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Detaurus
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Posted - 2005.11.17 23:57:00 -
[1]
With the nerfing of the insta jump bookmarks, getting across certain places, and known camps, expecially in links between different parts of the galaxies, will be impossible, except for small groups. This represents an attempt to place blame for a nerf on the system resources(such as the drone problem), which in reality has more to do with a persistent desire of devs to nerf solo play. The capacity of a battleship to defend itself from the protected class of tackler in an expeditious manner was severely nerfed by halving drone bays, and making drones as easy to hit as a house. The 'specialty' drones are a ridiculous joke. I should not care to take any of my well earned(that is working by ones self, not buying isk, not via communism(corporations), battleships into the eve of the future, when so much is being done to nerf solo play. Any that suggest I am playing a 'group' game can pitch in a few dollars then and pay for my subscription.
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Corvus Anderran
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Posted - 2005.11.18 00:13:00 -
[2]
Oh my god you're right! I looked up these changes, and found that signature resolution of drones on the test server has increased, but sig radius is still the same! I thought that this was just a weapon change, but now thanks to you, Detaurus, I see the devs' plan! Clearly they intend to change the sig resolution adjustment to signature radius instead as a stealth nerf! I'm glad we have you here to spot these things for us!
Second, I read up that the insta changes won't be brought in with RMR, they are just an experiment. But now I see, the devs are clearly lying! They obviously intend to bring this change in through stealth also! Obviously the devs are all pirates, who play in frigate packs all the time, and their secret plan is to gank all of Detaurus' hard earned battleships while he's just minding his own business flying around lowsec looking for haulers to gank! 
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Ortu Konsinni
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Posted - 2005.11.18 00:23:00 -
[3]
So, are you leaving yet?
Can I have your stuff?
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Ortu Konsinni
Diplomatic delegate
French Force Alliance -- l'alliance des francophones
Web site : http://destabiliser.com/ffa/ |
Naughty Boy
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Posted - 2005.11.18 00:25:00 -
[4]
Edited by: Naughty Boy on 18/11/2005 00:26:31
 Originally by: Detaurus
communism(corporations)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comunism
Sincerly Yours, The Naughty Boy.
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Spreadsheet - Damage @ range. |
Trelennen
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Posted - 2005.11.18 01:01:00 -
[5]
Edited by: Trelennen on 18/11/2005 01:03:59
Damn Detaurus, won't you ever stop with your uninformed whines (like sig radius of drones, which doesn't change at all) and trolls?
And comparing corporations to communism? Get a clue man, corporations is a thing from liberalism, not communism... (read the link given by naughty, maybe you'll learn something for once  )
edit: oh, and for this specific whine, changes for insta are only on test for testing right now, and devs already stated they won't go into RMR, and they're are trying to figure a way to remove instas without removing the ability to travel fast instas give.
And if you really don't like this game, please stop playing it and posting here, noone will regret you 
Quote:
dont fly what you cant afford to lose, always have it insured, make sure you can replace it before you take it into 0.0 or any potentially kaboomish situations.
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Munin Crow
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Posted - 2005.11.18 01:49:00 -
[6]
Hehehe... actually corporations would be capitalism. 
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Detaurus
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Posted - 2005.11.18 01:50:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Naughty Boy
Edited by: Naughty Boy on 18/11/2005 00:26:31
Originally by: Detaurus
communism(corporations)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comunism
Sincerly Yours, The Naughty Boy.
I was not equating capitalist thriving corporations with communism.
I was equating the concept of I will do a little and my big brother will pay for everything else with communism, which it is.
Liberals, with their workers' rights and ridiculous torte requirements on behalf of often stupid and careless consumers, belive big brother and big business(corporations) should pay for everything.
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Reatu Krentor
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Posted - 2005.11.18 01:58:00 -
[8]
*looks up reads a bit, smiles at another detaurus post and walks away*
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The ammatar are not the enemy, they are the smoke and mirrors of the amarr. |
Detaurus
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Posted - 2005.11.18 02:04:00 -
[9]
Insta changes are already on test center. The new drones are horrible, a newbie ship can shoot them down fairly easily. You are right, and the results are much worse than I thought. Heavy drones wont be able to hit anything small. Battleships are quickly becoming useless. The devs hate the fact that some people prefer to play this game alone. miss miss miss, with medium turrets, and large turrets, tank tank tank with cruise heavies and torpedoes, intys are becoming invulnerable, and it is more ridiculous than any other set of changes I have seen in this game. Shall we recite the major changes to combat? Lol
Turrets- All For Intys
Missiles- All For Intys
Drones- All For Intys
Insta Changes- All For Tacklers(Intys)
ECM Changes- All For Intys
Removal Of Web Range Modification From Development- All For Intys
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Professor McFly
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Posted - 2005.11.18 02:06:00 -
[10]
World of Warcraft is that way ->
____________________
1) Buy Eve Time Card
2) Sell it for ISK
3) You just legally bought ISK for real money! |
Hans Roaming
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Posted - 2005.11.18 02:09:00 -
[11]
Maybe the BS isn't meant to be a pwnmobile, maybe it's meant to be part of a battlegroup, just like today.
El Presedente
Anti Pirate? Tired of sec hits? Join us for free wars! |
Detaurus
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Posted - 2005.11.18 02:13:00 -
[12]
you know what happens to an airplane that attempts a kamikaze maneuver on one of the US navies aircraft carriers today? (assuming it is not met by fighters(drones) first?
This is what they get, and the operator doesnt even have to aim
http://tri.army.mil/lc/cs/csa/phalanx.jpg
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Aeid Nomais
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Posted - 2005.11.18 02:26:00 -
[13]
omg, just go away!!! 
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Corvus Anderran
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Posted - 2005.11.18 02:41:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Detaurus
you know what happens to an airplane that attempts a kamikaze maneuver on one of the US navies aircraft carriers today? (assuming it is not met by fighters(drones) first?
This is what they get, and the operator doesnt even have to aim
http://tri.army.mil/lc/cs/csa/phalanx.jpg
Hey, that's a good idea! So put some small guns on your BS if you want to hit small stuff! I think you solved your own problem there.
