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Freyya GeoCorp. Paxton Federation	Posted - 2009.01.29 16:28:00 - [1] Has anyone actually put any thought into it who this new race might be? Could it be the illusive Einheduani? Or could it be the Talocan, Sleepers, Takhmal and Yan Yung? Could it be both as a member of this forum long ago posted the thought that the 4 ancient races merged into the Einheduani? If either is so; their tech is calculated to be at least T10 and way above since they are indeed the first ones to set foot in New Eden thousands of years ago. Seeing as this would make them near invincible compared to our tech it seems illogical to have them as the new race, although it would fit in with what was mentioned in a devblog that we all know (or should) that we where not the first ones in New Eden and that others have set foot here before us. IF it is indeed the aforementioned races then why didn't the Jove follow after them into the wormholes since they are thought to be about the same age as the other races (give or take a few hundred to thousand years). Discuss.. ___________ NOW COLLECTING ISD AND CCP AUTOGRAPHS It'll be worth something someday. -Rauth

CCP Navigator C C P CCP	Posted - 2009.01.29 16:47:00 - [2] Your timing of this question could not be better! Check out the when evolution leaps forward blog by CCP Ytterbium for all of your answers

Freyya GeoCorp. Paxton Federation	Posted - 2009.01.29 16:50:00 - [3] Edited by: Freyya on 29/01/2009 16:56:09 Lol nice! /Reading as fast as possible! Blog read; Sleepers whoo! Now i'm going to have to completely rewrite my story since they are actually going to be introduced..buhbye about 25 chapters worth of typing ^^ (Search for Dark Screams if you're wanting to know what i'm talking about) Anyhow; Still leaves some valid questions in my post which will probably be answered in coming blogs....POAST BLOGS NAOW!
Dark Soldat Caldari Dirty Deeds Corp. Axiom Empire	Posted - 2009.01.29 16:52:00 - [4] zomg sleepers everybody get your blankets to confuse them !!!
Noix Arikani	Posted - 2009.01.29 16:55:00 - [5] itsa DEVBLOG devgasm
Scott Ryder Amarr Dark Skullz Empire	Posted - 2009.01.29 16:56:00 - [6] I wonder if those new wormholes will be farmed just like plexes have done? Camped down...
Nicholas Barker Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers	Posted - 2009.01.29 17:05:00 - [7] basicly they're a new faction of npcs to shoot at, not a playable race. ------
Rodj Blake Amarr PIE Inc.	Posted - 2009.01.29 17:08:00 - [8] And I for one welcome our new Sleeper overlords. Dulce et decorum est pro imperium mori.
Sidus Isaacs Gallente	Posted - 2009.01.29 17:10:00 - [9] Originally by: Scott Ryder I wonder if those new wormholes will be farmed just like plexes have done? Camped down... NO, I do not belive so, not witht he random entranve points and wormhole colapses. This sytem is not static, but more dynamic.
Ottersmacker 24th Imperial Crusade	Posted - 2009.01.29 17:13:00 - [10] So this is why in the fanfest videos one could notice devs saying things about space and time in such a clever/spooky manner.. :o the wormholes somehow mess with time as well?
Ki Tarra Caldari Ki Tech Industries	Posted - 2009.01.29 17:15:00 - [11] Originally by: Sidus Isaacs Originally by: Scott Ryder I wonder if those new wormholes will be farmed just like plexes have done? Camped down... NO, I do not belive so, not witht he random entranve points and wormhole colapses. This sytem is not static, but more dynamic. That and of course the option to engage the farmers at will.
Andrea Erlang Caldari Erlang Biolabs	Posted - 2009.01.29 17:15:00 - [12] Quote: As such, with the expansion arrival, expect various pirate battleships to arrive into low-security areas to ambush the unprepared pilots. Of course, the nature and type of these new spawns will be put into scale towards null and high-security space as we plan to even out rewards, not destabilize them further. To be clear, no pirate battleship spawn will make it into high-security space. Does this mean what I think it means?! Boosting low-sec? Nerfing high-sec?
Droog 1	Posted - 2009.01.29 17:23:00 - [13] Originally by: Andrea Erlang Quote: As such, with the expansion arrival, expect various pirate battleships to arrive into low-security areas to ambush the unprepared pilots. Of course, the nature and type of these new spawns will be put into scale towards null and high-security space as we plan to even out rewards, not destabilize them further. To be clear, no pirate battleship spawn will make it into high-security space. Does this mean what I think it means?! Boosting low-sec? Nerfing high-sec? Sounds like a boost to losec by adding BS spawns and not a nerf to hisec. Sounds like BS will remain in hisec missions but not spawn in hisec belts.
Tzar'rim	Posted - 2009.01.29 17:25:00 - [14] Originally by: Andrea Erlang Quote: As such, with the expansion arrival, expect various pirate battleships to arrive into low-security areas to ambush the unprepared pilots. Of course, the nature and type of these new spawns will be put into scale towards null and high-security space as we plan to even out rewards, not destabilize them further. To be clear, no pirate battleship spawn will make it into high-security space. Does this mean what I think it means?! Boosting low-sec? Nerfing high-sec? Fek sleepers, this is far more intersting indeed!
Faife Federation of Freedom Fighters	Posted - 2009.01.29 17:29:00 - [15] awesome to having NPCs with actual player ships and ability to call targets. hoping it works well and gets applied to all NPCs with time.
Freyya GeoCorp. Paxton Federation	Posted - 2009.01.29 18:19:00 - [16] I'm going to read it as a boost to lowsec a bit but keeping the rewards in line with the respective security rating, somewhat at least.. It is also awesome that the new Sleepers will be able to employ tactics not uncommon in PvP although i wonder what kind of balance is built in to not make them overpowered or facilitate the need to go blob NPC's... As said before this will probably be explained a bit in future devblogs. Anyways, to keep my topic somewhat on topic; I am going to have to correct my previous statement that they are calculated to have T10 technology. According to lore they had somewhat better than T2 and more advanced in special areas around a thousand years ago. I'm going to assume it was at least above T3 in the more advanced areas. Given the fact that they've had a thousand years to evolve and upgrade their tech i do think it's a safe bet that they could be well above tech 10 if we keep the current growth of our tech over the last years. Revisiting on my OP i am now wondering why only the Sleepers are coming to the playground and where the other ancient races stand. My intrigues towards the Enheduanni are growing largely as well since i too was starting to assume the 4 ancient races evolved into them.
Captain Pompous Is Right Even When He's Wrong So Deal With It	Posted - 2009.01.29 18:51:00 - [17] Originally by: Freyya It is also awesome that the new Sleepers will be able to employ tactics not uncommon in PvP You mean like jamming? Like in Falconry?
Megan Maynard Minmatar Out of Order	Posted - 2009.01.29 18:54:00 - [18] FOR THE LOVE OF ALL THINGS AWESOME. PLEASE have BS rats and support in low spawn at gates to nab travels lol. How awesome would it be to make carebears actually have to worry about gates when real pirates aren't around lol. Escalating ambushes by npc's at low sec gates would be freaking awesome. I want a fight when I come into system, I deserve it dangit.
Freyya GeoCorp. Paxton Federation	Posted - 2009.01.29 19:05:00 - [19] Originally by: Captain Pompous Originally by: Freyya It is also awesome that the new Sleepers will be able to employ tactics not uncommon in PvP You mean like jamming? Like in Falconry? Correct, i believe it was hinted at a little bit more detailed in a/some later posts in the "GIVE US NPC AI" thread. Could be wrong though but it's posted somewhere... ___________ NOW COLLECTING ISD AND CCP AUTOGRAPHS It'll be worth something someday. -Rauth
Armoured C Gallente Federation of Freedom Fighters Executive Outcomes	Posted - 2009.01.29 19:10:00 - [20] Originally by: CCP Navigator Your timing of this question could not be better! Check out the when evolution leaps forward blog by CCP Ytterbium for all of your answers i would go to the blog if it actualy gave us more info on the actual new NPC which is doesnt actualy give, i hate to troll over a CCP member but ze BLOGS show us nothing This week EvE Life: Fleet fighting blog is now available
Rainhailer Gallente Einherjar Rising Cry Havoc.	Posted - 2009.01.29 19:22:00 - [21] Edited by: Rainhailer on 29/01/2009 19:24:41 Originally by: Scott Ryder I wonder if those new wormholes will be farmed just like plexes have done? Camped down... You're a complete idiot. The systems wormholes link to are static but the ways in are dynamic. They lead to ENTIRE SYSTEMS not complexes.
Armoured C Gallente Federation of Freedom Fighters Executive Outcomes	Posted - 2009.01.29 19:24:00 - [22] wormholes arnt static , once they close the will go somewhere else, they are static and there connection until the timer/mass thing runs out then you will have to go find another one ...if you made it out of the last one of course This week EvE Life: Fleet fighting blog is now available
Gnulpie Minmatar Miner Tech	Posted - 2009.01.29 19:25:00 - [23] Originally by: Freyya Has anyone actually put any thought into it who this new race might be? Could it be the illusive Einheduani? Or could it be the Talocan, Sleepers, Takhmal and Yan Yung? It is the Sleepers accordingly to the newest devblog. So better get your sleeper technology skillbook ready!
Leaving Eve	Posted - 2009.01.29 19:27:00 - [24] Originally by: Captain Pompous Originally by: Freyya It is also awesome that the new Sleepers will be able to employ tactics not uncommon in PvP You mean like jamming? Like in Falconry? You mean like Guristas?
John Holt Caldari ANZAC ALLIANCE Southern Cross Alliance	Posted - 2009.01.29 19:29:00 - [25] Edited by: John Holt on 29/01/2009 19:29:29 Originally by: Armoured C Originally by: CCP Navigator Your timing of this question could not be better! Check out the when evolution leaps forward blog by CCP Ytterbium for all of your answers i would go to the blog if it actualy gave us more info on the actual new NPC which is doesnt actualy give, i hate to troll over a CCP member but ze BLOGS show us nothing Why would we want them to give us extensive knowledge of a faction we haven't even run into yet. We need to learn about the Sleepers by contact with them, not dev blog spoilers.
Kahega Amielden Minmatar Suddenly Ninjas	Posted - 2009.01.29 19:34:00 - [26] Confirming that the AI improvements involve NPC falcons Originally by: Catharacta My CNR runs on salvager tears.
Par'Gellen Gallente	Posted - 2009.01.29 19:36:00 - [27] Edited by: Par''Gellen on 29/01/2009 19:36:18 Can anyone link some official info on the Sleepers? I can't find them (or any of the other races mentioned) anywhere on this site --- To err is human. But it shouldn't be the company motto...
Becq Starforged Minmatar Ship Construction Services Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2009.01.29 19:50:00 - [28] The existing NPC races typically come in basic and elite version. Given this, will the elite version of the Sleepers be the Bogeymen? Regarding information on the Sleepers, I think the bulk of that was introduced through the COSMOS missions; specifically the Matari ones. I wouldn't be surprised if this was collected somewhere, but I don't know where. -- Becq Starforged The Flame of Freedom Burns On!
