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What is the point of High Sec?

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Alavaria Fera GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 919	Posted - 2012.05.28 14:20:00 - [31] - Quote Tippia wrote: Eva Rourge wrote: i personally have no bias. Unlikely. You wouldn't use the phrase GÇ£getting warmerGÇ£ unless you have already made up your mind about what the GÇ£correctGÇ¥ answer is. Quote: Actually if cost becomes irrelevant then your statement simply means that highsec is a place where you gamble on people's miserliness at the risk of aggression. Good thing, then, that nothing of the sort happens. The means highsec remains a place where aggression comes at a cost and that you can keep gamble on people's miserliness and hope it's enough to keep you safe. Totally believing the unbiased person who just wants a safer highsec. Yep, oh and did you hear about - Those who cannot adapt become victims of Evolugalbugaslugakjlwsdhvbzxd
Merovee Gorthaur Legion Of Mordor 17	Posted - 2012.05.28 14:21:00 - [32] - Quote Hi-sec is formal pvp/pve (industrial, Market, trade and thuggery) and a great place to be even with the risks.
Eva Rourge 5	Posted - 2012.05.28 14:22:00 - [33] - Quote Tippia wrote: Eva Rourge wrote: i personally have no bias. Unlikely. You wouldn't use the phrase GÇ£getting warmerGÇ£ unless you have already made up your mind about what the GÇ£correctGÇ¥ answer is. Quote: Actually if cost becomes irrelevant then your statement simply means that highsec is a place where you gamble on people's miserliness at the risk of aggression. Good thing, then, that nothing of the sort happens. That means highsec remains a place where aggression comes at a cost and that you can keep gamble on people's miserliness and hope it's enough to keep you safe. Nope, i have not made up my mind but i do have a guess. By warmer i simply mean we are getting constructive replies. Honestly, i've never mined in my life and i don't inted to. I do not care about bears as i do not care about gankers, i associate myself with neither. J'ai bien assez vecuGÇª
Sentient Blade Walk It Off Imperial Ascension 407	Posted - 2012.05.28 14:23:00 - [34] - Quote Highsec is a barrier that ensures no one group can ever completely control EvE to the detriment of everyone else.
Tippia Sunshine and Lollipops 7443	Posted - 2012.05.28 14:23:00 - [35] - Quote Eva Rourge wrote: Nope, i have not made up my mind but i do have a guess. Then nothing is GÇ£getting warmerGÇ¥. Quote: By warmer i simply mean we are getting constructive replies. Equally unlikely. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥ Shift-click does nothing GÇö why the Unified Inventory isn't ready for primetime.
Alavaria Fera GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 919	Posted - 2012.05.28 14:25:00 - [36] - Quote Tippia wrote: Eva Rourge wrote: Nope, i have not made up my mind but i do have a guess. Then nothing is GÇ£getting warmerGÇ¥. Quote: By warmer i simply mean we are getting constructive replies. Equally unlikely. Their, uh, *intent* is showing. Those who cannot adapt become victims of Evolugalbugaslugakjlwsdhvbzxd
Eva Rourge 5	Posted - 2012.05.28 14:26:00 - [37] - Quote Tippia wrote: Eva Rourge wrote: Nope, i have not made up my mind but i do have a guess. Then nothing is GÇ£getting warmerGÇ¥. Quote: By warmer i simply mean we are getting constructive replies. Equally unlikely. It's ok, really, no need to explain further. You don't like the fact that i poked a hole through your statement and since you can not argue it any further you have to question the reasoning behind my question. Perfectly understood. Now unless you have any proof that i side with either bears or gankers lets just move along. Thanks. J'ai bien assez vecuGÇª
Eva Rourge 5	Posted - 2012.05.28 14:27:00 - [38] - Quote Alavaria Fera wrote: Tippia wrote: Eva Rourge wrote: Nope, i have not made up my mind but i do have a guess. Then nothing is GÇ£getting warmerGÇ¥. Quote: By warmer i simply mean we are getting constructive replies. Equally unlikely. Their, uh, *intent* is showing. Oh hey there. Glad you joined the discussion. Perhaps you could give me an idea of what you consider high sec to be. J'ai bien assez vecuGÇª
Makkz Lamorei Prosapia Vexillum 4	Posted - 2012.05.28 14:29:00 - [39] - Quote High sec is the place where npc's have a form of control, it is "relatively" safe, it is where warfare is done legally by paying of the cops, but more importantly, its where capital ships controlled by players cant go.