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Munin Crow
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Posted - 2005.11.18 02:44:00 -
[15]
Quote:
I was not equating capitalist thriving corporations with communism.
I was equating the concept of I will do a little and my big brother will pay for everything else with communism, which it is.
Liberals, with their workers' rights and ridiculous torte requirements on behalf of often stupid and careless consumers, belive big brother and big business(corporations) should pay for everything.
This actually sounds a little more like working for a corporation so that you can get a chance to use the corporate credit account...
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Detaurus
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Posted - 2005.11.18 02:47:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Corvus Anderran
Originally by: Detaurus
you know what happens to an airplane that attempts a kamikaze maneuver on one of the US navies aircraft carriers today? (assuming it is not met by fighters(drones) first?
This is what they get, and the operator doesnt even have to aim
http://tri.army.mil/lc/cs/csa/phalanx.jpg
Hey, that's a good idea! So put some small guns on your BS if you want to hit small stuff! I think you solved your own problem there.
Phalanx is a big gun, the vulcan autocannon on an a-10 is a 'small' gun
im ALL for turrets and missiles having trouble hitting small ships, but when they do, it should go BOOM!
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Furion35
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Posted - 2005.11.18 02:49:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Detaurus
im ALL for turrets and missiles having trouble hitting small ships, but when they do, it should go BOOM!
Agreed.
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Corvus Anderran
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Posted - 2005.11.18 02:55:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Detaurus
Originally by: Corvus Anderran
Originally by: Detaurus
you know what happens to an airplane that attempts a kamikaze maneuver on one of the US navies aircraft carriers today? (assuming it is not met by fighters(drones) first?
This is what they get, and the operator doesnt even have to aim
http://tri.army.mil/lc/cs/csa/phalanx.jpg
Hey, that's a good idea! So put some small guns on your BS if you want to hit small stuff! I think you solved your own problem there.
Phalanx is a big gun, the vulcan autocannon on an a-10 is a 'small' gun
im ALL for turrets and missiles having trouble hitting small ships, but when they do, it should go BOOM!
The Phalanx is not a big gun. You get those on, wait for it, frigates!
And if you hit an interceptor with a large gun, it does go boom. You just need a low transversal to hit it. Obviously you don't have the skills to use the super cool anti transversal mods.
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Hllaxiu
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Posted - 2005.11.18 03:38:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Detaurus
you know what happens to an airplane that attempts a kamikaze maneuver on one of the US navies aircraft carriers today? (assuming it is not met by fighters(drones) first?
This is what they get, and the operator doesnt even have to aim
http://tri.army.mil/lc/cs/csa/phalanx.jpg
What happens to a sub when it launches a volley of torpedos at an Aircraft carrier?
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Rockbox
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Posted - 2005.11.18 03:44:00 -
[20]
For the record the Gatling cannon in the body of an A-10 Warthod is a big gun, its a 30mm multibarrel rapid fire cannon that shoots a unique depleted uranium round... it cuts tanks and lightly armored vehicles in half...
The Phalanx cannons aboard U.S. Nimitz class aircraft carriers is for shooting down incoming missles as its range is very short... it purpose is to put up a "wall" of lead between the carrier and the incoming missle. I suppose it could hit aircraft but why would an aircraft be within straffing range of a Capital ship... Deturus guess what it wouldent do you know why? Because a U.S. Nitmiz carrier doesent travel alone (like you in your BS pwnmobile) it is escorted by guided missle destroyers (Arlighlie Burke Class) and at the heart of the air defense netword the Ticonderoga guided missle defense CRUISER... it has missle bays full of a multi use sea to air missle and a highly advanced Ageis Radar and target tracking system, any enemy fighters/bomber get within 100miles of the carrier group and they will have fighters from the carrier on them aswell as the air defense missles from the Destroyers and Cruisers...
............if you read my whole post... did I just shoot down his argument?
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Detaurus
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Posted - 2005.11.18 03:52:00 -
[21]
Edited by: Detaurus on 18/11/2005 03:52:58
it is escorted because it is precious, not because it is weak. I guarantee you an aircraft carrier can eliminate most of the ships in its little armada. And according to the US NAvy(who should know) it IS used as a last ditch anti aircraft platform. Why? because of Kamikaze tactics during WWII
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Detaurus
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Posted - 2005.11.18 03:54:00 -
[22]
Bruce lee had body guards. Mostly to keep people from getting hurt.
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Robstr
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Posted - 2005.11.18 04:13:00 -
[23]
Edited by: Robstr on 18/11/2005 04:13:09
Originally by: Detaurus
Bruce lee had body guards. Mostly to keep people from getting hurt.
WAIT HOLD IT!!!
Your saying the battlegroup is there to keep the carrier from hurting things that don't need to be?!
That makes so much sence my mind exploded.
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xNashx
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Posted - 2005.11.18 04:15:00 -
[24]
No, I don't think Bruce Lee had body guards.
xNashx
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Detaurus
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Posted - 2005.11.18 04:18:00 -
[25]
Originally by: xNashx
No, I don't think Bruce Lee had body guards.
xNashx
Watch Bruce Lee: The Legend in the bruce lee dvd movie collection boxed set
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Rockbox
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Posted - 2005.11.18 05:00:00 -
[26]
The carrier is not weak, but is vounerable it alone can wreak havoc, but also many things could slip past its defenses. Submarines, long range missles, ect. It is also valuable (as you stated) so is your BS in game (as you stated) are you starting to see the coralation.... if not here it is plain and simple, your bs is powerful, it is valuable dont let it be destroyed by stealthy foes surround yourself with an escort. And also I would like to point out we are talking about Battle Ships in game but comparing them to Aircraft Carriers in RL. Now as a proper comparison lets look at the RL battle ship... wait what battle ships the last one in active service (U.S.S. Missouri) was turned into a floating musuem. Hmm why did the battle ships do extinct? Planes with bombs, in the early 20th century there was a demonstration that displayed how a couple cheap planes with a sufficeient amount of the right sized and placed bombs could sink a very expensive warship... it was downhill from there battleships could not track and hit fast moving torpedo and dive bombers (although threw up plenty of flack and did often down planes). Look what happened to the Bismark a WWI eara wooden bi-plane which was horribly outdated with one cheap torpeado took out the pride of the German navys battship's stearing systems (O **** whats that you say!? OMFG RL TACKLE IT CANT GET AWAY!) And so the Bismark effectively disabled unable to leave, sailed in circles and was finished off by some British battleships... imo a good RL example of what a cheap (and oudated) weapon can do to a very high tech, well built, and expensive one..
