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Ametius
DYNAMIC INTERVENTION ORPHANS OF EVE
4
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Posted - 2013.01.19 13:57:00 -
[2251] - Quote
I was just a player in my Corp for almost 3 years and for that time about half my Corp lived in WH Space. They always encouraged me to come out to WH Space to the HQ. I never liked the idea of living out of a suitcase (that what it seems like) if i was to move and live there and they were no facilities there for me to even do Industry in a meaningful way. It was just easier to do it all in High sec.
So about a few months ago I decided i'm give it a try and started gathering up some things in a WH Suitcase. Assembled some stuff in some Assembled GSC's for refitting ships, ammo, rigs, skill books and stuff needed modules and such. About a month ago I got a WH window in my region close by to move my stuff which some members of my Corp/Alliance helped with in moving into the WH via an Orca while I followed behind in my Covert Ops Buzzard.
I'd be honest to tell you it took a grand total of 1 minute to realize how a horrible mess the storage system was at POS. I'd be more honest to say it actually took less than 20 seconds once I decided to look while inside the shield with the other Corp mate asking where I wanted my stuff to go. I had no idea where he was to put my stuff. The Orca pilot had to wait in the shield with all my stuff while i had a Corp Director figure out where I could even put my stuff as he was messing with sorting out the awefull POS Role Management System. I'd try and it didn't quite work and he would have to play with roles again. That took some time. Then I would to get my stuff moved to a space tab on a Component Array. I couldn't even access itGǪ more fumbling with the POS Role System by the Director as time rolls on. It became damn funny!
The Orca pilot was getting agitated by how long it was taking and I was musing of horrible a mess figuring out all that role system was with the amount of players that also lived at the POS. I was an almost 3 year member of my Corp, well known inside my corp, I wasn't even a newbie. I had responsibilities in Corp management in a Wallet Division of the Corp. Imagine how much of a pain it is if I was a Newbie player or a younger Corp member moving to the WH POS. That's a llot of time a POS Director/Manager has to spend on that horrible role system at the POS sorting out roles. And I as a corp member was being affected by that, the Orca pilot was being effected by that as well having moved my stuff. And I still couldn't get access to put my stuff in a hanger or an array. Its not like a POS is the most easily livable place either in its current state.
It was so much of a mess that the Corp CEO who was on grid at the time in the WH POS shield decided it was likely faster if the Orca simply dumped the stuff/ships from Cargo out and help move it from there into some temporary spot in one the Component Array himself vs sorting out all the role access. There was a concern that jettisoning the ships some might go flying off outside the POS Shield. I though the thought of that was funny in itself if it happened. I had to re-board every ship dumped out inside the shield and one by one get them moved to another hangar for storage. This consumed allot of time and not fun or easy. It looked like a mess on DSCAN as someone in the Corp Alliance chat was now asking who has ship X, Y, Z on scanGǪ in the WH of all places.
After that was all sorted out It became even more funny, because now being in my Buzzard ship and no hauler ship yet I couldn't even access my own GSC's now inside one the spare tabs on the Component Array due to the drop down tree on the POS Array. The most i could access was a very small secure container which was small enough in m3 to move it back and forth to my Cargo space. I had to constantly move back and forth from the Component Array to my Cargo space on my Buzzard to access its content. That was a pain in the ass and wasn't much in it either! The more important stuff was in the GSC which i couldn't access inside the Array tab. I couldn't move it to a hauler to access its content since I had none.
It was a few weeks later I was able to get out to empire and get my Transport ship in to be able to move a GSC to the ships hull just to access its content and move stuff back and forth. There was more stuff as well like when I actually brought the Transport ship in I couldn't even more the unassembled ship to a hangar. What was even funny I couldn't even Jettison the damn ships out of my ship cargo. I had to move the ships to a Component Array I had access to, then assemble the Ships in the Component Array, then move the ships from there to a SMA that happen to be in distance to move it. And that took forever to figure out as no one was around to help. Someone in Alliance Chat had to help me figure that out.
But just from that little snapshot of my first experiences just moving to WH Space to our corp POS that was not a fun experience at all and quite a frustrating one at best with POS Mechanics. I can only imagine the daily frustrations of the players that live at POS everywhere as well the security issues they have with storage access and roles as well as dealing with new players to their Corps that are accessing their POS.
