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LordInvisible
Gallente
The CULT OF DAMNED
Tear Extraction And Reclamation Service
   |
Posted - 2008.10.30 08:20:00 -
[1]
Edited by: LordInvisible on 30/10/2008 08:25:56
Edited by: LordInvisible on 30/10/2008 08:24:55
Edited by: LordInvisible on 30/10/2008 08:24:14
Hi!
Here is a collection of all threads in which PLAYER BASE expressed their POW about this EVE-NERF patch. All this topics about same track of issues, while CCP could only add stacking penalties to rigs and low slot modules and maybe (really maybe) put those pesky speed-implants in 2 same slots..
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=909767
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=910779
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=910486
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=907998
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=909164
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=847392
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=905631
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=887942
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=621219
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=834634
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=909150
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=905761
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=908380
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=903809
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=896144
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=909743
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=908793
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=908545
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=905067
!! http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=832371 !!
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We are recruting: Recruitment |
LordInvisible
Gallente
The CULT OF DAMNED
Tear Extraction And Reclamation Service
|
Posted - 2008.10.30 08:25:00 -
[2]
Edited by: LordInvisible on 30/10/2008 08:26:03
reserved
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=853059
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=904263
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=834562
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=909709
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=905797
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=910200
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=910752
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=909986
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We are recruting: Recruitment |
Sleepkevert
Amarr
Rionnag Alba
Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.10.30 08:29:00 -
[3]
Losing expensive implants?
Anyway, those who whine on the forums the loudest aren't always right, plus most of the people only see the nerf and never try it on sisi. So did I so I decide not to take a point in this debate. But, postcounts mean nothing, people that hate it will post, while people that are ok with it generally don't even look at the forums.
_
Add your own line! |
Murina
The Scope
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Posted - 2008.10.30 10:24:00 -
[4]
 Originally by: Sleepkevert
Losing expensive implants?
Anyway, those who whine on the forums the loudest aren't always right, plus most of the people only see the nerf and never try it on sisi. So did I so I decide not to take a point in this debate. But, postcounts mean nothing, people that hate it will post, while people that are ok with it generally don't even look at the forums.
And thats why the nerf was promoted in the first place, a limited few whiners posting thread after thread complaining about nano and blaming the game instead of improving their own piloting and team work skills, while every other player was getting on and learning new combat skills and generally enjoying the game.
And now that CCP has decided to utterly change combat in the game to moron level the experienced players are pointing out how bad this will be for skilled combat in eve.
And we are doing it enmasse.
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Remi Kulis
Caldari
Cellular Automaton Solutions
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Posted - 2008.10.30 10:56:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Murina
Originally by: Sleepkevert
Losing expensive implants?
Anyway, those who whine on the forums the loudest aren't always right, plus most of the people only see the nerf and never try it on sisi. So did I so I decide not to take a point in this debate. But, postcounts mean nothing, people that hate it will post, while people that are ok with it generally don't even look at the forums.
And thats why the nerf was promoted in the first place, a limited few whiners posting thread after thread complaining about nano and blaming the game instead of improving their own piloting and team work skills, while every other player was getting on and learning new combat skills and generally enjoying the game.
And now that CCP has decided to utterly change combat in the game to moron level the experienced players are pointing out how bad this will be for skilled combat in eve.
And we are doing it enmasse.
How exactly does this change take away your, apparently superior, piloting and team work skills? And when did throwing isk in the form of poly carbs at any give ship and pushing the MWD button become "skilled PvP"?
The playing field will be leveled a bit, so it will take more "player skill" then before to succeed in nano fits... and ohmigawd some modules and ships like AB, Scram and Assault Ships might actually become viable! Yeah horrible, horrible changes.
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El Mauru
Amarr
Quantum Industries
RAZOR Alliance
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Posted - 2008.10.30 11:34:00 -
[6]
Edited by: El Mauru on 30/10/2008 11:34:55
anybody else finding the op's corp name rather fitting for the ocasion? 
-
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LordInvisible
Gallente
The CULT OF DAMNED
Tear Extraction And Reclamation Service
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Posted - 2008.10.30 12:27:00 -
[7]
stick to the topic, troll..
if u dont have anything usefull to say regarding my thread, stay away, its not that hard..
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We are recruting: Recruitment |
Murina
The Scope
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Posted - 2008.10.30 12:56:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Remi Kulis
How exactly does this change take away your, apparently superior, piloting and team work skills? And when did throwing isk in the form of poly carbs at any give ship and pushing the MWD button become "skilled PvP"?
Nano forced both sides to tackle to kill and because of doing that they were forced to defend the tacklers, and it is within those needs that skilled combat was made as both sides tackled and counter tackled while jamming hostile tacklers and repairing friendly ones.
Now all that is needed is f1 unless CCP are gonna force ppl to fight 1 v 1 cos that is all this patch has done, make ultra rare 1 v 1 fighting slightly more interesting.
Originally by: Remi Kulis
ohmigawd some modules and ships like AB, Scram and Assault Ships might actually become viable!
Wrong they will all still suck in gang combat, just because you cannot be bothered to get onto the test server does not mean the rest of us have not.
Screaming out load that things are gonna be better when you have not even tested them is quite pathetic tbh, just because you suck at pvp and have chosen to point the finger at nano instead of improving is no reason for a nerf or continued ignorance.
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LordInvisible
Gallente
The CULT OF DAMNED
Tear Extraction And Reclamation Service
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Posted - 2008.10.30 13:32:00 -
[9]
with arazu/lachesis/keres scram range, there is no need for logistcs to keep tacklers alive..Rather bring falcon and jamm the tackled opponent, so the tacklers are even safer..
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We are recruting: Recruitment |
Megan Maynard
Minmatar
Out of Order
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Posted - 2008.10.30 13:39:00 -
[10]
Nano age my ass, we killed a vagabond, nano pilgrim and a ishtar last night with 3 battlecruisers and a zealot.
They have to slow down to do anything to you anyway, i don't see the problem with nano atm.
