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Would you say the golem is in the top 5 best mission ships?

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Cbpress	Posted - 2011.02.26 22:29:00 - [1] Iv'e got all my missile skills lvl 5 (expect the spec skills for each missile type, the're at lvl 4). would a golem be better then a tengu (which is what i use now for mishies). better yet would you say its in the top 5 best mission ships? if or if not what would be the others in your opinion.
Straight Edged	Posted - 2011.02.26 23:02:00 - [2] it definitely one of the top mish runner. But it wont beat tengu, as it cant survive low sec.
Ifly Uwalk Caldari Empire Tax Collection Agency	Posted - 2011.02.27 00:03:00 - [3] Yes. No. Maybe. Usually. Rarely. Sometimes. Depends.
Nina Mercedez	Posted - 2011.02.27 04:29:00 - [4] Originally by: Straight Edged it definitely one of the top mish runner. But it wont beat tengu, as it cant survive low sec.
Chainsaw Plankton IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE	Posted - 2011.02.27 05:30:00 - [5] I'd use the golem for the up close brawler missions with good loot/salvage, and the tengu for the long range/blitz missions
Tau Cabalander Caldari	Posted - 2011.02.27 05:35:00 - [6] Ideally you want a Golem, a Tengu, and a CNR. I personally enjoy my Tengu the most, though it is not ideal for all missions, especially for all the EM-weak NPC I face doing missions mostly in Amarrian space. Golem: close range missions Tengu: Kinetic weak NPC missions (Guristas, Serpentis, etc.), or really high tank missions (can pull the whole room in any mission without worries). CNR: All other missions.
Missy Sasha	Posted - 2011.02.27 06:23:00 - [7] I'm aiming for a tengu and golem and nightmare. I don't really like my CNR much anymore. It's like a tengu but slow as balls.
Carniflex StarHunt R.A.G.E	Posted - 2011.02.27 09:07:00 - [8] Yes. I would say Golem is in the top 5 missionrunning boats. On what spot exactly it is inside that top 5 depends on your missionrunning style and environment.
Nuela	Posted - 2011.02.28 16:25:00 - [9] Edited by: Nuela on 28/02/2011 16:28:00 I have yet to try the Tengu out. I have one...waiting in the bay...but haven't gotten around to it. I have also been told the Golem is superior to the CNR. In my experience...no. Well, ok it probably is but it requires more work. The CNR is a very self-sufficient, easy to do everything ship. It is what people talk about - ultimate Caldari PvE EZ-mode. Mission type? Who cares? Throw in the right missles, the right defense and off you go. Trade drones out? Why? You can have 5 light drones of each type and so deploy the correct one when you get there. In addition, you can rig it up and lay your Cruise Missles against Cruisers and sometimes even frigates for good damage. The Golem can do the same and uses half the amount of missles. You can even rig Torpedos for more DPS. However, torpedoes have short range. So longer range missions you could fit Cruise missles on there...but that takes SECONDS man...take off the Siege launchers...put on the Cruise...take off the Cruise put back on the Siege. Sigh :) In addition even if you use Cruise you can't lay down the smackdown as well on smaller targets due to the lack/wrong type of rigs and your cruises won't do quite as much damage as the CNR can. So...I have both. I use the CNR probably 80% of the time. However the missions with loads of close range BS rats...the Golem is what I take.
Nuela	Posted - 2011.02.28 16:31:00 - [10] Originally by: Missy Sasha I'm aiming for a tengu and golem and nightmare. I don't really like my CNR much anymore. It's like a tengu but slow as balls. Guess I should get my Tengu up and running. The CNR is slower than a pig swimming in molasses in January.
Duvichi	Posted - 2011.03.01 18:20:00 - [11] Originally by: Nuela Guess I should get my Tengu up and running. The CNR is slower than a pig swimming in molasses in January. Is that a european or african pig? Laden or unladen? I like to salvage so I like my golem, but it is a bit of a pain in some missions.
