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Stick Cult
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Posted - 2009.06.19 14:58:00 -
[1]
I don't think there's anything wrong with the Doomsday atm. There are too many titans, let's deal with that problem. But DD's are not overpowered. Everyone's citing the recent event with 16 DD's killing a Thanatos...but that's 16 DD's, not one or two. Goons n' friends had 27 titans on grid, the problem isn't with DD's, but with having too many titans. People are saying that DD's can kill capital ships now, well sure they can, if an alliance actually fields a dozen titans in combat. The Thanatos kill was in an almost completely safe situation, and not in battle.
So please. Stop with the DD nerfs. |
Pedro Sangre
Ars ex Discordia
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Posted - 2009.06.19 15:24:00 -
[2]
I don't think you get it. That display was fair warning to EVE & CCP.
If titans / DDs aren't fixed, we (and others too most likely) will do it in combat...repeatedly...until even your bad posting is drowned out by the screams of broken and podded pubbies. |
Ausser
Cybertech Industrials Agency
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Posted - 2009.06.19 15:50:00 -
[3]
 Originally by: Pedro Sangre
I don't think you get it. That display was fair warning to EVE & CCP.
If titans / DDs aren't fixed, we (and others too most likely) will do it in combat...repeatedly...until even your bad posting is drowned out by the screams of broken and podded pubbies.
This.
Originally by: Stick Cult
...
There are too many titans, let's deal with that problem. But DD's are not overpowered.
...
So please. Stop with the DD nerfs.
Okay, then let's tailor the work we try to do in the other titan threads to your point of view, just to see if we can fix the problem.
But how to do without to 'nerf' the titans?
It's soo simple!
We just buff the DDD to deal 1.000.000.000 dmg on each ignition.
Now the titans will kill eachother untill only one is left.
Problem solved. Profit.  |
Ortos
Federal Defence Union
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Posted - 2009.06.19 16:17:00 -
[4]
Originally by: Stick Cult
I don't think there's anything wrong with the Doomsday atm. There are too many titans, let's deal with that problem. But DD's are not overpowered. Everyone's citing the recent event with 16 DD's killing a Thanatos...but that's 16 DD's, not one or two. Goons n' friends had 27 titans on grid, the problem isn't with DD's, but with having too many titans. People are saying that DD's can kill capital ships now, well sure they can, if an alliance actually fields a dozen titans in combat. The Thanatos kill was in an almost completely safe situation, and not in battle.
So please. Stop with the DD nerfs.
and yet ppl still say that its only in 0,0 you can find real pvp |
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CCP Zymurgist
Gallente
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Posted - 2009.06.19 18:35:00 -
[5]
Thread moved to General Discussion. |
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CommmanderInChief
Comply Or Die
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Posted - 2009.06.19 18:43:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Pedro Sangre
I don't think you get it. That display was fair warning to EVE & CCP.
If titans / DDs aren't fixed, we (and others too most likely) will do it in combat...repeatedly...until even your bad posting is drowned out by the screams of broken and podded pubbies.
this..fleet warfare is dead..1 or multiple I won buttons..trouble is eve has now become about numbers not about skill..you bring 5 titans ill bring 10, no one dares bring BS/Support fleets out cos they get obliterated now, it was bad enough when ppl have 1 titan you hoped to get away but with the ailly amouts now your getting triple DDD which there is no chance of survival, forget the DD tanked ships, the wont survive 2 or more and thats the way its going..so yes seriously nerf the production of titans and DDDs |
Abrazzar
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Posted - 2009.06.19 18:47:00 -
[7]
One titan per controlled region. More difficulty to hold a complete region. Easier for smaller alliances to disrupt sovereignty. More fun claiming and maintaining sovereignty. Something like this. It needs a lot of work. |
Sir Muffoon
Backdoor Enterprises
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Posted - 2009.06.19 18:53:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Abrazzar
One titan per controlled region. More difficulty to hold a complete region. Easier for smaller alliances to disrupt sovereignty. More fun claiming and maintaining sovereignty. Something like this. It needs a lot of work.
Per.. region? That's alot of space. |
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Chribba
Otherworld Enterprises
Otherworld Empire
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Posted - 2009.06.19 18:55:00 -
[9]
How about unnerf the low-sec DD so I can get rid of them pesky NPCs roaming the belts while I mine?!!
Secure 3rd party service |
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Abrazzar
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Posted - 2009.06.19 19:04:00 -
[10]
Edited by: Abrazzar on 19/06/2009 19:04:13
Originally by: Sir Muffoon
Originally by: Abrazzar
One titan per controlled region. More difficulty to hold a complete region. Easier for smaller alliances to disrupt sovereignty. More fun claiming and maintaining sovereignty. Something like this. It needs a lot of work.
Per.. region? That's alot of space.
You can get a new and improved (now with real really useful) Mothership per constellation.
--------
Ideas for: Mining
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Sir Muffoon
Backdoor Enterprises
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Posted - 2009.06.19 19:07:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Abrazzar
You can get a new and improved (now with real really useful) Mothership per constellation.
I don't like it. Defenders already have enough advantages, this would just make 0.0 even more stale.
DDDs should just get changed, and sov mechanics should be completely redone. Oh, and motherships made useful. I know that's pretty broad but really, there's a lot of threads on this. |
iP0D
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Posted - 2009.06.19 19:09:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Pedro Sangre
I don't think you get it. That display was fair warning to EVE & CCP.
If titans / DDs aren't fixed, we (and others too most likely) will do it in combat...repeatedly...until even your bad posting is drowned out by the screams of broken and podded pubbies.
Welcome to 2006
You've either missed a few points or a few years :P
Besides, looking at the latest lolDDcarrierkill hilarity you wonder how real people really are about their "opinions". Sure .. titans are bad, don't mind we just put a bid on two more and ordered 5 more components batches :P
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Van'Klomp
FireStar Inc
Paxton Federation
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Posted - 2009.06.19 19:14:00 -
[13]
You know, you guys could put some energy into generating some ideas and then pulling them apart (constructively!).
Idea one (disclaimer: I know not alot about Titans, I've only been killed by a Titan once, blah di blah)...
If an Alliance can field multiple Titans, then the Titans need to be far more vulnerable than they currently are. So, how about a BIG penalty for deploying a DD. For example; Firing the DD will consume all of the Titan's power. Once the DD has been fired, the Titan's systems must re-initialise (this could mean a complete shutdown of modules maybe), during which time (5 minutes? 10? 15? 30?) the Titan will be vulnerable to attack and must be guarded.
