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Jodie Amille
Rifters
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Posted - 2009.09.22 12:10:00 -
[61]
Edited by: Jodie Amille on 22/09/2009 12:33:58
The amarr blob, the minmatar blob. From what I've seen these days the amarr seem to blob more. It was brought about by the minmatar blobbing more earlier.
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Zen Guerrilla
Minmatar
Mindfunk
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Posted - 2009.09.22 22:52:00 -
[62]
I predict that after tonight the Amarr will not find anything to fight for quite some time. At least those in the EU timezone.
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Pew pew!
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Ambo
I've Got Nothing
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Posted - 2009.09.23 10:43:00 -
[63]
 Originally by: Zen Guerrilla
I predict that after tonight the Amarr will not find anything to fight for quite some time. At least those in the EU timezone.
*checks KB.
Wow, minnies got owned yesterday.
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Morphisat
Hidden Agenda
Deep Space Engineering
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Posted - 2009.09.23 10:50:00 -
[64]
Originally by: Zen Guerrilla
I predict that after tonight the Amarr will not find anything to fight for quite some time. At least those in the EU timezone.
And why would that be ?
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BattleStar Crusader
Amarr
Absinthe Brothers Consortium
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Posted - 2009.09.23 11:05:00 -
[65]
Edited by: BattleStar Crusader on 23/09/2009 11:05:47
Edited by: BattleStar Crusader on 23/09/2009 11:05:33
The fight last night was an absolute sluaghter. Fair play to the minmitar fc who decided to stay and fight but seriousley you need to train your scouts or get new ones. When your fleet was spotted 3 different fleets converged on your position. The first was the R.S.M hac fleet who gave the intel to me, i then formed an ab-c batleship fleet. Initial plan was to come and screw you over by ourselves but we realsied the militia had a fleet and we all worked together. In the end we all jumped into you guys from kourm knowing the Auga gate was HUGE and that all the rr would be like 50km away from each other.
You put up a valient effort and i salute you for that, and warping in the battleships late in the fight would of helped if it were sooner. All in all a good fight :)
The next thing i would like to poing out is that you primaried a damnation ???? why would you do that.....?
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Zen Guerrilla
Minmatar
Mindfunk
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Posted - 2009.09.23 13:26:00 -
[66]
Originally by: BattleStar Crusader
Edited by: BattleStar Crusader on 23/09/2009 11:05:47
Edited by: BattleStar Crusader on 23/09/2009 11:05:33
The fight last night was an absolute sluaghter. Fair play to the minmitar fc who decided to stay and fight but seriousley you need to train your scouts or get new ones. When your fleet was spotted 3 different fleets converged on your position. The first was the R.S.M hac fleet who gave the intel to me, i then formed an ab-c batleship fleet. Initial plan was to come and screw you over by ourselves but we realsied the militia had a fleet and we all worked together. In the end we all jumped into you guys from kourm knowing the Auga gate was HUGE and that all the rr would be like 50km away from each other.
You put up a valient effort and i salute you for that, and warping in the battleships late in the fight would of helped if it were sooner. All in all a good fight :)
The next thing i would like to poing out is that you primaried a damnation ???? why would you do that.....?
The worlds best primary calling wouldn't have saved us there. :)
Awesome fight tho and no lag at all on my side.
But please, "all the RR"? We barely had 10 BS'es. When you went on the way, we had NONE. The whole fleet was BC and down and we only just shipped up right before the engagement. Once again you brought an absolute overkill fleet. That really is the only thing that ****es me off. In the end this will stop the Minnie side from forming proper fleets at all. And then there's nothing left to do but plex. :(
And i still don't know how we didn't see the rest of your guys coming. Our scouts really sucked there.
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Pew pew!
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Mutnin
Mutineers
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Posted - 2009.09.23 15:08:00 -
[67]
Edited by: Mutnin on 23/09/2009 15:09:20
Originally by: Zen Guerrilla
The worlds best primary calling wouldn't have saved us there. :)
Awesome fight tho and no lag at all on my side.
But please, "all the RR"? We barely had 10 BS'es. When you went on the way, we had NONE. The whole fleet was BC and down and we only just shipped up right before the engagement. Once again you brought an absolute overkill fleet. That really is the only thing that ****es me off. In the end this will stop the Minnie side from forming proper fleets at all. And then there's nothing left to do but plex. :(
And i still don't know how we didn't see the rest of your guys coming. Our scouts really sucked there.
It's because the only way Amarr will ever fight is if they have over whelming numbers or much better ships. I just looked at the KB, he had 20 more people in his gang and braging that is was 3 gangs converging on one. Then wonders why they won. If roles were reversed and Minmatar clearly had more in their gang the Amarr would have never left high sec.
