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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
James Amril-Kesh
4S Corporation RAZOR Alliance
707
|
Posted - 2012.09.16 04:36:00 -
[61] - Quote
Taxes for alliance size is an awful, awful idea and very easily exploited. http://themittani.com/features/local-problem A simple fix to the local intel problem |
Ryhss
Android Gang Stealth Syndicate
10
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Posted - 2012.09.16 05:16:00 -
[62] - Quote
There's NOT to much ISK in Eve. You do realize any CCP programmer can add or remove ISK with a few lines of code? |
James Amril-Kesh
4S Corporation RAZOR Alliance
707
|
Posted - 2012.09.16 05:41:00 -
[63] - Quote
Ryhss wrote:There's NOT to much ISK in Eve. You do realize any CCP programmer can add or remove ISK with a few lines of code? ... Exactly how would they accomplish that? http://themittani.com/features/local-problem A simple fix to the local intel problem |
Jimmy Gunsmythe
Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic
153
|
Posted - 2012.09.16 06:53:00 -
[64] - Quote
Some of you are just so sad and predictable. It's like watching the same show over and over, and reciting the lines for the thousandth time. You need a hobby. It is the greatest inequality to try to make unequal things equal. |
Lilianna Star
Perkone Caldari State
121
|
Posted - 2012.09.16 06:59:00 -
[65] - Quote
So, on top of wardecs we need another reason for people to turtle in their NPC corps. |
Nerath Naaris
Pink Winged Unicorns for Peace Love and Anarchy
154
|
Posted - 2012.09.16 07:11:00 -
[66] - Quote
Ryhss wrote:There's NOT to much ISK in Eve. You do realize any CCP programmer can add or remove ISK with a few lines of code?
CCP already does that with botted/RMTed ISK.
Unless they have given up on that. Forum-unbanned since 2011.10.20. |
Cpt Gobla
No Bullshit Jokers Wild.
60
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Posted - 2012.09.16 10:04:00 -
[67] - Quote
One thing that should be taken into account is that while assets being destroyed doesn't remove any absolute ISK from the system it does decrease the value of all ISK present in the system.
For every asset destroyed a certain amount of minerals will leave the system. This changes the ratio of minerals/ISK which in turn increases the value of said minerals. Since the vast majority of assets in the game have their value rooted in these minerals, one way or the other, this basically ends up being a devaluation of ISK by an extremely minor amount.
Both removal of ISK and removal of minerals in the system balance the economy. The only thing is that removal of minerals is a much dirtier method with more side-effects (although not all of them negative, EVE's market is only more interesting because of this). |
Ghazu
182
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Posted - 2012.09.16 10:11:00 -
[68] - Quote
lets just start charging npc alts 1m per post on forums. |
Nicolo da'Vicenza
Divine Power. Cascade Imminent
1770
|
Posted - 2012.09.16 10:18:00 -
[69] - Quote
Ghazu wrote:lets just start charging npc alts 1m per post on forums. that's one way, but the OP's proposal of increasing the fee for alliances by an order of magnitude per 1000 members works too
for OP's NPC corp, that works out to 7.55*10^126 put upon Caldari Provisions. Per member. That's a fine of ten quattuordecillion for every atom in the observable universe put upon each and every member of Caldari Provisions.
Some might say passing along a weekly fee of "7.55 unquadragintillion" onto people like the OP is a bit of a harsh penalty. But I say it is not enough. Death to large alliances! |
Brooks Puuntai
Red Federation RvB - RED Federation
743
|
Posted - 2012.09.16 10:35:00 -
[70] - Quote
Reduce faucets not create more sinks. Increasing alliance bills is a stupid idea and depending on what the ranges are you will just have people splinter off to avoid the higher bill if its too much. |
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Aiwha
101st Space Marine Force Nulli Secunda
492
|
Posted - 2012.09.16 13:19:00 -
[71] - Quote
CCP needs to get the goddamn hotpants in the nex store.
