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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 3 post(s) |
Siiee
Recycled Heroes
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Posted - 2010.09.12 23:58:00 -
[31]
So if I get this right, you're collecting the isk for this "investment" and then putting it all up as collateral, continuing your existing market activities essentially out of pocket, and then giving a portion of your regular returns to the "investors"?
I don't understand the excess complications, if you want to run a charity why not just run a charity? If you want to limit it to T4U people accept only T4U shares as "payment" (anyone who firesale'd all their shares was just a sucker).
If you want to limit your charity to only people with 10 bil minimum liquidity then set up private contracts to your potential "investors", something like 1 unit of trit, with 10bil payment and 10bil received on the contract, contract is only acceptable if the person can make the payment, and they get their isk back right away so they can accept your hand out and get their isk in other, real investments.
Otherwise essentially all you're doing is pulling 1.3 trillion isk out of circulation for the period of your offering. I just don't see the point.
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Thoraemond
Minmatar Far Ranger
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Posted - 2010.09.13 00:22:00 -
[32]
Originally by: Siiee [...] essentially all you're doing is pulling 1.3 trillion isk out of circulation for the period of your offering. I just don't see the point.
Taking currency out of circulation would be an interesting purpose in itself, but that is unlikely to be the purpose here, since 1.3 trillion ISK is only roughly 0.3% of the ISK in circulation (if I remember the most recent total correctly). á á
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Berikath
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Posted - 2010.09.13 00:35:00 -
[33]
Originally by: Cheque Please
Less than 2% = Margaret Thatcher
But since it's fully collateralized, you might find more than enough people willing to settle for Mrs. Thatcher
Mmm.... oh yeah... take those dentures out....
Bow-chicka-wow-wow!!!
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F90OEX
F9X WE FORM VOLTRON
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Posted - 2010.09.13 12:58:00 -
[34]
Originally by: Siiee Otherwise essentially all you're doing is pulling 1.3 trillion isk out of circulation for the period of your offering. I just don't see the point.
Well you don't since you don't know the bigger picture, as I wrote on the 1st post "short version", I am in the process of writing the longer version, there is risk like anything in Eve, the risk might be small but it is something that will be disclosed to potential investors so they can make there own mind up if this is something from them. The 1T security is only there, just in case I either give up or never log in again and fail to repay back there investment under the agreement that is drawn up.
Other reason for the 10bil investment is, IMO nothing comes free in Eve. You have to work for it, If you have 10bil to invest tells me you have made some effort in this game. I LIKE people who have made an effort and 10bil might seem like a lot. But I am no different I spend the same amount of hours grinding away saving up Isk, taking risks and other things looking back I might not do now.
Nothing was handed to me on a silver plate, nearly everything I have in Eve I worked towards it and made an effort. I have helped a lot of people in Eve, people I saw who just needed some Isk to get them started, or someone who took a risk and failed due to no fault of there own, I gave them whatever they lost. There the kind of people I like and there the people would like to see invest in this, and hopefully they will.
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49473
Jita Trade and Research Institute
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Posted - 2010.09.13 20:46:00 -
[35]
10 billion.
Depending on the strength of the proposal, this will go up to 100billion.
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Martosh Toma
Gallente Fraction Investment
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Posted - 2010.09.13 21:21:00 -
[36]
At first this looks indeed like a charity, especially mentioning the mails of people that claim to have lost investing in T4U. Considering the lukewarm reactions on BB's scam i'd say most of the people that lost there need no charity.
Now if it is an actual investment where the % return people decide to go for affects the risks on the investment as a whole, and the deposit with chribba is only a scam prevention measure and a hit by a bus strategy ( Note: this sounds awfully familiar ),then this might be an interesting opportunity.
Now, assuming I understood the above correctly:
- Could you give a rough estimation on the risks based on the preferred percentage of projected monthly growth?
- Will you be using some kind of third party accounting to show the results as they may result in a (partial) loss without being a scam.
- Would you allow an investor to act as broker on this investment to provide smaller granularity with no workload on your side, assuming the fees for sub investors on this are reasonable?
As to payment monthly or as a lump sum at the end. I'd say it would depend on the type of investment. if it is a type of investment where predicteble sums of isk would become available during the period the bond is active, then I would prefer to recieve at least part of the intrest every month. But not every investment is like that. Allthough I must say, with the option to specify projected monthly growth and little or no information on the actual investment, this feels more like gambling than investing.
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Machete Visor
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Posted - 2010.09.14 03:50:00 -
[37]
something is missing here...
for a 1 for 1 ISK secured investment, it is kind of like a FDIC insured savings account in real life.
So the rate should be the risk free rate of eve... or the rate of inflation maybe as a proxy.
Anyone got that handy from the last QEN?
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F90OEX
F9X WE FORM VOLTRON
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Posted - 2010.09.17 18:02:00 -
[38]
After talking with some people and looking at the numbers of what I can guarantee, Interest will be set @ 10%.
Some people don't want to do 6 months, so I have opted for a shorter term of 3 months of which will be paid every 30 days, at the end of the 3 months you will be paid back your Investment + interest.
