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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
ceaon
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Posted - 2010.08.15 19:38:00 -
[61]
+1 to set local on delayed
Originally by: CCP Adida The male thread was locked because the discussion turned into transsexuals and man boobs.
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Xiong Yoshi
Roving Guns Inc. RAZOR Alliance
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Posted - 2010.08.15 19:40:00 -
[62]
It took me a long time to finally come out in support of delayed/removed Local.
No, I haven't decided to support it in reaction to any event, or sequence of events.... more because I believe that this change will add an entire layer of "mystery" to roaming or ratting.
I believe that it will make the experience slightly more intense - which is what EVE needs.
------------------------------------------------ There are only two types of ships: those which have blown up; and those which will.
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MatrixSkye Mk2
Minmatar
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Posted - 2010.08.15 19:42:00 -
[63]
Originally by: Razin
Originally by: MatrixSkye Mk2 And actually, it wouldn't make the predator easier to be killed. The stalker gets the advantage. The prey gets screwed.
Yeah yeah, I know what you're going to say. The prey should always have predators defending it yadda yadda. In essence you demand the prey work twice/triple as hard as the predator. And even then, the predator has the advantage of making the decision on whether to engage or not to.
To a point, isn't this how it should be in 0.0?
Actually, if someone should be getting a slight advantage it should be the defender, not the attacker. But we're getting a bit off topic.
Grief a PVP'er. Run a mission today! |
Pr1ncess Alia
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Posted - 2010.08.15 19:42:00 -
[64]
high sec - local as we know it
low sec - delayed local
0.0 - local as system upgrade
fixed.
--- Players are losing faith and loyalty in CCP due previous expansions not living up to player expectations. The CSM and CCP agreed that expectation management can be improved |
Pesky LaRue
Minmatar The Magnificent Bastards
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Posted - 2010.08.15 19:45:00 -
[65]
Edited by: Pesky LaRue on 15/08/2010 19:45:20
Originally by: ceaon +1 to set local on delayed
Agreed.
I'd be up for the stargates reporting transit (ie, either a number of people in local, or a notification that someone has entered/left, as this kind of fits within the RP scope of things), but I love the idea of not knowing WHO is in the system with you, unless they decide to say hi in local. .
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Razin
The xDEATHx Squadron Legion of xXDEATHXx
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Posted - 2010.08.15 19:48:00 -
[66]
Originally by: MatrixSkye Mk2
Originally by: Razin To a point, isn't this how it should be in 0.0?
Actually, if someone should be getting a slight advantage it should be the defender, not the attacker. But we're getting a bit off topic.
IMO this is very pertinent to this issue.
Currently the 'defender' has an overwhelming advantage that allows certain escape. Delayed local would serve to balance this somewhat. ...
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Cozmik R5
Minmatar Chaosstorm Corporation Apoapsis Multiversal Consortium
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Posted - 2010.08.15 19:49:00 -
[67]
+1mil for Local change.
Only problem: 18-24 months because of CCP's hard-headedness. ____________________
Try not. Do. Or do not. There is no try. |
MatrixSkye Mk2
Minmatar
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Posted - 2010.08.15 19:52:00 -
[68]
Originally by: Razin
Originally by: MatrixSkye Mk2
Originally by: Razin To a point, isn't this how it should be in 0.0?
Actually, if someone should be getting a slight advantage it should be the defender, not the attacker. But we're getting a bit off topic.
IMO this is very pertinent to this issue.
Currently the 'defender' has an overwhelming advantage that allows certain escape. Delayed local would serve to balance this somewhat.
See AFK cloakers. They pretty much already decide who, what, where, when, and how. If the cloaker says NO ENGAGEMENT then rest assured there will be no engagement. If cloaker says ENGAGEMENT, then ready or not here he comes. Period.
I wouldn't exactly call that a disadvantage. At all.
Grief a PVP'er. Run a mission today! |
Ori Blake
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Posted - 2010.08.15 20:07:00 -
[69]
1. Dscans don't show whether or not the target is a wartarget. Combine that with no local in hisec, and you'd make the defender unable to do things like mission or mine. The attacker would also have less abilty to just randomly find their wartargets: they'd have to spy and metagame just to get locations, or resort to camping pipes.