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Lyria Skydancer
Amarr
Developmental Neogenics Amalgamated
|
Posted - 2008.10.30 14:40:00 -
[11]
There are equal amounts of pro nerf threads aswell. The change will be fine, you'll see.
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[Video] The Cruise |
lecrotta
lecrotta Corp
|
Posted - 2008.10.30 14:46:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Lyria Skydancer
There are equal amounts of pro nerf threads aswell. The change will be fine, you'll see.
LOL list please.....no?...a bit like the reports from pro nerfits a token and worthless claim of "it will be alright" and sod all content.
Screw game play just so long as nano is gone hey pal......i wonder what you will blame next?.
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Nuts Nougat
SniggWaffe
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Posted - 2008.10.30 14:46:00 -
[13]
Tbh I was excited about the nano nerf when I read the devblog. Thought it'd be finally cheaper for me to run poly ships. Then i saw sisi....
Originally by: Lyria Skydancer
There are equal amounts of pro nerf threads aswell. The change will be fine, you'll see.
lol.
---
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Lyria Skydancer
Amarr
Developmental Neogenics Amalgamated
|
Posted - 2008.10.30 14:56:00 -
[14]
Originally by: lecrotta
Edited by: lecrotta on 30/10/2008 14:52:01
Originally by: Lyria Skydancer
There are equal amounts of pro nerf threads aswell. The change will be fine, you'll see.
LOL show the list please?.....no?...although your comment at the end sums up the reports from pro nerfits, a token and worthless claim of "it will be alright" and sod all content.
Screw game play just so long as nano is gone hey pal?......i wonder what you and the others will blame next?.
What do you mean blame? I'm flying nano's myself and I do know the issue first hand. Next up are falcons btw; I fly those aswell.
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[Video] The Cruise |
lecrotta
lecrotta Corp
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Posted - 2008.10.30 15:02:00 -
[15]
Edited by: lecrotta on 30/10/2008 15:03:34
Originally by: Lyria Skydancer
Originally by: lecrotta
Originally by: Lyria Skydancer
There are equal amounts of pro nerf threads aswell. The change will be fine, you'll see.
LOL show the list please?.....no?...although your comment at the end sums up the reports from pro nerfits, a token and worthless claim of "it will be alright" and sod all content.
Screw game play just so long as nano is gone hey pal?......i wonder what you and the others will blame next?.
What do you mean blame? I'm flying nano's myself and I do know the issue first hand. Next up are falcons btw; I fly those aswell.
Yea "i fly nano but i want it nerfed"......very original...next falcons....then i suppose cloaks?...after that snipers cos you cannot get near them before they warp......and on and on....
Why not save time and make everybody sit inside the grid CCP uses for tourneys and if they cross the line their ship instantly explodes, ppl can sit their all day hitting f1 like they do while ratting and dream of being uber pilots...
PS: interesting that you avoided linking all the supportive threads for this stupid game killing nerf.
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Lyria Skydancer
Amarr
Developmental Neogenics Amalgamated
|
Posted - 2008.10.30 15:07:00 -
[16]
Originally by: lecrotta
Yea "i fly nano but i want it nerfed"......very original...next falcons....then i suppose cloaks?...after that snipers cos you cannot get near them before they warp......and on and on....
Why not save time and make everybody sit inside the grid CCP uses for tourneys and if they cross the line their ship instantly explodes, ppl can sit their all day hitting f1 like they do while ratting and dream of being uber pilots...
PS: interesting that you avoided linking all the supportive threads for this stupid game killing nerf.
Original? I'm not the one accusing people of "you want it nerfed because you can't handle it and you don't fly it".
I can't be arsed to link loads of threads. CCP knows what needs to be done and it's being done now.
-----------------------------------------
[Video] The Cruise |
lecrotta
lecrotta Corp
|
Posted - 2008.10.30 15:18:00 -
[17]
Edited by: lecrotta on 30/10/2008 15:25:31
Originally by: Lyria Skydancer
Originally by: lecrotta
Yea "i fly nano but i want it nerfed"......very original...next falcons....then i suppose cloaks?...after that snipers cos you cannot get near them before they warp......and on and on....
Why not save time and make everybody sit inside the grid CCP uses for tourneys and if they cross the line their ship instantly explodes, ppl can sit their all day hitting f1 like they do while ratting and dream of being uber pilots...
PS: interesting that you avoided linking all the supportive threads for this stupid game killing nerf.
Original? I'm not the one accusing people of "you want it nerfed because you can't handle it and you don't fly it".
I can't be arsed to link loads of threads. CCP knows what needs to be done and it's being done now.
Its called the truth pal, look at most of the muppets who initially supported this nerf and you will see angry carebears looking to blame nano for losing their ratting ships.
The same ccp that made nano in the first place and introduced a mission that requested a MWD in a dead space area? ........Interesting how you call on the mighty ccp as if its a store house of game balance knowledge while totally ignoring the fact that they introduced all the things they are now nerfing.
You have got nothing and bring nothing to this argument but empty platitudes and weak excuses.
The only threads supporting this nerf normally last a page or so (mostly ppl disagreeing with the OP) go like this:
"good job ccp i think this may be a good thing perhaps".
No content no idea and no point just like your empty posting:
Originally by: Lyria Skydancer
The change will be fine, you'll see.
LOL top content....
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Lyria Skydancer
Amarr
Developmental Neogenics Amalgamated
|
Posted - 2008.10.30 15:26:00 -
[18]
Originally by: lecrotta
Its called the truth pal, look at most of the muppets who initially supported this nerf and you will see angry carebears looking to blame nano for losing their ratting ships.
The same ccp that made nano in the first place and introduced a mission that requested a MWD in a dead space area?........Interesting how you call on the mighty ccp as if its a store house of game balance knowledge while totally ignoring the fact that they introduced all the things they are now nerfing.
You have got nothing and bring nothing to this argument but empty platitudes and weak excuses.
The only threads supporting this nerf last a page or so (mostly ppl disagreeing) go like this:
"good job ccp i think this may be a good thing perhaps".
No content no idea and no point just like your empty posting.