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Detaurus
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Posted - 2005.11.18 05:18:00 -
[27]
when one of my torpedoes hit, it better blow up.
TomB wont allow it though, and I hate him so, very very much. :)
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Naughty Boy
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Posted - 2005.11.18 05:33:00 -
[28]
Edited by: Naughty Boy on 18/11/2005 05:33:36
Originally by: Detaurus
when one of my torpedoes hit, it better blow up.
I don't think you realize what exactly is happening.
When i shoot at an interceptor orbiting me with my 1400mm artillery, the shot appears to be landing on the interceptor, even though it says that it misses it completely.
When i shoot at it with a cruise missile, it says that I hit it, just for very low damage. It doesn't mean that the cruise missile hits the interceptor right in the hull, like the 1400mm shell apparently does. It means that the interceptor is caught into the blast radius, and takes some damage. What you see doesn't really exist... 
Cry how much you want, torps being the ultimate doom of whatever it could catch is a thing of the past and no amount of your entertaining threads will bring them back.
Sincerly Yours, The Naughty Boy.
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Spreadsheet - Damage @ range. |
sonofollo
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Posted - 2005.11.18 06:51:00 -
[29]
they wont be in RMR and if they are well so be it the rest of us are ready to adapt
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Malthros Zenobia
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Posted - 2005.11.18 06:57:00 -
[30]
Edited by: Malthros Zenobia on 18/11/2005 07:12:54
------------------------------------
Your Civilian Gatling Railgun perfectly strikes Choke Slam [CAIN], wrecking for 6.0 damage. |
Malthros Zenobia
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Posted - 2005.11.18 07:13:00 -
[31]
Originally by: Detaurus
you know what happens to an airplane that attempts a kamikaze maneuver on one of the US navies aircraft carriers today? (assuming it is not met by fighters(drones) first?
This is what they get, and the operator doesnt even have to aim
http://tri.army.mil/lc/cs/csa/phalanx.jpg
Try again, that's part of the Phalanx Close-in Weapons System, which is an ANTI-MISSILE system.
A carrier's only defense against aircraft in modern warfare are the other vessels escorting it, or the aircraft it can launch.
And just to kick you while you're down, do you want to guess at the kind of missiles used on the high-speed aircraft? Yes, small and quick (light) missiles, not large ICBMs Bunker Busters.
Also, the Anti-Aircraft guns used today are SMALL (in naval weaponry sizes). I'ts a good thing you're not in the Navy, I could just imagine you flipping out, screaming that it's bull**** your Battleship's 8-inch cannons can't hit the fighters that're dive-bombing you, when they can hit large targets at great distances.
Do yourself a favor and leave RL comparisons out of your whines, because you're apparently just as clueless about the real world military.
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Your Civilian Gatling Railgun perfectly strikes Choke Slam [CAIN], wrecking for 6.0 damage. |
AlphaM
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Posted - 2005.11.18 09:08:00 -
[32]
I think you will you find Bruce Lee(BS) had bodyguards (an escort) to protect him from being swarmed by a mob(interceptors)
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Rex Martell
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Posted - 2005.11.18 09:38:00 -
[33]
Battleships ruled the sea unchallenged until the advent of Aircraft. After Aircraft the power and range of the Battleships/Carriers expanded but it no longer ruled unchallenged.
The greatest treat to RL battleship or Aircraft Carrier is the lone fighter/Bomber as seen in the Falklands War when a squadron of Mig's down several Battleships.
Can't resist one last RL annology
The Bismarck was crippled by a Swordfish a wood and canvas Bi-Plane. Slowed by the attach it was caught and sunk by battleships.
"The object of war is not to die for your corp, but to make the other b@##@#d die for his" |
Detaurus
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Posted - 2005.11.18 13:20:00 -
[34]
"The MK 15 Phalanx Close-In Weapons System (CIWS - pronounced "sea-whiz") is a fast-reaction, rapid-fire 20-millimeter gun system that provides US Navy ships with a terminal defense against anti-ship missiles that have penetrated other fleet defenses. Designed to engage anti-ship cruise missiles and fixed-wing aircraft at short range, Phalanx automatically engages functions usually performed by separate, independent systems such as search, detection, threat evaluation, acquisition, track, firing, target destruction, kill assessment and cease fire. Phalanx underwent operational tests and evaluation onboard USS Bigelow in 1977, and exceeded maintenance and reliability specifications. Phalanx production started in 1978 with orders for 23 USN and 14 Foreign Military Sales (FMS) systems. "
http://www.fas.org/man/dod-101/sys/ship/weaps/mk-15.htm
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Phelan Lore
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Posted - 2005.11.18 13:41:00 -
[35]
Originally by: Robstr
Edited by: Robstr on 18/11/2005 04:13:09
Originally by: Detaurus
Bruce lee had body guards. Mostly to keep people from getting hurt.
WAIT HOLD IT!!!
Your saying the battlegroup is there to keep the carrier from hurting things that don't need to be?!
That makes so much sence my mind exploded.
ROFL
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Detaurus
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Posted - 2005.11.18 14:03:00 -
[36]
Everyone that flames me here needs to take some classes in rhetoric. Few can understand even what they are saying or implying by their obstinancy.
Bruce lee needed no protection, yet bodyguards were employed so that he did not have to deal with the opposition, and if he did, it would not have been that fair of a fight.
Battleship Pilots Should Feel Such A Complete Sense Of Boredom Engaging Small Ships That They Pretty Much Leave Them Alone. At This Moment Battleships Know They Must Kill An Inty As Fast As Possible.
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Elaron
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Posted - 2005.11.18 14:03:00 -
[37]
Real world military equipment and situations may hold some superficial simiarities to things that can be found in EVE, but, in all honesty, you cannot equate the two. That's like trying to equate a gooseberry with a sprout because they are both round.