Ker HarSol Minmatar Zip - I	Posted - 2009.01.29 19:57:00 - [29] Originally by: Par'Gellen Can anyone link some official info on the Sleepers? I can't find them (or any of the other races mentioned) anywhere on this site It is reasonable to expect that the sleeper technology skillbook will be necessary to build the new t3 stuff. Maybe more skills necessary, but that one at least. There is already a shortage and prices going up. LOL
Gneeznow Minmatar Goo Spew	Posted - 2009.01.29 19:59:00 - [30] do they have a bounty? can you raise sec status by pew'ing them? thats what I want to know!
Freyya GeoCorp. Paxton Federation	Posted - 2009.01.29 20:02:00 - [31] Edited by: Freyya on 29/01/2009 20:15:22 Some basic info regarding the sleepers and their respective counterraces; Yan Jung Race Name: Yan Jung Race: Descended from unknown Humans Race age: Unknown, at least 1000Æs of years old. Tech Level: Around T2, some areas a little behind others further along. Technology of Note: Achieved Tech 2 level over 1000 years ago. The Yan Jung nation possessed advanced gravitronic technology and force field theories beyond T2. Have self repairing buildings that use nano tech with power sourceÆs that last over 1000Æs years without fuel. Sleepers Race Name: Sleepers Race: Descended from unknown Humans Race age: Unknown, Tech Level: Around T2, some areas a little behind others further along. Technology of Note: The Sleepers were masters of virtual reality, neural interfacing and cryotechnology. Takmahl Race Name: Takmahl Race: Descended from unknown Humans Race age: Unknown, Tech Level: Around T2, some areas a little behind others further along. Technology of Note: The Takmahl nation excelled in cybernetics and bio-engineering. Talocan Race Name: Takmahl Race: Descended from unknown Humans Race age: Unknown, Tech Level: Around T2, some areas a little behind others further along. Technology of Note: The Talocan were masters of Spatial manipulation and Hypereuclidean Mathematics. Not much else is really known beyond this point, even the above uses some speculation. ___________ NOW COLLECTING ISD AND CCP AUTOGRAPHS It'll be worth something someday. -Rauth
Mithfindel Gallente Zenko Group	Posted - 2009.01.29 20:05:00 - [32] If I remember correctly, the Blood Raiders consider the Takmahl their predecessors. (According to the Amarr COSMOS missions.)
Freyya GeoCorp. Paxton Federation	Posted - 2009.01.29 20:05:00 - [33] Edited by: Freyya on 29/01/2009 20:06:39 Originally by: Ker HarSol Originally by: Par'Gellen Can anyone link some official info on the Sleepers? I can't find them (or any of the other races mentioned) anywhere on this site It is reasonable to expect that the sleeper technology skillbook will be necessary to build the new t3 stuff. Maybe more skills necessary, but that one at least. There is already a shortage and prices going up. LOL This is what i find odd. Why only the sleeper race? Where does this leave the other race skillbooks? I find it hard to believe they'd only find a suitable cause for only one of the 4 ancient races. I have my reservations about their skillbook being needed to build T3. Originally by: Mithfindel If I remember correctly, the Blood Raiders consider the Takmahl their predecessors. (According to the Amarr COSMOS missions.) All the 4 Cosmos mission areas are linked to the ancient races. I have a rather large list of alot of landmarks and cosmos/mission descriptions but i am not finding alot on the ancients. ___________ NOW COLLECTING ISD AND CCP AUTOGRAPHS It'll be worth something someday. -Rauth
Shirley Serious Amarr Imperial Academy	Posted - 2009.01.29 20:07:00 - [34] Originally by: Freyya Takmahl Race Name: Takmahl Race: Descended from unknown Humans Race age: Unknown, Tech Level: Around T2, some areas a little behind others further along. Technology of Note: The Takmahl nation excelled in cybernetics and bio-engineering. from the cosmos mission background, the Takmahl were from the Amarr planet, Athra, and split shortly after the Amarr entered space. They were exiled to Araz constellation. Yes. Yes, I am.
Avon Caldari Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers	Posted - 2009.01.29 20:31:00 - [35] Damn. My money was on Thargoids.
Gnulpie Minmatar Miner Tech	Posted - 2009.01.29 20:36:00 - [36] Hehe, I wonder when some of the rich guys buy up all the skillbooks and make a huuuge profit. But yeah, the Sleepers as new npc race makes sense. They are masters of cryotechnology so they could survive where others would have had died.
Avon Caldari Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers	Posted - 2009.01.29 20:42:00 - [37] Originally by: Gnulpie They are masters of cryotechnology so they could survive where others would have had died. Like freezers and ice buckets and igloos?
Don Zoul	Posted - 2009.01.29 20:59:00 - [38] Isn't it obvious? the new race is Transformers else why would our scientists be researching modular space ships... My money(wild guess) is on the Sleepers having cryogenicaly frozen themselves and/or perhaps neurally-interfaced themselves with their techology. Almost like a new race of self-aware drones, their ships could be individual and also made on mass in building blocks, like the modular Tech3 we're seeing rumours of.
Durzel The Xenodus Initiative.	Posted - 2009.01.30 00:13:00 - [39] Can someone clarify something for me? These new wormhole systems where these Sleepers will be will only be accessible via 0.0 (and/or are 0.0 themselves?) won't they? Isn't it kinda redundant to tell people in 0.0 that they will need to fit for PvP? We need this paradigm shift in high-sec missioning, not where people already have a predisposition towards PvP surely? (clue: people who won't/can't go to 0.0 or low-sec aren't going to go there come Apoc or anything else)
Kahega Amielden Minmatar Suddenly Ninjas	Posted - 2009.01.30 00:19:00 - [40] No. I'm pretty sure wormholes will appear everywhere, even hisec. What you probably read was that w-space will basically be 0.0 for the purposes of PVP and all that. Originally by: Catharacta My CNR runs on salvager tears.
bff Jill	Posted - 2009.01.30 00:20:00 - [41] maybe each part of a tech 3 ship is actually a sleeper who has neural interfaced himself into a machine.
Rutger Centemus Joint Empire Squad	Posted - 2009.01.30 00:24:00 - [42] Originally by: Durzel Can someone clarify something for me? These new wormhole systems where these Sleepers will be will only be accessible via 0.0 (and/or are 0.0 themselves?) won't they? The devblog said that the new W-systems would be accessible from every type of space ( 1.0 -> -1.0 sec). There would however be some differences in general profitability between those W-systems usually linked to highsec, lowsec and 0.0. Keywords being 'generally', 'usually' etc. The W-systems themselves could, for all intends and purposes, be classed as 0.0 as there wouldn't be factional navies or Concord, just rats, and no 'penalties' on pvp. Originally by: Crumplecorn I prefer launching bathtubs of antimatter at my opponents over pointing an open DVD player at them, even if the bathtubs do miss a lot. So no.
Durzel The Xenodus Initiative.	Posted - 2009.01.30 00:28:00 - [43] Ah cool, thanks. Not too fussed about profitability - low-sec/0.0 should always provide more of a reward, just keen to see how good the new AI is in relative safety
london Gallente KDS Navy	Posted - 2009.01.30 00:28:00 - [44] As I stated in the comments for the blog, I just hope this new faction is of human decent and not some cheesy star trek alien type. :/
Pikkuhukka Caldari Space Perverts and Forum Warriors United	Posted - 2009.01.30 00:33:00 - [45] Originally by: Gneeznow do they have a bounty? can you raise sec status by pew'ing them? thats what I want to know! also what i only want to know about these, bounty, yes, no? c/d?
NewEden Explorer	Posted - 2009.01.30 00:36:00 - [46] Edited by: NewEden Explorer on 30/01/2009 00:36:00 Originally by: london As I stated in the comments for the blog, I just hope this new faction is of human decent and not some cheesy star trek alien type. :/ yeah, we wouldn't want anything 'unnatural' in an inter-galactic space game.
london Gallente KDS Navy	Posted - 2009.01.30 00:56:00 - [47] Originally by: NewEden Explorer Edited by: NewEden Explorer on 30/01/2009 00:36:00 Originally by: london As I stated in the comments for the blog, I just hope this new faction is of human decent and not some cheesy star trek alien type. :/ yeah, we wouldn't want anything 'unnatural' in an inter-galactic space game. Well, yeah. ;)
Sidrat Flush Caldari Life is Experience Rally Against Evil	Posted - 2009.01.30 00:57:00 - [48] Originally by: CCP Navigator Your timing of this question could not be better! Check out the when evolution leaps forward blog by CCP Ytterbium for all of your answers Is that your alt? Nice introduction, and very fortunate if it wasn't planned in advance.
TimMc Gallente Brutal Deliverance OWN Alliance	Posted - 2009.01.30 01:08:00 - [49] This... sounds... ****ing AWESOME!
Armoured C Gallente Federation of Freedom Fighters Executive Outcomes	Posted - 2009.01.30 01:11:00 - [50] my money was on the wookie
Abrazzar	Posted - 2009.01.30 01:38:00 - [51] So let's do some wild speculation: The sleepers stashed away some of their own in cryogenic sleep in those hidden systems (probably seen the downfall of their race). The systems were set to revive its population if they detect an activation of the EVE gate. Our Dear Empress created traces of anti-reality with that earth-tech weapon (might not even be a weapon, just used as such), which were detected by the Sleeper sensors and interpreted as reopening of the EVE gate. Sleepers woke up and are preparing for their way home, opening up the systems to wormholes only to meet the empires being in their way. Considering the EVE gate is still closed and the Sleeper's ancestral space occupied by some rather primitive human people they declare war on them all for desecrating the EVE gate, and simply being where there should only be Sleepers. So the Capsuleers go in and blow everything up. The Jove are too depressed to do anything much, or they are busy looking in the new systems for information on how to cure themselves, maybe even trading information with the Sleepers and probably betraying the rest of the empires for their own advantages. Rogue Drones stumble into some wormholes and soon develop strains that use new adaptive Sleeper technology. Considering drones have not much use for cryogenics and sentience isn't that widespread with them, diplomatic relations with the Sleepers are unlikely. -------- Ideas for: Mining
Seetesh Caldari Warped Mining Strip Mining Club	Posted - 2009.01.30 01:43:00 - [52] DO u suppose the sleeprs are the onces who reprogrammed jamyl's data burst after she died in the tournie?
Abrazzar	Posted - 2009.01.30 01:55:00 - [53] Originally by: Seetesh DO u suppose the sleeprs are the onces who reprogrammed jamyl's data burst after she died in the tournie? Well, the only race that is said to have the technology to be able to do that would be the Enheduanni. The Jove said that those have enough knowledge of the human brain to be able to manipulate it in the manner it happened with the Empress. This would also offer a technological explanation for the 'telepathic' abilities the Empress displays. It'd basically be a device used to read out the structures and working of another brain, translating it into what the person is thinking and displaying it in the host's brain as a voice or 'innate knowledge' of the other's thoughts and feelings. Telepathic projection is achieved by stimulating the target's brain in the area that processes hearing to simulate a voice talking to them. Considering her body was thoroughly modified and she got another foreign personality imprinted onto her own and had a rather thorough restructuring of her brain in ways unknown to the empires, it is quite possible that she got 'upgraded' with all kinds of devices and the means to control them. Considering the technological specialty of the Sleepers, it may even be possible that the Sleepers and Enheduanni are somewhere related.