And my big hat with the poofy feather. Regards,
LCpl. Aiwha-á |
Gillia Winddancer
Shiny Noble Crown Services
78
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Posted - 2012.09.16 13:24:00 -
[72] - Quote
If you guys are so eager to see a hyper-effective isk faucet then I will gladly be of service. Just wire all your excess isk to me and I will safekeep it all.
In all seriousness though, inflation is a rather bad thing in any MMORPG/multiplayer game. EVE has managed it rather splendidly though considering for how long it's been running.
Path of Exile circumvented this problem more or less flawlessly though, by simply not having any gold as a currency, and instead let consumable and sought after items that everyone wants and use at any given level act as currency. Whilst other hack'n slash games like Diablo and so on suffer from what I'd call super-mega-hyper inflation due to the game being designed the way it is, Path of Exile will probably never suffer from this issue. Turning players themselves into monetary faucets was a stroke of genius really.
Obviously it would be a challenge to figure out how to turn EVE players themselves into faucets. Regular isk sinks only go so far after all, service fees, taxes etc etc - such things have a limit after all. The main reason for why it works for a game like Path of Exile is that it is chance based and the materials you use tend to have a rather low chance of success into turning out the way you want for any particular build that you may be after. EVE does not have that kind of thing (save maybe from researching T2 blueprints?).
And then of course, EVE and hack'n slash games are quite different games as well. Generally I also don't think that chance based features are as appreciated as well in a game like EVE compared to whatever Diablo clone that exist out there today.
But yeah, if anyone have any good idea on how a player could "gamble" isk in order to pursue something that is useful or sought after, regardless of player age, and without upsetting the game balance in any way then yeah, go right ahead and suggest it.
Only thing I can think of (that is far from being a solid idea) would be a general lottery system of some sort that is chance based on an individual level.
Second of all, a system of sorts where you spend a rather large amount (read very high amount) of isk in order to change a T1 module into a random meta module - all the way to officer level. Then again, getting a faction/officer level would be somewhere around 1/1000 or so at the very least (at any rate be far more difficult than by simply going out there and try to get a drop the normal way). But yeah, as I said, this idea have a fair few holes and would probably require extreme amounts of testing before even considering anything else. Correctly done though it could end up sucking away incredible amounts of isk from the game simply because there are people that like to take these kind of chances. But once again, how's the reception on chance based features here?
The one big advantage that EVE has over Path of Exile with this system is the fact that modules can be destroyed which pretty much would make this system somewhat self-regulated from gradually excess buildup of the rarest of modules.
Anyway, I cannot think of any other way to really burn isk from the game apart from something along these lines.
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Riot Girl
Perkone Caldari State
103
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Posted - 2012.09.16 13:31:00 -
[73] - Quote
If there's too much in ISK in this game it's because you guys aren't blowing up enough ships. You can only blame yourselves for this problem. |
Rico Minali
Sons Of 0din Dark Therapy
1040
|
Posted - 2012.09.16 14:28:00 -
[74] - Quote
Just get rid of hisec incursions. Trust me, I almost know what I'm doing. |
kilmenow Hakaari
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
1
|
Posted - 2012.09.16 15:20:00 -
[75] - Quote
EvEa Deva wrote:Want a huge ISK sink? let us paint our ships, inject gambling into the game, pole dancers, highsec legal drugs like quafe redbull or quafe bath salts, maybe add ship crews that can be upgraded with ISK. Anything that goes to the game and not another player.
as long as those items are strictly from npc sellers, it would be an isk sink.