These threads remind me of the Waaaaamityville Horror ... :P
Elaron
It is never too late to correct the mistakes of the past. |
Grey Area
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Posted - 2005.11.18 14:18:00 -
[38]
I do have SOME sympathy with Detaurus, largely based on comparative costs;
Ship A.
BS - 100 million ISK plus lots of high level skills to fly well
Ship B.
Interceptor - under 10 million ISK and a few low level skills to fly well.
Why should I choose to invest in ship A. if it can be easily defeated or at least held to a standoff by ship B.?
If CCP want to limit BS use (and let's face it, that is what it is all about), then simply limit the number that can be made...make it like a production queue for a prestigious car...you order it now, you get your BS in 1 or 2 years' time.
And it makes me laugh that Detaurus complains about CCP trying to force people to co-operate (which I agree with him, they do want that), but at the same time they've had to boost the smaller ships because people WON'T co-operate.
I'd have no problem with 10 frigates taking down a BS...but CCP have had to erode the BS abilitiies to a point where you can do it with three or four, because you can't get more people than that to co-operate. But it doesn't help the "feel" of the game.
Groovy CURVES, and the SPREADSHEET that made 'em |
Grey Area
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Posted - 2005.11.18 14:20:00 -
[39]
Originally by: Elaron
Real world military equipment and situations may hold some superficial simiarities to things that can be found in EVE, but, in all honesty, you cannot equate the two. That's like trying to equate a gooseberry with a sprout because they are both round.
They are both green as well. Just because there are differences does not mean that there are no similarities, and vice versa. You cannot EQUATE them, but you can COMPARE them.
Groovy CURVES, and the SPREADSHEET that made 'em |
Liisa
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Posted - 2005.11.18 14:38:00 -
[40]
Originally by: Detaurus
Battleship Pilots Should Feel Such A Complete Sense Of Boredom Engaging Small Ships That They Pretty Much Leave Them Alone. At This Moment Battleships Know They Must Kill An Inty As Fast As Possible.
I wish for you to clarify your statement.
Do you mean that battleships should be able to kill all other ship classes with such ease that if one is not flying a battleship one has to flee at the first sight of a battleship in order not to lose ones ship?
(Assumption made is that this meeting is in non-secure space of course.)
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El Yatta
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Posted - 2005.11.18 14:56:00 -
[41]
What he means is that he doesn't think other players are worth co-operating with, so he therefore doesn't think they are equal to him, which they are. He then assumes that he should be "bored" by their presence - ie. nobody else should be able to touch him. He is of course, entirely wrong.
Comments such as "corporations (communism)" and "if anybody mentions its a team game, why dont they chip in with my subscription?" prove he doesn't UNDERSTAND the concept of working with other people. They contribute, and so do you! So you'd all pay a part of each otehrs subs, and end up paying the same - ie, pay your own damn sub.
---:::---
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Karthik
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Posted - 2005.11.18 16:09:00 -
[42]
Originally by: Rex Martell
The greatest treat to RL battleship or Aircraft Carrier is the lone fighter/Bomber as seen in the Falklands War when a squadron of Mig's down several Battleships.
Never seen someone disprove themselves with their own statement before
1. From above, greatest threat = lone ..., then words later "squadron of migs...". One vs. 12 to 16. Well done.
2. There were no battleships in the Falklands war. The biggest vessel the Argentinians had IIRC was the General Belgrano, a cruiser purchased from the US and sunk by a submarine. The British have no battleships in their inventory, and haven't had any since well before 1982. The British did lose several vessels to Exocets, but these are not launched from Migs. They are launched from Super Etendards (spelling?), French aircraft (which makes sense seeing as the Exocet is a French missile).
We now return you to your regularly scheduled whine.
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Abbadon Weishaupt
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Posted - 2005.11.18 18:30:00 -
[43]
Quote:
Everyone that flames me here needs to take some classes in rhetoric. Few can understand even what they are saying or implying by their obstinancy.
Even as a relative noob here - I understand perfectly what the people flaming you are saying ;) - You could try listening - the good advice plastered all over these boards has saved my bacon more than once :D
On the other hand whinging has never helped me once *shrug*
Abba
PS I just *know* I am gonna regret posting this but what the hell
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nahtoh
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Posted - 2005.11.18 20:33:00 -
[44]
Originally by: Rex Martell
Battleships ruled the sea unchallenged until the advent of Aircraft. After Aircraft the power and range of the Battleships/Carriers expanded but it no longer ruled unchallenged.
The greatest treat to RL battleship or Aircraft Carrier is the lone fighter/Bomber as seen in the Falklands War when a squadron of Mig's down several Battleships.
Can't resist one last RL annology
Well could you at lest get it right...Dassault aircraft mostly flown by argentintina and no Battleships lost by the RN (as not having any at all never mind in theater) support ships destroyers and frigates lost only...
So not bad wrong aircraft and ship types cited.
"I am not saying there should be capital punishment for stupidity, but
why can`t we just take the safety labels off everything and let the
problem solve itself" (credits to mcallister TCS)
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axis featherfall
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Posted - 2005.11.18 22:26:00 -
[45]
detaurus did you by chance eat paint chips as a kid? or maybe live under some power lines? World of warcraft is indeed that way ===>
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Detaurus
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Posted - 2005.11.18 23:15:00 -
[46]
I prefer playing Battlefront 2, a far superior PVP game
and now you can be Jedi, slaughtering everyone, if you kill enough people, its great.
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babyblue
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Posted - 2005.11.18 23:34:00 -
[47]
Can we stop the comparisons with US Navy Ships please?
(1) This is a video game
(2) Suspend your disbelief and work out if it's fun to play
(3) US Navy ships have been known to shoot down harmless Iranian passenger 747s and were also highly vulnerable to tiny speed boats manned by fundamentalist lunatics. A bit like BOB .
(4) thats enough numbered bullet points..........
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Corvus Anderran
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Posted - 2005.11.18 23:51:00 -
[48]
Originally by: babyblue
Can we stop the comparisons with US Navy Ships please?
(1) This is a video game
(2) Suspend your disbelief and work out if it's fun to play
(3) US Navy ships have been known to shoot down harmless Iranian passenger 747s and were also highly vulnerable to tiny speed boats manned by fundamentalist lunatics. A bit like BOB .
