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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 28 post(s) |
James Draekn
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Posted - 2005.10.29 23:05:00 -
[481]
Tuxford, is it possible to reduce the signature radius of all the destroyers so that they are closer to a frigates signature radius. This would make them more effective when fighting in fleet engagments.
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FalloutBoy
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Posted - 2005.10.30 05:58:00 -
[482]
Originally by: Joerd Toastius
Originally by: Diana Merris FalloutBoy: I think you are missing the point that the Tristan is the top of the line Gallente frigate not the Incursus. You are making an invalid comparison. Unfortunately there really isn't a way to compare the Incursus properly because the other races all have a missile boat as the second line assault frigate.
I think that's kinda the point - the fact that it isn't an alternative weapons layout frig relegates it to second-class status as there's no reason to use it over the Tristan
actually the tristan is a peace of **** and would still choose the incursus over it every time
need a sig? Gallery Contact me for more info |
Kestral 666
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Posted - 2005.10.30 07:23:00 -
[483]
No offence, but the Incursus is the top of the line gall frig, thats why the enyo is based off it, The tristan is the "missile" boat, hence why the nemisis is based off it
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Takigama
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Posted - 2005.10.30 08:54:00 -
[484]
this is probably coming in a bit late, but, i really think there should be a missile-based destroyer as part of mk2 seeing as missiles are now more in-line with guns..
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O'Sirius
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Posted - 2005.10.30 09:37:00 -
[485]
Originally by: Takigama this is probably coming in a bit late, but, i really think there should be a missile-based destroyer as part of mk2 seeing as missiles are now more in-line with guns..
In line? I'm Amarr and I would say they're more like "under" the line of guns. Rockets and Torps seem to be the only good ones. Maybe lights.
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Nafri
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Posted - 2005.10.30 09:52:00 -
[486]
Originally by: Kestral 666 No offence, but the Incursus is the top of the line gall frig, thats why the enyo is based off it, The tristan is the "missile" boat, hence why the nemisis is based off it
Nope, gallente just got a dedicated gun boat instead of a missle boat. Tristan ist still their top frigate. --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Put your panties on your head! |
Ithildin
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Posted - 2005.10.30 10:06:00 -
[487]
Originally by: Nafri
Originally by: Kestral 666 No offence, but the Incursus is the top of the line gall frig, thats why the enyo is based off it, The tristan is the "missile" boat, hence why the nemisis is based off it
Nope, gallente just got a dedicated gun boat instead of a missle boat. Tristan ist still their top frigate.
Very much correct, mate.
Gemini (as in the ships we had BEFORE interceptors came out) ships are very linear - the one with the most hit points is the one with the highest cost, and also the one that's the highest in the tier. Tristan is, for some odd reason as it's a missile-ish boat, the top tier Gal frigate. That the Incursus is in many ways much better is an entirely different story.
T2 hulls are chosen from style and feel rather than tier. For example, the Vigil is Minmatar highest tier 2 ship (compared to the other races Minnies don't have two tier 3s) and behaves exactly like the lower tier 3 of the other races. However, since it was styled as a electronics frigate and since it looked EW-ish it became the hull for the Cheetah.
Don't fight in Jita. That system is bugged to hell and back. The most unusual things can happen there. |
HippoKing
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Posted - 2005.10.30 13:12:00 -
[488]
faction ship stats please?
if they have already been posted, i apologise, but 19 pages is quite a lot.
and now the merlin and worm both have 4mids. the worm needs another advantage please --
This Zig. For great justice! |
keepiru
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Posted - 2005.10.30 13:19:00 -
[489]
Edited by: keepiru on 30/10/2005 13:19:43
Originally by: HippoKing faction ship stats please?
if they have already been posted, i apologise, but 19 pages is quite a lot.
and now the merlin and worm both have 4mids. the worm needs another advantage please
Um yeah. And uh... could you decrease the succubus' mass to less than an assault frigate's? Pretty please with sugar and cream?
edit: And increase its cap, as it used to have better cap than the punisher... -------------
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Lia Jjaro
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Posted - 2005.10.30 19:03:00 -
[490]
Originally by: James Draekn Tuxford, is it possible to reduce the signature radius of all the destroyers so that they are closer to a frigates signature radius. This would make them more effective when fighting in fleet engagments.