Carebears will still get owned. Nothing will change.
What will change is that nano noobs will cry. Pro nano players will still own people because they know the game. Funny thing is though that the latter group of players are a minority.
The people that oppose the nerf know very well that nano hacs are imbalanced and out of egoism they try to convince everyone it is fine eventhough it is not. These are people that base their whole operations/alliance/corp/warfare on one single tactic: Nanophagottry. It will be intresting to see how well these people do after nerf.
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[Video] The Cruise |
MyOwnSling
Gallente
RONA Corporation
RONA Alliance
|
Posted - 2008.10.30 15:33:00 -
[19]
Edited by: MyOwnSling on 30/10/2008 15:35:00
Originally by: lecrotta
The only threads supporting this nerf normally last a page or so (mostly ppl disagreeing with the OP) go like this:
"good job ccp i think this may be a good thing perhaps"
Out of curiosity, where are your supporting threads? I tend to not read nano threads so often anymore so I haven't seen much of what you speak. Perhaps you could provide some links?
-------------
Stop whining.
Originally by: Puupuu
dude... your face...
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Quixis
|
Posted - 2008.10.30 15:35:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Lyria Trolldancer
Stuff.....
So let me get this straight, because nano hacs are 'imbalanced' the whole game needs to be reworked?
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Shard Merchant
Minmatar
|
Posted - 2008.10.30 15:36:00 -
[21]
Most of those threads are filled with people arguing the opposite. And a good part of the OPs are just trolling with no content.
In short, even if your expose could make a difference, its not a very good one.
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Lyria Skydancer
Amarr
Developmental Neogenics Amalgamated
|
Posted - 2008.10.30 15:37:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Quixis
Originally by: Lyria Trolldancer
Stuff.....
So let me get this straight, because nano hacs are 'imbalanced' the whole game needs to be reworked?
Because speed has been broken a long time and there are so many variables now that you need to rework the whole system if you want to do it right.
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[Video] The Cruise |
lecrotta
lecrotta Corp
|
Posted - 2008.10.30 15:38:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Lyria Skydancer
The people that oppose the nerf know very well that nano hacs are imbalanced and out of egoism they try to convince everyone it is fine even though it is not.
Oh yes using the "balance" word i was wondering when you were gonna drop that eve nerf "power word" out, are gonna use "broken" next?. Ppl like you draw it like a gun but the truth is that "balance" in a game with variety is when said variety is available to all.
Originally by: Lyria Skydancer
These are people that base their whole operations/alliance/corp/warfare on one single tactic: Nanophagottry. It will be intresting to see how well these people do after nerf.
Ever siege'd a pos with nano?, ever taken space with nano?, ever killed a titan with nano?, ever beat a RR BS gang or logistic gang with nano?....no cos it cannot be done nano is a task specific style of pvp.
Nano is good for roaming deep in hostile space that is it, and its getting nerfed cos it will not sit still like the rats most of the wanna be pvp dreamers who support this nerf want it to its that simple.
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Lyria Skydancer
Amarr
Developmental Neogenics Amalgamated
|
Posted - 2008.10.30 15:40:00 -
[24]
Originally by: lecrotta
Originally by: Lyria Skydancer
The people that oppose the nerf know very well that nano hacs are imbalanced and out of egoism they try to convince everyone it is fine even though it is not.
Oh yes using the "balance" word i was wondering when you were gonna drop that eve nerf "power word" out, are gonna use "broken" next?. Ppl like you draw it like a gun but the truth is that "balance" in a game with variety is when said variety is available to all.
Originally by: Lyria Skydancer
These are people that base their whole operations/alliance/corp/warfare on one single tactic: Nanophagottry. It will be intresting to see how well these people do after nerf.
Ever siege'd a pos with nano?, ever taken space with nano?, ever killed a titan with nano?, ever beat a RR BS gang or logistic gang with nano?....no cos it cannot be done nano is a task specific style of pvp.
Nano is good for roaming deep in hostile space that is it, and its getting nerfed cos it will not sit still like the rats most of the wanna be pvp dreamers who support this nerf want it to its that simple.
You seriously do not know/grasp why they are nerfing nano's? Do you really not see the issue?
-----------------------------------------
[Video] The Cruise |
lecrotta
lecrotta Corp
|
Posted - 2008.10.30 15:41:00 -
[25]
Originally by: MyOwnSling
Originally by: lecrotta
The only threads supporting this nerf normally last a page or so (mostly ppl disagreeing with the OP) go like this:
"good job ccp i think this may be a good thing perhaps"
Out of curiosity, where are your supporting threads? I tend to not read nano threads so often anymore so I haven't seen much of what you speak. Perhaps you could provide some links?
Try looking at the top of the thread pal there's plenty of em up their i posted in quite a few along with lots of others, 0plus spend a lot of time on the test server trying out fits and ships in gang combat.
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lecrotta
lecrotta Corp
|
Posted - 2008.10.30 15:42:00 -
[26]
Edited by: lecrotta on 30/10/2008 15:43:23
Originally by: Lyria Skydancer
Originally by: lecrotta
Originally by: Lyria Skydancer
The people that oppose the nerf know very well that nano hacs are imbalanced and out of egoism they try to convince everyone it is fine even though it is not.
Oh yes using the "balance" word i was wondering when you were gonna drop that eve nerf "power word" out, are gonna use "broken" next?. Ppl like you draw it like a gun but the truth is that "balance" in a game with variety is when said variety is available to all.
Originally by: Lyria Skydancer
These are people that base their whole operations/alliance/corp/warfare on one single tactic: Nanophagottry. It will be intresting to see how well these people do after nerf.
Ever siege'd a pos with nano?, ever taken space with nano?, ever killed a titan with nano?, ever beat a RR BS gang or logistic gang with nano?....no cos it cannot be done nano is a task specific style of pvp.
Nano is good for roaming deep in hostile space that is it, and its getting nerfed cos it will not sit still like the rats most of the wanna be pvp dreamers who support this nerf want it to its that simple.