I found a great explination of eve economics on another site, here's a link:
http://www.kugutsumen.com/showthread.php?13367-EVE-O-Nomics-wat-is-isk-sink
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kilmenow Hakaari
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
1
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Posted - 2012.09.16 15:35:00 -
[76] - Quote
Brooks Puuntai wrote:Reduce faucets not create more sinks. Increasing alliance bills is a stupid idea and depending on what the ranges are you will just have people splinter off to avoid the higher bill if its too much.
that's the part that is a conflict driver, eventually those small groups could start fighting amungst each other or 1 small group fights another from a different mega alliance. So instead of fighting huge alliance blocks like the CFC, SOCO, HBC, ect, there would be many smaller alliances within the block. The large blocks aren't too concerned if 1 member allaince has a beef with some other alliance. They are allowed (or left to) handle thier own business as long as it doesn't interfer with the larger goals.
I was origninally looking at this as a way to create an isk sink and a conflict driver. |
Cpt Gobla
No Bullshit Jokers Wild.
62
|
Posted - 2012.09.16 16:16:00 -
[77] - Quote
How about hiring NPCs to aid players?
Can't beat that player trashing you in local in a 1v1? Your pimped out carebear-mobile not the solo pwn machine you expected? Hire a NPC Command Ship to provide boosts for just a million per minute!
Still getting your ass handed to you? Your opponent called in friends that you don't have? Hire a NPC Logistics Ship to repair you for just ten million per minute!
One of your enemies lit a cyno and you got hotdropped? Need that little extra to solo PvP in your Moros? Hire a NPC Titan to doomsday your enemies for just a hundred million!
Just think of the possibilities! |
Shizuken
Venerated Stars
93
|
Posted - 2012.09.16 16:23:00 -
[78] - Quote
Trendon Evenstar wrote:Where did the other 145m go?
In whomever's wallet you bought the ship from. The only thing that takes money out of the economy are payments that go to CCP entities like NPC corp taxes, market tax, broker fees, skillbooks etc.. CCP already increased the market tax to put downward pressure on inflation by taking more money out of the economy.
So in the case of your example, no ISK was harmed in the destruction of your ship. |
kilmenow Hakaari
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
3
|
Posted - 2012.09.16 17:23:00 -
[79] - Quote
Cpt Gobla wrote:How about hiring NPCs to aid players?
Can't beat that player trashing you in local in a 1v1? Your pimped out carebear-mobile not the solo pwn machine you expected? Hire a NPC Command Ship to provide boosts for just a million per minute!
Still getting your ass handed to you? Your opponent called in friends that you don't have? Hire a NPC Logistics Ship to repair you for just ten million per minute!
One of your enemies lit a cyno and you got hotdropped? Need that little extra to solo PvP in your Moros? Hire a NPC Titan to doomsday your enemies for just a hundred million!
Just think of the possibilities!
jsut think about concord getting swarmed by tons of npc ships. The salvage and drops would be great |
oldbutfeelingyoung
Perkone Caldari State
696
|
Posted - 2012.09.16 17:46:00 -
[80] - Quote
the only perfect solution is that every player put half their amount of ISK into my wallet
i promise i will not use it and will not put any of it back on the market
really i promise ..... trust me .............you know me ,you can trust me ,right? If Dust has social areas ,then vanishing the blog is not an CCP decision ,but an all exclusive Sony decision |
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James Amril-Kesh
4S Corporation RAZOR Alliance
707
|
Posted - 2012.09.16 18:03:00 -
[81] - Quote
I'm not really sure whether insurance is an ISK faucet or an ISK sink. If nobody spent any ISK getting their ships insured then yes, it would be an ISK faucet because there's ISK entering the economy whenever someone gets their ship blown up. On the other hand if there are lots of pilots ensuring their ships beyond the default level but not getting those ships blown up at all, it's an ISK sink since the money for insurance is paid to an NPC entity.