This is just an idea, so now pull it to bits, discard it if it's crap, or build on it if it has potential. But do it, CONSTRUCTIVELY! |
Dragon Greg
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Posted - 2009.06.19 19:14:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Stick Cult
I don't think there's anything wrong with the Doomsday atm. There are too many titans, let's deal with that problem. But DD's are not overpowered. Everyone's citing the recent event with 16 DD's killing a Thanatos...but that's 16 DD's, not one or two. Goons n' friends had 27 titans on grid, the problem isn't with DD's, but with having too many titans. People are saying that DD's can kill capital ships now, well sure they can, if an alliance actually fields a dozen titans in combat. The Thanatos kill was in an almost completely safe situation, and not in battle.
So please. Stop with the DD nerfs.
Close but no cigar. Problem is not too many titans. Problem is us. We, the players.
Just think for a moment, how many Titans would we choose to field in a sovereignty battle and how many doomsdays would we set off if the collective mass of a number of titans would disrupt say bubble mechanics, or dislodge pos defences from their online state. Or if excessive use of doomsdays would not just damage ships, but would hurt sovereignty structures like the cynojammer.
Titans are just ships, very feeble ones at that. Doomsdays are nuclear weapons. Except in EVE they cause no fallout. If they did we'd be a lot less like sheep.
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Dragon Greg
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Posted - 2009.06.19 19:19:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Van'Klomp
You know, you guys could put some energy into generating some ideas and then pulling them apart (constructively!).
Idea one (disclaimer: I know not alot about Titans, I've only been killed by a Titan once, blah di blah)...
If an Alliance can field multiple Titans, then the Titans need to be far more vulnerable than they currently are. So, how about a BIG penalty for deploying a DD. For example; Firing the DD will consume all of the Titan's power. Once the DD has been fired, the Titan's systems must re-initialise (this could mean a complete shutdown of modules maybe), during which time (5 minutes? 10? 15? 30?) the Titan will be vulnerable to attack and must be guarded.
This is just an idea, so now pull it to bits, discard it if it's crap, or build on it if it has potential. But do it, CONSTRUCTIVELY!
Nice line of thinking, but take a look at exactly how they are used. They are used specifically in excess because we do not want to risk a misfire, or a vulnerability, or even risk for that matter. The theory is sound, but breaks at human behaviour.
A titan dies in about 40 seconds anyway these days, it is a glass cannon. Which is yet another reason for us to make more of them, for again the same reasons of vulnerability and risk.
If setting off a DD would fry own cynojammer or such critical elements, people would be a lot more reserved with them. Might even be creative and visionary with them.
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Hyveres
Caldari
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Posted - 2009.06.19 19:23:00 -
[16]
Just make it impossible to cloak supercapitals and their numbers will go down a bit.
"Subtlety is a thing for philosophy, not combat. If you're going to kill someone, you might as well kill them a whole lot."
- Vulcan Raven, The Last Days Of Foxhound |
Crackzilla
The Shadow Order
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Posted - 2009.06.19 19:36:00 -
[17]
It took a year for ccp to recognize the nano issue. How long will it take this time? We've been arguing that titans are going to be a problem for at least as long.
1) Prevent supercapitals from cloaking
2) a) nerf dd
b) stop the standard titan fitting of mwd, cloak, agility.
c) remove dd entirely
d) some combination of these
3) Give Chribba a titan in high sec
Until the titan issue is fixed the best solution is to protest by abusing the current game mechanics.
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Escobar Noreaga
Amarr
F.R.E.E. Explorer
Wildly Inappropriate.
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Posted - 2009.06.19 19:39:00 -
[18]
DD's were bad before they were common and will only get more rediculous as time goes on.
low cost to kill unlimited targets is and will always be the problem untill its gotten rid of.
how bout changing the cost of setting of DD's to 2 bil. more then fair in its current state.
imho just get rid of the whole mechanic.
personally i pray that goons mass produce titans as fast as possible and show CCP the future of titan warefare.
________
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Van'Klomp
FireStar Inc
Paxton Federation
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Posted - 2009.06.19 19:40:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Dragon Greg
If setting off a DD would fry own cynojammer or such critical elements, people would be a lot more reserved with them. Might even be creative and visionary with them.
I like this line of thinking. |
Thebro Nobrunder
Schrodinger's Renegades
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Posted - 2009.06.19 21:39:00 -
[20]
I definitely think eve needs more double D's  |
Spurty
Caldari
Ore Mongers
BricK sQuAD.
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Posted - 2009.06.19 21:46:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Thebro Nobrunder
I definitely think eve needs more double D's
pix! |
Ferdio Ricotez
Gallente
Killer Carebears
United Interstellar Alliance
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Posted - 2009.06.19 21:49:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Thebro Nobrunder
I definitely think eve needs more double D's
Actually, it's triple D (DoomsDay Device)
Also, isn't this just tank rushing? I mean, if you play GDI in CnC you can just as well build 100 Mammoth tanks, and have a pwnage army, instead of a great mix of all types of infantry and units. I wouldn'd advice that for the Nod, though. Their units tend to easily fall apart when in tank rushes.
Maybe the DDD should just hit the fitting Titan itself extra hard? |
Sharp Feather
Gallente
Aliastra
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Posted - 2009.06.19 21:53:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Dragon Greg
Titans are just ships, very feeble ones at that. Doomsdays are nuclear weapons. Except in EVE they cause no fallout. If they did we'd be a lot less like sheep.
Great idea man, it need a fallout. If the systems get poisonned people, even if they win the fight, wont be able to hold it because of the fallout dot. Great idea man...really! |
Dragon Greg
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Posted - 2009.06.19 21:56:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Van'Klomp
Originally by: Dragon Greg
If setting off a DD would fry own cynojammer or such critical elements, people would be a lot more reserved with them. Might even be creative and visionary with them.
I like this line of thinking.
Well it's the only way we ever think before we act like sheep tbh.
When titans were created, or rather introduced (since the original idea came from an era vastly different from the one when they were introduced) they were thought to be the flagships of EVE. Massively expensive, massively superior.
How naive.
Never underestimate how crazy subscribers are.
That same observation still applies. Take away the doomsday, and we all know what we will do. Nothing will stop us from good old fashioned doctrines of pumping as many people blind through a gate as we possibly can. To a point where planning to kill a node in order to win an objective becomes not just practical, but viable military doctrine again.