On my first encounter with my Corp POS moving my stuff to the POS, it affected 4 players (The Orca pilot, The POS Manager, My CEO & Myself included) that was in no small way as CCP said a POS will only affect a small amount of players mostly POS managers.
And i'm sure if i twiddled my thumb more at the POS I could of find more stuff that was a source of frustration all on my first 4 hours at the POS. Imagine what other players endure living at POS for years.
Needless to say sadly I don't spend much time at the WH or the POS. Its not exactly an exciting place to live or work out of. It would be more fun if a POS was more livable and easier to use with easier role management for Managers and more security features as well. |
SoHo White
Etoilles Mortant Ltd. Solyaris Chtonium
21
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Posted - 2013.01.19 14:17:00 -
[2252] - Quote
Played for over 7 years and agree that POS's need work.
As the CEO of an Alliance I would welcome help with POS's and access/security.
Everyone I have spoken to in my Alliance would support a modular POS system and more people would use them if they weren't so restricted as they are at the moment. |
Adam Banisaba
Elite Death Force
0
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Posted - 2013.01.19 14:29:00 -
[2253] - Quote
We REALLY need something done with the current POS system.
Please do something for the small portion of your player base... |
Mirel Dystoph
Kaesong Kosmonauts Test Alliance Please Ignore
34
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Posted - 2013.01.19 14:58:00 -
[2254] - Quote
This thread isn't paging fast enough. "Nothing essential happens in the absence of noise."-á |
McSnarf
EVE University Ivy League
5
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Posted - 2013.01.19 15:02:00 -
[2255] - Quote
Getting more usability out of a major investment like a POS? Absolutely!
WAY more important than "Duelling" :)
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Green Guts
Expandentes Rudentis Online Originally Riotous Corps
1
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Posted - 2013.01.19 15:23:00 -
[2256] - Quote
Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:+1 I, too, am a small portion of the community. Currently own and operate one Large "Methstar" in lowsec for booster production, and would love to set up more POSes as well. But they are a pain in the ass to work with. One is fine enough for the time being, thank you. I'm looking forward to seeing how we can improve them ASAP. How do you respond to the comment s by Seleene as to the fact that Two Step should have known that CCP was not shelving POSs as communication is at an all time high (I presume this is not including the whole bounty hunting lack of communication). And of course excluding the fact that there has been no public statement to the fact that any POS improvements will be included in the next expansion. |
genddr
Crown of Swords Talocan United
0
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Posted - 2013.01.19 15:26:00 -
[2257] - Quote
What just affects POS owners ?
NOT
Owners and all the members that use the pos as there homes.
Some security enhancements are needed that's the biggest issue on my mind.
And why are they doing/did away with faction towers again ? I started this game for its variety, and it is slowly being taken away. |
Anna Kovalevskaya
10th level Banzee U N K N O W N
0
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Posted - 2013.01.19 15:27:00 -
[2258] - Quote
Please improve POS system. Corp rights, security, tabs, UI - everything is way too old and need to be fixed. |
Don't NeedNo Man
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
1
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Posted - 2013.01.19 15:56:00 -
[2259] - Quote
I'm a strong black woman and I don't need no man to be telling me what to do.
But it would be nice if you could improve POSes.
+1 |
Redragon
Enlightened Industries Test Alliance Please Ignore
0
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Posted - 2013.01.19 16:27:00 -
[2260] - Quote
As someone that has run POS for years now. Please CCP show us some love. The Current system makes me want to POD myself. |
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Chorus Beck
Mirai Yume The Dark Nation
5
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Posted - 2013.01.19 16:41:00 -
[2261] - Quote
POS needs some love...
Security Adding modules
I am tired of living out of a POS for the last 2+ years in a WH and bouncing off anchored structures, slow boating to get in range of hangars and research stations...
The guns are fun though.... Leave the guns... |
Commander Keem
Arkhon Industries Mineral Excavations and Combat Innovations
0
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Posted - 2013.01.19 16:51:00 -
[2262] - Quote
Signed |
Qu Pollard
Nuvellus
0
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Posted - 2013.01.19 17:00:00 -
[2263] - Quote
+1 modular pos but i would be happy with improvements to the current system. Something is better than nothing. |
Aryth
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
806
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Posted - 2013.01.19 17:01:00 -
[2264] - Quote
I love how the only responses from CCP are, "We are reading it", and "We were misquoted!"
Typical communications failures we have come to expect from CCP.