Don't expect a reply, about half a dozen people have asked the same thing about Battlecruiser sig radius reduction and received no reply. ---------------------
Yes, I'm an alt. Bite me. |
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Malachi Nefzen
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Posted - 2005.10.30 19:44:00 -
[491]
leave the eagles bonus as is
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Sarmaul
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Posted - 2005.10.30 20:21:00 -
[492]
Originally by: Tuxford
Rifter
- Poweroutput increased to 37MW
- Max velocity increased to 320m/s
- Max velocity bonus replaced with 5% tracking per level
- Added a low slot
- Added a med slot
/emote makes sweet man-love to Tuxford all night long
Originally by: Chowdown We camp a lot
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Trelennen
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Posted - 2005.10.30 22:38:00 -
[493]
Edited by: Trelennen on 30/10/2005 22:40:30
Originally by: Malachi Nefzen leave the eagles bonus as is
Well, why don't you want eagle to get a boost? You want to still be able to whine by saying caldari HACs sucks after MK2?
I hope you do realize (as demonstrated several times) that 5% resist all / level is much better than 5% shield boost? To be more exact, if you compare ships that are permanently boosting, you need a 7.5% boost bonus to be on par with the 5% resist all (that's why brutix and cyclone had their boost/repair bonus increased to 7.5% when the other two get resist bonus, but still gallente/matari ask for brutix/cyclone to get a res bonus too instead of this increased boost/repair bonus...). Maybe you just need a clue about game mechanics?
(large sb 2 + amp gives 78/s - 60/s + 30% - when running, then 25% boost bonus gives 19.5/s while the booster is running, 25% resist all will make you take 25% less damage, as such as soon as you endure more than 78 DPS, resists are better, and you must admit that if you endure less than 78 DPS, you don't need either bonus. In addition, the res bonus will still apply if you run out of can or are nossed to death, while the boost bonus won't... By the way, 7.5% boost bonus will give 29.25/s while boosting, and then as soon as you endure more than 117 DPS, you'll be better with the res bonus, with the booster permanently running)
edit: oh, and if you fit only a med booster 'cause you're going for gank fitting, the resist bonus will definitely be better. And it'd be even more better if you fit a passive tank, and i'm pretty sure the eagle can fit a decent one. So yeah dev, stop taking time working on Caldari ships, obviously they don't want the boosts you're trying to give them. Keep this precious time to work on other ships in need
Quote: dont fly what you cant afford to lose, always have it insured, make sure you can replace it before you take it into 0.0 or any potentially kaboomish situations.
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Malachi Nefzen
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Posted - 2005.10.30 23:41:00 -
[494]
Edited by: Malachi Nefzen on 30/10/2005 23:43:38 lets seee
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Sarrena
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Posted - 2005.10.31 02:27:00 -
[495]
Edited by: Sarrena on 31/10/2005 02:29:48 Edited by: Sarrena on 31/10/2005 02:28:37 A few ideas, not sure if they're good or bad so take them at face value and skip da flames ;)
-Sac needs at least one more turrent (Lots of model room). -Zealot is still unlikely to be used, an idea that may or may not hold any merit, instead of a launcher give it a turrent reselution bonus to force it down between small and medium, giving it a rather neat edge in accuracy and damage (dont trans it to the Zealot for the love of god!). -Arb could use a second missle slot, its already frail when compared to its Gall equal when it is supposed to have superiour armor, so maybe a better attack? Little less PG to control it? -Cal dest, give it some more missle slots and less turrent (4/4?). No really :) -Gall dest, more drones, past that its still cool.
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j0sephine
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Posted - 2005.10.31 03:40:00 -
[496]
Edited by: j0sephine on 31/10/2005 03:40:58
"Rifter
- Added a low slot
- Added a med slot
"
... wait wait waaaaait. Either i misread the earlier comments, or it's very recent change... but was under impression Rifter is getting the extra mid slot *instead* of extra low... now it actually gets one mid *and* one low? as in, it'll be 4-3-3..? o.o;
...
i mean... sure, it makes sense i guess, it as like, 2 slots short than everyone else, and now all tier.3 frigates will be 10 slots total, but like... omfg.
...
seriously, omfg o.o;;
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Naughty Boy
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Posted - 2005.10.31 04:58:00 -
[497]
Originally by: j0sephine seriously, omfg o.o;;
Same impression here. With the new mid slot, the rifter just lost a major weakness. Same slot layout as the jaguar, which sounds even less interesting... I'm not complaining, but the new mid slot is not a minor improvement/adjustement. I'll have to test that.