We need doomsdays to keeps us sharp, and to prevent us from flocking mindlessly. Trouble is we go overboard deliberately with them. To a degree this is understandable, titans are glass cannons, and we - as much as we hate to admit it - just hate uncalculated risks. So we overcompensate.
I hate real life analogies, but the only reason we have not blown ourselves up in real life is because nuclear weapons cause fallout which pretty much kills anything or at the minimum makes the victory incredibly sour. If doomsdays had a fallout element, we would behave very differently in our use of them. God help us, we might actually have to fight over a system instead of just using supercaps as a discouragement tool aimed to kill the pvp risk.
We've seen all sorts of sensible and wierd proposals pass in the Assembly Hall, all much discussed and some even very ingenious on a level of game mechanics.
None sofar even acknowledge that the biggest problem/variable in the equasion is us, the players.
Many are subject to bias. Depending on their position in game everyone changes their views.
Got to attack? Whine about titans and doomsdays and jammers.
Got to defend? Pump the system full with titans, do a few PR stunts claiming you dislike it oh so much and ridicule it, while at the same time continuing to buy and build more and more ships.
We have yet to see what CCP comes up with for the upcoming changes. Maybe this time they factor in their customers 
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Taedrin
Gallente
Golden Mechanization Protectorate
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Posted - 2009.06.19 22:32:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Sharp Feather
Originally by: Dragon Greg
Titans are just ships, very feeble ones at that. Doomsdays are nuclear weapons. Except in EVE they cause no fallout. If they did we'd be a lot less like sheep.
Great idea man, it need a fallout. If the systems get poisonned people, even if they win the fight, wont be able to hold it because of the fallout dot. Great idea man...really!
People would then favor scorched earth or total war strategies. As the guy above me mentioned, never underestimate how crazy us pod pilots are. |
jst tstng
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Posted - 2009.06.19 22:45:00 -
[26]
Rock Paper Shotgun.
In other words, a new ship or ships. A designated titan killer. It doesnt need to be bigger just specialized to be a big problem for titans and can rock paper scissored by something already in game.
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Dragon Greg
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Posted - 2009.06.19 22:52:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Taedrin
Originally by: Sharp Feather
Originally by: Dragon Greg
Titans are just ships, very feeble ones at that. Doomsdays are nuclear weapons. Except in EVE they cause no fallout. If they did we'd be a lot less like sheep.
Great idea man, it need a fallout. If the systems get poisonned people, even if they win the fight, wont be able to hold it because of the fallout dot. Great idea man...really!
People would then favor scorched earth or total war strategies. As the guy above me mentioned, never underestimate how crazy us pod pilots are.
You know, I would consider that a valid and very fun option. Burn the space you are about to loose, or get an alliance to kill themselves, or kill them to a point where they really die. Or fight a war where both sides face a real war of attrition.
Either way, with everything falling or burning to pieces no shields like sovereignty remain to shelter blobs, there would be a much higher need to really fight. Or flee and then have fun with the firesales.
Older people will remember places like FA or Xetic and may be able to relate to that a bit easier. |
Dragon Greg
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Posted - 2009.06.19 22:56:00 -
[28]
Originally by: jst tstng
Rock Paper Shotgun.
In other words, a new ship or ships. A designated titan killer. It doesnt need to be bigger just specialized to be a big problem for titans and can rock paper scissored by something already in game.
That is .. almost silly. Either that or I do not fully understand what you mean. Ever shot at one? :P If a normal gang just so much as looks at one it melts :P
There's just two challenges in killing a titan:
1. tackling it.
2. having people alive to tackle and kill it after the other 27 doomsdays from the backup titans.
Glass cannons, but there has to be at minimum a big fat fallout element, maybe even an upper limit to a point where the gigantic mass starts unanchoring the outpost in the system or something like that.
Why not. In the storylines the old NPC titans, while bigger then our player titans can't go near planets or moons. I could see ours having really bad consequences when there's 12 at a pos or an outpost :P
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Alt lock
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Posted - 2009.06.19 23:19:00 -
[29]
Originally by: jst tstng
Rock Paper Shotgun.
In other words, a new ship or ships. A designated titan killer. It doesnt need to be bigger just specialized to be a big problem for titans and can rock paper scissored by something already in game.
A good idea here short and sweet
Plus NEW SHIP!!! |
Ephemeron
Caldari Provisions
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Posted - 2009.06.19 23:30:00 -
[30]
HICs were introduced with the purpose of titan/mothership tackling. At least it was one of their intended roles. HICs are still the best tools for killing a titan. Usually HICs can take 2 DDD, but with 3+ they die.
If HICs could have some kind of immunity or strong resistance to DDD, you'd see a lot more titan deaths. Still, even with that, the production rate of titans would greatly exceed losses.
Another major factor in titan proliferation is their ability to fit cloaking devices. If they were unable to cloak, they would be used less often, more strategically, and of course, end up dying slightly more often.
Still, that would not stop the inevitable overflow of titans, where their numbers keep increasing almost unchecked. The day when titan fleet will be able to destroy a cap fleet will be a major turning point in fleet dynamics. I'm not sure CCP fully understands just how important those changes will be. But Goons, PL, and many other experienced people are trying to give them a hint. |
Dragon Greg
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Posted - 2009.06.20 00:24:00 -
[31]
Originally by: Ephemeron
HICs were introduced with the purpose of titan/mothership tackling. At least it was one of their intended roles. HICs are still the best tools for killing a titan. Usually HICs can take 2 DDD, but with 3+ they die.
If HICs could have some kind of immunity or strong resistance to DDD, you'd see a lot more titan deaths. Still, even with that, the production rate of titans would greatly exceed losses.
Another major factor in titan proliferation is their ability to fit cloaking devices. If they were unable to cloak, they would be used less often, more strategically, and of course, end up dying slightly more often.
Still, that would not stop the inevitable overflow of titans, where their numbers keep increasing almost unchecked. The day when titan fleet will be able to destroy a cap fleet will be a major turning point in fleet dynamics. I'm not sure CCP fully understands just how important those changes will be. But Goons, PL, and many other experienced people are trying to give them a hint.
Inability to cloak would provide much greater risk in titan deployments, I agree. Sadly we would just not like that risk and do what we always do: bring more.
As for Titans killing capital fleets, I agree it would majorly impact dynamics. BUT ... first of all the cluster dying over such an event would be a much bigger wakeup call to CCP then people actually doing it, and secondly I sometimes am not so sure whether that really is such a bad thing.
