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@CCP : Do not cave in to Goons on Inferno 1.1

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Kyle Myr GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 283	Posted - 2012.06.18 20:35:00 - [391] - Quote Jade Constantine wrote: Marconus Orion wrote: This thread is out of control. I think its turned into a war between goonswarm posters and the mod team as to whether bad posters are allowed to ignore the forum rules. Hopefully the mods will win. "Rumor threads and posts which are based off no actual information and are designed to either troll or annoy other users will be locked and removed. Players who engage in these type of threads can expect to receive a warning and ban." Jade, I think you should stop posting. I wouldn't want you to get banned for accusing the entire CSM of being CFC alts, or for repeatedly posting unfounded rumors of a conspiracy between Goonswarm and CCP to enact the 1.1 war system changes. For what it's worth, the advice I gave Issler above would work very well for you as well - simply split your alliance into many small corporations, whereupon it will become prohibitively expensive to wardec you, and every wardec you receive can be returned four-fold for the low price of a flat 70 million ISK. You could even revive La Maison as an altcorp!
Implying Implications cuties4life 118	Posted - 2012.06.18 20:35:00 - [392] - Quote holy christ this thread.... Minmatar V3 gallery: http://minus.com/mOqXRikn5
Jade Constantine Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction 2350	Posted - 2012.06.18 20:37:00 - [393] - Quote Richard Desturned wrote: CCP Goliath wrote: Guys, before this goes on any further, kindly take off the hats and get real - we do not develop with one corp or alliance in mind... CCP SoniClover wrote: Regarding the war dec system changes being some goonswarm conspiracy - all of these changes were decided (and most implemented) long before this particular goonswarm war even started. Do you really think we add new stuff a few days before a release just because of one war? Regarding defenders now being defenseless, etc. This change will make it a little bit more difficult to defend, but what we have to do is strike a balance between defender options and incentives to declare war. We can give defenders all kinds of shiny new tools to defend themselves, but if they result in nobody declaring war anymore, then why bother? Yes, we want the system as a whole to have more consequences, but that cuts both ways. it's amazing that despite two devposts blatantly shooting your conspiracy theory out of the air, you're still pushing it don't you feel bad Well thats a strawman argument you are attempting there young man. And lucky for you that you managed to avoid including my (and other) response(s) to SoniClover on that subject where it was immediately pointed out that the Honda Accord wardec predated the SF dec by 3 weeks or so and could possibily have been considered to have influenced their thinking. Add to this the podcast I linked you all earlier that had Two Step speaking of how terrible it was that large alliances were getting dogpiled by hisec on the run up to the CSM summit in Iceland and your contention here falls apart like a boat made of marshmellow on an unkind sea. Further of course, MANY players disagreed with what Soniclover writes in your quote - and its quite apparent that the system as a whole as updated for 1.1 is not "cutting both ways" but simply making it easier for 0.0 alliances to wardec who they please while removing the consequences of that decision in defensive ally formations. All in all, these are not devquotes that do much for your argument. The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom Epic Inferno Wardec Test, Sign up and shoot Goons for free!
Cutter Isaacson Peace N Quiet 521	Posted - 2012.06.18 20:37:00 - [394] - Quote Sixx Spades wrote: Jade Constantine wrote: well aren't they? Weaselior wrote: we know they did because-----Edit----- No rumors without facts, please. Tyrozan Ensign ISD Community Communications Liaisons Interstellar Services Department Woah, and Jade is still posting Quoting this in the vain hope that the rules that apply to everyone else, will also be applied to the rantings of Jade Constantine. Numbers of terminally stupid people seem to be on the increase, I suggest we have a real life Stupidageddon to rectify this issue.
Kyle Myr GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 283	Posted - 2012.06.18 20:38:00 - [395] - Quote Jade Constantine wrote: Enaris Kerle wrote: Jade Constantine wrote: I'm sure you made a small error in your posting there and by "everyone else" meant "CFC posters" right. Because your support from any actual independents is vanishingly small. I guess that's true if you assume that everyone who's not of your opinion is actually a CFC alt well aren't they? Have you considered how paranoid you sound? e. Is this PTSD from previous positions in EVE?
