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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 12 post(s) |
Neal Altol
desolate fools
6
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Posted - 2013.04.03 16:49:00 -
[91] - Quote
Dracvlad wrote:Nikk Narrel wrote:Trivial is still more than zero.
Take baby steps before giant leaps are considered.
You may be surprised to learn a great many players have no idea what you are talking about, and believe the game is intended to be zero effort. The instant gratification crowd, lol, well funny enough watching local is not trival, for example I was leadership level, so had to deal with other corpies, then I was ratting in the carrier, supported by another toon on Frigate killing duties, so was assigning fighters, repping when needed, replying to corpies in chat and on TS. While keeping an eye on local, people who never PvE have sort of contempt for this, but really it takes concentration. So in terms of playing Eve that is not trival. Of course the carrier is aligned to a POS and as soon as something arrives in local I fleet warp, but at times I have not picked up the neut in local immediately, but as I was aligned it still resulted in a frustrated ganker. Sometimes of course I have my other toon on a gate, and of course I have to check channels, intel being the most urgent one. You say no effort, well keeping an eye on local is actually more difficult then sitting there using Dotlan and the in game map for target selection, I bet your fully focussed on that unlike my partial eye on local... I guess I am splitting hairs, but at the end of the say, if we remove Eve to make its a big dark place go the entire hog, not half hearted that will result in no carebear targets at all, or only stupid ones...
first time I've heard the argument that keeping an eye on local is hard. the thing flashes when it changes sounds like a fail at multitasking. |
Nikk Narrel
Infinite Improbability Inc Unclaimed.
1583
|
Posted - 2013.04.03 17:08:00 -
[92] - Quote
Dracvlad wrote:Nikk Narrel wrote:Trivial is still more than zero.
Take baby steps before giant leaps are considered.
You may be surprised to learn a great many players have no idea what you are talking about, and believe the game is intended to be zero effort. The instant gratification crowd, lol, well funny enough watching local is not trival, for example I was leadership level, so had to deal with other corpies, then I was ratting in the carrier, supported by another toon on Frigate killing duties, so was assigning fighters, repping when needed, replying to corpies in chat and on TS. While keeping an eye on local, people who never PvE have sort of contempt for this, but really it takes concentration. So in terms of playing Eve that is not trival. Of course the carrier is aligned to a POS and as soon as something arrives in local I fleet warp, but at times I have not picked up the neut in local immediately, but as I was aligned it still resulted in a frustrated ganker. Sometimes of course I have my other toon on a gate, and of course I have to check channels, intel being the most urgent one. You say no effort, well keeping an eye on local is actually more difficult then sitting there using Dotlan and the in game map for target selection, I bet your fully focussed on that unlike my partial eye on local... I guess I am splitting hairs, but at the end of the say, if we remove Eve to make its a big dark place go the entire hog, not half hearted that will result in no carebear targets at all, or only stupid ones... I am a miner.
Because I am hunted by those who use local to easily spot me in system, I need to use it to counter their use of it. This is basically dumbing it down, since any effort I might be willing to make can never compare with the ease and flawless nature of local.
I want to compete, and have the guy in the next system die horribly because he did not go to the same effort I did. The hunters pass me by simply because he is easier to find, and I am not worth the effort by comparison. That is competition in PvE. Cloaking being on a ten minute manual cycle timer? (Author: Bree Okanata) Fine. As long as there is a ten minute timer for being docked in a station. Also, you can't stop moving in the game. Just add in a way so every ten minutes you are randomly warped to the nearest other player. Keeps people from going AFK. |
Dracvlad
Taishi Combine
61
|
Posted - 2013.04.03 18:51:00 -
[93] - Quote
Neal Altol wrote:Dracvlad wrote:Nikk Narrel wrote:Trivial is still more than zero.
Take baby steps before giant leaps are considered.
You may be surprised to learn a great many players have no idea what you are talking about, and believe the game is intended to be zero effort. The instant gratification crowd, lol, well funny enough watching local is not trival, for example I was leadership level, so had to deal with other corpies, then I was ratting in the carrier, supported by another toon on Frigate killing duties, so was assigning fighters, repping when needed, replying to corpies in chat and on TS. While keeping an eye on local, people who never PvE have sort of contempt for this, but really it takes concentration. So in terms of playing Eve that is not trival. Of course the carrier is aligned to a POS and as soon as something arrives in local I fleet warp, but at times I have not picked up the neut in local immediately, but as I was aligned it still resulted in a frustrated ganker. Sometimes of course I have my other toon on a gate, and of course I have to check channels, intel being the most urgent one. You say no effort, well keeping an eye on local is actually more difficult then sitting there using Dotlan and the in game map for target selection, I bet your fully focussed on that unlike my partial eye on local... I guess I am splitting hairs, but at the end of the say, if we remove Eve to make its a big dark place go the entire hog, not half hearted that will result in no carebear targets at all, or only stupid ones... first time I've heard the argument that keeping an eye on local is hard. the thing flashes when it changes sounds like a fail at multitasking.