Jmanis Catharg Caldari Dusk Blade	Posted - 2009.01.30 02:12:00 - [54] Originally by: Avon Damn. My money was on Thargoids. They're still waiting for us to arrive in Polaris flying the "Argent's Quest".
Tayra Yesu	Posted - 2009.01.30 02:24:00 - [55] For once I am going to fiction speculate in agreement with Pottsey, and say all of the ancient races collectively make up "the Enheduanni" aka "the others".
ashellia	Posted - 2009.01.30 04:28:00 - [56] u know what would be cool, Sleepers spawing out in low sec, (prolly from wormholes) and start attacking/blobbing pirate gatecamps.. and they dont carry bounties since they aren't exactly pirates.. just so they cant be farm for isk :p. make them spawn in system with the highest count of ship destroyed/poded.. so gate campers wont fill all that save in their 10 bs fleet
Jove X Dragon Highlords Imorral Dragons	Posted - 2009.01.30 04:40:00 - [57] Sleeper race? Makes me wonder if the Dev's have been hanging out in the Jove channel. We were discussing the sleeper races a lot recently.

CCP Dropbear	Posted - 2009.01.30 04:57:00 - [58] Just dropping in quickly to let you guys and girls know that as far as storyline stuff goes, there will be a good deal of information you can actually go out and discover for yourselves. This is part of the whole idea, after all. From the resources you gather to the items you loot, they will all be pieces of the puzzle. In short; they won't just build you ships, they'll build you a backstory for these Sleepyheads too.

Jove X Dragon Highlords Imorral Dragons	Posted - 2009.01.30 05:31:00 - [59] Originally by: CCP Dropbear Just dropping in quickly to let you guys and girls know that as far as storyline stuff goes, there will be a good deal of information you can actually go out and discover for yourselves. This is part of the whole idea, after all. From the resources you gather to the items you loot, they will all be pieces of the puzzle. In short; they won't just build you ships, they'll build you a backstory for these Sleepyheads too. Thats a nice touch and everything, but before you go adding new backstory, you might want to fix up some of the loose threads already dangling? Whats up with the Jove? How can Lady Sarum be an acceptable Empress when Khanid II got run out of town ... etc etc.
Rakshasa Taisab Caldari Sane Industries Inc. Ursa Stellar Initiative	Posted - 2009.01.30 07:32:00 - [60] Originally by: Jove X Thats a nice touch and everything, but before you go adding new backstory, you might want to fix up some of the loose threads already dangling? Fixing loose dangly threads leads to Star Wars episode 1-3.
samuel Aroq Gallente	Posted - 2009.01.30 07:32:00 - [61] Originally by: Jove X Whats up with the Jove? How can Lady Sarum be an acceptable Empress when Khanid II got run out of town ... etc etc. Jove is jove, they are elusive =) Khanid did not get run out of town, he ran out of town on his own when not wanting to follow tradition.
Rondo Gunn Caldari Perkone	Posted - 2009.01.30 07:43:00 - [62] Originally by: Rakshasa Taisab Originally by: Jove X Thats a nice touch and everything, but before you go adding new backstory, you might want to fix up some of the loose threads already dangling? Fixing loose dangly threads leads to Star Wars episode 1-3. Yeah. Next up: Star Wars 3 and 1/2 : The Quest For More Money. I hear jar-jar is in it alot.
Freyya GeoCorp. Paxton Federation	Posted - 2009.01.30 07:54:00 - [63] Edited by: Freyya on 30/01/2009 07:55:31 Originally by: london As I stated in the comments for the blog, I just hope this new faction is of human decent and not some cheesy star trek alien type. :/ The Sleepers are among oneof the first to set foot in New Eden via the EvE gate. EvE was never ment to be the alien kind game since it focusses on humans and their way of thought. Conflicts and all... Originally by: Sidrat Flush Originally by: CCP Navigator Your timing of this question could not be better! Check out the when evolution leaps forward blog by CCP Ytterbium for all of your answers Is that your alt? Nice introduction, and very fortunate if it wasn't planned in advance. Hehe i can fully denie any altism...i wish ^^ Just a very fortunate timing since i was wondering who they were going to be for a longer time now. The 4 ancients and the Enheduanni have been captivating my imagination for a long time now (well over a year) and i was researching them to use in my Fanfic novel. As such i was already hoping it was them
ollobrains2 Gallente New Eve Order Holdings	Posted - 2009.01.30 10:12:00 - [64] when do we get to play with these sleepers on sisi ? or is ccp going to bypass pre expansion sisi testing and go straight on march 10 with these changes ?
Ralitge boyter Minmatar	Posted - 2009.01.30 10:39:00 - [65] Why would the four ancient races have evolved into the Einheduani? What is to say that we are not looking at a similar situation as now with 5 races, four in active struggle amongst them selfÆs and one that has moved away from the rest of them to lead a secluded live a live in which they are able to evolve them selfÆs and their technology far beyond what the other races are capable of... I would expect the war to have raged on for a long time sparked off by who knows what. The Einheduani could have stepped in, in the end and pushed the existing races out to their own corners of the universe. Effectively ending the war and paving the way for us to make out way to new Eden. Sleepers might just have been the first race that found the way back, or maybe those pesky sisters of eve found a way to create a ôstargateö in the hopes to make our way back to earth. But instead of having achieved this they somehow homed in on the Sleepers due to the fact that they used Sleeper technology in order to be able to create this gate. Of course something went wrong the gate turned out to be unstable and caused ôminiö wormholes to open up across the known universe. This then gives the sleepers the ability to come to low sec space and push some pirates around out there, while giving us the ability to move to Sleeper space where we can pester them. Sleepers for what ever reason didnÆt need gates (maybe this is because of their cryotechnology skills that they are able to survive the long time required to travel between the systems without going insane or dying of boredom. For all we know our knowledge of history is wrongà we might simply be decedents of these ancient races with the Jove obviously descending from the Einheduani giving them the ability to move away from us at a higher pace. The opening of the EVE gate and the catastrophic failure of the gate might have happened many thousands of years earlier then our history books tell us. We could very well be decedents of the few scattered peoples left behind when the Einheduani ripped apart space and time as we know it and moved the warring factions to the furthest reaches of the galaxy. Leaving us to recover from the shock of total destruction of all fundaments that we had build our lifeÆs on, causing us to revert back to a much simpler lifestyle in the end evolving into the five races as we know them today. I think assuming that what we know about the ancient races and what we believe we know from our own history might simply be assuming too much, you should not forget that the history of the eve gate had to be pieced together by the separate races and having reinvented space travel and meeting up with the other races this collective knowledge had to be fitted together in a way that created a plausible account of what actually happened all those thousands of years ago. Who is to say that the memories as they where passed on from one generation to the next on our separate home worlds stayed 100% correct? Why would we assume that the scholars of old didnÆt make a compromise when the various history books didnÆt line up yet they where tasked to fit the existence of this newly discovered race in to our own history. ------------------------------------------- Should you disagree with me, well I guess that is because I disagree with you. If you have a problem with that please feel free not to tell me.
Bartholomeus Crane Gallente The Crane Family	Posted - 2009.01.30 10:49:00 - [66] That Jove flying his BS into the gate? He did it ... -- Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
ollobrains2 Gallente New Eve Order Holdings	Posted - 2009.01.30 10:53:00 - [67] [pink] the big question is what will the sleepers represent - a machine AI perhaps not to different from the drones but perhaps more evolved. Given that they live in wspace, perhaps the 2500 systems represent linked wormhole systems not linked to the main eve galaxy until this coming big event ( which will happen on march 10) reopens old links from the eve universe perhaps to existing eve systems that got cut off early on ( if the sleepers were original eve inhabitants they to would have been cut off from earth) perhaps they discovered a technology to open up wormholes and all of them went thro from eve to a third area of undiscovered space. Perhaps it all got cut off leavign them cut off until now Will the accidential reopening of the wormholes be linked to a) something the eve races do b) soemthing the sleepers do c) something natural Also will the sleepers be machine, AI minded or a real race that has advanced to something else ? how cohesive will they be by the sounds of it they are roaming without settled systems ..... yet. We await the slow dribbel of dev blogs from ccp on it and probably no sisi testing either [pink]
Dr Sheepbringer Gallente	Posted - 2009.01.30 10:58:00 - [68] Edited by: Dr Sheepbringer on 30/01/2009 11:03:22 I want WAR!! PvE goes PvP! Sleeper emerging like shadows and busting balls in all areas (high-sec also), we have a enemy! So, that's not going to happed. I hope Sleepers would "mimic" player (or learn from them) fits and basically come at you with the best fits (to counter or mimic). Also that "Hey there's a tackler , kill it!!". One thing I would like to know is that if the sleepers will warp away? Stop whining.
ollobrains2 Gallente New Eve Order Holdings	Posted - 2009.01.30 11:02:00 - [69] Originally by: Dr Sheepbringer I want WAR!! PvE goes PvP! Sleeper emerging like shadows and busting balls in all areas (high-sec also), we have a enemy! ccp have a new race to drive into eve events to this can only be a good thing id like to see pirate factions having plexes spawn in wspace perhaps they can send in operations and the player can destroy ( add some variance along with the sleepers) along with al lthe other bits.
Pottsey Enheduanni Foundation	Posted - 2009.01.30 11:18:00 - [70] Ralitge boyter said ôWhy would the four ancient races have evolved into the Einheduani?ö That idea comes from one of my old posts at http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=734344&page=1#15 which shows the reasons. But it is a lot of speculation. Ralitge boyter said ôSleepers for what ever reason didnÆt need gates (maybe this is because of their cryotechnology skills that they are able to survive the long time required to travel between the systems without going insane or dying of boredom.ö The Enheduanni use teleportation over gates and they use Sleeper agents which leads some to believe among other things that the Sleepers are a part of the Enheduanni. This explains why the Sleepers donÆt need gates. ____ Telltale sign of their presence is non-linear teleportation (www.eve-online.com/races/theodicy/Theodicy_All.pdf)
Freyya GeoCorp. Paxton Federation	Posted - 2009.01.30 11:29:00 - [71] Edited by: Freyya on 30/01/2009 11:30:45 Heyya Potsey, was wondering when you'd pop in ^^ I am not putting aside the fact that the Sleepers might be agents of chaos working for the Enheduanni. Much like the Shadows in Babylon 5 had the Drakh as "slaves" or associates if you will. it's a PITA that so little is yet known although i found the information you mailed me over a year ago was pretty vast. Eventhough it's still alot of guessing there's some solid information and thoughts here.. I guess we'll just have to wait and see how things will go from here and what information will be released through dev blogs and what information we'll have to find out for ourselves by exploring 3rd space. ___________ NOW COLLECTING ISD AND CCP AUTOGRAPHS It'll be worth something someday. -Rauth
ollobrains2 Gallente New Eve Order Holdings	Posted - 2009.01.30 12:38:00 - [72] pottesy by the sounds of it ccp have taken youre research and used it, sleepers can use wormholes to get in and out of kspace... ok simple enough can they continue to reenter jove space, do jove have access to wormholes, do the jove continue to fight skirmishes with the ancient foe, where 4 original united empires loosley based on todays empires united against a meddling jove ? is history set to repeat itself except this time round the jove 3rd empire is co operating to a degree with the new races or keeping them seperate to prevent a repeat, they dont try and take over the amarr-min,gal-calderi states now. what has changed , the wormholes might represent the elundiah agianst the new races.