Possible ideas to reduce ISK in the economy: Remove insurance payouts unless the pilot has explicitly ensured their ship Reduce NPC bounties in L4 missions, nerf vanguard payouts by ~5% Raise NPC corp taxes to 20-25% Change refining collaterals in highsec stations into monetary fees reduced by NPC corp standings http://themittani.com/features/local-problem A simple fix to the local intel problem |
Ryhss
Android Gang Stealth Syndicate
10
|
Posted - 2012.09.16 18:08:00 -
[82] - Quote
James Amril-Kesh wrote:Ryhss wrote:There's NOT to much ISK in Eve. You do realize any CCP programmer can add or remove ISK with a few lines of code? ... Exactly how would they accomplish that? By writing a few lines of code, putting it in a patch. You do right?realize this is a game, right? |
oldbutfeelingyoung
Perkone Caldari State
696
|
Posted - 2012.09.16 18:12:00 -
[83] - Quote
James Amril-Kesh wrote:I'm not really sure whether insurance is an ISK faucet or an ISK sink. If nobody spent any ISK getting their ships insured then yes, it would be an ISK faucet because there's ISK entering the economy whenever someone gets their ship blown up. On the other hand if there are lots of pilots ensuring their ships beyond the default level but not getting those ships blown up at all, it's an ISK sink since the money for insurance is paid to an NPC entity.
Possible ideas to reduce ISK in the economy: Remove insurance payouts unless the pilot has explicitly ensured their ship Reduce NPC bounties in L4 missions, nerf vanguard payouts by ~5% Raise NPC corp taxes to 20-25% Change refining collaterals in highsec stations into monetary fees reduced by NPC corp standings
you forgot :
remove moon goo remove bigger roids in 0.0 remove lvl 5 missions remove bigger bounty npc ships in low and null
If Dust has social areas ,then vanishing the blog is not an CCP decision ,but an all exclusive Sony decision |
Nicolo da'Vicenza
Divine Power. Cascade Imminent
1772
|
Posted - 2012.09.16 19:06:00 -
[84] - Quote
oldbutfeelingyoung wrote:James Amril-Kesh wrote:I'm not really sure whether insurance is an ISK faucet or an ISK sink. If nobody spent any ISK getting their ships insured then yes, it would be an ISK faucet because there's ISK entering the economy whenever someone gets their ship blown up. On the other hand if there are lots of pilots ensuring their ships beyond the default level but not getting those ships blown up at all, it's an ISK sink since the money for insurance is paid to an NPC entity.
Possible ideas to reduce ISK in the economy: Remove insurance payouts unless the pilot has explicitly ensured their ship Reduce NPC bounties in L4 missions, nerf vanguard payouts by ~5% Raise NPC corp taxes to 20-25% Change refining collaterals in highsec stations into monetary fees reduced by NPC corp standings you forgot : remove moon goo remove bigger roids in 0.0 none of these create isk tl;dr: you are dumb |
James Amril-Kesh
4S Corporation RAZOR Alliance
707
|
Posted - 2012.09.16 19:12:00 -
[85] - Quote
oldbutfeelingyoung wrote:you forgot :
remove moon goo remove bigger roids in 0.0 remove lvl 5 missions remove bigger bounty npc ships in low and null
edit: and if there are indeed so many botters in EvE ,ban them ,biomass or crucify their avatars on the Jita and Amarr monuments Moon goo: Doesn't create ISK Bigger roids: Don't create ISK lvl 5 missions: Okay, I don't really care about those, but I seriously doubt they contribute to inflation all that much Large bounty NPCs in low/null: Absolutely not. Null income for individual alliance members is disproportionally low as it is, and null NPC bounties don't contribute nearly as much to inflation as lvl 4 missions do.
As for the botters, CCP's already doing that... somewhat. I'd fully support them being a little less lenient and more proactive towards botters. http://themittani.com/features/local-problem A simple fix to the local intel problem |
oldbutfeelingyoung
Perkone Caldari State
697
|
Posted - 2012.09.16 19:16:00 -
[86] - Quote
Nicolo da'Vicenza wrote:oldbutfeelingyoung wrote:James Amril-Kesh wrote:I'm not really sure whether insurance is an ISK faucet or an ISK sink. If nobody spent any ISK getting their ships insured then yes, it would be an ISK faucet because there's ISK entering the economy whenever someone gets their ship blown up. On the other hand if there are lots of pilots ensuring their ships beyond the default level but not getting those ships blown up at all, it's an ISK sink since the money for insurance is paid to an NPC entity.
