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Why Flying a T3 Might be Worth the SP Loss Risk:

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Raindeth FACTION Inc.	Posted - 2009.02.11 14:04:00 - [1] We know that you lose SP if your T3 ship goes "boom." That is a pretty harsh risk. What reward could possibly offset that to make these ships appealing? In the Chronicles and in a recent Eve video we've been teased with a "super-weapon." In the video (I think it was on an abaddon) the weapon is shown as an area-of-effect weapon that has an energy... "...thing" that looks like it fries one enemy and then jumps to the next. I'm thinking with SP loss as the risk for flying one of these ships, being able to fit a weapon like that may... MAY be the compensating reward. Raindeth ok rewatching that video, the weapon might have to be toned down a bit, lol... Thanks Ron for making me watch this whole vid
Jason Sweet Imperial Academy	Posted - 2009.02.11 14:07:00 - [2] Yeah that wouldnt be OP at all would it? I highly doubt that would ever be put on a ship that is a cruiser
Raindeth FACTION Inc.	Posted - 2009.02.11 14:14:00 - [3] It was shown on a battleship. Putting a smaller version on a cruiser would do less damage, but retain the coolness effect. Also, if this is the case, the predictions that T3 ships will be hunted down to grief their owners, might have to be re-examined. I mean something is going to have to accompany the huge isk price and SP time-loss risk to make people want to fly these things.
Jason Sweet Imperial Academy	Posted - 2009.02.11 14:19:00 - [4] Ill still fly 1 even with the sp loss If you keep your skills at level 1 you only lose 7 minutes of training time So if you dont want to risk as much just keep them at low levels but if you want to train them to max then that is your choice
Illioe	Posted - 2009.02.11 14:25:00 - [5] Originally by: Jason Sweet Ill still fly 1 even with the sp loss If you keep your skills at level 1 you only lose 7 minutes of training time So if you dont want to risk as much just keep them at low levels but if you want to train them to max then that is your choice This exactly. Everyone is stuck in the mentality that they need everything at 5. You don't.
Atnal Raddick Explorations	Posted - 2009.02.11 14:25:00 - [6] Edited by: Atnal on 11/02/2009 14:26:08 The question is could I still eject from the ship, before it goes pop, and not experience a SP loss, thus getting around that mechanic.
Updyke State Wh0re Academy	Posted - 2009.02.11 14:26:00 - [7] If the speed and agility of these ships are going to be anything close to what we've got on sisi, those perks alone are enough for me personally to take the risk of losing SP. It's less of a risk than HG snakes were in the past. Nano, in it's fullblown ***gotty glory, is coming back with a bang! The recent speed/web nerf suddenly makes sense. Ships and weapons were performing so well that there was no headroom for T3 ships. everything else had to be nerfed to make some space for t3, it would appear And then ofc t3 will prolly cost x3 times as much as t2, meaning that people will be tempted to buy isk via plexes to fund ships, in order to have solo-omgwtfpnbbq ships. It will still be cheaper than snakes and polycarbs used to cost, making isk-buyage even more tempting. CCP profit directly. I really don't care for all the above as long as I get an XXL Taranis
Jason Sweet Imperial Academy	Posted - 2009.02.11 14:32:00 - [8] Originally by: Atnal Edited by: Atnal on 11/02/2009 14:26:08 The question is could I still eject from the ship, before it goes pop, and not experience a SP loss, thus getting around that mechanic. Yes if you eject before it goes pop you dont lose sp
Raindeth FACTION Inc.	Posted - 2009.02.11 14:38:00 - [9] Originally by: Illioe Originally by: Jason Sweet Ill still fly 1 even with the sp loss If you keep your skills at level 1 you only lose 7 minutes of training time So if you dont want to risk as much just keep them at low levels but if you want to train them to max then that is your choice This exactly. Everyone is stuck in the mentality that they need everything at 5. You don't. So, you're going to spend like 810 million isk on a ship and fly it with level 1 skills?? Good luck with that.