Leader of the Goonswarm Economic Cabal Vile Rat: You're the greatest sociopath that has ever played eve. |
Bane Necran
Appono Astos
1487
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Posted - 2013.01.19 17:18:00 -
[2265] - Quote
I urge CCP to consider how most everyone in this thread is either a current resident of 0.0 or an alt of one.
What this is really about, is stopping or at least delaying the 0.0 sov changes you are working on, by making you 'refocus' on something else that will keep the game in the doldrums of mediocrity where they continue to thrive. Gee, that sounds familiar. "The nice thing about quotes is that they give us a nodding acquaintance with the originator which is often socially impressive." ~Kenneth Williams |
Aryth
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
807
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Posted - 2013.01.19 17:21:00 -
[2266] - Quote
Bane Necran wrote:I urge CCP to consider how most everyone in this thread is either a current resident of 0.0 or an alt of one.
What this is really about, is stopping or at least delaying the 0.0 sov changes you are working on, by making you 'refocus' on something else that will keep the game in the doldrums of mediocrity where they continue to thrive. Gee, that sounds familiar.
I think you missed the part where we have been outlining how to rebalance null for months. POS are the one thing all EVE players can agree need to be fixed. Since, you know, not like there aren't a huge portion of them in highsec or anything. Leader of the Goonswarm Economic Cabal Vile Rat: You're the greatest sociopath that has ever played eve. |
Bane Necran
Appono Astos
1487
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Posted - 2013.01.19 17:26:00 -
[2267] - Quote
Aryth wrote:I think you missed the part where we have been outlining how to rebalance null for months. POS are the one thing all EVE players can agree need to be fixed. Since, you know, not like there aren't a huge portion of them in highsec or anything.
I think you're missing how CCP said POS updates are still in the works, its just not their main focus right now.
So POS changes are still upcoming, and this thread has no reason to exist, except to force CCP to make POS changes the focus, and abandon or delay a much needed 0.0 sov revamp. "The nice thing about quotes is that they give us a nodding acquaintance with the originator which is often socially impressive." ~Kenneth Williams |
Viaana
Jazz Associates Azgoths of Kria
9
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Posted - 2013.01.19 17:31:00 -
[2268] - Quote
Shocked this is still up for discussion, POS' are a right mess atm, they're a massive part of the game and it would mean alot to everyone playing if they were improved, even if they arn't even aware of it. One thing that sets this MMO apart from so many others is your ability to make something or somewhere your own. |
Aryth
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
807
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Posted - 2013.01.19 17:32:00 -
[2269] - Quote
Bane Necran wrote:Aryth wrote:I think you missed the part where we have been outlining how to rebalance null for months. POS are the one thing all EVE players can agree need to be fixed. Since, you know, not like there aren't a huge portion of them in highsec or anything. I think you're missing how CCP said POS updates are still in the works, its just not their main focus right now. So POS changes are still upcoming, and this thread has no reason to exist, except to force CCP to make POS changes the focus, and abandon or delay a much needed 0.0 sov revamp.
I haven't missed that at all, because they haven't really said that. They have danced around the issue and won't actually say what they intend to do. Vague statements about being misquoted, or that it wasn't scrapped, does not mean we get anything this year. CCP has been talking about a POS revamp since at least 2009 that I can remember. Leader of the Goonswarm Economic Cabal Vile Rat: You're the greatest sociopath that has ever played eve. |
Rengerel en Distel
Amarr Science and Industry
1032
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Posted - 2013.01.19 17:43:00 -
[2270] - Quote
Bane Necran wrote:I urge CCP to consider how most everyone in this thread is either a current resident of 0.0 or an alt of one.
What this is really about, is stopping or at least delaying the 0.0 sov changes you are working on, by making you 'refocus' on something else that will keep the game in the doldrums of mediocrity where they continue to thrive. Gee, that sounds familiar.
Well, either a resident of 0.0, or WHs, or low, or high ... you know, the people a POS revamp would have an effect upon. I disagree that it would take everyone in CCP working full time only on POSs to get it done in a year. If that is reality, then they have other issues as a gaming company.
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Ciara Talari
Orbital Dominance Malefic Aspects
7
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Posted - 2013.01.19 17:49:00 -
[2271] - Quote
Rengerel en Distel wrote:Bane Necran wrote:I urge CCP to consider how most everyone in this thread is either a current resident of 0.0 or an alt of one.