Amarr are always the same, they sit in high sec all day, while the Minmatar get bored twiddling their thumbs and chasing around a WT here or there. Then just about the time the Minmatar gangs are ready to disband, the Amarr blob comes along. Always of course with over kill yet the Minmatar typically fight them anyway, simply because that how Minmatar are.
If the Minmatar happen to beat them in the smaller gang, then Amarr go into hiding for hours if not til the next day. If the Amarr happen to win, they show up on the forums gloating how great they are because they won a fight with 20 more guys than the other side had.
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Mutnin
Mutineers
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Posted - 2009.09.23 15:14:00 -
[68]
Edited by: Mutnin on 23/09/2009 15:17:46
Originally by: Jodie Amille
Edited by: Jodie Amille on 22/09/2009 12:33:58
The amarr blob, the minmatar blob. From what I've seen these days the amarr seem to blob more. It was brought about by the minmatar blobbing more earlier.
Actually, well before your old corp joined FW Amarr used to blob all day long during the UK time zone. Then Minmatar would blob all night long during the US time zone, so it was fairly equal blobbing pretty much non stop with just the role reversing depending what time zone it was.
Now it's just less profound in the differences, because Minmatar can pull some UK time zone fleets and Amarr can pull some US time zone fleets. About the time you guys showed up was when Amarr started getting more active in the US time zone and has been somewhat active since then.
Meanwhile in the same time period the Minmatar have lost a lot of FC's whom likely got tired of being hounded for fleets the moment they signed on.
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In4r4
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Posted - 2009.09.23 17:08:00 -
[69]
Originally by: Mutnin
Edited by: Mutnin on 23/09/2009 15:17:46
Originally by: Jodie Amille
Edited by: Jodie Amille on 22/09/2009 12:33:58
The amarr blob, the minmatar blob. From what I've seen these days the amarr seem to blob more. It was brought about by the minmatar blobbing more earlier.
Actually, well before your old corp joined FW Amarr used to blob all day long during the UK time zone. Then Minmatar would blob all night long during the US time zone, so it was fairly equal blobbing pretty much non stop with just the role reversing depending what time zone it was.
Now it's just less profound in the differences, because Minmatar can pull some UK time zone fleets and Amarr can pull some US time zone fleets. About the time you guys showed up was when Amarr started getting more active in the US time zone and has been somewhat active since then.
Meanwhile in the same time period the Minmatar have lost a lot of FC's whom likely got tired of being hounded for fleets the moment they signed on.
The killboard shows it was 60 vs 45 , if you guys would get out your crap ships and l2scout then them having 15 more ships would not automatically mean a slaughter .
The fact is the Mini's on Eu are full of fail pilots in fail corps full of fail FC's . The militia is full of noobs flying around defending plexes in metro in rifters while the like of BC's corp owns any mini gang it comes across.
You all need to stop making excuses for why your so bad, and your corps need to step up and learn to pvp , seriously guys your not just bad, your embarrassingly bad.
/eats popcorn while waiting for "but flying a rifter is fun blahblahblah" |
Ethan Blue
Non Entity
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Posted - 2009.09.23 18:37:00 -
[70]
I like how players feel it is the other sides responsibility to entertain them. Amarr complains that Minnie's don't undock. Minnie's complain that Amarr... the smallest militia.... uses blobs all the time.
LiveDog (Minnie Pilot) lost a Thanny last night in Auga. Both sides were using hit and run, cover and retreat tactics... one of our pilots, Baruc, warp/bumped him off the station in a beautiful display of timing.
LiveDog was the first person on local to say GF, and gave props to the pilot that bumped him. He neither griped nor complained. He laughed about it.
So to the Original Post: I was enlisted in the Caldari militia and made some good friends, but I have A LOT more fun and fly with better, more active pilots that don't display the same infighting that Caldari traditionally have. I would highly recommend the Amarr/Minnie war on either side. The good pilots are usually the ones who are griping on the forums like us :)
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Insa Rexion
Minmatar
CTRL-Q
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Posted - 2009.09.23 20:16:00 -
[71]
Originally by: In4r4
The killboard shows it was 60 vs 45 , if you guys would get out your crap ships and l2scout then them having 15 more ships would not automatically mean a slaughter .
The fact is the Mini's on Eu are full of fail pilots in fail corps full of fail FC's . The militia is full of noobs flying around defending plexes in metro in rifters while the like of BC's corp owns any mini gang it comes across.