(4) thats enough numbered bullet points..........
You realise suspension of disbelief relies upon things appearing natural, right? If small guns did 10x the damage of large guns you wouldn't achieve suspension of disbelief very easily. The point is not that Eve ship combat should reflect precisely on 20th century naval warfare, but that it provides a good example of why a small ship can still be capable of damaging a large one.
By the way, the best way of looking at it is to ignore aircraft altogether. Compared to ships, aircraft are more like drones. Instead, the best example for how a small ship hurts a large one is the torpedo boats used around 1900. They were small, fast ships, capable of avoiding gunfire from capital ships, and then dealing heavy damage with torpedoes, before escaping. However, the navies fielding lots of battleships didn't say "Omfg nerf!", they invented the torpedo boat destroyer.
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HippoKing
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Posted - 2005.11.19 00:02:00 -
[49]
Originally by: Detaurus
The new drones are horrible, a newbie ship can shoot them down fairly easily. You are right, and the results are much worse than I thought. Heavy drones wont be able to hit anything small.
age 10-15 years. have a bath. have another bath. go out. meet other people. engage in some real social contact. then come back, and log onto the test server.
now TEST! singature radius increases aren't in. sig resolution increases are. this makes heavies attack frigs FASTER ffs!
tracking hasn't (as far as i've seen) been nerfed. nor has speed. however, there is a skill to increase speed, providing more effectivness against small ships.
once you have checked you facts, come back, and then whine if you still feel justified
and never end a post with Lol
and this line is just to stop me breaking the rule i just made 
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Finix Jaeger
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Posted - 2005.11.19 00:17:00 -
[50]
Lorth! Quickly punch him, I'll get a bag and a shovel.
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Proud owner of the Aphoxema G Calendar |
Detaurus
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Posted - 2005.11.19 00:43:00 -
[51]
Um no, you are incorrect, I am 27, and a casual gamer. I am however, a compulsive poster, but that goes back to my "swg is going to die days". Swg just did, as I predicted, as I am always correct. The issue about sig radius was a mistake. Interceptors can hit a dime going 2,000m/s anyways, I was merely infuriated by the low hit points of the drones, and what I thought were 0% resists. Towards the bottom of the drone dialog box are the 4 reists with 0% next to each one.
Signature Resolution refers to.... start the guide located here http://www.eve-online.com/guide/en/g26.asp
basically it represents the ability of a turret to shoot in a narrow arc. Scan resolution is not being changed(is it even listed), and is what you are referring too.
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Agent Kenshin
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Posted - 2005.11.19 01:41:00 -
[52]
Edited by: Agent Kenshin on 19/11/2005 01:44:26
Edited by: Agent Kenshin on 19/11/2005 01:43:30
Originally by: Liisa
Originally by: Detaurus
Battleship Pilots Should Feel Such A Complete Sense Of Boredom Engaging Small Ships That They Pretty Much Leave Them Alone. At This Moment Battleships Know They Must Kill An Inty As Fast As Possible.
I wish for you to clarify your statement.
Do you mean that battleships should be able to kill all other ship classes with such ease that if one is not flying a battleship one has to flee at the first sight of a battleship in order not to lose ones ship?
(Assumption made is that this meeting is in non-secure space of course.)
For those who played long ago during the times of Beta and just after Beta thats exactly what the game was. You would pwn any ship with a battleship and so thats about the only ship you could fly in PvP. (And everyship had tachyons.) You could do anything. This was before the time of interceptors and tech 2. Ships just didnt cut it.
Edit- I will give you one thing yes CCP has nerfed the game to take away from battleships being the ONLY viable combat ship. Theyve been doing it since Castor hit.
Now FINALLY there is some diversity in fleets. And bships cant just pwn everything they touch. It needs its support to take out the enemies support whether those be interceptors or other ships. Sorry but flying a lone bship in pvp is just  ... Thats just asking to get killed by something smaller. HACs are easily a match for a lone bship pilot unless that bship pilot knows what hes doing. Groups of frigates and AF are fast enough and and with numbers can engage larger ships. But there is a point where you just dont engage because you know that they have superior numbers or setups.
I dont know about everyone but i have only seen a lone interceptor take out a bship only once. And that person in teh bship was not even setup for combat.... which was the only reason he died. Eventually a bship will kill the smaller ship if there is no support on the way for that lonely ceptor pilot.
OMG formatting...
Originally by: MAXSuicide
only carebears call pvpers 'greifers'
ehehehh....
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Detaurus
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Posted - 2005.11.19 02:36:00 -
[53]
like dreadnoughts I expect tech 2 battleships to be useless, and easily smoked by any hac.
I hate TomB
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vile56
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Posted - 2005.11.19 02:38:00 -
[54]
ibtl
i have one questions if instas are gone wouldnt the bs be a pwnmbl since they have to trek those 15km
well walk up to her with your pants down and if she runs away it was never meant to be. |
Detaurus
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Posted - 2005.11.19 03:12:00 -
[55]
no battleships are so slow, getting to the gate past a camp will b impossible. one t1 frig will webify it, for an hour, and the battleships wont be able to hit ****.
200,000 isk > 110,000,000 isk
thats TomB Mathematics
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Agent Kenshin
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Posted - 2005.11.19 03:31:00 -
[56]
Originally by: Detaurus
like dreadnoughts I expect tech 2 battleships to be useless, and easily smoked by any hac.
I hate TomB
Hehe tech 2 bships if there not flagships will be super HACs which will make them super nice. :) But very over powered at the same time.
Originally by: MAXSuicide
only carebears call pvpers 'greifers'
ehehehh....
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Malthros Zenobia
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Posted - 2005.11.19 03:52:00 -
[57]
Originally by: Detaurus
like dreadnoughts I expect tech 2 battleships to be useless, and easily smoked by any hac.
I hate TomB
I'm sure you don't read dev blogs, but I honestly expect a HAC to be a big threat to a T2 BS. T2 BSes are going to be command ships, not super heavy combat ships (which would throw balance completely out of the window, much like an 8 hislot t2 dread with HAC resists).
I expect t2 BSes to be sitting a good distance behind enemy lines, with lots of defensive mods set so that it can survive while giving its gang huge bonuses.