Weaselior GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 3519	Posted - 2012.06.18 20:39:00 - [396] - Quote Dear ISD: when I post "we know goons batphoned CCP because they were scared, and we know they were scared because they batphoned ccp", I am not spreading rumors: I am rephrasing Jade's rumormongering to make clear that he is using circular reasoning. Nobody is intended to believe that statement, it is intended to be so absurd on its face nobody believes it. Sincerely, Weaselior
Weaselior GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 3519	Posted - 2012.06.18 20:40:00 - [397] - Quote However, if you wish to edit out rumors, might I suggest the posts I am paraphrasing.
Jade Constantine Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction 2350	Posted - 2012.06.18 20:41:00 - [398] - Quote Kyle Myr wrote: Jade, I think you should stop posting. I wouldn't want you to get banned for accusing the entire CSM of being CFC alts, or for repeatedly posting unfounded rumors of a conspiracy between Goonswarm and CCP to enact the 1.1 war system changes. Lucky I'm not doing those things really. So please stop trying to leverage forum rules to silence dissenting opinions. At some level you need to accept that other players have differing outlooks on the game and to be prepared to discuss these things without continual recourse to personal attacks and slander. Kyle Myr wrote: For what it's worth, the advice I gave Issler above would work very well for you as well - simply split your alliance into many small corporations, whereupon it will become prohibitively expensive to wardec you, and every wardec you receive can be returned four-fold for the low price of a flat 70 million ISK. You could even revive La Maison as an altcorp! That would be my advise to Goonswarm as well. If you split up your alliance you could be protected from the consequence of high sec raiding corp dogpile without needing to advocate a complete nerfing of the defensive ally system. The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom Epic Inferno Wardec Test, Sign up and shoot Goons for free!
Alavaria Fera GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 1042	Posted - 2012.06.18 20:41:00 - [399] - Quote Jade Constantine wrote: Enaris Kerle wrote: Jade Constantine wrote: I'm sure you made a small error in your posting there and by "everyone else" meant "CFC posters" right. Because your support from any actual independents is vanishingly small. I guess that's true if you assume that everyone who's not of your opinion is actually a CFC alt well aren't they? Citation needed. A lot of citations, actually, because there's a lot of people that disagree with you. Those who cannot adapt become victims of Evolugalbugaslugakjlwsdhvbzxd
Cutter Isaacson Peace N Quiet 521	Posted - 2012.06.18 20:41:00 - [400] - Quote Weaselior wrote: Dear ISD: when I post "we know goons batphoned CCP because they were scared, and we know they were scared because they batphoned ccp", I am not spreading rumors: I am rephrasing Jade's rumormongering to make clear that he is using circular reasoning. Nobody is intended to believe that statement, it is intended to be so absurd on its face nobody believes it. Sincerely, Weaselior Not empty quoting. I have to wonder if the ISD guy even noticed that the poster was FROM Goonswarm? Numbers of terminally stupid people seem to be on the increase, I suggest we have a real life Stupidageddon to rectify this issue.
Holander Switzerland GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 20	Posted - 2012.06.18 20:42:00 - [401] - Quote Kyle Myr wrote: . You could even revive La Maison as an altcorp! For more ** it man its the escort brothel super space ** club this aint fun anymore I throw all the grenades
Kyle Myr GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 283	Posted - 2012.06.18 20:43:00 - [402] - Quote Jade Constantine wrote: Kyle Myr wrote: Jade, I think you should stop posting. I wouldn't want you to get banned for accusing the entire CSM of being CFC alts, or for repeatedly posting unfounded rumors of a conspiracy between Goonswarm and CCP to enact the 1.1 war system changes. Lucky I'm not doing those things really. So please stop trying to leverage forum rules to silence dissenting opinions. At some level you need to accept that other players have differing outlooks on the game and to be prepared to discuss these things without continual recourse to personal attacks and slander. Kyle Myr wrote: For what it's worth, the advice I gave Issler above would work very well for you as well - simply split your alliance into many small corporations, whereupon it will become prohibitively expensive to wardec you, and every wardec you receive can be returned four-fold for the low price of a flat 70 million ISK. You could even revive La Maison as an altcorp! That would be my advise to Goonswarm as well. If you split up your alliance you could be protected from the consequence of high sec raiding corp dogpile without needing to advocate a complete nerfing of the defensive ally system. Why would we need to do that? We aren't a social place where you leave guns at the door.