Pattern Clarc	Posted - 2009.01.30 13:32:00 - [73] It's interesting how everyone has ignored the obvious in regards to why they might be called Sleepers
Shirley Serious Amarr Imperial Academy	Posted - 2009.01.30 13:42:00 - [74] Edited by: Shirley Serious on 30/01/2009 13:42:46 Originally by: Pattern Clarc It's interesting how everyone has ignored the obvious in regards to why they might be called Sleepers Cryogenic suspension? People like to ignore the obvious. Because the obvious is what the secret conspiracy of shapeshifting lizard freemason investment bankers who flouridate water for the CIA want you to believe. Take a look in the Out of Pod Experience forum for this sort of thing.
Abrazzar	Posted - 2009.01.30 13:53:00 - [75] Originally by: Pattern Clarc It's interesting how everyone has ignored the obvious in regards to why they might be called Sleepers Curious. I thought I had posted something along those lines. -------- Ideas for: Mining
ry ry	Posted - 2009.01.30 14:00:00 - [76] Originally by: Pattern Clarc It's interesting how everyone has ignored the obvious in regards to why they might be called Sleepers they'll all look like a young keifer sutherland? i still hold out hope that CCP will oneday do a tyranids ripoff with hostile npc biological 'ships' that explode into meaty chunks. possibly around the time they introduce something to do with all this DNA i've got from running missions when i can't afford biscuits for the crew anymore.
Deviana Sevidon Gallente Panta-Rhei United Front Alliance	Posted - 2009.01.30 14:20:00 - [77] Perhaps the Sleepers are even more advanced then Pod Controlled Ships. Instead of Pods the Sleepers control their Ships from a hidden place where their cryogenically conserved bodies are safe, while their mind remote controls Killer Ships.
ry ry	Posted - 2009.01.30 14:22:00 - [78] maybe they pilot their battleships in their jim jams.
Pottsey Enheduanni Foundation	Posted - 2009.01.30 14:50:00 - [79] Edited by: Pottsey on 30/01/2009 14:50:45 Pattern Clarc said ôIt's interesting how everyone has ignored the obvious in regards to why they might be called Sleepersö If you mean due to Cryogenic suspension that makes zero sense. There is no way they can be called sleepers due drifting is space in Cryogenic suspension. ThatÆs a massive plot hole if thatÆs the case not to mention the other problems. Unless the other CSM guy was wrong and these are not the same sleepers as the others. ollobrains2 said ôpottesy by the sounds of it ccp have taken youre research and used it,ö Not just my research, there was a chat recently that a lot of ideas and concerns about the story by players on the Jove channel are making it into story. This dev blog makes us believe this even more as a lot of the dev blog is just like what we have been talking about on the Jove channel for months. Just waiting for the Eve gate bit next and then I will be convinced CCP have taken our research. Perhaps itÆs just fluke and we players are guessing right and coming up with the correct theoryÆs, but it is starting to feel more and more like the Jove channel is monitored and ideas are being put in game based on what the players are talking about. Which isnÆt a bad thing I guess. Then again I could well be wrong and itÆs all just one big fluke. ____ Telltale sign of their presence is non-linear teleportation (www.eve-online.com/races/theodicy/Theodicy_All.pdf)
Irida Mershkov Gallente Noir.	Posted - 2009.01.30 15:06:00 - [80] Where have all these races suddenly come from? I noticed someone post four of them previously in the thread. I haven't done the COSMOS missions which might explain why I haven't heard of them. But I thought EVE only had the four races and the Jove? where did the Einheduani? Talocan, Sleepers, Takhmal and Yan Yung come from?
Shirley Serious Amarr Imperial Academy	Posted - 2009.01.30 15:11:00 - [81] Originally by: Pottsey Pattern Clarc said ôIt's interesting how everyone has ignored the obvious in regards to why they might be called Sleepersö If you mean due to Cryogenic suspension that makes zero sense. There is no way they can be called sleepers due drifting is space in Cryogenic suspension. ThatÆs a massive plot hole if thatÆs the case not to mention the other problems. "The Sleepers were masters of virtual reality, neural interfacing and cryotechnology." from sleeper tech skillbook. Use of cryogenics makes a great deal more sense than enheduanni super secret agents. Originally by: Irida Mershkov Where have all these races suddenly come from? I noticed someone post four of them previously in the thread. I haven't done the COSMOS missions which might explain why I haven't heard of them. But I thought EVE only had the four races and the Jove? where did the Einheduani? Talocan, Sleepers, Takhmal and Yan Yung come from? Enheduanni are a plot device in one of the Eve chronicles. The other races all died out from known space long long ago, leaving the 4 playable races and the Jove as the only active civilisations. Seems like some of the "Sleepers" might have made it somewhere else. Yes. Yes, I am.
Pottsey Enheduanni Foundation	Posted - 2009.01.30 15:23:00 - [82] Irida Mershkov said ôBut I thought EVE only had the four races and the Jove? where did the Einheduani? Talocan, Sleepers, Takhmal and Yan Yung come from?ö Eve has always had lots of races far more then 10+ at the last count depending how you define race. The Talocan, Sleepers, Takhmal and Yan Yung are mostly known in the archaeology circles of Eve as there are lots of ruins, artefacts and skill books about them and have been around for years. Shirley Serious said ôUse of cryogenics makes a great deal more sense than enheduanni super secret agents.ö I donÆt see how. Enheduanni super secret agents makes little sense how it is and I fully admit most of its just farfetched speculation by me. But being called Sleepers due to Cryogenic suspension in ships travailing to other systems makes far, far less sense then Enheduanni agents. Shirley Serious said ôThe other races all died out from known space long long ago, leaving the 4 playable races and the Jove as the only active civilisations.ö Debatable but this isnÆt the place to talk about that.
Irida Mershkov Gallente Noir.	Posted - 2009.01.30 15:48:00 - [83] Originally by: Pottsey Irida Mershkov said ôBut I thought EVE only had the four races and the Jove? where did the Einheduani? Talocan, Sleepers, Takhmal and Yan Yung come from?ö Eve has always had lots of races far more then 10+ at the last count depending how you define race. The Talocan, Sleepers, Takhmal and Yan Yung are mostly known in the archaeology circles of Eve as there are lots of ruins, artefacts and skill books about them and have been around for years. Is there anywhere I could find some info about these so that I could read about them? Are they in the chronicles? I haven't read all of them yet.
Shirley Serious Amarr Imperial Academy	Posted - 2009.01.30 15:56:00 - [84] Originally by: Pottsey I donÆt see how. Enheduanni super secret agents makes little sense how it is and I fully admit most of its just farfetched speculation by me. But being called Sleepers due to Cryogenic suspension in ships travailing to other systems makes far, far less sense then Enheduanni agents. Here's a thing: http://www.hb3.info/cosmos/minmatar/akraun_maertigor.html Undoubtedly, more such things exist. Called "Sleepers" because they all pretty much went to 'sleep' in their stasis chambers. That's not their real name. Just like how in archaeology, some cultures are called things like "black jug people", because the artifacts associated with them are black jugs. Not because that's the culture's name. So the civilisation is called "Sleepers" because that's all that's really known about them. That they 'slept' in stasis chambers and such. Cryogenic sleeper ships were what used to be used to construct stargates with. It's not a novel concept. If the "Sleeper" civilisation left the Ani constellation, it's perfectly possible. Quote: Debatable but this isnÆt the place to talk about that I said known space. Those civilisations no longer exist in any meaningful way within the space that players can interact with. No agents, no stations, no npcs, just ruins and a scattering of artifacts. Yes. Yes, I am.
Anglo Minmatar Astral Mexicans	Posted - 2009.01.30 17:10:00 - [85] i dnt care what they are called.. i just wants to get scared again when entering belts or whatever.. heck i even want to loose ships again to NPC`S
Pottsey Enheduanni Foundation	Posted - 2009.01.30 17:24:00 - [86] Edited by: Pottsey on 30/01/2009 17:23:58 Shirley Serious said "Sleepers" because they all pretty much went to 'sleep' in their stasis chambers" Yes they went to sleep in chambers to enter virtual worlds and be completely immersed. There is no reference to travailing like this. If they did travel like this the biggest potential problem with sleepers in stasis is they would have all arrived at their own systems 100 and some 1000's of years apart and been isolated. Effectively each sleeper solo system would become its own isolated empire advance in technology independently from all the other Sleeper systems and making new ships with new tech without knowing what the other system is doing. I say this as the devs said no gates are built in wormhole space and wormhole space are sleeper sectors. If they can jump between sectors without the need for gates then they don't need stasis chambers surly? If they did need stasis chambers why have they not built star gates in the wormhole sectors. My problem is what link is there between the new NPCS and the old sleepers. How do we see these unknown ships with advance tech and come to the conclusion they are the old sleepers? The way I see it is if they need stasis chambers to travel between systems and don't have gates every system should be drastically different and each system should effusively be its own race that's different. Shirley Serious said "I said known space." I know and I said its debatable, but this isn't the thread to talk about that. Lets try and stay on topic. Irida Mershkov said "Is there anywhere I could find some info about these so that I could read about them? Are they in the chronicles? I haven't read all of them yet." Send me a Eve mail with your email and I will give you my documents full of game lore.
Avon Caldari Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers	Posted - 2009.01.30 17:43:00 - [87] Originally by: Pottsey Edited by: Pottsey on 30/01/2009 17:23:58 Shirley Serious said "Sleepers" because they all pretty much went to 'sleep' in their stasis chambers" Yes they went to sleep in chambers to enter virtual worlds and be completely immersed. There is no reference to travailing like this. Maybe we aren't real? Maybe we are just part of their virtual universe? ~shudders~
Rawr Cristina Caldari Naqam Exalted.	Posted - 2009.01.30 17:56:00 - [88] Originally by: Avon Damn. My money was on Thargoids. Aww, you beat me to it by 2 pages - Infectious -
faxtarious Minmatar Celestial Ascension	Posted - 2009.01.30 18:43:00 - [89] Originally by: Freyya Edited by: Freyya on 29/01/2009 19:00:00 I'm going to read it as a boost to lowsec a bit but keeping the rewards in line with the respective security rating, somewhat at least.. It is also awesome that the new Sleepers will be able to employ tactics not uncommon in PvP although i wonder what kind of balance is built in to not make them overpowered or facilitate the need to go blob NPC's... As said before this will probably be explained a bit in future devblogs. Anyways, to keep my topic somewhat on topic; I am going to have to correct my previous statement that they are calculated to have T10 technology. According to lore they had somewhat better than T2 and more advanced in special areas around a thousand years ago. I'm going to assume it was at least above T3 in the more advanced areas. Given the fact that they've had a thousand years to evolve and upgrade their tech i do think it's a safe bet that they could be well above tech 10 if we keep the current growth of our tech over the last years. Revisiting on my OP i am now wondering why only the Sleepers are coming to the playground and where the other ancient races stand. My intrigues towards the Enheduanni are growing largely as well since i too was starting to assume the 4 ancient races evolved into them. Also: CCP stole my thunder Freyya on 21/01/2008 ôAlright, on to business. WeÆve received numerous warnings from Spectre about a system several light years away. Apparently it was flooded with electrical signatures for a minute or two. After thorough analysis of these signatures we believe them to be cyno fields, but we are unable to detect if they are regular or covert cynoÆs. To be honest they donÆt resemble either databased sig but they show only minor fluctuations in the generated signal.ö Freyya on 24/01/2008 "They're awakening you know, getting ready to reclaim their place in this world again." Freyya on 24/01/2008 They are awakening, the fears and horrors of mankind. Pain and suffering is what they bring, for they are hard to find. Dark and sinister they seem to be, but those do not describe them well. The death they bring is slow, and trapped you will become to dwell. Lingering in the shadow is what they do, until the time is right it seems. A pain to be so great, will mark the return of darkened screams." As written in my Fanfic story just shy over a year ago ^^ Cyno field with a different signature than regular or covert cyno was going to become the wormhole after the discovery of their existance For they are hard to find = Wormholes and exploration, And trapped you will become to dwell = Wormholes closing, you getting destroyed in W-space leaving you trapped. Although i have to admit this wasn't exactly meant in this way ^^ I demand a place in the fiction team! God i wish i had posted the remaining chapters sitting on my HD before all this CCP GIVE THIS MAN A JOB !!! What I've always loved about EvE lore is that itÆs so close to home. It could be a Hollywood block buster in its genre (space / sci-fi /futuristic / politics /drama) But my friend, after reading your writings, and how you interpret the lore, you bring that chill up my spine and that mystery that has been lacking in the past.