In principle that is. Capitals are the new battleships, just like once upon a time cruisers were the new "battleships". Considering how really twisted the levels of income are on an organisational level from the X64 trees I sometimes wonder whether it would really be a bad thing if they had to spend all that ISK on new dread replacements the way a few years ago it went into battleship replacements in the light of some mass capital kill method.
As for the PR stunts of doomsdaying a carrier with 27 titans, claiming to do it as a wake up call to show CCP "how bad it is", I got to say I take that with more then just a grain of salt :P
First of all we do that kind of stuff because we can. Secondly "how bad it is" is not stopping anyone from investing harder and faster in new builds and acquisitions.
It's like how people's perspectives on titans change with the eb and flow of conflict. When times are tough it's bad, when times are juicy the protests die out, or become token ludicrous stunts :P
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Thebro Nobrunder
Schrodinger's Renegades
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Posted - 2009.06.20 00:37:00 -
[32]
As to a dedicated anti titan weapon... isn't that what dreads are supposed to be (no matter how bad they are at it?)
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Agent Known
Apotheosis of Virtue
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Posted - 2009.06.20 01:39:00 -
[33]
Originally by: Thebro Nobrunder
As to a dedicated anti titan weapon... isn't that what dreads are supposed to be (no matter how bad they are at it?)
Dreads were made for sieging POSs and stuff like that I guess...although they can take a bit more punishment than a HIC could with doomsdays.
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Admiral IceBlock
Caldari
Northern Intelligence
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Posted - 2009.06.20 02:01:00 -
[34]
Originally by: Ferdio Ricotez
Originally by: Thebro Nobrunder
I definitely think eve needs more double D's
Actually, it's triple D (DoomsDay Device)
Also, isn't this just tank rushing? I mean, if you play GDI in CnC you can just as well build 100 Mammoth tanks, and have a pwnage army, instead of a great mix of all types of infantry and units. I wouldn'd advice that for the Nod, though. Their units tend to easily fall apart when in tank rushes.
Maybe the DDD should just hit the fitting Titan itself extra hard?
Are you ******ed or just very high? What do you think NOD has when GDI has been sittting and building 100 mammoth? 
Please resize your signature to the maximum allowed of 400 x 120 pixels with a maximum file size of 24000 bytes. Zymurgist |
Crackzilla
The Shadow Order
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Posted - 2009.06.20 02:20:00 -
[35]
Originally by: Ephemeron
If HICs could have some kind of immunity or strong resistance to DDD, you'd see a lot more titan deaths. Still, even with that, the production rate of titans would greatly exceed losses.
To be effective you'd need nano hics that could go at least 3-4km/s or ceptors with something like 99% resists to that dd dmg type.
Hics rarely get a point on a titan, as hics are too slow. A suicidal dictor setup for speed probably has a better shot at the initial tackle unless the titan is warped into a sucker bubble.
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Hellspawn666
Minmatar
Emo Rangers
Electric Monkey Overlords
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Posted - 2009.06.20 02:23:00 -
[36]
Seems to me that you should get rid of cloaking devices for any capitals since it heavily removes the need for a foothold in a system when you can cyno in a bunch of carriers/ms/titans and scatter them with cloaking devices.
Also why not introduce a ship specific module that blocks doomsdays, make it so you can only fit it on say command ships since HICs get primary enough as it is. This module would stop any titan doomsdaying but everyone on the field can see who is doing so. This way the enemy has to field some kind of support gang and it prevents just fielding swarms of capitals. Since if the enemy has any decent logistics then you'd find it impossible to doomsday. Dont nurf the doomsday itself but instead enable a counter-meassure. But for pitys sake dont let capitals be the counter measure :)
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Teras Menac
Gallente
Caldari POS Constructions Inc.
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Posted - 2009.06.20 06:28:00 -
[37]
Originally by: jst tstng
Rock Paper Shotgun.
In other words, a new ship or ships. A designated titan killer. It doesnt need to be bigger just specialized to be a big problem for titans and can rock paper scissored by something already in game.
What about a Doomsday Jammer of some kind? Something that takes a high-slot and a ridiculous amount of powergrid so that it's hard to fit much gank onto the ship that it's fit to. Or like you said a Titan killer, maybe some kind of dedicated E-War Dreadnaut.
I also like the idea of the Titan doing damage to its own logistics.
Maybe make the Doomsday use the same fuel as the Jump Drive so if you use it you have to refuel it before you can jump again.
Have it do damage to the Titan itself. I don't know if it already does this, I haven't flown a Titan.
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EnslaverOfMinmatar
Amarr
Viziam
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Posted - 2009.06.20 06:29:00 -
[38]
Nerf titans
uʍop ǝpısdn ǝɹnʇɐuƃıs ʎɯ ƃuıpɐǝɹ ǝɹɐ noʎ
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Veveritz
Minmatar
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Posted - 2009.06.20 06:34:00 -
[39]
Buff titans a bit and remove the doomsday
It's getting boring really fast when somebody can double / triple doomsday you
Or make it that you can only fire 1 doomsday per day in 1 system.
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Teras Menac
Gallente
Caldari POS Constructions Inc.
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Posted - 2009.06.20 06:44:00 -
[40]
What about Titan's having some kind of unique cyno so that it shows up on the overview as a "Titan's Cyno". That way the Titan requires a fleet just to protect it's Cyno.
Pardon my ignorance if it already behaves this way. |
KiloAlpha
Southern Cross Trilogy
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Posted - 2009.06.20 08:07:00 -
[41]
Originally by: jst tstng
Rock Paper Shotgun.
In other words, a new ship or ships. A designated titan killer. It doesnt need to be bigger just specialized to be a big problem for titans and can rock paper scissored by something already in game.
we already have a titan killer its called a dreadnaught |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
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Posted - 2009.06.20 09:21:00 -
[42]
Cloaks should not work on capital ships period.
At the very least, the decloak range should be increased to the ships' sig radius. One Titan description says that they're so massive that they can affect tides - how the hell do you hide that with a cloaking device that you can fit on a tier 1 frigate?
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Furb Killer
Gallente
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Posted - 2009.06.20 09:26:00 -
[43]
Even if you add a new ship which can withstand 27 doomsdays and then tackle a titan + proceed to kill it without backup except some other ships from its class, then still titans wouldnt die. The only result would be that motherships get a role, which would be protecting the titans from them, and they can actually survive the doomsdays from the friendly titans. So then we created super-capitals online.
