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Cheopis
Amarr One Stop Mining Shop One Stop Research
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Posted - 2008.12.18 08:58:00 -
[1]
Welp, more MD veterans are leaving this forum.
Hexxx, Treelox, Shar Tegral
Any comments on the likely impact on ingame financial activities as CCP continues to ignore the high finance players' need for a separate market forum that has some measure of accountability (you must login with actual account info before posting)
And no, I don't plan on having any sort of long drawn out argument on how badly CCP botched the call on the decision to move MD rather than create a new forum.
Where do you think this forum is headed, and how will the total lack of support of the high stakes financial market on the part of CCP impact the ingame playing experience? Has anyone already noticed a difference? What difference?
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Estel Arador
Minmatar
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Posted - 2008.12.18 09:02:00 -
[2]
It's one of those self-fulfilling prophecy things. People think it's getting worse and instead of hanging in or trying to improve, they leave, after which they can say "See it's getting even worse".
FREE! jumpclone service |
Shae Laurel
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Posted - 2008.12.18 09:20:00 -
[3]
Edited by: Shae Laurel on 18/12/2008 09:20:01 People comes and goes... Life will go on and so will MD.
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inVictu5
Caldari Universal-Corp Nexus-Alliance
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Posted - 2008.12.18 09:31:00 -
[4]
Take a minute, and think about what you just posted... "the likely impact on ingame financial activities" as referred to "leaving the forum".
IF the following people are to l33t for this forum why don't they use another forum and leave quietly. Instead everyone must insist on posting their sad ****y farewell. Crying that the game is slowly dieing. And how the noobs dont respect them and there infinite knowledge of a fictional reality. Every game I have ever played its always the same story. My conclusion, its a game, you are ******ed, and you probably need more social activities.
Now go grab your thesaurus and flame me with your uber intellectual l33tness
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Ambo
State Protectorate
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Posted - 2008.12.18 09:35:00 -
[5]
Tbh I think that moving the forum to the top has had little to do with anything.
It's more the current weakness of the IPO/Bond market coupled with the somtimes bizzare moderation of the forum.
The 'community' feel that this forum previously enjoyed has been lessened somewhat in recent months so I can see why the old-timers feel that it's no longer worth hanging out here. However, long-term, I don't think there will be any great change. New people will emerge as the champions of MD. --------------------------------------
Trader? Investor? Just want to track your finances? Check out EMMA |
Mike'P
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Posted - 2008.12.18 10:40:00 -
[6]
I personally think that moving the forum up and hence getting more people to participate was the right thing to do. But maybe that is because I have yet to experience the depths of idiocy that exist amongst the EVE player base - but I'm old enough to have been around the block a few times, so maybe I'm just more tolerant and don't bother reading threads that don't look like they are of interest.
However, I have personally found that some members of the 'veterans club' generate as much unhelpful commentary as they do useful, and having seen some of them effectively chase people out of 'their' patch on this forum - well, if that results in them going elsewhere, I think the forum will be better off for it.
And let's think about that for a minute - are any of these peeps really leaving MD because it moved up a few slots in the forum list? Well, that thought makes me laugh, if nothing else!
I don't believe this will have much impact on ingame financial activities - for every person leaving the game, there is someone who will spot the opportunity and move in. None of us is irreplaceable in this world. And if there really is a need for the 'high finance players' to talk about things that us younger, less well off players wouldn't understand or be able to participate in - they'll find a spot to do so.
Where is the forum headed? Well, pretty much in the same direction it always has been, but hopefully with less aggressive and snarky commentary by some of the 'veterans'. It would be nice to see some much smaller IPOs coming along so that some of the newer players could dip their toes into the market from both sides. I also think that we could do with a nice, purposeful, scam IPO, as this is obviously allowed by game mechanics, and would give us something to talk about, as well as being a learning experience for everyone involved.
The other thing to bear in mind is that if EVE Bank follow their planned route, I suspect that a lot of financial activity would occur off these forums anyway.
Just my 2p.
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SunGod RA
Genos Occidere
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Posted - 2008.12.18 10:51:00 -
[7]
that's IT! I'M LEAVING TOO!!!