You all need to stop making excuses for why your so bad, and your corps need to step up and learn to pvp , seriously guys your not just bad, your embarrassingly bad.
/eats popcorn while waiting for "but flying a rifter is fun blahblahblah"
There seems to be a fair bit of unjust critcism and waay too much seriousness in this thread. Describing militia members as "fail" when they are noobs is just silly really, by your reasoning anyone with low skillpoints must be fail. You said it yourself, the militia is full of noobs and as such it's true, we lack the skill and importantly the resources to take on the well coordinated amarr guardian/BS gangs effectively. However i don't think an inability to field anything better than a rag tag bunch of cruisers and BCs in response qualifies as failure, just lack of time in game TBH. If we are guilty of something it is getting bored enough to say "**** it" and engage with what we have. That however, brings me to my next point...
I also happen to think that the criticism of the Amarr (particularly ABC and PIE etc) for fielding decent gangs with support is completely unwarranted. Perhaps if we minnies would never engage them and no fights occured as a result of this stalemate it would be fair criticism, but the fact remains that WE DO ENGAGE THOSE FLEETS for whatever stupid reason, with our poorly composed fleets of cruisers etc. So I ask you, why the hell should the Amarr change what they are doing ? It clearly works for them and we are apparently in no hurry to learn from past defeats (lol ?). My hat comes off to them for consistently bringing it.
Myself, i am having a great time in FW and i would reccomend joining either side. The minnies do really need a few more experienced pilots and FCs in the EU tz for sure. The FCs we have get swamped with xes and I respect them for trying to do something with what we have ... complete nubs and all. Time will surely bring mpore experience and we will find our way, I just hope the like of ABC and PIE (sorry if i left anyone out) haven't got bored and left by the time we do as I could see some great fights just waiting to be had by all.
TLDFR: FW is a mish mash but we are most of us having a really good laugh in the minnie/amarr conflict, may it continue 
I has 17 XBOX can I get sov ??
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Mitch Taylor
Dark-Rising
IT Alliance
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Posted - 2009.09.24 00:07:00 -
[72]
These things tend to go in cycles. I dont know how much of this is 'hurf' but, if things are a bit down in the Minmatar camp, something will roll along to pick it up again.
The Dark is Rising...
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Bashiri
Cursed Inc
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Posted - 2009.09.24 01:59:00 -
[73]
Edited by: Bashiri on 24/09/2009 02:00:46
All I say is 3 months ago amarr pilot was fail at bringing the right ships. Now those same pilots moved on into better ships and more skills at what they do. I see minmatar in the same cycle of new pilots with small ships.
As for amarr bringing higher scale ships. You did once now it's our time to shine , don't complain learn to counter it.
Blobs are on both side so stfu with that same old talk and see you in space.
edit : P.S join minmatar I need more targets.
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Dr BattleSmith
PAX Interstellar Services
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Posted - 2009.09.24 02:27:00 -
[74]
I find the people that complain about Amarr blobs to be all so funny.
I've noticed a lot of fleets formed in Amarr militia will stop taking x's after 10 or so members.
Several FCs will ensure their fleet is 1/2 to 3/4 the size of the Matar fleet in the hope they won't run away.
So you have Amarr deliberately trying to make weaker fleets just so the Matar will engage.
Stop running away, it's getting old fast.
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Insa Rexion
Minmatar
CTRL-Q
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Posted - 2009.09.24 06:42:00 -
[75]
Edited by: Insa Rexion on 24/09/2009 06:43:39
Originally by: Dr BattleSmith
I find the people that complain about Amarr blobs to be all so funny.
I've noticed a lot of fleets formed in Amarr militia will stop taking x's after 10 or so members.
Several FCs will ensure their fleet is 1/2 to 3/4 the size of the Matar fleet in the hope they won't run away.
So you have Amarr deliberately trying to make weaker fleets just so the Matar will engage.
Stop running away, it's getting old fast.
I have already said I respect the amarr for bringing out decent fleets and the quality of their FCs, but i have to object to inaccurate picture you paint here. It may well be true that some amarr FCs do try to keep the fleet smaller than the minnie fleet numbers wise, but a fleet or RR BS and dual even triple guardians is still vastly superior than the rag tag bunch of ships we can assemble most of the time, des[pite NUMERICAL advantage. It's not as if they are trying to create an inferior fleet to ours to get us to engage as you appear to be claiming, just a smaller one
And clearly we are not running away, in fact that is our biggest fault TBH, we don't run away when we should, when it's clear that our fleet is completely outmatched. The total slaughter described a few posts earlier and several other floor wipings we've taken recently are testament to the fact that we don't run all the time as you appear to be claiming.