2.No local in lowsec would make ratting hard to impossible for smaller corps and soloists. Even larger corps simply wont have the presence for effective intel to cover all the gate to a non-dead end system.
3. Dscanning is annoying. It's useful short term, but to have to spam a button every 5 seconds to get informational data is a bad design mechanic.
4. This would also kill off small gang and solo PvP because without a local headcount, you'd have to assume that every solo ship is a bait ship. Even now they still might be, but with an accurate local count you can choose still to engage and risk it.
They'd have to deal with these issues and more before delayed local becomes viable in anywheres but 0.0.
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Rowbin Hod
Cloak and Daggers Black Core Alliance
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Posted - 2010.08.15 20:22:00 -
[70]
I think the main issue with a proposed change is that the people proposing/supporting this are imagining how the current landscape of lowsec/0.0 would be better with this change. They are probably imaging themselves launching a surprise attack on an unsuspecting lone traveller or miner. They are probably touching themselves while imaging this.
What they don't get is how this one change will fundamentally change the whole landscape of New Eden. People will flock back to Empire in their droves, logistics will be borked.
I'm not saying it would be a bad change, but I really don't think the people supporting this fully appreciate how much it will affect the game as a whole as oppsed to the little bit they're imagining.
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Mire Stoude
The Undesirables
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Posted - 2010.08.15 20:59:00 -
[71]
As long as we are talking about d-scan improvements, along with all the other obvious improvements, it needs to be made so that un-piloted ships CAN (as an option) be filtered out.
Also, if local is removed as an intel source, other free intel such as the information you can get from the star map (# of active ships, ships destroyed, NPC's destroyed, etc) should be removed as well.
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Drykor
Minmatar Aperture Harmonics K162
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Posted - 2010.08.15 21:02:00 -
[72]
Didn't read the rest of the thread. But yes, yes it is time. I would totally be around known space if we didn't have these carebear local dynamics.
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Razin
The xDEATHx Squadron Legion of xXDEATHXx
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Posted - 2010.08.15 21:07:00 -
[73]
Originally by: MatrixSkye Mk2 Edited by: MatrixSkye Mk2 on 15/08/2010 19:58:37
Originally by: Razin
Originally by: MatrixSkye Mk2 Actually, if someone should be getting a slight advantage it should be the defender, not the attacker. But we're getting a bit off topic.
IMO this is very pertinent to this issue.
Currently the 'defender' has an overwhelming advantage that allows certain escape. Delayed local would serve to balance this somewhat.
See AFK cloakers. They pretty much already decide who, what, where, when, and how. If the cloaker says NO ENGAGEMENT (ie, keeps his PVP flag "OFF") then rest assured there will be no engagement. If cloaker says ENGAGEMENT (ie, ticks his PVP flag "ON"), then ready or not here he comes. Period.
I wouldn't exactly call that a disadvantage. At all.
In all my time ratting in 0.0 I've never had this problem. If I did I expect I'd just move to a different system.
Cloakers are a special case, and probably would need some balancing if local wend delayed. Could be as little as limiting the d-scan range while cloaked, to as harsh as not able to scan or use probes and/or produce a scan signature while cloaked. ...
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Jita Alt666
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Posted - 2010.08.15 21:13:00 -
[74]
CCP Adida... ....come quick this is a duplicate thread.
Maybe you will notice in 18 months.
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sentinel22uk
Black Talon Mercs Middle of Nowhere
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Posted - 2010.08.15 21:14:00 -
[75]
But look what pvp has come to ?
You enter a system and everybody immediately safes up/cloaks/docks, do you have any idea how much time and effort it takes to kill one person solo anymore ?
Pretty much 90% of every mod in eve is to aid defence and look at the lengths you have to go to get a simple fight.
Nobody engages anyone if the odds aren't stacked in their favour its simple common sense, this causes eve to be a very boring and long winded place.
A simple delayed local in null sec would solve every problem every person who wants to fight faces, and in turn would send prices of 0.0 gained materials sky high.
