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CrazySpaceHobo
Caldari
Mysterys Inc.
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Posted - 2009.09.16 01:27:00 -
[91]
 Originally by: Julian Lynq
a bpo holder can become an inventor as he wishes.
he could make a decision for a certain item and be going tommorow.
an inventor cannot do that.
he needs the luck of someone selling him his bpo. and he does not have the choice that the bpo holder has. some t2 bpo's are just "priceless" and not ever being sold.
overall an inventor needs to put much more effort into becoming a t2 bpo holder and produce from it in a profitable way than what it takes for a bpo holder to become an efficient inventor.
Priceless? Incorrect, everything and everyone has their price. What you mean is, you dont have the money to pay that price.
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Julian Lynq
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Posted - 2009.09.16 07:32:00 -
[92]
Originally by: CrazySpaceHobo
Originally by: Julian Lynq
a bpo holder can become an inventor as he wishes.
he could make a decision for a certain item and be going tommorow.
an inventor cannot do that.
he needs the luck of someone selling him his bpo. and he does not have the choice that the bpo holder has. some t2 bpo's are just "priceless" and not ever being sold.
overall an inventor needs to put much more effort into becoming a t2 bpo holder and produce from it in a profitable way than what it takes for a bpo holder to become an efficient inventor.
Priceless? Incorrect, everything and everyone has their price. What you mean is, you dont have the money to pay that price.
if the price is equal to 20 years of speculated profit from it, that is the same as "priceless". stupidly high price == no price.
imagine you wanted to buy my character. i tell you "sorry dude, my character is not for sale - it is priceless". you then go on and on about it and i say "well, ok. i'll sell it to you for 5000bn isk. it has a price now. not my fault if you cannot afford it."
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HankMurphy
Minmatar
Pelennor Swarm
THE KLINGONS
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Posted - 2009.09.16 07:49:00 -
[93]
no need to make the argument more complex than it is.
no one should have an inexhaustible resource. especially one that can no longer be obtained through the game. (no, buying them from someone else isn't obtaining them through the game.)
they need to be removed convert them to 100run bpcs or what have you
collectors items? sure. but its not a collectors item, its a resource (you cant make more fed megas out of a fed mega).
most ppl paid money for them? too bad. name one instance where player investment played any part in CCP game decisions
why remove them when most production is done by bpcs? great question. just as good as, say, why keep them when most production is done by bpcs?
these items were replaced by invention and left in the game so that the conversion from the old lottery system to the new invention based went smoothly w/o destroying the market. the conversion is done, it's time they disappeared. isk invested, the bpos 'real' value, the % of market produced by them... none of these things have anything to do with the discussion.
i don't think i've heard one valid reason here to keep them. that's probably because there isn't one.
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Hey, sewer rat may taste like pumpkin pie, but I'd never know 'cause I wouldn't eat the filthy mother*****r |
Junko Togawa
Caldari
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Posted - 2009.09.16 07:54:00 -
[94]
*sips thread* Yes, this whine is aging nicely. Let it breathe some more and I'll enjoy it with a nice Camembert and some wheat crackers... 
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buttesauce
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Posted - 2009.09.16 08:11:00 -
[95]
the argument about removing t2 bpos recause they are outdated and made useless is a good one. theres no need for em.
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Governor LePetomane
Rock Ridge Brokerage Solutions
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Posted - 2009.09.16 08:28:00 -
[96]
Originally by: HankMurphy
i don't think i've heard one valid reason here to keep them. that's probably because there isn't one.
There isn't really a valid reason to get rid of them either, frankly. Over time they'll eventually go inactive, get banned or get asploded, and in the meantime their effect on the market is in all likelihood wildly exaggerated.
But actually therein lies the valid reason to keep them: watching somebody go OMG T2 BPOS TEH EBIL every couple of months is still vastly entertaining.
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Shadowsword
Epsilon Lyr
Tau Ceti Federation
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Posted - 2009.09.16 08:33:00 -
[97]
Edited by: Shadowsword on 16/09/2009 08:33:29
Originally by: Professor Tarantula
I've yet to see any T2 Drone BPO's for sale, anywhere, for some reason people don't want to part with their limited edition items. And like i said, i find it too much of a bother to keep messing around with copies instead of just having a BPO i can research and use indefinitely.
/more coffee is required
Here a Drone BPO for sale: http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1178223
If you're serious about wanting to get rid of T2 bpos, buy it and trash it.
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Rellik B00n
Lethal Death Squad
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Posted - 2009.09.16 09:01:00 -
[98]
Originally by: Irida Mershkov
Originally by: Rellik B00n
Edited by: Rellik B00n on 15/09/2009 11:40:50The only value attributed to these in-game items has been placed on them by players./url]
I'm not sure I'm reading this right? but isn't this generally the idea? It being a Player-Driven MMO.
sweet! 4 pages lol!
to answer: you are indeed reading it right.
So in game terms the BPOs are worth? Thats right zero, nothing, zip.
In player terms they are worth? 5x one years profit or some such bull****.
therefore all arguments vis-a-vis "I spent all this ISK on one" or "why not go out and buy one" mean nothing and CCP removing T2 BPOs from the game is the same as CCP removing exotic dancers from the game.
I bet there would be a far greater whine thread about dancers tho 
+
LDS @ Bclnc
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Mecinia Lua
Galactic Express
Burning Horizons
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Posted - 2009.09.16 10:06:00 -
[99]
You have to understand it isn't the t2 BPOs themselves that are making it more expensive to buy t2 ships than the invent and build them.
