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14 Accounts Multiboxed, How To Do It!

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Zhek Kromtor	Posted - 2010.03.27 04:45:00 - [1] After being 3-day banned for merely mining as a multiboxer (the ban stated "macro use" though no macros or automation were being used) I decided to make a site to demonstrate how you can multibox without breaking any rules. I won't be mining anymore and I can understand how seeing 12 ospreys mining would cause players and GM's to assume the worst. Now I'm training exploration to hopefully do some complexes. Here's the site explaining how I have more computers than friends: http://sites.google.com/site/khromtor/ If we could get some clarification from CCP about whether using programs like Synergy that merely allow you to use a single mouse among multiple computers in the same way someone uses a single mouse when they have multiple displays that would definitely open the door to a lot more multiboxers... and multiboxers are generally very fun to pewpew. Just ask the guys that blew up my entire rokh mining fleet a week ago as I attempted my 0.0 escape.
Severus Caro Caldari Macro Hunters and Killers	Posted - 2010.03.27 04:52:00 - [2] Just... wow. Yes, not exactly constructive, but I have to say...
Wendi Watson	Posted - 2010.03.27 05:01:00 - [3] http://www.eveonline.com/pnp/eula.asp Section 7, A, 3: Quote: You may not use macros or other stored rapid keystrokes or other patterns of play that facilitate acquisition of items, currency, objects, character attributes, rank or status at an accelerated rate when compared with ordinary Game play. You may not rewrite or modify the user interface or otherwise manipulate data in any way to acquire items, currency, objects, character attributes or beneficial actions not actually acquired or achieved in the Game. Such a setup can hardly be considered a normal game play
Thorning	Posted - 2010.03.27 05:29:00 - [4] That's both ridiculous - the measures taken to not potentially violate an EVE rule - and hilariously awesome - the overall setup. Wish I could afford that kind of setup. Is standard multiboxing with synergy and broadcasted keystrokes really not permitted in EVE? Its allowed in like every MMO out there. I find it hard to believe that EVE would have some weird restriction on it. I see the GM comment you refer to on your site, but I bet there is a good chance that's just a random GM dude who doesn't really know/understand multiboxing or how the rules of EVE apply to it.
inVictu5 Globo Gym Purple Cobras	Posted - 2010.03.27 05:48:00 - [5] Edited by: inVictu5 on 27/03/2010 05:48:06 I kind of have the same setup.. But I use it to rub one out, nothing like having 14 hands know what Im saying Here at Globo Gym were better than you! And we know it
Zeba Minmatar Honourable East India Trading Company	Posted - 2010.03.27 06:08:00 - [6] whoa.. I really like eve and have on many occasions ran 5 accounts at once on one machine using dual screens but that setup is just borderline crazy. I salute you. 07 Originally by: CCP Zymurgist Get off the forums and go kill someone! CCP Shadow's Troll List.
Kayai	Posted - 2010.03.27 06:10:00 - [7] wow, just wow... asinine in deed.
Jerid Verges	Posted - 2010.03.27 06:15:00 - [8] Originally by: Wendi Watson http://www.eveonline.com/pnp/eula.asp Section 7, A, 3: Quote: You may not use macros or other stored rapid keystrokes or other patterns of play that facilitate acquisition of items, currency, objects, character attributes, rank or status at an accelerated rate when compared with ordinary Game play. You may not rewrite or modify the user interface or otherwise manipulate data in any way to acquire items, currency, objects, character attributes or beneficial actions not actually acquired or achieved in the Game. Such a setup can hardly be considered a normal game play Yet it is perfectly okay to metagame with 2, 3, even more alts. Doublestandards.
Vaal Erit Science and Trade Institute	Posted - 2010.03.27 06:27:00 - [9] It's a low tech macro, but still a macro. I applaud your creativity and engineering skills but am glad that CCP bans your accounts. We got enough problems with alts and people 2-3 boxing and the like, we don't need this. Also, they only ban macro users for 3 days? Well I can see why we are still flooded with macros to this day. Originally by: Jim Raynor EVE needs danger, EVE needs risks, EVE needs combat, even piracy, without these things, the game stagnates to a trivial game centering around bloating your wallet with no purpose.
Estephania Independent Political Analysts	Posted - 2010.03.27 06:29:00 - [10] I think the OP shouldn't be worried about being banned from Eve. First he should get a life. Paying for 14 accounts to suck roids looks like RMT farming and certainly can not be considered a NORMAL gameplay.

Ji Sama Caldari Tash-Murkon Prime Industries United Corporations Of Modern Eve	Posted - 2010.03.27 07:05:00 - [11]
Typhado3 Minmatar	Posted - 2010.03.27 07:44:00 - [12] I salute you o7 while I really don't think your bad, a line has to be drawn and for me the line is you have to click yourself the buttons that take the actions. Programs (or pieces of wood) that let you do multiple button clicks at once are stepping over that line. ------------------------------ God is an afk cloaker
Cambarus The Compass Reloaded	Posted - 2010.03.27 07:47:00 - [13] I've seen threads like this before and CCP have actually stated that it's allowed to use certain macros and mouse/keyboard duplicators for the purpose of multiboxing, but tbh with that many accounts running at the same time you really shouldn't be surprised that CCP assumed the worst. I mean like 2 or 3 fine, maybe even 4, but 12? That's just asking for GMs to poke their noses in >_>
Serpents smile	Posted - 2010.03.27 07:50:00 - [14] That's just nuckingfuts!
Boomershoot Caldari Suddenly Ninjas	Posted - 2010.03.27 10:25:00 - [15] Originally by: Cambarus I've seen threads like this before and CCP have actually stated that it's allowed to use certain macros and mouse/keyboard duplicators for the purpose of multiboxing No.
DearMotherOfGod Tim and Sasha Savings and Loans	Posted - 2010.03.27 10:29:00 - [16] You're clearly crazy(in the good kind of way)
L1P	Posted - 2010.03.27 10:37:00 - [17] Originally by: Wendi Watson http://www.eveonline.com/pnp/eula.asp Section 7, A, 3: Quote: You may not use macros or other stored rapid keystrokes or other patterns of play that facilitate acquisition of items, currency, objects, character attributes, rank or status at an accelerated rate when compared with ordinary Game play. You may not rewrite or modify the user interface or otherwise manipulate data in any way to acquire items, currency, objects, character attributes or beneficial actions not actually acquired or achieved in the Game. Such a setup can hardly be considered a normal game play Not normal yes, but I salute his ingenuity and he does not use macros or stored rapid keystrokes. While I understand how it would look to a GM, they got it wrong in this case.
Dirk Mortice	Posted - 2010.03.27 10:44:00 - [18] Edited by: Dirk Mortice on 27/03/2010 10:45:09 Originally by: Zhek Kromtor After being 3-day banned for merely mining as a multiboxer (the ban stated "macro use" though no macros or automation were being used) I decided to make a site to demonstrate how you can multibox without breaking any rules. I won't be mining anymore and I can understand how seeing 12 ospreys mining would cause players and GM's to assume the worst. Now I'm training exploration to hopefully do some complexes. Here's the site explaining how I have more computers than friends: http://sites.google.com/site/khromtor/ If we could get some clarification from CCP about whether using programs like Synergy that merely allow you to use a single mouse among multiple computers in the same way someone uses a single mouse when they have multiple displays that would definitely open the door to a lot more multiboxers... and multiboxers are generally very fun to pewpew. Just ask the guys that blew up my entire rokh mining fleet a week ago as I attempted my 0.0 escape. You got banned for it, that sounds like clarification to me, no? Also, mining with 12 ospreys, are you kidding me!?? Why would you ever want to do that
Arec Bardwin	Posted - 2010.03.27 10:56:00 - [19] What does your girlfriend say to that crazy computer setup??
Sokratesz Rionnag Alba Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2010.03.27 10:56:00 - [20] Heh, awesome. CSM Iceland meeting minutes - READ THEM :D

Gauss Gun	Posted - 2010.03.27 10:57:00 - [21] Edited by: Gauss Gun on 27/03/2010 10:58:20 Originally by: Wendi Watson http://www.eveonline.com/pnp/eula.asp Section 7, A, 3: Quote: You may not use macros or other stored rapid keystrokes or other patterns of play that facilitate acquisition of items, currency, objects, character attributes, rank or status at an accelerated rate when compared with ordinary Game play. You may not rewrite or modify the user interface or otherwise manipulate data in any way to acquire items, currency, objects, character attributes or beneficial actions not actually acquired or achieved in the Game. Such a setup can hardly be considered a normal game play As with any "law" wording can be interpreted in different ways, however I strongly disagree with CCP's an in this case. What does constitute pattern of play ? Pattern by definition in the context of eve can be interpreted as a set of repetetive actions which take place over and over again. By that logic any single missioner will be considered a macro miner because he keeps doing same stuff over and over again - run one mission after another - PATTERN. In defense of the guy I would like to say that traditionally macro mining was referred to robot manipulating account rather than a real human being. The logic here is such, that for all other "honest" players its kinda difficult to compete with people who macro mine, hence the activity is made illegal. What we have here is not the case of macro mining simply put because it is actually REAL human being sitting behind the monitor. What we do have is some creative thinking as to how he could make resources available to him more productive and useful. In order to make his ideas work he is using some nifty technical ideas. By the logic of that CCP GM who banned him in the first place, he should be banned again for longer for 2nd offence. Simply because even though he did change technical means, but he is (by his own admission) keeps doing the same thing as before - mining in high sec with multiple accounts, but now he is controlling them not by means of some programme but rather by means of 10 of mouses stacked together. I have a feeling that GM just did not bother to look into the situation carefully enough to properly evaluate it and issued a ban. So we can we have a proper official opinion on the matter ? edit/ spelling
Dratic Reaper Industries Cry Havoc.	Posted - 2010.03.27 11:00:00 - [22] Originally by: Dirk Mortice Edited by: Dirk Mortice on 27/03/2010 10:45:09 Originally by: Zhek Kromtor After being 3-day banned for merely mining as a multiboxer (the ban stated "macro use" though no macros or automation were being used) I decided to make a site to demonstrate how you can multibox without breaking any rules. I won't be mining anymore and I can understand how seeing 12 ospreys mining would cause players and GM's to assume the worst. Now I'm training exploration to hopefully do some complexes. Here's the site explaining how I have more computers than friends: http://sites.google.com/site/khromtor/ If we could get some clarification from CCP about whether using programs like Synergy that merely allow you to use a single mouse among multiple computers in the same way someone uses a single mouse when they have multiple displays that would definitely open the door to a lot more multiboxers... and multiboxers are generally very fun to pewpew. Just ask the guys that blew up my entire rokh mining fleet a week ago as I attempted my 0.0 escape. You got banned for it, that sounds like clarification to me, no? Also, mining with 12 ospreys, are you kidding me!?? Why would you ever want to do that Why not! He's obviously got the hardware for it, hes done the drakes, myrms now a few ospreys for mining.
Dirk Mortice	Posted - 2010.03.27 11:05:00 - [23] Originally by: Dratic Originally by: Dirk Mortice Edited by: Dirk Mortice on 27/03/2010 10:45:09 Originally by: Zhek Kromtor After being 3-day banned for merely mining as a multiboxer (the ban stated "macro use" though no macros or automation were being used) I decided to make a site to demonstrate how you can multibox without breaking any rules. I won't be mining anymore and I can understand how seeing 12 ospreys mining would cause players and GM's to assume the worst. Now I'm training exploration to hopefully do some complexes. Here's the site explaining how I have more computers than friends: http://sites.google.com/site/khromtor/ If we could get some clarification from CCP about whether using programs like Synergy that merely allow you to use a single mouse among multiple computers in the same way someone uses a single mouse when they have multiple displays that would definitely open the door to a lot more multiboxers... and multiboxers are generally very fun to pewpew. Just ask the guys that blew up my entire rokh mining fleet a week ago as I attempted my 0.0 escape. You got banned for it, that sounds like clarification to me, no? Also, mining with 12 ospreys, are you kidding me!?? Why would you ever want to do that Why not! He's obviously got the hardware for it, hes done the drakes, myrms now a few ospreys for mining. whatever floats your internet spaceboat I suppose
Baneken Gallente Aseveljet Sev3rance	Posted - 2010.03.27 11:18:00 - [24] Originally by: Arec Bardwin What does your girlfriend say to that crazy computer setup?? You assume that OP's girlfriend hasn't left already with an obsession like that ?
Jim Pooley The Bobtheminer Appreciation Society	Posted - 2010.03.27 11:24:00 - [25] Originally by: Baneken Originally by: Arec Bardwin What does your girlfriend say to that crazy computer setup?? You assume that OP's girlfriend hasn't left already with an obsession like that ? And you're assuming he even had one in the first place ------------------------------------------ Mines a Pint of Large
Ramiera DaMorre	Posted - 2010.03.27 11:26:00 - [26] Edited by: Ramiera DaMorre on 27/03/2010 11:26:09 Now you're just assuming all girls are "normal" and just like the others.
Mara Rinn	Posted - 2010.03.27 11:28:00 - [27] Originally by: Wendi Watson Section 7, A, 3: Quote: You may not use macros or other stored rapid keystrokes or other patterns of play that facilitate acquisition of items, currency, objects, character attributes, rank or status at an accelerated rate when compared with ordinary Game play.... Such a setup can hardly be considered a normal game play How? He's not doing anything that 14 players side by side couldn't do too. He's not acquiring items, currency, objects, character attributes, rank or status faster than 14 players side by side. He's doing ordinary game play on 14 computers side by side. If you're going to quote the rules, at least emphasise the important points: Quote: You may not use macros or other stored rapid keystrokes or other patterns of play that facilitate acquisition of items, currency, objects, character attributes, rank or status at an accelerated rate when compared with ordinary Game play.... See? Focus on the important qualifier in the sentence, and suddenly it all becomes crystal clear. Originally by: Baneken You assume that OP's girlfriend hasn't left already with an obsession like that ? You assume the OP ever had a girlfriend? [Aussie players: join channels ANZAC or AUSSIES]
Hamno M. Corp Daisho Syndicate	Posted - 2010.03.27 11:34:00 - [28] Well, if your going to do something you might as do it well... The NEW M.Corp Data Hub - Check it out!
Fingers McSteal	Posted - 2010.03.27 12:00:00 - [29] lol... Suggestion... Standup and go to window of house your in... look outside... discover there is a world out there with beer and women in it and seriously... you need to get out more
Swiftgaze Elysium Trading Company Elysium Alliance	Posted - 2010.03.27 12:01:00 - [30] Edited by: Swiftgaze on 27/03/2010 12:02:12 It's funny how you're still discussing about rules that aren't any. You may not use macros or other stored rapid keystrokes or other patterns of play that facilitate acquisition of items, currency, objects, character attributes, rank or status at an accelerated rate when compared with ordinary Game play. Argument: "No Scotsman puts sugar in his porridge." Answer: "But my uncle Angus is a Scotsman, and he puts sugar in his porridge." Falsification: "Yes, but your uncle Angus is no true Scotsman." There is no true definition of the subject of discussion, ordinary game play, which means the rule you are debating about is undefined as well. This is pointless. ----------------------------------- Pregnant? Tired? Crack-addict? Hate Eve?

Gauss Gun	Posted - 2010.03.27 12:04:00 - [31] Originally by: Swiftgaze Edited by: Swiftgaze on 27/03/2010 12:02:12 It's funny how you're still discussing about rules that aren't any. You may not use macros or other stored rapid keystrokes or other patterns of play that facilitate acquisition of items, currency, objects, character attributes, rank or status at an accelerated rate when compared with ordinary Game play. Argument: "No Scotsman puts sugar in his porridge." Answer: "But my uncle Angus is a Scotsman, and he puts sugar in his porridge." Falsification: "Yes, but your uncle Angus is no true Scotsman." There is no true definition of the subject of discussion, ordinary game play, which means the rule you are debating about is undefined as well. This is pointless. thats why we need an official response for this
Rastigan Caldari Ars ex Discordia SOLODRAKBANSOLODRAKBANSO	Posted - 2010.03.27 12:47:00 - [32] Originally by: Mara Rinn How? He's not doing anything that 14 players side by side couldn't do too. He's not acquiring items, currency, objects, character attributes, rank or status faster than 14 players side by side. He's doing ordinary game play on 14 computers side by side. He is still behind the wheel of all 14 accounts, those accounts cant do anything by themselves without him clicking... Something that cant be said about any 0.0 Battleship who stays 3+ hours in one system killing belt rats. Seriously CCP it really cant be that hard to try and filter out macro ratters.
Boomershoot Caldari Suddenly Ninjas	Posted - 2010.03.27 12:50:00 - [33] Originally by: Rastigan Originally by: Mara Rinn How? He's not doing anything that 14 players side by side couldn't do too. He's not acquiring items, currency, objects, character attributes, rank or status faster than 14 players side by side. He's doing ordinary game play on 14 computers side by side. He is still behind the wheel of all 14 accounts, those accounts cant do anything by themselves without him clicking... Something that cant be said about any 0.0 Battleship who stays 3+ hours in one system killing belt rats. Seriously CCP it really cant be that hard to try and filter out macro ratters. He's clicking 13 times faster than anyone without macros could ever do.
Rastigan Caldari Ars ex Discordia SOLODRAKBANSOLODRAKBANSO	Posted - 2010.03.27 12:54:00 - [34] Edited by: Rastigan on 27/03/2010 12:54:26 Edited by: Rastigan on 27/03/2010 12:53:53 Originally by: Boomershoot He's clicking 13 times faster than anyone without macros could ever do. Did you even go to his website to see how its done ? http://sites.google.com/site/khromtor/
Destruction Theory	Posted - 2010.03.27 12:58:00 - [35] I say let him, he's not using software, and if he wants to spend that much money on a setup, specifically designed to skirt around ccps rules, then let him. It is completely irrelevant as to how MANY accounts he is, it is however relevant how he uses them. According to his website, he only uses physical means, no software is involved. CCP were wrong to ban him, though I can understand how they assumed that he was a macro miner.
hired goon	Posted - 2010.03.27 13:45:00 - [36] The question that preoccupies me is, if you have the money to spend on that setup PLUS the ú130 per month it costs to afford 14 accounts; why not spend all that on PLEX and make all the money you are probably making mining... but instantly and without mind numbing boredom or GM bans??? -omg-
vulnevia The Exploited. Black Star Alliance	Posted - 2010.03.27 13:56:00 - [37] Just you wait untill this guy buys 14 battleships and starts to gatecamp somewhere... --------- the EVE Crafting Blog
Niclas Solo Amarr GANKsTers's inc. R.E.P.O.	Posted - 2010.03.27 14:00:00 - [38] Originally by: hired goon The question that preoccupies me is, if you have the money to spend on that setup PLUS the ú130 per month it costs to afford 14 accounts; why not spend all that on PLEX and make all the money you are probably making mining... but instantly and without mind numbing boredom or GM bans??? Because he can? But really wow all that just to be able to mine in ospreys? maybe you should take a chat with a psycholog? you shouln't be banned for playing like this but it isn't right.
Gone'Postal Roast and Toast Inc.	Posted - 2010.03.27 14:14:00 - [39] Edited by: Gone''Postal on 27/03/2010 14:15:06 Edited by: Gone''Postal on 27/03/2010 14:14:47 Originally by: Boomershoot Originally by: Cambarus I've seen threads like this before and CCP have actually stated that it's allowed to use certain macros and mouse/keyboard duplicators for the purpose of multiboxing No. Yes. The Bindable keys on teh G15 keyboard are allowed, and these can be bound to any keystroke and/or combi. Also, OP.. Jesus.. but credit for thinking outside the box lol. Originally by: Rells Without the carebears, the economy would be dead.
Furb Killer Gallente	Posted - 2010.03.27 14:22:00 - [40] Originally by: Gone'Postal Edited by: Gone''Postal on 27/03/2010 14:15:06 Edited by: Gone''Postal on 27/03/2010 14:14:47 Originally by: Boomershoot Originally by: Cambarus I've seen threads like this before and CCP have actually stated that it's allowed to use certain macros and mouse/keyboard duplicators for the purpose of multiboxing No. Yes. The Bindable keys on teh G15 keyboard are allowed, and these can be bound to any keystroke and/or combi. Also, OP.. Jesus.. but credit for thinking outside the box lol. Wanted to post this, but beaten :( Since G15 macros are allowed (now suddenly half of eve starts raging because i mentioned the word macro), i cant see any reason why this wouldnt be allowed. And then also with a normal electronic solution instead of a wooden one. If playing with 14 accounts would be too 'different', than playing with 2 also shouldnt be allowed. And why wouldnt playing on 14 accounts be allowed, but is spamming local in half of eve still allowed? So i dont see any reason why he would be doing something wrong. Btw, you are all assuming OP isnt a girl. (Okay unlikely, but still).

small chimp	Posted - 2010.03.27 14:30:00 - [41] 14 account wow that must be a hardcore (wow player) i guess that guy who mines with 14 account is so hc that uh he is a famous alliance lerder!?!?
Phantom Slave Universal Pest Exterminators	Posted - 2010.03.27 14:37:00 - [42] Originally by: Boomershoot He's clicking 13 times faster than anyone without macros could ever do. If you look at the link in the OP you'll see that he can NOT click "13 times faster". He has 6 mice taped together with wooden dowels holding them still. He can move his 6 pointers faster than 1 person can, but still has to manually click each mouse button to do things. @OP: I can't even fathom doing what you're doing. Mining is so terribly boring, and mining with 12 osprey's? Mind Numbingly boring stuff going on there. Good luck to you and I hope CCP see's this thread so they can respond.
Hixxy Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2010.03.27 15:14:00 - [43] while it might not be the case for the OP but only a 3 day ban for macroing? should be insta account lockdown and for eternity or until proven otherwise. also posting it's just a 3 day ban might not be too clever an idea as it might encourage people to try it as the penalties are so weak.
Pesky LaRue Minmatar Brotherhood Of Fallen Angels	Posted - 2010.03.27 15:15:00 - [44] Originally by: Arec Bardwin What does your girlfriend say to that crazy computer setup?? Haha, very droll. . [Brotherhood Of Fallen Angels]
Shirley Serious Amarr The Khanid Sisters of Athra	Posted - 2010.03.27 15:32:00 - [45] There's those stories in the news, with people with extra fingers on their hands. Is that allowed? There are input devices to control computers with the foot. If a person has the co-ordination to use those simultaneously on one computer, and a mouse+keyboard on another, is that allowed? And other things like that. Using software doodads, is clearer to say "don't do this" But, if a person can operate 6 machines at once through other means - mechanical contraptions, or extra fingers, or whatever, then there is nothing really there, that the Eula can outlaw, is there? "You may not have more than 4 fingers and one thumb per hand" ? would look daft, no? Yes. Yes, I am.
Gerrei	Posted - 2010.03.27 15:34:00 - [46] Originally by: Arec Bardwin What does your girlfriend say to that crazy computer setup?? I lol'd. Then I remembered I don't have a girlfriend, and I lol'd some more.
Menkaure Amarr LEM0N	Posted - 2010.03.27 15:42:00 - [47] Originally by: hired goon The question that preoccupies me is, if you have the money to spend on that setup PLUS the ú130 per month it costs to afford 14 accounts; why not spend all that on PLEX and make all the money you are probably making mining... but instantly and without mind numbing boredom or GM bans??? ^This, good point. Also... I call shenanigans. I cant believe this would work that well... especially with that mouse contraption thing. You'd lose some along the way for some reason or another. I think its a fake. Or a cleverly thought out way to "prove" that hes not using macros, when he actually is. Setting up photos of some bizarre setup that people think might work, then just turning on the macros when everyone is convinced he's legit! Whatever it is, I don't buy the setup for a second.
Serpents smile	Posted - 2010.03.27 15:52:00 - [48] Hmmm, why do 6 monitors show -exact- the same screen?
Cozmik R5 Minmatar Dock 94 Chaos Theory Alliance	Posted - 2010.03.27 16:11:00 - [49] Life: not everybody has one. ____________________ Try not. Do. Or do not. There is no try.
Suicide'Alts'FTW Gallente Federal Navy Academy	Posted - 2010.03.27 16:53:00 - [50] I love analogies, don't you? --- Let us consider a chef that wants to cook in a particular kitchen. As this is backwards world he must pay for the privilege of using the kitchen and must abide by the funny kitchen EULA. Supposing the chef finds himself stirring a pot of soup with a ladle on a burner in the kitchen. There is one chef, one ladle, and one pot on a stove burner in a kitchen. Let us suppose then than the chef wanted to make soup more expeditiously so he adds a further three pots of soup to the stove and starts cycling between the pots. The chef is not allowed to build a robot to do the stirring for him as this breaks the kitchen EULA as it would be unfair to the other chefs in the kitchen if our chef had a helper. The chef can, however, buy a ladle to partially perform the act of stirring. The catch is, 1. it must not be any faster or more effective than if the chef were to stir normally, 2. that the ladle is moved manually between pots, 3. that the chef holds onto the ladle the whole time the ladle is stirring, 4. that the act of stirring absolutely must not be completely performed by the ladle. This is does not break the kitchen EULA(see discussion on "G15 macros," note that this analogy isn't perfect but bear with me) as it has been determined to not be particularly advantageous for a chef to use this ladle. But suppose the chef made a contraption that had four ladles attached to it so he could reach and stir all four pots at the same time with the same contraption. The question of if this breaks the EULA of the kitchen is not entirely clear. A broad interpretation, and the best historical evidence that can be garnered given that it is against the kitchen EULA to discuss some of the specifics of an EULA ruling, would indicate that it does break the kitchen EULA. And this would be the case irregardless of if the contraption were a spider-web system of wires suspending/connecting the four ladles, or a large jig with a handle holding the four ladles in relation to each other, or any other contrivance imaginable. That is the situation and conundrum as best I can describe it.

