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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 27 post(s) |
Brinid Navarre
Green-Core
Elysian Empire
1
   |
Posted - 2012.04.26 14:38:00 -
[31] - Quote
Turelus wrote:If you want an effective log in banner for newbies to see just show a wallet with -100 000 000.00 ISK and say "THIS COULD BE YOU!"
That would scare the crap out of me!
That's not very much isk. You can make that in an hour playing fairly. Try again. ;) |
Morne Vyvorant
Random Precision.
Broken Toys
1
|
Posted - 2012.04.26 14:39:00 -
[32] - Quote
As I gaze upon the fruits of CCP's security team's efforts, I am in awe.
Let the RMT apocalypse begin.
Seriously though, great job guys. |
corestwo
Goonfleet Investment Banking
196
|
Posted - 2012.04.26 14:40:00 -
[33] - Quote
CCP Sreegs wrote:spookydonut wrote:Hey can you give us an updated count of false positives?
At fanfest sreegs said it was only 1 false positive.
I know for a fact that it's at least 15 now, and maybe as high as 50. That is untrue and as I elaborated in every single case we've found where someone was flagged for RMT who shouldn't have been, they were doing something else they shouldn't have been. Not so much a false positive as a positive for the wrong activity. It may be mincing words a bit but there's a very big difference from my perspective as these aren't really innocents getting caught in the crossfire.
If this proves to be true in some of your ongoing investigations (I have a friend who is still banned who only just received any sort of reply from you guys after almost a month of hearing absolutely nothing...) will you come out and admit it? |
Drew Solaert
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
146
|
Posted - 2012.04.26 14:40:00 -
[34] - Quote
You big beautiful bastards! Keep up the amazing work sercuity team because you are doing everything right. Everything.
<3
I'll be joining the FDU on May 1st.-á Ladies! Please contain yourselves.-á Blog to launch soon, because my ego demands it, watch this space.-á Both Pew and ummm whatever sound industry makes.
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CCP Sreegs
C C P
C C P Alliance
1046
|
Posted - 2012.04.26 14:42:00 -
[35] - Quote
Simvastatin Montelukast wrote:Other then isk, did the banned accounts have lots of :
Ore?
Faction Goodies?
other items of interest?
Assets are calculated into an isk value for the sake of simplicity. You can imagine that items seized run the gamut.
"Sreegs has juuust edged out Soundwave as my favourite dev." - Meita Way 2012 |
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Perramas
Pan Caldarian Ventures
45
|
Posted - 2012.04.26 14:43:00 -
[36] - Quote
This war against the bots and RMT networks is the reason I have resubscribe to EVE online. Keep up the great work! |
Lors Dornick
Kallisti Industries
170
|
Posted - 2012.04.26 14:46:00 -
[37] - Quote
Allaun wrote:Does anyone actually own a beeper? Seriously, when was the last time anyone here saw someone with a beeper? Bare minimum, you can buy a 15 dollar throw away phone for that. 
I still have one.
It still works (tested it for fun some time ago) but I have to admit that I haven't been carrying it around for the last 15 years or so.
ps.
Once upon a time I even had a supercool watch with builtin beeper ...
ds.
|
Adonis Helios
Everlasting Forge
6
|
Posted - 2012.04.26 14:46:00 -
[38] - Quote
Ranger 1 wrote:Adonis Helios wrote:Suggestion...
Have updates or warnings for the new players via the TV in the Captain's Quarters or even on the odd billboards floating around space by the jumpgates?
Kinda like those annoying drug control ads on TV lol
"I.e xxx amount of RMTers banned since xxxx date - Crime doesn't pay!" or some other equally corny phrase. I doubt they want to "break immersion" that way. Not saying a clever way to do it couldn't be found, but they probably want to keep most of those messages in something like the launcher or EVE Gate rather than in the game world itself.
I understand your point entirely. Perhaps it can be worked in such a way to be seen as a crime in-game? I'm sure the Eve story guys can work their magic.
I.e Concord(not CCP) banning players laundering ISK? .. I dunno |
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
1669
|
Posted - 2012.04.26 14:46:00 -
[39] - Quote
corestwo wrote:CCP Sreegs wrote:spookydonut wrote:Hey can you give us an updated count of false positives?
At fanfest sreegs said it was only 1 false positive.