The only good solution i can think of is completely changing the role of the titan. Imo what still is the best way to go is changing it more into a mobile station. Give it ability to hold huge (=100+ or something like that) ammount of clones and battleship. Give it repair facilities, maybe even a small force field arround it (would be needed when you add repair facilities, so people can just keep pressing the repair button when they are under attack at a titan, either they be in the forcefield and can only repair, or they are outside it and cant repair). Then they are definately usefull (everytime someone is killed he is back within 5 minutes in a new battleship). But they dont have the huge flaw they have now. Whatever you are going to do, it is just very bad game design:
Who exactly thought adding a button which when pressed kills everyone (in case of single titan everyone in BC/hac and smaller) on grid without anything they can do besides running was a good idea.
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Raneru
Euphoria Released
|
Posted - 2009.06.20 13:10:00 -
[44]
I posted 2 years ago about the problems with DD. As a non cap pilot, you spend ages setting up your bs for an epic fight and moving it to the op start point. Then you spend ages travelling xx jumps in fleet to get to the dest only to have 1 or 2 guys warp in at long range and click 1 module to undo all the preparation.
Don't people have epic 0.0 fleet BS fights like back in the day anymore? It all seems to be cap fights and pos takedowns nowadays 
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Dragon Greg
|
Posted - 2009.06.20 13:15:00 -
[45]
Originally by: Furb Killer
Even if you add a new ship which can withstand 27 doomsdays and then tackle a titan + proceed to kill it without backup except some other ships from its class, then still titans wouldnt die. The only result would be that motherships get a role, which would be protecting the titans from them, and they can actually survive the doomsdays from the friendly titans. So then we created super-capitals online.
The only good solution i can think of is completely changing the role of the titan. Imo what still is the best way to go is changing it more into a mobile station. Give it ability to hold huge (=100+ or something like that) ammount of clones and battleship. Give it repair facilities, maybe even a small force field arround it (would be needed when you add repair facilities, so people can just keep pressing the repair button when they are under attack at a titan, either they be in the forcefield and can only repair, or they are outside it and cant repair). Then they are definately usefull (everytime someone is killed he is back within 5 minutes in a new battleship). But they dont have the huge flaw they have now. Whatever you are going to do, it is just very bad game design:
Who exactly thought adding a button which when pressed kills everyone (in case of single titan everyone in BC/hac and smaller) on grid without anything they can do besides running was a good idea.
What exactly is the role of a Titan. By intention it is a ship to provide massive fleet bonuses, a supporting tool in mobility, logistical support, and an anti blob discouragement tool.
In practice very little of that is left standing.
Jump portal is nice, for fleet mobility. Its role of general logistics has faded away, since it has to compete with much cheaper and much more readily available alternatives.
Its own capacity for logistics is really a joke, taking into account normal fleet operations it has basically no room to properly serve as a point of ship replacements on the field, nor can it compete with a multitude of cheaper tools for logistics of resources like strontium or ammo or fuel.
Fleet bonuses are really nice, but because of the value of the ship and EVE's built in support for metagaming Titans are best kept outside of the main fleet :P Very often even in a POS with the shields closed to even own alliance members :P
As a blob discouragement they do work. No fleet runs around without being cautious of a hotdrop or a trap on a gate or at a pos. That is good. No really, that IS good, because we know what we do if we do not have to be careful. We make conventional ship blobbing and node lagging military doctrine.
Like I said earlier, we still need the risk and danger of a doomsday. We just also need doomsdays to cause fallout and come at a price for those who use them.
You are right that there is no feasible other role for a titan but being a glass cannon. There is neither support nor incentive to use it for much else.
I like the idea of a remote repair effect, but that is very close to an area effect. I like that, because it would open up a lot of options in general to field specialty ships. Not just Titans. I am not sure however if CCP are fond of taking this angle.
Personally I think the moment we have to think twice about throwing doomsdays around because they hurt us and our stuff, and not just the target, is the moment we will see the structural part of the problem disappear. At that point it would be nice to have reasons to use the ships for other purposes.
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Havohej
Minmatar
Du'uma Fiisi Integrated Astrometrics
|
Posted - 2009.06.20 13:28:00 -
[46]
Originally by: iP0D
looking at the latest lolDDcarrierkill hilarity you wonder how real people really are about their "opinions". Sure .. titans are bad, don't mind we just put a bid on two more and ordered 5 more components batches :P
You expect people to not accumulate all the titans they can in the meantime, just because they know titans are broken? So that their enemies can continue accumulating titans and have all the advantages for themselves? That would be stupid. EVE isn't the game for e-honor and trusting your opponent to be equally conscious of doing the right thing. Until it's fixed, existing powers should continue piling up titan after titan and should continue lighting as many DDs on one grid as possible until CCP is forced to admit that making ISK and skill training time the only gate to getting these things was a mistake, to admit that they should have - but didn't - see this coming, and finally do something about it.
One titan isn't insurmountable, neither is two... 27? |
Newsflash
Gallente
NorthUnited
|
Posted - 2009.06.20 13:29:00 -
[47]
firstly: titans ARE overpowered. secondly: its ****ing ridiculous that something size of a station can cloak.. |
Jamyl TashMurkon
Amarr
|
Posted - 2009.06.20 13:31:00 -
[48]
Originally by: Newsflash
firstly: titans ARE overpowered. secondly: its ****ing ridiculous that something size of a station can cloak..
no? |
Newsflash
Gallente
NorthUnited
|
Posted - 2009.06.20 13:35:00 -
[49]
Originally by: Jamyl TashMurkon
Originally by: Newsflash
firstly: titans ARE overpowered. secondly: its ****ing ridiculous that something size of a station can cloak..
no?
no? you are clueless or part of pandemc legion or whoever haves most of titans atm... i hope ccp does something soon to nerf these gamebreakers. |
Kiri Serrensun
|
Posted - 2009.06.20 14:12:00 -
[50]
Originally by: Dragon Greg
As a blob discouragement they do work. No fleet runs around without being cautious of a hotdrop or a trap on a gate or at a pos. That is good. No really, that IS good, because we know what we do if we do not have to be careful. We make conventional ship blobbing and node lagging military doctrine.
Not really--they just raise the bar a bit, creating blobs of HIC's and battleships with doomsday tanks. The only ones who really suffer are newer players in sub-BS ships, who can have their ability to play the game switched off with a single button press.
