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Entity	Posted - 2005.07.19 16:07:00 - [1] Edited by: Entity on 19/07/2005 16:10:08 Right, so there's these new pirate implants that add nice bonuses. So how do they work? This post is intended to disspell rumours and present you with verified facts on their behaviour. Q: Does the set bonus also affect the +2 or +3 character attributes of the implants? A: No, they do not. They are just the bog standard attribute buffs. Q: Can I mix low-grade with normal versions and still get the benefits? A: Yes, they mix, and the bonuses will be slightly better (or worse) accordingly. Q: Ok, so, what will my bonus be? A: This is the tricky part. Like most bonuses in this game, they are multiplicative, and the full set is quite something! Here is how it works: Multiply all "set bonus" multipliers together: multi = 1.15 x 1.15 x 1.15 x 1.15 x 1.15 x 1.5 = 3.01703578125 Note: the 1.5 comes from the 6th implant (Omega) Calculating final bonus: - Multiply each implant's special bonus (velocity, shield boost, armor, etc) percentage value with the combined set bonus multiplier calculated above. - Convert the result to a multiplier. - Multiply the five figures to get the final multiplier (which is the actual bonus). For the Snake, Crystal and Slave sets: Alpha = 1% x multi = 3.01703578125 = 1.0301703578125x Beta = 2% x multi = 6.03407156250 = 1.0603407156250x Delta = 3% x multi = 9.05110734375 = 1.0905110734375x Gamma = 4% x multi = 12.06814312500 = 1.1206814312500x Epsilon = 5% x multi = 15.08517890625 = 1.1508517890625x Total = Alpha x Beta x Gamma x Delta x Epsilon = 1.5363x = +53.63% For the Talisman set (this set reduces a figure, the multipliers are inversed!): Alpha = 1% x multi = 3.01703578125 = 0.9698296421875x Beta = 2% x multi = 6.03407156250 = 0.9396592843750x Delta = 3% x multi = 9.05110734375 = 0.9094889265625x Gamma = 4% x multi = 12.06814312500 = 0.8793185687500x Epsilon = 5% x multi = 15.08517890625 = 0.8491482109375x Total = Alpha x Beta x Gamma x Delta x Epsilon = 0.6188x = -38.12% For the Halo set (this set uses different figures and is also a reducing type): Alpha = 1.00% x multi = 3.01703578125 = 0.9698296421875x Beta = 1.25% x multi = 3.77129472656 = 0.9622870527344x Delta = 1.50% x multi = 4.52555367188 = 0.9547444632813x Gamma = 1.75% x multi = 5.27981261719 = 0.9472018738281x Epsilon = 2.00% x multi = 6.03407156250 = 0.9396592843750x Total = Alpha x Beta x Gamma x Delta x Epsilon = 0.7930x = -20.7% Notes: - Incomplete sets still give amplified bonus. E.g. one low-grade and one regular implant plus the regular omega would give a 1.1 x 1.15 x 1.5 = 1.8975 set bonus multiplier. - Mixed low-grade and regular implants yield figures somewhere between the low-grade and regular ones. - Some implants may be bugged on TQ, not having the correct set bonus or simply not working at all. My calculations are based on properly working implants, so don't be alarmed if the values presented here do not match what you are getting ;-) - A freshly inserted pirate implant does not show the correct amplified bonus figure. Relog to see the correct stats.
Entity	Posted - 2005.07.19 16:08:00 - [2] SUMMARY Regular sets: Snake: 53.63% velocity and smuggling chance bonus Slave: 53.63% armor hp bonus Crystal: 53.63% shield boost bonus Talisman: -38.12% energy emission systems duration bonus Halo: -20.7% signature radius bonus Low-grade sets: Snake: 33.83% velocity and smuggling chance bonus Slave: 33.83% armor hp bonus Crystal: 33.83% shield boost bonus Talisman: -26.94% energy emission systems duration bonus Halo: -14.3% signature radius bonus Hope this is useful for you.
Meridius	Posted - 2005.07.19 16:15:00 - [3] Edited by: Meridius on 19/07/2005 16:14:44 <3 ________________________________________________________
Ralitge boyter	Posted - 2005.07.19 16:18:00 - [4] Whow thats a great bit of info, I feel a sticky comming here.