The main bottleneck is Dyspro. However Dominion is going to attempt to address this somewhat.
Thoughts expressed are mine and mine alone. They do not necessarily reflect my alliances thoughts.
Your signature is too large. Please resize it to a maximum of 400 x 120 with the file size not exceeding 24000 bytes. -Mitnal |
HankMurphy
Minmatar
Pelennor Swarm
THE KLINGONS
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Posted - 2009.09.16 10:23:00 -
[100]
lets beat this dead horse!
Originally by: Governor LePetomane
There isn't really a valid reason to get rid of them either, frankly. Over time they'll eventually go inactive, get banned or get asploded, and in the meantime their effect on the market is in all likelihood wildly exaggerated.
VALID REASON It's an inexhaustible resource no longer capable of being gained through any act of game play (only through a player-player transaction).
Originally by: Rellik B00n
CCP removing T2 BPOs from the game is the same as CCP removing exotic dancers from the game.
you make a bold argument. i do like strippers.
You can't make t2 ship/items/ammo out of exotic dancers. i hope you can see how this might make things different.
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Hey, sewer rat may taste like pumpkin pie, but I'd never know 'cause I wouldn't eat the filthy mother*****r |
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Mifter Hogdido
Amarr
The 0ri
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Posted - 2009.09.16 10:52:00 -
[101]
No, simply no. 
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Pipboy2K
Divine Retribution
Sons of Tangra
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Posted - 2009.09.16 10:54:00 -
[102]
Originally by: HankMurphy
You can't make t2 ship/items/ammo out of exotic dancers. i hope you can see how this might make things different.
fail, ships arent made out of bpos either, they are made out of materials :P
joke aside... i dont understand why people still complain about t2 bpos.
have you guys ever calculated how much profit in % you do per month compared to the invest? i by myself rather sold my t2 bpos to get the cash. some (simple) maths for you guys: you do about 1.666% profit/month with a ROI of 5 years.... FRAKKIN 1.666%!!!!!
i did a ****load more with t2 component production (i made 20b in t2 components after 1 1/2 months with an invest of about 100b)
you probably come up with the argument "but hey, i can still sell the bpo after that" sure, of course you can, but after those 5 years, where you finally got 50b cash and your 50b bpo (with the luck the item never gets nerfed in the time), im already at 500b+. t2 bpos would only be unfair if there were no better ways to make money in those volumes. atm they are just a prestige object.
to those roleplayes ala "but i want to build t2 ships, and i want to produce them from t2 bpos"... im the big bad mofo gouvenor of eve, loving tasty carebear tears, who denies you the right to build t2 ships from t2 bpos, unless you pay me 50b isk. then you will get one from me. if you dont have the cash, keep crying... enough RP for you?
War, war never changes |
Ryoji Tanakama
Caldari
Firestar Drive Yards
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Posted - 2009.09.16 11:10:00 -
[103]
Originally by: Kalintos Tyl
Originally by: Ryoji Tanakama
Invention is more profitable than production from a t2 bpo.
So why exactly do they need to be removed when they provide no particular benefit beyond a slightly different procedure of manufacture?
They provide mineral efficiency per unit but severely restrict the number of units per hour, this means vastly fewer units to market, which ultimately means slower profit.
Leave t2 bpos as they are.
And nope, i dont own a single t2 bpo.
I'd quite like to hold on to my little invention advantage tyvm.
T2 BPO dont use research slots, being 2x time efficent per manufacturing slot being 40% cheaper to make ( ships), no need to make copies ( you need pos or 1 week wait ). Wait invention is better how ?
Duh...
I can make 10 at a time? Deliver at least five times as many to market in any given period.
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N Ano
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Posted - 2009.09.16 11:28:00 -
[104]
**** you op 
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Ryoji Tanakama
Caldari
Firestar Drive Yards
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Posted - 2009.09.16 11:28:00 -
[105]
Originally by: Rellik B00n
Originally by: Irida Mershkov
Originally by: Rellik B00n
Edited by: Rellik B00n on 15/09/2009 11:40:50The only value attributed to these in-game items has been placed on them by players./url]
I'm not sure I'm reading this right? but isn't this generally the idea? It being a Player-Driven MMO.
sweet! 4 pages lol!
to answer: you are indeed reading it right.
So in game terms the BPOs are worth? Thats right zero, nothing, zip.
In player terms they are worth? 5x one years profit or some such bull****.
therefore all arguments vis-a-vis "I spent all this ISK on one" or "why not go out and buy one" mean nothing and CCP removing T2 BPOs from the game is the same as CCP removing exotic dancers from the game.
I bet there would be a far greater whine thread about dancers tho
No its more similar to CCP making a change so that every ship you spend ISK on is no longer flyable, and just has to sit in your hangar looking pretty.
People spent tens of billions on their t2 BPOs. The market is clearly totally controlled by invention (check the prices on items before and after invention). You're not going to convince CCP to remove them because you have sour grapes, but these days they dont even offer any meaningful advantage.
If you believe that making a bigger profit on 1 unit is better than making a lesser profit on 10 units then you're dead wrong. All that matters is isk profit over time. A much higher profit over time is achievable through invention, therefore the inventor gets rich very quickly while the BPO holder still has to wait 3 more years to get a single isk of profit whatsoever.
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Mihali
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Posted - 2009.09.16 12:19:00 -
[106]
Simple, they won't & it's been discussed ober & ober again. If you want one, save up to buy one. There is always at least a few on contact.
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