You seriously do not know/grasp why they are nerfing nano's? Do you really not see the issue?
Because its unpopular with certain aspects of the community, namely carebears and paper tigers.
Why dont you explain it then but you are forbidden to use words like "broken" and "balance", your post must show and contain full content and combat scenarios.
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Lyria Skydancer
Amarr
Developmental Neogenics Amalgamated
|
Posted - 2008.10.30 15:44:00 -
[27]
Originally by: lecrotta
Because its unpopular with certain aspects of the community, namely carebears and paper tigers.
No, if they wanted to (with every right also) nerf the carebear community they would nerf high sec money making. This is not a carebear nerf. This is primarily a nerf to GTC-ebay-nano-warriors that is flooding eve lately. Good riddance imo. The veterans will have no problems whatsoever with the changes.
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[Video] The Cruise |
Quixis
|
Posted - 2008.10.30 15:47:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Lyria Faildancer
Originally by: Quixis
Originally by: Lyria Trolldancer
Stuff.....
So let me get this straight, because nano hacs are 'imbalanced' the whole game needs to be reworked?
Because speed has been broken a long time and there are so many variables now that you need to rework the whole system if you want to do it right.
I believe you'll find speed was just fine until i-stabs, which they fixed, but what followed just brought it all back.
Rigs, in combination with implants (high snakes are not as commons as the nerf herders would like us to believe) and various other SPEED mods.
So yea, I see your point.
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MyOwnSling
Gallente
RONA Corporation
RONA Alliance
|
Posted - 2008.10.30 15:49:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Lyria Skydancer
Originally by: lecrotta
Because its unpopular with certain aspects of the community, namely carebears and paper tigers.
No, if they wanted to (with every right also) nerf the carebear community they would nerf high sec money making. This is not a carebear nerf. This is primarily a nerf to GTC-ebay-nano-warriors that is flooding eve lately. Good riddance imo. The veterans will have no problems whatsoever with the changes.
I think I have to agree here. No carebears I know were ever affected by nanos. Generally it has been the 0.0 occupants, and if you are carebearing in 0.0 and you get engaged by pvpers, then you are likely going to die nano or not.
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Stop whining.
Originally by: Puupuu
dude... your face...
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lecrotta
lecrotta Corp
|
Posted - 2008.10.30 15:50:00 -
[30]
Edited by: lecrotta on 30/10/2008 15:54:33
Originally by: lecrotta
Because its unpopular with certain aspects of the community, namely carebears and paper tigers.
Originally by: Lyria Skydancer
This is primarily a nerf to GTC-ebay-nano-warriors that is flooding eve lately. Good riddance imo. The veterans will have no problems whatsoever with the changes.
Veterans hate the changes, take your head out of the sand and look at all the threads about how bad these chasnges are ffs are you blind????, the ppl posting reports are not noobs or carebears they are high sp and xp pvpers and long term gamers telling ccp what a mistake they are making.
If it does go through yes ppl like myself will adapt first and continue to wipe the floor with the inept and the stupid but a great, skilled and entertaining form of pvp will be lost for ever.
Originally by: MyOwnSling
I think I have to agree here. No carebears I know were ever affected by nanos. Generally it has been the 0.0 occupants, and if you are carebearing in 0.0 and you get engaged by pvpers, then you are likely going to die nano or not.
Its the 0.0 carebears im referring to, those ppl that think a ratting fitted ship is ok to use against a a pure pvp fitted gang in their space.
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Lyria Skydancer
Amarr
Developmental Neogenics Amalgamated
|
Posted - 2008.10.30 15:54:00 -
[31]
Originally by: lecrotta
Veterans hate the changes, take your head out of the sand and look at all the threads about how bad these chasnges are ffs are you blind????,
You base this on what? I fly with/know alot of veterans that support the nano nerf. What kind of people are you flying around with? You're one that is blind.
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[Video] The Cruise |
lecrotta
lecrotta Corp
|
Posted - 2008.10.30 15:56:00 -
[32]
Edited by: lecrotta on 30/10/2008 15:56:48
Originally by: Lyria Skydancer
Originally by: lecrotta
Veterans hate the changes, take your head out of the sand and look at all the threads about how bad these chasnges are ffs are you blind????,
You base this on what? I fly with/know alot of veterans that support the nano nerf. What kind of people are you flying around with? You're one that is blind.
Name dropping?...how about you post all the threads for the nerf you claim these vets have started instead, cos this thread and this forum is full of those against it.
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Lyria Skydancer
Amarr
Developmental Neogenics Amalgamated
|
Posted - 2008.10.30 15:59:00 -
[33]
Edited by: Lyria Skydancer on 30/10/2008 15:59:03
Originally by: lecrotta
Name dropping?...how about you post all the threads for the nerf you claim these vets have started instead, cos this thread and this forum is full of those against it.
Many reasonable vets don't visit the forums. 99% of the forums is full of trolls and morons tbph. You base your arguments on that crowd.
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[Video] The Cruise |
Mag's
MASS
|
Posted - 2008.10.30 16:00:00 -
[34]
Originally by: Lyria Skydancer
99% of the forums is full of trolls and morons tbph.
Hence, why you are here.
Mag's
Originally by: Avernus
One of these days, the realization that MASS is no longer significant will catch up with you. |
MyOwnSling
Gallente
RONA Corporation
RONA Alliance
|
Posted - 2008.10.30 16:03:00 -
[35]
Originally by: lecrotta
Edited by: lecrotta on 30/10/2008 15:56:48
Originally by: Lyria Skydancer
Originally by: lecrotta
Veterans hate the changes, take your head out of the sand and look at all the threads about how bad these chasnges are ffs are you blind????,
You base this on what? I fly with/know alot of veterans that support the nano nerf. What kind of people are you flying around with? You're one that is blind.
Name dropping?...how about you post all the threads for the nerf you claim these vets have started instead, cos this thread and this forum is full of those against it.
Where does he claim those vets started any threads? All he said is that he knows many that support it. Has nothing to do with posting on forums. I know people who swing both ways who don't ever visit the forums. In all honesty, I don't think the forums are a good indicator of what the majority of the player base think, but because that's all CCP has to go on, that's what they seem to respond to.