Jake Warbird Republic Military School Minmatar Republic 1227	Posted - 2012.05.28 14:29:00 - [40] - Quote You have enough constructive answers. What is the point of this thread?
Tippia Sunshine and Lollipops 7443	Posted - 2012.05.28 14:31:00 - [41] - Quote Eva Rourge wrote: You don't like the fact that i poked a hole through your statement What fact would that be that I don't like? After all, you didn't really poke hole in anything so you must be talking about something else. vOv Also, I can't really argue further since you've offered no counter-argument. The actual fact remains: highsec is a place where aggression comes at a cost. Whether or not that cost is relative or approaches zero (and these days, it cannot be zero) doesn't in any way change this fact. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥ Shift-click does nothing GÇö why the Unified Inventory isn't ready for primetime.
Eva Rourge 5	Posted - 2012.05.28 14:31:00 - [42] - Quote Jake Warbird wrote: You have enough constructive answers. What is the point of this thread? Glad you asked. The point is: with all the noise around ganking and mining and bears and goons and whatnot - does anyone actually understand what this particular environment is supposed to represent and what one should actually expect of it? J'ai bien assez vecuGÇª
Tippia Sunshine and Lollipops 7443	Posted - 2012.05.28 14:33:00 - [43] - Quote Eva Rourge wrote: The point is: with all the noise around ganking and mining and bears and goons and whatnot - does anyone actually understand what this particular environment is supposed to represent and what one should actually expect of it? Most people do, yes. The rest whine. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥ Shift-click does nothing GÇö why the Unified Inventory isn't ready for primetime.
Snow Burst RED.OverLord 29	Posted - 2012.05.28 14:36:00 - [44] - Quote Eva Rourge wrote: No wall of text here, just a simple question. A clear one sentence reply would benice. Edit: Since i've gotten a few replies suggesting that this is a thread about how safe high sec needs to be... let me add the following to my original question: Do we really need high sec at all? lol! ******** thread high sec is for the fw and such god i cant believe this was asked lol There Is A 90% Chance All Of What You Just Read Is Wrong, Inaccurate Or Just Me Being Controversial In Some Way.-áOr By Some Chance It's Completely Right In Every Way... At Least To Me :3
Khadann First Legion 19	Posted - 2012.05.28 14:37:00 - [45] - Quote what is the rate of player's produced items in high sec against low and null sec? Is it like 80% of goods produced in high sec? We need this backbone which is high sec: Imagine jita under 0.0 and all other systems. You won't be able to find a single neutral place to buy, build or sell your stuff. Maybe we could make all eve 0.0, but that means you can not survive in midle size corporations At the end, the game will just be 4 giant coalitions with territories and agreements... sounds even more boring than high sec :s
Vyl Vit Cambio Enterprises 534	Posted - 2012.05.28 14:39:00 - [46] - Quote Hi. I just had my 57th birthday. Thanks. I've been playing "Chew The Opposition Into Little Pieces" for more than forty years. I'm a chess master - basketball player for 17 years, football for 12, baseball for 20. I can roast you in bridge, spades, gin rummy, MONOPOLY, double-board Risk. In fact, I've spent my entire life in unbridled competition with one thought in mind, "Winning isn't everything. It's the only thing. You might imagine with so much win/loss, reams of scores, several major INJURIES, my adrenalin pumping, stick it to the enemy days of glory are about over. I've had my run. However, playing isn't. Playing is good for the mind. Einstein said intelligent people need to play. When I found EVE Online I found something where I can make a contribution and let the other folks have their time with going for each other's throats. It just so happens, I can do my bit to contribute in high sec. I don't pick high sec cause it's safe. I pick it cause it's practical. I get what I'm doing done there, so there's where I do it. What I don't get is, why are there people who want things all their own way to such an extreme that they'd contort this sandbox into their own personal, custom made, suit only me environment and tell everybody else to just go get lost? I shall not humble myself to such selfish people. The PvP end of this game has nothing in it to match the RL PvP I've done in four decades (and I've got the scars to prove it), so making some claim the world revolves around this handful of folks (to me) is no more than average doo doo ka ka. So I ask, "What is the point of your question, and who are "you" to ask?" Anyone with any sense has already left town.