I know for a fact that it's at least 15 now, and maybe as high as 50. That is untrue and as I elaborated in every single case we've found where someone was flagged for RMT who shouldn't have been, they were doing something else they shouldn't have been. Not so much a false positive as a positive for the wrong activity. It may be mincing words a bit but there's a very big difference from my perspective as these aren't really innocents getting caught in the crossfire. If this proves to be true in some of your ongoing investigations (I have a friend who is still banned who only just received any sort of reply from you guys after almost a month of hearing absolutely nothing...) will you come out and admit it?
In all fairness, if your internet "friend" actually was doing something in violation of the EULA (botting, RMT, or otherwise) are you really sure they would admit it to you...
When I check troll in the dictionary, it has a photo shopped picture of you standing somewhere in the vicinity of a point.
Also, I can kill you with my brain. |
corestwo
Goonfleet Investment Banking
196
|
Posted - 2012.04.26 14:47:00 -
[40] - Quote
Ranger 1 wrote:corestwo wrote:CCP Sreegs wrote:spookydonut wrote:Hey can you give us an updated count of false positives?
At fanfest sreegs said it was only 1 false positive.
I know for a fact that it's at least 15 now, and maybe as high as 50. That is untrue and as I elaborated in every single case we've found where someone was flagged for RMT who shouldn't have been, they were doing something else they shouldn't have been. Not so much a false positive as a positive for the wrong activity. It may be mincing words a bit but there's a very big difference from my perspective as these aren't really innocents getting caught in the crossfire. If this proves to be true in some of your ongoing investigations (I have a friend who is still banned who only just received any sort of reply from you guys after almost a month of hearing absolutely nothing...) will you come out and admit it? In all fairness, if your internet "friend" actually was doing something in violation of the EULA (botting, RMT, or otherwise) are you really sure they would admit it to you...
Edited some clarification in; he was running a bond in the alliance. It'd have been all too easy for him to get false flagged. |
Esrevid Nekkeg
Justified and Ancient
89
|
Posted - 2012.04.26 14:47:00 -
[41] - Quote
Good news, good news indeed. Way to go and keep it up!
Here I used to have a sig of our old Camper in space. Now it is disregarded as being the wrong format.
Looking out the window I see one thing: Nothing wrong with the format of our Camper! Silly CCP......
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Turelus
Caldari Independent Navy Reserve
The Fourth District
27
|
Posted - 2012.04.26 14:48:00 -
[42] - Quote
Brinid Navarre wrote:Turelus wrote:If you want an effective log in banner for newbies to see just show a wallet with -100 000 000.00 ISK and say "THIS COULD BE YOU!"
That would scare the crap out of me! That's not very much isk. You can make that in an hour playing fairly. Try again. ;)
I think for a brand new EVE player that would seem a lot of money.
Although a few billion might be more around the right mark to make an actual statement to newbies. |
Jastra
Black Thorne Corporation
Black Thorne Alliance
88
|
Posted - 2012.04.26 14:48:00 -
[43] - Quote
good stuff |
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CCP Sreegs
C C P
C C P Alliance
1049
|
Posted - 2012.04.26 14:48:00 -
[44] - Quote
corestwo wrote:CCP Sreegs wrote:spookydonut wrote:Hey can you give us an updated count of false positives?
At fanfest sreegs said it was only 1 false positive.
I know for a fact that it's at least 15 now, and maybe as high as 50. That is untrue and as I elaborated in every single case we've found where someone was flagged for RMT who shouldn't have been, they were doing something else they shouldn't have been. Not so much a false positive as a positive for the wrong activity. It may be mincing words a bit but there's a very big difference from my perspective as these aren't really innocents getting caught in the crossfire. If this proves to be true in some of your ongoing investigations (I have a friend who is still banned who only just received any sort of reply from you guys after almost a month of hearing absolutely nothing...) will you come out and admit it?
I believe we have. We've also reimbursed people who were wrongly caught in the crossfire. I'll add to that though that everyone in prison is innocent and not everyone claiming to have been caught in some massively wide net that doesn't exist is doing so honestly. :)
I don't feel any pain one way or another by admitting a mistake. We did the same by admitting we had any false positives at all.
"Sreegs has juuust edged out Soundwave as my favourite dev." - Meita Way 2012 |
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Rrama Ratamnim
Phoenix Evolved Part Duo
1
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Posted - 2012.04.26 14:49:00 -
[45] - Quote
Turelus wrote:If you want an effective log in banner for newbies to see just show a wallet with -100 000 000.00 ISK and say "THIS COULD BE YOU!"
That would scare the crap out of me!
Agreed a negative wallet picture with a big caption "Don't be a statistic! RMT is wrong!"
That said
is it just me or for all the good work team security does do they need a new name??? Its just so .. normal....