Cipher Jones Minmatar	Posted - 2011.03.01 18:22:00 - [12] Originally by: Tau Cabalander Ideally you want a Golem, a Tengu, and a CNR. I personally enjoy my Tengu the most, though it is not ideal for all missions, especially for all the EM-weak NPC I face doing missions mostly in Amarrian space. Golem: close range missions Tengu: Kinetic weak NPC missions (Guristas, Serpentis, etc.), or really high tank missions (can pull the whole room in any mission without worries). CNR: All other missions. So you can do the same thing 3 times. lol Yes its prolly in the top 5 1. mach 2. nightmare 3. vargur 4. tengu 5. Golem
BerSerKer 13	Posted - 2011.03.01 19:20:00 - [13] depends on the mission realy like level 2 you could use a frig but if you going 4 but moslty 5 unsuported yes golum but just 4s drake and its not a big loss
zobod	Posted - 2011.03.01 19:55:00 - [14] Originally by: Cipher Jones Originally by: Tau Cabalander Ideally you want a Golem, a Tengu, and a CNR. I personally enjoy my Tengu the most, though it is not ideal for all missions, especially for all the EM-weak NPC I face doing missions mostly in Amarrian space. Golem: close range missions Tengu: Kinetic weak NPC missions (Guristas, Serpentis, etc.), or really high tank missions (can pull the whole room in any mission without worries). CNR: All other missions. So you can do the same thing 3 times. lol Yes its prolly in the top 5 1. mach 2. nightmare 3. vargur 4. tengu 5. Golem Currently working out whether to go Vargur or Mach, why do you think the Mach better, the Vargur's 100% large projectile turret bonus is pushing me towards that at the moment...
The Old Chap	Posted - 2011.03.01 20:14:00 - [15] I've used Mach, Golem and Vargur, now only use the Vargur. Main reasons: Marauder is better than standard or faction bs for two reasons: only need 4x turrets (cheaper to fit, half the ammo consumption) AND it can salvage as you go (twice the cargo capacity, 3x spare hi-slots for salvage gear/tractors and a 2x bonus for tractor beam range). Salvage-as-you-go is great for pi$$ing off the ninja salvagers too, when they warp in and you've already bagged most of the loot! I prefer Vargur to Golem because every shot counts, no problem with npc's spamming defender missiles. I also find autocannons more versatile than cruise or torps, and chew through the missions faster.
Gryganne Gallente Rockhound Inc.	Posted - 2011.03.01 21:14:00 - [16] The Golem is prob. in the top 5. As for Tengu, that's an LOL ship for general lvl 4 mission running. If you want to take forever to run missions and make less isk, sure, use a Tengu. If you want to make isk at a good pace, you're just kidding yourself if you don't use a BS. Sure, the Tengu is good for some missions. So? A stabber is an ideal ship for Recon 2 and 3, but you don't hear me going around saying that the stabber is the best lvl 4 mission runner because it's the best at doing some lvl 4 missions. The Tengu is good for a few missions, the Golem (or perhaps the CNR) is better for the majority of them.
SickSeven Simplistic Syndicate	Posted - 2011.03.01 23:30:00 - [17] Vargur > all. Seriously. I think it's finally getting the recognition it deserves. You died at the fittings screen, you just hand't realized it yet - Mr. Cue
Necro Merc	Posted - 2011.03.01 23:55:00 - [18] I've not tried a Vargur but will be able to use one soon. Golem I believe has to be king of lvl 4 missions though. The ability to do 100% of a specific damage type gives 'dari battleships the edge everytime imo. Whoever said the Tengu sucks is talking out their ass, Tengu can finish some missions a LOT quicker than even a Golem can due to range - Worlds Collide anyone? However the Golem with 3x TP (I've just recently started using 3 instead of 2, dropping my cap booster in exchange) is a MONSTER. 1 shots most if not all BC. 1-3 shots for a cruiser depending on resists, **** it can even 2 shot frigates!!! Only downside is the 55km weapon range, but that's only a problem on a handful of missions, which is why people say have a CNR aswell.
Starshi	Posted - 2011.03.02 00:13:00 - [19] Noone ever mentions paladin ? I find it a monster ship to do missions with. I put out 910 dps ( in eft, w/o drones ) and i do missions very quickly. The score and Veng in less than 20 minutes, blockade in 25-30 minutes, gone berserk in ~15 minutes, UMP and smuggler interception in less than 20 mins. Its true i cant do worlds collides and angel extravaganza fast, but i dont take them anyway :) Most importantly i get 2k isk per lp and i usually make 70-80m even 90m per hour in missioning with second account salvaging everything on my way.