Sincerly Yours, The Naughty Boy. --- We are the underdogs, its best just to accept the fact. Khaldorn Murino |
Sarmaul
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Posted - 2005.10.31 09:33:00 -
[498]
Originally by: j0sephine seriously, omfg o.o;;
maybe I should've just said that instead of forcing myself onto Tux. Oh well
/emote lights up a ciggy
Originally by: Chowdown We camp a lot
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Nafri
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Posted - 2005.10.31 10:12:00 -
[499]
Without its speed bonus there is no reason to keep the rifter down in terms of slots --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Put your panties on your head! |
Reatu Krentor
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Posted - 2005.10.31 13:28:00 -
[500]
Nice stuff in here so far but I want to aim one of the spot lights on a class of ships that seems to have been forgotten for the upgrades: Industrials . Specifically I'm calling for attention to my minmatar heritage . Since the recent addition of the new Amarr industrial, the Sigil, there has been this horrific thought in my mind that an AMARR indy is actually faster than the MINMATAR counterpart, which is the Wreathe. The Sigil reaches a max speed (no skills) of 155 whereas the Wreathe only has a top speed of 125, not to mention having a lower powergrid, lower armor/shield. And the Wreathe is the fastest Minmatar hauler. Now where is the balance ?! ***Random Rambling Rant brought to you by: " Random ranting a day, keeps the nutcase away."*** ------------------------------------------ The ammatar are not the enemy, they are the smoke and mirrors of the amarr. |
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Spuki
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Posted - 2005.10.31 13:53:00 -
[501]
Originally by: Nafri Without its speed bonus there is no reason to keep the rifter down in terms of slots
It still has a huge speed advantage over the merlin, tristan and punisher.
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Trelennen
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Posted - 2005.10.31 14:13:00 -
[502]
Originally by: Spuki
Originally by: Nafri Without its speed bonus there is no reason to keep the rifter down in terms of slots
It still has a huge speed advantage over the merlin, tristan and punisher.
Not that huge anymore, and it balances its lower HP.
Quote: dont fly what you cant afford to lose, always have it insured, make sure you can replace it before you take it into 0.0 or any potentially kaboomish situations.
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j0sephine
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Posted - 2005.10.31 14:38:00 -
[503]
Edited by: j0sephine on 31/10/2005 14:38:42
"Not that huge anymore, and it balances its lower HP."
Merlin has whole 50 hp (5%) more than Rifter with maxed out skills (906 vs 856) yet the speed difference between them is 112.5 m/sec (40%) before even weight difference and afb/mwd start enter into the picture.
Somehow i think if i asked for 90 m/sec more for Merlin in exchange for 40 hp, you'd find this unreasonably exaggerated demand...
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Akiman
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Posted - 2005.10.31 14:41:00 -
[504]
can you do something about gallente ships structure bonus? it seems useless...if its not..please tell me! well...at least i cant do structure tanking!
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Spuki
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Posted - 2005.10.31 15:06:00 -
[505]
Originally by: Akiman can you do something about gallente ships structure bonus? it seems useless...if its not..please tell me! well...at least i cant do structure tanking!
It will become useful when damage controls give resistances to structure ... maybe :)
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Joerd Toastius
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Posted - 2005.10.31 15:47:00 -
[506]
The other thing to remember is that multiplicative bonuses such as ABs, MWDs, ODs etc widen the absolute speed gap considerably.
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Trelennen
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Posted - 2005.10.31 18:36:00 -
[507]
Originally by: j0sephine Edited by: j0sephine on 31/10/2005 14:38:42
"Not that huge anymore, and it balances its lower HP."
Merlin has whole 50 hp (5%) more than Rifter with maxed out skills (906 vs 856) yet the speed difference between them is 112.5 m/sec (40%) before even weight difference and afb/mwd start enter into the picture.
Well, Merlin has it's shield resist bonus in MK2 (instead of the shield HP bonus, which was giving a net edge with HP), making its shield HP 33% more efficient than rifter's shield HP. And Merlin has 50 more raw CPU and only 2 less Pg, which means it can fit much easilier a tank (which will be more efficient due to the resist bonus again). And Merlin, like Tristan and Punisher, has it's max cap increased, Rifter doesn't. Thus Merlin will have more cap to tank with compared to the Rifter. So yeah if you ask for 90m/s in exchange of these HP, the lower fitting, the lower cap, and the lesser resists, I wouldn't mind, but I bet you wouldn't ;)
Rifter's has edge in speed for its survivability, Merlin in HP, resists, cap and fitting to tank for its survivability, I don't see the issue.
Quote: dont fly what you cant afford to lose, always have it insured, make sure you can replace it before you take it into 0.0 or any potentially kaboomish situations.
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Diana Merris
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Posted - 2005.10.31 19:06:00 -
[508]
Originally by: j0sephine Edited by: j0sephine on 31/10/2005 14:38:42
"Not that huge anymore, and it balances its lower HP."
Merlin has whole 50 hp (5%) more than Rifter with maxed out skills (906 vs 856) yet the speed difference between them is 112.5 m/sec (40%) before even weight difference and afb/mwd start enter into the picture.