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Grath Telkin
Amarr
The Illuminati.
Pandemic Legion
|
Posted - 2009.06.20 16:07:00 -
[51]
Originally by: Newsflash
Originally by: Jamyl TashMurkon
Originally by: Newsflash
firstly: titans ARE overpowered. secondly: its ****ing ridiculous that something size of a station can cloak..
no?
no? you are clueless or part of pandemc legion or whoever haves most of titans atm... i hope ccp does something soon to nerf these gamebreakers.
WOAH THERE FELLA |
Bestofworst
Gallente
|
Posted - 2009.06.20 16:15:00 -
[52]
Give back an epic feeling to Titans, give them strong tank and (visually) millions of small guns firing off it's hull. Titan if anything should be something that bolsters the forces, like a moral lift, rather than just wipe out the opposition. |
iP0D
|
Posted - 2009.06.20 22:50:00 -
[53]
Originally by: Havohej
Originally by: iP0D
looking at the latest lolDDcarrierkill hilarity you wonder how real people really are about their "opinions". Sure .. titans are bad, don't mind we just put a bid on two more and ordered 5 more components batches :P
You expect people to not accumulate all the titans they can in the meantime, just because they know titans are broken? So that their enemies can continue accumulating titans and have all the advantages for themselves? That would be stupid. EVE isn't the game for e-honor and trusting your opponent to be equally conscious of doing the right thing. Until it's fixed, existing powers should continue piling up titan after titan and should continue lighting as many DDs on one grid as possible until CCP is forced to admit that making ISK and skill training time the only gate to getting these things was a mistake, to admit that they should have - but didn't - see this coming, and finally do something about it.
One titan isn't insurmountable, neither is two... 27?
You're right. It is an arms race. It's just funny to see how some try to pass themselves off as the ones who will lead the charge to change titans. |
Biolaja Tista
Gallente
Garoun Investment Bank
|
Posted - 2009.06.20 22:54:00 -
[54]
Edited by: Biolaja Tista on 20/06/2009 22:56:07
Quote:
Another day, another world ending disaster.
_________________
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Armoured C
Gallente
Federation of Freedom Fighters
Aggression.
|
Posted - 2009.06.20 22:58:00 -
[55]
titans arnt broken
the amount of isk in game is broken ,
if the amount of isk was the same when the first few titans were made there wouldn't be many titans.
you can easily see it is the amount of isk in game that is the problem when one man can fund a titan in which should be a alliance effort.
JOIN FOFF NOW CHAT CHANNEL FOR MORE INFO
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Armoured C
Gallente
Federation of Freedom Fighters
Aggression.
|
Posted - 2009.06.20 22:59:00 -
[56]
Edited by: Armoured C on 20/06/2009 22:59:50
titans arnt broken
the amount of isk in game is broken ,
if the amount of isk was the same when the first few titans were made there wouldn't be many titans.
you can easily see it is the amount of isk in game that is the problem when one man can fund a titan in which should be a alliance effort.
in my opinion it is not titans that is broken but empire itself
JOIN FOFF NOW CHAT CHANNEL FOR MORE INFO
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Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
|
Posted - 2009.06.21 00:09:00 -
[57]
I dont know a single person in-game who doesn't thing DDD are going to be nerfed.
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Pan Crastus
Anti-Metagaming League
|
Posted - 2009.06.21 01:13:00 -
[58]
Originally by: Ausser
We just buff the DDD to deal 1.000.000.000 dmg on each ignition.
Now the titans will kill eachother untill only one is left.
Problem solved. Profit.
First I thought this was a stupid idea because then you could just hotdrop dread fleets with 1 Titan and kill everyone, making POS warfare very difficult. But then it occurred to me that the Titan could destroy itself too when DD'ing. So, let's do this. ;-)
How to PVP: 1. buy ISK with GTCs, 2. fit cloak, learn aggro mechanics, 3. buy second account for metagaming
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Smooth Kitty
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Posted - 2009.06.21 02:13:00 -
[59]
Originally by: Armoured C
Edited by: Armoured C on 20/06/2009 22:59:50
titans arnt broken
the amount of isk in game is broken ,
if the amount of isk was the same when the first few titans were made there wouldn't be many titans.
...
This but for different reasons.
It's rather silly that a few alliances can have a separate dread fleet in every corner of eve, massive and safe (Sov 4) supercap production, capital giveaways to member, and still can't spend all the isk they generate from their moons. Seems the only way to bring down an established alliance now days is to infiltrate them or turn one of their trusted members.
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Bestofworst
Gallente
|
Posted - 2009.06.21 02:29:00 -
[60]
Originally by: Smooth Kitty
Originally by: Armoured C
Edited by: Armoured C on 20/06/2009 22:59:50
titans arnt broken
the amount of isk in game is broken ,
if the amount of isk was the same when the first few titans were made there wouldn't be many titans.
...
This but for different reasons.
It's rather silly that a few alliances can have a separate dread fleet in every corner of eve, massive and safe (Sov 4) supercap production, capital giveaways to member, and still can't spend all the isk they generate from their moons. Seems the only way to bring down an established alliance now days is to infiltrate them or turn one of their trusted members.
We need natural disasters, wormholes opening up ontop of a POS, sucking everything in it, moons dysncing out of orbit and drifting off (from a meteor hit or something)
But that is all I can think of, but I would hate a random factor be the chance of victory, but it's always better to attack a city recovering from a natural disaster.
----
My Music |
Jmanis Catharg
Caldari
Surfers Anonymous
|
Posted - 2009.06.21 02:31:00 -
[61]
Edited by: Jmanis Catharg on 21/06/2009 02:32:02
Quote:
Also why not introduce a ship specific module that blocks doomsdays, make it so you can only fit it on say command ships since HICs get primary enough as it is.
On an aside with that, how about a deployable bubble that absorbs area-effect devices, up to a certain amount of damage? Say, 100,000 HP? Like a mobile warp disruption bubble, but will suck up at least a few DDs and easily stop smartbombs, ECM bursts etc to provide a smaller scale tactical use? 5km, 10km and 20km range variants (small, med, large)
Another aside on something else you said though, I don't think removing cloaks is the answer because it'll proliferate another unwanted tactic: Loggofski.
---
Originally by: CCP Mitnal
I went to the forums for special powers and all I got was a dancing padlock and a banhammer.