Alavaria Fera GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 1042	Posted - 2012.06.18 20:43:00 - [403] - Quote Jade Constantine wrote: Lucky I'm not doing those things really. So please stop trying to leverage forum rules to silence dissenting opinions. At some level you need to accept that other players have differing outlooks on the game and to be prepared to discuss these things without continual recourse to personal attacks and slander. But not you, you're just always right. Dissenters with you are all just CFC alts, according to yourself. Those who cannot adapt become victims of Evolugalbugaslugakjlwsdhvbzxd
Richard Desturned GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 1044	Posted - 2012.06.18 20:43:00 - [404] - Quote Jade Constantine wrote: Further of course, MANY players disagreed with what Soniclover writes in your quote - and its quite apparent that the system as a whole as updated for 1.1 is not "cutting both ways" but simply making it easier for 0.0 alliances to wardec who they please while removing the consequences of that decision in defensive ally formations. yeah the dozens of personal tax dodging corps clearly contribute substantial strength for your "defense" rather than riding the coattails of the more relevant groups in the picture, like eh
Sixx Spades GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 17	Posted - 2012.06.18 20:44:00 - [405] - Quote Jade Constantine wrote: That would be my advise to Goonswarm as well. If you split up your alliance you could be protected from the consequence of high sec raiding corp dogpile without needing to advocate a complete nerfing of the defensive ally system. And you CONTINUE to assume we care. Please continue to use straw man arguments. Jade Constantine, self-made space harlot. News at 11. http://bit.ly/LTW5gW
Alavaria Fera GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 1042	Posted - 2012.06.18 20:45:00 - [406] - Quote Richard Desturned wrote: Jade Constantine wrote: Further of course, MANY players disagreed with what Soniclover writes in your quote - and its quite apparent that the system as a whole as updated for 1.1 is not "cutting both ways" but simply making it easier for 0.0 alliances to wardec who they please while removing the consequences of that decision in defensive ally formations. yeah the dozens of personal tax dodging corps clearly contribute substantial strength for your "defense" rather than riding the coattails of the more relevant groups in the picture, like I thought they were jita campers? Those who cannot adapt become victims of Evolugalbugaslugakjlwsdhvbzxd
Jade Constantine Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction 2350	Posted - 2012.06.18 20:46:00 - [407] - Quote Alavaria Fera wrote: Jade Constantine wrote: Enaris Kerle wrote: Jade Constantine wrote: I'm sure you made a small error in your posting there and by "everyone else" meant "CFC posters" right. Because your support from any actual independents is vanishingly small. I guess that's true if you assume that everyone who's not of your opinion is actually a CFC alt well aren't they? Citation needed. A lot of citations, actually, because there's a lot of people that disagree with you. Well tbh there aren't - and certainly not in this thread. I have been debating with goonswarm/CFC coalition people almost exclusively and the one or two without those tags (or posting in an NPC corp like some of your number) have generally been happy to be identified on the CFC side of the argument. Most notably - nobody from a hisec wardec corp has posted on your side of the argument. So you are in the position of supporting a nerf to a game system that impacts hisec (while claiming it does nothing to you) and thats dog-in-the-mangerism in its purest form. The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom Epic Inferno Wardec Test, Sign up and shoot Goons for free!
Holander Switzerland GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 20	Posted - 2012.06.18 20:46:00 - [408] - Quote Kyle Myr wrote: Why would we need to do that? We aren't a social place where you leave guns at the door. LIKE A HORIZONTAL TANGO CLUB A BANG BANG BAR A WEENIE TOUCHING CEREMONy
Alavaria Fera GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 1042	Posted - 2012.06.18 20:46:00 - [409] - Quote Sixx Spades wrote: Jade Constantine wrote: That would be my advise to Goonswarm as well. If you split up your alliance you could be protected from the consequence of high sec raiding corp dogpile without needing to advocate a complete nerfing of the defensive ally system. And you CONTINUE to assume we care. Please continue to use straw man arguments. There's a lot of citations needed there. I mean are they ganking all the neutral alts of the JF service? Those who cannot adapt become victims of Evolugalbugaslugakjlwsdhvbzxd
Weaselior GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 3522	Posted - 2012.06.18 20:47:00 - [410] - Quote Jade Constantine wrote: I have been debating with goonswarm/CFC coalition people almost exclusively and the one or two without those tags (or posting in an NPC corp like yourself) have generally been happy to be identified on the CFC side of the argument. You just defined everyone who disagrees with you as members of the CFC, in order to state only CFC members disagree with you.