Rastigan Caldari Ars ex Discordia SOLODRAKBANSOLODRAKBANSO	Posted - 2010.03.27 17:01:00 - [51] Originally by: Serpents smile Hmmm, why do 6 monitors show -exact- the same screen? In order for him to mirror things, everything pretty much has to be exactly the same. same resolution, button location, etc...
Vixisti The Scope	Posted - 2010.03.27 17:08:00 - [52] You're crazy..... but I like it!!!
Zeba Minmatar Honourable East India Trading Company	Posted - 2010.03.27 18:14:00 - [53] Originally by: vulnevia Just you wait untill this guy buys 14 battleships and starts to gatecamp somewhere... Heh, yeah. Thats going to be 14 easy killmails added to someones resume. Originally by: CCP Zymurgist Get off the forums and go kill someone! CCP Shadow's Troll List.
Roemy Schneider Vanishing Point.	Posted - 2010.03.27 18:19:00 - [54] nerf the drake already - putting the gist back into logistics
Cors It's A Trap	Posted - 2010.03.27 18:29:00 - [55] funny thing is, if you used those exact same computers, and use a program like input director to move across the computers(Screens) you'd be fine. You'd have to do each action for each account on each screen, and may slow you down, but it'd be legal. The reason you got banned was when ccp saw the accounts, and saw the exact same mouse movements/mouse clicks on multiple clients at once.
Rawr Cristina Caldari Omerta Syndicate	Posted - 2010.03.27 18:32:00 - [56] Edited by: Rawr Cristina on 27/03/2010 18:35:22 I don't see how using Synergy is any different from having 2 clients running on the same PC on seperate monitors, just more stable (my PC crashes a lot when I run both my accounts, so I sometimes use Synergy so I can have my laptop running the 2nd one, didn't know you could get banned for it...) I do see how they might have figured that 14 ospreys with similar names might have been a macro fleet, though... Originally by: Cors funny thing is, if you used those exact same computers, and use a program like input director to move across the computers(Screens) you'd be fine. You'd have to do each action for each account on each screen, and may slow you down, but it'd be legal. The reason you got banned was when ccp saw the accounts, and saw the exact same mouse movements/mouse clicks on multiple clients at once. That's exactly what Synergy does. It dosen't automate, just allow you to use 1 mouse/keyb across multiple PCs - Malyutka (The Virus) -
Messick Gallente University of Caille	Posted - 2010.03.27 18:41:00 - [57] Awesome Command Center you have there!!! just toooooo cool :) I'm still trying to convince the Wife I need a 2nd monitor (well want, not need) ------------------- Some good Advice to live by is Here.
TooNu Caldari Nefarious Activities	Posted - 2010.03.27 19:58:00 - [58] And nobody else wonders why he has a small bottle of glue on his desk?
JeanMichel Bizarre Volition Cult	Posted - 2010.03.27 20:18:00 - [59] Originally by: Arec Bardwin What does your girlfriend say to that crazy computer setup?? Haha, I see what you did there. ------
FightTh3p0w3r	Posted - 2010.03.27 20:34:00 - [60] my friends say my dual screen setup is insane, wait till they see those pics. ---------- Vote CCP Prism X for employee of the year!

Cipher Jones Minmatar	Posted - 2010.03.27 21:10:00 - [61] Originally by: Vaal Erit It's a low tech macro, but still a macro. I applaud your creativity and engineering skills but am glad that CCP bans your accounts. We got enough problems with alts and people 2-3 boxing and the like, we don't need this. Also, they only ban macro users for 3 days? Well I can see why we are still flooded with macros to this day. Its certainly not a macro, as it only provides one input to each box. You have to sign the EULA for EACH client/account. It is only entering one command to each client and is therefore not a macro on any level. This is clearly a signature.
Lance Fighter Amarr	Posted - 2010.03.27 21:32:00 - [62] I raise the question: how long does it take to sign into all the accounts? are they all setup to use the same password.. something on the numpad? hmm? Originally by: CCP Shadow Have you ever wished you could have prevented a train wreck before it actually happened? I need to stop this one before the craziness begins.
000Hunter000 Gallente Industrial Exploits Massive Intergalactic Love Klub	Posted - 2010.03.27 22:34:00 - [63] Now... Usually i don't really care how people spend their time but... i gotta say... GET A LIFE DUDE!!! ________________________________________________
Eddie Gordo Minmatar Masuat'aa Matari Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2010.03.27 23:44:00 - [64] Multiple monitors definatly increases productivity. I use 2/3 monitors when I'm doing design work and they also come in handy if I want to run my 2 accounts + watch a movie... but this is a little bit silly :) Dust514 \| Podlogs \| Pluggit
Spurty Caldari D00M. RED.OverLord	Posted - 2010.03.27 23:50:00 - [65] gotta salute you there. Very inventive. So, you pay for all of your game time this way? Do you actually have time to 'play' the actual game or is all your time spent making isk to buy the PLEXs ? Can't see any problem with this myself. Originally by: Hurley I WAS NOT QUITTING SoT AND WAS NOT THINKING ABOUT JOINING IT. PL/SoT MADE A MISTAKE AND ARE NOT MAN ENOUGH TO ADMIT IT OR FIX IT.
AdmiralJohn The Unknown Bar and Pub Elysium Alliance	Posted - 2010.03.28 00:00:00 - [66] I'll bet that every single person supporting this guy is actually one of the 42 characters he is capable of using. OP: You fail in more ways than you have accounts. Originally by: Mara Rinn How? He's not doing anything that 14 players side by side couldn't do too. He's not acquiring items, currency, objects, character attributes, rank or status faster than 14 players side by side. He's doing ordinary game play on 14 computers side by side. The point is, he isn't fourteen people, why the hell should he be able to benefit as if he were?
Zhek Kromtor	Posted - 2010.03.28 00:11:00 - [67] Edited by: Zhek Kromtor on 28/03/2010 00:16:30 Originally by: AdmiralJohn I'll bet that every single person supporting this guy is actually one of the 42 characters he is capable of using. OP: You fail in more ways than you have accounts. The point is, he isn't fourteen people, why the hell should he be able to benefit as if he were? Because if I'm not allowed to play 14 then nobody should be allowed to play 2, unless CCP wants to come up with an arbitrary maximum number of accounts that one person can play. And while we're on the subject of numbers, if you and your 13 space buddies really get beat by someone using wooden dowels to control 14 ships it is abundantly clear who fails in the most ways.
Mashie Saldana Red Federation	Posted - 2010.03.28 00:13:00 - [68] I would say the pics are just for show if a GM asks and the mouse/key cloning apps still are used as before. After all it is no way in hell that the mouse assembly would work, even if two hands are used to move it. Godly scientist/builder/reverse engineer for sale
AdmiralJohn The Unknown Bar and Pub Elysium Alliance	Posted - 2010.03.28 00:14:00 - [69] Originally by: Zhek Kromtor Because if I'm not allowed to play 14 then nobody should be allowed to play 2, unless CCP wants to come up with an arbitrary maximum number of accounts that one person can play. I agree. I have this one lonely account. Alts make the game exponentially harder for casual gamers who don't have that kind of money or time to throw around.
Kultur Klaus	Posted - 2010.03.28 00:26:00 - [70] DUDE, SERIOUSLY

Ivas Tiffy Amarr Royal Amarr Institute	Posted - 2010.03.28 00:27:00 - [71] Originally by: Zhek Kromtor Edited by: Zhek Kromtor on 27/03/2010 21:10:54 After being erroneously 3-day banned for "macro use" while merely mining as a multiboxer (no macros or automation were being used - just Synergy a program that lets you share 1 mouse over multiple computers) I decided to make a site to demonstrate how I have adapted my technique of multiboxing to definitely not break any rules of the EULA. I no longer use Synergy or even mine. I can understand how seeing 12 ospreys mining would cause players and GM's to assume the worst. Now I'm training exploration to hopefully do some complexes. Here's the site explaining how I have more computers than friends: http://sites.google.com/site/khromtor/ If we could get some clarification from CCP about whether using programs like Synergy that merely allow you to use a single mouse among multiple computers in the same way someone uses a single mouse when they have multiple displays that would definitely open the door to a lot more multiboxers... and multiboxers are generally very fun to pewpew. Just ask the guys that blew up my entire rokh mining fleet a week ago as I attempted my 0.0 escape. Edit: Whether or not using a wooden dowel across some keypads is allowed is not up for debate IMO. The use of prosthetics, pirate hooks, wooden dowels or your face for pressing buttons is simply not breaking any rules. The question is whether or not multiboxers should be allowed to use common multiboxing software explicity allowed in almost all other major MMO's. IDIOTS like you should be perma banned... for using a external programe to get a unfair advantage that cannot be done via normal means IE: exploit. i hope you get perma removed!
EntroX Reikoku IT Alliance	Posted - 2010.03.28 00:40:00 - [72] Originally by: Zhek Kromtor Just ask the guys that blew up my entire rokh mining fleet a week ago as I attempted my 0.0 escape. Just passing by to confirm that i did enjoy that! /trox
Max Hardcase Art of War Cult of War	Posted - 2010.03.28 00:41:00 - [73] Edited by: Max Hardcase on 28/03/2010 00:41:01 Somehow this reminds of the cliched mastermind villain of comic book lore who sits behinds the scenes plotting. Something like this : http://www.heroes-inc.net/?p=1038
Ivas Tiffy Amarr Royal Amarr Institute	Posted - 2010.03.28 00:48:00 - [74] Originally by: Zhek Kromtor Edited by: Zhek Kromtor on 28/03/2010 00:16:30 Originally by: AdmiralJohn I'll bet that every single person supporting this guy is actually one of the 42 characters he is capable of using. OP: You fail in more ways than you have accounts. The point is, he isn't fourteen people, why the hell should he be able to benefit as if he were? Because if I'm not allowed to play 14 then nobody should be allowed to play 2, unless CCP wants to come up with an arbitrary maximum number of accounts that one person can play. And while we're on the subject of numbers, if you and your 13 space buddies really get beat by someone using wooden dowels to control 14 ships it is abundantly clear who fails in the most ways. didnt you just recently loose a bunch of ships in delve? AGAIN!
Gjs312 Rionnag Alba Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2010.03.28 01:02:00 - [75] This is completely hilarious and I hope they let you keep it.
Kirra Liu Echelon Holdings Echelon.	Posted - 2010.03.28 01:17:00 - [76] Wow... I gotta say though, if I had the money then I would probably be the same. Hope they don't ban you again for this as I don't see a problem with it. Kirra Liu / Lord Windu
Ralara Caldari Vivicide Vivisection.	Posted - 2010.03.28 01:38:00 - [77] Originally by: Ivas Tiffy Edited by: Ivas Tiffy on 28/03/2010 00:46:15 Originally by: Zhek Kromtor Edited by: Zhek Kromtor on 27/03/2010 21:10:54 After being erroneously 3-day banned for "macro use" while merely mining as a multiboxer (no macros or automation were being used - just Synergy a program that lets you share 1 mouse over multiple computers) I decided to make a site to demonstrate how I have adapted my technique of multiboxing to definitely not break any rules of the EULA. I no longer use Synergy or even mine. I can understand how seeing 12 ospreys mining would cause players and GM's to assume the worst. Now I'm training exploration to hopefully do some complexes. Here's the site explaining how I have more computers than friends: http://sites.google.com/site/khromtor/ If we could get some clarification from CCP about whether using programs like Synergy that merely allow you to use a single mouse among multiple computers in the same way someone uses a single mouse when they have multiple displays that would definitely open the door to a lot more multiboxers... and multiboxers are generally very fun to pewpew. Just ask the guys that blew up my entire rokh mining fleet a week ago as I attempted my 0.0 escape. Edit: Whether or not using a wooden dowel across some keypads is allowed is not up for debate IMO. The use of prosthetics, pirate hooks, wooden dowels or your face for pressing buttons is simply not breaking any rules. The question is whether or not multiboxers should be allowed to use common multiboxing software explicity allowed in almost all other major MMO's. IDIOTS like you should be perma banned... for using a external programe to get a unfair advantage that cannot be done via normal means IE: exploit. i hope you get perma removed! just so you know.. when you brag to corp/alliance mates about using synergy or similar programmes... it eventually gets around what you do. and you DO get petitioned.. Then I guess the 20% or so of us that use G15/19 keyboards should also be banned. --
SXYGeeK Gallente do you Mostly Harmless	Posted - 2010.03.28 02:07:00 - [78] Firstly, Multiboxing or playing multiple charecters at once is not against the EULA, CCP even encourages it with frequent programs to get additional accounts up. So, playing with 2 charecters or even 12 charecters is not breaking any rules. Each charecter is not going to gather resources faster or play any better than any other charecter. In fact quite the opposite, there is a diminishing return, It is just not possible to simultaneously control multiple accounts as good as folks that are controling just one. In most cases multiboxing is done with clients in windowed mode on a single PC or multiple PC's with multiple keyboards and mice. the only thing that synergy does is allow you to use one keyboard an mouse accorss multiple computers as if they where just mutiple displays on the same computer. it does not replicate clicks or movements or keystrokes. It is no different than running multiple clients windowed on a single multimonitor PC. essentialy it does not allow you to play your multiple clients any faster than someone with a nice 6 monitor PC that can run 10 copies of eve at a high framerate. (Intel i7 and Nvidia 260 with Matrox triple head) thus it is not a violation of the EULA. -We So SeXy
Ravelin Eb Krazny Oktyabr Revolyutsiya	Posted - 2010.03.28 02:08:00 - [79] This is all kinds of awesome. _________________________________ Boo hoo. Cry some more.
Langoss	Posted - 2010.03.28 02:20:00 - [80]

brutoid Caldari	Posted - 2010.03.28 02:25:00 - [81] So should hardware KVM switches be banned also?
Seros Kal 0utbreak	Posted - 2010.03.28 02:41:00 - [82] Can you field 10+ black ops by yourself ?
Bo Bojangles The Perfect Storm Gentlemen's Club	Posted - 2010.03.28 05:26:00 - [83] Originally by: vulnevia Just you wait untill this guy buys 14 battleships and starts to gatecamp somewhere... Oh he's pvp'd with it. I encountered Zhek's nasty little setup last July. Zhek's naming convention also makes it necessary for an opposing FC to broadcast his ships rather than call out the targets as per usual. Originally by: Zhek Kromtor And while we're on the subject of numbers, if you and your 13 space buddies really get beat by someone using wooden dowels to control 14 ships it is abundantly clear who fails in the most ways. I didn't see any dowels. What I saw was was your Ravens decloak, drop drones, target and fire in a unison that cannot be equated in a normal fleet orchestrated by a single target caller communicating to individual pilots. Though as I recall there was a slight variation in the beginning of the targeting sequence between the ships,.. have you tried maple?
Noun Verber Gallente	Posted - 2010.03.28 05:35:00 - [84] 1) Who needs 14 accounts? 2) Especially simultaneously 3) You deserved your ban.
Sourpsalm Gallente Pubs 'n Clubs	Posted - 2010.03.28 06:53:00 - [85] Originally by: Zhek Kromtor I have more computers than friends On the next episode of "Intervention".
Yoyort Davy Jones Locker Curatores Veritatis Alliance	Posted - 2010.03.28 08:20:00 - [86] Edited by: Yoyort on 28/03/2010 08:23:41 May wanna reword some posts you write , as money can be misunderstood quite easily. IGC or isk is better lol. Btw if you come from WOW, think CCP didnt wanna spread the illness. http://www.dual-boxing.com/showthread.php?t=29236 "Ya I'm bored of wow... this new season started and i got a taste of the resilience buff and didnt like it. Eve with synchronized mouseclicks is so much fun though. Epic volleys of missiles... I had to control my 12 guys 6 at a time since there's 2 on each computer. I dont know how the hell im going to make money if i get banned everytime i mine though. I was planning on hooking up with my old goonfleet buddies after i got back on my feet for some more space destruction but i literally was playing for 2-3 days before i got banned. Just ridiculous... I guess if enough idiots report you because they dont understand then sooner or later an ignorant GM will come along and ruin all your hard work." Posted by Kromtor on linked forum.
Furb Killer Gallente	Posted - 2010.03.28 08:30:00 - [87] Originally by: Noun Verber 1) Who needs 14 accounts? 2) Especially simultaneously 3) You deserved your ban. Who needs 2 accounts? There is no reason at all why 14 accounts wouldnt be allowed when 2 accounts are allowed (coming from someone with one account with one char). There is no reason at all why synergy wouldnt be allowed when g15 macros are allowed. Untill those things changes, he isnt doing anything wrong.
Eugene Spencer Rodents of Unusual Size	Posted - 2010.03.28 09:03:00 - [88] That setup is truly OTT and amazing :) ===== I have a specific comb for my beard.
Admrl Cain Caldari Unbound Incorporated	Posted - 2010.03.28 09:08:00 - [89] OP needs professional help... quickly. I kinda feel sorry for him :( ---------------------------------------- Admiral Cain. Yep, that's right.. mmhmmm
Darion Amador The Scope	Posted - 2010.03.28 09:14:00 - [90] Dude, i gotta know, have you ever gotten laid? And in the unlikely hood you have, before or after you acquired 14 accounts? Do you not like the wonders of life? Is there some thing you'd like to talk about? I'm here for you to talk you through it, i got lots of tissue paper. Does RL make you sad? Do you avoid it because you don't feel like you belong in RL? Are you an alien? If so, what is the meaning of life? Or rather, what is the question to the answear? Or are you a secret agent from CCCP trying to infiltrate the community and push them to purchase more account, can i take this as a sign that business is not booming? How many scalps do you have mounted on your wall? Do you use 70s glasses? There is so much i would like to know about you. Please give me your life story.