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Stop whining.
Originally by: Puupuu
dude... your face...
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MyOwnSling
Gallente
RONA Corporation
RONA Alliance
|
Posted - 2008.10.30 16:06:00 -
[36]
Originally by: lecrotta
Its the 0.0 carebears im referring to, those ppl that think a ratting fitted ship is ok to use against a a pure pvp fitted gang in their space.
Can you prove it? How do you know that somebody whining on the forums indeed falls into this category? Few will explicitly state it (though there are those whose posts would seem to imply it, sadly).
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Stop whining.
Originally by: Puupuu
dude... your face...
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lecrotta
lecrotta Corp
|
Posted - 2008.10.30 16:06:00 -
[37]
Originally by: Lyria Skydancer
Originally by: lecrotta
Name dropping?...how about you post all the threads for the nerf you claim these vets have started instead, cos this thread and this forum is full of those against it.
Many reasonable vets don't visit the forums. 99% of the forums is full of trolls and morons tbph. You base your arguments on that crowd.
Look at your posting ffs, you give nothing towards your own argument and dismiss the hundreds of ppl posting thread after thread about the almost endless problems this nerf is causing.
You have been asked to post links to the "many" threads supporting this nerf you "claim" are around....you did nothing but bleet out a weak excuse.
You were asked to give a detailed summary of roaming gang pvp on sissi and how its "better"....more excuses...
Your the moronic troll i think, but hey id be glad for you to prove me wrong.
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MyOwnSling
Gallente
RONA Corporation
RONA Alliance
|
Posted - 2008.10.30 16:09:00 -
[38]
Edited by: MyOwnSling on 30/10/2008 16:09:39
Originally by: lecrotta
You were asked to give a detailed summary of roaming gang pvp on sissi
How do you simulate this? The FFA areas aren't even close to the same conditions you find in a roaming gang, and on SISI 0.0 areas aren't occupied enough to test anything meaningfully. I would be interested in testing this, but I would like to know how you do it.
-------------
Stop whining.
Originally by: Puupuu
dude... your face...
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Gut Punch
The Dead Parrot Shoppe Inc.
|
Posted - 2008.10.30 16:14:00 -
[39]
Originally by: Lyria Skydancer
Edited by: Lyria Skydancer on 30/10/2008 15:59:03
Originally by: lecrotta
Name dropping?...how about you post all the threads for the nerf you claim these vets have started instead, cos this thread and this forum is full of those against it.
Many reasonable vets don't visit the forums. 99% of the forums is full of trolls and morons tbph. You base your arguments on that crowd.
So stfu troll and go back to your "enlightened" vet buddies. Frankly I don't appreciate CCP pulling the rug out from under me. I've spent 2.5 years in the game learning the rules and setting skill goals to be successful in small gang warfare. EVE used to be about being a sandbox where some form of human pilot skill and intelligence would allow you to enjoy the game. Granted you had to bounce back from some defeats and actually analyse why you lost. However, the people CCP are listening to atm are not people who figured out that perhaps their character race had some limitations and that they needed to train for specific races and ships for specific purposes. The most recent set of changes in the devblogs, in Z's posts, and on SiSi reflect a new string of dev personel who wouldn't know the first thing about how anyone outside the major empires or the mission ***** in caldari space operates.
These changes are nothing short of burning the rule book and starting over for the vets I know. So the buddies I play with are more than willing to drop their multiple accounts each and head somewhere else to get something out of our $15 a month.
You want Hello Kitty Online in empire with no risk? You want BLOB MOAR Online in 0.0 with great POS empires? If thats what you want Lyria then enjoy... I'm way out of here.
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lecrotta
lecrotta Corp
|
Posted - 2008.10.30 16:19:00 -
[40]
Edited by: lecrotta on 30/10/2008 16:22:38
Originally by: MyOwnSling
Originally by: lecrotta
You were asked to give a detailed summary of roaming gang pvp on sissi
How do you simulate this? The FFA areas aren't even close to the same conditions you find in a roaming gang, and on SISI 0.0 areas aren't occupied enough to test anything meaningfully. I would be interested in testing this, but I would like to know how you do it.
Because i did it pal, after the first and second patch along with the dev chappys in local we put together gangs of 20 per side (some times 30 per side although that was max) to test all manner ship ships vs ships along with a variety of fitting styles.
We conducted our tests mostly around gates and stations as these areas are the most combat intense in eve and both sides had experienced FC's leading them. As far as results were concerned a gang of BC with a bit of logistic support pretty much owned every other form of gang (apart from RR BS and capitals for obvious reasons).
Apart from the logistics cruisers and maybe a bit of (so for un nerfed) ewar, all hacs and cruisers along with all smaller ships were pointless to fly as bonused BC could hit anything while out tanking all but BS and capitals.
Nothing has changed since the tests as i was trying out a BC vs ceptor in a gang style test yesterday and even summat as small as a 5kms ceptor orbiting a gang buddy was getting melted.
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MyOwnSling
Gallente
RONA Corporation
RONA Alliance
|
Posted - 2008.10.30 16:23:00 -
[41]
Originally by: lecrotta
Originally by: MyOwnSling
Originally by: lecrotta
You were asked to give a detailed summary of roaming gang pvp on sissi
How do you simulate this? The FFA areas aren't even close to the same conditions you find in a roaming gang, and on SISI 0.0 areas aren't occupied enough to test anything meaningfully. I would be interested in testing this, but I would like to know how you do it.
Because i did it pal, after the first and second patch along with the dev chappys in local we put together gangs of 20 per side (some times 30 per side although that was max) to test all manner ship ships vs ships along with a variety of fitting styles.
We conducted our tests mostly around gates and stations as these areas are the most combat intense in eve and both sides had experienced FC's leading them. As far as results were concerned a gang of BC with a bit of logistic support pretty much owned every other form of gang (apart from RR BS and capitals for obvious reasons).