Perhaps you should read it again, I was comparing it to checking for targets using Dotlan and the in game map, -1 for reading comprehension... |
Neal Altol
desolate fools
7
|
Posted - 2013.04.03 20:41:00 -
[94] - Quote
Dracvlad wrote:
watching local is not trival,
While keeping an eye on local, people who never PvE have sort of contempt for this, but really it takes concentration.
You say no effort, well keeping an eye on local is actually more difficult then sitting there using Dotlan and the in game map for target selection,
um you fail at multitasking and think watching local is hard and not trivial
|
Teckos Pech
The Executives Executive Outcomes
65
|
Posted - 2013.04.04 06:46:00 -
[95] - Quote
Bump.... |
Dracvlad
Taishi Combine
61
|
Posted - 2013.04.04 08:42:00 -
[96] - Quote
Neal Altol wrote:Dracvlad wrote:
watching local is not trival,
While keeping an eye on local, people who never PvE have sort of contempt for this, but really it takes concentration.
You say no effort, well keeping an eye on local is actually more difficult then sitting there using Dotlan and the in game map for target selection,
um you fail at multitasking and think watching local is hard and not trivial
Still think you fail at reading and comprehension, it was a comparison between the two tasks and highlighting the effect of multi-tasking, but if you want to take it that way be my guest! |
TheGunslinger42
All Web Investigations
1169
|
Posted - 2013.04.04 10:50:00 -
[97] - Quote
Dracvlad wrote:well funny enough watching local is not trival
started laughing at this
by the time I got to the part where you said it was more difficult than using other intel tools, including dotlan, to figure out whether there is activity in other systems (let alone who specifically - dotlan isn't instant, doesn't flash, doesn't show the nice blue and red squares, doesn't show character names, etc) my sides were so split you could mistake them for the eve gate |
Neal Altol
desolate fools
8
|
Posted - 2013.04.04 17:25:00 -
[98] - Quote
TheGunslinger42 wrote:Dracvlad wrote:well funny enough watching local is not trival started laughing at this by the time I got to the part where you said it was more difficult than using other intel tools, including dotlan, to figure out whether there is activity in other systems (let alone who specifically - dotlan isn't instant, doesn't flash, doesn't show the nice blue and red squares, doesn't show character names, etc) my sides were so split you could mistake them for the eve gate
This 100 times this.
also bump |
Teckos Pech
The Executives Executive Outcomes
72
|
Posted - 2013.04.05 17:56:00 -
[99] - Quote
Egads...3 pages down.
Bump! |
Teckos Pech
The Executives Executive Outcomes
76
|
Posted - 2013.04.06 18:55:00 -
[100] - Quote
back up on top.... |
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Alvatore DiMarco
Capricious Endeavours Ltd
69
|
Posted - 2013.04.07 00:42:00 -
[101] - Quote
This thread is about to dip to Page 2. I have a suggestion for a new idea:
A post at the end of this thread to bump it back to the top.
I think I'll implement this idea myself. Immediately. |
Alx Warlord
SUPERNOVA SOCIETY
389
|
Posted - 2013.04.07 03:41:00 -
[102] - Quote
keep this always updated!!! awesome idea!!! Please read this! > New POS system (Block Built) Please read this! > Refining and Reprocess Revamp |
Teckos Pech
The Executives Executive Outcomes
83
|
Posted - 2013.04.07 17:59:00 -
[103] - Quote
Bump... |
Teckos Pech
The Executives Executive Outcomes
84
|
Posted - 2013.04.08 05:12:00 -
[104] - Quote
Bump.... |
Lord Battlestar
CALIMA COLLABORATIVE Atrox Urbanis Respublique Abundatia
34
|
Posted - 2013.04.08 05:19:00 -
[105] - Quote
Love this thread! I once podded myself by blowing a huge fart. |
Azrael Dinn
The 20th Legion Mildly Sober
78
|
Posted - 2013.04.08 12:44:00 -
[106] - Quote
And whats behind curtain number 1?
This:
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=223576&find=unread |
Alvatore DiMarco
Capricious Endeavours Ltd
72
|
Posted - 2013.04.08 14:03:00 -
[107] - Quote
Dear ISDs:
Please just sticky this thread already. It can only be beneficial.