Weaselior GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 3522	Posted - 2012.06.18 20:48:00 - [411] - Quote what I'm trying to say is do you see a problem with that logic
Richard Desturned GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 1044	Posted - 2012.06.18 20:50:00 - [412] - Quote Jade Constantine wrote: Most notably - nobody from a hisec wardec corp has posted on your side of the argument. Alekseyev Karrde wrote: The "merc tailored" option Soundwave referenced that I pushed for was a cap on allies (2-3 would have been nice) but you would not have any cost for taking them. If you wanted to hire a merc, you could at whatever price you negotiated. If you wanted to bring friends in, you could do it for free. If you wanted to accept free help from strangers (or strangers that buy in to your war dec) you could do that too, or any combination of the three. I feel this would have restored the merc market (the real one, not the Inferno mechanic) close to where it was before Inferno while not further unleveling the playing field between the big guys and the little guys. lol Noirdot are well-known CFC members of course eh
Jade Constantine Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction 2350	Posted - 2012.06.18 20:50:00 - [413] - Quote Weaselior wrote: what I'm trying to say is do you see a problem with that logic I see a problem with you leaving out the line above. The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom Epic Inferno Wardec Test, Sign up and shoot Goons for free!
dontbanmebro Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation 11	Posted - 2012.06.18 20:51:00 - [414] - Quote Jade Constantine wrote: So you are in the position of supporting a nerf citation needed
Nicolo da'Vicenza Divine Power. Cascade Imminent 1262	Posted - 2012.06.18 20:51:00 - [415] - Quote Weaselior wrote: Jade Constantine wrote: I have been debating with goonswarm/CFC coalition people almost exclusively and the one or two without those tags (or posting in an NPC corp like yourself) have generally been happy to be identified on the CFC side of the argument. You just defined everyone who disagrees with you as members of the CFC, in order to state only CFC members disagree with you. who do I send reimbursement mails to?
Weaselior GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 3522	Posted - 2012.06.18 20:52:00 - [416] - Quote Jade Constantine wrote: Weaselior wrote: what I'm trying to say is do you see a problem with that logic I see a problem with you leaving out the line above. the line above is the thing you attempted to prove, which you did by defining yourself as correct and then referencing your definition this rings no alarm bells in your head?
Weaselior GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 3522	Posted - 2012.06.18 20:52:00 - [417] - Quote no "wait a minute i may have done a dumb there hmm" thoughts?
Alavaria Fera GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 1042	Posted - 2012.06.18 20:52:00 - [418] - Quote Weaselior wrote: Jade Constantine wrote: I have been debating with goonswarm/CFC coalition people almost exclusively and the one or two without those tags (or posting in an NPC corp like yourself) have generally been happy to be identified on the CFC side of the argument. You just defined everyone who disagrees with you as members of the CFC, in order to state only CFC members disagree with you. That's kind of troublesome. I mean some CCP people disagree with him. That's why they made changes. Oh. Right. Those who cannot adapt become victims of Evolugalbugaslugakjlwsdhvbzxd
Holander Switzerland GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 20	Posted - 2012.06.18 20:54:00 - [419] - Quote Weaselior wrote: no "wait a minute i may have done a dumb there hmm" thoughts? just the sound of wind going in one ear out the other. Also spacecock. SEACREST OUT
Weaselior GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 3522	Posted - 2012.06.18 20:54:00 - [420] - Quote Nicolo da'Vicenza wrote: Weaselior wrote: Jade Constantine wrote: I have been debating with goonswarm/CFC coalition people almost exclusively and the one or two without those tags (or posting in an NPC corp like yourself) have generally been happy to be identified on the CFC side of the argument. You just defined everyone who disagrees with you as members of the CFC, in order to state only CFC members disagree with you. who do I send reimbursement mails to? fortunately we don't pick up the tab for the whole cfc's reimbursements or we might manage to bust our budget with our new size :ohdear:

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