Richard C Hoagland	Posted - 2011.03.02 02:28:00 - [20] Originally by: Starshi Noone ever mentions paladin ? I find it a monster ship to do missions with. I put out 910 dps ( in eft, w/o drones ) and i do missions very quickly. The score and Veng in less than 20 minutes, blockade in 25-30 minutes, gone berserk in ~15 minutes, UMP and smuggler interception in less than 20 mins. Its true i cant do worlds collides and angel extravaganza fast, but i dont take them anyway :) Most importantly i get 2k isk per lp and i usually make 70-80m even 90m per hour in missioning with second account salvaging everything on my way. Isn't one of the points of flying a marauder that you don't need a second account to salvage things for you?
Misanthra	Posted - 2011.03.02 04:02:00 - [21] Edited by: Misanthra on 02/03/2011 04:02:04 Originally by: Richard C Hoagland Isn't one of the points of flying a marauder that you don't need a second account to salvage things for you? Don't run a marauder but can see the point. faster wreck cleanup when they pile up. Also not sure how he runs his but my salvager also fleet boosts. If he does the same...viable setup. basic warfare skills 5 is 10% bonus no gear needed. make a salvage ship that can fit links (every race has a bc that fits 1), have it run a ganglink with mindlink implant (was surprised...these are cheap actually lol)....moar bonus. His setup also good for multirooms he wipes quick I imagine. Maruader just clusters the wrecks, salvages what it can....moves on. Salvager hits the clusters while pali off in next room.
Chainsaw Plankton IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE	Posted - 2011.03.02 05:06:00 - [22] Originally by: Misanthra Edited by: Misanthra on 02/03/2011 04:02:04 Originally by: Richard C Hoagland Isn't one of the points of flying a marauder that you don't need a second account to salvage things for you? Don't run a marauder but can see the point. faster wreck cleanup when they pile up. Also not sure how he runs his but my salvager also fleet boosts. If he does the same...viable setup. basic warfare skills 5 is 10% bonus no gear needed. make a salvage ship that can fit links (every race has a bc that fits 1), have it run a ganglink with mindlink implant (was surprised...these are cheap actually lol)....moar bonus. His setup also good for multirooms he wipes quick I imagine. Maruader just clusters the wrecks, salvages what it can....moves on. Salvager hits the clusters while pali off in next room. if he is running a 25-30m blockade I'd hope he was salvaging with the paladin the exact top 5 is a bit subjective. tengu definitely belongs on there for its unprobable setups for lowsec/0.0. Macha has to go on for uber dps, awesome speed, great agility, pretty flexible damage types, and well 3 slots left for varg/golem/paladin/nightmare/cnr.
Misanthra	Posted - 2011.03.02 07:25:00 - [23] Originally by: Chainsaw Plankton if he is running a 25-30m blockade I'd hope he was salvaging with the paladin the exact top 5 is a bit subjective. tengu definitely belongs on there for its unprobable setups for lowsec/0.0. Macha has to go on for uber dps, awesome speed, great agility, pretty flexible damage types, and well 3 slots left for varg/golem/paladin/nightmare/cnr. true...Blockade is t3 mission to me . Bum rush the damps at 600m/s+ to get to gimped range. Slow ass bs...I'd put salvager in bc (drake for the lazy tank most likely) to be aggro shield. Let them have all the fun of damps ( I get the damp blockade from region I saw it) to leave the dps bs free to kill. and top 5 is subjective. Me..I'd put jaguar in my top 5. Great boat for new corp regrinds and starting at lv 1 and 2 (does 3 well imo...better ships ofc but I like to make eve interesting at times). Not as sexy as marauder but when you really need a mission refresh to keep pve from getting too stale and wnat to try another corp (or go as far as faction change)....eats up them 1's and 2's (even 3's to make em interesting) like candy, Also fun as hell to fly.