*SLAM DOOR INADVERTANTLY INTO FOOT*
ow =[ |
Ray McCormack
hirr
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Posted - 2008.12.18 11:22:00 -
[8]
The only effect will be that we remaining veterans will be come worshipped beyond even your wildest imaginings.
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Confuzer
Volition Cult The Volition Cult
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Posted - 2008.12.18 11:24:00 -
[9]
I think it's childish. And being verbose about it even more childish. ----------------- Destiny is not a matter of chance. It is a matter of choice. It's not a thing to be waited for - it is a thing to be achieved. |
Midas Man
Caldari Dzark Asylum
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Posted - 2008.12.18 11:24:00 -
[10]
It all starts with the people who feel important (sometimes for good reason so no offence here) decide that the forums aint giving them enough back to warrent thier effort in helping. ie spend countless hours researching IPO releases calling up scams etc, directly benefiting not only themselves but the whole community of MD. Most would even offer advice and tip on all areas of the market but only if some research had been carried out by the person asking for help. Recently there ha been alot of clutter from noobish question, alot of the time the answer is a page back at most or worse in the stickies lol. The people putting in all this effort for the betterment of the market and community have now devised a way to continue to progress the secondry market and benefit everyone including the MD forums they are leaving behind, and yet they still recieve critasism.
On the topic of what will happen, well there will be countless scams that work and the secondry market will dissapear completely from here anyone with a valid IPO/Bond will go the ebank route and avoid the scamfest. Reason for the scam fest none of the trusted regulars to call out the scams and dodgy offerings I cannot see newer people sticking around after being scammed a few times.
The Market will probably get healthier from this move but MD will become the "Ask your Noob questions and get scammed here" forum. Looking at the low post count this forum has even when the Experienced regulars visited I cannot see there being much activity at all. I may be wrong, IMO alot of the people "leaving" will keep an eye out here for any investment that looks good. And I think alot of them wont be able to help themselve adding a sarcastic or funny remark to latest batch of noob posts.....shrug.
I only frequent here and it will continue, It gives me much amusement at work.
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Maeda Toshiie
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Posted - 2008.12.18 11:29:00 -
[11]
Unfortunate in that some interesting posting will be lost, not so unfortunate as some inappropriate arrogance will be lost as well. Eve likes a vacuum. Losses only create a bit of interesting chaos followed by new opportunities for different players. Losing the so-called elite is only temporary, as even if they quit the game, let alone the forum, the game will role on, and others will just take their places. And few outside of a small community will ever really note or care about the change.
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Karanth
Gallente Federal Defence Union
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Posted - 2008.12.18 11:31:00 -
[12]
This forum will be worse for it. But then, who really cares here anymore? Certainly not the lazy people spamming the same questions like "How I sell things and make $$$" and "X is too expensive CCP fix it!"
Not the people who get derided for being the 'Elites' of MD, who have done so much and yet are insulted for being successful.
And surely not the people wanting to learn about how things work. You can till all you like, but a wasteland is a wasteland, and what little arable land that's left is blowing away.
Wheel of Whineage |
Carniflex
Caldari StarHunt Fallout Project
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Posted - 2008.12.18 11:46:00 -
[13]
Life will go on as before.
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Taua Roqa
Minmatar Sebiestor tribe
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Posted - 2008.12.18 12:04:00 -
[14]
welcome to the desert of the real
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Benedic
The Aftermath
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Posted - 2008.12.18 12:30:00 -
[15]
Need to run a test on the caremeter, it's sitting right at 0.
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Taikun
Gallente 20th Legion Southern Cross Alliance
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Posted - 2008.12.18 13:55:00 -
[16]
"But lifeÆs like a bucket of waterùyou put your hand in it, and shake your hand around, and it makes a few waves. Then you take your hand out, and nothingÆs changed.ö Russell Brice
Taikun
A criminal is a person with predatory instincts who has not sufficient capital to form a corporation. |
Damien Jax
Industrial Research College Ltd
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Posted - 2008.12.18 14:02:00 -
[17]
The effect of them leaving is that they don't post here, they post on EBANK's forum (www.eve-bank.net).