JoBlack	Posted - 2005.07.19 16:23:00 - [5] Originally by: Meridius Edited by: Meridius on 19/07/2005 16:14:44 <3 QFE
X'Alor	Posted - 2005.07.19 16:23:00 - [6] So it DOES work as I/we suspected. can you do a calc and verify the full low grade set using the high grade 50% omega (crystal specifically) from the other thread.......... multiplicative % bonus on same % boost as high grade and low grade implants of same set. The high grade gives a higher secondary bonus to the same base bonus as low grades. Full low grade set = 33% bonus(including slot 6) full set standards = 53% bonus(including slot 6) interesting point, it's the secondary % that makes the high grade so much better but you are still only boosting the same base bonus. the low grades give an additional 10% bonus to ALL other set implants of that set. 50% total boost for set bonus plus the slot 6 low grade omega = 75% total boost to bonus on same base boost stats as the high grades. The high grades or +3 set implants give 15% to all others in that set. 75% total for set bonus + 50% high grade omega for a 125% total boost bonus for set for same base state. the high grade set without the slot 6 should be = to the low grade set including the slot 6 low grade implant so a lowgrade set + high grade omega yeilds a 100% bonus to implant set bonus which = to the high grade set using low grade slot 6 omega just trying to maximize my ingame ISK is all.

Vanamonde	Posted - 2005.07.19 16:45:00 - [7] Stickeh! (for a bit). EVE Forum Rules

Darth Revanant	Posted - 2005.07.19 17:04:00 - [8] X'Alor - I'm hoping it works that way too. But the +3's would still be slightly better due to the +15% to all other implants from all other implants instead of the 10%. CBA to do the math, but the +3's should still be marginally better with that bonus, plus they're still +3 attribute enhancers, not +2. Entity - I'm guessing you did this on Sisi? I think experimenting in mixing the sets would be quite expensive otherwise. Could you confirm this? Actually I did do the math: Full set of low grade with high grade omega: 1.1 x 1.1 x 1.1 x 1.1 x 1.1 x 1.5 = 2.415765 mulitplier Alpha = 1% x multi = 2.415765 = 1.02415765x Beta = 2% x multi = 4.83153 = 1.0483153x Delta = 3% x multi = 7.247295 = 1.07247295x Gamma = 4% x multi = 9.66306 = 1.0966306x Epsilon = 5% x multi = 12.078825 = 1.12078825x Total = Alpha x Beta x Gamma x Delta x Epsilon = 1.415236x = +41.52% So better than all low-grade, but still well below the +3's. _________________
Larno	Posted - 2005.07.19 17:16:00 - [9] Woah... so +53.63% shield boost bonus with the Crystal set. Slightly overpowered compared to the other sets I think.
Entity	Posted - 2005.07.19 17:28:00 - [10] Originally by: Darth Revanant Entity - I'm guessing you did this on Sisi? I think experimenting in mixing the sets would be quite expensive otherwise. Could you confirm this? A bit of evidence gathering from both Sisi and TQ, yes. Your calc is correct.
X'Alor	Posted - 2005.07.19 17:41:00 - [11] agreed and goes without saying "all" the high grade + 3 implants will be better than low grade + 50% high grade omega. I'm curious what the difference would be of all low grade + high grade 50% omega vs high grade + low grade 25% omega. they should be within about a half of a percent of each other and guesstimated it about 43% bonus bouncing numbers about my brain just doing rough percentages they work out to be the exact same boost to base stat bonus. your talking 400 mill for low grades set + slot 6 and a bill for the high grades not including the omega +50%. I'm thinkin for affect boost and $$$$$ spent, I'm good with 42% boost and that one atty point really doesn't make that big a difference with my chars training at this time. your talking the difference between a 35 day train or a 37 day train. not saying they gotta change or anything needs changing but seems all low grade should be 1,2,3,4,5 and all high grade boosted 1 extra percent at base 2,3,4,5,6 to help substantiate the added cost of the high grades being 150 mill or more each and the high grade omegas as high as 300mill. the low grades seem relatively readily available too. the high grades not so. and the low grade complete crystal set is like adding another midslot to my existing raven and dedicating to a named shield boost amp for free with no grid or power reqs unaffected by stacking penalty. I'm sooooooooo good with that. BTW WTB One unit of low grade crystal gamma for 75 mill. Message me ingame anytime and we'll work out some safe space hub to escrow it at. that's spot on average for the middle percent boosted implant.