vulnevia The Exploited. Black Star Alliance	Posted - 2010.03.28 09:38:00 - [91] Originally by: Bo Bojangles Originally by: vulnevia Just you wait untill this guy buys 14 battleships and starts to gatecamp somewhere... Oh he's pvp'd with it. I encountered Zhek's nasty little setup last July. Zhek's naming convention also makes it necessary for an opposing FC to broadcast his ships rather than call out the targets as per usual. Hmm, I've seen a similar KM somewhere befor on battleclinic, could be that it's the same guy. I think it's awesome though that he talks about mining in 12 ospreys when he's pvping with all those accounts, and that noone has been raging about that. --------- the EVE Crafting Blog
TheLordofAllandNothing Caldari United Systems Navy Zenith Affinity	Posted - 2010.03.28 10:51:00 - [92] Edited by: TheLordofAllandNothing on 28/03/2010 10:55:19 Originally by: AdmiralJohn I'll bet that every single person supporting this guy is actually one of the 42 characters he is capable of using. OP: You fail in more ways than you have accounts. Originally by: Mara Rinn How? He's not doing anything that 14 players side by side couldn't do too. He's not acquiring items, currency, objects, character attributes, rank or status faster than 14 players side by side. He's doing ordinary game play on 14 computers side by side. The point is, he isn't fourteen people, why the hell should he be able to benefit as if he were? As long as you pay the money for said accounts into CCPs corporate account i doubt they could give a **** what you do with those accounts unless your macroing(which he isn't) To the op: Very creative setup, and it's nice to see you have a hobby(computers and eve ) Everyones desires are different, he wanted to build that, like i wanted to build a triple monitor rig for my eve.(<3 you ATI ) _______________________ Fix rockets in '09 =(
SirDynty Gallente Boiians Green Alliance	Posted - 2010.03.28 10:57:00 - [93] Edited by: SirDynty on 28/03/2010 10:57:08 It rocks man,seriously! that computes and monitor trays:) You can mine on it,i approve
Ferroto Baggins Caldari Navy of Xoc Wildly Inappropriate.	Posted - 2010.03.28 11:32:00 - [94] Edited by: Ferroto Baggins on 28/03/2010 11:34:00 Dude that setup is beast. If I ever win the lottery that's the first thing I'm building.
Franny Band of Builders Inc. Trinova	Posted - 2010.03.28 11:37:00 - [95] o.O 14 accts! ok, so I should kill synergy?, or just not put the 2nd acct on my 42" flatscreen when the wife's at work
Wacktopia Dark Side Of The Womb	Posted - 2010.03.28 11:39:00 - [96] Originally by: Wendi Watson http://www.eveonline.com/pnp/eula.asp Section 7, A, 3: Quote: You may not use macros or other stored rapid keystrokes or other patterns of play that facilitate acquisition of items, currency, objects, character attributes, rank or status at an accelerated rate when compared with ordinary Game play. You may not rewrite or modify the user interface or otherwise manipulate data in any way to acquire items, currency, objects, character attributes or beneficial actions not actually acquired or achieved in the Game. Such a setup can hardly be considered a normal game play That line is so ambiguous. It doesn't mention multiple accounts so technically, if I click buttons really fast to mission faster than a 'normal' player am I too breaking the EULA? What a load of rubbish. Surely the spirit of that rule is to not 'cheat' by using a robot/macro/automation to play for you - playing 14 clients at once takes some skill in it's own right. To the OP: Nice work, that must have taken some setting up? Also, I loled at the 4 bits of wood with marker pen on amongst all the technical wizardry :)
Cipher Jones Minmatar	Posted - 2010.03.28 16:22:00 - [97] Originally by: Wacktopia Originally by: Wendi Watson http://www.eveonline.com/pnp/eula.asp Section 7, A, 3: Quote: You may not use macros or other stored rapid keystrokes or other patterns of play that facilitate acquisition of items, currency, objects, character attributes, rank or status at an accelerated rate when compared with ordinary Game play. You may not rewrite or modify the user interface or otherwise manipulate data in any way to acquire items, currency, objects, character attributes or beneficial actions not actually acquired or achieved in the Game. Such a setup can hardly be considered a normal game play That line is so ambiguous. It doesn't mention multiple accounts so technically, if I click buttons really fast to mission faster than a 'normal' player am I too breaking the EULA? What a load of rubbish. Surely the spirit of that rule is to not 'cheat' by using a robot/macro/automation to play for you - playing 14 clients at once takes some skill in it's own right. To the OP: Nice work, that must have taken some setting up? Also, I loled at the 4 bits of wood with marker pen on amongst all the technical wizardry :) Again, this applies to each client. OP is not violating that paragraph. The paragraph ONLY applies to the client you are agreeing to the eula on. Think about it... Quote: You may not use macros or other stored rapid keystrokes or other patterns of play that facilitate acquisition of items, currency, objects, character attributes, rank or status at an accelerated rate when compared with ordinary Game play. Multiple accounts facilitate that, even 2 accounts. It is referring to each individual account. This is clearly a signature.
Jypsie	Posted - 2010.03.28 17:39:00 - [98] I am unsure if I am impressed or horrified. Bit of both.
Zacktar Gallente	Posted - 2010.03.28 18:40:00 - [99] Originally by: Bo Bojangles Originally by: vulnevia Just you wait untill this guy buys 14 battleships and starts to gatecamp somewhere... Oh he's pvp'd with it. I encountered Zhek's nasty little setup last July. Zhek's naming convention also makes it necessary for an opposing FC to broadcast his ships rather than call out the targets as per usual. Originally by: Zhek Kromtor And while we're on the subject of numbers, if you and your 13 space buddies really get beat by someone using wooden dowels to control 14 ships it is abundantly clear who fails in the most ways. I didn't see any dowels. What I saw was was your Ravens decloak, drop drones, target and fire in a unison that cannot be equated in a normal fleet orchestrated by a single target caller communicating to individual pilots. Though as I recall there was a slight variation in the beginning of the targeting sequence between the ships,.. have you tried maple? Seriously? I saw Zhek and all his accounts in Vylade just last night. They were all 4/09 I believe.I was like wtf is this? Last July would put those at being 3 months old. And even if they were in cloaky Ravens you had how much time to get out? Or destroy 3 month old toons? Lol... All he would have heard after decloaking in Ravens is weepweepweepweepweep trying to target you because of the targeting delay. You are bitter and fail if he whooped you with cloaky Ravens at 3 months old. 14 of him or not. I salute you Zheke. Awesome setup.
Cambarus The Compass Reloaded	Posted - 2010.03.28 19:44:00 - [100] I find it amusing that the GMs are still avoiding this thread, half the posts on the from page of GD seem to have GM replies but this one's gone on for 4 pages with no official posts >_>

TekRa Minmatar	Posted - 2010.03.28 19:51:00 - [101] 12 accounts doesn't mean he plays 12x more than average. take a break from the 'get a life' comments. I bet there are many people in eve who spend much more time in game with fewer accounts. sig.
Joe Space	Posted - 2010.03.28 19:53:00 - [102] OP: keep up the good work
Erich Herrmann	Posted - 2010.03.28 20:01:00 - [103] Originally by: Boomershoot He's clicking 13 times faster than anyone without macros could ever do. 7 times faster. If he had a keyboard under each hand, he could click twice at any one time.
omgevenmoarfreemoniez	Posted - 2010.03.28 20:01:00 - [104] I'd say the OP should get a life, but it looks like he's so far gone he might be better taking the shadow of a life that he currently has.
AdmiralJohn The Unknown Bar and Pub Elysium Alliance	Posted - 2010.03.28 20:26:00 - [105] I'll bet this thread was created by mods to see who the no-lifers are. If you really think this is cool, you need to reevaluate your priorities.
TekRa Minmatar	Posted - 2010.03.28 21:07:00 - [106] Originally by: AdmiralJohn I'll bet this thread was created by mods to see who the no-lifers are. If you really think this is cool, you need to reevaluate your priorities. as far as games go, it is quite cool; in the grand scheme of things less so. what do you do that's so special, cured cancer yet? sig.
Mitchello Caldari The Collective Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2010.03.28 21:30:00 - [107] Originally by: Zhek Kromtor Here's the site explaining how I have more computers than friends: http://sites.google.com/site/khromtor/ If we could get some clarification from CCP about whether using programs like Synergy that merely allow you to use a single mouse among multiple computers in the same way someone uses a single mouse when they have multiple displays that would definitely open the door to a lot more multiboxers... That's quite misleading actually. You are not using a single mouse among multiple computers to go from one client to another, to another, etcetera. You are controlling all of them at the same time for the same actions, effectively doing the same thing as multiboxing software which breaches the EULA, if not through spirit of the text then even just solely by providing an unfair advantage which is just as much part of the EULA. Or am I mistaken when I see those screenshots, it does strike me that while you are not currently using software to do it for you, you are pairing up all mouse movements to control all your clients at the same time with one singular control. Those mice are tied together, for perfect positioning, so that movement is mirrored across all your clients, while effectively moving just one mouse "unit". That's pretty much called "obtaining an unfair advantage", exactly the same as doing it with software to not have to bother with tying those mice together.
Professor Tarantula Hedion University	Posted - 2010.03.28 21:49:00 - [108] I can feel the EMF just looking at that setup. My deepest sympathies. Prof. Tarantula, Esq.
Dogo Duma Caldari The Darwin Foundation INVICTUS.	Posted - 2010.03.28 21:49:00 - [109] Originally by: Wacktopia Originally by: Wendi Watson http://www.eveonline.com/pnp/eula.asp Section 7, A, 3: Quote: You may not use macros or other stored rapid keystrokes or other patterns of play that facilitate acquisition of items, currency, objects, character attributes, rank or status at an accelerated rate when compared with ordinary Game play. You may not rewrite or modify the user interface or otherwise manipulate data in any way to acquire items, currency, objects, character attributes or beneficial actions not actually acquired or achieved in the Game. Such a setup can hardly be considered a normal game play That line is so ambiguous. It doesn't mention multiple accounts so technically, if I click buttons really fast to mission faster than a 'normal' player am I too breaking the EULA? What a load of rubbish. Surely the spirit of that rule is to not 'cheat' by using a robot/macro/automation to play for you - playing 14 clients at once takes some skill in it's own right. To the OP: Nice work, that must have taken some setting up? Also, I loled at the 4 bits of wood with marker pen on amongst all the technical wizardry :) It's not ambiguous at all. If he indeed has those mice tied together for synchronised control over multiple accounts at the same time for the same coordinated actions, he has an inherent and non native advantage over other players, regardless of whether single or multi account user. Regardless of PVE or PVP, his actions are by design accelerated over those of any other player who does not have such synchronised control over all of his clients at the same time.
Eto Tekai	Posted - 2010.03.28 21:58:00 - [110] What about one of the Mercury water drinking birds like that episode of Simpsons where he had to work from home becuase he was fat.

Johnathan Roark Caldari The Graduates Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2010.03.28 22:46:00 - [111] Originally by: Ralara Then I guess the 20% or so of us that use G15/19 keyboards should also be banned. Can't find it now, but I saw a thread a while back with a dev saying those are ok because they require human interaction. Same could be applied to this case, but GMs hate to admit they are wrong. POS-Tracker 3.0 Hosting
ceaon Gallente	Posted - 2010.03.28 22:58:00 - [112] OP you are a hero /respect BTW awesome post OP you win the forums today Originally by: CCP Adida The male thread was locked because the discussion turned into transsexuals and man boobs.
Berenices Herculina Gallente Center for Advanced Studies	Posted - 2010.03.28 23:34:00 - [113] WTF...
DiamondX Minmatar More-Cowbell Cult of War	Posted - 2010.03.28 23:38:00 - [114] Seriously WTF...
Duncan MacPherson Minmatar Clan MacPherson	Posted - 2010.03.29 01:39:00 - [115] Good on you OP.But anyone who tell you to get a life - needs to get one themselves. Who is anyone to tell anyone how to live.
Thuranni Eldjotnar	Posted - 2010.03.29 01:53:00 - [116] Edited by: Thuranni on 29/03/2010 01:53:02 nevermind
Orange Silver Fox Ironworks Black Star Alliance	Posted - 2010.03.29 02:32:00 - [117] Many people posting in this thread need to just relax. It is pretty obvious from reading the material on his website that is just fooling around with ospreys. There are killboard links with him in a bunch of ravens bringing the smackdown on unsuspecting foes burn eden style.
Bo Bojangles The Perfect Storm Gentlemen's Club	Posted - 2010.03.29 03:39:00 - [118] Originally by: Zacktar All he would have heard after decloaking in Ravens is weepweepweepweepweep trying to target you because of the targeting delay. You are bitter and fail if he whooped you with cloaky Ravens at 3 months old. 14 of him or not. Umm, no I'm not bitter about losing an internet spaceship dude. I was just trying to show that Zhek does more than mine with his dirty dozen or so. They weren't cloaky Ravens either, he decloaked at a gate he'd just jumped through, and I could have crossjumped him but there were more goons on the other side I think, and I'd heard of Zhek as he'd allegedly had progressed through pvping with Caracals and Drakes, and wanted to see this thing of his myself. But sure, ok, my phoon fails at tanking 12 Ravens and change. I'll go uninstall now. =p
AndrewNardella	Posted - 2010.03.29 04:12:00 - [119] Originally by: Dogo Duma Originally by: Wacktopia That line is so ambiguous. It doesn't mention multiple accounts so technically, if I click buttons really fast to mission faster than a 'normal' player am I too breaking the EULA? What a load of rubbish. Surely the spirit of that rule is to not 'cheat' by using a robot/macro/automation to play for you - playing 14 clients at once takes some skill in it's own right. To the OP: Nice work, that must have taken some setting up? Also, I loled at the 4 bits of wood with marker pen on amongst all the technical wizardry :) It's not ambiguous at all. If he indeed has those mice tied together for synchronised control over multiple accounts at the same time for the same coordinated actions, he has an inherent and non native advantage over other players, regardless of whether single or multi account user. Regardless of PVE or PVP, his actions are by design accelerated over those of any other player who does not have such synchronised control over all of his clients at the same time. See second to last paragraph for the important stuff. ^^ This is why it is unfair. I have a setup that allows me to view and control six clients on one computer, but I can only perform actions on one client because I only have one mouse, keyboard and cursor. The OP is cheating he is able to perform multiple actions simultaneously, he has an unfair advantage over me which is clearly against the rules. If this were not against the rules then I would be doing it too. But since it is, the OP is cheating and deserves to be punished for his actions which are harmful to the game. If he were to use a single mouse and keyboard along with software like synergy, input director or teleport to allow control of multiple PCs non concurrently I would approve. All that said everything pertinent to weather these actions are breaking the rules or not is mostly irrelevant as rules are subject to interpretation. The only interpretation that is important is that of CCP. I would like to hear in this thread weather CCP thinks the OP is cheating and breaking the rules. I also applaud the efforts the OP has made, impressive setup!
King Gore Gore Squad	Posted - 2010.03.29 04:41:00 - [120] Has the OP gotten his account unbanned? - Come one come all to my Carnaval of Carnage, where I'll slice and dice and peel off your skin like an orange.

Boomershoot Caldari Suddenly Ninjas	Posted - 2010.03.29 06:12:00 - [121] Originally by: King Gore Has the OP gotten his account unbanned? Yes, The ban expired.
Mordorg Gallente Aliastra	Posted - 2010.03.29 07:27:00 - [122] Originally by: Hixxy while it might not be the case for the OP but only a 3 day ban for macroing? should be insta account lockdown and for eternity or until proven otherwise. also posting it's just a 3 day ban might not be too clever an idea as it might encourage people to try it as the penalties are so weak. I used to feel exactly this way. But then I was banned for botting in another game because I "didn't respond to a GM" while I was obviously afk in a safe zone. Even GMs can make mistakes, as this case shows. He did not violate the eula as it is written; it merely appeared that it he was.
Mitchello Caldari The Collective Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2010.03.29 10:09:00 - [123] Edited by: Mitchello on 29/03/2010 10:09:26 Originally by: Mordorg Even GMs can make mistakes, as this case shows. He did not violate the eula as it is written; it merely appeared that it he was. In this case however the GM has not made a mistake, the player in question was silly enough to demonstrate to the public how he achieves an unfair advantage in obtaining items (etc.) at an accelerated pace because of synchronised control over his clients, previously through software control and later on through (hilarious really but still within the same paradigm) tying his mice together to achieve the same accelerated results. Unless I am mistaken and he has not lined up his clients, mirrored the UI's, synchronised client UI element positions and synchronised his mice to control 14 clients simultaneously through singular actions in the screenshots he uploaded.
Nina Mercedez	Posted - 2010.03.29 11:17:00 - [124] Originally by: Wendi Watson http://www.eveonline.com/pnp/eula.asp Section 7, A, 3: Quote: You may not use macros or other stored rapid keystrokes or other patterns of play that facilitate acquisition of items, currency, objects, character attributes, rank or status at an accelerated rate when compared with ordinary Game play. You may not rewrite or modify the user interface or otherwise manipulate data in any way to acquire items, currency, objects, character attributes or beneficial actions not actually acquired or achieved in the Game. Such a setup can hardly be considered a normal game play So what is considered "normal gameplay"? I use 4, if not 5, accounts on a daily basis in missions. Some might not consider this normal, but it's normal for me. And sometimes I use my other computer, too.
Aera Aiana	Posted - 2010.03.29 11:44:00 - [125] ... I don't mind the multiboxing... but seriously dude, 14 accounts? Are you singlehandedly trying to keep the PLEX price high?
Azran Zala Fleet of the Damned	Posted - 2010.03.29 12:44:00 - [126] Edited by: Azran Zala on 29/03/2010 12:47:19 If using synergy is cause for banning, then thats just stupid. I too use synergy, not really to multibox, but simply because I dont want 4 different keyboards and mice on my desk. (fileserver, media-pc, gamerig, laptop) I have my desktops sitting neatly beside my desk with table cloths over them providing secondary functions as end tables. And I use my laptop's keyboard and mouse to control them all. Synergy just allows u to use 1 mouse and keyboard for multiple machines. All it does is save space. It doesnt do anything for you.
Ivas Tiffy Amarr Royal Amarr Institute	Posted - 2010.03.29 12:51:00 - [127] Edited by: Ivas Tiffy on 29/03/2010 12:51:21 Originally by: Azran Zala Edited by: Azran Zala on 29/03/2010 12:47:19 If using synergy is cause for banning, then thats just stupid. I too use synergy, not really to multibox, but simply because I dont want 4 different keyboards and mice on my desk. (fileserver, media-pc, gamerig, laptop) I have my desktops sitting neatly beside my desk with table cloths over them providing secondary functions as end tables. And I use my laptop's keyboard and mouse to control them all. Synergy just allows u to use 1 mouse and keyboard for multiple machines. All it does is save space. It doesnt do anything for you. i am sure you are trolling... cloth over your pc cases? lol
Azran Zala Fleet of the Damned	Posted - 2010.03.29 13:01:00 - [128] Originally by: Ivas Tiffy Edited by: Ivas Tiffy on 29/03/2010 12:51:21 Originally by: Azran Zala Edited by: Azran Zala on 29/03/2010 12:47:19 If using synergy is cause for banning, then thats just stupid. I too use synergy, not really to multibox, but simply because I dont want 4 different keyboards and mice on my desk. (fileserver, media-pc, gamerig, laptop) I have my desktops sitting neatly beside my desk with table cloths over them providing secondary functions as end tables. And I use my laptop's keyboard and mouse to control them all. Synergy just allows u to use 1 mouse and keyboard for multiple machines. All it does is save space. It doesnt do anything for you. i am sure you are trolling... cloth over your pc cases? lol Ok the cloth was an exagiration, but yeah I do stack 2 on each side and use them as extra table space. Also : Quote: "But then I come to realize after complaining to other multiboxers on dual-boxing.com that CCP may not even allow software multiboxing - that is sending a keyboard or mouseclick to multiple computers or clients at the same time via multiboxing software such as Synergy, Keyclone, Octopus, etc." Synergy doesnt send the same key/mouse click to multiple pcs at once. It switches focus to a specific pc, (whichever u've moved the mouse cursor to) and sends keyboard/mouse commands over the network. Basically it gives u the look and feel of having a multi-monitor setup.
Ashira Twilight	Posted - 2010.03.29 14:01:00 - [129] I think his "command center" is sexy. To all you "get a life!" people, you're all just jealous of the man. I know I am.
H3llHound Blacksteel Mining and Manufacturing	Posted - 2010.03.29 14:42:00 - [130] i hope you got an Ac in there, otherwise i dont want to imagine the heat in there on a hot day __________________________________________________ We are Recruiting

Arrs Grazznic Poena Executive Solutions	Posted - 2010.03.29 17:23:00 - [131] Originally by: Ivas Tiffy i hope you get perma removed! just so you know.. when you brag to corp/alliance mates about using synergy or similar programmes... it eventually gets around what you do. and you DO get petitioned.. Do you actually know what Synergy is? All it allows you to do is control multiple computers from a single mouse and keyboard combination. It doesn't record mouse clicks or key strokes for later playback. It doesn't duplicate mouse clicks or key strokes onto other computers. Read about Synergy here, but pay careful attention to this: Quote: Synergy lets you easily share a single mouse and keyboard between multiple computers with different operating systems, each with its own display, without special hardware. It's intended for users with multiple computers on their desk since each system uses its own monitor(s). Redirecting the mouse and keyboard is as simple as moving the mouse off the edge of your screen. Synergy also merges the clipboards of all the systems into one, allowing cut-and-paste between systems. Furthermore, it synchronizes screen savers so they all start and stop together and, if screen locking is enabled, only one screen requires a password to unlock them all. Learn more about how it works. Cheers, Arrs
Ivas Tiffy Amarr Royal Amarr Institute	Posted - 2010.03.29 17:39:00 - [132] but this does not eexplains why he has 12 ships with the same exact setups... his taped mouse setup is PURE 100% fail. i hope his accounts remain banned. he has put that up as a scape goat to dance around an unfair advantage. and no.. a g15 is NOTHING like a "macro" it wont record mouse strokes etc.
Lord Slater Amarr Kodan Armada	Posted - 2010.03.29 17:45:00 - [133] Heh nice setup. I wish a senior Gm or dev would claryfy this tho as who knows one day i might have such a need too. ----------------------------------------------- YYAARRHH HAHAHA IM THE HAPPY PIRATE
Hixxy Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2010.03.29 18:01:00 - [134] Originally by: Ivas Tiffy but this does not eexplains why he has 12 ships with the same exact setups... his taped mouse setup is PURE 100% fail. i hope his accounts remain banned. he has put that up as a scape goat to dance around an unfair advantage. and no.. a g15 is NOTHING like a "macro" it wont record mouse strokes etc. but before weapon grouping was added to EvE you could "group" things and set them to buttons. they posted it was ok to use too i think. 1 guy jumping through with 14 chars and insta locking/firing/whatever with 1 keystroke is wrong. not sure how this program works but if that's the case he got off lightly, they looked and saw 14 accounts and "gave him a warning". i hope when they catch somone auto mining etc they dont get that privlage and are insta banned with no chance of getting the account back.
Tallaran Kouros Caldari	Posted - 2010.03.29 18:10:00 - [135] If nothing else then this is at least against the spirit of the EULA...
Cipher Jones Minmatar	Posted - 2010.03.29 20:59:00 - [136] Originally by: Tallaran Kouros If nothing else then this is at least against the spirit of the EULA... How exactly? As I've mentioned several times the EULA applies to each client not all clients. This is clearly a signature.
Dogo Duma	Posted - 2010.03.29 22:02:00 - [137] Originally by: Cipher Jones Originally by: Tallaran Kouros If nothing else then this is at least against the spirit of the EULA... How exactly? As I've mentioned several times the EULA applies to each client not all clients. It's very simple really. The EULA is not a case of compliance per client, it's a case of formal terminology of "the software", "the system", "the game". Period. The topic here isn't about a client or multiple clients, single account or multiple account subscriber status (remember, your accounts are a service, we don't own anything, CCP does), it's about the guy synchronising actions across clients via a singular means of control/input, giving him an effective unfair advantage of accelerated control over his gameplay as opposed to that of any other player not using the same method (either software based or ducttaped mice doesn't matter). EULA is pretty clear on these parts really. If the guy did not synchronise control over all clients through a single means of input affecting all clients, he would not be breaking the EULA. For example, someone else playing multiple accounts has to do the same thing for all clients as someone with a single account would have to do, but one client at a time. This guy jumps over that, first through software and then with tying his mice together (he must be minmatar tbh) so that he does not have to go from one client to the next and to the next and etcetera. Instead he controls them all, at the same time, with a singular means of control which affects all clients simultaneously. Since that is not possible without what he's done, he achieves an accelerated method of control over his clients, affecting the rate of actions he undertakes in game directly. Doesn't matter if that happens in PVE or PVP really. In PVE his synchronised singular control enables him to obtain items at an accelerated pace. In PVP it enables him to wipe out items at an accelerated pace.
Gjs312 Rionnag Alba Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2010.03.29 22:12:00 - [138] Edited by: Gjs312 on 29/03/2010 22:12:38 edit: wow i misread that
Cipher Jones Minmatar	Posted - 2010.03.29 23:15:00 - [139] Quote: It's very simple really. The EULA is not a case of compliance per client, actually its right there in the EULA: Quote: YOUR ACCOUNT You may establish only one (1) account for each copy of the Software licensed. If you wish to establish another Account, you must obtain another license for the Software Quote: A. Software License Subject to the terms of the EULA, CCP grants you a limited, non-exclusive, revocable license to use the Software and its accompanying documentation solely in connection with accessing the System in order to play EVE using a single valid Account. States it directly and clearly. Someone will argue, someone will call me "troll". Pre-emptive LOL. This is clearly a signature.
Dogo Duma	Posted - 2010.03.30 00:08:00 - [140] Originally by: Cipher Jones Quote: It's very simple really. The EULA is not a case of compliance per client, actually its right there in the EULA: Quote: YOUR ACCOUNT You may establish only one (1) account for each copy of the Software licensed. If you wish to establish another Account, you must obtain another license for the Software Quote: A. Software License Subject to the terms of the EULA, CCP grants you a limited, non-exclusive, revocable license to use the Software and its accompanying documentation solely in connection with accessing the System in order to play EVE using a single valid Account. States it directly and clearly. Someone will argue, someone will call me "troll". Pre-emptive LOL. Nobody will call you a troll, people will at best conclude you have no reading skills, probably because there is no mention of the word "client" in what you quoted. Either way that's beside the point, since your licence is granted for "the software" on a per account basis based on the per copy abstract. Irrelevant of number of accounts you register to licence as such. Anyway, the above is a moot point. The guy accelerates the pace of actions and control, and as such breaks the EULA regardless of. And that's the core of it. Does he achieve an advantage over other players? Yes. How? Both via software and other means which provide synchronised control at accelerated rate of multiple accounts ("the software", remember). Ergo, EULA broken (violated seems such a strange word to use given the context of EVE's subscribers )