Apart from the logistics cruisers and maybe a bit of (so for un nerfed) ewar, all hacs and cruisers along with all smaller ships were pointless to fly as bonused BC could hit anything while out tanking all but BS and capitals.
Ok, so you and a bunch of people had what sounds like a rather well-organized testing environment (obviously a good thing). How often does this happen? Are you able to keep up with the changes occuring daily on SISI? I can't seem to hit SISI at the right times to get any worthwhile testing going.
-------------
Stop whining.
Originally by: Puupuu
dude... your face...
|
lecrotta
lecrotta Corp
|
Posted - 2008.10.30 16:25:00 -
[42]
Originally by: MyOwnSling
Originally by: lecrotta
Originally by: MyOwnSling
Originally by: lecrotta
You were asked to give a detailed summary of roaming gang pvp on sissi
How do you simulate this? The FFA areas aren't even close to the same conditions you find in a roaming gang, and on SISI 0.0 areas aren't occupied enough to test anything meaningfully. I would be interested in testing this, but I would like to know how you do it.
Because i did it pal, after the first and second patch along with the dev chappys in local we put together gangs of 20 per side (some times 30 per side although that was max) to test all manner ship ships vs ships along with a variety of fitting styles.
We conducted our tests mostly around gates and stations as these areas are the most combat intense in eve and both sides had experienced FC's leading them. As far as results were concerned a gang of BC with a bit of logistic support pretty much owned every other form of gang (apart from RR BS and capitals for obvious reasons).
Apart from the logistics cruisers and maybe a bit of (so for un nerfed) ewar, all hacs and cruisers along with all smaller ships were pointless to fly as bonused BC could hit anything while out tanking all but BS and capitals.
Ok, so you and a bunch of people had what sounds like a rather well-organized testing environment (obviously a good thing). How often does this happen? Are you able to keep up with the changes occuring daily on SISI? I can't seem to hit SISI at the right times to get any worthwhile testing going.
Sori did not mean to ninja edit but this:
Nothing has changed since the tests as i was trying out a BC vs ceptor in a gang style test yesterday and even summat as small as a 5kms ceptor orbiting a gang buddy was getting melted. The changes may look good to noobs and inexperienced players but in gang combat if your at 0 to one player orbiting to tackle your in the sweet spot of another and he will melt you.
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MyOwnSling
Gallente
RONA Corporation
RONA Alliance
|
Posted - 2008.10.30 16:33:00 -
[43]
Originally by: lecrotta
Sori did not mean to ninja edit but this:
Nothing has changed since the tests as i was trying out a BC vs ceptor in a gang style test yesterday and even summat as small as a 5kms ceptor orbiting a gang buddy was getting melted. The changes may look good to noobs and inexperienced players but in gang combat if your at 0 to one player orbiting to tackle your in the sweet spot of another and he will melt you just by pressing f1 now....
Yeah, in my minimal testing the ceptor went down in about 15 seconds against a larger target. So what does this mean? You can't tackle anything smaller than a BS post-nano nerf? Are small ships dead? Have you been able to test AF's yet (i.e. could they be a better heavy tackle ship than before)?
-------------
Stop whining.
Originally by: Puupuu
dude... your face...
|
lecrotta
lecrotta Corp
|
Posted - 2008.10.30 16:45:00 -
[44]
Edited by: lecrotta on 30/10/2008 16:48:45
Originally by: MyOwnSling
Originally by: lecrotta
Sori did not mean to ninja edit but this:
Nothing has changed since the tests as i was trying out a BC vs ceptor in a gang style test yesterday and even summat as small as a 5kms ceptor orbiting a gang buddy was getting melted. The changes may look good to noobs and inexperienced players but in gang combat if your at 0 to one player orbiting to tackle your in the sweet spot of another and he will melt you just by pressing f1 now....
Yeah, in my minimal testing the ceptor went down in about 15 seconds against a larger target. So what does this mean? You can't tackle anything smaller than a BS post-nano nerf? Are small ships dead? Have you been able to test AF's yet (i.e. could they be a better heavy tackle ship than before)?
I did not personally test AF's as i considered that if the smallest ship in the game orbiting at top speed (thus the hardest to hit) was gonna melt anything else of the same class was gonna be even easier.
The main issue was buffer tank, small ships have no buffer so the logistics can work their magic. A BC or larger has good med to long range and enough hp so that all but a huge monster amount of alpha dps cannot break it with a couple of logistics ships pumping out rep. While plating or extending small tacklers is impracticable as it not only slows the ships but increases sig radius along with taking up slots for tackle or the speed mods themselves.
1 v 1 you can maybe get in close quick enough to gunships to survive but in gang combat you cannot get close to every ship all at the same time.....
While on TQ speed allows small ships to do exactly that (survive) and stay reasonably survivable unless tackled and that is why it produced skilled pvp, the need to tackle to kill!.
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Lyria Skydancer
Amarr
Developmental Neogenics Amalgamated
|
Posted - 2008.10.30 16:45:00 -
[45]
Originally by: Mag's
Originally by: Lyria Skydancer
99% of the forums is full of trolls and morons tbph.
Hence, why you are here.
No, I'm the 1%.
-----------------------------------------
[Video] The Cruise |
Lyria Skydancer
Amarr
Developmental Neogenics Amalgamated
|
Posted - 2008.10.30 16:49:00 -
[46]
Originally by: Gut Punch
So stfu troll and go back to your "enlightened" vet buddies.
You want Hello Kitty Online in empire with no risk? You want BLOB MOAR Online in 0.0 with great POS empires? If thats what you want Lyria then enjoy... I'm way out of here.
1. It will be a pleasure owning you after patch and you being angry about it is just a bonus.
2. Why would I be in a tiny corp if I wanted blob more online? I don't think you know wth you're talking about. But so doesn't 99% of the forum people either. Who would have guessed you would say such clueless things.