Eva Rourge 5	Posted - 2012.05.28 14:41:00 - [47] - Quote Tippia wrote: Eva Rourge wrote: The point is: with all the noise around ganking and mining and bears and goons and whatnot - does anyone actually understand what this particular environment is supposed to represent and what one should actually expect of it? Most people do, yes. The rest whine. Agreed. Thus the fact that some guy who actually takes the time to write a long letter explaining how being a business man he prefers to mine and whatever it is that he does: clearly does not represent failure of other players or the game itself but perhaps failure of CCP marketing? CCP: what did you invision high sec to be? What do you see it being now? Could we let the cat out of the bag already and let our new subs know that high sec isnt the PvE "realm" and losing your beloved mining barge isn't an accident but rather the logical finale or the sum of all of your actions which you've amounted to? J'ai bien assez vecuGÇª
Malcanis Vanishing Point. The Initiative. 3976	Posted - 2012.05.28 14:41:00 - [48] - Quote Eva Rourge wrote: Warpshade wrote: Imho high sec adds a different layer of PvP, whether it be wardeccing, suicide ganking or criminal flagging. Interesting point. Thus high sec is really not safe at all, is it? In fact it really does not differ much from low sec except for the circumstances surrounding your death. Correct. All areas of EVE support non-consensual combat PvP, with high sec having the most complex and restrictive rules of engagement, and 0.0 having no rules at all. As Tippia correctly states, attemtping non-consensual PvP in hi-sec comes at a cost; you can either pay CONCORD to look the other way while you make war on another corp; you can allow or entice another player to steal your property from a jet-can; you can have killrights from previously losing a ship; or you can accept that CONCORD will destroy your ship. With respect to that final cost, if the target makes himself a sufficiently vulnerable, valuable target, then it becomes economic to to gank him for a profit. Fortunately, it is generally possible to improve the survivability of your ship (or use a ship with better options) to make ganking uneconomic. For instance, a Hulk can be tanked to the point where it requires 2 battlecruisers to kill it, with a net cost to the attackers of well in excess of 100 million ISK, more than they can reasonably hope to recover. Malcanis' Law: Any proposal justified on the basis that "it will benefit new players" is invariably to the greater advantage of older, richer players. Things to do in EVE:-áhttp://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/
Aeryn Sun Aumer Celestial Fox Reconnaissance 0	Posted - 2012.05.28 14:44:00 - [49] - Quote Make every system null sec and be done with it.
Snow Burst RED.OverLord 29	Posted - 2012.05.28 14:46:00 - [50] - Quote Aeryn Sun Aumer wrote: Make every system null sec and be done with it. -1 stupid idea wud ruin eve There Is A 90% Chance All Of What You Just Read Is Wrong, Inaccurate Or Just Me Being Controversial In Some Way.-áOr By Some Chance It's Completely Right In Every Way... At Least To Me :3
Eva Rourge 5	Posted - 2012.05.28 14:46:00 - [51] - Quote Vyl Vit wrote: So I ask, "What is the point of your question, and who are "you" to ask?" I am the average Eve player but wait... what does your age have anything to do with anything rather than your age and who are you to ask me who i am? I'm 39, i like to listen to Muse and enjoy firearms competitively. I have 2 children and am at this very moment pouring myself a glass of scotch. Anything else? J'ai bien assez vecuGÇª
Francisco Bizzaro 132	Posted - 2012.05.28 14:46:00 - [52] - Quote Eva Rourge wrote: Jake Warbird wrote: You have enough constructive answers. What is the point of this thread? Glad you asked. The point is: with all the noise around ganking and mining and bears and goons and whatnot - does anyone actually understand what this particular environment is supposed to represent and what one should actually expect of it? Why should we expect anything? It's a sandbox, so what happens happens. Quote: I'll go further: could it be that instead of "fixing" high sec so that "everyone" feels comfortable the only thing that is needed is a clear warning label? Do new/casual/whatever players actually understand what they are stepping into when they undock for the very first time? I agree with this. But doesn't the warning already exist? The promos market Eve as a harsh universe. The tutorials are also pretty clear on the point, from what I recall. Part of the trouble is that people don't believe what they are being told no matter how often you tell them. Probably our comprehension has been numbed by years of video game advertisement where a game like WoW is marketed as a world at war when actually is a pretty organized and civil place. So among the expectations that they bring to Eve is that all this stuff about the "harsh universe" is just a bunch of hype that doesn't need to be taken seriously. A lot of Eve hype doesn't need to be taken seriously - but at least that one point is somewhat accurate.