Tyaden	Posted - 2010.03.30 00:14:00 - [141] one day ill have my own wooden dowel setup...
Raptor Stan	Posted - 2010.03.30 01:49:00 - [142] So just what is normal gameplay? 1 person, one computer, 1 mouse, 1 keyboard, 1 monitor, 1 account, 1 character? CCP clearly wants you to have more than one account and approves of it. Remember the Power of Two programs? So multiple account MUST fall under the heading of "normal gameplay". Now lets say I have two accounts on two different computers and I want to go mining. For convenience I want my laser cycles to match. Now I really don't want to get banned so my only option is to lock up the rocks and place my keyboards side by side and press F1 at the same time on both keyboards using one finger on each of my two hands. But wait! I just pressed two buttons at the same time! Uh-oh! I told my two clients to mine faster than "normal gameplay" allows. But I'm not in violation of the EULA am I? Do you see how your argument against multiboxing falls apart? If I can press two buttons on two different keyboards at the same time using one finger on each hand and not be in violation of the EULA then why not place 4 keyboards such that I could press 4 buttons at a time? Would stretching my fingers across two keyboards and using more than one finger at once violate the EULA? For that matter I can make two regular sized mice fit under my hand and have my index finger on one mouse and my middle finger on the other. Am I not allowed to use one hand to move two mice? This is an exercise in absurdity. Either you have to have an absurd rule such as only allowing a player to have one account/client active at any time and only use one finger at a time or you must allow an absurd setup like Zhek demonstrated. So which do you want; one account, one finger or can you accept that EVE is a sandbox game and people will get creative both in-game and out? Personally, I am impressed with Zhek's setup. If he had fingers long enough there would be no dowels rods and this discussion would be moot. As such I think it is perfectly valid. It follows that if a hardware solution is valid then why not a software solution. As long as someone is originating each of those clicks and keystrokes at the same time they are relayed to the client what does it matter if they were replicated by a piece of software or by a dowel rod stretched across several keyboards.
Tom Peeping	Posted - 2010.03.30 03:07:00 - [143] Originally by: Vaal Erit It's a low tech macro, but still a macro. I applaud your creativity and engineering skills but am glad that CCP bans your accounts. We got enough problems with alts and people 2-3 boxing and the like, we don't need this. Also, they only ban macro users for 3 days? Well I can see why we are still flooded with macros to this day. No way.... CCP seem to have defined macros as using software to click a mouse, whereas physically clicking the keyboard is ok. This system the user has to physicially press the keys. In his favor, there've been a LOT of pretty dumb GM's out there. (sorry ccp, I really like you, seriously, but your GM's don't always check with prior GM rulings, or even your own policies, and have given us some real inconsistency many many times.)
Cipher Jones Minmatar	Posted - 2010.03.30 04:38:00 - [144] Originally by: Dogo Duma Originally by: Cipher Jones Quote: It's very simple really. The EULA is not a case of compliance per client, actually its right there in the EULA: Quote: YOUR ACCOUNT You may establish only one (1) account for each copy of the Software licensed. If you wish to establish another Account, you must obtain another license for the Software Quote: A. Software License Subject to the terms of the EULA, CCP grants you a limited, non-exclusive, revocable license to use the Software and its accompanying documentation solely in connection with accessing the System in order to play EVE using a single valid Account. States it directly and clearly. Someone will argue, someone will call me "troll". Pre-emptive LOL. Nobody will call you a troll, people will at best conclude you have no reading skills, probably because there is no mention of the word "client" in what you quoted. Either way that's beside the point, since your licence is granted for "the software" on a per account basis based on the per copy abstract. Irrelevant of number of accounts you register to licence as such. Anyway, the above is a moot point. The guy accelerates the pace of actions and control, and as such breaks the EULA regardless of. And that's the core of it. Does he achieve an advantage over other players? Yes. How? Both via software and other means which provide synchronised control at accelerated rate of multiple accounts ("the software", remember). Ergo, EULA broken (violated seems such a strange word to use given the context of EVE's subscribers ) Maybe you don't know what a client is but everyone who is seriously in this conversation understands what it is, not to mention everyones lawyers. If it creates an unfair advantage by using multiple accounts all multiple accounts are a violation of the EULA, which it clearly states is not the case. This is clearly a signature.
Chuuuy Caldari SniggWaffe	Posted - 2010.03.30 06:52:00 - [145] I don't understand why people keep calling this an 'unfair advantage'. Players constantly have advantages over each other in-game. Some players have more skill points. Some players have more ISK. Some players have more experience. So yes, he does have an advantage. However, this is not an unfair advantage. It's not unfair because anyone can go out and do it.
RedClaws Amarr Dragon's Rage E C L I P S E	Posted - 2010.03.30 07:04:00 - [146] It's impressive, be it a but out of the ordinary. I'm wondering though : what screen resolution do you use on monitor and eve client to be able to put them next to each other that seamlessly.
Mary Stardust	Posted - 2010.03.30 07:05:00 - [147] WOW - I would say that if you put as much effort into RL as you do in eve, you will do well. My guess is that is quite sad to see people doing this as it obviously an illness at this level. Get out and talk to real people.
Kalos Beila	Posted - 2010.03.30 08:38:00 - [148] Wow dude. I think I can see the future because - I can see the exact spot youre going to drop dead! In that chair. In front of those monitors. Nobody wants to see "This dude really pwnt @ EVE Online." on someone's tombstone. This is proof that it IS possible to win so much that you fail. Epicly. I wonder how much heat the earth would lose if you stepped out into the sun due to your albedo reflecting so much **ing light on your pale as ** skin? Its time to put down the game, dude.
Dogo Duma	Posted - 2010.03.30 09:43:00 - [149] Originally by: Cipher Jones Maybe you don't know what a client is but everyone who is seriously in this conversation understands what it is, not to mention everyones lawyers. If it creates an unfair advantage by using multiple accounts all multiple accounts are a violation of the EULA, which it clearly states is not the case. Repeating the same thing until infinity still does not make it true, please don't misunderstand me, I do feel sympathy for your position, it's just not going anywhere. The EULA makes no mention of the word, term, concept or abstract of "the client". End of story, right there. The concept of "unfair advantage" is one coined by CCP. It has nothing to do with single or multiple accounts. Nobody says that the use of multiple accounts creates such an unfair advantage, so no amount of repeating your strange statements is going to reach into even stranger conclusions . Please, repeat yourself again, we're all looking forward to these little lessons
Mag's the united Negative Ten.	Posted - 2010.03.30 10:00:00 - [150] Originally by: Dogo Duma Repeating the same thing until infinity still does not make it true...... The same could be said for you. I too await your repeat and little lesson.

Dogo Duma	Posted - 2010.03.30 10:24:00 - [151] Originally by: Mag's Originally by: Dogo Duma Repeating the same thing until infinity still does not make it true...... The same could be said for you. I too await your repeat and little lesson. If you insist, by all means (Please keep feeding him)
Norian Lonark Gallente Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance	Posted - 2010.03.30 12:07:00 - [152] Thats just crazy and one of the nerdiest things I ever did see.. but I do like your monitor mounting solution
Gorefacer Caldari Resurrection Gentlemen's Club	Posted - 2010.03.30 12:09:00 - [153] Haha I wondered where this guy went. Remember seeing his flock of caracals in Delve last year. Many terms in the EULA are vague (most likely intentionally so). In this way CCP can make their determination of whether or not something is "fair" gameplay. There really isn't a right or wrong answer until CCP clarifies. Also it's funny to watch all these EVE nerds flock to the thread to post how superior they feel to this guy and his computer hobby. Some people put massive amounts of time into a single character on EVE. In a relatively short time he could set this up and end up using MUCH less time on the setup and in-game than these other people. It's not like he's somehow spending 14x more time in his chair playing EVE because that's how many accounts he's multiboxing or is that not immediately clear to some people? Of course he may be as big a basement dweller as people accuse him of but you really can't tell just because he linked up a bunch of cheap computers together for fun. "You can't reason someone out of a belief they haven't reasoned themselves into" - Prometheus
oolk	Posted - 2010.03.30 12:30:00 - [154] Originally by: Cipher Jones Originally by: Vaal Erit It's a low tech macro, but still a macro. I applaud your creativity and engineering skills but am glad that CCP bans your accounts. We got enough problems with alts and people 2-3 boxing and the like, we don't need this. Also, they only ban macro users for 3 days? Well I can see why we are still flooded with macros to this day. Its certainly not a macro, as it only provides one input to each box. You have to sign the EULA for EACH client/account. It is only entering one command to each client and is therefore not a macro on any level. I beg to differ...its the grandfather of macros... At 1st,you had to enter a stack of punchcards in a puter in order for it to display basic stuff...its no different. Just joking...kind of.
Agent Unknown Caldari	Posted - 2010.03.30 12:33:00 - [155] I don't see the problem with this honestly. Synergy is basically a network-based KVM, which auto-switches between screens. I use a similar program to extend my desktop to my laptop screen. It's not a macro, just a cool way of multi-boxing. By the way, this is my signature. TeamSpeak For EVE - API-controlled TeamSpeak 3 Access!
Jovialmadness	Posted - 2010.03.30 12:52:00 - [156] Question: would not all the mouse pointers have to start in the perfect same spot? I don't know Jack about all this crazy stuff but I could see how a program might handle that issue but physically bonding multiple "mice" together would seem like a nightmare to me. Just one gets out of whack and you gotta fix it. Am I off base on this?
N0N	Posted - 2010.03.30 13:47:00 - [157] Originally by: Dogo Duma Originally by: Mag's Originally by: Dogo Duma Repeating the same thing until infinity still does not make it true...... The same could be said for you. I too await your repeat and little lesson. If you insist, by all means (Please keep feeding him) I think he was feeding you actually. But anyway, this guy said it better. Originally by: Gorefacer There really isn't a right or wrong answer until CCP clarifies.
Cipher Jones Minmatar	Posted - 2010.03.30 17:28:00 - [158] Originally by: Dogo Duma Originally by: Cipher Jones Maybe you don't know what a client is but everyone who is seriously in this conversation understands what it is, not to mention everyones lawyers. If it creates an unfair advantage by using multiple accounts all multiple accounts are a violation of the EULA, which it clearly states is not the case. Repeating the same thing until infinity still does not make it true, please don't misunderstand me, I do feel sympathy for your position, it's just not going anywhere. The EULA makes no mention of the word, term, concept or abstract of "the client". End of story, right there. The concept of "unfair advantage" is one coined by CCP. It has nothing to do with single or multiple accounts. Nobody says that the use of multiple accounts creates such an unfair advantage, so no amount of repeating your strange statements is going to reach into even stranger conclusions . Please, repeat yourself again, we're all looking forward to these little lessons just because you're an ignorant **** doesn't mean people don't understand what I am saying. If we were in a court of law I would not use the word client, I would repeat the eula verbatim. since were not in a court of law it is obvious that you just want to troll as the concepts I have presented are directly from what you agreed to when you signed up for eve. You not understanding a license does not invalidate it. The fact that you treat the eve forums as if they were a court of law show that your level of fanboi'ism is legendary and I cannot present an idea to you without bias. Good day. This is clearly a signature.
Cearain Caldari 24th Imperial Crusade	Posted - 2010.03.30 23:36:00 - [159] Op's set up is awesome. (especially all those monitors) Personally, I would never get used to the whole mouse/keyboard sync thing. But wtf having a ready fleet of Battleships is really nice. I can't see how any of these individual accounts would be making more of anything than an individual account could do, on an account per account basis. If the rule is not an ôaccount per accountö basis then clearly anyone who has more than one account violates that rule. So I don't see any rule (at least one that is reasonably interpreted) being broken. As to whether the op needs a life? Well I don't see it based on this. This is the nature of hobbies. He (or she) implemented a nice idea - crazy - but nice. ItÆs nice because it actually worked! Sometimes you just try to do things to see if you actually can pull it off. And it seems he is pulling it off. He got all those ravens attacking one target! Nice. I would like to see this in action myself. No itÆs not how I would like to play the game but itÆs still a pretty nice thing he accomplished. People who are really complaining this is ôno fairö: I think you are the ones who need some fresh air. People get so jealous that someone else in this game will make more isk then they can, itÆs really funny to me. Really itÆs just a game. If someone wants build a behemoth like this to get those battleships all firing on the same target and they actually get the thing to workà Well its time to toast them and have a laugh. If this guy can maintain that many accounts through real money or isk and he took the time to set this up, I want to see what he can do with this jalopy. My only complaint is what is with the ravens? This setup screams Minmatar.
Eric Policky	Posted - 2010.03.30 23:48:00 - [160] Originally by: Jovialmadness Question: would not all the mouse pointers have to start in the perfect same spot? I don't know Jack about all this crazy stuff but I could see how a program might handle that issue but physically bonding multiple "mice" together would seem like a nightmare to me. Just one gets out of whack and you gotta fix it. Am I off base on this? Move your mouse pointer to any corner of the screen. Now keep moving the mouse in the same direction as you were before. Notice the cursor stays perfectly stationary. In this way, you can place every cursor in the exact same location (one corner of the screen).

Manip Ulater	Posted - 2010.03.31 04:20:00 - [161] I dont see why wooden dowels would be 'that' much different that when I used to mine with 7 accounts (1 orca, 5 hulks, 1 hauler) on 1 box and the magical alt+tab stroke. The EULA quote is pretty ambiguous as anytime CCP offers the power of two for serious business alts they are essentially encouraging you to push against that rule. If CCP wants me to get an extra account that basically means I will make money in missions 50% faster with 2 chars running seperate missions. or reduce my salvaging time with an alt helping. Either way, the Power of Two promotions over the years imho nullify the wording in that EULA quote, as far as the 'faster than normal' argument.
Neo Gabriel Gallente Quantum Cats Syndicate	Posted - 2010.03.31 04:30:00 - [162] Soon the testimonials by the guys that don't macro but mine in an orca and 4 hulks or 4 mackinaws 23/7 will come in. "Oh I just have all the dual boxed hulks setup in 2 computers while I mange the operation from my main in the orca, I don't use any software at all hurf durf."
Cambarus The Compass Reloaded	Posted - 2010.04.02 13:56:00 - [163] I'm bumping this topic because quite frankly it's ridiculous that we've not had an official post in it yet =\
Great Artista Caldari Veto. Veto Corp	Posted - 2010.04.02 15:44:00 - [164] Now that is a command center. ____ Rockets need a boost. CCP status: [_] Told. [x] Not told. ◕◡◕
Aixa Syal Minmatar al-Syal Brigade	Posted - 2010.04.03 07:04:00 - [165] That monitor setup looks like something from the matrix :P
Cassie Ragadda	Posted - 2010.04.03 12:49:00 - [166] I use synergy for my work PC and my play PC. I can promise you that it does not perform any automated tasks, nor does it macro. If I don't physically touch the mouse and create the action of moving and clicking the mouse then it does nothing. It also only works on 1 pc at a time since the whole purpose of the (FREE) application is to do nothing but allow 1 keyboard and 1 mouse to work on multiple PCs, 1 at a time. You move your mouse to PC "A", you can do things on PC "A", you move the mouse to PC "B" you can do things on PC "B". If you think this constitutes macroing then you need a new brain, because yours quit working. Macroing is defined by a program that performs actions FOR YOU. If your not smart enough to come up with new ways to doing things and think because you cant drive a car that everyone should walk, that's your problem. Deal with it. I am so sick of people that don't have enough brain power, or willpower, or motivation to step outside the box. They claim because they cant do it no one should. Whaaaa I cant run 2 accounts on my pc whaaaa its not fair that others can. Its stupidity! Speaking of GMs and how they treat customers and don't seem to follow any type of standardized procedures. I had 2 friends that were in a plex, reds jumped into the system but not to them. They both logged off, when they logged back in they both were in the station their ships gone no evemails, no insurance pay out. Petitions were filed. GM "A" restored clone, implants, ship for one of the 2 people. GM "B" said sorry can't help to the other. WTH is with that? CCP should work on improving CS, that's a bit fishy to me. Being banned for using a simple utility that does nothing more than keep you from having to use 10 keyboards and 10 mice for 10 PCs, IMO was wrong. Next you will say switch boxes are macros too. Its also sad that a GM can port in, say hey look, all those accounts are coming from the same IP, must be a macro. Should I make sure, should I see if it really is a macro? Naaa, I'm not held accountable for my actions. click I would fire someone for treating my customers like that. IMO they should be too. "IF they were to have done such a thing, you never know if that's the real story" Until CCP comes out and says multiboxing is not permitted (which they never will because it will cut into their wallet) then I can run 100+ accounts if I want, and there is nothing any GM should do to interfere since they didn't say it was against the rules, Heck even Blizzard says Keyclone is allowed because its not a macro program it just simply sends the keyboard keys that you hit to all the PCs, but will do absolutely nothing if you don't make it. Thus not a macro.
Kortec Minmatar White Legion Knights	Posted - 2010.04.03 13:27:00 - [167] Salute to the OP... Thinking outside the box ! - Kortec
Cambarus The Compass Reloaded	Posted - 2010.04.03 21:01:00 - [168] I actually petitioned this last night, because the lack of a response here is really annoying. Typically exploit petitions get replies within half an hour, this one's been there more than a day and still nothing... Which is bad because I'd like to know if it's worth keeping my 2 alts or not... I guess I'll have to keep bumping this topic till we get an answer
Dogo Duma	Posted - 2010.04.03 21:49:00 - [169] Edited by: Dogo Duma on 03/04/2010 21:48:53 Originally by: Cassie Ragadda synergy Kudos for not getting it This isn't about multiboxing in a sense of using multiple accounts, it's about multiboxing a selection of accounts through a synchronised set of controls which enable the player to control his accounts all at the same time without additional manual actions required on his behalf, accelerating his gameplay (and for the purposes of EVE accelerating his rate of progression / acquisition / damage / etc). His first statements, focused on the use of software for the purposes of multiboxing, synchronising his control over multiple accounts. The software tool you are referring to is such a tool, the difference is that where you do not use any broadcasting options, he did. Effectively allowing him to use one means of control to direct all clients simultaneously. To sketch a picture, where you would have to go from one client to the next and to the next, he would click once, and all his clients would execute the same action. The most recent version of him is that rack of mice, tied together. Go figure. It doesn't change the simple observation however. But, to avoid confusion it is probably an idea to point out those (maybe subtle) differences which keep normal gameplay with multiple accounts (on same machine or spread across multiple machines and controlled using such a tool like synergy) within the bounds of the EULA, and his gameplay which involves broadcasting/ducttape to control all accounts simultaneously. Your gameplay isn't accelerated. His is.
Boomershoot Caldari Suddenly Ninjas	Posted - 2010.04.03 22:01:00 - [170] Originally by: Cambarus I guess I'll have to keep bumping this topic till we get an answer You will not get an official answer here.

Noesis Dream	Posted - 2010.04.03 22:51:00 - [171] Very Cool setup you have there! He's physically using those accounts, no harm there if you ask me. Lots of people dont seem too understand the difference between this and macro's.
Zhek Kromtor	Posted - 2010.04.04 00:48:00 - [172] Originally by: Dogo Duma blah blah blah ACCELERATING blah blah blah... I assure you my progress compared to a normal player or to a normal group of players is anything but accelerated. LetÆs pretend I run missions 3 times as fast as a single player using 1 account That wealth is then spread out among 14 characters which means I gain wealth at a rate of 21% that of a normal player. Compare me to a group of individual players grouped together using 14 accounts to run missions and again I lag behind tremendously because it is so incredibly difficult to actually spread my guys out and loot or salvage efficiently. Then take a look at what the EULA is really restricting: macros. The acceleration they give is clearly seen in that the player can continue to gain wealth while not playing the game thus gaining wealth at a truly accelerated rate. Literally the only advantage you could argue that I have over 14 individual players is my ability to focus fire with extreme coordination - that coordination could easily be matched by 14 people with half a brain and some discipline since I have to broadcast a target on my main and then attempt to sync click it with my other characters û the very same method by which they would focus fire. Using the overview for sync targeting is completely out of the question as it is incredibly unpredictable regardless of how it is sorted. If what I am doing gives me an advantage as you claim then why are gangs of multiboxers not dominating the landscape of Eve? Why, in every MMO, is it considered an accomplishment for a multiboxer to achieve the same things that normal groups achieve? You can say that using a wooden dowel or boxing software provides acceleration compared to not using it, but they only accelerate base multiboxing capabilities and never match or ever come close to exceeding the capabilities of individuals controlling the accounts i.e. ônormal gameplayö.
Capt Fossil Gallente	Posted - 2010.04.04 00:56:00 - [173] Originally by: Boomershoot You will not get an official answer here. And that is just plain ignoring paying customers who want an ANSWER! Same as in the Macro miner thread.
Dramund	Posted - 2010.04.04 01:04:00 - [174] He was banned for it. I'd call that a pretty official answer.
Zhek Kromtor	Posted - 2010.04.04 01:10:00 - [175] Originally by: Dramund He was banned for it. I'd call that a pretty official answer. facepalm I'm currently playing all 14 accounts now. I'm not banned, nor was I told not to play the accounts. Read the OP.
Nexus Kinonn	Posted - 2010.04.04 01:27:00 - [176] Originally by: Zhek Kromtor Originally by: Dramund He was banned for it. I'd call that a pretty official answer. facepalm I'm currently playing all 14 accounts now. I'm not banned, nor was I told not to play the accounts. Read the OP. You were 3-day banned for using Synergy. That's in the OP.
Shinji Seto Minmatar Xolti Research	Posted - 2010.04.04 02:07:00 - [177] You Mr. OP are pure win! "Outlaw" This was the name given to those who roam the universe with only his freedom as his guide.
Capt Fossil Gallente	Posted - 2010.04.04 02:37:00 - [178] Originally by: Nexus Kinonn I am a dork and am here live on this froum to prove it. Op, I saw you/them/you guys in Verge Vendor a couple of nights ago. I am totally impressed by your ingenuity and wish you the best of luck. Best of luck man.
Cipher Jones Minmatar	Posted - 2010.04.04 03:50:00 - [179] Originally by: Nexus Kinonn Originally by: Zhek Kromtor Originally by: Dramund He was banned for it. I'd call that a pretty official answer. facepalm I'm currently playing all 14 accounts now. I'm not banned, nor was I told not to play the accounts. Read the OP. You were 3-day banned for using Synergy. That's in the OP. Do you think you could possibly troll any harder? CCP did not ban him for using Synergy according to anything posted. The only way you could know this is if you saw his ban email, which was not posted. This is clearly a signature.
Mingus Sin	Posted - 2010.04.04 04:23:00 - [180] I want to have your love child!

