But you didn't kill it, and back to the causation argument, you argue that it exploded because you aggressed it. So what? lets just suggest you're not coming close to breaking the tank, did you REALLY kill it? REALLY? You argue that because you fired upon it, maybe only the once, you are entitled to be considered a contribuatory factor in killing it. Should the person I buy the ship from be considered culpable, remember, I wouldn't have SD the ship if I hadn't bought it would I? Should squad leader be culpable for warping squad?

Simply this: If you're not the immediate factor in a ships popping you didn't kill it.

Simply this: If you're not the immediate factor in a ships popping you didn't kill it.

I self destruct cause I can. I self destructed a bellicose and logged off when we got invaded by 200 russians faggots in tengus.

Come at me haters.

But you didn't kill it, and back to the causation argument, you argue that it exploded because you aggressed it. So what? lets just suggest you're not coming close to breaking the tank, did you REALLY kill it? REALLY? You argue that because you fired upon it, maybe only the once, you are entitled to be considered a contribuatory factor in killing it. Should the person I buy the ship from be considered culpable, remember, I wouldn't have SD the ship if I hadn't bought it would I? Should squad leader be culpable for warping squad?

If you're not the immediate factor in a ships popping you didn't kill it.

3. You didn't apply enough damage to kill it.

4. You were not the immediate factor in it's destruction

5. The pilot had the option to deny the ship and equipment, you were unable to prevent him from doing what he wanted to do, therefore you failed at YOUR end.

Out of interest what are peoples thoughts about people self-destructing when they technically didn't make any kind of mistake at all?

If you aren't watching signatures or have already collapsed known wormholes - then it could be argued you have not done reasonable diligence and that you deserve to lose whatever you're flying.

BUT, what about if you're doing all of these things - you hit Siege/Triage in a site - and a new incoming wormhole spawns as you do so? You can't escape, you can't reship, in that situation unless you have support you're probably screwed (certainly in any lone capital). Appreciate the logical counter-argument is "always fly with support" but I'd challenge anyone to say that they haven't farmed their own C5-C6 sites in fewer numbers than would be considered prudent in a fleet fight.

Personally speaking, and unlike my corp mate, if I was in a fight from the outset I had no hope of winning and I believed I had done everything in advance I could reasonably have done - I'd consider SD. Especially if unnecessarily over-blobbed. If I'd committed to a fight and things went south midway through however, that's a different kettle of fish entirely.

Out of interest what are peoples thoughts about people self-destructing when they technically didn't make any kind of mistake at all?

If you aren't watching signatures or have already collapsed known wormholes - then it could be argued you have not done reasonable diligence and that you deserve to lose whatever you're flying.

BUT, what about if you're doing all of these things - you hit Siege/Triage in a site - and a new incoming wormhole spawns as you do so? You can't escape, you can't reship, in that situation unless you have support you're probably screwed (certainly in any lone capital). Appreciate the logical counter-argument is "always fly with support" but I'd challenge anyone to say that they haven't farmed their own C5-C6 sites in fewer numbers than would be considered prudent in a fleet fight.

Personally speaking, and unlike my corp mate, if I was in a fight from the outset I had no hope of winning and I believed I had done everything in advance I could reasonably have done - I'd consider SD. Especially if unnecessarily over-blobbed. If I'd committed to a fight and things went south midway through however, that's a different kettle of fish entirely.

But you didn't kill it, and back to the causation argument, you argue that it exploded because you aggressed it. So what? lets just suggest you're not coming close to breaking the tank, did you REALLY kill it? REALLY? You argue that because you fired upon it, maybe only the once, you are entitled to be considered a contribuatory factor in killing it. Should the person I buy the ship from be considered culpable, remember, I wouldn't have SD the ship if I hadn't bought it would I? Should squad leader be culpable for warping squad?
Simply this: If you're not the immediate factor in a ships popping you didn't kill it.


3. You didn't apply enough damage to kill it.
4. You were not the immediate factor in it's destruction
5. The pilot had the option to deny the ship and equipment, you were unable to prevent him from doing what he wanted to do, therefore you failed at YOUR end.

Is cowardice in a game even possible? The repercussion are zero in any and all situations.

Stop crying, my (big) belly hurts.

I don't think he can help it. If it works why bother fixing it? I don't know why people are so emotional about changing this.

I MEANT YOU!

I MEANT YOU!

I don't understand.

I don't understand.

This game is not all about combat and the actions of a target are not all about the aggressor.

The common misconception is that the reason for the target to self-destruct is to deny the aggressor a killmail. However, when I self-destruct a Strategic Cruiser, I'm self-destructing to protect my skill points and not give away a perfectly repairable ship.
The aggressors and his precious killmail are irrelevant to me

IF someone does indeed self-destructing only to deny the aggressor a killmail, it is just another form of grieving. There are many forms of grieving in EVE, it is just that usually the aggressor is on the delivering, instead of on the receiving side.

So, the tears about not receiving a killmail are no different from the tears from suicide ganked miners. Not getting what you want, or losing what you have, is part of EVE. It is what sets this game apart from your average cuddly MMO.

There were two points that were made during the course of this thread.

1-. The SD that matter were of capital and pos mods/poses.
2-. Also as important as above was the fact that a more advanced tool than the kill mail was requiered to better undestand how a battle develops, other than fraps.

That being said I do not understand the quote above except for tve tengu thing that is pretty obvious. But i tell you this. Eject worksfaster and better than SD.

There were two points that were made during the course of this thread.

1-. The SD that matter were of capital and pos mods/poses.
2-. Also as important as above was the fact that a more advanced tool than the kill mail was requiered to better undestand how a battle develops, other than fraps.

That being said I do not understand the quote above except for tve tengu thing that is pretty obvious. But i tell you this. Eject worksfaster and better than SD.

You're right, I don't understand the quote above. lrn2 english.

Also, since when can you self destruct POS's and POS mods? (Spoiler: You can't)

I meant the ships inside, I messed up. Can't work and try to answer a post at the same time.

PS: engrish second languagege, my mess some up thing s in times from times

Seems CCP woke up and released KM for SDing, atleast that what people claim since today on 2 Supers that SDed and issued a KM anyway.

If so, huge thanks to CCP

words spreading out, just need more confirmation.

anyway OP can suck it

words spreading out, just need more confirmation.

anyway OP can suck it

The SD mails are bugs, they happened a few months back as well randomly until CCP fixed it again. You can tell its a bug because the mails are malformed.