Both the amarr and the minnies blob, FACT. you guys may have some smaller fleets running around as do we, but both of us roll in blobs some of the time and to attempt to imply otherwise is bollox frankly.
I think the 2 posts above yours have it about right, this goes in cycles, right now amarr are peaking and we need to get better, but your pretty picture of a few amarr holding off hordes of minnies is more than a little disingenuous when you leave out the fact that its 10 RR BSs, 3 guardians and a falcon against a load of poorly skilled nubs half the time. But sure, go back to your fantasy hero land if it makes you feel good 
I has 17 XBOX can I get sov ??
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Dr BattleSmith
PAX Interstellar Services
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Posted - 2009.09.24 09:34:00 -
[76]
I just want a fight....
I don't always get a chance to fleet up for FW so it kinda sucks when matar won't fight.
Yes it does swing, yes there are blobs.....
Besides that, when it's even, or fair, or even the odds on the matar side....
The confidence just isn't there and they fold all too easy.
It's on a constant see-saw too, Amarr come out, get bored, go home.
Matar come out, no Amarr, get bored and go home.... rinse and repeat.
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Dr BattleSmith
PAX Interstellar Services
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Posted - 2009.09.24 09:41:00 -
[77]
The general point of my post is....
"Matar.... prove me wrong.... more fighting!"
Offended? I'm wrong?
In the immortal words of the worlds most celebrated idiot.... "Bring it on!"
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BattleStar Crusader
Amarr
Absinthe Brothers Consortium
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Posted - 2009.09.24 10:31:00 -
[78]
I have to agree the minmitar do bring it from time to time, and im sure the amarr will vouch, when i used to run militia fleets, i would take battlecruiser to fight battleships and limit the gang to 2 squads. I got alot of good fights that way.
With regards to logistics, in the last week i have seen 5 different pilots rolling around in scimitars, all online around the EU prime time???? And yes the cycle is now on the amarr side and we seem to have the bigger, better fleet (always have in my opinion) but not more than 4 weeks ago you were flying round with 15+ battlcrusiers in gang.
I will admit after a string of large defeats both sides tend to fall back to the small ships theory lol.
AS for mutnin your explanation of things was not valid when your were in the militia, nor is it valid now, time and time again your own militia stated how you were wrong, and you are wrong now.
"It's because the only way Amarr will ever fight is if they have over whelming numbers or much better ships. I just looked at the KB, he had 20 more people in his gang and braging that is was 3 gangs converging on one. Then wonders why they won. If roles were reversed and Minmatar clearly had more in their gang the Amarr would have never left high sec.
Amarr are always the same, they sit in high sec all day, while the Minmatar get bored twiddling their thumbs and chasing around a WT here or there. Then just about the time the Minmatar gangs are ready to disband, the Amarr blob comes along. Always of course with over kill yet the Minmatar typically fight them anyway, simply because that how Minmatar are.
If the Minmatar happen to beat them in the smaller gang, then Amarr go into hiding for hours if not til the next day. If the Amarr happen to win, they show up on the forums gloating how great they are because they won a fight with 20 more guys than the other side had."
This is complete and utter crap, we run around low sec all day, loking for small fights and solo engagements, 75% of my corp go round soloing until fleet is called, so don't sit in your station maoning mutnin, about how things are becuase your to useless to your own people to get into a fleet.
Yes we run away to reship, your side does exactly the same every single day, last night i watched a cruiser gang reship in to battlecruisers with a scimitar to take on our cruiser gang. Im sure most of your pilots have alot of fun running around in rifter gangs, they sure look fun =).
Ladies and Gentlemen of the forum i request taht you no longer listen to mutnin as he has no valid point to make. Listen to the poeple in the militias that undock and fight and havnt been moaning for the last 4 months that amrr are over blobbing and have to many people in flet, When he himself openly states he wont help his own militia with a fleets.
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Mutnin
Mutineers
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Posted - 2009.09.24 16:26:00 -
[79]
Edited by: Mutnin on 24/09/2009 16:30:36
BSC....
I guess I must always log in when you guys are running back to high sec. 
Last night was a perfect example. I hadn't really logged in much, and decided to see if anything was happening. I log in to see one of our older FC's asking for X's. I decided WTF, I haven't ganged up in a while and he is a good FC so I'll see what's up.
Amarr reportedly had a gang with 21 in it and were "looking for a fight". From the time I logged in til the time we had a 16 man gang sitting on the Kourm gate was about 15 minutes. Soon as we made the jump to the Kourm gate, the Amarr gang jumped out of Kourm and disappeared to high sec.