Because of the shorter term, and how my trading cycle works, I am limiting the amount required to 500bil. Even though I am used to dealing with bigger numbers, this makes it a lot easier for me to deal with, since I like to keep things as simple as possible.
Martosh Toma
Hopefully I have answered your 1st question, and for the other 2 I don't have a problem with either one, of course depends who the other person is with regarding question 3.
Also I know this is not a problem for most, but we all know people who have there accounts hacked, IF your going to post here as an investor please make sure you post with a alt. If your someone I know well in game and invested just send me a mail so I know who you are, completely optional of course, I leave that to you.
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Grendell
Technologies Unlimited
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Posted - 2010.09.17 18:30:00 -
[39]
Could you clarify the details you have arranged with Chribba if any?
Grendell ♥
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Dalden V
Blue Lounge Industries
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Posted - 2010.09.17 22:24:00 -
[40]
Does losing 17b to T4U give me preference? :)
Seriously though, I'm willing to invest 10b if secured via Chribba.
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My Entity
Caldari State War Academy
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Posted - 2010.09.17 22:41:00 -
[41]
Once the dealing with Chribba is over, please kindly have Chribba confirm the arrangement on your thread.
Then I am also interested in investing at least 10B.
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F90OEX
F9X WE FORM VOLTRON
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Posted - 2010.09.17 23:26:00 -
[42]
I should have time to speak with him over the weekend, once everything is sorted, I will ask him to make a post.
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Grendell
Technologies Unlimited
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Posted - 2010.09.17 23:38:00 -
[43]
Originally by: F90OEX I should have time to speak with him over the weekend, once everything is sorted, I will ask him to make a post.
Thanks.
Grendell ♥
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Aishwarya Rai
Ta'aqiru Technologies
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Posted - 2010.09.17 23:52:00 -
[44]
evemail send
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My Entity
Caldari State War Academy
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Posted - 2010.09.18 00:38:00 -
[45]
Originally by: F90OEX
No assets just straight Isk , My assets are about 10 trillion+ tbh, Liquid Isk is a lot more.
Are you... "the broker?"
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Martosh Toma
Gallente Fraction Investment
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Posted - 2010.09.18 00:49:00 -
[46]
sorry I do not want to complain but, am I understanding your offer correctly?
You mention a guaranteed return for 10% per month for 3 months with a full isk based collateral with Chribba and a 10B minimum investment. With interest to be payed monthly, we would get over 6% a month, even if the thing fails at the end without a final intrest payment and it is liquidated by Chribba.
This is not a bond, its not an investment, it is a charity for the wealthy. The only risks we would run in this are: - a Botched hand over with/by Chribba - Chribba scamming - Some kind of RMT money laundering operation. None of these seem likely at this point in time.
The only thing odd to me is the suggestion to use alts to post participation. I do not see a reason for it except when linked to one of the 3 options above. As for security, character names are usually not linked to account names, except if you participated in old style gtc transfers and/or character transfers. Participation in this charity with any char (be it main or alt), does not change anything in your risk of being hacked as far as I can tell.
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Helmh0ltz
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Posted - 2010.09.18 02:18:00 -
[47]
So essentially, you are running a charity for rich people. ====== Your signature is freakishly huge for this forum. Please resize according to the forum rules, thanks. Shadow. |
Nexo92
Death Incarnate INC
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Posted - 2010.09.18 02:33:00 -
[48]
Edited by: Nexo92 on 18/09/2010 02:33:35
Originally by: Helmh0ltz Edited by: Helmh0ltz on 18/09/2010 02:27:41 How much is your total net worth in ISK (approximately)?
Does it really matter ?
Edit- Although I too am slightly curious
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Zekuloth
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Posted - 2010.09.18 02:56:00 -
[49]
THIS IS A SCAM (SEE BELOW) OR SOMETHING STRANGELY FISHY IS GOING ON IN THIS THREAD. IF THE LATTER ID STAY AWAY UNLESS YOU WANT A CCP BAN.
as initially this sounds a lot like someone else who pretended to be very rich and asked for a large capital injection to buy a officer fit BS to go missioning in and we all know how that turned out.
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Marshiro
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Posted - 2010.09.18 03:39:00 -
[50]
The best charity you can offer is that of knowledge. Whose with the will can and shall take advantage of it, those that do not have no right to wealth. Unlike isk, knowledge is a object that enriches all at the same time.
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So Sowwey
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Posted - 2010.09.18 04:54:00 -
[51]
F9x had been promising to do this for a long time. He finally did it . Spoke to him today and it sounds good. I'm in for 100 Bil. |
Arithron
Gallente Gallente Trade Alliance
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Posted - 2010.09.19 08:26:00 -
[52]
A big trader in the market; players of 2-4 years who are respected traders would have heard of you?
Funny, never seen a transaction in my logs (just checked last 2 yrs) with you, and I deal multi-bils in multiple markets.
