a frigate, you probably shouldn't worry so much about PVPing at this point. And don't worry - since the Heavy Neutraliser is the new FOTM module for BS, you'll still die just as bad as before ^^
----
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Muad' Dib
Gallente
Beyond Divinity Inc
|
Posted - 2008.11.04 12:31:00 -
[60]
Originally by: Kayosoni
Originally by: Veldya
Good for fleet fights, absolute **** for everything else.
honestly it's not really different from how it is now. battleships cannot hit frigs/cruisers, and since webs are 60% only, frigs webbed still have a chance to live, and cruisers webbed by battleships also still have a chance to live.
Want me to find frigs killed by battleships or even a t1 frig by your sieged moros's in low-sec on your own killboard or are you gonna ad the 'depends on case' line now ?
---
I smack just for myself.
[orange]Your signature is too large. Please resi |
Wrayeth
Sharks With Frickin' Laser Beams
|
Posted - 2008.11.04 12:54:00 -
[61]
TBH, who the hell cares about fleet fights when all other combat in EVE will suck unless you enjoy flying frigs and cruisers?
Worst patch ever.
-Wrayeth
n00b Extraordinaire
"Look, pa! I just contributed absolutely nothing to this thread!" |
DeadDuck
Amarr
Amarr Border Defense Consortium
Curatores Veritatis Alliance
|
Posted - 2008.11.04 13:01:00 -
[62]
Originally by: Muad' Dib
Originally by: Kayosoni
Originally by: Veldya
Good for fleet fights, absolute **** for everything else.
honestly it's not really different from how it is now. battleships cannot hit frigs/cruisers, and since webs are 60% only, frigs webbed still have a chance to live, and cruisers webbed by battleships also still have a chance to live.
Want me to find frigs killed by battleships or even a t1 frig by your sieged moros's in low-sec on your own killboard or are you gonna ad the 'depends on case' line now ?
Well that will happen after the patch also... neut them and then release the drones... plop... dead FRIG/AF ...
________________
God is my Wingman |
Cpt Branko
Surge.
|
Posted - 2008.11.04 13:46:00 -
[63]
Originally by: DeadDuck
Originally by: Muad' Dib
Originally by: Kayosoni
Originally by: Veldya
Good for fleet fights, absolute **** for everything else.
honestly it's not really different from how it is now. battleships cannot hit frigs/cruisers, and since webs are 60% only, frigs webbed still have a chance to live, and cruisers webbed by battleships also still have a chance to live.
Want me to find frigs killed by battleships or even a t1 frig by your sieged moros's in low-sec on your own killboard or are you gonna ad the 'depends on case' line now ?
Well that will happen after the patch also... neut them and then release the drones... plop... dead FRIG/AF ...
Uhhhh... Moros's drone bonus + Hobgoblin IIs = shredded frigates in seconds?
Sig removed, inappropriate link. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint |
Nemtar Nataal
Demonic Retribution
G00DFELLAS
|
Posted - 2008.11.04 13:56:00 -
[64]
Originally by: Kayosoni
CCP you have my blessing for this patch. The changes to speed will do wonders for making fleet fights fun again.
just wait and see.
'
Yes its so fantastic, we are all back to 16th century wafare 
 Why again does EVE evolve around bring everyone you can find to the same system get them onto the same grit and then shoot each other untill some one backs down.
 It isnt even funny and i think most people would agree that smale scale fights are more fun as you have a bigger chance of doing a diffrence as a individual.
Its a shame you could not find a middle ground where bothe Fleet, RR and Nano wafare could exist with our excluding one another. Now we have once again taken away a lot of the sand in the sand box and stream lined EVE towards one type of wafare rather then sevrel.
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Bellum Eternus
Gallente
Death of Virtue
|
Posted - 2008.11.04 13:58:00 -
[65]
Know what? If this speed change had been in effect about 6 months ago, I'd still have a 6 billion ISK Kronos sitting in my hangar.
I'm looking forward to having light drones actually be a problem for interceptors again.
Bellum Eternus
Inveniam viam aut faciam.