-----------------------------------------
[Video] The Cruise |
MyOwnSling
Gallente
RONA Corporation
RONA Alliance
|
Posted - 2008.10.30 16:54:00 -
[47]
Originally by: lecrotta
Edited by: lecrotta on 30/10/2008 16:48:45
I did not personally test AF's as i considered that if the smallest ship in the game orbiting at top speed (thus the hardest to hit) was gonna melt anything else of the same class was gonna be even easier.
The main issue was buffer tank, small ships have no buffer so the logistics can work their magic. A BC or larger has good med to long range and enough hp so that all but a huge monster amount of alpha dps cannot break it with a couple of logistics ships pumping out rep. While plating or extending small tacklers is impracticable as it not only slows the ships but increases sig radius along with taking up slots for tackle or the speed mods themselves.
1 v 1 you can maybe get in close quick enough to gunships to survive but in gang combat you cannot get close to every ship all at the same time.....
While on TQ speed allows small ships to do exactly that (survive) and stay reasonably survivable unless tackled and that is why it produced skilled pvp, the need to tackle to kill!.
I was thinking about the higher resists that an AF has. That could help a bit with the logistics issue, but I don't know how much. Have you tried an inty with the new MWD sig radius bonus? And have you tried anything aside from logistics/BC vs inty gangs? Sorry for asking so many questions but I haven't had enought time to test.
-------------
Stop whining.
Originally by: Puupuu
dude... your face...
|
lecrotta
lecrotta Corp
|
Posted - 2008.10.30 17:01:00 -
[48]
Edited by: lecrotta on 30/10/2008 17:03:36
Originally by: MyOwnSling
Originally by: lecrotta
I did not personally test AF's as i considered that if the smallest ship in the game orbiting at top speed (thus the hardest to hit) was gonna melt anything else of the same class was gonna be even easier.
The main issue was buffer tank, small ships have no buffer so the logistics can work their magic. A BC or larger has good med to long range and enough hp so that all but a huge monster amount of alpha dps cannot break it with a couple of logistics ships pumping out rep. While plating or extending small tacklers is impracticable as it not only slows the ships but increases sig radius along with taking up slots for tackle or the speed mods themselves.
1 v 1 you can maybe get in close quick enough to gunships to survive but in gang combat you cannot get close to every ship all at the same time.....
While on TQ speed allows small ships to do exactly that (survive) and stay reasonably survivable unless tackled and that is why it produced skilled pvp, the need to tackle to kill!.
I was thinking about the higher resists that an AF has. That could help a bit with the logistics issue, but I don't know how much. Have you tried an inty with the new MWD sig radius bonus? And have you tried anything aside from logistics/BC vs inty gangs? Sorry for asking so many questions but I haven't had enought time to test.
The af resists may make it be hit for a little less but its slower so it will take longer to get into range (plus lower transversal when it is in range orbiting) along with the fact that in a 10 man BC gang you may have good transversal against one or two or even 5 or 6 if they are stupid and bunched up but if 1 BC can melt a ceptor in seconds more can do it in......need i go on?.
And yes we tried loads of variations but BC gangs with a bit of logistics and ewar owned all smaller mixed race/ship gangs (hacs were a expensive joke and even at 100 isk on sissi were not worth using over BC) and only lost to BS and capital as i mentioned before.
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MyOwnSling
Gallente
RONA Corporation
RONA Alliance
|
Posted - 2008.10.30 17:10:00 -
[49]
Edited by: MyOwnSling on 30/10/2008 17:11:15
Originally by: lecrotta
Edited by: lecrotta on 30/10/2008 17:03:36
Originally by: MyOwnSling
Originally by: lecrotta
I did not personally test AF's as i considered that if the smallest ship in the game orbiting at top speed (thus the hardest to hit) was gonna melt anything else of the same class was gonna be even easier.
The main issue was buffer tank, small ships have no buffer so the logistics can work their magic. A BC or larger has good med to long range and enough hp so that all but a huge monster amount of alpha dps cannot break it with a couple of logistics ships pumping out rep. While plating or extending small tacklers is impracticable as it not only slows the ships but increases sig radius along with taking up slots for tackle or the speed mods themselves.
1 v 1 you can maybe get in close quick enough to gunships to survive but in gang combat you cannot get close to every ship all at the same time.....
While on TQ speed allows small ships to do exactly that (survive) and stay reasonably survivable unless tackled and that is why it produced skilled pvp, the need to tackle to kill!.
I was thinking about the higher resists that an AF has. That could help a bit with the logistics issue, but I don't know how much. Have you tried an inty with the new MWD sig radius bonus? And have you tried anything aside from logistics/BC vs inty gangs? Sorry for asking so many questions but I haven't had enought time to test.
The af resists may make it be hit for a little less but its slower so it will take longer to get into range (plus lower transversal when it is in range orbiting) along with the fact that in a 10 man BC gang you may have good transversal against one or two or even 5 or 6 if they are stupid and bunched up but if 1 BC can melt a ceptor in seconds more can do it in......need i go on?.
And yes we tried loads of variations but BC gangs with a bit of logistics and ewar owned all smaller mixed race/ship gangs (hacs were a expensive joke and even at 100 isk on sissi were not worth using over BC) and only lost to BS and capital as i mentioned before.
Well then what's the problem? Isn't the solution obvious? All you need to do is hot drop some carriers and you're fine. Right? Or a titan?
edit: having a sarcastic moment. I am planning on testing some of this myself soon. I hope it's not as bad as you describe.
-------------
Stop whining.
Originally by: Puupuu
dude... your face...
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lecrotta
lecrotta Corp
|
Posted - 2008.10.30 17:13:00 -
[50]
Originally by: MyOwnSling
Well then what's the problem? Isn't the solution obvious? All you need to do is hot drop some carriers and you're fine. Right? Or a titan?
edit: having a sarcastic moment. I am planning on testing some of this myself soon. I hope it's not as bad as you describe.
Read some of the many threds linked on this one or just check out the forums bud its all their to see...unfortunatly.
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LordInvisible
Gallente
The CULT OF DAMNED
Tear Extraction And Reclamation Service
|
Posted - 2008.10.30 18:56:00 -
[51]
well, there are some threads PRO- nano nerf, but not as many as anti..