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Your Civilian Gatling Railgun perfectly strikes Choke Slam [CAIN], wrecking for 6.0 damage. |
Agent Kenshin
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Posted - 2005.11.19 04:00:00 -
[58]
Originally by: Malthros Zenobia
Originally by: Detaurus
like dreadnoughts I expect tech 2 battleships to be useless, and easily smoked by any hac.
I hate TomB
I'm sure you don't read dev blogs, but I honestly expect a HAC to be a big threat to a T2 BS. T2 BSes are going to be command ships, not super heavy combat ships (which would throw balance completely out of the window, much like an 8 hislot t2 dread with HAC resists).
I expect t2 BSes to be sitting a good distance behind enemy lines, with lots of defensive mods set so that it can survive while giving its gang huge bonuses.
There are plans for HAC like bships. Which is good and bad.. 
Originally by: MAXSuicide
only carebears call pvpers 'greifers'
ehehehh....
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Detaurus
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Posted - 2005.11.19 04:44:00 -
[59]
HAC are what battleships should have been. high resists, high damage, screw everything smaller than them.
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Deth Kreig
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Posted - 2005.11.19 15:37:00 -
[60]
Originally by: Detaurus
With the nerfing of the insta jump bookmarks, getting across certain places, and known camps, expecially in links between different parts of the galaxies, will be impossible, except for small groups. This represents an attempt to place blame for a nerf on the system resources(such as the drone problem), which in reality has more to do with a persistent desire of devs to nerf solo play. The capacity of a battleship to defend itself from the protected class of tackler in an expeditious manner was severely nerfed by halving drone bays, and making drones as easy to hit as a house. The 'specialty' drones are a ridiculous joke. I should not care to take any of my well earned(that is working by ones self, not buying isk, not via communism(corporations), battleships into the eve of the future, when so much is being done to nerf solo play. Any that suggest I am playing a 'group' game can pitch in a few dollars then and pay for my subscription.
<bling!>sleep....
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Caanan
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Posted - 2005.11.19 16:29:00 -
[61]
Edited by: Caanan on 19/11/2005 16:30:29
Detaurus while you raise a valid point in saying that CCP nerfed solo play and now you cannot go out solo in your battleship and kill everyone in the game.
I'm sorry if they made you cry.
But, CCP are not going to listen to one whiny player who is asking to change the whole game so its unbalanced and every other ship is useless, except battleships ofcourse.
So all your whiny threads about not being able to wtfpwn anything you see are totally worthless because I'd say 99% of the eve community disagrees with you, and I don't think CCP agrees with you either. If they did then you would probably be the best pvper in the game because we would all fly the other ships and you would kill us all in your uber battleship.
Oh wait, theres reality.
Just enjoy the game, and maybe look up the word teamwork.
Have a nice day.
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LUKEC
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Posted - 2005.11.19 16:37:00 -
[62]
this guy call for miz cenuij and some geddon i think
Be back in a year or so :/
Originally by: Istvaan Shogaatsu
Pre-patch: Scorpion + Gankageddon.
Post-patch: Scorpion + Raven, maybe.
Missiles sux, doesn't they?
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Frezik
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Posted - 2005.11.19 18:39:00 -
[63]
The Russian T-26 tank was the mainstay of the Soviet Army pre-WWII. It faught in large numbers in the Spanish civil war, and was the most widely produced tank in the world.
They were stopped by drunken Finns carrying glass bottles filled with gasoline and a small cloth for a fuse.
Right now, American M1A1 Abrams are being rocked in Iraq by explosive devices containing nothing more sophisticated than a digital watch.
Some of the most interesting parts of warfare are when a small but resourceful group takes out a much larger, better funded group. So it is with the Intercepter.
Redundancy's First Law of Game Features: 'When mentioning a feature or change to the playerbase after release, people will generally assume the interpretation they find most controversial.' |
Ranger 1
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Posted - 2005.11.19 19:54:00 -
[64]
Originally by: Caanan
Edited by: Caanan on 19/11/2005 16:30:29
Detaurus while you raise a valid point in saying that CCP nerfed solo play and now you cannot go out solo in your battleship and kill everyone in the game.
I'm sorry if they made you cry.
But, CCP are not going to listen to one whiny player who is asking to change the whole game so its unbalanced and every other ship is useless, except battleships ofcourse.
So all your whiny threads about not being able to wtfpwn anything you see are totally worthless because I'd say 99% of the eve community disagrees with you, and I don't think CCP agrees with you either. If they did then you would probably be the best pvper in the game because we would all fly the other ships and you would kill us all in your uber battleship.
Oh wait, theres reality.
Just enjoy the game, and maybe look up the word teamwork.
Have a nice day.
I rather doubt he would be the best PVPer in the game in his uber battleship, as I understand he's not that great in a battleship vs other battleships either. Sorry, truth hurts.
Here's another truth, your view point of how combat should be balanced is extremely narrow... not to mention uninformed Det. You have no clear idea of the limitations ceptor pilots have, if you did you would not be troubled by them as much.
But since you lack the insight, wisdom, and skill to turn your opponents weaknesses to your advantage you seek to unbalance the game instead to fit your limited playstyle.
Thankfully, it's NOT going to happen. However your score in the "Most Annoying" poster competion is rapidly rising, and no one has been able to match you on the "Laughingstock Meter" for weeks now.
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Frezik
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Posted - 2005.11.19 21:35:00 -
[65]
Originally by: Ranger 1
Thankfully, it's NOT going to happen. However your score in the "Most Annoying" poster competion is rapidly rising, and no one has been able to match you on the "Laughingstock Meter" for weeks now.
I think the guy with the Miner setup on the Machariel beat him out on the Laughingstock Meter. Barely.
Redundancy's First Law of Game Features: 'When mentioning a feature or change to the playerbase after release, people will generally assume the interpretation they find most controversial.' |
Karl Shade
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Posted - 2005.11.20 01:09:00 -
[66]
Methinks Detaurus is part of a devious plot by the devs to make whiners look bad.
Oh, wait. They already look bad don't they?
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Piscis Trust
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Posted - 2005.11.20 06:00:00 -
[67]
if your battleship is so useless. . . why dont you just buy a cepter?