Somehow i think if i asked for 90 m/sec more for Merlin in exchange for 40 hp, you'd find this unreasonably exaggerated demand...
No, I will gladly take that deal. Do it right now! Do it yesterday! !
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Nyxus
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Posted - 2005.10.31 23:19:00 -
[509]
Edited by: Nyxus on 31/10/2005 23:21:52 <whispers> Pssst.....Tux. Come here while everyone else is busy crying about drones. I wanna talk to you about the maller.
For a long time I had trouble quantifying what my problem is with fitting out the Maller when comparing it to other ships. It lacks a dronebay, but it has more slots to offset this, right? And when I first started doing a comparative fitting analysis it all looked peachy until I realized one thing.
The Maller has an empty highslot.
When comparing ships you wouldn't leave out a highslot on any other ship, would you? No, of course not. Especially since the Maller gives up the copious dronebay that the other Tier 3 cruisers have in order to obtain the extra slot. You utilize all the slots on a ship. And ships that have a bonus, like the mwd bonus on the Rax, are given some extra fittings to make sure that they can fit thier load of weapons and this ship specific bonus when comparing it to other ships. Hence the new grid given to the Rax.
There are only 2 items that can fit in a utility slot. A Nos and a Smartbomb. Here is a comparison showing all of the Tier 3 cruisers (MK2 style) with maximum fitting skills to both ship and weapons. All numbers are using the largest long range weapons for all ships for so there is a direct comparison. I have listed the Maller with a rack of guns and an empty highslot, a Nos, and a Smartbomb.
Here it is plain to see that the Maller has been balanced leaving the high slot empty. To me there are just a few options available to rectify this inbalance.
- Boost the grid of the Maller so that it can fill all of it's slots like every other tier 3 cruiser.
- Change the utility slot to a weapon slot.
- Remove the utility slot and give the maller a dronebay equivalent to the Rupture (60m3)
- Change the highslot to a low slot or mid to at least allow something to be fitted
Something needs to be done. All other Tier 3 cruisers can fit all thier slots with only 1 RCU. The Maller should be able to do the same. Either that or change the slot layout on the Maller. As it stands, like the Coercer, the Maller is not balanced.
Nyxus
Edit - I left the Omen in by accident. I am too lazy to remove it.
Oveur> "CUZ I'M EEEXXTTRRREEEEEEEEMME!!" |
Meridius
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Posted - 2005.11.01 00:18:00 -
[510]
Originally by: Nyxus Edited by: Nyxus on 31/10/2005 23:21:52 <whispers> Pssst.....Tux. Come here while everyone else is busy crying about drones. I wanna talk to you about the maller.
For a long time I had trouble quantifying what my problem is with fitting out the Maller when comparing it to other ships. It lacks a dronebay, but it has more slots to offset this, right? And when I first started doing a comparative fitting analysis it all looked peachy until I realized one thing.
The Maller has an empty highslot.
When comparing ships you wouldn't leave out a highslot on any other ship, would you? No, of course not. Especially since the Maller gives up the copious dronebay that the other Tier 3 cruisers have in order to obtain the extra slot. You utilize all the slots on a ship. And ships that have a bonus, like the mwd bonus on the Rax, are given some extra fittings to make sure that they can fit thier load of weapons and this ship specific bonus when comparing it to other ships. Hence the new grid given to the Rax.
There are only 2 items that can fit in a utility slot. A Nos and a Smartbomb. Here is a comparison showing all of the Tier 3 cruisers (MK2 style) with maximum fitting skills to both ship and weapons. All numbers are using the largest long range weapons for all ships for so there is a direct comparison. I have listed the Maller with a rack of guns and an empty highslot, a Nos, and a Smartbomb.
Here it is plain to see that the Maller has been balanced leaving the high slot empty. To me there are just a few options available to rectify this inbalance.
- Boost the grid of the Maller so that it can fill all of it's slots like every other tier 3 cruiser.
- Change the utility slot to a weapon slot.
- Remove the utility slot and give the maller a dronebay equivalent to the Rupture (60m3)
- Change the highslot to a low slot or mid to at least allow something to be fitted
Something needs to be done. All other Tier 3 cruisers can fit all thier slots with only 1 RCU. The Maller should be able to do the same. Either that or change the slot layout on the Maller. As it stands, like the Coercer, the Maller is not balanced.
Nyxus
Edit - I left the Omen in by accident. I am too lazy to remove it.
I come from the belief that the Maller should get 6 turret points. Unfortunately, i will likely get shot in the face for saying this ________________________________________________________
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