Professor Dubois	Posted - 2009.02.11 14:48:00 - [10] I know the quantity might change, but how much skill point do you loose? a fix amount or a lvl of each of the skills.
DeadDuck Amarr Amarr Border Defense Consortium Curatores Veritatis Alliance	Posted - 2009.02.11 14:51:00 - [11] Originally by: Raindeth So, you're going to spend like 810 million isk on a ship and fly it with level 1 skills?? Good luck with that. Can anyone tell me why people think Tec3 cruisers will be so expensive, besides being "Tec3" ? There will be 2500 systems in W space with access from every system in the galaxy. Most of the threats will come from NPC's that will not be a match for a gang. The Gangs will most likely be alone farming the W systems. I'm not a industrialist. Can anyone tell me why they think tec3 crusiers will be so expensive ? ________________ God is my Wingman
Hirana Yoshida Behavioral Affront	Posted - 2009.02.11 14:51:00 - [12] Edited by: Hirana Yoshida on 11/02/2009 14:54:01 The current SP loss incurred when losing a T3 ship is minuscule .. one level in a Rank 1 skill .. Training to level 4 takes about 20 hours, level five about 5 days, big whoop. The big hurdle that will stop everyone from flying the new cruisers is going to be monetary cost. Due to the fact that all materials has to be salvaged from wormholes and refining them only in POS labs etc. the cost of the individual ships will likely be closer to that of a dread than anything else .. there's your balance. If CCP started giving super statistics to costly ships, the faction cruisers/bs and their ilk should have godly modules.
Ranger 1 Amarr Shiva Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2009.02.11 14:54:00 - [13] You do realize that if your T3 ship goes boom you only lose one level off one of the skills necessary to fit the various component sections of these ships right? All of those skills are rank 1. Even if you had all of them at level 5 when you lost that ship, you would only be down to level 4 in one of them, and have what... a week to train it back up. Stop fixating on training the skills and figure out "why" you train the skills. This game is full of obsessive compulsive personality types. ===== * Now I know how George Washington felt when Napoleon bombed him at Pearl Harbor. - Beast Boy
Misina Arlath Amarr	Posted - 2009.02.11 15:04:00 - [14] Originally by: Updyke If the speed and agility of these ships are going to be anything close to what we've got on sisi, those perks alone are enough for me personally to take the risk of losing SP. It's less of a risk than HG snakes were in the past. Nano, in it's fullblown ***gotty glory, is coming back with a bang! The recent speed/web nerf suddenly makes sense. Ships and weapons were performing so well that there was no headroom for T3 ships. everything else had to be nerfed to make some space for t3, it would appear And then ofc t3 will prolly cost x3 times as much as t2, meaning that people will be tempted to buy isk via plexes to fund ships, in order to have solo-omgwtfpnbbq ships. It will still be cheaper than snakes and polycarbs used to cost, making isk-buyage even more tempting. CCP profit directly. I really don't care for all the above as long as I get an XXL Taranis If they remove nano just to replace it in game again through T3 ships, I think I will give up on this game for real >.> And I've been here since -03 -------------------------------------------------- "Every complex problem has a solution which is easy, neat and wrong!"