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Beringe
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Posted - 2005.11.20 07:36:00 -
[68]
Originally by: Detaurus
HAC are what battleships should have been. high resists, high damage, screw everything smaller than them.
Then why don't you just get a HAC? Hell, if you are so hell-bent on playing solo, HACs are probably the easiest (read: no effort required on your part) choice.
Of course, the battleship is still the king of EVE...but we all know you don't know how to use them.
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Sometimes, I wake up but keep on dreaming. |
Edrakiss
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Posted - 2005.11.20 11:37:00 -
[69]
Edited by: Edrakiss on 20/11/2005 11:37:23
Detaurus, piece of advice 'shut the **** up'
Reasons:
1) You are evidently far too hung up on name, just because WWII battleships made you happy in bed as an adolescant does not mean ccp or anyone else for that matter shares your shallow mindset.
2) Please attempt to realise that this is a MMORG. Lots of people play at the same time. Simple sense tells me that playing affectively single player games on eve is not rewarding. Make some 'friends' and then see how your precious battleship does in pvp. Your character is not nearly charismatic or beautiful enough to make it alone.
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j0sephine
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Posted - 2005.11.20 11:50:00 -
[70]
"HAC are what battleships should have been. high resists, high damage, screw everything smaller than them."
You forgot "and with minimal insurance payout that doesn't cover even fraction of market price" part, there...
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Trelennen
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Posted - 2005.11.20 14:22:00 -
[71]
Originally by: Edrakiss
2) Please attempt to realise that this is a MMORG. Lots of people play at the same time. Simple sense tells me that playing affectively single player games on eve is not rewarding. Make some 'friends' and then see how your precious battleship does in pvp.
I would add that comparisons with RL BS and frigates is kina moot, as RL BSs require loads more people to manoeuver and fire weapon than a RL frigate. EVE BSs require the exact same number of people, that is only one, than a frigate. Having a BS in EVE pawn a group of 10 frigates each would be ok to me if you needed 20 players or more to fly the BS, which is not the case, so we can forget about it.
On that note, that poor horse has been beaten long enough now, he deserves some rest 
Quote:
dont fly what you cant afford to lose, always have it insured, make sure you can replace it before you take it into 0.0 or any potentially kaboomish situations.
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Malthros Zenobia
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Posted - 2005.11.20 23:37:00 -
[72]
Originally by: Detaurus
HAC are what battleships should have been. high resists, high damage, screw everything smaller than them.
Oh cool, and here I thought your ineptness only applied to Battleships. It seems to apply to HACs too.
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Your Civilian Gatling Railgun perfectly strikes Choke Slam [CAIN], wrecking for 6.0 damage. |
Kor'Goth
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Posted - 2005.11.24 08:02:00 -
[73]
Ok, i will put these in order they were brought up in the post..
A.) Name any war or battle for that matter that a battleship has defeated ANY aircraft.. hint.. don't waste your time. The battleship was decommissioned and stopped being produced for a reason. They cannot react at the same speed that faster moving and more dynamic vessels can. Same applies on EVE. A BS can smack a ship around if its in a controlled environment or its target is basically immoble. However, take this away and the ship flounders against more versatle (ie, as you so favor, Inties or AFs). Learn the difference between warping in at 15km which you've done since you were a newb (still are.. just a lot louder and more obnoxious with your complaints), and using your ships range as an advantage. Find me a inty that can fire over 40km. Or better yet, one that can withstand a heavy NOS for any length of time. Again, don't look. They don't exist. However, a BS can handle both of these quite easily and is actually comfortable with both.
B.) While the Phalanx can fire at aircraft, notice the kind it can hit. Fixed-wing. If you know what that means then you know that either it doesn't have the range to hit these things (in which case your analogy fails) or is so out dated that a fair substitute cannot be found.
C.) HACs. Yes, HACs are nice. However, EVE has no "I win!!" button ships. As much as you want one so you can manage to PvP people older than a week, it won't happen. Balance is more important in a game than some Uber-ship that you want. (On a side note, you happen to think one exists and you hate it. Hypocritical much?) Just because you rushed up to train a BS doesn't mean we should reward your rash behavior. Learn from your mistakes like everyone else.
P.S. You are still my favorite comic writer. I'm currently compiling your works for my rainy days. You bring sun-shine into my life. I thank you for that. 
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Detaurus
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Posted - 2005.11.24 08:08:00 -
[74]
Using your preferred real world analogies then, perhaps you could demonstrate the capacity of an interceptor to hold a carrier, and keep it from going anywhere.
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mimik
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Posted - 2005.11.24 08:56:00 -
[75]
Edited by: mimik on 24/11/2005 08:56:38
Originally by: Detaurus
Using your preferred real world analogies then, perhaps you could demonstrate the capacity of an interceptor to hold a carrier, and keep it from going anywhere.
this aint up to your usual standards det as it is too easy to flame.
1 - a battleship and aircraft carrier are designed for 2 different purposes.
2 - EVE does not yet have a carrier class ship.
3 - in RL aircraft carriers use their own "interceptors" to avoid being attacked by interceptors. ie the aircraft carrier itself does not avoid being attacked or defend itself. it relies on other units, its planes. try applying that analogy to EVE now.
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Ayanami Nova
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Posted - 2005.11.24 09:38:00 -
[76]
Every single one of Detaurus's posts can be answered with the fact that its a community based game. If you wnat a single player game where bigger is better than i hear that X3 is available.
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Leon 026
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Posted - 2005.11.24 09:49:00 -
[77]
Quote:
Using your preferred real world analogies then, perhaps you could demonstrate the capacity of an interceptor to hold a carrier, and keep it from going anywhere.
A single engined bomber carrying a torpedo in a squadron during WWII could sink battleships (and did so). The Japanese battleship Yamato, the largest battleship to have ever been constructed, was sunk by torpedo bombers.
Be happy that at least in EVE, you only get tackled, and not destroyed by small interceptors carrying torpedoes, so you can stop your whining, you're having it easy.
-------------------------------
Would you like cheese with your whine?