I vote for Team RoboCop!
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Denidil
Larimer Highlands Heavy Industries
261
|
Posted - 2012.04.26 14:49:00 -
[46] - Quote
corestwo wrote:
Edited some clarification in; he was running a bond in the alliance. It'd have been all too easy for him to get false flagged.
and just as easy for him to try to be hiding his illicit activities under the legal ones.
I have found this new mysterious resource called "Life" |
SabotNoob
Sabot Industries
46
|
Posted - 2012.04.26 14:51:00 -
[47] - Quote
"...which can be used by you to fund your game time and the money goes into developing a better spaceship game instead of buying the equivalent of a digital drug dealer a cool new diamond-covered blingy case for his beeper."
Beeper?! Who the hell still uses a beeper? They should be shot (in-game), then banned. |
Kismeteer
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
150
|
Posted - 2012.04.26 14:53:00 -
[48] - Quote
I think that moving all the offenders to a corp of 'Banned Players' while they were banned would have been a good way to indicating that they were 'bad'. |
corestwo
Goonfleet Investment Banking
196
|
Posted - 2012.04.26 14:54:00 -
[49] - Quote
Denidil wrote:corestwo wrote:
Edited some clarification in; he was running a bond in the alliance. It'd have been all too easy for him to get false flagged.
and just as easy for him to try to be hiding his illicit activities under the legal ones.
While I'll be the first to admit that goons were probably as riddled with RMTers as any other nullsec alliance, he's also one of the last people I'd expect to have been RMTing. And the fact that every goon wasn't involved in RMT is just as obvious as your bias towards thinking we were.
@CCPSreegs: I'll hold you to that, then, once you guys finish. Given how long it took him to get one reply, I suppose I'll be reporting back sometime in 2013. |
gfldex
493
|
Posted - 2012.04.26 15:01:00 -
[50] - Quote
All hail our new RMT overlo ... no wait! All hail our new Internet Space Friend CCP Sreegs!
When someone burns down your sandcasle, bring sausages. |
Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
282
|
Posted - 2012.04.26 15:03:00 -
[51] - Quote
Wow..... AWESOME!!!!!
If 1268 accounts are now permabanned.... are you getting any flack from management about the loss of 1268 Monthly Subs??
That would be a loss of $20,000 in monthly income for CCP???
How can we get management off your back!!!! |
Eric Deloitte
The Flowing Penguins
Iron Oxide.
2
|
Posted - 2012.04.26 15:10:00 -
[52] - Quote
Gizznitt Malikite wrote:
Wow..... AWESOME!!!!!
If 1268 accounts are now permabanned.... are you getting any flack from management about the loss of 1268 Monthly Subs??
That would be a loss of $20,000 in monthly income for CCP???
How can we get management off your back!!!!
They were probably costing CCP a lot more in Plex sales that sub fees |
Francisco Bizzaro
59
|
Posted - 2012.04.26 15:11:00 -
[53] - Quote
Gizznitt Malikite wrote:
Wow..... AWESOME!!!!!
If 1268 accounts are now permabanned.... are you getting any flack from management about the loss of 1268 Monthly Subs??
That would be a loss of $20,000 in monthly income for CCP???
How can we get management off your back!!!!
It probably just means 1268 ISK-purchased PLEX don't get consumed every month. Still an issue, but less direct than missing $20k.
And anyway, if the RMTers were contributing $20k to CCP every month, they must have been earning even more than that via their RMT business. That business now gets shifted to legal CCP-endorsed PLEX. |
Faith Patrouette
Careless Carebears Inc.
5
|
Posted - 2012.04.26 15:12:00 -
[54] - Quote
I never thought i would openly admit this but Sreegs.. I think I love you!
Keep up the great work guys! |
Cpt Arareb
Ideal Machine
Many Reckless Corps
15
|
Posted - 2012.04.26 15:13:00 -
[55] - Quote
Nice work indeed sreegs and team ..keep up |
Kazanir
Eighty Joule Brewery
Goonswarm Federation
375
|
Posted - 2012.04.26 15:14:00 -
[56] - Quote
CCP Sreegs wrote:That is untrue and as I elaborated in every single case we've found where someone was flagged for RMT who shouldn't have been, they were doing something else they shouldn't have been. Not so much a false positive as a positive for the wrong activity.
It may be mincing words a bit but there's a very big difference from my perspective as these aren't really innocents getting caught in the crossfire.
I have refrained from commenting or arguing with you on the forums, thus far, because I seriously respect you for this undertaking. You are doing a good thing and have to contend with a legion of idiots while doing so. Props.