Sophia Truthspeaker THE INTERNET. Goodfellas.	Posted - 2009.02.11 15:06:00 - [15] Originally by: Hirana Yoshida Edited by: Hirana Yoshida on 11/02/2009 14:54:01 The current SP loss incurred when losing a T3 ship is minuscule .. one level in a Rank 1 skill .. Training to level 4 takes about 20 hours, level five about 5 days, big whoop. The big hurdle that will stop everyone from flying the new cruisers is going to be monetary cost. Due to the fact that all materials has to be salvaged from wormholes and refining them only in POS labs etc. the cost of the individual ships will likely be closer to that of a dread than anything else .. there's your balance. If CCP started giving super statistics to costly ships, the faction cruisers/bs and their ilk should have godly modules. I agree on the skill loss being not quite so harsh as it sounds in the beginning. But the price is still totally unpredictable. They could be cheaper than t1 for that matter. But most likely the cost will be pretty variable. I expect the subsystems to have diffrent rarities. Which wouldn't necessarily make them better, just more rare. If you choose the cheapest subsystem, I doubt the price will be in the dread are. If you want to fly the most expansive ship, then you can probably pay a bit more. _________ Proposed Mining and Attribute Changes The truth is out there
War Fairy	Posted - 2009.02.11 15:10:00 - [16] Originally by: DeadDuck Originally by: Raindeth So, you're going to spend like 810 million isk on a ship and fly it with level 1 skills?? Good luck with that. Can anyone tell me why people think Tec3 cruisers will be so expensive, besides being "Tec3" ? There will be 2500 systems in W space with access from every system in the galaxy. Most of the threats will come from NPC's that will not be a match for a gang. The Gangs will most likely be alone farming the W systems. I'm not a industrialist. Can anyone tell me why they think tec3 crusiers will be so expensive ? First you have to kill the sleepers, which have been reported to break carrier tanks on test, until you get an ancient relic. Then you might get a BPC via an invention type system. You need at minimum 6 BPCs to make a ship, hull + 5 subsystems. Then you need to gas harvest from w-space. Then you need to put up a low-sec POS and react the gas. Then you need some sleeper salvage and you can make the parts to the ship. Then you make the ship. Then you get a ship that has skill loss and is not better just different, according to CCP.
Elaron Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2009.02.11 15:17:00 - [17] Originally by: DeadDuck Can anyone tell me why people think Tec3 cruisers will be so expensive, besides being "Tec3" ? There will be 2500 systems in W space with access from every system in the galaxy. Uncertainty of raw material supply. Expectation that material supply will be relatively scarce based on how rigging was to start with. POS logistics required - or the ability to field and defend two different outposts. Price gouging. Probably other reasons, too.
Ralitge boyter Minmatar	Posted - 2009.02.11 15:32:00 - [18] Edited by: Ralitge boyter on 11/02/2009 15:34:04 A bit like a Ferrari is not worth it to drive to you work every day, though being superior in many ways the cost and risk (potholes, jealous co-workers, theft) is simply make it not worth the improved driving experience. Thats why I would not bother with the T3 ships at least not for the time beeing. Maybe if they turn out to be really a lot better then the current ships in game I might give them a try but certainly in the first two months they are simply not going to be worth it. ------------------------------------------- Should you disagree with me, well I guess that is because I disagree with you. If you have a problem with that please feel free not to tell me.
Southern Suzy Minmatar THE INTERNET.	Posted - 2009.02.11 15:32:00 - [19] uhuh gonna be another series of hisec carebear ships So wait this is the end of my post allready? Moooooobbbbiiiiiieeeeeesssss
Evangeline Vice	Posted - 2009.02.11 15:33:00 - [20] The weapon that is jumping from ship to ship si probably the one mentioned in the chronicle here: Linky quote "It's like no ship I've ever seen, sir. Whatever's inside it, it's given over entirely to some vast mechanism that takes up a good deal of the ship's interior and definitely involves the isogen-5. The ship's forward superstructure also has several release points not usually found on vessels of this design. Some kind of particle emitter technology that's been rigged onto the mains. I can't explain their function except that they look like hybridized conductors of some sort."
Noe Man Minmatar Pax Emunio	Posted - 2009.02.11 15:46:00 - [21] Edited by: Noe Man on 11/02/2009 15:46:01 Originally by: Misina Arlath If they remove nano just to replace it in game again through T3 ships, I think I will give up on this game for real >.> And I've been here since -03 Be sure to take the dildo our of your A S S on the way out the door, idiot.
Updyke State Wh0re Academy	Posted - 2009.02.11 15:54:00 - [22] Waaaaaaaaaaiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiitttttt a second.... this is what we've been asking for for EVAR! A way to make more money out of pirating... 1. Attack T3 ship 2. Pew pew T3 ship to hull 3. Pause, allowing T3 pilot to save sp, and possibly implants, by ejecting. 4. ??? 5. Profit I'm lovin dis.
