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Macrominers R.I.P

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 1 post(s)
Jess Tamblyn	Posted - 2005.12.02 10:28:00 - [91] Damn good job guys!!
Snake Jankins	Posted - 2005.12.02 11:54:00 - [92] Originally by: Cummilla And until someone explains to me why those with inordinate\abnormally large and unhealthy amounts of playtime is any different of an "inappropriate RL influence" on Eve as ebay and RL cash is, then you will find me being VERY skeptical about how powerful vigilante weapons can be. Sorry, these ISK farmers don't play the game, they abuse the game for earning money and don't even care about the game. I see no reason, why I should feel for someone who's farming isk for ebay. Surely not because he's farming in hi-sec and hiding behind a nub corp and concorde. They wouldn't be harassed, if they played the game as what it is, a space mmorpg. But they don't care, so why should I care, if they get smart bombed ? I care about people, who play the game as it is meant to be played, and isk farming is not such a way. ___________ 'Wanna-not-be forum warrior. <3'
sonofollo	Posted - 2005.12.02 11:55:00 - [93] this has been the only topic of late - lets find other discussions and including this one
sonofollo	Posted - 2005.12.02 11:58:00 - [94] ok guys some more kador region - syming18-23 - birdie20, demonised, darkamarrfighter, find these guys and any other associated types floating around feel free to hit em. They were in player corp called Royal horse guard we war dec'd blew up about 150m ISK worth of ships and modules the controller pulled em all back to starter corps so now we can only petition and ore take. But feel free to suicide attack
Osric Bloodletter	Posted - 2005.12.02 13:41:00 - [95] Actually, simply kill the hauler with a suicide ship. Then use a hauler of your own to constantly empty the can to pay back your losses. :) When you've earned enough to buy more suicide ships, kill off the miners and sell the loot.
Cummilla	Posted - 2005.12.02 19:50:00 - [96] Originally by: Pandemic Thinking Originally by: Cummilla Originally by: Pandemic Thinking Originally by: Cummilla Originally by: Natas Liah Edited by: Natas Liah on 01/12/2005 21:59:43 Everyone can thank Morgena of the Seraphin Technologies corp for stopping me from getting to a large group of macrominers, he/she thinks its fun to camp me and prevent my pod from reaching the target system. Even after being told exactly what it is im trying to do. I'd like to thank her for stopping an out of control, self appointed, vigilante You got a better idea? I have no love affair with macro-ers. Although to be honest I think the vigilante in question has more than a fair amount of anti-ebay psychosis that they need to deal with so that they can weigh the macroer issue a little more objectively. Theoretically, I have no problem with suicide attacks which nominally engage the execution of their act within normal boundaries of how any typical pvp engagement would go. IE, warpin, lock target, tackle target, activate weapons, repair damage, kill said target, etc. But the key here is that this vigilante weazels in close to the target and doesn't have to lock anything..ever. They don't have to web, scramble, etc. They do not have to prioritze targets for locking and killing, nor to they have to have backup there to help them execute these macroers that they've found guilty and passed sentence upon. All they do is exploit an AE weapon that quite honestly wasn't intended to be used in empire in that fashion. And "justifying" their exploit in that regard makes you no better than the macroers that you kill when you have to stoop to their level. Basically we are all supposed to empathize with this vigilante because "it would be too hard" for him to actually organize suicide kestrel\caracal squads to perform these same tasks. Or it might actually happen that through the act of tackling a devious macroer a kessie or caracal might be lost to concordokken before it would be able to inflict damage\kills itself. Smartbombs make the would-be vigilante TOO POWERFUL of a self appointed "sherrif." And until someone explains to me why those with inordinate\abnormally large and unhealthy amounts of playtime is any different of an "inappropriate RL influence" on Eve as ebay and RL cash is, then you will find me being VERY skeptical about how powerful vigilante weapons can be. It would seem to me that your argument is that "they are being too effective". Seems to me that if they are willing to sacrife something as large as a BS and take the security hit, all of which is within game mechanics, then it is far dink'um. Other than that... your argument is pretty silly. And you still have not come up with an alternate response to Macro-Mining... Actually the best method is the one that requires less intervention and doesn't rely actively on players to work. One poster, who pointed to rock bottom common mineral prices, understands what I mean in this regard. Plus you didn't address my point in regards to the extreme antiebay animus on the part of the OP and the fact that such a perspective is highly suspect in view of the fact that there are all sorts of IRL inputs(not all of which the OP gives a damn about) into this game that impact the "level playing field" you so dearly value. It just comes off reeking of "get rid of someone elses advantage whilst leaving mine alone."