Ulair Memmet ORIGIN SYSTEMS Shadows of Light	Posted - 2010.04.04 05:46:00 - [181] 3 words: Get A Life Is it FUN to play like this? I mean seriously..
Amanda Mor Gallente	Posted - 2010.04.04 06:27:00 - [182] Originally by: Ulair Memmet 3 words: Get A Life Is it FUN to play like this? I mean seriously.. Apparently it is (to him). Seriously, can we dispense with the get a life comments? I called this guy a wacko in another thread that linked to this one the other day, but in a harmless way. Is he a little crazy? Probably, yeah, but really who cares? Is he really any different than someone who spends 7 years rebuilding a 1969 Dodge Charger to Dukes of Hazzard specs (no, not me, a friend of mine - he's crazy)? You really think this guy spends more time on Eve than, oh I don't know, CHRIBBA? Nobody tells him to get a life. If he's actually able to afford that setup (I'd guess it would have to run well north of $5,000 c/d?), then he likely has a successful career, which means he's light years ahead of most of the people here. And as mentioned before, just cause he has 14 accounts, doesn't mean he plays 14 times more than someone who has 1 account. Oh, and I'm not one of his alts (which apparently would put me among the minority in the eve universe). ---------------------------------------------- I'm not an alt. Oh wait, yes I am.

Chribba Otherworld Enterprises Otherworld Empire	Posted - 2010.04.04 08:30:00 - [183] Originally by: Amanda Mor You really think this guy spends more time on Eve than, oh I don't know, CHRIBBA? Nobody tells him to get a life. Coz everyone already knows I'm a lost cause Secure 3rd party service \| my in-game channel 'Holy Veldspar'

Dasola Minmatar	Posted - 2010.04.04 10:52:00 - [184] All hail OP. Thats mean setup. Cant wait to see you get all those accounts to battleships and start roaming 0.0 during wartime. Anyways, i have 4 accounts myself and really dont see so much difference me running 4 accounts on 3 computers then he doing it his way. After all hes not accuiring things faster, he has pile of accounts to divide poceeds to. If you think hes missioning too fast, get your 13 friends with you and go missioning and see yourself is it really that good. Im pretty sure you start to see the light. What op is doing in mo opinion is no different then player useign one of those g15 macro keyboards. And if we start to yell unfair advantage, how about this: Do you make more then 100 mil profit per month on tradeing? Then you have unfair advantage over me and you must be banned. I can understand why ccp is banning bot and macro users, theyre not even at computer playing. Theyre having computer playing their game for them. but clearly op is on computer playing and issueing those commands to clients.
Bal'Ayle	Posted - 2010.04.04 11:11:00 - [185] the way i see it is if you are macro'ing that's fine, just so long as your at the PC if you pay for 10 accounts fine your paying for the servers i play in - you drive down the prices of materials in high sec and raise the prices in null sec because you don't do it there his set-up shoes dedication and ingenuity i myself do not possess but at the same time i don't think he could con a player in eve quite like i can, he DOES have an advantage over me, but that's why i love eve. PEOPLE make the difference his accounts aren't better then mine, his workmanship behind the desk allows him to play like this, if he had a computer doing it for him i would be irritated but he is actually playing all the accounts in a kind of Frankenstein way :D way i see it so long as there is a pilot at the controls good luck to em, the EULA is a standard template for online fairness i dont think it should be taken word for word, its eve its a harsh place but people using their own skills make it so so much better a game then any other i know, hell look at his set up that's what i imagine my scorpion ****pit looks like =]
Larkonis Trassler Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED	Posted - 2010.04.04 11:22:00 - [186] ITT jealous nerds who would all do this if they had the time/money to do so. Please resize your signature to the maximum file size of 24000 bytes. Zymurgist No. Larkonis
Mr Kidd	Posted - 2010.04.04 11:23:00 - [187] 14 multiboxed accounts, that's just sad though your technical prowess is impressive. Do you even get up to go to the bathroom or just have all the necessary plumbing connected to your chair?
Cambarus The Compass Reloaded	Posted - 2010.04.04 14:50:00 - [188] Originally by: Dramund He was banned for it. I'd call that a pretty official answer. 1) He was falsely banned because a GM thought he was a macrominer, not because he was using synergy. 2)I've known people who were banned, yelled at the GMs, and got unbanned. GMs make mistakes too, that's why we have the option of having a petition escalated (not to mention that there's a petition category specifically to complain about GMs and ISK screwing up) Also to the guy who said we won't get an official response here: Why not? There's a whole lot of people posting in this topic wanting a rule clarification, I see no reason why they won't eventually get one. Like I said, I also put in a petition, which had a link to this thread. It's just a matter of time before one of the senior GMs gets a look at it, and till then I'll just have to keep this thread visible :D
Korashy Djurm	Posted - 2010.04.04 15:31:00 - [189] I have a mini fridge next to my computer, i can grab a drink without leaving. I have an unfair advantage ban me. Stupid, he doesn't have an unfair advantage he's simply smarter than you (or has more money). Are you gonna cry unfair advantage when a Ferrari passes you on the road? Or when your badger gets killed by a BS? Fact is all decisions and actions are performed by a single person. What sort of hardware you are using should have nothing to do with your character being banned. Some might have a really comfortable chair, some might even have a toilet installed by their desk. You can't ban people how they choose to play the game, I mean if i choose to play naked that's none of your business.
Swiftgaze Elysium Trading Company Elysium Alliance	Posted - 2010.04.04 15:36:00 - [190] Whenever I try to find out if someone is a macro, I try to talk to them. :)

Celes Steele	Posted - 2010.04.04 17:37:00 - [191] Edited by: Celes Steele on 04/04/2010 17:41:16 On phone (Storm) so painful!! And forget about edits... If CCP added something like "also not allowed is using a single keystroke or a device allowing a single keystroke or single action to simultaneously control more than one client" Would it not make this issue crystal clear and also clarify other things like the G15 keyboard, multiboxing, Synergy at the same time?
Dramund	Posted - 2010.04.04 20:37:00 - [192] Originally by: Cambarus 1) He was falsely banned because a GM thought he was a macrominer, not because he was using synergy. Yes, those are the OP's words - and guilty people never claim they have been "erroneously" punished, am I right? I'll wager the words of his appeal weren't "Your GM's were wrong, lift the ban." Quote: 2)I've known people who were banned, yelled at the GMs, and got unbanned. GMs make mistakes too, that's why we have the option of having a petition escalated (not to mention that there's a petition category specifically to complain about GMs and ISK screwing up) Also to the guy who said we won't get an official response here: Why not? There's a whole lot of people posting in this topic wanting a rule clarification, I see no reason why they won't eventually get one. Like I said, I also put in a petition, which had a link to this thread. It's just a matter of time before one of the senior GMs gets a look at it, and till then I'll just have to keep this thread visible :D They don't have to answer because the question isn't "Is it against the EULA to use Synergy on 14 machines to mine?" No, that is a meaningless question, unless you are into self-contained thought experiments. The real question is, "If I use Synergy to mine with 14 machines at a time, can I get banned?" As you can clearly see from the OP's story, yes. Yes, you can if only because using Synergy looks a lot like macromining. We shouldn't expect constant responses on the forums from CCP on every little issue to reassure us that they haven't changed their minds. This would be like someone getting arrested for peeing in public, then writing a letter to the mayor asking, "Am I allowed to pee in public? Should I do it again?" If the mayor were particularly bored that day, the mayor would respond, "Yes, dummy, you were arrested, so you probably shouldn't do it again." Then that same person could appeal to an adjudicator, "But really, I wasn't peeing in public, I just decided to whip it out and pour water out of a sports bottle at waist level so it looked like I was peeing in public." To that, the adjudicator might say "Okay, we'll lighten the sentence, but that is still a bad idea." So the point is, I wouldn't expect CCP to say anything unless out of some strange change of heart, it is OK.
Amanda Mor Gallente	Posted - 2010.04.04 21:22:00 - [193] Originally by: Chribba Originally by: Amanda Mor You really think this guy spends more time on Eve than, oh I don't know, CHRIBBA? Nobody tells him to get a life. Coz everyone already knows I'm a lost cause I feel for ya buddy - there's a slew of 12 step programs you can take to cure your addiction (I'm looking into a few myself). ---------------------------------------------- I'm not an alt. Oh wait, yes I am.
Cambarus The Compass Reloaded	Posted - 2010.04.05 00:39:00 - [194] Originally by: Dramund Originally by: Cambarus ... Yes, those are the OP's words - and guilty people never claim they have been "erroneously" punished, am I right? I'll wager the words of his appeal weren't "Your GM's were wrong, lift the ban." Maybe not in those words, but if he got banned because the GM thought he was a macro, then yeah, I'd argue that odds are that was the bulk of his petition... Originally by: Dramund They don't have to answer because the question isn't "Is it against the EULA to use Synergy on 14 machines to mine?" No, that is a meaningless question, unless you are into self-contained thought experiments. The real question is, "If I use Synergy to mine with 14 machines at a time, can I get banned?" As you can clearly see from the OP's story, yes. Yes, you can if only because using Synergy looks a lot like macromining. We shouldn't expect constant responses on the forums from CCP on every little issue to reassure us that they haven't changed their minds. No, that's NOT the real question. You can get banned for a multitude of things, including things that are seemingly innocent (think of all the people who got banned after logging in from work/school/anywhere that wasn't their home for security reasons just recently). The whole reason behind people inquiring about this specific rule is because synergy and other such programs are quite common in MMOs, and if someone DOES get banned for using them (assuming it's not against the rules) they have the ability to link to this thread when they petition to get unbanned. Having an official ruling about grey areas in the rules of an MMO (BTW people who argue about the EULA are idiots, CCP has the right to terminate not only a character, but an entire account if they want to, for no other reason than the sky being a bit too cloudy that day) allows people to know what they can do without having to worry about a permaban (a temp ban due to a gm mistake is annoying, but not that big a deal. it's a permaban for actually breaking an official rule that people should be worried about) Originally by: Dramund Insert bad example here That's a terrible example. The analogy reversed would be that what we're trying to find out here is whether or not it's illegal to empty a water bottle. The OP got banned for looking like a macro, but let's be honest, even were he manually controlling each character individually with no hilarious dowel and stick setup, he'd STILL look like a macro, and will still probably get temp banned now and then. The problem is that those of us interested in running maybe 2 or 3 characters this way want an official ruling on using the software, and we're not getting one.
Dramund	Posted - 2010.04.05 01:01:00 - [195] Originally by: Cambarus That's a terrible example. The analogy reversed would be that what we're trying to find out here is whether or not it's illegal to empty a water bottle. The OP got banned for looking like a macro, but let's be honest, even were he manually controlling each character individually with no hilarious dowel and stick setup, he'd STILL look like a macro, and will still probably get temp banned now and then. The problem is that those of us interested in running maybe 2 or 3 characters this way want an official ruling on using the software, and we're not getting one. No you followed that analogy quite well. Reversed, you would be trying to find out if emptying a water bottle in an alley next to a dumpster is illegal. No, it's not illegal, but it looks like illegal activity meaning you are going to deal with the consequences. Similarly, CCP can't magically determine whether your macro-like activity is the result of wooden dowels, Synergy, or an actual macro, so even if they officially said it was OK, it would just become an overused cop-out for people who actually use macros... "Oh, this? This isn't my jacket man, my friend must have left weed in here." I don't imagine they would officially say it is OK. It can (not will) get you banned. Simple enough, no?
Ivas Tiffy Amarr Royal Amarr Institute	Posted - 2010.04.05 04:31:00 - [196] Originally by: Zhek Kromtor Originally by: Dramund He was banned for it. I'd call that a pretty official answer. facepalm I'm currently playing all 14 accounts now. I'm not banned, nor was I told not to play the accounts. Read the OP. " After being erroneously 3-day banned for "macro use" " looks liek my petition was not enough... I will wait for a week till ALL your accoutns are running at same time then use trackking agetns to find what system your in then hunt you down.. then if i see you all MINING i will file ANOTHER petition.
Wet Ferret	Posted - 2010.04.05 05:43:00 - [197] I don't see how this can not considered macro/botting. You're interacting with one client. Let me repeat that: one client. A 3rd party program is running the rest. edit: and just to remind you, there is still no divider between posts and sigs.
SunOfSin Caldari Perkone	Posted - 2010.04.05 11:33:00 - [198] Edited by: SunOfSin on 05/04/2010 11:35:46 Edited by: SunOfSin on 05/04/2010 11:34:55 you can b runing a G15 keyboard you set up macro so do not run G15 keyboard? you guys damb pay 150$ for a keyboard 70% games you play banned you for do it? i 3 accs on one pc all do alt+tab do not need G15 keyboard or macros
Ivas Tiffy Amarr Royal Amarr Institute	Posted - 2010.04.05 14:13:00 - [199] Originally by: SunOfSin Edited by: SunOfSin on 05/04/2010 11:35:46 Edited by: SunOfSin on 05/04/2010 11:34:55 you can b runing a G15 keyboard you set up macro so do not run G15 keyboard? you guys damb pay 150$ for a keyboard 70% games you play banned you for do it? i 3 accs on one pc all do alt+tab do not need G15 keyboard or macros
Cambarus The Compass Reloaded	Posted - 2010.04.05 14:20:00 - [200] Originally by: Dramund No you followed that analogy quite well. Reversed, you would be trying to find out if emptying a water bottle in an alley next to a dumpster is illegal. No, it's not illegal, but it looks like illegal activity meaning you are going to deal with the consequences. Similarly, CCP can't magically determine whether your macro-like activity is the result of wooden dowels, Synergy, or an actual macro, so even if they officially said it was OK, it would just become an overused cop-out for people who actually use macros... "Oh, this? This isn't my jacket man, my friend must have left weed in here." I don't imagine they would officially say it is OK. It can (not will) get you banned. Simple enough, no? Clearly you missed the problem if you think that's accurate. The guy here has 14 accounts running. There is absolutely NOTHING he's going to be able to do to make them look like anything other than bots, it's just not viable. HOWEVER, for those of us who would like to be able to use key duplicating software to run a COUPLE of accounts, IE something that does NOT look like a massive gang of botters (so the comparison of emptying water bottles in alleys is not accurate, as the issue there is not that the act itself is illegal but that it LOOKS like something that is, whereas the issue of bot-banning is one caused by the number of characters this guy had running, and NOT the fact that he was using sticks or keyclick duplicators to get them to all go at once) it is important to get an official response from CCP on whether or not the act itself is actually legal. This is not the sort of thing that I'd like to get banned for after my accounts have been fully set up and I've spent close to a hundred bucks per getting them to a point where they're good for what I want them to do. At least not permanently. The odds of getting banned for looking like a bot are not high if you're only doing it with 2 or 3 accounts, I (and I imagine others) just want to know that if we DO end up getting banned for it, that it will have been an accidental band and one that will be lifted.

Cipher Jones Minmatar	Posted - 2010.04.05 15:43:00 - [201] Edited by: Cipher Jones on 05/04/2010 15:47:28 Quote: No, that's NOT the real question. You can get banned for a multitude of things, including things that are seemingly innocent (think of all the people who got banned after logging in from work/school/anywhere that wasn't their home for security reasons just recently). Thats simply not true. You can be banned for anything at anytime. You don't have to be guilty of anything. Quote: looks liek my petition was not enough... I will wait for a week till ALL your accoutns are running at same time then use trackking agetns to find what system your in then hunt you down.. then if i see you all MINING i will file ANOTHER petition. You are a total douche and don't deserve to play the same eve as me. You cant even bother to read the thread before you post. Go cry to a GM fanboi. This is clearly a signature.
Siigari Kitawa Gallente The Aduro Protocol Talon Alliance	Posted - 2010.04.05 15:52:00 - [202] I don't understand how somebody gets banned for using Synergy. All Synergy is is a KVM tool. www.siigarikitawa.com ò www.eohpoker.com ò Buy a GTC
Orb Lati Minmatar ANZAC ALLIANCE IT Alliance	Posted - 2010.04.05 23:23:00 - [203] While i don't seriously think the OP actually uses that setup to play (ie the glue bottle still beside the monitor in 1 of the pictures) Im sure it illustrates a point. I don't think program that mirrors mouse and keyboard clicks in the strictest sense is a Macro. In most cases a macro is defined as: 1. A single, user-defined command that is part of an application and executes a series of commands. I don't think a replication of 1 command over multiple systems is the same as the term "execution of a series of commands" I would prefer that the term macro so far as eve is concern is those programs the effectively play the game without any player input. While I do see that his game play provides him with an advantage over other "individual" players, he is paying the cost of those accounts in a game where multiple accounts seem to be the norm. On a completely unrelated note. I would really like to know how your achieving the "boarderless" windowed client in portrait format, with those 2 clients per monitor? Ie are you editing a ini file to get the unique resolution available? What program are you using to strip the boarders and reposition, as i know evemover doesnt allow for it? "We worship Strength because it is through strength that all other values are made possible"
Unknown Slave	Posted - 2010.04.06 01:11:00 - [204] U sir,are a genuis.....
Ravella	Posted - 2010.04.06 05:34:00 - [205] Heh more power to you Krom.. oh noes ban me I run 5 all by myself.. got the fastest alt+tab fingers around...
Bongo Debbie Minmatar Trillionaire High-Rollers Suicidal Bassoon Orkesta	Posted - 2010.04.06 05:48:00 - [206] Originally by: Larkonis Trassler ITT jealous nerds who would all do this if they had the time/money to do so. Go and lose 14 orcas to carebears about it. ----
Bongo Debbie Minmatar Trillionaire High-Rollers Suicidal Bassoon Orkesta	Posted - 2010.04.06 05:50:00 - [207] Originally by: Siigari Kitawa I don't understand how somebody gets banned for using Synergy. All Synergy is is a KVM tool. How about you settle your debts rather than screw everybody over before commenting on anything else? ----
JZX100	Posted - 2010.04.06 10:14:00 - [208] Love the setup man, love it. Wouldn't have gone that route, but I admire the ingenuity to design that. That was the nice thing about multi-boxing in wow, could use keyclone & synergy to control the characters. Didn't really continue on past the trial period because the cost of buying 4 more original copies and 8 more expansions plus monthly fee's was a little more then i wanted to pay. Saying he has no life/family... Well keep assuming. Don't know the guy personally, he never stated how much he played daily, and it might be chump change to him to afford the setup/pay for the monthly fee. So he might have a damn good job, hot girl friend/wife, or the exact opposite. But its nice to see people are still closed minded and judge a book by it's cover. But to the OP (or anybody in that matter) if you enjoy it do it, just hope CCP comes back with a clear answer. Oh and life's not fair, just have to deal with it guys. Also before you cry about it being a game .
Liorah	Posted - 2010.04.06 14:01:00 - [209] While I don't know the specifics of what information, logs, and records the GMs in EVE have access to, I know that in other games the logs are quite extensive. But for the purpose of discussion, lets just assume that the server records the times of mouse clicks for each client. Situation A: If this Synergy program is really a software KVM switch, the times between the mouse clicks of each client would show that the user had to switch between each client to click. The hypothetical mouse click timing tracker would document this. Situation B: If this Synergy program is really a mouse keystroke duplication program, the times between the mouse clicks would be minimal, near instantaneous. The hypothetical mouse click timing tracker would document this. To this non-lawyer and non-GM, "Situation A" would seem to be perfectly acceptable while "Situation B" would be a violation. Further, removing the "Synergy" program from the mix, any setup that mimics "Situation B" would continue to appear to be a violation. Why the difference? In "Situation A", one person is doing the work of one person, repeated many times whether for one, two, 14, or 100 accounts. In "Situation B", one person is doing the work of multiple persons, facilitated by software or mechanical (or wooden) means. That is what makes the situation a violation (in the eyes of this non-lawyer, non-GM). Obviously, there is some wiggle room for small numbers of clients. And if someone was using mouse/key duplication software for two accounts, it would take a fair bit longer to pick up on it. But for 14 accounts? Yeah, it's pretty obvious right away, and you don't need logs to detect it either. Thus no need to even bother with contacting the person who did this before issuing a ban. Hint to the OP: If you are actually serious and not trolling, try making your setup mimic "Situation A", where you have to perform the equivalent of an alt-Tab to each client and issue your mouse/keyboard commands instead of finding wild and crazy ways to duplicate keystrokes and mouse clicks to multiple computers at once. Cause if I were a GM (I'm not), you'd be on my "Watch" list after that first three-day ban, and I'd make sure you spent more time out of game than in it for as long as you continued this behaviour.
Dodgy Past Amarr Debitum Naturae BricK sQuAD.	Posted - 2010.04.06 14:51:00 - [210] Originally by: Liorah Hint to the OP: If you are actually serious and not trolling, try making your setup mimic "Situation A", where you have to perform the equivalent of an alt-Tab to each client and issue your mouse/keyboard commands instead of finding wild and crazy ways to duplicate keystrokes and mouse clicks to multiple computers at once. Cause if I were a GM (I'm not), you'd be on my "Watch" list after that first three-day ban, and I'd make sure you spent more time out of game than in it for as long as you continued this behaviour. Why on earth do you have to alt tab? Two monitors or 2 computers ( with two mice you can click at the same time ) is perfectly reasonable. As others have said how would it look for CCP to push the idea of using multiple accounts and then ban people for the fact that they gain an advantage by doing so. I regularly take advantage of 2 accounts at once, be it for scouting or using one account to collect loot while I rat with the other. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- you seem determined to turn it into ******* Hollyoaks for neckbeards.