Jake Warbird Republic Military School Minmatar Republic 1229	Posted - 2012.05.28 14:48:00 - [53] - Quote I'm pretty much under the 1 year bracket of players and I understand the risks of undocking... Regardless of sec your ship is going to go boom. The sooner we come to terms with that fact the easier Eve is going to be.
Snow Burst RED.OverLord 29	Posted - 2012.05.28 14:48:00 - [54] - Quote Eva Rourge wrote: Vyl Vit wrote: So I ask, "What is the point of your question, and who are "you" to ask?" I am the average Eve player but wait... what does your age have anything to do with anything rather than your age and who are you to ask me who i am? I'm 39, i like to listen to Muse and enjoy firearms competitively. I have 2 children and am at this very moment pouring myself a glass of scotch. Anything else? no one cares... he asked why shud you be the sole voice of the people There Is A 90% Chance All Of What You Just Read Is Wrong, Inaccurate Or Just Me Being Controversial In Some Way.-áOr By Some Chance It's Completely Right In Every Way... At Least To Me :3
Vincent Athena V.I.C.E. Comic Mischief 679	Posted - 2012.05.28 14:49:00 - [55] - Quote High sec is a place for people who do like SiFi spaceship games, but do not get "The Rush" to play. Just in case you do not quite get what I mean by The Rush: The Rush is a good felling one gets with and after a burst of adrenaline associated with an exciting experience, like PvP combat. Not everyone gets The Rush. Some get no pleasure from adrenaline, and some actually feel bad or sick from it. According to Dr. Drew Pinsky, the difference between these people is genetic. You are born to get The Rush, or you are not. The result is some players will not enjoy PvP and actively seek to avoid it, and no amount of game tweaking will change that, because game tweaking will not change their genes. After all this is a game, people will tend to avoid game activities that make them sick. Instead they do cooperative activities, industry, missions and the like, or just play as solo players. People who do not get The Rush can also enjoy activities like fishing, a sport that is more popular that any computer game, even WoW. Or puzzle games, or solitaire, or Golf (one of the most popular pastimes on the planet). These players like an activity that occupies the mind, is relaxing, and gives one a gentle feeling of accomplishment as they watch the isk pile up. For them, a certain amount of repetition is not boring, its reassuring and relaxing. As most people do not get The Rush, there is in fact a majority of EvE players in high sec. Retaining these players is good for CCP's income, which keeps them from going bankrupt. http://vincentoneve.wordpress.com/
Aeryn Sun Aumer Celestial Fox Reconnaissance 0	Posted - 2012.05.28 14:50:00 - [56] - Quote Snow Burst wrote: Aeryn Sun Aumer wrote: Make every system null sec and be done with it. -1 stupid idea wud ruin eve Why, that is what CCP wants, ruthless PVP. What would harbor that more than making every system null sec. 0t would prevent mining, carebears and whining. Everything people ***** about.
Darth Tickles Dark Sun Consortium 452	Posted - 2012.05.28 14:50:00 - [57] - Quote Aeryn Sun Aumer wrote: Make every system null sec and be done with it. I gotta say, all else being equal, when I think about what the trade hubs in a fully 0.0 game would be like I get pretty engorged. The funny thing is the incentives for creating a secure free trade zone would be enough that the biggest power players would probably be nrds. Unfortunately the game would die without a hisec for beginners and casuals.
Jake Warbird Republic Military School Minmatar Republic 1229	Posted - 2012.05.28 14:50:00 - [58] - Quote Vyl Vit wrote: Hi. I just had my 57th birthday. Thanks. Wow a RL bitter vet! j/k Happy Bday,sir! Hope you had a good one!
March rabbit Trojan Trolls Red Alliance 180	Posted - 2012.05.28 14:51:00 - [59] - Quote just a simple question: why the biggest trade hub is Jita and not some ass of 0.0 space like 1A8-? I'm pretty sure if you try to answer this question you will understand what high-sec is needed for.
Bad Messenger draketrain Confederation of xXPIZZAXx 139	Posted - 2012.05.28 14:51:00 - [60] - Quote Question is wrong, why we need 0.0 is proper question.

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