What this is really about, is stopping or at least delaying the 0.0 sov changes you are working on, by making you 'refocus' on something else that will keep the game in the doldrums of mediocrity where they continue to thrive. Gee, that sounds familiar. Well, either a resident of 0.0, or WHs, or low, or high ... you know, the people a POS revamp would have an effect upon. I disagree that it would take everyone in CCP working full time only on POSs to get it done in a year. If that is reality, then they have other issues as a gaming company.
And even if it would mean all of them working on it. it MUST be done! |
libel brian
Unexpected Productions
0
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Posted - 2013.01.19 18:18:00 -
[2272] - Quote
Please let rework the POS situation. |
Damian Aurilen
Zephyr Corp Black Thorne Alliance
0
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Posted - 2013.01.19 18:32:00 -
[2273] - Quote
The current POS system is a piece of s*** and in dire need of update. First and most important would be security or lack of i should say. Second if anyone ever tried doing reactions they know what a pain that is with current system. Third i would love if the module idea came about that i heard of, it's a pain flying around to structure A,B,C etc. Offline this online that. Lastly be nice if you could turn a POS into a reall floating city ( ability to spend billion isk or w/e to maybe get additional structure, more cpu, more grid etc). |
Demetrios Thanatos
Sarnef.com
0
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Posted - 2013.01.19 18:55:00 -
[2274] - Quote
I'm pretty new into the game and my experience with a POS was brief. I plan to use POS'es in the future so i definitely think that revamping the POS and make it more accessible to the new players is a good ideea. |
Vilgan Mazran
Aperture Harmonics K162
12
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Posted - 2013.01.19 19:26:00 -
[2275] - Quote
As a WH resident: if this needs to take place over multiple expansions, please prioritize the stuff that REALLY sucks. A modular POS system sounds great. A method to change clones in wspace is ESSENTIAL. You want community? Stop forcing people to have 2nd thoughts about going out on roams because they are unable to switch to a more appropriate clone. |
Celly Smunt
Viziam Amarr Empire
59
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Posted - 2013.01.19 19:44:00 -
[2276] - Quote
Balder Verdandi wrote: Let's break this down into a couple smaller ideas first because as a former programmer I know it can't all be done at once ..... but if you look both inside the box, and outside it, you can find solutions to most of the problems quickly.
In-Game Art and its effects on the game
(Snipped some good stuff about existing graphics)
Security and Access on modular towers/POS's
Think corporate outpost using alliance outposts as the primer.
(Snipped more good stuff)
+1
I like the "groundwork already there" idea as I believe that it would make a massive move forward toward the revamp of the POSes rather than having the DEVS do a complete rewrite and completely different graphic scheme, sadly, I am not familiar with outposts, but that sounds like a solid foundation.
I also have mentioned a couple of times in this thread that they could put the base artwork into the hands of the player-base and that doing so would serve the purpose of allowing player participation and showing the player base that at least they are getting the ball rolling.
o/ Celly Don't mistake fact for arrogance, supposition for fact, or disagreement for dismissal. Perception is unique in that it can be shared or be singular. Run with the pack if you wish, but think for yourself. A sandwich can be a great motivator. |
Celly Smunt
Viziam Amarr Empire
59
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Posted - 2013.01.19 20:03:00 -
[2277] - Quote
Luc Chastot wrote:Max Kolonko wrote: - small corps will try to place "covert" footholds in enemy teritory by placeing poses in some deep spots
It would need to be carefully balanced, but I like the idea of allowing the FW factions to place footholds on enemy territory.
I wouldn't even limit it to FW, imagine some big alliance in Null finding that some smaller corp has built up a fair presence in some distant corner of their space? then you have to look at the possible outcomes of conflict or co-operation.
anything's possible given the right set of circumstances.
o/ Celly
Don't mistake fact for arrogance, supposition for fact, or disagreement for dismissal. Perception is unique in that it can be shared or be singular. Run with the pack if you wish, but think for yourself. A sandwich can be a great motivator. |
Kimimaro Yoga
The Praxis Initiative Gentlemen's Agreement
11
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Posted - 2013.01.19 20:22:00 -
[2278] - Quote
Ciara Talari wrote:Rengerel en Distel wrote:Bane Necran wrote:I urge CCP to consider how most everyone in this thread is either a current resident of 0.0 or an alt of one.