IMO every person who lives in 0.0 to PvP would enjoy this, if you want to be in a safe heaven stay in highsec, don't come to 0.0 to mine arkonor and expect to be safe.
+3
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Ben Derindar
Dirty Deeds Corp.
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Posted - 2010.08.15 21:35:00 -
[76]
I love how the local argument always brings out the people who are so quick to tell others to HTFU when they whine for the game to be changed to suit themselves, but on the subject of local, dohohoho that's completely different.
Yeah, no. You don't like local, go live in a wormhole. Problem solved.
/Ben
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Sergei Le'Poof
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Posted - 2010.08.15 21:36:00 -
[77]
Right now with all the riff raff in local no one can really admire my magnificent hair. But with local in delayed, I will just "o/" and I will be the only one in local to admire.
Me likes. Delayed local now.
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Akita T
Caldari Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2010.08.15 21:40:00 -
[78]
Edited by: Akita T on 15/08/2010 21:44:26
Originally by: Ben Derindar Yeah, no. You don't like local, go live in a wormhole. Problem solved.
You can have legitimate reasons to want 0.0 local put on delayed mode even if you never leave highsec yourself anymore. And while you're at it, you can also move L4 missions to lowsec.
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Beginner's ISK making guide | Manufacturer's helper | All about reacting _
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Sky Marshal
IMpAct Corp
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Posted - 2010.08.15 21:40:00 -
[79]
Originally by: MatrixSkye Mk2
Originally by: sentinel22uk People are talking about how this would be negative for solo pvp ? Please how ?
Simply removing local would make it easier to kill and easier to *be* killed = a more fun eve for me.
And actually, it wouldn't make the predator easier to be killed. The stalker gets the advantage. The prey gets screwed.
Yeah yeah, I know what you're going to say. The prey should always have predators defending it yadda yadda. In essence you demand the prey work twice/triple as hard as the predator. And even then, the predator has the advantage of making the decision on whether to engage or not to. I could defnitely see how this would be more fun for you but not everyone.
/thread
All people who want delayed local have no clue about how people will obviously react. They are too addicted to the "Adapt or die" expression, to realize that people will not play their game.
Local is fine, period. _______ With the NGE, I'm sorry about the mistake we made. We screwed up and didn't listen to the fans when we should have. - John Smedley, CEO of Sony Online Entertainment |
RippaSplitta
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Posted - 2010.08.15 21:43:00 -
[80]
You enter a system and everybody immediately safes up/cloaks/docks, do you have any idea how much time and effort it takes to kill one person solo anymore ?
delayed local:
You enter a system and nobody is there except moon mining POS or blob. You will put 0.0 at the same level of low sec.
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sentinel22uk
Black Talon Mercs Middle of Nowhere
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Posted - 2010.08.15 21:44:00 -
[81]
I do live in a wormhole :P
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Opertone
Caldari Metalworks Majesta Empire
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Posted - 2010.08.15 21:46:00 -
[82]
Originally by: Akita T
Isn't it about time local was changed to delayed mode already ? You know, like in w-space. Not just 0.0, but ALL of it.
Radical and cruel ? Maybe. But very EVE-y. Waah waah AFK cloaker syndrome ? HTFU. But but but ? NO.
Supporting in Akita T thread
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Akita T
Caldari Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2010.08.15 21:49:00 -
[83]
Edited by: Akita T on 15/08/2010 21:53:01
Originally by: Sky Marshal Local is fine, period.
Really ? Explain then how exactly is a backwater STEALTH assault supposed to be STEALTHY when the second you enter local everybody else knows you're there ? The only "solution" you have now is to BECOME one of the "annoyances" people call AFK cloaker. Yeah, it's fine allright. Fine like a baby's used diaper.
Here's a "compromise" : ships with cloaks automatically cloak whenever they enter a system (as opposed to gate-cloak) AND they never show up in local even if they speak.
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Beginner's ISK making guide | Manufacturer's helper | All about reacting _
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Shawna Gray
Gallente
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Posted - 2010.08.15 22:01:00 -
[84]
Originally by: sentinel22uk
You enter a system and everybody immediately safes up/cloaks/docks, do you have any idea how much time and effort it takes to kill one person solo anymore ?