Trader20	Posted - 2009.01.30 18:58:00 - [90] I heard the new npc's all have falcon alts.
faxtarious Minmatar Celestial Ascension	Posted - 2009.01.30 18:58:00 - [91] Originally by: Abrazzar So let's do some wild speculation: The sleepers stashed away some of their own in cryogenic sleep in those hidden systems (probably seen the downfall of their race). The systems were set to revive its population if they detect an activation of the EVE gate. Our Dear Empress created traces of anti-reality with that earth-tech weapon (might not even be a weapon, just used as such), which were detected by the Sleeper sensors and interpreted as reopening of the EVE gate. Sleepers woke up and are preparing for their way home, opening up the systems to wormholes only to meet the empires being in their way. Considering the EVE gate is still closed and the Sleeper's ancestral space occupied by some rather primitive human people they declare war on them all for desecrating the EVE gate, and simply being where there should only be Sleepers. So the Capsuleers go in and blow everything up. The Jove are too depressed to do anything much, or they are busy looking in the new systems for information on how to cure themselves, maybe even trading information with the Sleepers and probably betraying the rest of the empires for their own advantages. Rogue Drones stumble into some wormholes and soon develop strains that use new adaptive Sleeper technology. Considering drones have not much use for cryogenics and sentience isn't that widespread with them, diplomatic relations with the Sleepers are unlikely. Simply put geniuos...
Par'Gellen Gallente Tres Hombres Psychiatric Hospital	Posted - 2009.01.31 15:43:00 - [92] I'm so freakin confused it's kinda **ing me off. Where are all you people getting all this information? I NEED AN OFFICIAL LINK PLZ OR IT DIDN'T HAPPEN KTHXBAI! --- To err is human. But it shouldn't be the company motto...**
Rakshasa Taisab Caldari Sane Industries Inc. Ursa Stellar Initiative	Posted - 2009.01.31 15:56:00 - [93] Originally by: Par'Gellen I'm so freakin confused it's kinda ****ing me off. Where are all you people getting all this information? I NEED AN OFFICIAL LINK PLZ OR IT DIDN'T HAPPEN KTHXBAI! By playing the game. Not the 'shoot rats in belts' or the 'shoot rats in missions' style of play. Nor the trade-wars, alliance-wars nor the molestation of pink fluffy fedos style of play. They play EVE, a different facet of EVE. One most people will never even come close to touching.
Par'Gellen Gallente Tres Hombres Psychiatric Hospital	Posted - 2009.01.31 16:00:00 - [94] Originally by: Rakshasa Taisab By playing the game. Not the 'shoot rats in belts' or the 'shoot rats in missions' style of play. Nor the trade-wars, alliance-wars nor the molestation of pink fluffy fedos style of play. They play EVE, a different facet of EVE. One most people will never even come close to touching. Thank you. That was most unhelpful. You get a -15 penalty. They are going on and on about things that I have NEVER seen in the game and I've played since it hit the shelves back in 2003. Looking at the Eve Backstory links on THIS VERY SITE I see nothing about any of the races they mention. I'd suspect they are just making it all up but their facts and conversations sound solid as if they are getting it from some lore that I simply don't have access to. I WANT IT! GIMME! LOL! (Yes I'm that kind of nerd.)
Rakshasa Taisab Caldari Sane Industries Inc. Ursa Stellar Initiative	Posted - 2009.01.31 16:20:00 - [95] Edited by: Rakshasa Taisab on 31/01/2009 16:22:43 Edited by: Rakshasa Taisab on 31/01/2009 16:20:55 Originally by: Par'Gellen Thank you. That was most unhelpful. You get a -15 penalty. You do not get it because you are looking for the cheat-codes of the game they play. And cheat-codes ruin the game. You only get scraps, like the skill book or what has been hinted at in backstories, or even what CCP has said in the dev blogs about what we might find in wormspace. Not to mention, part of what they cook up in that forum of theirs in some cases probably ends up in the backstory if it's good enough.
Par'Gellen Gallente Tres Hombres Psychiatric Hospital	Posted - 2009.01.31 16:30:00 - [96] Edited by: Par''Gellen on 31/01/2009 16:34:56 Originally by: Rakshasa Taisab Edited by: Rakshasa Taisab on 31/01/2009 16:22:43 Edited by: Rakshasa Taisab on 31/01/2009 16:20:55 Originally by: Par'Gellen Thank you. That was most unhelpful. You get a -15 penalty. You do not get it because you are looking for the cheat-codes of the game they play. And cheat-codes ruin the game. You only get scraps, like the skill book or what has been hinted at in backstories, or even what CCP has said in the dev blogs about what we might find in wormspace. Not to mention, part of what they cook up in that forum of theirs in some cases probably ends up in the backstory if it's good enough. You lost me at "get it". Edit: Just to be clear. I'm not asking for cheat codes. I'm simply asking for the freakin manual! Not to much to ask I'd think...
Abrazzar	Posted - 2009.01.31 16:45:00 - [97] There are COSMOS locations that allow you to discover much of the backstory of those races. check your map and filter for the complexes. You might want to take some buddies along on some of those plexes. Have fun.
Par'Gellen Gallente Tres Hombres Psychiatric Hospital	Posted - 2009.01.31 17:14:00 - [98] Edited by: Par''Gellen on 31/01/2009 17:14:39 Originally by: Abrazzar There are COSMOS locations that allow you to discover much of the backstory of those races. check your map and filter for the complexes. You might want to take some buddies along on some of those plexes. Have fun. So there is no official lore on a major part of the coming expansion? Just things people have made up based on parts of some COSMOS locations? I find that... rather... silly... --- To err is human. But it shouldn't be the company motto...
Pottsey Enheduanni Foundation	Posted - 2009.01.31 17:22:00 - [99] Par'Gellen "So there is no official lore on a major part of the coming expansion? Just things people have made up based on parts of some COSMOS locations? I find that... rather... silly..." What do you mean things people made up? Cosmos is official lore. Ok its scattered lore but if you collect it all in one location there is a reasonable amount. ____ Telltale sign of their presence is non-linear teleportation (www.eve-online.com/races/theodicy/Theodicy_All.pdf)
Abrazzar	Posted - 2009.01.31 17:23:00 - [100] Originally by: Par'Gellen Edited by: Par''Gellen on 31/01/2009 17:14:39 Originally by: Abrazzar There are COSMOS locations that allow you to discover much of the backstory of those races. check your map and filter for the complexes. You might want to take some buddies along on some of those plexes. Have fun. So there is no official lore on a major part of the coming expansion? Just things people have made up based on parts of some COSMOS locations? I find that... rather... silly... Based on official information found in the COSMOS plexes. Not silly, only requires some effort to find out. -------- Ideas for: Mining
Shirley Serious Amarr Imperial Academy	Posted - 2009.01.31 17:36:00 - [101] Originally by: Par'Gellen I'm so freakin confused it's kinda ***ing me off. Where are all you people getting all this information? Mission briefings in the Cosmos missions contain a great deal of information. There are no official links. You just have to do the missions yourself, or trust some of the player made stuff. However, most player made stuff is only concerned with doing* the missions, not the background information contained within. E.g. Most Cosmos guides will not mention what the Curator of the Museum Arcana has to say about the Takmahl being originally from Amarr, but were exiled for heresy, settling in Araz before dying out. Instead, they will just tell you that you need to find certain objects, and where to find them.
Par'Gellen Gallente Tres Hombres Psychiatric Hospital	Posted - 2009.01.31 17:45:00 - [102] Well I've been trying all day to figure it out and with the help of several people from the Missions channel we seem to have established that they are Minmatar/Kangaroo hybrid zombies that consist of three halves (yeah really) and come from Old Mars before the Exodus. They aquired alien technology from the Zinglebort cyborgs in the Dingleballs Nebula and integrated it with their own. Their favorite food is live kittens and they really like old re-runs of Three's Company (probably because they all sort of resemble Ralph Furley, however this is just speculation). Their language is made up of pops and clicks while smacking two (or more) hardwood logs together. Using softwood logs like pine or false wood like fomica is considered the gravest of insults and usually results in a declaration of war between the two parties. At this point they enter into a government sanctioned sleeping contest to determine the winner. The person (or thing, as they are not adverse to declaring war on inanimate objects) that sleeps the longest wins (we suspect this is where they get the name). This exhaustive search for lore about them resulted in little else other than some details like the fact that they like purple eyeliner (but nobody knew what they used it for since they have no eyes), and an almost race-wide primal fear of the number seventeen. I hope this clears things up a bit.
Rakshasa Taisab Caldari Sane Industries Inc. Ursa Stellar Initiative	Posted - 2009.01.31 19:00:00 - [103] Originally by: Par'Gellen ... Their language is made up of pops and clicks while smacking two (or more) hardwood logs together. ... That is the equivalent of doing L4 missions in an Ibis. (And claiming success after getting popped)
Par'Gellen Gallente Tres Hombres Psychiatric Hospital	Posted - 2009.01.31 19:23:00 - [104] Originally by: Rakshasa Taisab Seriously, are things going so badly with the younger generation (those under 20 it seems) that they need to be fed with teaspoons. Can't swallow anything bigger than a cube of sugar, as they do not have the strength to chew it? Well considering that I'm 35 maybe you should revise your drivel to include everyone up to say, age 40? That would at least give me a few more years to be an idiot before I have to grow up. No matter. It's all make believe anyway and I just can't see me caring about it any longer. If CCP wants to get out some hard facts about their fiction that's fine. If they want to take the lazy half-arse road and let the players make it all up that's fine too. You guys have fun with that. I'll pass though thanks... I like some good fiction but I've never been a fan of those lame "choose your own story" books.