AristotleOnassis	Posted - 2011.03.02 10:41:00 - [24] kestrel is eons better then jaguar at lv1's
Starshi	Posted - 2011.03.02 13:01:00 - [25] Well, yes initially marauders are ships that salvage as you go, but i got that second account anyway, so why not improve my salvaging ? Precise, i cant salvage everything with the marauder anyway, because either i do the mission to fast, or the wrecks are >40kms away, so an additional salvager is always welcome. Also there is no t1 ship ( except faction ships ) that can match the damage of the paladin. Enough with the offtopic, but i still think that paladin definitely has a spot in the top5 :)
Zhilia Mann Tide Way Out Productions	Posted - 2011.03.02 16:24:00 - [26] Why five? For top-tier L4 running you have three good Marauders, two excellent pirate BSs, one great Navy BS, and the Tengu. That's seven and you can easily make a case for each of them depending on the exact circumstances.
Liadan Khanum Gallente Dragon Armed Mercenary Escort Squadron	Posted - 2011.03.02 16:44:00 - [27] I just got into a paladin and I love it the dps bump over my old abaddon is very noticible. The Abad could only out damage a max skill HM tengu with multifreq sometimes. The pally can more then keep up with scorch most of the time and if I get into conflag range its not even a contest. And getting to close range is pretty easy with the tengu kiting at 700m/s in the other direction and getting most of the Aggro. Of course this is just for Amarr space mish. I've also done the Raven, Cruise CNR, Torp golemn, HM tengu progression. once I went to the torp golem I never went back to the cruise CNR. Just make sure you have a good AB. I doo bounce back anf forth between the tengu and golem (golems stays home in caldari space, tengu gos on the road). There are definately times when the Torp Golem (have to try 3 TP sometime!) is better than the tengu in shear dps, but at least rignt now the tengu is more fun to fly for me and with a buffer/speed/(sig) tank it can deal with any level 4 (inculding AE bonus). I have to say though that since the noctis was introduced I don't bother too much with salvaging with the marauder's. I may tar ball the wrecks and loot the bs but if I decide to fully loot and salvage I come back with a noctis.
knentil	Posted - 2011.03.02 18:11:00 - [28] Lol, people still salvage? I thought that was just a thing to make piwates think they were cool when they dropped in on your mission.
Liang Nuren	Posted - 2011.03.02 18:22:00 - [29] Originally by: Straight Edged it definitely one of the top mish runner. But it wont beat tengu, as it cant survive low sec. I must have imagined running low sec missions in a marauder. Yeah, that's it. -Liang -- Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire On Twitter
Cipher Jones Minmatar	Posted - 2011.03.02 21:55:00 - [30] Originally by: zobod Originally by: Cipher Jones Originally by: Tau Cabalander Ideally you want a Golem, a Tengu, and a CNR. I personally enjoy my Tengu the most, though it is not ideal for all missions, especially for all the EM-weak NPC I face doing missions mostly in Amarrian space. Golem: close range missions Tengu: Kinetic weak NPC missions (Guristas, Serpentis, etc.), or really high tank missions (can pull the whole room in any mission without worries). CNR: All other missions. So you can do the same thing 3 times. lol Yes its prolly in the top 5 1. mach 2. nightmare 3. vargur 4. tengu 5. Golem Currently working out whether to go Vargur or Mach, why do you think the Mach better, the Vargur's 100% large projectile turret bonus is pushing me towards that at the moment... 1 account and the vargur is better, 2 accounts and the mach IMHO. I think a maxed out Vargur and a maxed out Mach will kill a BS in the same number of volleys. The ammo is the only real issue, but i can make t2 or t1 and faction it up. with 2 accounts its pretty much a negligible difference.
Veryez	Posted - 2011.03.03 01:20:00 - [31] I can fly both at max skills, as well as nightmare and vargur. The Golem is far better than the Tengru in nearly any mission. Running missions quickly is all about DPS, and a 3xTP golem has far more DPS than a Tengru. In fact the Tengru mostly sits in my hanger collecting dust. The golem's strength is that it preforms well against all npc's. Having said that, I find the Vargur better than the golem in minmatar space on almost every mission. Setup correctly, it can alpha frigates @ 80k, damage selection is nice, and with an ab, it makes travel distances a pleasure. I don't have much experience w/a mach, so will reserve judgement. The golem makes a nice mission runner for when you're heavily engaged in corp chat, as it requires very little attention. The Tengru is only marginally better than a nighthawk at mission running (though the ab is nice), it has a great tank, but who cares about tank. Once you can run the mission, running it quickly is all about dps. The Tengru does excel in running missions in losec though. So to answer your questions Golem > Tengru, and yes, Golem belongs in the Top 5.