Signed, Features & Ideas Posters |
Teckos Pech
The Executives Executive Outcomes
85
|
Posted - 2013.04.09 06:46:00 -
[108] - Quote
Bump |
Dracvlad
Taishi Combine
63
|
Posted - 2013.04.09 11:50:00 -
[109] - Quote
Rumpy Bumpy |
Omnathious Deninard
Extrinsic Operations
826
|
Posted - 2013.04.09 13:59:00 -
[110] - Quote
This seemed to fall back to page 2, back up to the top. Ideas For Drone Improvement Updated 11/30/12Catastrophic Uprising is Recruiting |
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Tchulen
Trumpets and Bookmarks The Omega Industries
294
|
Posted - 2013.04.09 14:04:00 -
[111] - Quote
Bump
Would be easier on everyone if this was sticky (hint hint) |
Teckos Pech
The Executives Executive Outcomes
89
|
Posted - 2013.04.10 20:03:00 -
[112] - Quote
Bump.... |
Lucien Visteen
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
131
|
Posted - 2013.04.10 20:14:00 -
[113] - Quote
Damn you for beating me to the bump! Here I was trying to do good, sigh. Guess that is what I get for taking a long time to post.
Since you also want to keep the legion contained in one place allow me to add to this cesspool from here.
Please keep in mind that the suggestions mentioned below are work in progress and should be wieved as a whole. For that reason I will for now only give a very basic presentation.
TL:DR at bottom of the post.
Hate it, dislike it, be neutral about it. It don't really matter to me at this stage and If you want to flame it, fine, but please be constructive about it. Have questions about it or want me to elaborate then respond and I will do it to the best of my abilities.
Changes to the chat.
Local should be set to only show players in your alliance, chatting is also filtered to display the chatting of your alliance only. New channel introduced for constellation. Like npc corp chat will show number of players in the chat (constellation), friend and foe, but will not show playerportrait unless player has typed in it.
Posibilities.
Local will show number of players in the system. This in regards to the gates tracking you traveling to and from the system.
Ships entering or leaving through wormhole accesspoints will not be added to or subdracted from the number of people in the system, since they did not enter or leave via a gate.
Possible current change for cloak.
Spec ops cloak will, during 10 seconds after going out of gate cloak, not reveal player on grid.
Tech 2 cloak will, during 6 seconds after going out of gate cloak, not reveal player on grid.
Future possible cloak changes.
spec ops cloak. 2 stage system. Passive and active cloaking. Passive cloaking remove player-position and information on grid. Active cloaking hides ship aswell.
tech 2 cloak. 2 stage system. Passive and active cloaking. passive cloaking hides player-postition and information on grid. Active cloaking hides ship for 60 min. (+15 mins per level in cloaking)
tech 1 cloak. 2 stage system. Passive and active cloaking. Passive cloaking hides player position on grid. Active cloaking hides ship for 30 min (+7min30sek. per level in cloaking)
Change I would like to see for spec ops class ships (cosmetic). Ventet thrusters.
Counter.
scanner module. Maybe high or mid slot.
Gives dscan ability to pick up cloak signature on grid. Will show ship type if cloaked ship is within scan radius. 10 sek cooldown between each scan (-1 sek per level in scanning) and a 20 sek calibration delay (-2 sek per level in scanning)
Possible future counter.
Ship class with spesific scanning role, or a tech 2 variant of the module, adding further reductions in the time needed for calibration and/or scanning cooldown.
Defensive deployable. Needs launcher.
A deployable that can detect a hostile lock and will then begin a countermeasure to "steal" the first volley aimed at the target the deployable belongs too. The deployable WILL be destroyed after the first volley no matter the amount of damage projected. The deploable can not be picked up or reused, and only one can be used per player at a time. The deployable will be visible on grid for 2 minutes after launch. After that time it will activate a cloak of its own.
The defensive deployable can stay active for 14 min. (+4 min. per level in the deployable skill) After it has expired a new will have to be launched
TL:DR A series of suggestions to change the staus quo. I would like it if you read the whole thing.
The ships hung in the sky in much the same way that bricks don't. |
Nikk Narrel
Infinite Improbability Inc Unclaimed.
1626
|
Posted - 2013.04.10 20:24:00 -
[114] - Quote
Lucien Visteen wrote:Defensive deployable. Needs launcher.
A deployable that can detect a hostile lock and will then begin a countermeasure to "steal" the first volley aimed at the target the deployable belongs too. The deployable WILL be destroyed after the first volley no matter the amount of damage projected. The deploable can not be picked up or reused, and only one can be used per player at a time. The deployable will be visible on grid for 2 minutes after launch. After that time it will activate a cloak of its own.