Pottsey Enheduanni Foundation	Posted - 2009.01.31 19:32:00 - [105] Par'Gellen said "If CCP wants to get out some hard facts about their fiction that's fine. If they want to take the lazy half-arse road and let the players make it all up that's fine too. You guys have fun with that. I'll pass though thanks... I like some good fiction but I've never been a fan of those lame "choose your own story" books." What's your problem? CCP have given out hard facts with the fiction for the new races. It's been in game for years. If you're not a fan of those lame "choose your own story" books then you should be happy as CCP haven't gone down that path. The Sleeper fiction is the same for everyone and its been in game for years. Why do you keep going on about rubbish like "Just things people have made up" or "choose your own story books."
Sagacious Z Minmatar Eve University	Posted - 2009.01.31 20:42:00 - [106] From the game developer: "That is why for Apocrypha, we are unleashing an ancient race into the universe: the infamous Sleepers, lurking throughout the vast unknowns stretching at the other side of the Wormhole maws. Do not underestimate them, as they will remain radically different from the regular pirate factions you are used to. More often than not, they will give you some substiantial bang for your buck and will require player gang coordination and effort to be dispatched. More details are left for another Dev Blog, but at the moment, know they have comparable player attributes and thus require variations of PvP fits to engage." This is AWESOME!!! NOTE: "and will require player gang coordination and effort to be dispatched." OUTSTANDING! I hope this puts to rest the gazillion posts made on these forums from many players to make the game more for solo players. EVE is a MMOG and is supposed to involve player fights, player enemies, friends, parternships, corps, etc. I am so happy that the game designers are underscoring the fact this game is designed for player interaction. I have always been afraid that the players asking to make the game more friendly toward solo players would infect the minds of the game developers. I have confidence now that the game will continue to develop and stress the importance of player interaction, both friends and enemies. For all you "make the game easier for solo player" types, I say learn how to have fun interacting with other players. I don't want you to leave the game, but if you don't want to interact with other players, perhaps you should. Thank you EVE game developers!
Par'Gellen Gallente Tres Hombres Psychiatric Hospital	Posted - 2009.01.31 21:37:00 - [107] Originally by: Pottsey The Sleeper fiction is the same for everyone and its been in game for years. Interesting as I've never heard of them before the blog about them a couple of days ago and have played the game since it hit retail. Maybe I needed to be in beta or alpha or pre-alpha or Ovuer's broom closet to have access to it but I'm not that leet I guess... All I'm getting from you guys is "Go run a bunch of missions and figure it out yourself you lazy terd!" and to me that means "They are whatever you want them to be because CCP has no official stance or linkable lore/fiction/whatever on them." Listen, all I want is to know who the hell they are. Same as everyone else who cares about such things. That is not too much to ask by far. It should be as simple as clicking the Backstory button on the left over there and finding them. I've tried. It's just a big load of nothing. For Pete's sake you guys are guarding this stuff way to fanatically. I'm not asking for someone to FedEx me their first born child in a box here. I just want a linky to the official lore/fiction. And don't give me any more of that "You must be this leet to know this stuff." garbage. It's getting very old.
Shirley Serious Amarr Imperial Academy	Posted - 2009.01.31 22:09:00 - [108] Originally by: Par'Gellen Listen, all I want is to know who the hell they are. Same as everyone else who cares about such things. That is not too much to ask by far. It should be as simple as clicking the Backstory button on the left over there and finding them. I've tried. It's just a big load of nothing. For Pete's sake you guys are guarding this stuff way to fanatically. I'm not asking for someone to FedEx me their first born child in a box here. I just want a linky to the official lore/fiction. unfortunately, links to the official "lore" don't exist. the stuff about them only appears in the mission briefings ingame, and unless people take screenshots or stuff, then there's no record of it. There's this site http://www.hb3.info/cosmos/ which has some screenshots, but the site's in German. But even in the missions, there's not a lot there. Sleepers are only mentioned a couple of times, a few sentences at most. Takmahl aren't much better, background for them is a paragraph or two. Don't know about the others. Some people construct elaborate theories on this, claiming connections to other parts of the story, like the enheduanni mentioned in one of the short stories, but that's all they are. Theories and speculation.
Pottsey Enheduanni Foundation	Posted - 2009.01.31 22:13:00 - [109] Par'Gellen said " Interesting as I've never heard of them before the blog about them a couple of days ago and have played the game since it hit retail. Maybe I needed to be in beta or alpha or pre-alpha or Ovuer's broom closet to have access to it but I'm not that leet I guess..." Cosmos, hacking and archaeology are a major parts of the game how have you never heard of them? There are 4 Cosmos regions if you fly to any of those regions you will see traces of the 4 races all over. There are tons of old ruins, dig sites, complex, agents in space and stuff to do with the 4 races. You don't even need to look that hard as half the stuff shows in the scanner as soon as you enter the solar system. Have you never bothered to speak to NPC ships/agent that are found in space? Par'Gellen said " For Pete's sake you guys are guarding this stuff way to fanatically. I'm not asking for someone to FedEx me their first born child in a box here. I just want a linky to the official lore/fiction." Links have been given and I even offered to email my collection of game lore if people send me there email by Eve mail. How is that guarding stuff fanatically? Did you miss http://www.hb3.info/cosmos/ that's got a lot in English, click agent names for the English bit. Visiting the regions has even more lore then just the agents in that website. Go to Deltole sector and there are at least 3 perhaps more complexes to warp to. As you warp in you get a screen pop up with game lore not to mention all the text on the ruins and the items. You don't even have to scan down the complexes. Par'Gellen said " And don't give me any more of that "You must be this leet to know this stuff." garbage. It's getting very old." No one is giving you any of that. You're being super lazy. Any noob can fly to a Cosmos region and see the lore for them self. There is nothing hidden or elite about it. If you follow the linsk you can see all the Cosmos regions. Ok some of its hidden or needs keys to access but a lot of its easily accessible in a basic frigate.
Gybson Minmatar The Vanguard II	Posted - 2009.01.31 22:27:00 - [110] Edited by: Gybson on 31/01/2009 22:27:28 Originally by: Par'Gellen Originally by: Pottsey The Sleeper fiction is the same for everyone and its been in game for years. Interesting as I've never heard of them before the blog about them a couple of days ago and have played the game since it hit retail. Maybe I needed to be in beta or alpha or pre-alpha or Ovuer's broom closet to have access to it but I'm not that leet I guess... All I'm getting from you guys is "Go run a bunch of missions and figure it out yourself you lazy terd!" and to me that means "They are whatever you want them to be because CCP has no official stance or linkable lore/fiction/whatever on them." Listen, all I want is to know who the hell they are. Same as everyone else who cares about such things. That is not too much to ask by far. It should be as simple as clicking the Backstory button on the left over there and finding them. I've tried. It's just a big load of nothing. For Pete's sake you guys are guarding this stuff way to fanatically. I'm not asking for someone to FedEx me their first born child in a box here. I just want a linky to the official lore/fiction. And don't give me any more of that "You must be this leet to know this stuff." garbage. It's getting very old. Sleeper information and technology has been part of the game since the COSMOS missions were introduced. It's fractured lore that takes a bit of work and effort to uncover and gain some understanding. If you search the market for Sleeper you'll see many items listed. There's also a chance that the people who have done all the work and know as much about the Sleepers as there is to know, don't necessarily want to blab on the boards, and cause a gold rush mentality to the areas where Sleeper tech is located. This is after all a PVP game at all levels, and information gives you an edge over other players, which can be turned into profit. There's nothing stopping you from going to the COSMOS areas and doing the work like everyone else, but people here may be reluctant to share information for free, and give up their potential ISK making edge when M10 arrives. Just giving a different point of view to yours, where you might be thinking CCP should be spelling it all out in a nice simple package. They probably want to give a sense of discovery and mystery to what will happen in the expansion, but there are some clues already in the game if you're willing to do the research. Cheers
Par'Gellen Gallente Tres Hombres Psychiatric Hospital	Posted - 2009.02.01 02:41:00 - [111] Edited by: Par''Gellen on 01/02/2009 02:43:06 Thanks Gybson for the most honest answer I've received yet to this. I understand now that people are sitting on the lore for personal gain. This is all well and good I guess. To answer Pottsey's question of why I haven't run the COSMOS missions myself in all this time: I did a few in my day. They were boring, required laughable standing prerequisites, and the rewards were rediculous garbage (BP's for items far harder to build and much less useful than most of their T1 counterparts? WTF?!?!) so I moved on to greener pastures. In fact the few I ran that I really remember were confusing and didn't explain anything at all. The descriptions and text read more like lunatic rambling than any kind of coherent fiction. If this is the best CCP can do for the backstory lore of their next major expansion (very very sad) I guess I should simply forget about trying to understand it and just blow things up as they fly in front of my guns. They seem to force us into that mode of thinking at every opportunity anyway. I'm sorry that maybe I wanted a little something more from the game...
Terranid Meester Tactical Assault and Recon Unit	Posted - 2009.02.01 04:07:00 - [112] Originally by: Par'Gellen Edited by: Par''Gellen on 01/02/2009 02:43:06 Thanks Gybson for the most honest answer I've received yet to this. I understand now that people are sitting on the lore for personal gain. This is all well and good I guess. To answer Pottsey's question of why I haven't run the COSMOS missions myself in all this time: I did a few in my day. They were boring, required laughable standing prerequisites, and the rewards were rediculous garbage (BP's for items far harder to build and much less useful than most of their T1 counterparts? WTF?!?!) so I moved on to greener pastures. In fact the few I ran that I really remember were confusing and didn't explain anything at all. The descriptions and text read more like lunatic rambling than any kind of coherent fiction. If this is the best CCP can do for the backstory lore of their next major expansion (very very sad) I guess I should simply forget about trying to understand it and just blow things up as they fly in front of my guns. They seem to force us into that mode of thinking at every opportunity anyway. I'm sorry that maybe I wanted a little something more from the game... Personally, I think you spout a load of idiocy.I think many people would agree with me.
Par'Gellen Gallente Tres Hombres Psychiatric Hospital	Posted - 2009.02.01 04:52:00 - [113] Originally by: Terranid Meester Personally, I think you spout a load of idiocy.I think many people would agree with me. My alt agrees with you.

CCP Dropbear	Posted - 2009.02.01 05:26:00 - [114] Hey Par As I said in my earlier post, there will be more to the Sleeper storyline for you guys to uncover and put together. We are not simply going with what's there and leaving it at that. What information that currently exists on them serves as the basis for the more detailed stuff you can discover yourselves. If you would like to see what is currently out there, I recommend reading this thread, as well as this one. I believe they cover the majority of the details, if not all.