Sorry BSC, but I've seen that kind of thing play out time and time again..While I'm sure both side are guilty of it, I do think Minmatar have shown countless times that they will fight at the disadvantage. On the flip side I just don't see Amarr willing to do the same very often.
TBH, it's the very reason I rarely gang up anymore because it always plays out the same. You spend a hour chasing the other side's gang all over trying to get a fight and end up just ganking people whom jumped into the wrong gate or baiting some guy in a belt.
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Cearain
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Posted - 2009.09.24 16:59:00 -
[80]
Let me say that I think faction war rocks. I can't really imagine ever doing anything else in eve. I can only play at random times for an hour to 2 hours at a time so itÆs great to have all the targets. If anyone knows of a better way to get pvp action in this game when you can't play allot let me know. (I'm fairly new to eve so keep that in mind when you read what IÆm gonna say)
Ok that said if I log on for 2 hours I will likely spend only an hour of that time in a fleet/gang with a strong likelihood of a fight coming. The rest is more or less dead time.
How can we reduce that 50% dead time?
Everyone knows at least one reason why there is not more action. (There are others like few fcs etc..) Dr. Battlesmith (and countless others) have said it:
Originally by: Dr BattleSmith
I just want a fight....
I don't always get a chance to fleet up for FW so it kinda sucks when matar won't fight.
Yes it does swing, yes there are blobs.....
à
It's on a constant see-saw too, Amarr come out, get bored, go home.
Matar come out, no Amarr, get bored and go home.... rinse and repeat.
This is my experience as well. Ambo said the same thing in his 6th post in this thread. If you necro past posts about faction war you will find this same problem mentioned again and again. So this is well known.
Why does this happen? The reason this happens is because in FW there is nothing that a faction *must* defend. I mean even if you completely give up on plexes like Gallente did àso what? The other side gets a medal. Yep they get a pixel medal. What do you lose? Nothing.
The point is, with no POS (or other thing with real value to defend) there is no way to *force* an engagement. There is really nothing to fight for. ItÆs meaningless warfare. ThatÆs hard for many to swallow so they try to value statistics like ôisk efficiencyö or ôloss kill ratiosö This leads to the well known problem described above.
What can we do? Well we canÆt really change the rules. ThatÆs up to ccp and I really donÆt know what they could/should do about this anyway.
It seems to me we just need to recognize that FW is meaningless warfare and embrace it. How?
Start flying more reckless. Stop being so concerned about isk efficiency. Sometimes I am so stir crazy for a fight I feel like I would be willing to let 5 ships blow up just to get the satisfaction of one kill. At least I would be fighting instead of spinning in station.
Oh no what if I lose some battleships? WouldnÆt that be the end of the world? Tech one battle ships often pay for themselves once you get platinum insurance. LetÆs say you lose on average 20mil in mods on the thing. Well ok. One GTC = 600mill. So for one gtc you can lose 30 battleships. Yep 30 of them thatÆs about the loss of a dollar per ship. As for you guys flying those frigates that cost less than 1 million isk fully fittedà. Well, you can lose 600 of them for 35 dollars. 600 of them. They cost six cents a piece.
IÆm not trying to sound like Mr big bucks here, but come on isnÆt our RL time worth *something*? ôI want to save my nickel so IÆm going to sit around for an *hour* with my frigate docked. Or I may lose a nickel.ö
I say, to hell with isk efficiency. We arenÆt merc corps; we are in faction war. Faction warfare is completely meaningless warfare. Meaningless warfare is a beautiful thing and is to be embraced to the fullest. DonÆt try to find meaning in ôisk efficiency.ö That road leads to everyone spending all their time refitting their ships.
Lets start valuing our time just a little bit and start fighting more battles even if they are losing battles. Try to bring fleets out that are on par with what your scouts see the other side flying. Stop trying to one up them. Try to bring fleets that are on par with what your scouts see the other side flying. Stop trying to one up them. (oops sorry I think I said that twice.)
People who tell you ôwinning faction warö is based on isk efficiency are fools. The truth is you are winning faction war if you are doing more meaningless fighting than the other guys. I would rather waste a dollar and get a few fights in that night, rather than waste a night saving a nickel by running from everything.
In sum, faction war is great but it could be better if perspectives change slightly. Just my 2 cents.
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Mutnin
Mutineers
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Posted - 2009.09.24 19:00:00 -
[81]
Originally by: Cearain
How can we reduce that 50% dead time?
The only way to reduce the dead time is to get people to stop constantly blobbing up. You don't have to have a FC to go get action in FW. This is what annoys the hell out of me and I see it from both sides.