Leon / LN026
[ITEMP] Templarii Foreign Legion |
Detaurus
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Posted - 2005.11.24 09:54:00 -
[78]
If you would care to use the army analogy, this should follow then
"the biggest enemy of the tank is the soldier, the biggest enemy of the soldier is the tank"
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Fogy
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Posted - 2005.11.24 11:43:00 -
[79]
Originally by: Detaurus
you know what happens to an airplane that attempts a kamikaze maneuver on one of the US navies aircraft carriers today? (assuming it is not met by fighters(drones) first?
This is what they get, and the operator doesnt even have to aim
http://tri.army.mil/lc/cs/csa/phalanx.jpg
why?
ITS SPECIFICALLY EQUIPED TO COUNTER THEM!
they got thous darn 20mm vulcan guns wich fiers like 2000 shotts a minut.. with a automated radar/tracking computer thingie.. that alignes the "ray" of bullets to the target.
but then again EVE is a freeken Game, not anything in RL.."
"From my rotting boddy flowers shall grow and I am in them, and that is eternity"
♥RUBRA♥
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Sendraks
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Posted - 2005.11.24 11:43:00 -
[80]
Originally by: Detaurus
If you would care to use the army analogy, this should follow then
"the biggest enemy of the tank is the soldier, the biggest enemy of the soldier is the tank"
If you're using difference in size here to determine the relationship, then thats more akin to a cruiser vs frigate scenario.
Plus you're not taking into account that a tank usually has some antipersonnel weaponry on it, though this is not effect if the individual soldier can get within a certain radius of the tank. Tanks are notoriously easy to blindside I believe.
Furthermore, lone solider armed with anti-tank missile/gun does present quite a threat to the tank.
The biggest enemy of the soldier is other soliders.
The reality is, as everyone here is trying to tell you, that in real life the maxim of the Bigger the weapon/vehicle the better it does, doesn't hold water.
Artillery, cruiser missile launchers, are all devastatingly effective weapons, but they require the support of other units in order to operate safely and effectively.
You seem to think, that Eve should be nothing more than dumbed down nonesense where the indivudal in the biggest ship should be able win out over everyone else, unless they are in similar big ships. Frankly if that was the case, Eve would be no way near as enjoyable as it is.
You have to think about the set up of your ship, you have to think about what sort of opposition you are likely to face and what kind of support you are likely to need. |
Kor'Goth
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Posted - 2005.11.25 01:40:00 -
[81]
Originally by: Detaurus
Using your preferred real world analogies then, perhaps you could demonstrate the capacity of an interceptor to hold a carrier, and keep it from going anywhere.
Blow it up? Not like the Carrier can somehow run away from an aircraft. The only way to fully represent the speed difference in a game where millions of Kilometers can be transversed in a second is a device that can prevent this FTL speed. In other words, you would need to nerf webbers more than inties.
Oh, your army analogy works this time! I'm truely impressed. A soldier's worst enemy is a tank, and a tank's worst enemy is a soldier. Only a properly equiped soldier can destroy a tank with ease, while a tank cannot produce a similar effect to even a comperable level vice versa.
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Parallax Error
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Posted - 2005.11.25 01:52:00 -
[82]
1. Battleships are not solo do it all killing machines
2. Real Life Analogies are weak at best in a MMORPG, at worst they are utterly irrelevant.
3. Interceptors are a type of Frigate in EVE, if your going to do RL analogies then an Interceptor should be equated to one of the latest High Tech Frigates.
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Malthros Zenobia
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Posted - 2005.11.25 05:29:00 -
[83]
Originally by: Detaurus
Using your preferred real world analogies then, perhaps you could demonstrate the capacity of an interceptor to hold a carrier, and keep it from going anywhere.
It flies in and drops it's air-to-surfagce torpedoes, which can sink the damn thing, or hits it with some sidewinders or whatever missile payload it carries, crippling the ship.
Then you have the ace pilots who can evade/countermeasure missiles, and are a few hundred MPH too fast for an anti-missile gun(phalax) to hit it, and it makes attack runs on the ship, whose (LARGE) main guns are utterly useless because while extremely powerful, they cannot track/hit the intercepting ship.
A fast-attack aircraft would have no problem immobilizing or outright sinking a battleship in modern warfare. If that battleship gets a clean shot off on the aircraft it's toast though, just like in EVE.
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Your Civilian Gatling Railgun perfectly strikes Choke Slam [CAIN], wrecking for 6.0 damage. |
Toshiro Khan
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Posted - 2005.11.25 07:26:00 -
[84]
Detaurus,
Can you please self destruct your ship when ever you see someone who is a battleship that has been playing longer then you.
The reason is this, by your logic that the battleship should be a solo pwnmobile.. its safe to say, someone with more skill points should be able to pwn some with less skill points with ease, but on the off chance of something wrong happening.. i.e lag, making a silly mistake and so on which could lead to you winning, its safe to say the easy option would be for you to self destruct.
This would make things very fair on everyone thats been playing longer then you, the reason i have limited it to battleships is because of your belife that the battleship should be a solo pwnmobile.
Oh if you fail to take this on board, then you must belive someone with less skill points can beat someone with more skill points then, it stands to reason that a battleship may not be the solo pwnmobile either and does indeed require support in many cases.
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Laqum
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Posted - 2005.11.25 12:04:00 -
[85]
Just remember guys, keep it on-topic and remember the rules. 
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Sharcy
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Posted - 2005.11.25 12:46:00 -
[86]
Originally by: Detaurus
Liberals, with their workers' rights and ridiculous torte requirements on behalf of often stupid and careless consumers, belive big brother and big business(corporations) should pay for everything.
Still funny, how the word "liberal" has a totally different meaning in american english. What you're describing would be a socialist in Europe. Liberal is actually right-wing here.
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Abbadon Weishaupt
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Posted - 2005.11.25 12:58:00 -
[87]
Quote:
Still funny, how the word "liberal" has a totally different meaning in american english. What you're describing would be a socialist in Europe. Liberal is actually right-wing here.
Not in the Europe I live in - Liberal is still left wing here ;)
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Ninketsu
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Posted - 2005.11.25 13:49:00 -
[88]
Hahaha
I love your posts, Detaurus.
______________________________________
Gobling Artillery
1.Find a cousin.
2.Load the cousin in the cannon.
3.Find another cousin. |
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