Chainsaw Plankton IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE	Posted - 2011.03.03 04:09:00 - [32] Originally by: Misanthra true...Blockade is t3 mission to me . Bum rush the damps at 600m/s+ to get to gimped range. Slow ass bs...I'd put salvager in bc (drake for the lazy tank most likely) to be aggro shield. Let them have all the fun of damps ( I get the damp blockade from region I saw it) to leave the dps bs free to kill. and top 5 is subjective. Me..I'd put jaguar in my top 5. Great boat for new corp regrinds and starting at lv 1 and 2 (does 3 well imo...better ships ofc but I like to make eve interesting at times). Not as sexy as marauder but when you really need a mission refresh to keep pve from getting too stale and wnat to try another corp (or go as far as faction change)....eats up them 1's and 2's (even 3's to make em interesting) like candy, Also fun as hell to fly. if your doing the serp blockade I'd just blitz it... stupid damps, or semi-afk fof it, that works too
Zaknussem Intrum Industria	Posted - 2011.03.03 12:40:00 - [33] Originally by: Veryez The Golem is far better than the Tengru in nearly any mission. Running missions quickly is all about DPS, and a 3xTP golem has far more DPS than a Tengru... The golem's strength is that it preforms well against all npc's. The golem makes a nice mission runner for when you're heavily engaged in corp chat, as it requires very little attention. The Tengru is only marginally better than a nighthawk at mission running (though the ab is nice), it has a great tank, but who cares about tank. Once you can run the mission, running it quickly is all about dps. The Tengru does excel in running missions in losec though. So to answer your questions Golem > Tengru, and yes, Golem belongs in the Top 5. To answer the original question, I believe that the Golem belongs on the Top 5, though I won't even try to say where exactly it belongs. As to the above quoted text... my experience differs. You're a little off about what is the important factor about running missions. It's not DPS... it's just overall speed. And on that front the Tengu wins in almost every category. It's faster and more agile, it aligns faster to warp, it's smaller and every decent Tengu fit has an Afterburner, which makes speed-tanking a very lucrative option. True, the Tengu lacks the DPS of a 3xTP Torp Golem, but the DPS the Tengu has is put to better use. No extra modules (or Drones) are required to achieve similar results. The small sig radius of the Tengu also pretty much eliminates ninja salvagers from the equation, so the Golem's "salvage-as-you-go" advantage is slightly diminished. Finally, the Tengu only has HALF the required training time of the Golem.
Mirabele	Posted - 2011.03.03 13:41:00 - [34] Originally by: Gryganne The Golem is prob. in the top 5. As for Tengu, that's an LOL ship for general lvl 4 mission running. If you want to take forever to run missions and make less isk, sure, use a Tengu. If you want to make isk at a good pace, you're just kidding yourself if you don't use a BS. Sure, the Tengu is good for some missions. So? A stabber is an ideal ship for Recon 2 and 3, but you don't hear me going around saying that the stabber is the best lvl 4 mission runner because it's the best at doing some lvl 4 missions. The Tengu is good for a few missions, the Golem (or perhaps the CNR) is better for the majority of them. Tengu Owns!. The majority of ships in lvl 4 are cruiser-sized. And the tengu kills a cruiser probebly twice as fast as a golem/cnr( or very close to it ) And with 800+ dps with fury ( KIN ), it kills BS's faster then, uhm, lets say a Domi. Tengu is an awesome ship. Most of us are quite boored with the "look at my big fat slow bs" runs that we went for other ships. And the Tengu makes mince meat out of prity mutch every mission. And it runs probebly about 50% of them faster then any Golem / Vargur does. Taking in to account that you DONT salvage( Wich ofc is isk/h, and that is the most important factor in most players minds )I hate salvaging, its booring and un-inspiering. If you ask me. The Tengu runs mission faster then a CNR. As for Golem: By just running the mission and not salvaging, the math was that CNR was faster?( correct me if iam wrong ) Vargur / Mach: I have no clue ;) // Mira
PrankMaster	Posted - 2011.03.04 05:09:00 - [35] Tengu is best for everything that has a significant amount of smaller ships, and/or involves covering a lot of distance. And for 0.0 combat exploration it is not even a discussion, you move around so much that everything heavier than a cruiser feels like watching paint dry

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