The defensive deployable can stay active for 14 min. (+4 min. per level in the deployable skill) After it has expired a new will have to be launched I kinda think this one has potential.
As to the changes to local and cloaking changes, I still think the two threads I created for each respectively detail a more logical approach. Remember, nothing balances anything better than a duplicate. Cloaking being on a ten minute manual cycle timer? (Author: Bree Okanata) Fine. As long as there is a ten minute timer for being docked in a station. Also, you can't stop moving in the game. Just add in a way so every ten minutes you are randomly warped to the nearest other player. Keeps people from going AFK. |
Lucien Visteen
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
131
|
Posted - 2013.04.10 21:52:00 -
[115] - Quote
Nikk Narrel wrote:Lucien Visteen wrote:Defensive deployable. Needs launcher.
A deployable that can detect a hostile lock and will then begin a countermeasure to "steal" the first volley aimed at the target the deployable belongs too. The deployable WILL be destroyed after the first volley no matter the amount of damage projected. The deploable can not be picked up or reused, and only one can be used per player at a time. The deployable will be visible on grid for 2 minutes after launch. After that time it will activate a cloak of its own.
The defensive deployable can stay active for 14 min. (+4 min. per level in the deployable skill) After it has expired a new will have to be launched I kinda think this one has potential. As to the changes to local and cloaking changes, I still think the two threads I created for each respectively detail a more logical approach. Remember, nothing balances anything better than a duplicate.
Thank you for the feedback.
I read through your suggestions despite what you, and others, may think and I can agree to the notion that coming up with a good balance is... dificult. Having cloaked, "poss'ed" and docked pilots prevented from seeing whats in the chat in return for their respective invulnerables (or states) is interresting and fair, but I wonder about the coding of it.
Having a ship that can actively hunt cloakies would be lots of fun, and may add a mutch neede ship role. I have an idea or two about sutch a ship myself and I may, or may not present that too, depending on feedback here. I don't want to yet, since they are very easy to get wrong, and I want to have a good grasp on what can be considered good balance.
I personally want to do away with the local as a potential for intel altogether and keep it as an alliance/corp chat, the possible suggestions are depending on feedback, and are subject to change.
With these current suggestions no one will benefit from local at all. While giving cloaks a bypass through gate camps. And have an on grid defense for spec ops ships. Please correct me if im wrong, but only spec ops ships, with their cloak module can warp cloaked after all. And I feel these might be the easiest to code. I don't mind if you disect my suggestions and tell me exactly why you think I am wrong, or why its a bad balance, and I do take it into account.
I may try to defend it though
An addition to the deployable aswell. Incase people desides to get picky. It only repsonds to the agression of ships fitted with a cloak. The ships hung in the sky in much the same way that bricks don't. |
The Baby-sitter
Vitriol Ventures Tribal Band
2
|
Posted - 2013.04.10 22:26:00 -
[116] - Quote
CCP does not see this as a problem so they won't fix it! |
Hideyoshi Kinoshita
Celestial.Beings. United Coalition of New Eden
4
|
Posted - 2013.04.10 22:53:00 -
[117] - Quote
personally, i will give cloak device a timer like the mining laser. It takes a long time to cycle but you can cancel it at any moment. However, you can't auto repeat it. A further nerf will be having a de-cloak cool down timer.
Or just remove the cloaky dude from the local channel just joking |
Teckos Pech
The Executives Executive Outcomes
90
|
Posted - 2013.04.10 23:14:00 -
[118] - Quote
Hideyoshi Kinoshita wrote:personally, i will give cloak device a timer like the mining laser. It takes a long time to cycle but you can cancel it at any moment. However, you can't auto repeat it. A further nerf will be having a de-cloak cool down timer.
Or just remove the cloaky dude from the local channel just joking
The last one will absolutely solve the afk cloaking issue. No need to afk cloak in that case.
Just saying.
|
Lucien Visteen
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
131
|
Posted - 2013.04.11 15:53:00 -
[119] - Quote
The Baby-sitter wrote:CCP does not see this as a problem so they won't fix it!
I beg to differ The ships hung in the sky in much the same way that bricks don't. |
Teckos Pech
The Executives Executive Outcomes
91
|
Posted - 2013.04.11 17:42:00 -
[120] - Quote
Lucien Visteen wrote:The Baby-sitter wrote:CCP does not see this as a problem so they won't fix it! I beg to differ
Well, it seems they wont simply make cloaks have a timer or use fuel. Can you agree that those posts are stupid and a waste of time?
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