Cummilla	Posted - 2005.12.02 19:54:00 - [97] Originally by: Osric Bloodletter Actually, simply kill the hauler with a suicide ship. Then use a hauler of your own to constantly empty the can to pay back your losses. :) When you've earned enough to buy more suicide ships, kill off the miners and sell the loot. This seems sensible. Same with sonofolio's idea of wardeccing. The point is that the OP's approach of smartbombing is overboard and is as evasive of the spirit of game mechanics as the macroers are.
Bongo Smith	Posted - 2005.12.02 21:35:00 - [98] Originally by: Cummilla so dearly value. It just comes off reeking of "get rid of someone elses advantage whilst leaving mine alone." You do realise it would be less of an effort and more profitable if we all simply started macroing for ISK, too, instead of fighting this thing? It's a thought that has crossed my mind more and more as I watch the same typed-with-fist names sit in the same belts for days and days. You fail to address the fact that macroing and selling ISK on eBay is forbidden by the EULA. Yet both are rampant, and it appears CCP is not lifting a finger to do anything about it (well, they are vehemently CLAIMING to do a lot about it, yet I SEE nothing done about it). At some point I will decide that they have, through inactivity, changed the rule, and turn from a macro hunter to a macro miner. As will many others (I think many already have: The number of macroers has exploded). That day the game dies. The price of ISK has now dropped to ONE THIRD in dollars from what it was 4 months ago. That's either because they're not selling a lot (I doubt it), or because there are so many ISK farmers, with such a lucrative business, that they're competing with each other for the customers lining up.
Sreyaluskaya Moyl	Posted - 2005.12.02 21:36:00 - [99] Originally by: Cummilla Actually the best method is the one that requires less intervention and doesn't rely actively on players to work. One poster, who pointed to rock bottom common mineral prices, understands what I mean in this regard. Yes, when I posted that it got me thinking, can I "market PvP" them? Theoretically you could fill all buy orders in all stations in the systems where they operate, then place system buy order for 0.01 ISK. Perhaps even do it on a station by station basis, - follow the hauler to the station, fill buy order (NPC or player) & make a huge margin. Logistically though, well I won't even bother doing the maths for Jita. Might work elsewhere, but I'm assuming an awful lot - that macroers sell in the station they dock at, for a start - there may be a real person freightering it all where the price is good. Trade skills could help with setting the buy orders, but not with the filling of the existing orders. But then again, you only have to fill player orders once really, NPC order comes back daily, and are a fixed cost.... hmm this merits more thought. Originally by: Cummilla Plus you didn't address my point in regards to the extreme antiebay animus ..." Well yes, but trouble is, it's not an in-game advantage to the macroers, it just ends up an in-game advantage to those who can spend extra real money on the game, the people macroers sell ISK to. But let's not have this discussion again here. In the right cirumstances, a combination of market and suicide pvp could beat these guys (in the sense of increasing their costs) - when some of them went off to that distant system yesterday, I bet we could make it so they would have to either shift the minerals they mined to a good price or accept 0.01 isk. Hard to keep it up day after day though...
Bongo Smith	Posted - 2005.12.02 21:51:00 - [100] Originally by: Cummilla Originally by: Osric Bloodletter Actually, simply kill the hauler with a suicide ship. Then use a hauler of your own to constantly empty the can to pay back your losses. :) When you've earned enough to buy more suicide ships, kill off the miners and sell the loot. This seems sensible. Same with sonofolio's idea of wardeccing. The point is that the OP's approach of smartbombing is overboard and is as evasive of the spirit of game mechanics as the macroers are. WTF? It's an out-of-game problem, why would you try and find some twisted "explainable in the game universe" solution to it? Something needs to be done, and trying to roleplay it out isn't the answer. What's your solution to Eve getting DOSsed (just an example, AFAIK Eve is not being DOSsed)? FOF missiles?