Possible ideas to reduce ISK in the economy: Remove insurance payouts unless the pilot has explicitly ensured their ship Reduce NPC bounties in L4 missions, nerf vanguard payouts by ~5% Raise NPC corp taxes to 20-25% Change refining collaterals in highsec stations into monetary fees reduced by NPC corp standings you forgot : remove moon goo remove bigger roids in 0.0 none of these create isk tl;dr: you are dumb
no wanting to make 0.0 and low sec more interesting by nerfing high is dumb
Now and then ,you see quotes from people that the players make EvE as it is right now i guess you got what you wanted, so live with it If Dust has social areas ,then vanishing the blog is not an CCP decision ,but an all exclusive Sony decision |
Nicolo da'Vicenza
Divine Power. Cascade Imminent
1772
|
Posted - 2012.09.16 19:24:00 -
[87] - Quote
oldbutfeelingyoung wrote:[ no wanting to make 0.0 and low sec more interesting by nerfing high is dumb
Now and then ,you see quotes from people that the players make EvE as it is right now i guess you got what you wanted, so live with it look man I know you is a dumb but if you read the OP, you'll notice we're talking about making 0.0 and high interesting by nerfing large alliances
going by the OP's proposal, that means each NPC corp member gets fined "7.55 unquadragintillion" a week. Do you think that is sufficient? |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
9515
|
Posted - 2012.09.16 19:27:00 -
[88] - Quote
James Amril-Kesh wrote:I'm not really sure whether insurance is an ISK faucet or an ISK sink. It's a faucet. It would be pretty useless if it weren't.
The only way for it to be a sink is to make silly mistakes GÇö either forgetting that you have the ship insured and get CONCORDed, or constantly getting new policies without ever losing any ships (at which point anyone remotely sane will stop insuring their ships).
James Amril-Kesh wrote:lvl 5 missions: Okay, I don't really care about those, but I seriously doubt they contribute to inflation all that much L5s create very little ISK since the vast portion of the hard-coded rewards come in the form of LP, and cashing those in sinks more ISK than is gained from the agent rewards and bonuses. There are a few that also offer bounties, but that's a pretty negligible addition on the scale of things. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.
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oldbutfeelingyoung
Perkone Caldari State
698
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Posted - 2012.09.16 19:29:00 -
[89] - Quote
Nicolo da'Vicenza wrote:oldbutfeelingyoung wrote:[ no wanting to make 0.0 and low sec more interesting by nerfing high is dumb
Now and then ,you see quotes from people that the players make EvE as it is right now i guess you got what you wanted, so live with it look man I know you is a dumb but if you read the OP, you'll notice we're talking about making 0.0 and high interesting by nerfing large alliancesgoing by the OP's proposal, that means each NPC corp member gets fined "7.55 unquadragintillion" a week. Do you think that is sufficient?
i was not reacting to the OP ,so call me dumb i don,t care
about the OP proposal anything to bring down the size of an alliance and maybe (i said maybe) make Null more attractive to smaller corps and /or alliances ,i am all for it.
like i said i didn,t react on the OP but on some nerf the hell out of High reply If Dust has social areas ,then vanishing the blog is not an CCP decision ,but an all exclusive Sony decision |
Bully Hedro
Inner 5phere
29
|
Posted - 2012.09.16 19:33:00 -
[90] - Quote
They basically need to do 2 things.
1) use Dust 514 as a big sink where we pay Dust players to kill enemy planets for isk. They use the isk to buy NPC goods in the store.
or
2) rise Hi-sec taxes for more of an isk sink and to promote low and null sec.
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