Liorah	Posted - 2010.04.06 15:09:00 - [211] Originally by: Dodgy Past Originally by: Liorah Hint to the OP: If you are actually serious and not trolling, try making your setup mimic "Situation A", where you have to perform the equivalent of an alt-Tab to each client and issue your mouse/keyboard commands instead of finding wild and crazy ways to duplicate keystrokes and mouse clicks to multiple computers at once. Cause if I were a GM (I'm not), you'd be on my "Watch" list after that first three-day ban, and I'd make sure you spent more time out of game than in it for as long as you continued this behaviour. Why on earth do you have to alt tab? Two monitors or 2 computers ( with two mice you can click at the same time ) is perfectly reasonable. As others have said how would it look for CCP to push the idea of using multiple accounts and then ban people for the fact that they gain an advantage by doing so. I regularly take advantage of 2 accounts at once, be it for scouting or using one account to collect loot while I rat with the other. (and also parts that you didn't quote) Reading comprehension. You don't have it.
Empress Shai	Posted - 2010.04.06 18:36:00 - [212] Edited by: Empress Shai on 06/04/2010 18:44:04 Edited by: Empress Shai on 06/04/2010 18:41:29 @Liorah: I am not criticizing, only stating my experience. Quote Liorah "Situation B: If this Synergy program is really a mouse keystroke duplication program..." If you set up Synergy, it is the same as if you had a PC capable of running 2 monitors, each running a client in the window. All it does is extend your keyboard/mouse to another PC. It doesn't (that I have ever experienced) instantly duplicate mouse clicks to other computers. You have to scroll over to the other PC, which it doesn't increase reaction time, and I have been using synergy for non EVE uses for YEARS (it is more than a couple years old). ------------------- Seperate thoughts: I am betting CCP won't ban him for a couple reasons. 1. He bought every account. That is money in their pocket. 2. If he Super PLEXs (uses em to pay for game time), people are selling him PLEX, which they buy from CCP, which makes money... you get the idea. If your average PLEX purchase from CCP buys you 2 months for a minimum transaction, and he buys 14, that is 7 months sold to this multiboxer that CCP collects EXTRA a month. For CCP, they are making extra money, and there are enough systems out there with low traffic, we can't really complain. He is AT the computer. It's the people who macro mine who should be shot. Just my (overextended) .02 isk
Liorah	Posted - 2010.04.06 20:37:00 - [213] @Empress Shai Your post raised my curiosity, so I actually took a look at Synergy's website, and it looks like a neat program. From a cursory glance, I'd agree that it appears you have to actually click each action on each screen; it appears to be a rather slick, software KVM-like switch without the video sharing. With those observations in mind, I would say that using Synergy "shouldn't" (heh) be in violation of the EULA (non-lawyer, non-GM still). It would also seem that OP's wooden contraption is more of a violation of the EULA than Synergy. If my understanding of Synergy is correct, this thread "should" get OP a ban faster than using Synergy. I caveat this with the disclaimer that I don't use Synergy and have only given a cursory glance of the website :) As to whether he would be banned, anecdotal comments seems to indicate that there is inconsistency in the actions and behaviours of the GMs. If there is some way to prove that he had to click/keypress every action on every account on every computer, that "should" settle the matter completely. Otherwise, as it stands, if you get one GM who has had a bad day, for example, OP might stand little chance regardless of the software he uses or doesn't use. Any possible unprofessionalism displayed toward the GMs wouldn't help. I suspect CCP won't make a stance on Synergy, unless they take the time to cite a specific version/date of product release, because the public at large could take it in any direction they wanted, adding the keystroke/mouse duplication ability if so desired. A hardware product is slightly harder to change at the drop of a hat, so it's safer to declare a hardware device "permissible". I still maintain that it wouldn't take long for a GM in a game with even just average logging capabilities to find out whether a user is using mouse/keystroke duplication software, or clicking/keypressing each action. Originally by: Empress Shai He is AT the computer. It's the people who macro mine who should be shot. I think this sums it all up nicely: OP would be small potatoes, a shallow example, and the effort spent on him near-useless against the macro miners.
Magesto Caldari Radiant shield Radiant Force	Posted - 2010.04.06 22:34:00 - [214] ok, my question is this, what if he wasnt mining at that time, and was missioning? would that still be considered a violation of any sort? i mean what would the diff be if he was individually clicking each of his insane amount of accts? would that have made a diff? and if doing it that way was still questionable what about those of us with 2 or 3 accts running lvl 3s or 4s or mining even? i say ** it, if hes willing to go to that kinda trouble for it, let him. its his life thats wasting away, and we can all hope that with all the money he is funneling into ccp that they will lower the monthly on eve. because lets face it, 14 accts, after 2 months of being active, he's pretty much a shareholder of ccp. CHECK PLEASE!**
Kent Lineatus	Posted - 2010.04.06 23:20:00 - [215] Question, on those side screens how did you get the 2 windowed clients split screen like that or are they just over lapped and not actually resized? thx
Psychotic Maniac Caldari Head Shrinkers	Posted - 2010.04.07 02:32:00 - [216] What kind of drugs are you on? All you need is 14 chinese.
SupaKudoRio	Posted - 2010.04.07 04:12:00 - [217] /me sets up a Reading Comprehension skill book store. "Wuts synergy? omg it must be an ebil macro program, ima ignore the posts mentioning what it does and NEEERRRDDDD RRRAAAAGGGGEEEEE in op's chinese face, lolololololololol." Pretty much sums up the entire thread, minus the comments on how awesome the setup is or how little of a life the OP has. Quote: With synergy, all the computers on your desktop form a single virtual screen. You use the mouse and keyboard of only one of the computers while you use all of the monitors on all of the computers. You tell synergy how many screens you have and their positions relative to one another. Synergy then detects when the mouse moves off the edge of a screen and jumps it instantly to the neighboring screen. The keyboard works normally on each screen; input goes to whichever screen has the cursor. Source. _____ 10/10: Where is your God now?
NuroCorp	Posted - 2010.04.07 07:24:00 - [218] OP I would love to see a video of that setup actually running - to validate it. Otherwise its a very clever but unconvincing possible cover for why you got banned seeing as we'll most likely never get the GM's side of the story. I cant imagine that setup working for ratting/missioning with too many variables, and whilst you could use all 14 accounts in one mission, several missions would just not happen with that setup. I can see mining being plausible but to synchronize all accounts each time you log in without some sort of script would take a stupid amount of time and to me would be unpractacle. That said, v nice monitor setup :)
Cipher Jones Minmatar	Posted - 2010.04.07 11:26:00 - [219] Originally by: Psychotic Maniac Edited by: Psychotic Maniac on 07/04/2010 07:16:31 What kind of drugs are you on? All you need is 14 chinamen. /waits for smack from 42 alts. "Dude, Chinaman is not the preferred nomenclature, Asian American, please." This is clearly a signature.
debbie harrio	Posted - 2010.04.07 17:34:00 - [220] Edited by: debbie harrio on 07/04/2010 17:35:13 Originally by: NuroCorp OP I would love to see a video of that setup actually running - to validate it. Otherwise its a very clever but unconvincing possible cover for why you got banned seeing as we'll most likely never get the GM's side of the story. I cant imagine that setup working for ratting/missioning with too many variables, and whilst you could use all 14 accounts in one mission, several missions would just not happen with that setup. I can see mining being plausible but to synchronize all accounts each time you log in without some sort of script would take a stupid amount of time and to me would be unpractacle. That said, v nice monitor setup :) good sir would this suffice. Quote: nullThe Dowel Killer

Imran Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2010.04.07 17:37:00 - [221] Originally by: Cozmik R5 Life: not everybody has one. Says the person playing an internet spaceship game. __________________________________________ EwokPoacher: Why hate Gallente? Blackest Sheep: Because we are beautiful.
Ryhss Caldari 42nd Airborn	Posted - 2010.04.07 17:40:00 - [222] Originally by: Destruction Theory I say let him, he's not using software, and if he wants to spend that much money on a setup, specifically designed to skirt around ccps rules, then let him. It is completely irrelevant as to how MANY accounts he is, it is however relevant how he uses them. According to his website, he only uses physical means, no software is involved. CCP were wrong to ban him, though I can understand how they assumed that he was a macro miner. THIS!
NuroCorp	Posted - 2010.04.07 22:58:00 - [223] Originally by: debbie harrio Edited by: debbie harrio on 07/04/2010 17:35:13 Originally by: NuroCorp OP I would love to see a video of that setup actually running - to validate it. Otherwise its a very clever but unconvincing possible cover for why you got banned seeing as we'll most likely never get the GM's side of the story. I cant imagine that setup working for ratting/missioning with too many variables, and whilst you could use all 14 accounts in one mission, several missions would just not happen with that setup. I can see mining being plausible but to synchronize all accounts each time you log in without some sort of script would take a stupid amount of time and to me would be unpractacle. That said, v nice monitor setup :) Nope, as it is not a video :P good sir would this suffice. Quote: nullThe Dowel Killer
NuroCorp	Posted - 2010.04.08 01:44:00 - [224] Originally by: Imran Originally by: Cozmik R5 Life: not everybody has one. Says the person playing an internet spaceship game. QFT. And best explained in trainspotting... Choose life. Choose a job. Choose a career. Choose a family, Choose a **ing big television Choose washing machines, cars, compact disc players, and electrical tin openers. Choose good health, low cholesterol and dental insurance. Choose fixed-interest mortgage repayments. Choose a starter home. Choose your friends. Choose leisure wear and matching luggage. Choose a three piece suite on hire purchase in a range of ing fabrics. Choose DIY and wondering who you are on a Sunday morning. Choose sitting on that couch watching mind-numbing sprit-crushing game shows Stuffing ing junk food into your mouth. Choose rotting away at the end of it all, pishing you last in a miserable home Nothing more than an embarrassment to the selfish, **ed-up brats You have spawned to replace yourself. Choose your future. Choose life. SO I, uh, chose EVE instead....
Celes Steele	Posted - 2010.04.08 06:10:00 - [225] Ok some quotes from the link you posted in your OP Kromtor The ban specifically stated "macro use". If they're actually upset with me multiboxing with sync'ed mouseclicks* then that's another story.* Someone responding with what looks like a CCP response Quote: You are welcome to use multiple accounts at the same time, no matter how many accounts you are using. What we understood you were asking with regards to multiboxing, was controlling all of those account with a single keystroke program or mouse click copy program. To make it more clear: You may use as many accounts as you wish at the same time, however you may not use a program to control more then 1 account at the same time with the same keystrokes/mouse, you will need to actually switch between the windows to control them. Kromtor your immediate eresponse Well then my petition explaining how I do just that probably won't go over too well. Kromtor 2 days later your next response The solution to boxing in Eve without breaking the rules and then you post a link to the google pics. Personally I agree with NuroCorp. I think the pics are simply for show. A video of you actually running this thing is what is needed to prove you aren't using syncro mouseclicks which would clearly be giving you an unfair advantage over regular multiboxing which you have to move to each client and initiate the action. I suck at quoting, but perhaps you can explain what you mean by the syncro mouseclicks you refer to in the thread you were posting in. It appears to me you produced the pictures as an attempt to justify how it would be possible to operate multiple accounts and not break the letter of the EULA. However if its only a picture, and you are continuing to use the syncro mouseclicks you stated you were, you shoud be banned permanently for attemping to hide it.
knubba Gallente freelancers inc F A I L	Posted - 2010.04.08 12:48:00 - [226] Originally by: vulnevia Just you wait untill this guy buys 14 battleships and starts to gatecamp somewhere... Like this? I wondered what kind of macro mission runner this was, but it was just too obvious to really be a bot. It's ok in my book, he is paying for his accounts so CCP is making money, and he isn't mining faster than 12 single users, maybe actually slower, since it must be a pain to set up and remember settings on every character, imagine managing skills...
Zhek Kromtor	Posted - 2010.04.08 13:28:00 - [227] Originally by: Celes Steele I can haz quotes There are different versions of synergy, some which allow for you to move your cursor on all your screens at once. It's referred to as synchronized or broadcasted mouse which is no different than what all common multiboxing software (Keyclone, Octopus, etc) do for the keyboard. In my original petition I explained to CCP that this was all that was being used - keep in mind the ban was for "macro use" and I was 3-day banned while mining so it was obvious they thought I was a macro miner. It was then pointed out to me on dual-boxing.com forums that CCP may not even allow the use of multiboxing software. I decided to come up with a method that would allow me to definitely play without breaking any rules while waiting for CCP's reply. There has been no reply in any form to my original anonymous petition (you can't petition via your accounts when 3 day banned cause you can't log even into the website). I've gone out of my way to make a website detailing how my new setup works. I've never macroed and I don't even mine anymore thanks to this crap. CCP can easily tell whether or not someone is running third party software like Synergy. I understand your desire to get a 24/7 video feed on me so you can see me slouched over my precious wooden dowels, surely all 400 lbs of me covered in a mixture of acne puss, sweat, and a near full-body neckbeard, but that would just be too embarassing for me. Maybe if CCP actually lets us know specifically what is and isn't allowed then I can go through the trouble of making a sexy video of my fat fingers dancing upon my wooden dowels with the knowledge that every other asshat poster quoting some irrelevant line in the EULA that they claim proves that using wooden sticks is akin to macroing at least won't be taken seriously. http://sites.google.com/site/khromtor/
Jack Paladin Solar Storm Sev3rance	Posted - 2010.04.08 13:34:00 - [228] Originally by: NuroCorp Originally by: Imran Originally by: Cozmik R5 Life: not everybody has one. Says the person playing an internet spaceship game. QFT. And best explained in trainspotting... Choose life. Choose a job. Choose a career. Choose a family, Choose a **ing big television Choose washing machines, cars, compact disc players, and electrical tin openers. Choose good health, low cholesterol and dental insurance. Choose fixed-interest mortgage repayments. Choose a starter home. Choose your friends. Choose leisure wear and matching luggage. Choose a three piece suite on hire purchase in a range of ing fabrics. Choose DIY and wondering who you are on a Sunday morning. Choose sitting on that couch watching mind-numbing sprit-crushing game shows Stuffing ing junk food into your mouth. Choose rotting away at the end of it all, pishing you last in a miserable home Nothing more than an embarrassment to the selfish, **ed-up brats You have spawned to replace yourself. Choose your future. Choose life. SO I, uh, chose EVE instead.... DING! Level up for you xD
Ick Ickagami	Posted - 2010.04.08 14:11:00 - [229] Originally by: Zhek Kromtor ...........slouched over my precious wooden dowels, surely all 400 lbs of me covered in a mixture of acne puss, sweat, and a near full-body neckbeard............. Whoa. Sensitive people will have nightmares for weeks over THAT mental image.
Xsst	Posted - 2010.04.09 13:26:00 - [230] Zhek your blog reference to Sam Deathwaker from EQ1 brought back so many memories. I used to love looking at pics of his setups and what he got up to. I remember his 12 wizards in PVP, 1 click and anyone he came up against was dead, just like your 12 ravens. I could copy and paste almost exactly the same types of threads and the stick he got in that game. The majority actually liked him and his love of the game. There was an epic thread (I think it was on the leading EQ guild homepage) where someone found out he had been imprisoned for practising reproduction with a minor. I don't think people were too happy about that though!

Zhek Kromtor	Posted - 2010.04.09 13:42:00 - [231] luckily my mom forbids me from practicing reproduction in her basement http://sites.google.com/site/khromtor/
Harotak THE FINAL STAND The Final Stand.	Posted - 2010.04.09 13:48:00 - [232] Edited by: Harotak on 09/04/2010 13:48:02 Originally by: Psychotic Maniac /waits for smack from 42 alts. Threadnaughting, the most obvious way to make use of 14 eve accounts.
Seishi Maru 24th Imperial Crusade	Posted - 2010.04.09 15:30:00 - [233] Originally by: Bo Bojangles Originally by: vulnevia Just you wait untill this guy buys 14 battleships and starts to gatecamp somewhere... Oh he's pvp'd with it. I encountered Zhek's nasty little setup last July. Zhek's naming convention also makes it necessary for an opposing FC to broadcast his ships rather than call out the targets as per usual. Originally by: Zhek Kromtor And while we're on the subject of numbers, if you and your 13 space buddies really get beat by someone using wooden dowels to control 14 ships it is abundantly clear who fails in the most ways. I didn't see any dowels. What I saw was was your Ravens decloak, drop drones, target and fire in a unison that cannot be equated in a normal fleet orchestrated by a single target caller communicating to individual pilots. Though as I recall there was a slight variation in the beginning of the targeting sequence between the ships,.. have you tried maple? OMG OMG.. imagine if he was using tempests with 1400mm? With a good few safespots he coudl be instapopping battleships adn warping out before anyone can figure what is going on.
Gavin Darklighter Ministry of War	Posted - 2010.04.09 16:31:00 - [234] And imagine if all the pilot's names were in binary and the same number of characters. Overview would look something like this.. 01101011010 01010101101 10010101010 01101011010 01111011011 10011010110 10110101110 10110101110 Wait, who is primary again? signature picture exceeds the size limit.~WeatherMan
The Wicked1	Posted - 2010.04.09 18:23:00 - [235] Originally by: Gavin Darklighter And imagine if all the pilot's names were in binary and the same number of characters. Overview would look something like this.. 01101011010 01010101101 10010101010 01101011010 01111011011 10011010110 10110101110 10110101110 Wait, who is primary again? Now that would be an unbeatable alliance
omgevenmoarfreemoniez	Posted - 2010.04.09 18:31:00 - [236] I'm starting a petition here for the OP to be euthanised as an act of compassion. Please sign it.
RipperZane	Posted - 2010.04.09 19:52:00 - [237] Edited by: RipperZane on 09/04/2010 19:53:54 NOTE: I posted with wrong toon! Grrrr Originally by: Zhek Kromtor Originally by: Celes Steele I can haz quotes There are different versions of synergy, some which allow for you to move your cursor on all your screens at once. PLease site a source for this I have never seen Synergy do this,(specifically named Synergy2 at the sourceforge pages). Afaik it doesn't replicate keyclicks to multiple clients at once. Is there are mode in Synergy? Have you in fact USED Synergy? I have 2 laptops, and 2 screens on my desktop. I use 1 laptop for netflix, one for in home work, and my 2 screens on my PC for client 1 and 2 (both windowed), and it has never appeared as an option to use it for multi replication of keystrokes. Synergy as a concept, as in a key repeater between machines and clients is not, in point of fact, Synergy2 (the technical name for the app). Or am I wrong? I only bring this forward to correct, not to argue. Misinformation or incorrect data harms the public as a general rule. I do not disagree with anything you said, but Synergy (again look for it at Source Forge DOT Net) afaik has not had that option. It is intended as a software KVM (1 keyboard/mouse for multiple machines), which is really great if you use multiple machines due to needing a full PC for specific dedicated tasks, or like being uberLEET geek and having your windows PC playing EVE, and compiling code on your Ubuntu box simultaneously. Just saying.
Cambarus The Compass Reloaded	Posted - 2010.04.09 20:07:00 - [238] BAM! Got a response from a senior GM today regarding my petition :D For obvious reasons I won't post the exact response here, but suffice to say that the senior GM said that using programs such as synergy (and YES, this DOES include versions that can control several accounts at once) IS ALLOWED \o/ What is not allowed is anything that automates it. So like having a button that will lock and fire on all accounts is not allowed, but having a program that allows you to hit f1 for all accounts at once is (or at least that's how I read it, what I can say for sure is that keyclick duplicating software is allowed, the GM even explicitly mentioned synergy and G15s as not being against the rules)
CyberGh0st Minmatar Sebiestor tribe	Posted - 2010.04.09 20:57:00 - [239] These sort of programs also existed in DAoC, and there it could be used to nuke 1 target with for example 10 nukes and the target would be instantly dead. "Team Wizzy" or something like that was well known for it. In the end Mythic made it an illegal action to use 1 keystroke to fire off multiple accounts. I think some explicit rules should prohobit this kind of borderline behavior. Sure it is not macroing, but to me it is still something that has no place in the game. http://www.mmodata.net Favorite MMO's : DAoC Pre-TOA-NF / SWG Pre-CU-NGE
Psychotic Maniac Caldari Head Shrinkers	Posted - 2010.04.10 02:44:00 - [240] Originally by: Gavin Darklighter And imagine if all the pilot's names were in binary and the same number of characters. Overview would look something like this.. 01101011010 01010101101 10010101010 01101011010 01111011011 10011010110 10110101110 10110101110 Wait, who is primary again? good one. would have to broadcast in the overview tags.