There just are not many people willing to go out and fight with out being in a large gang. People need to get over the timidness of needing their hands held to un-dock and just get out there and find some action.
This is the problem in FW, you have 90% of the people that will only undock if there is a gang. Then out of the other 10% at least half of them roam around solo in ceptors and just run plexes. Then you have a few EVE vets that will solo but they only fly HAC's recons BC's and so on.
The problem with this is they are missing the entire thing that "could" make FW awesome and full of action. First off ceptors are a waste of time to engage because in most cases unless the pilot is dumb, he will just run away from anything they can't kill. (anything bigger than a frig)
Then the guys in HAC's/Recons ect.. aren't gonna get anyone to fight them with out it being a gank. Hence the reason I stopped flying my Harbi after a week, because it only attracts a gank not a fight.
Simply put we need more people flying around solo or in 2 to 3 man gangs in frigs in T1 cruisers. Fly cheap stuff that doesn't cost much to lose and go find some action.
I bet you anything, if more people started doing this, FW would be a hell of a lot more action than it is now. People just need to get over the need to have their hand held constantly by and FC and go find some action.
Simply put, FW should be about undocking and going out to find some quick action, not sitting in the station Xing up and doing nothing because there is no FC online to run a blob.
TBH I think Red vs Blue is gonna blow FW away for this very reason, because they are making a point to stay away from the big blobs and trying to encourage people to fly cheap.
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Jelosavich
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Posted - 2009.09.24 19:41:00 -
[82]
Originally by: Mutnin
I guess I must always log in when you guys are running back to high sec.
Amarr reportedly had a gang with 21 in it and were "looking for a fight". From the time I logged in til the time we had a 16 man gang sitting on the Kourm gate was about 15 minutes. Soon as we made the jump to the Kourm gate, the Amarr gang jumped out of Kourm and disappeared to high sec.
When were you online? When I was online last night (PST) everything was absolutely dead. There were less than a handful of minnies out, and someone had taken a ~10-15 person Amarr gang 10 jumps into backwater systems just to find ANYTHING.
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Mutnin
Mutineers
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Posted - 2009.09.24 20:13:00 -
[83]
Originally by: Jelosavich
Originally by: Mutnin
I guess I must always log in when you guys are running back to high sec.
Amarr reportedly had a gang with 21 in it and were "looking for a fight". From the time I logged in til the time we had a 16 man gang sitting on the Kourm gate was about 15 minutes. Soon as we made the jump to the Kourm gate, the Amarr gang jumped out of Kourm and disappeared to high sec.
When were you online? When I was online last night (PST) everything was absolutely dead. There were less than a handful of minnies out, and someone had taken a ~10-15 person Amarr gang 10 jumps into backwater systems just to find ANYTHING.
I dunno what time it was, maybe around 11pm US EST, but that's just a guess. I joined the gang pretty much a min or two after I logged on. I figured that would be the only fight to be had that time of night but nothing happened.
I know the Amarr gang was in Kourm, with about 5 in Auga as we all warped to the Kourm gate in Auga. My comms were screwed so I was only hearing bits and pieces but shortly after we formed up on the gate and were ready to fight the Amarr gang disappeared.
Someone said the wt's went Tuomuta and I lost connection about that time. By the time I got logged back into the fleet they were bored and talking about going to 00. I was having connection problems and my comms were screwed so I ended up just dropping fleet and logging.
It's been kind of the same today since I logged on.. I've gone out for a few solo roams and haven't found a single fight all day. Yet watching Militia channel and both KB's I can see Minmatar have had a fleet up most of the day and had some ganks on smaller Amarr gangs in both Auga and Dal.
Yet, where is the large Amarr BS gang while Minmatar have their gang camping Kamela? It's simple, Amarr wont poke their heads out while Minmatar have a big fleet. Then when Minmatar fleet disbands Amarr will come rolling around with a BS/BC fleet and Minmatar will sit in stations.
The role will reverse over and over with some ganks in between with a lot of people spending far too much time getting no "real" fights just a gank here and a gank there. This is why I don't like the blobs and why I'm vocal about it. The take away from what FW could be, which is lots of smaller scale fights with occasional fleet battles.
In stead we have everyone wanting big fleet/ganks and because of that there is far too much dead time. My hope, is maybe people will wake up and see that we could be getting a lot more PVP if people would ship down and not blob up so often.
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BattleStar Crusader
Amarr
Absinthe Brothers Consortium
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Posted - 2009.09.24 20:52:00 -
[84]
Edited by: BattleStar Crusader on 24/09/2009 20:52:21
Mutnin all i see is you throwing your toys out the pram becuase no on will fly a t1 cruiser. People train skils to get better ships, to fly more expensive ships and to be able to out damage the other guy. Your saying you want every one to DUMB DOWN to fight on your level and keep you entertained.