Pandemic Thinking	Posted - 2005.12.02 21:55:00 - [101] Originally by: Cummilla Plus you didn't address my point in regards to the extreme antiebay animus on the part of the OP and the fact that such a perspective is highly suspect in view of the fact that there are all sorts of IRL inputs(not all of which the OP gives a damn about) into this game that impact the "level playing field" you so dearly value. It just comes off reeking of "get rid of someone elses advantage whilst leaving mine alone." You really need to run that post by someone with an extra bit of puncuation. I assume that english is not your primary language, so I will avoid atacks in this vein. Why do they bother me? Simply put; they are not playing the game. (are you playing the game?) EVE is a Multiplayer universe, and it's enviornment is held is a rather fragile balance. In my home system, there was a number of belts that supported several corps, who mined and produced ships for the player base. In one week, a macro-miner came through and left nothing. Not a scrap of ore, and in turn, produced nothing, but isk that would appear on Ebay. Think of it in terms of aborginal cultures in the Amazon Rainforest. Agriculture based co-ops have slashed and burned large amounts of the rainforest, damaging the local native cultures and their ability to sustain a way of life. They now have to rely on outside assistance and their way of life is quickly disappearing. This is much the same way that Macro-miners and isk farmers gather up all the resources, and force the players to rely on purchases of isk to remain competitive in the EVE enviorment. He with the most cash, has the most isk, has the upper hand. The enviorment of EVE is no more self-contained and the player driven economy, and intergral part of EVE, is lost. This is why it is against the EULA. A Good Deed is nothing more than a Bad Deed in need of a Drink
Tawny Merekitain	Posted - 2005.12.02 22:07:00 - [102] good job ----------------------------------------------- Current ship: Maller class Cruiser
Sreyaluskaya Moyl	Posted - 2005.12.02 22:13:00 - [103] Arrg, No! Don't discuss why it's right or wrong please, there's plenty of threads for that. Have a think about the solutions instead. A combination of suicide and taking away the market through careful manipulation might work, it might at least drive up their costs stupidly! I've got loads of cash and probably would make a profit eventually on any assets I bought in any system (except the main hubs.) So, like the smartbombers, I probably wouldn't lose much in market pvp. Anyone got any experience of what macroers generally do with what they have macroed? (Anonymity guaranteed..) Do they - sell rocks immediately in station, or - sell refined rocks (minerals) almost immediately in station, or - not sell anything in system they are actually mining in and they take it elsewhere for best price. I would guess the first because it requires less macro sophistication?
Pandemic Thinking	Posted - 2005.12.03 01:27:00 - [104] I went into a high sec system to pick up a skill. In the local chat were 89 players; the system only has three belts. I look at the names and it was dozens of random string names and noob corps. So I check the belts and there were noob macro-miner characters, five days old in Omens, mining away on what there was. EVE's economy is being trashed by this horsesht and CCP CAN'T do a think about it??? Or is it that CCP doesn't feel the need to do anything about it? A Good Deed is nothing more than a Bad Deed in need of a Drink*
Skurlan	Posted - 2005.12.03 01:50:00 - [105] A better way is to bump the ships as close to each other as possible then you only need one ship to smart bomb them to oblivion, smaller loss
Taran Blake	Posted - 2005.12.03 02:04:00 - [106] What you need to do is to petition GM's for the return of lost security status.
Natas Liah	Posted - 2005.12.03 02:08:00 - [107] The same groups i first talked about are still mining even now, they do it almost non stop, i really feel sick when i think of what they are doing. Something terrible is coming for them... To be continued.
Clan MacGregor	Posted - 2005.12.03 02:12:00 - [108] We are kicking a player out of our corp that we found out was buying isk from a farmer. If only other corps would act in a similar manner.