However, the response time we are seeing on certain things is a little disconcerting, and it is what motivated corestwo to post. In the case that corestwo is posting about, it took us nearly a month to get any sort of response despite repeated petitions and e-mails to your security@ e-mail address. Having to wait for such a long period of time without even a "we are looking at this" e-mail, while you are posting about the low false positive rate on the forums -- I'm sure you can see how these events make me sad. Nevertheless I have tried to be patient, but now it has been a month since the original bannings.
Also, I know of at least one person who was unbanned a week ago and who had all of his accounts compensated with 14 days of game time for the false positive ban. You declined to provide an explanation for the false positive to this person, but I can only surmise that you considered him innocent rather than in the "was doing something shady" category.
I'm trying to say this nicely because I genuinely want your efforts to be successful and I respect what you have done so far. This is why I haven't been harassing you about hypotheticals like the previous devblog thread. But the case I'm talking about is almost a textbook example of a false positive and so far it isn't being handled very well. Right now we have 200 billion ISK in assets (belonging to around 20-25 real people who invested in the bond) that are sitting unusable and have been for a month. In light of that situation, continuing to read posts about "no false positives" and "doing something else they shouldn't have been" at this point is aggravating. It is especially even more aggravating because there is no way the lost income from that 200B in assets will be compensated fairly by CCP if the person IS unbanned -- it is just gone, and there is no way for you to fairly rectify the consequences of a false positive of this magnitude.
Like I said. I don't have any desire to start an Internet slapfight or rake you over the coals on this stuff since I think you're doing a pretty good job at a great thing. But yeah -- there are still issues, and for me they aren't just hypotheticals.
Ranger 1 wrote:In all fairness, if your internet "friend" actually was doing something in violation of the EULA (botting, RMT, or otherwise) are you really sure they would admit it to you...
I have access to the API data of the banned accounts that were mentioned by corestwo so I could go check if I really wanted to. But yes, in this case I am sure. |
Shepard Book
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
44
|
Posted - 2012.04.26 15:15:00 -
[57] - Quote
Anything being done to prevent them making new accounts? |
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
1669
|
Posted - 2012.04.26 15:16:00 -
[58] - Quote
corestwo wrote:Denidil wrote:corestwo wrote:
Edited some clarification in; he was running a bond in the alliance. It'd have been all too easy for him to get false flagged.
and just as easy for him to try to be hiding his illicit activities under the legal ones. While I'll be the first to admit that goons were probably as riddled with RMTers as any other nullsec alliance, he's also one of the last people I'd expect to have been RMTing, for a variety of reasons. And the fact that every goon wasn't involved in RMT is just as obvious as your bias towards thinking we were. @CCPSreegs: I'll hold you to that, then, once you guys finish. Given how long it took him to get one reply, I suppose I'll be reporting back sometime in 2013.
My original question was an honest one, and I have no prejudice toward goons in general. Any alliance or corp can have botters, RMT, or ISK laundering going on and the general membership may very well not be aware of it.
I've had more than one person that I thought I knew fairly well finally fess up to dabbling in those activities over the years... it happens.
One thing to keep in mind if it takes that long to get a response other than "Goodbye" it could very well mean they are taking the time to be thorough, which in my mind is preferable a fast and probably negative outcome.
When I check troll in the dictionary, it has a photo shopped picture of you standing somewhere in the vicinity of a point.
Also, I can kill you with my brain. |
corestwo
Goonfleet Investment Banking
196
|
Posted - 2012.04.26 15:21:00 -
[59] - Quote
Ranger 1 wrote:One thing to keep in mind if it takes that long to get a response other than "Goodbye" it could very well mean they are taking the time to be thorough, which in my mind is preferable a fast and probably negative outcome.
At least one case in which CCP decided that the player was, shall we say, partially guilty (unbanned, minus some cash), the player in question was unbanned on all of his multiple accounts in less than a week. I'm sure kazanir can provide more examples of swift turnaround times. So, you can see why we're kind of upset about a month without so much as a "we're looking into it". |
Ayame Tao
State War Academy
Caldari State
2
|
Posted - 2012.04.26 15:27:00 -
[60] - Quote
CCP Sreegs wrote:Simvastatin Montelukast wrote:Other then isk, did the banned accounts have lots of :
Ore?
Faction Goodies?
other items of interest? Assets are calculated into an isk value for the sake of simplicity. You can imagine that items seized run the gamut.
Can I have their stuff?
o/\o for Team Security.
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