[Vid] I M M O R T A L
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Evan Batarr
|
Posted - 2008.11.04 14:51:00 -
[66]
Originally by: Wrayeth
TBH, who the hell cares about fleet fights when all other combat in EVE will suck unless you enjoy flying frigs and cruisers?
Worst patch ever.
/signed
And I completely disagree that fleet fights will become better more interesting - especially from a Minmatar Fleet BS pilot's view. Try and fit a Minmatar Sniper shooting at 200 km (and doing damage) and surviving a DD - works for all other races and also did for Minmatar until this ridiculously dumb patch! |
Evan Batarr
|
Posted - 2008.11.04 14:55:00 -
[67]
Originally by: DeadDuck
Originally by: Muad' Dib
Originally by: Kayosoni
Originally by: Veldya
Good for fleet fights, absolute **** for everything else.
honestly it's not really different from how it is now. battleships cannot hit frigs/cruisers, and since webs are 60% only, frigs webbed still have a chance to live, and cruisers webbed by battleships also still have a chance to live.
Want me to find frigs killed by battleships or even a t1 frig by your sieged moros's in low-sec on your own killboard or are you gonna ad the 'depends on case' line now ?
Well that will happen after the patch also... neut them and then release the drones... plop... dead FRIG/AF ...
LULZ - if the frig has a half-decent tank (plated Rifter anyone?) your drones pop before the Frig is in structure! And then you can only hope you have a perma-running active tank or you'll lose your BS to a Frig |
Cpt Branko
Surge.
|
Posted - 2008.11.04 15:23:00 -
[68]
Originally by: Evan Batarr
LULZ - if the frig has a half-decent tank (plated Rifter anyone?) your drones pop before the Frig is in structure! And then you can only hope you have a perma-running active tank or you'll lose your BS to a Frig
Was talking about Moros. Beastly dronebay, insane drone damage bonus, Dreadnaught? |
eliminator2
Gallente
Heretic Army
Heretic Nation
|
Posted - 2008.11.04 15:31:00 -
[69]
congrats ccp of making the game blobtastic and more further away from solo, congratz
id like to be the first to say welcome to blob online
great work on small tweaks thought they r good ccp i luv me self ^^ |
Evan Batarr
|
Posted - 2008.11.04 16:06:00 -
[70]
Originally by: Cpt Branko
Originally by: Evan Batarr
LULZ - if the frig has a half-decent tank (plated Rifter anyone?) your drones pop before the Frig is in structure! And then you can only hope you have a perma-running active tank or you'll lose your BS to a Frig
Was talking about Moros. Beastly dronebay, insane drone damage bonus, Dreadnaught?
Well, we were talking of BS. And you too in the beginning of your post - and WTF would attack a Moros in a frig? LULULZ again |
Cpt Branko
Surge.
|
Posted - 2008.11.04 16:06:00 -
[71]
Originally by: eliminator2
congrats ccp of making the game blobtastic and more further away from solo, congratz
Solo was obviously too common and totally like overpowered.
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Keflin Geard
Black Nova Corp
Band of Brothers
|
Posted - 2008.11.04 16:51:00 -
[72]
Originally by: Dizeezer Velar
Originally by: Rexthor Hammerfists
I love this patch, puts a smile on my face the second i get todo anything eve related these days :)
To be honest, this is a great patch for the noobies because it really boosts frigs and mid sized ships that do not take a whole lot of time to train up to fly effectively. It is a nerf to the older players who have invested alot of time into speccing BS sized hull ships.
So if you are a noobie, i can see you loving this patch.
No it wont - people are just going to fit there BCs and hacs with energy neuts and ecm and light weapons and dual wmd/ab set ups your still going to die horribly unless you bring 5 v 1 . The real difference is in a year if you are still playing your going to have the skills to fly better ships and there going to suck - you will download old eve vids and see how much fun hacs and recons used to be. You will wish that you had spent the first year paying your dues to learn the game like everybody else before you and could now look forward to being a badass in awesome tech II cruisers. This patch may be a short term boost for noobs but in the long run you are being cheated.
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