What this is really about, is stopping or at least delaying the 0.0 sov changes you are working on, by making you 'refocus' on something else that will keep the game in the doldrums of mediocrity where they continue to thrive. Gee, that sounds familiar. Well, either a resident of 0.0, or WHs, or low, or high ... you know, the people a POS revamp would have an effect upon. I disagree that it would take everyone in CCP working full time only on POSs to get it done in a year. If that is reality, then they have other issues as a gaming company. And even if it would mean all of them working on it. it MUST be done!
Funny, all the things I was thinking about concerning this issue got brought up on the very last page. Quite frankly, I can't believe Unifex meant his statement exactly as it was interpreted. It's true that a minor tweak of the existing interface would benefit a small number of people. But any major overhaul is going to affect the entire game. Bane makes the mistake of assuming the perception of POS as nullsec tools is the reality. We null residents might be more dependent on them, as places to moon mine, build super, store supers (on in the case of WH residents, store all the things). But highsec is rife with small POSes churning out blueprints, and lowsec POSes are almost as useful as nullsec POSes. The things are already everywhere, and are an integral part of the ecosystem. Any major revamp is going to have effects far wider-ranging than say, redesigning faction warfare.
Personally I think it would be just fine if most of CCP spent a year working on this. I feel that to some degree CCP is falling into the mental trap that consumes the makers of those "other" MMOs, that new and shiny content has to be released on a regular basis or people will get a sad and find something else to play. This is kind of missing the forest for the trees. If you improve overall gameplay, give players more options, make the existing options work better and be more relevant, you don't need to push shiny new stuff every single patch. That's the sort of thinking that ultimately led to the WiS debacle.
Now let's put this into the context of sov changes, and pulling staff off of other projects to work on the POS revamp. Why exactly is that a problem at all? The way I see it, a POS revamp would directly affect how sov warfare and territorial conflict evolves. How many strat ops consist of a battle at a POS, possibly followed by shooting the POS, or repping it? How many linchpins of territorial aggression consist of one POS with a couple bridging titans parked in it? certainly you could alter the sov warfare landscape with a new POS system.
And to take up an idea that's been brought up before, what if small corps/individuals could park POSes more readily inside systems that are owned by someone else, i.e. not just one per moon? The Personal POS, that lets the owner do a variety of relatively minor things without having to first remove the regular POS? As someone who lives in populated and active nullsec, people like this would mostly be targets for us (although we'd sitll have to spend time trying to evict them). But it would give both sides something to do. And there's much of null that's just empty. Dead. One player and five entire systems, all to themselves. A POS revamp could give smaller corps and individuals more reason to come into null and build something of their own, *without* having to get directly involved in the massive power game of sov-holding alliances and coalitions. I certainly like being part of that particular game... but if you want to keep nullsec active and churning, there need to be more tools whereby newcomers can profit from moving to null. The POS system is an obvious source of such tools.
Okay, too many ideas, post getting too long. But you wanna talk about enablers? Enablers need tools...
tl;dr A revamped POS system could be the biggest enabler of player activity in the entire game. The improved gameplay it could bring would be more than worth skipping other content in the short term. |
Hakaru Ishiwara
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
414
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Posted - 2013.01.19 20:27:00 -
[2279] - Quote
Celly Smunt wrote:*snip*
I also have mentioned a couple of times in this thread that they could put the base artwork into the hands of the player-base and that doing so would serve the purpose of allowing player participation and showing the player base that at least they are getting the ball rolling.
o/ Celly Not a good idea as that would make for more work from a project management standpoint. CCP has relatively cheap graphics resources already hired and who have worked on EVE (tech 3 cruisers!) in china... why not leverage those resources and add on as necessary if artwork is a challenge?
CCP can easily do a better job communicating with project outlines, milestones, goals, etc.
+++++++ I have never shed a tear for a fellow EVE player until now. Mark GÇ£SeleeneGÇ¥ Heard's Blog Honoring Sean "Vile Rat" Smith. |
vikari
Infinite Covenant Tribal Band
59
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Posted - 2013.01.19 21:05:00 -
[2280] - Quote
You want an instigator of small combat? How about you let small towers cloak themselves to the Sov notifications. So they can drop them in alliances sov and secretly do raids till the alliance locates them?
How about you increase the expenses we have by allow towers to jump around to new systems for a heavy fuel price.
There is no limit to the options of what POSs can do for this game. |
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