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Salastil
Gallente
GoonFleet
GoonSwarm
|
Posted - 2009.06.21 02:43:00 -
[62]
Edited by: Salastil on 21/06/2009 02:43:17
Stop dancing the issue, any ship or anchorable solution you come up with will be overcome instantly. People in this game are merciless in their abuse of mechanics, anything short of removing the doomsday and changing both supercapitals to be useful will just be overcome within days of it being implemented. The day first stations hit Sov4 CCP should have realized how fast mudflation would occur.
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skilzrulz
Gallente
0neZeR0 Enterprises
|
Posted - 2009.06.21 02:46:00 -
[63]
Originally by: Chribba
How about unnerf the low-sec DD so I can get rid of them pesky NPCs roaming the belts while I mine?!!
This guy is a genius
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Trent Nichols
Di-Tron Heavy Industries
Atlas Alliance
|
Posted - 2009.06.21 03:04:00 -
[64]
Originally by: Smooth Kitty
Originally by: Armoured C
Edited by: Armoured C on 20/06/2009 22:59:50
titans arnt broken
the amount of isk in game is broken ,
if the amount of isk was the same when the first few titans were made there wouldn't be many titans.
...
This but for different reasons.
It's rather silly that a few alliances can have a separate dread fleet in every corner of eve, massive and safe (Sov 4) supercap production, capital giveaways to member, and still can't spend all the isk they generate from their moons. Seems the only way to bring down an established alliance now days is to infiltrate them or turn one of their trusted members.
I think we are getting to the root of the problem right here. Moon mining is broken - there is no way CCP isn't aware of this. If they care enough to do something about it is anyone's guess.
CCP has also been presented, by forum posters, with good ideas about how to curb the existing titans. Limiting the number of DDs per grid and having the backwash of a DD down a cyno jammer are two of my favorites.
Logistics deployables mean less grind and more pewpew! |
Myrkala
Minmatar
Aurora Acclivitous
|
Posted - 2009.06.21 03:31:00 -
[65]
Edited by: Myrkala on 21/06/2009 03:31:02
Having many titans close to each other, they should be draw to each other by forces of gravity (attraction) and crush each other into the biggest veldspar belt 0.0 has ever seen.
I mean, how heavy is a Titan actually?
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Victoria Akmea
Gallente
Taishite Kami
|
Posted - 2009.06.21 03:40:00 -
[66]
My suggestion? Switch DD workings a bit. Play it off as a doomsday is the overloading and self destruct of a titan's reactor core or something. On doomsday, the blast does massive damage, but also destroys the titan with it.
((Disclaimer: No, I'm not one for 0.0 stuff. Feel free to ignore me.))
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Major Stallion
Balls Deep Inc.
|
Posted - 2009.06.21 04:15:00 -
[67]
Originally by: Pedro Sangre
I don't think you get it. That display was fair warning to EVE & CCP.
If titans / DDs aren't fixed, we (and others too most likely) will do it in combat...repeatedly...until even your bad posting is drowned out by the screams of broken and podded pubbies.
wow...i agree with a goon. OP shut it. DD's need fixing. |
Template Girl
|
Posted - 2009.06.21 06:48:00 -
[68]
I think a simple solution is to give titans an attribute (such as due to their super huge signature size) that they absorb more DD damage (plus take damage on their own DD if this isnt already the case). This way if you light off say 5 at a time you blow up all 5 titans. But if you light off 2 at a time the titans may survive but be very low on health (easy to finish off).
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Furb Killer
Gallente
|
Posted - 2009.06.21 08:39:00 -
[69]
Originally by: Template Girl
I think a simple solution is to give titans an attribute (such as due to their super huge signature size) that they absorb more DD damage (plus take damage on their own DD if this isnt already the case). This way if you light off say 5 at a time you blow up all 5 titans. But if you light off 2 at a time the titans may survive but be very low on health (easy to finish off).
No that is a terrible idea.
Having a weapon which destroys every ship below a certain size with one push on the button without anything you can do about it is just a bad idea for a game. |
Roy Batty68
Caldari
Immortal Dead
|
Posted - 2009.06.21 11:34:00 -
[70]
Balancing a game design on the assumption of rarity has never worked for any mmo. |
Armoured C
Gallente
Federation of Freedom Fighters
Aggression.
|
Posted - 2009.06.21 11:50:00 -
[71]
hi guy brought 70 billion worth of ship hey it a hauler
¼_¼ so rediculus
dont nerf titans
JOIN FOFF NOW CHAT CHANNEL FOR MORE INFO
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Pohbis
Neo T.E.C.H.
|
Posted - 2009.06.21 12:28:00 -
[72]
Originally by: Pedro Sangre
If titans / DDs aren't fixed, we (and others too most likely) will do it in combat...repeatedly...until even your bad posting is drowned out by the screams of broken and podded pubbies.
There's a big difference between doing something on the test server and actually having the balls and ability to make it happen under real conditions.
If someone wants to put the 30ish-something Titans on the line it would take to DD a cap fleet, let them. Odds are they'll be crying sweet tears after they lose a lot more than they manage to kill. If they manage to kill anything besides support that is... |
Furb Killer
Gallente
|
Posted - 2009.06.21 14:49:00 -
[73]
Originally by: Pohbis
Originally by: Pedro Sangre
If titans / DDs aren't fixed, we (and others too most likely) will do it in combat...repeatedly...until even your bad posting is drowned out by the screams of broken and podded pubbies.
There's a big difference between doing something on the test server and actually having the balls and ability to make it happen under real conditions.
If someone wants to put the 30ish-something Titans on the line it would take to DD a cap fleet, let them. Odds are they'll be crying sweet tears after they lose a lot more than they manage to kill. If they manage to kill anything besides support that is...
You realise they did it on TQ? And i am pretty sure if kennie would have undocked some capitals from that station they would have mass doomsdayed them.
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wtbrandomnamegenerator
|
Posted - 2009.06.21 16:03:00 -
[74]
Originally by: Pohbis
There's a big difference between doing something on the test server and actually having the balls and ability to make it happen under real conditions.
If someone wants to put the 30ish-something Titans on the line it would take to DD a cap fleet, let them. Odds are they'll be crying sweet tears after they lose a lot more than they manage to kill. If they manage to kill anything besides support that is...
Your an idiot, this happened Live, in 49-
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Bismaru's Ambition
Amarr
Trigrams Edge
|
Posted - 2009.06.24 03:39:00 -
[75]
Titans suck anyway, giant ball of 'lol I told you, you should have came in something smaller', evaded 7 DD, in a command / BS, maybe you guys donĘt know how to align or fail to add titan pilots to your address book.