Zhek Kromtor	Posted - 2010.04.10 05:16:00 - [241] Edited by: Zhek Kromtor on 10/04/2010 05:16:06 Originally by: Cambarus BAM! Got a response from a senior GM today regarding my petition :D For obvious reasons I won't post the exact response here, but suffice to say that the senior GM said that using programs such as synergy (and YES, this DOES include versions that can control several accounts at once) IS ALLOWED \o/ I think you should post it, at the very least let us know the name of the GM or the detractors will not believe you. http://sites.google.com/site/khromtor/
Cambarus The Compass Reloaded	Posted - 2010.04.10 11:36:00 - [242] Originally by: Zhek Kromtor Originally by: Cambarus I think you should post it, at the very least let us know the name of the GM or the detractors will not believe you. It was GM Lelouch who answered me, and no I won't post the exact response, because posting a GM response in a thread where everyone's running around arguing the rules is...
Empress Shai	Posted - 2010.04.10 13:36:00 - [243] Originally by: Cambarus BAM! Got a response from a senior GM today regarding my petition :D ... (and YES, this DOES include versions that can control several accounts at once) I gotta search for this. Didn't know that functionality existed. Where did you find this? I haven't found it yet. I need a resource, WHERE namely
Xen Mind School of Applied Knowledge	Posted - 2010.04.10 15:14:00 - [244] bump to the top as this seems to need alot of clarification CCP get you **** together and tell us if we are allowed to extend our desktop across computers or not
Vaneshi SnowCrash	Posted - 2010.04.12 13:03:00 - [245] Awesome rig dude. Just so much awesome. If Synergy is allowed... then does the guy get his three days of game time back for an erroneous ban?
ceaon Gallente	Posted - 2010.04.12 15:16:00 - [246] this on kotaku http://kotaku.com/5514947/online-gaming-rig-redefines-the-meaning-of-multiplayer BTW awesome post OP you win the forums today Originally by: CCP Adida The male thread was locked because the discussion turned into transsexuals and man boobs.
Dan O'Connor Cerberus Network Dignitas.	Posted - 2010.04.12 16:11:00 - [247] Originally by: Zhek Kromtor Edited by: Zhek Kromtor on 27/03/2010 21:10:54 After being erroneously 3-day banned for "macro use" while merely mining as a multiboxer (no macros or automation were being used - just Synergy a program that lets you share 1 mouse over multiple computers) I decided to make a site to demonstrate how I have adapted my technique of multiboxing to definitely not break any rules of the EULA. I no longer use Synergy or even mine. I can understand how seeing 12 ospreys mining would cause players and GM's to assume the worst. Now I'm training exploration to hopefully do some complexes. Here's the site explaining how I have more computers than friends: http://sites.google.com/site/khromtor/ If we could get some clarification from CCP about whether using programs like Synergy that merely allow you to use a single mouse among multiple computers in the same way someone uses a single mouse when they have multiple displays that would definitely open the door to a lot more multiboxers... and multiboxers are generally very fun to pewpew. Just ask the guys that blew up my entire rokh mining fleet a week ago as I attempted my 0.0 escape. Edit: Whether or not using a wooden dowel across some keypads is allowed is not up for debate IMO. The use of prosthetics, pirate hooks, wooden dowels or your face for pressing buttons is simply not breaking any rules. The question is whether or not multiboxers should be allowed to use common multiboxing software explicity allowed in almost all other major MMO's. I saw that setup of yours earlier. If you are breaking the EULA or not is open to debate, but when I saw 11 Ravens and 1 Drake, all with "Zhek [something]" in the name appearing on my Overview (that was in Dodixie if I remember correctly), it was pretty clear to me that something is not normal with the way you play. 12 accounts is 12 x $14.95 or EUR 14.95 (or whatever the subscription is for one month from where you are), that alone makes the entire endeavour quite expensive - and for what? 11 Ravens ganking Obelisks going out of trade hubs? To my mind that is quite a clear violation of the EULA... but I think I'll let CCP decide on this one. Yes, your setup is impressive. But then again... why go through all of this trouble? I have one character and I think I have more fun than you playing EVE - also less stress managing all accounts. And ships. And ISK. And CONCORD appearences. And fits. And... well - you get the picture. Bottom line - your epeen setup is just amusing. Also the money you're willing to spend (you might also be using PLEXes for all accounts, I don't know).
Jaime Wulf	Posted - 2010.04.12 16:18:00 - [248] Originally by: Vaal Erit It's a low tech macro, but still a macro. I applaud your creativity and engineering skills but am glad that CCP bans your accounts. We got enough problems with alts and people 2-3 boxing and the like, we don't need this. Also, they only ban macro users for 3 days? Well I can see why we are still flooded with macros to this day. 1: I don't believe they consider the Multi-Boxing as a Macro per say so maybe that's why the 3 day suspension... 2: you don't like that ppl have alts and such and that's ur business but consider this, if everyone who had an alt dropped the seperate accounts in order to fit into ur idea of what this/every game should be then EVE would have probably died on the vine along time ago tbh... Many of us like my Alts who Mine need dedicted haulers and such and frankly I doubt enough ppl in the world would find it fulfilling to do nothing in a game other than haul stuff all the time... 3: I agree in part that maybe that many accts is too much but on the other hand, WE know NOTHING about this person and should not stand in judgement of how they are doing things and why... For all we know this person is independantly wealthy and possibly HandiCapped and really doesnt have many options in that sense... Then again that may not be the case either...
Lee Gordon Gallente Frog Morton Industries Anuran Origin	Posted - 2010.04.12 18:19:00 - [249] Edited by: Lee Gordon on 12/04/2010 18:22:05 Quote: The following 2 EULA articles are considered to apply to this: "You may not use your own or third-party software to modify any content appearing within the Game environment or change how the Game is played." "You may not use macros or other stored rapid keystrokes or other patterns of play that facilitate acquisition of items, currency, objects, character attributes, rank or status at an accelerated rate when compared with ordinary Game play. You may not rewrite or modify the user interface or otherwise manipulate data in any way to acquire items, currency, objects, character attributes or beneficial actions not actually acquired or achieved in the Game." More specifically regarding your questions: 1: We do not allow this I'm afraid. {Original question "Do you allow Hardware multi-boxing?"} 2: We also do not allow this. {Original question "Do you allow Software multi-boxing?"} 3 and 4, are not possible due to multi-boxing not being allowed. {Original questions "practice for distinguishing multi-boxing from botting" and "do you have any fair play clauses".} This was called out already as bad information. My follow-up question pointed out the "Power of 2" program as a counter and I received the following : Quote: You are welcome to use multiple accounts at the same time, no matter how many accounts you are using. What we understood you were asking with regards to multiboxing, was controlling all of those account with a single keystroke program or mouse click copy program. To make it more clear: You may use as many accounts as you wish at the same time, however you may not use a program to control more then 1 account at the same time with the same keystrokes/mouse, you will need to actually switch between the windows to control them. This is from the post below: http://www.dual-boxing.com/showthread.php?t=19768
Zhek Kromtor	Posted - 2010.04.12 19:02:00 - [250] Lee Gordon, that's the GM response that I was referring to when I stated on my site that "...then I come to realize after complaining to other multiboxers on dual-boxing.com that CCP may not even allow software multiboxing..." According to Cambarus several posts back, (Senior?) GM Lelouch has since overruled that seemingly decided-as-he-perused-the-EULA decision. The mere fact that CCP has no interest in commenting in this thread, nor in banning me makes it clear that multiboxing - at least with dowels - is condoned. Responding to confirm that would only cause ragequits from the self-righteous single account protestors who clearly could not be part of a game that allows such impure behavior. http://sites.google.com/site/khromtor/

Lee Gordon Gallente Frog Morton Industries Anuran Origin	Posted - 2010.04.12 20:11:00 - [251] "According to Cambarus several posts back, (Senior?) GM Lelouch has since overruled that seemingly decided-as-he-perused-the-EULA decision." Sorry must have missed that. But away the EULA need an update on these kind of things, with all the new hardware you can get and so on.
Dan O'Connor Cerberus Network Dignitas.	Posted - 2010.04.12 20:38:00 - [252] Originally by: Zhek Kromtor The mere fact that CCP has no interest in commenting in this thread, nor in banning me makes it clear that multiboxing - at least with dowels - is condoned. A few possible things that are likely to be on-going in this situation: 1) Maybe they haven't said anything yet, and I highly doubt your way of playing EVE is "condoned". My guess you are yellow-flashy on their Overview. 2) They might have contacted you already on one or many email aliases you have provided to them, or possibly via the billing address you specified when you paid for the first time (if credit card was used). You however decided to ignore this and keep on playing - even opening a thread about the setup you currently claim to be EULA-approved. 3) I do believe CCP has been discussing this thread - but decided to see how this plays out amongst players before stepping in.
OVERBROW Minmatar	Posted - 2010.04.12 20:41:00 - [253] Originally by: Zhek Kromtor ...After being erroneously 3-day banned for "macro use" while merely mining as a multiboxer (no macros or automation were being used... Here's the site explaining how I have more computers than friends: http://sites.google.com/site/khromtor/ ...Edit: Whether or not using a wooden dowel across some keypads is allowed is not up for debate IMO. The use of prosthetics, pirate hooks, wooden dowels or your face for pressing buttons is simply not breaking any rules.... This guy is a ****ing hero. ----- mmopvp.blogspot.com -----
Pyrostasis Caldari Gang of Pain	Posted - 2010.04.12 22:53:00 - [254] Originally by: Zhek Kromtor Lee Gordon, that's the GM response that I was referring to when I stated on my site that "...then I come to realize after complaining to other multiboxers on dual-boxing.com that CCP may not even allow software multiboxing..." According to Cambarus several posts back, (Senior?) GM Lelouch has since overruled that seemingly decided-as-he-perused-the-EULA decision. The mere fact that CCP has no interest in commenting in this thread, nor in banning me makes it clear that multiboxing - at least with dowels - is condoned. Responding to confirm that would only cause ragequits from the self-righteous single account protestors who clearly could not be part of a game that allows such impure behavior. So Im confused...which is it? I have boxed other games previously, and really enjoyed it. I previously used innerspace and keyclone. However, when I moved to Eve after some research it seemed that CCP didnt allow any form of keyboard multicasters. Now from what I understand... Synergy (least the least time I used it) just let you use one mouse and keyboard to "switch" from comp to comp, but didnt allow multicasting. I would assume Synergy is legal. So... Zhek can you confirm what is and isnt allowed per the GM response that you got...
Magesto Caldari Radiant shield Radiant Force	Posted - 2010.04.12 23:34:00 - [255] i use 2 computers(desktop and a laptop on the desk right next to the monitor for the desktop) and 2 accts, and everything works wonderfully, 14 is just damned ridiculous *CHECK PLEASE!*
Cambarus The Compass Reloaded	Posted - 2010.04.13 04:17:00 - [256] Originally by: Pyrostasis Originally by: Zhek Kromtor Lee Gordon, that's the GM response that I was referring to when I stated on my site that "...then I come to realize after complaining to other multiboxers on dual-boxing.com that CCP may not even allow software multiboxing..." According to Cambarus several posts back, (Senior?) GM Lelouch has since overruled that seemingly decided-as-he-perused-the-EULA decision. The mere fact that CCP has no interest in commenting in this thread, nor in banning me makes it clear that multiboxing - at least with dowels - is condoned. Responding to confirm that would only cause ragequits from the self-righteous single account protestors who clearly could not be part of a game that allows such impure behavior. So Im confused...which is it? I have boxed other games previously, and really enjoyed it. I previously used innerspace and keyclone. However, when I moved to Eve after some research it seemed that CCP didnt allow any form of keyboard multicasters. Now from what I understand... Synergy (least the least time I used it) just let you use one mouse and keyboard to "switch" from comp to comp, but didnt allow multicasting. I would assume Synergy is legal. So... Zhek can you confirm what is and isnt allowed per the GM response that you got... TBH your best bet is to make a petition yourself, and make sure you get an answer from a senior GM. If he says go for it (which he should, I'm like 95% sure I've read threads on the forums about stuff like this before with GMs saying it was allowed) then you're in the clear. Just don't delete the petition and if any other GMs bother you about it you can laugh in their faces :P I gotta say though, I do find it amusing that people are STILL arguing about the EULA. CCP has the right to terminate your account for any (or no) reason. When dealing with ANY grey area of the EULA it's usually best to get a clear senior GM response rather than speculating on the forums. I now know that I'm allowed to multibox using software, and that's good enough for me.
Cooolllll	Posted - 2010.04.13 05:34:00 - [257] I had a question on your setup. How do you deal with heating issues? Do you somehow funnel that exhaust to heat your house?
Kewso	Posted - 2010.04.13 07:40:00 - [258] All I know is I use a nostromo, a logitech g15, and synergy for couple years. Cool thing is each of my pc's has it's own real world ip since I don't use NAT. I get 8 ip subnet from my ISP for a business account.
Empress Shai	Posted - 2010.04.13 12:24:00 - [259] I have a quad core with only 4 GB of Ram, and use my multiple clients windowed, and in the lowest possible "optimized" setting (performance, shadows off, etc). I can listen to a podcast or EVE-Radio without having to lag hardly at all (ISP is another story). It is cheaper than the OPs origonal posting. Though I am trying to figure a launcher that allows for the client to be maximized to 2 screens with 2 clients up, on the same PC. The GMs can track your clicks or something to see it isn't a bot, right? I thought I saw someone ^^ state that it was. I ask for clarification from your guys opinions is all.
Dan O'Connor Cerberus Network Dignitas.	Posted - 2010.04.13 12:27:00 - [260] Originally by: Empress Shai I have a quad core with only 4 GB of Ram, and use my multiple clients windowed, and in the lowest possible "optimized" setting (performance, shadows off, etc). I can listen to a podcast or EVE-Radio without having to lag hardly at all (ISP is another story). It is cheaper than the OPs origonal posting. Though I am trying to figure a launcher that allows for the client to be maximized to 2 screens with 2 clients up, on the same PC. The GMs can track your clicks or something to see it isn't a bot, right? I thought I saw someone ^^ state that it was. I ask for clarification from your guys opinions is all. Look for EVE Windowed Helper - it takes away the window decoration when playing in windowed mode. That way you can maximize a client, then say "Set Clients" with the tool, and it will remove the window border. You can then alt-tab between them. ----

Shira'v'Dhraal	Posted - 2010.04.13 13:01:00 - [261] That's a lot of efforts and money to avoid socialization. Joke aside, if you like playing this way, more power to you. Not my cup of tea but this kind of synchronized mini-fleet must be interesting to watch.
Zavulon Sukkot Suddenly Ninjas Tear Extraction And Reclamation Service	Posted - 2010.04.13 17:07:00 - [262] I approve of the tears in this thread. Eve really has no 'normal' game play. Sure, theres the hisec tour guide of missions, lowsec pirates, 0.0 metagamers, market manipulators, scammers, and then there are those who figure out something different. Those who are looking for a mediated experience where everyone plays the same game probably need to take a look at Sanrio Town. Worry about creative players like Zhek after you worry about seeing the same groups of 'characters' mining 23/6 in hisec belts and 24/7 auto-warping alleged resource collectors in the ass-back end of nullsec. NATI.
Semkhet Dark Tornado Ethereal Dawn	Posted - 2010.04.13 18:49:00 - [263] LOL... The amount of moronic replies in this thread is appalling. Leave this guy in peace. The fact that he throws enough resources for this kind of setup should ring a bell... CCP knows about this, it's their game, so if he's still playing nowadays, here goes your so much anticipated CCP stance. Besides, is there any genius able to explain why would CCP allow any single player to maintain a dozen accounts only to later on denying the means to play with'em ? Wake up and smell the coffee: it's a business, plain and simple.
Empress Shai	Posted - 2010.04.13 18:56:00 - [264] Originally by: Semkhet Wake up and smell the coffee: it's a business, plain and simple. Agreed, I am not knocking anything, just saying they likely don't care due to it makes them money, in one form or another.
akkim86	Posted - 2010.04.19 15:43:00 - [265] How'd you get the monitors set up like that (resolution/split screen)?
cBOLTSON Caldari Shadow Legion. Talos Coalition	Posted - 2010.04.19 18:09:00 - [266] now that is some funny ass ****!! Credit to the guy for making that whole setup himself. How is he cheating?? lmao! He is severly limiting himself in how technical he can be. I guarentee theres no way he can fly an interceptor with any effeciency like that. Give the guy a break, yea it is OTT and then some, but its good human inginuity (spelling?) So whats the limit? Having a 2nd account is also cheating then? How about if you were to control a mouse and keyboard with your feet as well as your primary mouse and keyboard with your hands? Would you be punished for being crazy dexterous with your feet? How about if he had all computers lined up and ran through the room doing the actions one by one... There is no SPECIFIC rule, and I cant see why people are getting angry.
Dan O'Connor Cerberus Network Dignitas.	Posted - 2010.04.19 19:08:00 - [267] Originally by: cBOLTSON How is he cheating?? lmao! He is severly limiting himself in how technical he can be. I guarentee theres no way he can fly an interceptor with any effeciency like that. Maybe not an interceptor, but he did use 12 Ravens plus 1 Drake in Dodi, most likely to gank people. ---- Store \| Apply
Elldranga	Posted - 2010.04.19 21:03:00 - [268] Originally by: Empress Shai I have a quad core with only 4 GB of Ram, and use my multiple clients windowed, and in the lowest possible "optimized" setting (performance, shadows off, etc). I can listen to a podcast or EVE-Radio without having to lag hardly at all (ISP is another story). It is cheaper than the OPs origonal posting. Though I am trying to figure a launcher that allows for the client to be maximized to 2 screens with 2 clients up, on the same PC. The GMs can track your clicks or something to see it isn't a bot, right? I thought I saw someone ^^ state that it was. I ask for clarification from your guys opinions is all. I wouldn't be suprised if CCP can track you by your clicks. I know I was mining at max efficiency for a period of time.... which of course means the same time periods between orders to warp/mine/etc when suddenly out of the blue, I'm somewhere else, with no rocks available to mine, near a planet. No warp, no nothing. Just BAM I'm there. I've always suspected it was a silent test, to see if my system continued to attempt to mine, or do the logical thing if there's someone actually at the computer... warp back to the belt.
Eto Tekai	Posted - 2010.04.19 21:55:00 - [269] I too, would love to know how you do your split screen.
Gawdisa	Posted - 2010.04.20 02:06:00 - [270] Edited by: Gawdisa on 20/04/2010 02:08:05 Split screen just looks like the windows are over lapped with the right window hanging off the viewable area. You aren't able to see the actual area of the screen where the ships reside, covered by the station box. I'm assuming the right hand windows are tagged to always remain on top. I gotta say it's an awesome setup. Just imagine the fap sessions. All those different screens. Mmmm. /edit cause i couldn't say **** =)

Yusuf Amir	Posted - 2010.04.20 19:01:00 - [271] Originally by: Gawdisa Edited by: Gawdisa on 20/04/2010 02:08:05 Split screen just looks like the windows are over lapped with the right window hanging off the viewable area. You aren't able to see the actual area of the screen where the ships reside, covered by the station box. I'm assuming the right hand windows are tagged to always remain on top. I gotta say it's an awesome setup. Just imagine the fap sessions. All those different screens. Mmmm. /edit cause i couldn't say **** =) Not really.
Syn Callibri Minmatar Swag Co. Sandbox Bullies	Posted - 2010.04.20 19:08:00 - [272] That rig is just freakin INSANE! "I have just as much authority as the empress, just not as many people that believe it."
Rayborn	Posted - 2010.04.21 03:37:00 - [273] WOW, impressive set up. but wondering if you really can get any fun out of this. I seriously doubt anyone will want to do this unless they are pro-isk farmer and selling the isk they make. but i might be wrong=P
Lady Aja Caldari IT Alliance	Posted - 2010.04.21 05:03:00 - [274] Originally by: Rayborn WOW, impressive set up. but wondering if you really can get any fun out of this. I seriously doubt anyone will want to do this unless they are pro-isk farmer and selling the isk they make. but i might be wrong=P So many of you guys think this is such a great setup. I for one do not believe it could EVER work. Cellotape to hold 6 mouses together? no apparent usage? no video showing proof this works? its a 100% bull**** excuse to get around " i aint marcoing mr gm.. "
Vaerah Vahrokha Minmatar Vahrokh Consulting	Posted - 2010.04.21 06:26:00 - [275] Quote: . I no longer use Synergy or even mine. I can understand how seeing 12 ospreys mining would cause players and GM's to assume the worst. Now I'm training exploration to hopefully do some complexes. You should be beaten with a spiky stick for wasting money and resources to mine with 12 ospreys instead of proper ships. - Auditing & consulting When looking for investors, please read http://tinyurl.com/n5ys4h + http://tinyurl.com/lrg4oz

GM Lelouch Game Masters	Posted - 2010.04.23 15:51:00 - [276] Edited by: GM Lelouch on 23/04/2010 15:52:45 Hello there, To make a long story short, automation of gameplay is not permitted; players must be manually issuing the commands to control their character(s) at all times. Our stance on programs such as Synergy and hardware/software combination such as the G15 keyboard is that they can be legitimately used as long as gameplay isn't automated. Synergy allows you to move your mouse cursor to multiple different monitors which are hooked up to different computers and we do not have any qualms with players using the program for this purpose. If Synergy was used in some way to control your accounts for you without a need for you to be at your keyboard, then that would not be allowed, but I am not aware of such a functionality with this program. If Synergy is used in conjunction with some other program to automate gameplay, it would not be permitted. G15 "macros" which allow you to group different commands into one keypress are allowed. For example, setting your G1 key to press F1, F2, F3 and so on for you with one key press is allowed (although this specific command is not as useful as it was before now that we have weapon grouping). An exceedingly complex G15 macro which would effectively automate gameplay, such as mining, without a need for the player to be present at his keyboard would be against the EULA, regardless of whether the player utilizing said macro is sitting at his keyboard at the time! Lastly, multiboxing is allowed, and programs designed for multiboxing in mind which allow a player to manually issue the same command to multiple game clients at the same time are allowed. In the same vein as what has been stated above, the player must be manually sending the commands; if a program is automating those commands for you, then it would be considered a breach of our EULA. I hope this clears up this matter. Best regards, Senior GM Lelouch EVE Online Customer Support

S'qarpium D'igil	Posted - 2010.04.23 18:30:00 - [277] Thank you for a very concise clarification. :)
Mashie Saldana Red Federation	Posted - 2010.04.23 19:42:00 - [278] Originally by: Lady Aja its a 100% bull**** excuse to get around " i aint marcoing mr gm.. " Indeed, OP was in Tourier local yesterday, I was impressed how he managed to jump all 14 ships out of system within one second using that mouse setup.
Cambarus The Compass Reloaded	Posted - 2010.04.23 20:21:00 - [279] Originally by: Mashie Saldana Originally by: Lady Aja its a 100% bull**** excuse to get around " i aint marcoing mr gm.. " Indeed, OP was in Tourier local yesterday, I was impressed how he managed to jump all 14 ships out of system within one second using that mouse setup. It's funny how 2 posts after we get an official response in the thread stating that g15s and synergy are allowed, people are already complaining that the OPs setup couldn't possibly work, given that we now know it's a moot point because he's allowed to use synergy anyway. Also even without any sort of setup like the OPs it's easy to get ships to jump together. Warp to gate and turn the autopilot on for all characters. Every jumps at the same time, but then I'd not expect anyone still arguing over whether or not the OPs setup is legit after a senior GM (thanks Lelouch :D ) has already declared the point moot to be able to figure out how to make several ships do something in unison.
EdwardNardella Capital Construction Research	Posted - 2010.04.23 22:32:00 - [280] Quite a timely post Mr. GM I got a petition response at the same time. Now I have to start looking for software to do this. I run six clients on one PC with two displays. I tried PwnBoxer but instead of handling the clients it handles their splash screen. KeyClone was too complex for my abilities gonna try again tho. MouseClone works but it has some bugs that make it almost useless. Anyone know of others? CCRES is recruiting pilots who want to live in WSpace/Wormholes. Fill out an application here!