While they don't post here, healthy discussions do take place over there. MD, as of late, has come a breeding ground for any joe schmoe to come along and offer up an IPO. Then, all of the newer people to visit MD don't do their research and plunk down billions of iskies on some unknown. So, by them moving out, it leaves plenty of newcomers vunerable to scams because less and less people will be around to do the research and point out flaws.
If you're truly serious about IPO's, or high finance, then I suggest you come to EBANK's forums and participate. While the "elders" have left here, they're still alive and kicking over there. It's just a way to escape all of the issues caused by the move and of course some CCP actions recently...
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cosmoray
Cosmoray Construction
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Posted - 2008.12.18 14:03:00 -
[18]
It depends on what all the peeps here want MD to be?
If MD is about raising money in the secondary market, then some of the players mentioned would be missed as they have good business knowledge and have often helped people with their business plans, and helped to point out fraudsters.
If MD becomes more of a discussion on the sale of goods in Eve they won't be missed.
A lot of businesses have investors here so have a duty to stay and report to them.
MD is what the new people will make it.
My general advice to potential investors, be careful
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Cheopis
Amarr One Stop Mining Shop One Stop Research
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Posted - 2008.12.18 14:10:00 -
[19]
Originally by: inVictu5 Take a minute, and think about what you just posted... "the likely impact on ingame financial activities" as referred to "leaving the forum".
IF the following people are to l33t for this forum why don't they use another forum and leave quietly. Instead everyone must insist on posting their sad ****y farewell. Crying that the game is slowly dieing. And how the noobs dont respect them and there infinite knowledge of a fictional reality. Every game I have ever played its always the same story. My conclusion, its a game, you are ******ed, and you probably need more social activities.
Now go grab your thesaurus and flame me with your uber intellectual l33tness
Ya, it's internet spaceships. For the sake of saving a few bits of code and five minutes of a moderator's time per day, CCP refuses to continue to support a forum for economic roleplay. Yes, roleplay. This forum was a roleplay forum to some extent because it was actually possibly to know who was speaking, (and record deals!), since the ability to post here is directly linked to game accounts. Yes, it was a sort of roleplay that most folks just didn't much get into. Internet spaceships is one thing. Internet banking? That's a stretch for most people. The people on this forum were here not because it was ideal, but because they had nowhere else to go that fit their needs better than this forum.
Now, if the people who played the game but did their internet banking roleplay here on the forums find that they can't roleplay the way they used to, they are likely to leave this forum. This is already beginning to happen. If they can't find a place that lets them roleplay similarly elsewhere (permanent records and account login verified posting) how likely are they to simply leave EVE? By chopping off the opportunity for economic roleplayers to play "their" game of EVE, I think CCP is risking a great deal. Some will stay, some will leave. Some will find other places. Some will eventually stop playing EVE because CCP doesn't have the common decency to continue to support a roleplay community here in the forums that they simply do not yet support ingame.
But back to my original bit. How does "out here" affect ingame? I believe people who are no longer allowed to roleplay in the forums as they did before are much more likely to leave EVE.
What would be the effect of Ebank or Dbank closing abruptly, should that come to pass? What would be the effect of the big financial roleplayers isolating themselves from new blood far more than they ever did before? In one case, a severe disruption of huge pieces of the EVE economy. In the other case stagnation and boredom.
Thats what I'm asking about here. How critical to the high end economic game do the experienced high rollers believe this forum really was? How much will the loss of some of the more colorful banking roleplay folks hurt this forum community, and the ingame economy?
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Taikun
Gallente 20th Legion Southern Cross Alliance
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Posted - 2008.12.18 14:15:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Damien Jax While the "elders" have left here
OMG. You make it sound like they walk on water. These forums wil become what it was intended to be. A discussion on how the market works. Not a play thing for a select few IPO announcements and other hogwash.
For YEARS these jokers have plagued this forum with IPO spam where it SHOULD have been in the sell forums. once CCP allowed that crap in here... next came quarterly announcements... directors 'retirements' and all sorts of off-topic garbage.
Moving this rat-trap riff raff posting off the CCP website is a good thing and long overdue. I wish them well but good riddence.