Just make capital ships immune to DD, and let titans work the same, I dunno just say capital parts have reflective, super thermal anti aurora second shields that are designed to reduce DD damage by 95%, only 2 titans will really be needed then and the idiots who die from them obviously werenĘt listening. Most of the whiners only saw the 16 on 1 carrier kill and got excited, titans donĘt INSTANTLY kill, you have enough time to get out if you are support and if you are a BS well unless you are bubbled (lol!) you should have been aligned.
Also PL could have easily fielded more and can right now as well as NC and the other 0.0 alliances, the reason they haven't been in fleets on 27 titans all the time is purely because it wouldnĘt end nice for them, alliance donĘt fly around in 20+ titans and they only would if they were 100% sure they were protected, the whole system at the time was practically red, most of the time they just chill with 3 ū 4 titans in bubbles :D:D
What next, "oh no titan died by 500 stealth bombers, nerf plz",.. imo motherships need a new buff and they need to be on the field more, as for titans,.. well yeah until you actually have been hit by 16 titans yourself and are NOT in PL, stfu and stop with the nerf drama. |
Ravenal
The Fated
E.Y
|
Posted - 2009.06.24 03:55:00 -
[76]
The problem has to do with scaling. When adding a feature to the game its scaling has to be considered. The DD feature is fine on its own, but scale it up by multiplying with the fleet sizes we see in EvE or nr of pilots it takes to crash a system it just gets silly.
DD works one at a time, breaks horribly when you start getting more. Any scaling fix needs to maintain their "solo" effectiveness. |
BiggestT
Caldari
Oz Space Diggers
|
Posted - 2009.06.24 04:26:00 -
[77]
Originally by: Hyveres
Just make it impossible to cloak supercapitals and their numbers will go down a bit.
Wow..
The most simple yet perfect solution! One may not even need a dd change..Though i'd still prefer that as well..
EVE history
t2 precisions |
Comodore John
|
Posted - 2009.06.24 04:53:00 -
[78]
Originally by: Crackzilla
Edited by: Crackzilla on 19/06/2009 19:48:37
4) Give Chribba a titan in high sec
Quote:
best idea ever imo, chribba already has a revelation in amarr, why not give him his avatar there also?
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Furb Killer
Gallente
|
Posted - 2009.06.24 07:29:00 -
[79]
Originally by: BiggestT
Originally by: Hyveres
Just make it impossible to cloak supercapitals and their numbers will go down a bit.
Wow..
The most simple yet perfect solution! One may not even need a dd change..Though i'd still prefer that as well..
No it is also a terrible solution. Then there still is the "i win" button in game which kills basicly everything on grid.
And who has the need to cloak their titan when you got 27 of them? There are enough ways that you can get arround the lack of cloak, and with 26 friends they dont have to worry that much about getting tackled.
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Manterror
|
Posted - 2009.06.24 09:24:00 -
[80]
the longer its left unchecked, the more time pilots have to train the skills, and eventually 0.0 will just be filled with Titans.
I dont want to pvp in a galaxy where the BS is made redundant. period.
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Rua
Caldari Provisions
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Posted - 2009.06.24 09:41:00 -
[81]
Make titans moving space stations that can't cloak or enter pos shields, remove pos from sov mechanics and change sov to work based on titans...
No more doomsdays and no more shooting at stupid pos towers, instead your shooting at some dudes titan while a fleet trys to keep him alive, mass fleet battle ensues and everyone has fun.
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Epofhis
hirr
Morsus Mihi
|
Posted - 2009.06.24 09:43:00 -
[82]
I was on Goon TS when the 27 DD salute went off in 49-. The whole time, the titan pilots involved didn't know whether the DD chain would destroy them all or not.
DD's don't need to be nerfed. The application of titans in general needs to be rethought. I've read some good ideas about what should be done, and to my mind the option of adding a script to make a DD a focused beam (read: pos and capital destroyer) would be the way to go. Titans have slots for capital sized weapons... why don't they ever get used? Because it makes more sense to fit officer SB's and neuts to clean off any tacklers. This is just, as stated before, the players who fly these ships making the best tactical decisions based on what they are likely to come up against. This issue doesn't need a nerf, it needs a change of doctrine.
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ovenproofjet
Caldari
Swords of Clarity
Galactic Federation of Varied Operations
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Posted - 2009.06.24 10:31:00 -
[83]
Wait who's nerfing big boobs?!!!! DD's must be repected!!
Oh wait....you mean titans, yeah nerf away at them, the fact that anyone can afford to bring that many doomsdays to one place means that the titan is no longer filling the role CCP intended. It was designed to be the flagship of an ALLIANCES fleet. Now it seems even individuals can own two (yes I'm refering to Chribba, but he's kind of an exception!), so perhaps make them a damn side more expensive. Why not make them need T2 components like jump freighters do? That would certainly bump up the asking price for one and make Shrike think twice before losing another four  |
Acop
|
Posted - 2009.06.24 12:17:00 -
[84]
Just a thought: What if titans were locked down for 5-10 minutes just like cyno field generating ships? Prevent them from warping/jumping for a few minutes after the DD has been fired.
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Furb Killer
Gallente
|
Posted - 2009.06.24 12:35:00 -
[85]
That is a terrible idea. Then you still have a way in game to destroy an entire fleet with one push on a button. That is just a terrible idea. (Not to mention with 30 titans who is going to tackle them anyway? If they are stuck for 5 minutes and you warp your dread fleet on them you lose your dread fleet to the other titans).
Quote:
The whole time, the titan pilots involved didn't know whether the DD chain would destroy them all or not.
DD's don't need to be nerfed.
Sorry i dont believe even goon titan pilots can be that stupid. Do 27 times 65k (roughly damage of a doomsday), and look if that number is smaller or larger than your ehp. You will notice it is far smaller than their ehp. Not to mention that the doomsdays werent fired at the same time. If a group of titans would get too low HP left they would have just stopped the other doomsdays from firing.
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fencer35
|
Posted - 2009.06.24 12:44:00 -
[86]
Quote:
Rock Paper Shotgun.
In other words, a new ship or ships. A designated titan killer. It doesnt need to be bigger just specialized to be a big problem for titans and can rock paper scissored by something already in game.
Yes !!!!! I like it
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