Only if u look at ANTI nano thread in CSM's Assembly Hall against PRO nano thread, there is like 1570 supporting accounts and if u then look PRO nano thread, there is 790 supporters..
That at least shows that there is two thirds of accounts that bother to vote against nano nerf..
And while searching for ANTI nano threads, i wanted to put up a list of PRO nano nerf threads, but i only managed to gather 6 threads, of which one or two were locked..
And like I said: CCP decided to overhaul whole fighting system just to solve a problem, that could be solved with adding stacking penalties to polycarb rigs and speed implants..
That would be even better solution for those nano fa*gs that specced in nanoing, then all this **** CCP is prolly putting up atm..
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We are recruting: Recruitment |
LordInvisible
Gallente
The CULT OF DAMNED
Tear Extraction And Reclamation Service
|
Posted - 2008.10.30 18:57:00 -
[52]
Ohh, and yes, i am for nerfing nanos..Just not nerfing whole system of fighting along with it..
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We are recruting: Recruitment |
lecrotta
lecrotta Corp
|
Posted - 2008.10.30 19:00:00 -
[53]
Edited by: lecrotta on 30/10/2008 19:01:25
Originally by: LordInvisible
And like I said: CCP decided to overhaul whole fighting system just to solve a problem, that could be solved with adding stacking penalties to polycarb rigs and speed implants..
If they had just nerfed speed alone caldari and amaar would be way over powered, as it is everybody apart from BC blobbers is gonna suffer. High speed or nano if you prefer is essential for cruisers and smaller to be worth flying in gang pvp its that simple really.
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LordInvisible
Gallente
The CULT OF DAMNED
Tear Extraction And Reclamation Service
|
Posted - 2008.10.31 11:03:00 -
[54]
maybe yes, but atm they gonna make useless like 2 races:D
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We are recruting: Recruitment |
sdthujfg
|
Posted - 2008.10.31 16:50:00 -
[55]
Originally by: LordInvisible
maybe yes, but atm they gonna make useless like 2 races:D
That's what you get for being a FOTM chaser. Maybe you learned a lesson now.
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lebrata
Hedion University
|
Posted - 2008.10.31 19:18:00 -
[56]
Originally by: sdthujfg
Originally by: LordInvisible
maybe yes, but atm they gonna make useless like 2 races:D
That's what you get for being a FOTM chaser. Maybe you learned a lesson now.
FOTM?.....they are changing the way combat in the entire game works are you blind and daft or just a troll.
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Rexthor Hammerfists
Rage of Inferno
|
Posted - 2008.10.31 19:21:00 -
[57]
Cute how worked up some ppl get when their toys get Balanced
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Boosters and PirateProfessions
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Murina
The Scope
|
Posted - 2008.10.31 19:39:00 -
[58]
Originally by: Rexthor Hammerfists
Cute how worked up some ppl get when their toys get Balanced
Its the game itself that is the toy bud, but i suppose that now virtually every ship class apart from a select few totally suck you could consider that "balancing" after a fashon. All they need to do is screw over amaar tracking to "balance" it to be as crap as the rest of the races in eve weapon systems and that will be it.
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Allen Ramses
Caldari
Typo Corp
|
Posted - 2008.11.01 00:13:00 -
[59]
Originally by: Rexthor Hammerfists
Cute how worked up some ppl get when their toys get Balanced
It's not that peoples' toys got balanced, it's how peoples' toys got balanced.
____________________
Pimped out Raven to run level 4 missions quickly: 210 Mil ISK.
Realizing your 120 Mil ISK Drake gets the job done faster: Priceless. |
Koyama Ise
Caldari
Equestrian Knight Order of Lolicon
|
Posted - 2008.11.01 04:29:00 -
[60]
Edited by: Koyama Ise on 01/11/2008 04:29:33
Originally by: Rexthor Hammerfists
Cute how worked up some ppl get when their toys get "balanced"
Fixed.
If I tie a feather to one of your arms and a car to the other would you say you're balanced? No.
If the system was balanced it means the speed tanking is still viable. Balance would have been something less broad spectrum, like fixing boni on polycarbs so it's not the same number as the structure hp penalty on nanofibres and maybe reducing base speed of certain ships.
Not just hitting everything at once; base speeds of subcaps, speed rig stacking, mass reduction modules/rigs to speed increase and agility increase, mwd speeds, mass values, drug boosts, gang mods, gang skills, possibly some more that I can't think of.
It'd be like saying medium blasters are overpowered and nerfing Blasters, Projectiles and Lasers.
------
FIX THE BLOODY OVERVIEW ALREADY!
SPEED NERF!
RUN FOR THE HILLS! |
Lysander Kaldenn
Viper Intel Squad
Sons of Tangra
|
Posted - 2008.11.01 07:59:00 -
[61]
Have you guys logged into Sisi and tried this out yet? I mean really tried it... Not just using all your old setups and complaining that they don't work anymore? There are actually some very viable fast setups based on sig radius instead of raw velocity. Look at all the BS pilots *****ing in Game Development.
I was against this nerf at the first. But after some testing I am more open minded. The mechanics have changed but as long as the missile changes remain as planned, we will still be able to speed (or maybe more acuratly: SIG) tank.
The thing I think is funny is when people start with: THE PLAYER BASE, and WE, and... blah blah. Your like renters complaining because your landlord put in new tile. Yes, you pay rent, but in the end, it's still not your house. Your options are to get used to the tile or to find somewhere else to live. Subcriptions are like rent, they don't buy you ownership or give you control.
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lebrata
Hedion University
|
Posted - 2008.11.01 10:04:00 -
[62]
Originally by: Lysander Kaldenn
Your options are to get used to the tile or to find somewhere else to live. Subcriptions are like rent, they don't buy you ownership or give you control.
IF THEY DO NOT LIKE PPLS OPINIONS THEY SHOULD NOT START THREADS ASKING FOR THEM THEN SHOULD THEY.....
And yes thier are SOME options for pvp but considerably less than on TQ at the moment.
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