Now this forum can trend back to it's intended audience. Everyone other than the 'elders'. IMHO.
Taikun
A criminal is a person with predatory instincts who has not sufficient capital to form a corporation. |
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Kazzac Elentria
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Posted - 2008.12.18 14:18:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Taikun
OMG. You make it sound like they walk on water. These forums wil become what it was intended to be. A discussion on how the market works. Not a play thing for a select few IPO announcements and other hogwash.
For YEARS these jokers have plagued this forum with IPO spam where it SHOULD have been in the sell forums. once CCP allowed that crap in here... next came quarterly announcements... directors 'retirements' and all sorts of off-topic garbage.
Moving this rat-trap riff raff posting off the CCP website is a good thing and long overdue. I wish them well but good riddence.
Now this forum can trend back to it's intended audience. Everyone other than the 'elders'. IMHO.
Taikun
*facepalm |
Taikun
Gallente 20th Legion Southern Cross Alliance
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Posted - 2008.12.18 14:21:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Kazzac Elentria *facepalm
Allow me to quote Mintal:
"This is for discussing the market, both how it works and to share market tips. If you wish to sell, buy, auction or trade items please use the forums specified for those purposes."
Take your IPOS, share offerings and EBanks elsewhere. This is NOT the place for you. God knows how or WHY they allowed a select few to think even for a second it was intended for another purpose.
Taikun
A criminal is a person with predatory instincts who has not sufficient capital to form a corporation. |
Damien Jax
Industrial Research College Ltd
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Posted - 2008.12.18 14:33:00 -
[23]
Edited by: Damien Jax on 18/12/2008 14:34:14
Originally by: Taikun
Originally by: Damien Jax While the "elders" have left here
OMG. You make it sound like they walk on water. These forums wil become what it was intended to be. A discussion on how the market works. Not a play thing for a select few IPO announcements and other hogwash.
For YEARS these jokers have plagued this forum with IPO spam where it SHOULD have been in the sell forums. once CCP allowed that crap in here... next came quarterly announcements... directors 'retirements' and all sorts of off-topic garbage.
Moving this rat-trap riff raff posting off the CCP website is a good thing and long overdue. I wish them well but good riddence.
Now this forum can trend back to it's intended audience. Everyone other than the 'elders'. IMHO.
Taikun
I'm sorry Taikun, I should have realized tone doesn't translate well via text. By no means was I suggesting they walked on water, I think you're just too self-absorbed with tearing everyone down in this forum to realize I was making a generalization.
This forum is (or was) the exact place for IPO's and the like, not the sell order forum. Market Discussion has dual meaning in EVE - the actual markets and then the financial market. CCP built in the share feature of corporations, where else should we discuss this feature than the market discussion forum?
Sell orders is no the place, not everyone has something to sell when they wish to talk about shares and finance. Market discussion is the correct forum (as has been demonstrated by CCP not moving IPO discussions out of this forum).
I have yet to see you offer one shred of constructive discussion to this forum in terms of actually discussing the market. All you do is troll every single thread and pop in to say something negative. Can you take the stick out of your bum please and lighten up? Not everyone in the world is going to bend over and listen to you and your "suggestions." If you don't like what's being discussed here, then by all means, report every single thread that you feel isn't market related. Like I told you in the other forums, move on and don't read it if you don't like it.
You're like the silly old mom who's little kid was hurt in some stupid accident and makes it her mission to ruin the fun of everyone else. You INSIST on voicing your opinions, no matter how assinine they may be, until you get what you want. All you do is ruin the experience and the enjoyment for everyone else. You, and others like you, are the exact reason this forum has gone to hell in a handbasket. You, and others like you, are why the word troll was developed.
Quit trolling, go back to lurking. I'm sorry your mom didn't coddle you more as a child, it must be hard being you. Quit taking out your anger and frustration on others in the MD forum. I feel a report coming on, I think you have a macro set up to click on report automatically when you enter a thread. So be it.