X'Alor	Posted - 2005.07.19 18:49:00 - [12] Kinda like the idea of mix and matching too. using the 1, 2, 3% armor hitpont ones and then using the 4 and 5% shield boost ones and using the slot 6 50% omega to shield boosting too. Gives ya 3 bonuses to the 3 slave used and you get 50% ontop of the 20 or 30% boosted shild boost % pending which ones ya use. Also combining the speed boost with the sig boost ones for small ships could be very very interesting. If your gonna combine ya gotta go with the +3's however. Can already see the hey that's not fair threads gonna come out with these however. What each set does for cap efficiency and primary uses. AKA shield boosting bonus vs straight up armor hitpoints. Granted 53% armor hitpoint bonus is HUGH but it doesn't change the fact that it has absolutely no bonus to the cap to sustain that armor. where as 53% booster bonus has everything to due with cap efficiency for said shield tankers. looks like this is one anti amarr ftw. although still not bad bonus. As far as these go in regard to what they do for cap use I'd say they go shield boost most valuable. speed boost next not sure about the next two but the armor hit point ones definitely last.
Soren	Posted - 2005.07.19 18:54:00 - [13] ntt 4tw? thanks _________________________________________________________
Sangxianc	Posted - 2005.07.19 20:55:00 - [14] I wouldn't say the armour bonus ones were useless. A Taranis with a 400mm Rolled Tungsten, Hull Upgrades 5, and Low Grade Slave full set would have over 2k armour. Thorax with 1600mm RT + Hull Upgrades 5 + Low Grade Slave set would have over 7k armour. It's the Dark Blood ones that got the shaft, they should have given them a Webby activation range bonus or something like that in my opinion. - Any man's death diminishes me, as I am involved in mankinde; And therefore never send to know for whom the bell tolls; It tolls for thee.
Joshua Foiritain	Posted - 2005.07.20 11:34:00 - [15] Originally by: Sangxianc I wouldn't say the armour bonus ones were useless. A Taranis with a 400mm Rolled Tungsten, Hull Upgrades 5, and Low Grade Slave full set would have over 2k armour. Thorax with 1600mm RT + Hull Upgrades 5 + Low Grade Slave set would have over 7k armour. It's the Dark Blood ones that got the shaft, they should have given them a Webby activation range bonus or something like that in my opinion. Hmm extra range to webbers (and nos?) would be HOT ------------------ [WTT: Vigilant]
X'Alor	Posted - 2005.07.20 13:30:00 - [16] think that would be hot. how bout having that with a highly skilled cruiser pilot in that blood faction cruiser(i think) that gets the bonus to nos' ........ and then add them implants. now that would be hot. WTB One unit of low grade crystal gamma for 75 mill. Message me ingame anytime and we'll work out some safe space hub to escrow it at.
Elfaen Ethenwe	Posted - 2005.07.21 09:03:00 - [17] omg, i so want the crystal sets <->-<->-<->-<->-<->-<->-<->-<->-<->-<->-<-> Together we Gank, Divided we Pop. <->-<->-<->-<->-<->-<->-<->-<->-<->-<->-<->
Lagar	Posted - 2005.07.21 14:21:00 - [18] about the Talisman implant Set: even tho the total amount of cap transfered will be increased the total cap used will increase acordinly. that's why this setup is only recomended for guardian logistic ships
Uglious	Posted - 2005.07.21 15:07:00 - [19] Currently, it appears the low-grade halo gamma implant is broken, and doesn't give any sig radius bonus. This has been reported as a bug.
X'Alor	Posted - 2005.07.21 18:48:00 - [20] Appears (so I'm told ) crystal set is AOK. Some numbers to fancy and some skill lvls that relate...... regarding crystals low grade. Pilot at all relevant engineering, shield skills, and power skills at 5. all repair skills at 5. shield comp 4 Using raven with. 6 seige/ and whatever you can fit gun wise XL T2/dual basic amps/dual hardeners/Cap Recharger 2 5 PDU 2's Low grade crystal set minus the slot 6 hardwire either size. Can have booster on auto repeat and activate 30 times before eating thru your cap capacity no prob. 2 min 30 sec with everything running. Activation cost of T2 XL 368 with lvl 4 shield comp setup repairs 1179.7 per activation(1180) every 5 seconds with low grade set. 30*1180 = 35,400 hitpoints repaired 35,400/150sec = 236 HP repaired per second taking into account recharge rates of said setup installing the high grade slot 6 50% hardwire should bring that setup without a change to about 285 HP per second repaired and guestimating that to be around 1425/1430 hitpoints repiared per activation. USING THE LOW GRADE SET so I'm told And not using any named amps or high end boosters. now think with two 39.5% boost amps and a pith x type xl booster and the full high grade set. Boy the idea of 2000 hitpoints repaired per activation starts bouncing about me brain and relatively easy with full high grade crystal set and an average of around 500HP repaired every second. Someone will do it and I hope I aint gotta shoot at it.