Does it matter? 0.0 is hardly balanced around solopvp.
Quote: A simple delayed local in null sec would solve every problem every person who wants to fight faces, and in turn would send prices of 0.0 gained materials sky high. IMO every person who lives in 0.0 to PvP would enjoy this, if you want to be in a safe heaven stay in highsec, don't come to 0.0 to mine arkonor and expect to be safe.
You didnt think this through.
Quote:
EDIT: Plus people are talking about a delayed local making it impossible to rat in lowsec... Why ? Nobody would know you were there, they would only see your ship on D-scan ( within 14.4AU of course ).
Its not much effort to scan through belts.
Quote:
If you want to reap the profits of 0.0 and the meager profits of lowsec, people should learn to live in these environments and adapt their techniques. For example, instead of using that big hefty dominix to kill belt rats, use a nano-fast align shield tanked battlecruiser/hac and warp as soon as you see anything on d-scan within 1-4 AU.
Why bother when your empire alt can run missions, trade and do invention etc instead. The utter stupidity of spamming d-scan every 2 seconds is certainly more than enough to keep me away from any belts.
Quote:
If you get caught by a instalocking stealth bomber de-cloak, then fair game.
Cloaks would be nerfed soon after local disappears.
0.0 is already more of a battleground than a place where you live. CCP is actually trying to encourage more characters to move out there, not less.
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Gneeznow
Minmatar Ship spinners inc
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Posted - 2010.08.15 22:06:00 -
[85]
I'm sure it'll happen CCP always listen to their playerbase oh wait no they dont and it takes them years to fix even the smallest things.
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Akita T
Caldari Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2010.08.15 22:07:00 -
[86]
Originally by: Gneeznow I'm sure it'll happen CCP always listen to their playerbase oh wait no they dont and it takes them years to fix even the smallest things.
That's why this is not in assembly hall nor in features&ideas, because there's no point in trying to talk to CCP.
It's obvious nothing will change anyway.
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Beginner's ISK making guide | Manufacturer's helper | All about reacting _
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Shawna Gray
Gallente
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Posted - 2010.08.15 22:12:00 -
[87]
Originally by: Gneeznow I'm sure it'll happen CCP always listen to their playerbase oh wait no they dont and it takes them years to fix even the smallest things.
Its not like removing local in 0.0 has huge support. Akita is probably just trying to get some reactions.
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Akita T
Caldari Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2010.08.15 22:19:00 -
[88]
Edited by: Akita T on 15/08/2010 22:19:43
Originally by: Shawna Gray
Originally by: Gneeznow I'm sure it'll happen CCP always listen to their playerbase oh wait no they dont and it takes them years to fix even the smallest things.
Its not like removing local in 0.0 has huge support. Akita is probably just trying to get some reactions.
[sarcasm]Oh yeah, it doesn't have any support whatsoever indeed. That's why it's NOT on the list of issues raised by any of the CSMs to CCP, ever.[/sarcasm]
Originally by: Akita T It's obvious nothing will change anyway.
Had to say it again. So yeah, you're kind of right with your second part though. _
Beginner's ISK making guide | Manufacturer's helper | All about reacting _
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Admiral Pelleon
White Shadow Imperium
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Posted - 2010.08.15 22:19:00 -
[89]
Originally by: Akita T And while you're at it, only show online/offline status of watchlist for people that have you in their contact list with positive standingsHowever, locator agents should also communicate online/offline status for anybody (alongside location)
Don't like this. Sucks for those of us in nullsec. We have to run a locator agent on an alt just to see if someone is online? More meta-gaming is not the way I want to see eve go. ________ Chicago players channel: 'Windy City'
Originally by: CCP Navigator Confirming that I am the best poster.
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Akita T
Caldari Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2010.08.15 22:21:00 -
[90]
Originally by: Admiral Pelleon Don't like this. Sucks for those of us in nullsec. We have to run a locator agent on an alt just to see if someone is online? More meta-gaming is not the way I want to see eve go.
Add ability to remote-contact locator agents for an extra fee based on jumps to agent ?
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Beginner's ISK making guide | Manufacturer's helper | All about reacting _
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