****ing grow up mate, its war in eve, learn to play or stop moaning about how things arn't the way You personaly want them.
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Mutnin
Mutineers
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Posted - 2009.09.24 21:12:00 -
[85]
Originally by: BattleStar Crusader
Edited by: BattleStar Crusader on 24/09/2009 20:52:21
Mutnin all i see is you throwing your toys out the pram becuase no on will fly a t1 cruiser. People train skils to get better ships, to fly more expensive ships and to be able to out damage the other guy. Your saying you want every one to DUMB DOWN to fight on your level and keep you entertained.
****ing grow up mate, its war in eve, learn to play or stop moaning about how things arn't the way You personaly want them.
You apparently can't see the forest for the trees if that's what you actually think. Don't worry BSC, I'm sure you wouldn't stop flying around in ceptors and hiding behind 20 others when you fly anything bigger.
My post wasn't aimed at you BSC, but maybe some of the more sensible types whom actually are after a fight, rather than hiding from everything that isn't a easy gank.
BTW, where was your great glorious Amarr BS gang while Minmatar camped Kamela all day?
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Jade Constantine
Gallente
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2009.09.24 21:23:00 -
[86]
I think it frustrates the TLF quite a lot that the 24th Crusade is undoubtedly an extremely risk-averse organization. I think partly thats the contribution of the RP corps in the 24th Crusade unfortunately - they really really don't like losing ships and the attitude generally filters down into the rank and file of the 24th fighters.
Plus - its probably fair to say that the TLF members tend to be more casual about their gaming than the 24th Crusaders. The Minmatar want to log-in - have some fun fights, get into messy battles and see what happens and thats a fine and enjoyable way of playing the game of course.
Problem is that the 24th Crusade leadership is absolutely fanatical about K/D ratio and only engaging on favourable terms and making sure the engagements are won on paper before deciding to engage.
I guess on one level it means that the 24th Crusade leaders are "better" gamers than the TLF leaders and its undoubtedly the case that they get better results. But does it bring more fun for their side than their opponents? I'm not so sure about that actually and I've heard a lot of rank and file moaning and groaning at the very common decisions to withdraw to hisec whenever an actual risky engagement is offered.
From my perspect as a Star Fraction pilot I have to say its gotten to the point where the 24th Crusade almost always needs to be tricked into fighting - they never really attack off their own back and its generally a matter of baiting traps and hotdropping appropriate forces.
(Of course our involvement is on a slightly different level to the TLF - and we're here to destabalize 24th Crusade fleet command and try to balance the odds a bit.)
But ultimately - I think a lot of the bad feelings comes from the 24th "must win and never lose ships" ethos clashing with the "lets just have fun" ethos of the TLF. Its a bit incompatible in this warzone and does seem to be stripping a lot of general fun from the conflict.
Still - there's always time to turn it around but as long as its the RP corps calling all the shots in the 24th Crusade I can assure you the TLF will never get "fair fights" and Amarrians engaging against the odds unless the Minmatar players seriously threaten the 24th Crusade plexing dominance because the only thing the RP overlords of the 24th do care about is system occupancy and unless that is challenged they have absolutely no reason to risk themselves on dicy engagements.
Anyway - thats my 2 cents on the current state of play.
3rd Forces in FW - discuss! |
Grim Asse
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Posted - 2009.09.24 22:39:00 -
[87]
Edited by: Grim Asse on 24/09/2009 22:45:38
Coming from the alliance that hotdrops carriers to kill solo BS's and keeping a titan in a system for armour bonus which only stations undock range their carriers never leave in an environment designed to get new players into pvp whilst skimming those pilots and corps from the Minmatar Militia who are too frightened to take on all of the 24th, that's quite rich.
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Jade Constantine
Gallente
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2009.09.25 00:04:00 -
[88]
Oh dear haven't we moved past this yet?
Originally by: Grim Asse
Coming from the roleplaying alliance that hotdrops carriers to kill solo BS's
To kill a docking game abaddon in the 45secs you have before it disengages and redocks you need to be dealing around 170,000 points of damage. If you need to bring in battleships from out of the system you need to factor in the warp to station delay and upscale accordingly. Alternatively you can use the Titan Bridge to drop 6 battleships directly on the dock-monkey and end his ship. If you have a problem with this tactic I suggest you stop counting on docking games to protect your battleship.
Quote:
... and keeping a titan in a system for armour bonus...