Hellspawn666	Posted - 2005.12.03 02:22:00 - [109] I love macrominers
Natas Liah	Posted - 2005.12.03 02:37:00 - [110] Edited by: Natas Liah on 03/12/2005 02:37:34 RIP puntttr feingss lluuuty kokoto minynt temery Shengm MD stuented Darker Man All names who have been spotted working with the other macroers that i destroyed. 8 medium barges and an indy were destroyed in a single attack, you would have thought they would have learned how to avoid smartbomb attacks like that by now. I suppose it must be to much hastle for them to split up though as that would make the macro difficult to run.
Natas Liah	Posted - 2005.12.03 02:49:00 - [111] Actually to add, you would of thought by now that if these were normal players, they would have gotten used to the fact that its always this same character suicide bombing them, the second they see me in local i would have thought they'd stop the mining, but nope, i sit in local for about 15 minutes before making the attack and they dont even respond. Even when i warp into the belt they continue to mine rather than run. Definetly macroers.
Pandemic Thinking	Posted - 2005.12.03 03:45:00 - [112] Went on the attack and destroyed a barge, he was out in a new barge before the criminal tag flag ended. It's not even worth the time it takes to refit a kessie for another attack. CCP is too busy counting the cash.. A Good Deed is nothing more than a Bad Deed in need of a Drink
Martin Gore	Posted - 2005.12.03 15:32:00 - [113] How about make ice mining lasers 5-10 times the price :) that way when macro miners lose their lasers they lose out on a lot of isk. At the moment all they lose is insurance money and a few mill.
Sreyaluskaya Moyl	Posted - 2005.12.03 18:36:00 - [114] Hey, post where you're doing it please, I got paying customers queuing up to watch this. (Well, one person besides me, and he's not paying, but it's a start. No-one used to pay to watch football either in the beginning.)
Taihira	Posted - 2005.12.03 18:57:00 - [115] Macro ganking... the next big sport... placing bets on how many a competitor can take down in one session before concorde get 'em "roll up, roll up, place your bets" That should become part of the prime fiction
Corrd	Posted - 2005.12.03 20:03:00 - [116] Hey CCP, can I set up an ebay honeypot? Here's my pitch. CCP, provide me a free account and an infinite amount of isk, trit, pyerite, mex. You name it. Give it to me. I will then sell it on ebay and other auction sites for real money. After the purchase, I will provide you complete details of the purchaser for you to ban thereby removing what I sell from the EVE economy. I promise to use that infinite amount of isk, trit etc to sell on Ebay cheaper and at a range of common prices offered by the competition. By running a honeypot, I will cripple the business model of those who macro mine or farm for a profit by making the real life cash value of in-game items as close to zero whilst maintaining the in-game value of the items by its subsequent later removal by you, CCP. As you, CCP, have a complete and independent audit log of all in-game transactions made by the honeypot coupled with proofs of purchase will I provide to you, you will then have sufficient evidence to ban the purchaser (or dock from the character with a stern warning). My fee is whatever I make selling Eve-Online items on Ebay. It's win-win-win for the playing community, CCP and me. It's loss-loss for the sellers and buyers of eve in-game items on Ebay and other auction sites. Cheers
Maya Rkell	Posted - 2005.12.03 20:08:00 - [117] It's lose-lose because CCP just breached the Ebay ToS and so on. Won't work. "Corpse cannot be fitted onto ship. Only hardware modules can be fitted."
slip66	Posted - 2005.12.03 21:09:00 - [118] Originally by: Taran Blake What you need to do is to petition GM's for the return of lost security status. now thats a good idea!
Corrd	Posted - 2005.12.03 21:15:00 - [119] Technically, it would be me doing the breaching and not CCP. I'd even repay the money to those who make a complaint to Ebay. But I would be providing the mark with what they purchased. A different entity (CCP) would be taking it away after investigating a player in breach of their EULA. CCP can ban that character and set me up another. I won't be employed by CCP. All I have to say is sorry, My eve account got caught and banned. Here's your money back. Please come again.
Maya Rkell	Posted - 2005.12.03 21:16:00 - [120] Law dosn't work that way. "Corpse cannot be fitted onto ship. Only hardware modules can be fitted."

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