Zeba Minmatar Honourable East India Trading Company	Posted - 2009.02.01 05:37:00 - [115] Originally by: Par'Gellen Originally by: Rakshasa Taisab ...By playing the game... ...Thank you. That was most unhelpful. You get a -15 penalty. They are going on and on about things that I have NEVER seen in the game and I've played since it hit the shelves back in 2003... Here is a short parable to help you understand. Two men who live next door to each other and have the same job board a bus every day to work. As the journey goes on one man is always alert and looking out the windows taking note of eveything he sees and talks to various people who sit around him. The other man sleeps the whole journey. Now at the end of 20 years when they both retire who knows moar about the journey? Originally by: CCP Dropbear Hey Par Dev Pwnd. Half the reason I still sub up tbqfh. inappropriate signature. ~WeatherMan
Freyya GeoCorp. Paxton Federation	Posted - 2009.02.01 10:15:00 - [116] Originally by: faxtarious CCP GIVE THIS MAN A JOB !!! What I've always loved about EvE lore is that itÆs so close to home. It could be a Hollywood block buster in its genre (space / sci-fi /futuristic / politics /drama) But my friend, after reading your writings, and how you interpret the lore, you bring that chill up my spine and that mystery that has been lacking in the past. Thanks for the compliment Always nice to know someone appreciates your work. My initial drive to start writing the story was indeed the lack of mystery and excitement in the game itself. Most was known around that time bar the 4 ancient races and the Enheduanni/Jove. As these areas where hardly touched by CCP Lore i started to think of my own little storyline and add some excitement and mystery for myself. I am still planning on finishing the story (was already at chapter 26 ) although i will probably have to rewrite a big deal. Now that the sleepers etc. have been made public and more lore on the way i will probably find that my interpretation is way off official stuff and i wanted it to be as official as possible for the areas already described in CCP lore. Now that the part where i can use my imagination to the fullest has been filled by official stuff i find it hard to write about this, since it will be completely different than what the official lore will say. Unfortunate but unavoidable from this point on...
Pottsey Enheduanni Foundation	Posted - 2009.02.01 10:17:00 - [117] Par'Gellen said " In fact the few I ran that I really remember were confusing and didn't explain anything at all. The descriptions and text read more like lunatic rambling than any kind of coherent fiction. The descriptions and text read more like lunatic rambling than any kind of coherent fiction." I don't recall any that are lunatic rambling but they don't explain much and that's how they should be. That's the whole point of a dead race and archaeology, little is known about the long dead race that vanished. We only have none coherent fiction, little snapshots of the race here and there. That's how it should be and if you collect all the little snapshots you get a decent amount of fiction although with gaps. What you're asking for would completely destroy the point of archaeology. Sleepers are not a current race that we have been dealing with for years so we shouldn't know much about them. Which is one of my biggest worries, how are we going see the new sleepers and realise they are the same or linked to the older Sleepers. Par'Gellen said "I understand now that people are sitting on the lore for personal gain." You keep saying that, why? The link was posted two days ago in this thread with most of the lore you wanted, I offered to mail people as well and all you can do is complain people are sitting on the lore for personal gain! Yet it's been posted more then once in this thread for everyone to see. People are giving you what you want and you're complaining they are not helping. No one is sitting on the lore for personal gain. All the lore was given out in this thread and after it was giveing out you started complaining no one would give it to you. You also seem to be missing the point of Cosmos blueprints, look at the fitting almost as good specs as T2 sometimes the same with much better fitting. Have PG problems with 8, 425mm railguns use the Cosmos version.
Freyya GeoCorp. Paxton Federation	Posted - 2009.02.01 10:27:00 - [118] Edited by: Freyya on 01/02/2009 10:29:45 Originally by: Par'Gellen Edited by: Par''Gellen on 01/02/2009 02:43:06 Thanks Gybson for the most honest answer I've received yet to this. I understand now that people are sitting on the lore for personal gain. This is all well and good I guess. To answer Pottsey's question of why I haven't run the COSMOS missions myself in all this time: I did a few in my day. They were boring, required laughable standing prerequisites, and the rewards were rediculous garbage (BP's for items far harder to build and much less useful than most of their T1 counterparts? WTF?!?!) so I moved on to greener pastures. In fact the few I ran that I really remember were confusing and didn't explain anything at all. The descriptions and text read more like lunatic rambling than any kind of coherent fiction. If this is the best CCP can do for the backstory lore of their next major expansion (very very sad) I guess I should simply forget about trying to understand it and just blow things up as they fly in front of my guns. They seem to force us into that mode of thinking at every opportunity anyway. I'm sorry that maybe I wanted a little something more from the game... I'm sorry but you seem like you want a free pass, one which has just been provided my a CCP employee. The ones of us who where interested in this part of the lore had to do alot of work to finds the bits and pieces and put them together. The fact that you seem to be unwilling to even do just a little bit of searching leds me to believe you want more out of the game lore, but are unwilling to do some work to find it. Nobody is sitting on anything for personal gain here and i feel you're just using that as an excuse to blow everyone off saying that you have to actually put in some effort to find the information needed. Gybson said it was a possibility, not a clear fact. There are a number of websites which discuss the topics at hand here as has already been pointed by CCP just now. A little bit of searching would have led you to the same places. Fact remains ;there is already some lore in place but it is sporadic at best. Alot of us have been putting some effort in it, to fill up the gaps with guesses and a little imagination. By that fact there is little one can tell you which is what you want to hear. As new lore is on the way with Apocasomething, consider it work in progress. So cut CCP a little slack with the whole "If this is the best CCP can do blahblahblah" and just wait like the rest of us have been for a long time now. ___________ NOW COLLECTING ISD AND CCP AUTOGRAPHS It'll be worth something someday. -Rauth
Ancy Denaries Caldari Solaris Operations	Posted - 2009.02.01 12:43:00 - [119] Edited by: Ancy Denaries on 01/02/2009 12:43:36 Originally by: Pottsey stuff No offence meant at all, but please use the "Quote" button or at least type [_quote=name]textage[/quote_] without the underscores. Makes it easier to distinguish the actual quote. EDIT Had to edit out stuff.age due to it censoring f.ag. Geez.... Balance is important, but you will always adapt to changing circumstances and you don't whine about stuff you can't change.
Par'Gellen Gallente Tres Hombres Psychiatric Hospital	Posted - 2009.02.01 17:12:00 - [120] Originally by: CCP Dropbear Hey Par As I said in my earlier post, there will be more to the Sleeper storyline for you guys to uncover and put together. We are not simply going with what's there and leaving it at that. What information that currently exists on them serves as the basis for the more detailed stuff you can discover yourselves. If you would like to see what is currently out there, I recommend reading this thread, as well as this one. I believe they cover the majority of the details, if not all. Many thanks for the links! Unfortunately they don't really answer any questions and actually generate more. Since none of it is official other than the screenshots of the COSMOS mission texts it all falls back to "Making up your own story". As I've said before that does not interest me and I consider it lazy fiction. The screenshots talk more about the agents' relatives and friends than about the Sleepers sigh... The missions appear as lunatic rambling simply because there is no frame of reference. It's the equivalent of saying that the Gazrenmavi may or may not have worn hats on hot summer days because you found an ancient hat in an ruin. Who the hell are the Gazrenmavi? See what I mean? There is a basic level of information you need to present to your readers for them to remain interested. Otherwise you are just typing words that are essentially meaningless. Much like what I feel I am doing right now by even trying to get you people to understand this simple fact of good fiction... This is a game I play in my free time. I really don't want to sink hours and hours into something as basic as simply trying to figure out who the Sleepers are. I should already have that basic starter information. Now going from there is a completely different story! Case in point: Asheron's Call 1 - The Empyreans The Empyreans were an ancient race far in advance of the current populace in terms of technology, magic, and understanding. They were the original inhabitants of the planet Auberean and fled their homeworld after one of their great mages experimented with portal magic in new ways that lead to an invasion from a race of semi-sentient insects. Nobody knows where they went but at least we know the simple basic fact of who they were. Their ruins litter the landscape of Auberean and there is much MORE to learn about them that requires player effort. I have no problem with that at all and find it much fun. I WOULD have a problem with having to pull the information of their basic identity out of the writers like pulling teeth from a grizzly bear as seems to be the case with CCP and the Sleepers. Now with all that being said, I think you guys at CCP do a great job of writing fiction. You just don't tie it together in ways that keeps most people interested. Most of those people don't post here because they don't care. I'm obviously an exception. I was speaking with an old real life friend that used to play Eve about the new stuff that was being added in March. I mentioned the Sleepers. His very first question was "Who are they?" and I HAD to reply "Nobody really knows..." to which he responded "What the hell does that mean?". That pretty much sums it up.
Rakshasa Taisab Caldari Sane Industries Inc. Ursa Stellar Initiative	Posted - 2009.02.01 17:25:00 - [121] Edited by: Rakshasa Taisab on 01/02/2009 17:27:54 Edited by: Rakshasa Taisab on 01/02/2009 17:26:56 You seem like a lost case, but I'll take one last stab at it: Do you know what made Star Wars episode 4-6 so great from a storytelling perspective, and episode 1-3 so much suckage? (Ignoring that annoying comic-relief character) It is perhaps the greatest and most underused storytelling device we have. And the quote you provided is a dime-in-a-million when it comes to fantasy roleplaying games. It lacks magic.
Pottsey Enheduanni Foundation	Posted - 2009.02.01 17:46:00 - [122] Edited by: Pottsey on 01/02/2009 17:49:05 Par'Gellen said "The missions appear as lunatic rambling simply because there is no frame of reference. It's the equivalent of saying that the Gazrenmavi may or may not have worn hats on hot summer days because you found an ancient hat in an ruin. Who the hell are the Gazrenmavi? See what I mean?" Not really as there is a frame of reference. Take a look at http://www.hb3.info/cosmos/gallente/sebast_mathon.html that's hardly lunatic rambling. Read the items like the Yan Jung Micro Processor for more info, you get more text as you warp into the ruins and on the buildings. That's is nothing at all like saying the Gazrenmavi may or may not have worn hats on hot summer days because you found an ancient hat in an ruin. Par'Gellen said *" The screenshots talk more about the agents' relatives and friends than about the Sleepers sigh..."* You know you could actually fly to the ruins yourself and see what the Sleepers are about. Look at the items and buildings, read the text instead of wanting to be spoon fed. http://www.hb3.info/cosmos/minmatar/akraun_maertigor.html how is that or the Yan Jung one more about agents' relatives and friends then the old races? How is there not a frame of reference? Par'Gellen said "This is a game I play in my free time. I really don't want to sink hours and hours into something as basic as simply trying to figure out who the Sleepers are. I should already have that basic starter information. Now going from there is a completely different story!" No you shouldn't have that basic starter information on the Sleepers. Your average pilot has no interest in old history or archaeology so would not have that info. Unless you character has a background in history or archaeology there is no reason why you would have the information. Due to the nature of the information only those with a background in history or archaeology or those that seek the information should have it. The point of exploring content is we don't know it all from the start and have to find out the information. Giving us the info from the start makes the exploring content pointless. You find some old ruins, you investigate and learn about the old ruins. Why would a pilot automaticly know about the ruins right from teh start? Archaeology and info on the sleepers is not something basic like you keep saying. As its not basic info you should not have it by default.