Mostly the Erebus is useful for the bridge. We hardly ever have enemy groups prepared to engage with numbers in kamela where it would actually deploy its gang bonus to make a difference. That said we'd be happy to lend the armour bonus to a TLF commander if they wanted to force a fleet confrontation in Kamela.
Quote:
... which only stations undock range their carriers never leave in ...
Nonsense. You are just talking rot there. Our carriers have fought at gates/belts/fleet battles and we're generally prepared to deploy directly into 24th crusade fleet concentrations as any of your regular commanders know well. Don't let smack-instincts lead you into saying silly things that everyone knows to be untrue.
Quote:
... an environment designed to get new players into pvp
Incorrect. FW has never been soley the preserve of new players and nor will it ever be. It is every bit as important to the roleplay community as it is to pvp training and you need open you mind and lose the blinkers on this issue.
Quote:
... whilst skimming those pilots and corps from the Minmatar Militia who are too frightened to take on all of the 24th, that's quite rich.
I think you need to understand just how quickly we'd support any FW rules change that meant we were deccing the whole 24th rather than individual corps. You guys are quite fortunate we're limited in who we can actually dec and your experienced player veterans who choose to hide in the militia corp to evade our decs are quite illustrative of how seriously they see the situation.
Anyway. Having completely refuted every one of your points lets move back to the debate at hand. The essentially risk-adverse nature of the 24th Crusade - as I said earlier I don't think this makes you "bad" players - just boring people to fight.
Actually one of the main comments some of our new players from the TLF have said is that in SF they can chase you to hisec where previously you were immune to the enemy militia between big fights and how liberating that possibility was.
This shows the frustration I mentioned on the part of the TLF at your tactics - you want to win and don't mind boring them (and yourselves) to win. SF provides an avenue to attack you while you are using NPC spawn mechanics to hide from TLF players in Amarr hisec. You have to expect people to find ways to counter your tactics.
In many ways each of your earlier points represent nothing so much as your irritation that people have countered you.
SF carriers on stations were initially deployed to drive yours off the field.
SF domination of Kamela was designed to counter your docking games there.
SF deployment of carriers into your fleet battles was to oppose your use of out of militia logistics alts.
SF Titan drops counter Amarrian docking range "games".
And our wardecs allow our pilots to pursue and engage you in hisec where you are otherwise completely protected from organized minmatar response.
Anyway - these are just facts and observations. There is no need for smack talk on an out of character forum section.
3rd Forces in FW - discuss! |
Dr BattleSmith
PAX Interstellar Services
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Posted - 2009.09.25 00:04:00 -
[89]
Originally by: Mutnin
Amarr reportedly had a gang with 21 in it and were "looking for a fight". From the time I logged in til the time we had a 16 man gang sitting on the Kourm gate was about 15 minutes. Soon as we made the jump to the Kourm gate, the Amarr gang jumped out of Kourm and disappeared to high sec.
You flew straight past the Amarr fleet and kept going, heard the reports of your location, we were capturing your plexes a few systems back :-P
Think the response on vent was "bah not going all the way back there, they'll just dock up, what's the timer on the major?".
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BlackDeej
Aquila Astralis
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Posted - 2009.09.25 00:32:00 -
[90]
In a way I agree with Mutnin - I would love to see more small gang fights, BC and down basically. One of the main problems with this is, unfortunately, Star Fraction and their HAC/BS gangs and carrier hot-drops.
Is it any wonder that the Amarr Militia is cautious about fighting in smaller ships when at any time SF might undock from Kamela (behind us if we are in Kourmonen or Auga) and then bolster the Minmatar fleet, turning what could be a (more or less) even fight into a one-sided massacre ?
I dont blame Star Fraction for wanting to get in on the fun, but seriously, picking off one or two pilots in a fleet while his fleetmates have to sit by and watch is pretty damn lame ! CCP need to change the game mechanics so that when someone attacks a fleet member they go flashy to that whole fleet - then at least we can defend our fleets properly.
The suggestion that a Corp or Alliance has to war-dec the whole militia when they war-dec a Corp within it would solve a lot of problems for both the Amarr and Minmatar militias - this surely can't be the intended way that these mechanics are supposed to work ?
An analogy would be like British troops in Iraq refusing to do anything as their ally gets shot next to them - "sorry mate, I'm not allowed to shoot the guy who's blowing you away, I can only stick a few bandages on afterwards" - I mean wtf !!
tl;dr ?
More small gangs = cool.
Non-militia alliances war-deccing militia corps needs to be fixed to war-deccing the whole militia.
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Light is faster than sound, this is why som |
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