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Taikun
Gallente 20th Legion Southern Cross Alliance
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Posted - 2008.12.18 14:47:00 -
[24]
Edited by: Taikun on 18/12/2008 14:47:49
Originally by: Damien Jax I have yet to see you offer one shred of constructive discussion to this forum in terms of actually discussing the market.
Who cares what you have or havent seen. I have said my fair share in the four years I have been around to those individuals I deem worth knowing what I know. In fact, many of the things I tore strips off of CCP collective hides has been changed for the better. Many have not but at least I voiced them. Who the hell are you? Stop riding on the coat tails of others and deliver something other than blah blah blah.
These forums were created for a specific purpose. NOT for the garbage we have been plagued with for the past year. Mintal CLEARLY states what this place is for. I even quoted him. Try READING IT.
Perhaps if YOU don't like the rules here YOU should find another sandbox to play in as well.
Taikun
A criminal is a person with predatory instincts who has not sufficient capital to form a corporation. |
Damien Jax
Industrial Research College Ltd
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Posted - 2008.12.18 14:53:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Taikun Edited by: Taikun on 18/12/2008 14:47:49
Perhaps if YOU don't like the rules here YOU should find another sandbox to play in as well.
Taikun
Well if you're what's left in MD after everyone leaving, I'll have no problem doing that.
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Midas Man
Caldari Dzark Asylum
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Posted - 2008.12.18 14:57:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Taikun Edited by: Taikun on 18/12/2008 14:47:49 Stop riding on the coat tails of others and deliver something other than blah blah blah.
you know you could Take you own advice, for someone so against IPO's you have done a massive amount of posting relating to ...wait for it....IPO and even more shocking you did it in this forum.
Unless you have something better to add than something that contradicts your earlier posting pointed out numerous time by many a MD poster, please remain silent.
Anyone interstead in seeing Taikun other point of view on this subject go to Eve Search and search "Taikun IPO" "Taikun scam". and other tings that will bring up page after page of post by him discussing exactly what he is telling people shouldn't be discussed here LOL.
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Block Ukx
Block Ships and Ammunitions
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Posted - 2008.12.18 14:59:00 -
[27]
ôThis is for discussing the marketö Most players consider the secondary market as part of the ômarketö.
Mintal, Is the secondary market part of the market? I think this needs to be clarified in the MD discussion rules thread.
BSAC Mineral Market Manipulation (MinMa) Information Desk |
Kazzac Elentria
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Posted - 2008.12.18 15:02:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Taikun
These forums were created for a specific purpose. NOT for the garbage we have been plagued with for the past year. Mintal CLEARLY states what this place is for. I even quoted him. Try READING IT.
Perhaps if YOU don't like the rules here YOU should find another sandbox to play in as well.
Taikun
The sell orders are not suited to the requirements that IPOs, Offerings, Bonds, etc.. require. And because they are related to the market in general they were allowed to rest here... for well over your and my time here.
To ignore that they've been like this and the reasons why is pretty moranic and indicative that you're just trolling here Taikun |
Taikun
Gallente 20th Legion Southern Cross Alliance
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Posted - 2008.12.18 15:10:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Kazzac Elentria To ignore that they've been like this and the reasons why is pretty moranic and indicative that you're just trolling here Taikun
Just because something has degraded into a situation does not give licence to allow it to continue. Case in point is these so called 'elders' attempt to impose their point of view on CCP on how this forum should operate. CCP said no thanks and they had a coniption and is pouting in their own playpen.
You call my POV trolling. All I see from you is a weak mind failing to maturely discuss a point of difference and falling upon the "you're a troll defense". Pathetic.
Taikun
A criminal is a person with predatory instincts who has not sufficient capital to form a corporation. |
Taikun
Gallente 20th Legion Southern Cross Alliance
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Posted - 2008.12.18 15:13:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Block Ukx ôThis is for discussing the marketö Most players consider the secondary market as part of the ômarketö.
Mintal, Is the secondary market part of the market? I think this needs to be clarified in the MD discussion rules thread.
Indeed it does need clarification.
I have questioned / demanded clarification and movement on this years ago. Of course... CCP's turnaround will have this settled long after we are all dead and buried.
Taikun
A criminal is a person with predatory instincts who has not sufficient capital to form a corporation. |
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