Panic Merchant	Posted - 2010.05.09 02:59:00 - [281] Hmmm, at work I have access to an old, unused 64 node cluster. We made some specialized electronics that can duplicate the signal from a mouse and a keyboard, so we can send the same commands to 64 nodes at once. The same setup also shrinks down the displays so they can easily fit into a smaller number of displays. Maybe I should setup 64 accounts and zap the life out of EVE... Is this allowed CCP? Hehe, with that number I could probably make a frigate gang and roam around ganking other gangs on my own :)
Emperor Cheney Celebrity Sex Tape	Posted - 2010.05.09 23:57:00 - [282] wait, wait So this means that if one of your ships gets pointed, you all end up being locked down, right? hmmmmmmmmm
Rpeg Minmatar Rosa Castellum	Posted - 2010.05.10 03:28:00 - [283] Maybe it's just me, but I would've spent that money on a prostitute. -- autechre - ep7 - track 1: rpeg estevancarlos.com
EdwardNardella Capital Construction Research	Posted - 2010.05.10 05:12:00 - [284] Originally by: Panic Merchant Hmmm, at work I have access to an old, unused 64 node cluster. We made some specialized electronics that can duplicate the signal from a mouse and a keyboard, so we can send the same commands to 64 nodes at once. The same setup also shrinks down the displays so they can easily fit into a smaller number of displays. Maybe I should setup 64 accounts and zap the life out of EVE... Is this allowed CCP? Hehe, with that number I could probably make a frigate gang and roam around ganking other gangs on my own :) I am pretty sure it is. You could easily get fresh 64 trial accounts to a total of 2k dps would be awesome. CCRES is recruiting pilots who want to live in WSpace/Wormholes. Fill out an application here!
Ulviirala Vauryndar Gallente Vauryndar Dalharil	Posted - 2010.05.10 08:53:00 - [285] That guy has got the money to pay for 64 accounts, and the hardware to run it on. EVE is so unfair. Or was it life? Or was my life EVE? Seriously, go and quit. Also, you can't run multiple trials from the same ip address. Unfortunately, your signature is not 22239 bytes, it exceeds the 24000 byte limit allowed on the forums. -Darth Patches I fail, regards to Cortes - Ulvi
Grantara	Posted - 2010.05.10 10:54:00 - [286] This is incredibly sick. Go see a therapist.
iP0D	Posted - 2010.05.10 11:05:00 - [287] Originally by: GM Lelouch Lastly, multiboxing is allowed, and programs designed for multiboxing in mind which allow a player to manually issue the same command to multiple game clients at the same time are allowed. In the same vein as what has been stated above, the player must be manually sending the commands; if a program is automating those commands for you, then it would be considered a breach of our EULA. That is still a bit confusing. Sending commands via software to multiple clients is allowed, but this must be done manually and not in an automated manner. The clinch with multiboxing is the simultaneous manual control over multiple clients. That is where guys like the OP get their advantages from, yes it is a manual interaction but one only focused on a single client, the software then broadcasts that simultaneously to other clients so all operate in an accelerated format in a synchronised manner. What you're saying now, is that the concept of broadcasting in multiboxing software, to simultaneously control multiple eve clients through broadcasting your manual actions on one client to the other clients in realtime, is allowed. Regardless of whether achieved through software like Synergy with broadcasting enabled, or mousecloning software. That's a recipee for disaster imo. You're giving carte blanche to multi account owners to accelerate their effective gameplay through such software.
Cambarus The Compass Reloaded	Posted - 2010.05.10 13:24:00 - [288] Originally by: iP0D Originally by: GM Lelouch That is still a bit confusing. Sending commands via software to multiple clients is allowed, but this must be done manually and not in an automated manner. The clinch with multiboxing is the simultaneous manual control over multiple clients. That is where guys like the OP get their advantages from, yes it is a manual interaction but one only focused on a single client, the software then broadcasts that simultaneously to other clients so all operate in an accelerated format in a synchronised manner. What you're saying now, is that the concept of broadcasting in multiboxing software, to simultaneously control multiple eve clients through broadcasting your manual actions on one client to the other clients in realtime, is allowed. Regardless of whether achieved through software like Synergy with broadcasting enabled, or mousecloning software. That's a recipee for disaster imo. You're giving carte blanche to multi account owners to accelerate their effective gameplay through such software. Multi-account owners alreadyhavea huge advantage over those that only have one, because even if you spend billions fitting out a ship, more often than not 2 t2 fits of the same ship will outperform it, and the problem scales up with numbers. But eve is not fair, nor has it ever been. Those who have t2 BPOs have a huge advantage over those who don't, and those who've been playing long enough to get limited edition ships and modules also have one. Such is eve, get over it. Also, how many people do you think there are out there who do what the OP here does? It's hilarious, but not exactly something I'd be worried about becoming a common practice, because with 14 accounts, you spend what, 3-4bil a month worth of plexs to keep them active? If I were able to spend the cash needed to fund 14 accounts on eve every month, I'd already be playing in an accelerated manner, just because of the sheer amount of isk I could make by selling GTCs.
Tiberizzle	Posted - 2010.05.16 18:39:00 - [289] Originally by: GM Lelouch Edited by: GM Lelouch on 23/04/2010 15:52:45 Hello there, To make a long story short, automation of gameplay is not permitted; players must be manually issuing the commands to control their character(s) at all times. Our stance on programs such as Synergy and hardware/software combination such as the G15 keyboard is that they can be legitimately used as long as gameplay isn't automated. Synergy allows you to move your mouse cursor to multiple different monitors which are hooked up to different computers and we do not have any qualms with players using the program for this purpose. If Synergy was used in some way to control your accounts for you without a need for you to be at your keyboard, then that would not be allowed, but I am not aware of such a functionality with this program. If Synergy is used in conjunction with some other program to automate gameplay, it would not be permitted. G15 "macros" which allow you to group different commands into one keypress are allowed. For example, setting your G1 key to press F1, F2, F3 and so on for you with one key press is allowed (although this specific command is not as useful as it was before now that we have weapon grouping). An exceedingly complex G15 macro which would effectively automate gameplay, such as mining, without a need for the player to be present at his keyboard would be against the EULA, regardless of whether the player utilizing said macro is sitting at his keyboard at the time! Lastly, multiboxing is allowed, and programs designed for multiboxing in mind which allow a player to manually issue the same command to multiple game clients at the same time are allowed. In the same vein as what has been stated above, the player must be manually sending the commands; if a program is automating those commands for you, then it would be considered a breach of our EULA. I hope this clears up this matter. Best regards, Senior GM Lelouch EVE Online Customer Support hate to bump this but wow sudden outbreak of common sense I was hopping mad when I heard this guy got banned for using Synergy and started to wonder if there was a full brain between the entire GM staff, now I suspect there might be.
Jovian Dax Caldari Old Dominion Engineering Consortium.	Posted - 2010.05.16 18:57:00 - [290] hey help a small guy out that only has one laptop and one char. some isk a char hell even another computer this game is big enough come help the little guy <a href="https://eve-search.com/externalLink.asp?l=http%3A%2F%2Fs938%2Ephotobucket%2Ecom%2Falbums%2Fad228%2Fthomasmlinek%2F%3Faction%3Dview%26current%3Dsig1copy1%2Egif" target="_blank"><img src="http://i938.photobucket.com/albums/ad228/thomasmlinek/sig1copy1.gif" border

Slavemaster	Posted - 2010.05.16 19:09:00 - [291] Man, forget the "get a life" comments... This is pure awesome, and yeah I wanna have a setup like that... .... Now just get 14 girls at the same time, then you might win Life... Happy hunting trooper Regards SM, born 03.
Space Pinata Amarr Discount Napkin Industries	Posted - 2010.05.16 21:52:00 - [292] Multiboxing: God awful from a gameplay standpoint, allowed solely because it brings in extra revenue.
T'Amber www.shipsofeve.com	Posted - 2010.05.16 22:12:00 - [293] All I can say is this: http://dl.eve-files.com/media/1005/batodualboxes.jpg -T'amber POLITICS:SIMULATORÖ
Elldranga	Posted - 2010.05.17 04:26:00 - [294] Originally by: GM Lelouch Edited by: GM Lelouch on 23/04/2010 15:52:45 Hello there, To make a long story short, automation of gameplay is not permitted; players must be manually issuing the commands to control their character(s) at all times. Our stance on programs such as Synergy and hardware/software combination such as the G15 keyboard is that they can be legitimately used as long as gameplay isn't automated. Synergy allows you to move your mouse cursor to multiple different monitors which are hooked up to different computers and we do not have any qualms with players using the program for this purpose. If Synergy was used in some way to control your accounts for you without a need for you to be at your keyboard, then that would not be allowed, but I am not aware of such a functionality with this program. If Synergy is used in conjunction with some other program to automate gameplay, it would not be permitted. G15 "macros" which allow you to group different commands into one keypress are allowed. For example, setting your G1 key to press F1, F2, F3 and so on for you with one key press is allowed (although this specific command is not as useful as it was before now that we have weapon grouping). An exceedingly complex G15 macro which would effectively automate gameplay, such as mining, without a need for the player to be present at his keyboard would be against the EULA, regardless of whether the player utilizing said macro is sitting at his keyboard at the time! Lastly, multiboxing is allowed, and programs designed for multiboxing in mind which allow a player to manually issue the same command to multiple game clients at the same time are allowed. In the same vein as what has been stated above, the player must be manually sending the commands; if a program is automating those commands for you, then it would be considered a breach of our EULA. I hope this clears up this matter. Best regards, Senior GM Lelouch EVE Online Customer Support I just gotta say thanks... it's not often we get a clear concise statement like this that actually addresses all the details we're concerned about. It's much appreciated GM Lelouch.
GauteGodager	Posted - 2010.05.17 16:43:00 - [295] Originally by: Ulviirala Vauryndar That guy has got the money to pay for 64 accounts, and the hardware to run it on. EVE is so unfair. Or was it life? Or was my life EVE? Seriously, go and quit. Also, you can't run multiple trials from the same ip address. Trials limitation is checked on client to see if you already have Eve running, not on Eve servers by comparing IPs (CCP isn't stupid, it would suck hardcore if you couldn't start playing at the same time than your wife/GF, roomate, brother, ...)
Slapchop Gonnalovemynuts	Posted - 2010.05.17 17:03:00 - [296] Originally by: Ulviirala Vauryndar Also, you can't run multiple trials from the same ip address. Yes you can, the limit is one per machine, not IP address. If you have 64 computers, or 64 virtual machines even, you can run 64 trial accounts. The way it works is when the eve client goes to log in it checks to see if the account logging in is a trial or if any clients are already logged in with a trial, and cancels out there, it is not related to IP at all. -------------------------------------------- Quote: EVE-Online... Too rough for ya? Don't like it? GTFO...
Zhek Kromtor	Posted - 2010.05.18 14:15:00 - [297] Thank you GM Lelouch for clarifying the rules it is much appreciated. Also thanks to GM Krymus who did eventually respond to my petition, apologized and expunged the 3-day ban from my record. I'm very impressed by the CCP employees in the way they rectified this. As for the "slipperly slope" arguments, seriously, good luck trying to play 6 at once let alone 64. Nothing works exactly how you want it and you are constantly having to switch to single systems in order to correct things. I take no offense to the "get a life" comments. My grandmother and I just finished a project that utilizes the laundry chute as a means for deliverying hotpockets fresh out of the microwave to me in the basement. I ring a bell and a few minutes later she drops a hot one down the chute. Believe me, I've got the life. http://sites.google.com/site/khromtor/
Zak'eni Private Nuisance	Posted - 2010.05.25 11:38:00 - [298] Zhek you rock, I hope you get back to goonwaffe and have some fun.
Wacktopia Dark Side Of The Womb Nostradamus Effect	Posted - 2010.05.25 11:59:00 - [299] I saw you on gate the other day with your ravenswarm. Quite a sight :)
khazak mokl	Posted - 2010.05.25 14:11:00 - [300] Wow Many thanks for the pics as I can now show them to my girlfriend and prove that I do not have a EVE addiction. Or if I do its so not as bad as urs lol. +100 points for genius getting it all to work and for building ur own monitor frames ect. I bet its a site to see in action. How much isk do your mining fleet make an hour just for lols?

Ekrid	Posted - 2010.06.09 04:09:00 - [301] Edited by: Ekrid on 09/06/2010 04:10:18 proof that CCP is ****ed. This is a COMPLETELY MECHANICAL SETUP TO MACRO. So they're using a mechanical means to get the same advantage as a piece of computer software, but without raising the red flag and so on. Also, its all just for show. Does CCP really indorse this horse** based on a mere picture? Shouldnt a CCP built it themself and find out if it works. Seriously. If it does work, its just a non-computerized way to input mass amounts of commands from a single mouse button.
Muddy Miner Gallente Tiny Fleet	Posted - 2010.06.09 06:41:00 - [302] Originally by: Zhek Kromtor Here's the site explaining how I have more computers than friends: http://sites.google.com/site/khromtor/ OCD Much??
SymFOR0	Posted - 2010.06.09 07:16:00 - [303] Originally by: Grantara This is incredibly sick. Go see a therapist. +1
Herateis	Posted - 2010.06.09 09:27:00 - [304] Edited by: Herateis on 09/06/2010 09:28:48 Originally by: SymFOR0 Originally by: Grantara This is incredibly sick. Go see a therapist. +1 +2 for the actual therapist line. There's this saying of everything in moderation. if this were beer, you'd be dead with a 90% BAC.
Reptail Caldari Cool Rampage Amongst Zeus 1	Posted - 2010.06.09 09:31:00 - [305] Originally by: GM Lelouch Edited by: GM Lelouch on 23/04/2010 15:52:45 Hello there, To make a long story short, automation of gameplay is not permitted; players must be manually issuing the commands to control their character(s) at all times. Our stance on programs such as Synergy and hardware/software combination such as the G15 keyboard is that they can be legitimately used as long as gameplay isn't automated. Synergy allows you to move your mouse cursor to multiple different monitors which are hooked up to different computers and we do not have any qualms with players using the program for this purpose. If Synergy was used in some way to control your accounts for you without a need for you to be at your keyboard, then that would not be allowed, but I am not aware of such a functionality with this program. If Synergy is used in conjunction with some other program to automate gameplay, it would not be permitted. G15 "macros" which allow you to group different commands into one keypress are allowed. For example, setting your G1 key to press F1, F2, F3 and so on for you with one key press is allowed (although this specific command is not as useful as it was before now that we have weapon grouping). An exceedingly complex G15 macro which would effectively automate gameplay, such as mining, without a need for the player to be present at his keyboard would be against the EULA, regardless of whether the player utilizing said macro is sitting at his keyboard at the time! Lastly, multiboxing is allowed, and programs designed for multiboxing in mind which allow a player to manually issue the same command to multiple game clients at the same time are allowed. In the same vein as what has been stated above, the player must be manually sending the commands; if a program is automating those commands for you, then it would be considered a breach of our EULA. I hope this clears up this matter. Best regards, Senior GM Lelouch EVE Online Customer Support of course that's what all macroers are doing :) and ccp support them so don't be much shocked
Gibbo3771	Posted - 2010.06.09 11:12:00 - [306] spot the virgin
Xenuria Gallente Marcabian 5th Invasion Fleet	Posted - 2010.06.17 23:11:00 - [307] I was in PF-346 and I was stuck in a warp sphere and under heavy fire by some red and then out of nowhere a huge fleet of ravens warps in and istantly launches a hellish barrage of rockets at my attacker. Blowing him into tiny space chunks. Then before his friends can warp away and hide they get blasted to bits too. MIND = BLOWN "My name is legion, for we are many"
Scout Ops Red Federation	Posted - 2010.06.18 03:01:00 - [308] Dude WTF??? Seriously GET A LIFE... its a great idea to multibox 2 clients for missions, mining, trade or PVP. 3 clients for mining, OK. It is 'yellow light alarm' to have 6-7 accounts that you run alteratively for manufacture or trade issues (not running all at once). But how the hell do you expect to have fun with 14 accounts simultaneously. WTF. And you pretend to do mining with these? On highsec I guess... dude, rocks will pop before you can do crap. You are gonna get crazy. It's not even isk-efficiently you may do the same with 10 accounts maybe. And for your mental sanity, drop the idea and abandon your least-beloved characters. You might even transfer them for profit...
Flex Carter Caldari Independant Mining Association	Posted - 2010.06.18 06:49:00 - [309] Originally by: Zhek Kromtor I take no offense to the "get a life" comments. My grandmother and I just finished a project that utilizes the laundry chute as a means for deliverying hotpockets fresh out of the microwave to me in the basement. I ring a bell and a few minutes later she drops a hot one down the chute. Believe me, I've got the life. LMAO.... Simply awesome m8. Don't worry about the whiners, keep doing what your doing...
Kendar Gallente 4S Corporation Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2010.06.18 07:59:00 - [310] Edited by: Kendar on 18/06/2010 07:59:02 11 pages of people telling him how he should live his life

1Ekrid1	Posted - 2010.06.18 08:00:00 - [311] CCP ban this mental midget mechanical macroer for his own psychological well-being. There's 1, repeat 1, frigate in the T1 lineup designed to be a suicide tackler. the rest are for COMBAT. so don't tell me to tackle when I'm in a combat T1 frig. OR tell CCP to fix their mess.
Ap0ll0n Gallente Cutting Edge Incorporated RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2010.06.20 09:52:00 - [312] Actually, the fact that he uses that many accounts to accumulate wealth, tells us more that he has a life, and just want to cut down on the time it takes to make isk.. Nuff said..
TheLordofAllandNothing Caldari NailorTech Industries RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2010.06.20 09:55:00 - [313] Meh the last few pages have just been people whining, and people who play and internet spaceship game telling other internet spaceship gamers to go see a therapist is the height of irony. tl;dr stfu, its his sandbox, now go play in yours. _______________________ Fix rockets in '09 =(
price checkinho	Posted - 2010.06.22 18:42:00 - [314] the internet is reporting OP's mother died because he was using that rig and didnt assist her when she fell. Confirm/deny? http://www.sankakucomplex.com/2010/06/19/mmo-gaming-kills-again/#comment-539664 I dont believe it, looks like a total scam. Article reports it as one pc which is wrong.
1Ekrid1	Posted - 2010.06.22 22:04:00 - [315] the whole thing is ascam. he got popped for being a macroer cause of his 14 accounts, and made up this entire picture to "prove" to CCP that he was no macroer. the only thing that proves really is that he has those 14 comps at his house, not that the thing actually works. and if it does in fact work, its a external mechanical method of doing the same thing a program for botting would do. There's 1, repeat 1, frigate in the T1 lineup designed to be a suicide tackler. the rest are for COMBAT. so don't tell me to tackle when I'm in a combat T1 frig. OR tell CCP to fix their mess.
Hon Dao	Posted - 2010.06.22 22:55:00 - [316] Edited by: Hon Dao on 22/06/2010 23:01:51 Edited by: Hon Dao on 22/06/2010 23:00:16 Originally by: 1Ekrid1 if it does in fact work, its a external mechanical method of doing the same thing a program for botting would do. How exactly does a GM permitted program that requires a person to be at their computer, in order to issue commands to 'n' copies of EVE at the same time, operate in the same way as a botting program intended to allow one copy of eve to be controlled automatically? Once again, I will say that you do not have the slightest f***ing clue what is involved in multiboxing, or botting for that matter. It is clueless people who report multiboxers, for something no botter would ever do, precisely because it makes you liable to be reported by clueless people, who can't tell the difference between boxing and botting (sadly, many GMs of many games included. Thankfully the GMs of EVE have been educated as to the difference, and the OP's actions deemed acceptable, regardless of whether he was multiboxing with hardware or software). Nice original name by the way. -------------------------------------------------- I could care less about Americans' use of English. Caring = Could care less Not caring = Couldn't care less
1Ekrid1	Posted - 2010.06.26 04:49:00 - [317] I rather think I do know what botting is since I've seen it in WoW, and I did it in ultima online before I found out it was wrong, it was just that forging is sooo tedious in that game, or at least it used to be back in 2001. regardless, if I see a multiboxer or botter around, Im reporting both of them as botters, and nothing gonna stop me. get rid of the multiboxers and the reporting stops. I sure cant tell the difference between them can I? you seem to think so, so I guess I'll just report forever until CCP gets tired of the surfeit of useless reports and gets rid of Mboxing forever. There's 1, repeat 1, frigate in the T1 lineup designed to be a suicide tackler. the rest are for COMBAT. so don't tell me to tackle when I'm in a combat T1 frig. OR tell CCP to fix their mess.
Dusty Meg Shock-Wave Industrys Astro Lux Aedificatiae	Posted - 2010.06.26 06:51:00 - [318] Which they wont do as its a big money income. And the fact is you can multibox without using a bot.
Myth Al'kar Blueprint Haus Empire Vacation Home	Posted - 2010.06.26 07:53:00 - [319] He needs to make 14 alts and do some serious hulkageddon.
Cura 666	Posted - 2010.06.26 09:59:00 - [320] I would give every multiboxer his own solar system with no stargates so they could multibox themselves to death. They could even make their own wars, pirate fleets and such and pretend they are so smart and great... If i had enough money i would employ like a million Chinese, buy them accounts and ruin this ****ing game just becouse i dont want to be dependent on other players. Puhlease...

TK634 Gallente	Posted - 2010.06.26 11:27:00 - [321] Makes me wonder why he doesn't invest in a single second-hand multi-chip Opteron box and virtualize clients using Red hat or Ubuntu Server. Each VM would be perfectly capable of running WINE and it'd cut down massively on his energy bills, not to mention floor-space. -- The Eternal Courier
Sazkyen	Posted - 2010.06.26 12:05:00 - [322] Edited by: Sazkyen on 26/06/2010 12:06:02 "You may not use macros or other stored rapid keystrokes or other patterns of play that facilitate acquisition of items, currency, objects, character attributes, rank or status at an accelerated rate when compared with ordinary Game play" This cannot be achieved. I have a very fast comp (which also has SSD) and I've noticed that it actually gives an advantage when I jump gates since I load a lot faster than most people and I can escape easily when chased through gates. So, should I downgrade? It gives me a definite advantage. Some OSs also allow for a bit faster gameplay. Etc. -SIG- Ship comparison
Awesome Possum	Posted - 2010.07.19 17:26:00 - [323] Originally by: 1Ekrid1 I rather think I do know what botting is since I've seen it in WoW, and I did it in ultima online before I found out it was wrong, it was just that forging is sooo tedious in that game, or at least it used to be back in 2001. regardless, if I see a multiboxer or botter around, Im reporting both of them as botters, and nothing gonna stop me. get rid of the multiboxers and the reporting stops. I sure cant tell the difference between them can I? you seem to think so, so I guess I'll just report forever until CCP gets tired of the surfeit of useless reports and gets rid of Mboxing forever. Or rather, gets tired of morons submitting useless reports about allowed activities that clog up the petition system, and bans the morons doing it. I like my idea better. ♥ Wreck Disposal Services
Corozan Aspinall Party Time Inc.	Posted - 2010.07.19 17:39:00 - [324] This kinda illustrates the (sometimes) extraordinary lengths some people will go to just to avoid communicating/interacting with other human beings .. Takes all sorts I guess. I'd prefer it if there were fewer guys like this around the place as, while 14 seems mind boggling, many people I run in to are doing 3-5 without breaking a sweat.
Thea Arsoniztik Red Tides Viewer Discretion Advised	Posted - 2010.07.19 18:13:00 - [325] After reading this on the site that the OP linked: Quote: The reason for the ban was that large numbers of accounts were seemingly being used in an automated fashion. I'm willing to accept that we have made an error on our part regarding this as our logs do indicate that your accounts were performing the actions at the same time as you say. Our sincere apologies for any inconvenience caused to you by this. I am in shock and awe that the logs actually showed something!
NupetietVer Valklear Guard	Posted - 2010.07.19 20:16:00 - [326] "SAC command, I need a simultaneous strike on target" All those monitors, looks like some command post.
Kewso	Posted - 2010.07.19 20:36:00 - [327] Edited by: Kewso on 19/07/2010 20:38:38 course that has nothing on this http://cito.allmysh-t.com/36boxerwowrig_490.jpg 36
Alianne Cooper	Posted - 2010.07.19 21:49:00 - [328] Necrophiliacs scare me more than this guy does.
Jinx Barker Caldari GFB Scientific	Posted - 2010.07.20 00:40:00 - [329] I say, congrats an a freaky setup, and, sorry I cant help but ask... how often do you get laid? Do you get laid at all? And I mean with another human being(s), domestic animals and blow up dolls do not count. Other than the laid part, I think more power to you dude.
Azhu	Posted - 2010.07.20 11:20:00 - [330] I thought I was a Big Nerd ..untill this post 5star top class



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