Lagar	Posted - 2005.07.22 12:33:00 - [21] the set implants are giving big bonuses... but remember it's beceause they are a SET IMPLANT... those kind of things are indevidualy weak but with every part of them.. they are VERY powerfull... that's why i thing the curent implant sets are fair.. after all.. the cost should be extreme after all :)
Drofier Ilmatti	Posted - 2005.07.22 18:03:00 - [22] I love it . Anyone interested in a complete low-grade crystal set? This makes me SOO temped to plug it in....
Illvin Bujold	Posted - 2005.07.24 12:56:00 - [23] I'd like to point out to those not already aware, that pirate implants drop from named npc pirates out in 0.0 space. (I have seen this personally.) 'I was gratified to be able to answer promptly, and I did. I said I didn't know.' ùMARK TWAIN
Darth Revanant	Posted - 2005.07.24 17:33:00 - [24] Good to know, thanks. Is that the only way though? Are they not pirate agent offers too? _________________
Faster ThanJesus	Posted - 2005.07.24 17:41:00 - [25] Edited by: Faster ThanJesus on 24/07/2005 17:42:34 Originally by: X'Alor Appears (so I'm told ) crystal set is AOK. Some numbers to fancy and some skill lvls that relate...... regarding crystals low grade. Pilot at all relevant engineering, shield skills, and power skills at 5. all repair skills at 5. shield comp 4 Using raven with. 6 seige/ and whatever you can fit gun wise XL T2/dual basic amps/dual hardeners/Cap Recharger 2 5 PDU 2's Low grade crystal set minus the slot 6 hardwire either size. Can have booster on auto repeat and activate 30 times before eating thru your cap capacity no prob. 2 min 30 sec with everything running. Activation cost of T2 XL 368 with lvl 4 shield comp setup repairs 1179.7 per activation(1180) every 5 seconds with low grade set. 30*1180 = 35,400 hitpoints repaired 35,400/150sec = 236 HP repaired per second taking into account recharge rates of said setup installing the high grade slot 6 50% hardwire should bring that setup without a change to about 285 HP per second repaired and guestimating that to be around 1425/1430 hitpoints repiared per activation. USING THE LOW GRADE SET so I'm told And not using any named amps or high end boosters. now think with two 39.5% boost amps and a pith x type xl booster and the full high grade set. Boy the idea of 2000 hitpoints repaired per activation starts bouncing about me brain and relatively easy with full high grade crystal set and an average of around 500HP repaired every second. Someone will do it and I hope I aint gotta shoot at it. Currently I've got a Gist X-Type with 1 standard amp (I'm going to upgrade on this at some point) and the crystal alpha, beta, delta and epsilon implants at low grade: The return is: 1051.2188058926212336314 per cycle (4s). I've not decided yet whether to go with 1 amp and 3 hardeners or 2 amps and 2 hardeners. I've also got the low grade epsilon but need to wait for cybernetics V to train (another 11 days ) Quite rediculous - I will have to spend on a couple of Pith X-type amps I think. We should start a new competition for shield boosters (like the passive tankers) to see who can get the most insane boost amount.
Drofier Ilmatti	Posted - 2005.07.25 02:41:00 - [26] Faster - Once you get that epsilon in, I recommend a standard Crystal Omega, not low-grade. You'll not get 36.83% as the low-grade omega would give, but a 41.52% Bonus . Happy huntin.
DigitalCommunist	Posted - 2005.07.25 04:44:00 - [27] Edited by: DigitalCommunist on 25/07/2005 04:45:36 Oh my god.. Atm I have +5's, if anyone manages to pod me I'm switching over to Snake implants.. I got some drugs to move. And the thought of 2.5km/s Megathron = lolololol edit: <3 _____________________________________ Perpetually driven, your end is our beginning.
Yeux Gris	Posted - 2005.07.25 11:12:00 - [28] Originally by: Illvin Bujold I'd like to point out to those not already aware, that pirate implants drop from named npc pirates out in 0.0 space. (I have seen this personally.) They Drop from officers too :) I have gotten two this way.
Lord Morkoth	Posted - 2005.08.01 02:56:00 - [29] well a cn raven with: 1 gist x type xl sb 1 gist x type amp 4 gist x type hards full crystal set + that 50% thingy: makes me wanna cry. Uber low cap useage, with 5 or 4 pdus t2 it can be on auto forever and boost something crazy per cycle. With high resistances and 11k shield hp this is pure overkill. We are The Collective. Resistance is futile.
rippz4ever	Posted - 2005.08.01 15:48:00 - [30] What would a "Low-grade Snake Delta" be worth? I just happenend to get one last night :-)

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