Perhaps you could share with us an alt or two we might know instead? Or direct us towards a market or two you have been very active in (afterall, multi-trils will leave trails)
Ari Vote Arithron for CSM! Check out my thread: http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=899358 |
Ramingo
Caldari Payable on Death
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Posted - 2010.09.19 08:42:00 -
[53]
Originally by: Arithron A big trader in the market; players of 2-4 years who are respected traders would have heard of you?
Funny, never seen a transaction in my logs (just checked last 2 yrs) with you, and I deal multi-bils in multiple markets.
Perhaps you could share with us an alt or two we might know instead? Or direct us towards a market or two you have been very active in (afterall, multi-trils will leave trails)
Ari
That's cause he doesn't do market trades. He lately has been controlling the navy raven market which is done entirely via contracts.
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Friary
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Posted - 2010.09.19 08:44:00 -
[54]
Controlling via contracts...oh yeah, that's doable...
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Arithron
Gallente Gallente Trade Alliance
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Posted - 2010.09.19 08:56:00 -
[55]
Edited by: Arithron on 19/09/2010 09:00:32 Ahh, contracts. Funny thing (again)- I checked his contract history and can't see that many ravens traded lately (sure, a few), especially not enough to get near 50 bil, let alone trillions. Even more interesting, THAT WAS 3 YEARS AGO.
For a contract trader who 'controls' the market, I see zero contracts past 3 years...
Ari Vote Arithron for CSM! Check out my thread: http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=899358 |
Ramingo
Caldari Payable on Death
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Posted - 2010.09.19 09:01:00 -
[56]
Friary/Arithron,
I'll indulge your lazy behinds.
http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1368657
http://www.eve-search.com/thread/1327813
http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1358161
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Arithron
Gallente Gallente Trade Alliance
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Posted - 2010.09.19 09:12:00 -
[57]
Thank you for the linkies :)
However, all from this year (I'd set the stage for a multi-tril scam ahead of time afterall), and no evidence of anything actually changing hands (or the existence of said CNR), especially given the lack of a contract in his history or posts by buyers (which we could then check sell contracts for further proof). I'd still want an alt of his that has a history in contracts to check legit :)
Ari Vote Arithron for CSM! Check out my thread: http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=899358 |
Ramingo
Caldari Payable on Death
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Posted - 2010.09.19 09:34:00 -
[58]
Originally by: Arithron Edited by: Arithron on 19/09/2010 09:16:29 Thank you for the linkies :)
However, all from this year (I'd set the stage for a multi-tril scam ahead of time afterall), and no evidence of anything actually changing hands (or the existence of said CNR), especially given the lack of a contract in his history or posts by buyers (which we could then check sell contracts for further proof). I'd still want an alt of his that has a history in contracts to check legit :)
Ari
p.s I will, ofc, believe the OP if he could contract me 500 CNR. I will contract back immediately ( I can be trusted).
Stop arguing about something you have no clue about apparently. Do you think he would do his contract trades with his forum posting/ most visible char, so that any random can find out how many he buys, at what price, and who from???
And yeah he could be setting himself up for a scam, nobody knows. But he could be doing that irrespective of whether he owns trillions and just wants the lulz, or because he lost 50 titans in a row.
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Arithron
Gallente Gallente Trade Alliance
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Posted - 2010.09.19 10:07:00 -
[59]
Lets assume I have no clue (you know what they say about assumption...):
The OP is claiming to have trillions made from CNR dominance. However, apart from some CNR sales in 2007, we have no proof of this; forum posts of recent times selling '1000' CNR can't be used as proof as no winners announced and easily done by anyone to lay down the groundwork for a future scam (remember Amber Leonne?)
Offering IPO at 10 bil a shot requires a little more then 'I dominate a market' claims. If the OP is really as rich as he says, then revealing an alt which may give some data on his operations in the past will have little consequenceas he already has trillions right to outcompete anyone?
Players asking for proof of the qualifications of an OP before investing in such an IPO isn't unusual. I can only assume you are an Alt or a m8 of the OP :)
Ari
Vote Arithron for CSM! Check out my thread: http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=899358 |
Ramingo
Caldari Payable on Death
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Posted - 2010.09.19 10:33:00 -
[60]
Edited by: Ramingo on 19/09/2010 10:34:15
Originally by: Friary Controlling via contracts...oh yeah, that's doable...
Was directed more at this quote.
And to you, direct contracts between players do not show up in public and you can't tell this in an audit either. As such the only real proof he can give you is letting you log on his account and check for finished contracts, but we all know that's not going to happen, and screenshots of contract history can be photoshopped/faked.
So in essence irrespective of what is said or done the only thing you can base it on is the sales posts he has made and contact the people who bought 50+ bill each of the navy ravens and then form your judgment, but even that isn't foolproof. In the end you're going to be safer not investing into anything as the only way to be somewhat secured is having the IPO/loan backed by collateral.
Also, I'm neither an alt nor a mate, but in the 2 years I've been playing I've noticed most of his posts and it's what got me thinking about manipulation (on a much, much smaller scale) myself.
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