Thamul	Posted - 2009.02.11 16:12:00 - [23] Originally by: Updyke Waaaaaaaaaaiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiitttttt a second.... this is what we've been asking for for EVAR! A way to make more money out of pirating... 1. Attack T3 ship 2. Pew pew T3 ship to hull 3. Pause, allowing T3 pilot to save sp, and possibly implants, by ejecting. 4. ??? 5. Profit I'm lovin dis. Mine goes slightly differently. Can't give ship to enemy. Can't loose skill points. Can't fly T3. Anything can be replaced except for training time. Thus it makes no sense to ever fly these. Especially since CCP has said they're no more powerful.
Ortela Devereaux	Posted - 2009.02.11 16:24:00 - [24] You don't get it, do you? There are no bonuses associated with the subsystem skills: it's just a matter whether you can jump in your next T3 ship after losing one or not. If you fly with everything on 1, you'll have to re-train 5x5 minutes to get back into one. If you got everything on 5, you'll go down to 4,3,2,1,0 and THEN have to retrain. For the ship itself, there's no difference in performance whether you got Subsystem X at 1 or 5. (Seems that way, at least... and it would make sense, wouldn't it?)
Kiotsu Adler	Posted - 2009.02.11 16:28:00 - [25] Edited by: Kiotsu Adler on 11/02/2009 16:29:18 Originally by: Ortela Devereaux (Seems that way, at least... and it would make sense, wouldn't it?) No it doesn't, then why to have levels. Any non-idiot wouldn't have ever a reason to train beyond 1. I'm sure they will add some sort of advantage if you train it, if not it does not make any sense. About ludicrous speed with T3 ships... mass stats are quite broken now, so these are not final, hold you horses nanofa*s
Concorduck Gallente	Posted - 2009.02.11 16:29:00 - [26] Edited by: Concorduck on 11/02/2009 16:29:15 In Before storm of Battleships suiciding T3 ships for the lulz EDIT: I'm watching you, goons. ----------------------------------------- Originally by: Crumplecorn Contact the CSM about it, voting themselves into disbandment wouldn't be pushing the boundaries of absurdity for them.
Ortela Devereaux	Posted - 2009.02.11 16:31:00 - [27] Originally by: Kiotsu Adler No it doesn't, then why to have levels. Any non-idiot wouldn't have ever a reason to train beyond 1. I'm sure they will add some sort of advantage if you train it, if not it does not make any sense. About ludicrous speed with T3 ships... mass stats are quite broken now, so these are not final, hold you horses nanofa*s Next time, read the whole post before quoting an excerpt... /facepalm
Akita T Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force	Posted - 2009.02.11 16:37:00 - [28] Originally by: Ortela Devereaux There are no bonuses associated with the subsystem skills Good joke. But no, that makes absolutely no sense. There might be no bonuses NOW on the PLACEHOLDERS you can see on SiSi, but why the hell have any skills and any SP loss if the skills wouldn't matter ? _ Create a character \|\| Fit a ship \|\| Get some ISK
Zel Nughat Amarr Nughat Corp	Posted - 2009.02.11 16:43:00 - [29] well if this is how it works, i mean, losing only one trained level, then for me its fine and dandy, i though that you would lose the skill completely and had to buy the skill book again, jeez ------------------------------------------- The moon is a terrible mistress... ...who walks the night with demons of dread.
Anvalor Gallente Germania Inc. D0GMA	Posted - 2009.02.11 16:43:00 - [30] For me it depends how much those ships cost. if they cost much more than t2 ships there is no reason to fly one in pvp. Maybe i would buy one for collecting them or so but thats not planned at the moment. If they stay to expensive i will just adapt like allways and stay in my t1 and t2 ships. Because i can fly nearly every t1 and t2 ship i will not get bored anyway. And that skillpoint loss is not so bad. It is another reason not to fly them for me but it gives you a good pleasure if you kill those ships instead of flying them.

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