Par'Gellen Gallente Tres Hombres Psychiatric Hospital	Posted - 2009.02.01 20:53:00 - [123] Originally by: Pottsey Edited by: Pottsey on 01/02/2009 17:49:05 Par'Gellen said "The missions appear as lunatic rambling simply because there is no frame of reference. It's the equivalent of saying that the Gazrenmavi may or may not have worn hats on hot summer days because you found an ancient hat in an ruin. Who the hell are the Gazrenmavi? See what I mean?" Not really as there is a frame of reference. Take a look at http://www.hb3.info/cosmos/gallente/sebast_mathon.html that's hardly lunatic rambling. Read the items like the Yan Jung Micro Processor for more info, you get more text as you warp into the ruins and on the buildings. That's is nothing at all like saying the Gazrenmavi may or may not have worn hats on hot summer days because you found an ancient hat in an ruin. Par'Gellen said *" The screenshots talk more about the agents' relatives and friends than about the Sleepers sigh..."* You know you could actually fly to the ruins yourself and see what the Sleepers are about. Look at the items and buildings, read the text instead of wanting to be spoon fed. http://www.hb3.info/cosmos/minmatar/akraun_maertigor.html how is that or the Yan Jung one more about agents' relatives and friends then the old races? How is there not a frame of reference? Par'Gellen said "This is a game I play in my free time. I really don't want to sink hours and hours into something as basic as simply trying to figure out who the Sleepers are. I should already have that basic starter information. Now going from there is a completely different story!" No you shouldn't have that basic starter information on the Sleepers. Your average pilot has no interest in old history or archaeology so would not have that info. Unless you character has a background in history or archaeology there is no reason why you would have the information. Due to the nature of the information only those with a background in history or archaeology or those that seek the information should have it. The point of exploring content is we don't know it all from the start and have to find out the information. Giving us the info from the start makes the exploring content pointless. You find some old ruins, you investigate and learn about the old ruins. Why would a pilot automaticly know about the ruins right from teh start? Archaeology and info on the sleepers is not something basic like you keep saying. As its not basic info you should not have it by default. I could not disagree more and I don't know German.
Pottsey Enheduanni Foundation	Posted - 2009.02.01 21:09:00 - [124] Don't know German! Good job the agent screenshots I was talking about are in English. Why do you disagree? Very clearly the stuff you said on "talk more about the agents' relatives and friends" is wrong. Why do you think Archaeology and info on old races in ruins is basic info? Surely you see the problem with giving all players the information by default? Can you explain how there is no frame of reference. Can you explain how those screenshot that look ok are lunatic rambling? ____ Telltale sign of their presence is non-linear teleportation (www.eve-online.com/races/theodicy/Theodicy_All.pdf)
Freyya GeoCorp. Paxton Federation	Posted - 2009.02.01 22:09:00 - [125] Edited by: Freyya on 01/02/2009 22:13:37 Forget it Pottsey, this one wants to be spoon fed and has no desire to even try to piece some things together. We enjoy a good mystery here and we enjoy piecing things together. You sir, are just being lazy and cannot see that you HAVE the basic info right in front of you. The fact that it is not enough basic information for you is hardly enough to say that there isn't any info at all. This is like a good book you see, one bit of info at a time only you don't get to read the whole thing in one go. You get served with a page, then half a page after a week and then another page after 2 months but guess what, they aren't sequential! We enjoy it, you don't. Fair enough i guess but please don't pretend there isn't anything while there is some... Sleepers; An ancient race out of 4 that lived in New Eden until well over a thousand years ago. They are believed to be the first who set foot in New Eden through the wormhole and made it far enough to survive the tests of time and develop a thriving civilization. We know that they excelled in VR, Cryogenics and neural interfacing and that they disappeared approximately a thousand years ago. Could it be because of the gate collapse? or did they vanish because they all hooked themselves up to hello kitty online? Or maybe they found back then what we will find with Apocsomething; Wormholes, and decided they would try greener pastures? All we know is that they are now out there and that probably by finding bits and pieces of information in ruins and wrecks, we will then discover what happened to them a thousand years ago and where they came from in the first place. Bit by bit, piece by piece. *MYSTERY* being the keyword here That is called building up tension and mystery and you apparently can't appreciate the slow pace at which information is coming out. All fine and dandy but please don't blame anyone else for your impatience and inability to do some research and thinking for yourself. I hereby re-invite you to come here again after a few months of M10 and be spoon fed the information available so far. Or you go out there and find it for yourself. Up to you.... ___________ NOW COLLECTING ISD AND CCP AUTOGRAPHS It'll be worth something someday. -Rauth
Pottsey Enheduanni Foundation	Posted - 2009.02.01 22:13:00 - [126] Edited by: Pottsey on 01/02/2009 22:15:50 Freyya I have been updating the file I sent you ages ago. here are the Yan Junj updates. Still working on the Sleeper updates. Race Name: Yan Jung, Race age: Unknown, at least 1000Æs of years old. Location: Settled in Deltole sector, especially Deltole V and VII. Tech Level: Around T2, some areas a little behind others further along. Technology of Note: Achieved Tech 2 level over 1000 years ago. The Yan Jung nation possessed advanced gravitronic technology and force field theories beyond T2. Have self repairing buildings that use nano tech with perpetual power sauce power sourceÆs that to date have lasted over 1000Æs years without fuel. Lore of Note: ò Descended from unknown Humans, immigrated through the Eve gate Eons ago. ò Fragments of text translate and talk about a mysterious middle kingdom. ò Suspected to have colonised other systems, even in far off places. ò Deltole plane V and VI seemed to be more inhabitable back then. If the planets got easier to live on what happened to the Yan Jung Nation? ò Yan Jung repelling force field that's almost impenetrable with a perpetual power sauce is in game. Like the lore if you blow it up, then it rebuilds in game. The field repels you. ò Possibly the largest Yan Jung ruins in space that still exists are over at Deltole X, close to the Stargate leading to Colelie. (warp to Coleie gate and you should see anohter gate off in the distance) ò The Yan Jung are more clever them some give them credit for. There micro processors are highly advance even though they are 1000's of years old. ò As far as I can tell all dates relating to the Yan Jung are 1000's of years old suggesting whatever happened to cause them vanished happened at least 2000 years ago. ____ Telltale sign of their presence is non-linear teleportation (www.eve-online.com/races/theodicy/Theodicy_All.pdf)
Freyya GeoCorp. Paxton Federation	Posted - 2009.02.01 22:21:00 - [127] Nice work Pottsey, looks like you've been digging deep for a while I'll send you an eve-mail one of these days so you'll have my email again. Catch up with you later.
Goremageddon Box Minmatar Guerilla Gorilla	Posted - 2009.02.01 22:44:00 - [128] Edited by: Goremageddon Box on 01/02/2009 22:50:52 Region: J7HZ-F Description: Children. Leave us be. Region: A821-A Description: "It was like the gods of old, descending from the heavens and handing us fire, empowering us far beyond our comprehension.. and then vanishing." - Treatise on the rise of the capsuleer. these are unreachable regions as that of the jovian region. just 2 cents. :P _______________________ Hottest Character Ever.
Dr Fausts	Posted - 2009.02.02 07:53:00 - [129] Edited by: Dr Fausts on 02/02/2009 07:53:19 Regarding Pottsey's Theory of the origin of the Einheduani. The argument you make based on technological capabilities is quite compelling. I may have missed a relevent point in the post you linked, but have you considered the possibility that the group which became the Einheduani was only subset of the available population at the time, perhaps even a minority. This would lead to the possiblity that relict populations of the ancient races may exist. I think that this is most likely for the Sleepers. Particulary if some kind of calamity was contemporary with the wane of the elder races. In this case, I think, that a race with advanced cryogenic technology is likely to attempt to preserve some of the population using this technology. This leads me to belive that you might be a bit quick to dismiss the cryogenic suspension possibility, stated earlier. If the virtual reality technology of the Sleepers was/is as good as we belive, then all that is required to maintain the cohesion of their civilisation is an advanced comunications system. Physical contact would no longer be a requirement, as spacially disparte elements of the popluation could maintain comunication chanels through the VR world. I do not belive that this is an unreasonable possibility. If my speculation is contridicted by existing facts, I appologise . I have only recently begun reseach into the elder races, and have not yet gathered sufficient data to argue from a particularly solid standpiont.
Xavier Zedicus Eradication Alliance	Posted - 2009.02.02 22:29:00 - [130] Originally by: Jove X Originally by: CCP Dropbear Just dropping in quickly to let you guys and girls know that as far as storyline stuff goes, there will be a good deal of information you can actually go out and discover for yourselves. This is part of the whole idea, after all. From the resources you gather to the items you loot, they will all be pieces of the puzzle. In short; they won't just build you ships, they'll build you a backstory for these Sleepyheads too. Thats a nice touch and everything, but before you go adding new backstory, you might want to fix up some of the loose threads already dangling? Whats up with the Jove? How can Lady Sarum be an acceptable Empress when Khanid II got run out of town ... etc etc. Cause Sarum concorded those minmitar capitals with an abbaddon.
Cory Sopapilla Minmatar	Posted - 2009.02.04 16:56:00 - [131] Originally by: Pattern Clarc It's interesting how everyone has ignored the obvious in regards to why they might be called Sleepers Inactive jump clones? It would be a much faster method of transportation to just pod jump.
Ralitge boyter Minmatar	Posted - 2009.02.09 17:26:00 - [132] Edited by: Ralitge boyter on 09/02/2009 17:27:49 Edited by: Ralitge boyter on 09/02/2009 17:26:11 Par, did you ever hear about real life archaeology? I mean we know about as much about the culture of the people that used to live on easter island as we know about certain races in EVE. Some times there is simply no information yet, like with the old egyptians till a stone was found with a translation for their writtings. All of a sudden a whole culture presented it self with it's own beleive structure, politics, romances, health care and what not. The Sleepers are a bit in the middle of those two cultures here on earth, we know quite a bit about the race, thru the things they left behind we found out bits here and there and we where able to work out tiny parts. The blanks are filled in with logical assumptions and most likely posibilities. If that is right who knows but that does not stop people from interpeting the signs and working out what they believe to be true. CCP has provided the bits and pieces which by others have been costructed to form a whole which the archaeology community in EVE as a whole accept as likely to be correct. In the next expension CCP is going to provide us more information for us to find... Will we ever completely understand their culture, I guess so if we can fight them we can most likely also communicate with them and find out more about them. But till that time we will have to do the same as before try and pice the story together from the bits and pices that we already have found. Remember the dinosaurs where initialy seen as (somtimes fire breathing) dragons, right now the general consensus is that they are the ansestors of birds. Initially the earth was flat and we where the center of the universe. As more evidence is found to prove our theories wrong or right we will correct these perceptions. What you seem to be asking for is a guide to all the future and past of EVE, all the races that once where or that still are, who they where where they came from and what they wanted did and dreamed of doing. Of course CCP will not provide you that, it would make the whole archaeology part of EVE quite pointless and only a different way to get you hands om new/different modules and more income. Which is exactly what this profestion is not about it is about the finding out more of the back story (in the process you happen to get rewarded of course) and that is what makes it fun for most people to do. ------------------------------------------- Should you disagree with me, well I guess that is because I disagree with you. If you have a problem with that please feel free not to tell me.
Britannica Caldari Intergalactic Trade and Transport Corporation The Fifth Syndicate	Posted - 2009.03.06 00:02:00 - [133] there are cyno fields, jumpdrives and jump portal generators, all the sleepers would need is an equivalent of each of these and a ship in each of the W-space systems and they have they own private jump system as for reasons in the back story for why the sleepers may have left theres the Jove, they were back in space within a few centuries of the collapse (aprox 15,000 years before curent eve date) and their first empire lasted about 9000 years. whos to say the jove didnt push the sleepers out of the known galaxy before they started all those genetic changes. and the sleepers are hostile thinking the jove have returned to finish the job or the sleepers are simply attempting to get even Curiosity is not the only thing that can kill a cat, stupidity will do the job just as quick

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