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dreadshane
Hell or HiWater
0
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Posted - 2013.09.15 17:30:00 -
[1] - Quote
All these new industial ship configurations, still nothing for the Orca.
Must I say it again, The ore bay should be the size of a Capital ship that it is. |
Dave Stark
3669
|
Posted - 2013.09.15 17:35:00 -
[2] - Quote
the orca is already better than the t1 industrials, what exactly do you want? |
Gianath
Gallentian Legitimate Businessmen
109
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Posted - 2013.09.15 18:12:00 -
[3] - Quote
Dave Stark wrote:the orca is already better than the t1 industrials, what exactly do you want?
I'll chime in.
#1 - The Orca's ore bay is only 50k versus a Mackinaw's 35. And an Orca is 68 times larger than a Mackinaw by volume. Yes, I know you can outfit the orca for additional cargo, but why even bother having an ore hold at all if you don't have a specialize bay that will even support two mining ships? Either the mining bay should be larger to account for the mining barge changes, or done away with entirely and just added to regular cargo space.
#2 - The Orca can only fit two mining barges inside unless you repackage and store them. It really needs an extra 50k of storage so it can carry an actual mining fleet.
Everything else about the Orca I love and don't think it needs updating. |
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
Working Stiffs
2104
|
Posted - 2013.09.15 18:33:00 -
[4] - Quote
Gianath wrote:#1 ... Either the mining bay should be larger to account for the mining barge changes, or done away with entirely and just added to regular cargo space.
Well, it won't be the cargohold, but that seems like a reasonable argument to me for a larger ore hold.
Gianath wrote:#2 - The Orca can only fit two mining barges inside unless you repackage and store them. It really needs an extra 50k of storage so it can carry an actual mining fleet.
Given past CCP remarks, I don't think this will happen, but if it did I suspect the Orca would lose its ability to be a general ship hauler, and only be able to cary industrials like the Rorqual.
|
Felicity Love
Whore and Peace
844
|
Posted - 2013.09.16 03:38:00 -
[5] - Quote
dreadshane wrote:All these new industial ship configurations, still nothing for the Orca.
Must I say it again, The ore bay should be the size of a Capital ship that it is.
Orca is performing as intended. The barges and exhumers it supports are performing as intended. The resource redistribution is performing as intended.
And it's all very dull and predictable and the economy is looking lethargic at times... which is to say, again, we need some NEW earth-shaking content from CCP because this summer was pretty damn boring compared to other summers.
Proud Beta Tester for "Bumping Uglies for Dummies" |
Salpad
Carebears with Attitude
373
|
Posted - 2013.09.16 04:17:00 -
[6] - Quote
Dave Stark wrote:the orca is already better than the t1 industrials, what exactly do you want?
Personally, I'd just like CCP to take a look at it, some time next year. Think it over. If they conclude that it's fine as it is, then that'd be okay with me. But every ship, that hasn't already got one, deserves a re-think. |
Derath Ellecon
Washburne Holdings
Situation: Normal
1569
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Posted - 2013.09.16 12:10:00 -
[7] - Quote
Dave Stark wrote:the orca is already better than the t1 industrials, what exactly do you want?
Except that it's not when it comes to Ore bay size.. The Miasmos can get an ore capacity of 68,000m3. |
Rengerel en Distel
1909
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Posted - 2013.09.16 13:43:00 -
[8] - Quote
Derath Ellecon wrote:Dave Stark wrote:the orca is already better than the t1 industrials, what exactly do you want? Except that it's not when it comes to Ore bay size.. The Miasmos can get an ore capacity of 68,000m3.
And what's the orca get with ore hold, cargo bay and fleet hangar? I'm guessing > 68k m3.
With the increase in shiptoasting, the Report timer needs to be shortened.
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Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
44581
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Posted - 2013.09.16 14:15:00 -
[9] - Quote
Gianath wrote:
#2 - The Orca can only fit two mining barges inside unless you repackage and store them. It really needs an extra 50k of storage so it can carry an actual mining fleet.
Bad idea. This would allow transport of unpackaged Battleships which is exactly why it is the size it currently is....and should stay.
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Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
44581
|
Posted - 2013.09.16 14:18:00 -
[10] - Quote
Rengerel en Distel wrote:Derath Ellecon wrote:Dave Stark wrote:the orca is already better than the t1 industrials, what exactly do you want? Except that it's not when it comes to Ore bay size.. The Miasmos can get an ore capacity of 68,000m3. And what's the orca get with ore hold, cargo bay and fleet hangar? I'm guessing > 68k m3.
Cargo Bay can vary with Expanders, but mine has total 144,000 m3. |
Emily Anasarsy
Reverse Engineering LTD
7
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Posted - 2013.09.16 14:29:00 -
[11] - Quote
Gianath wrote:Dave Stark wrote:the orca is already better than the t1 industrials, what exactly do you want? I'll chime in. #1 - The Orca's ore bay is only 50k versus a Mackinaw's 35. And an Orca is 68 times larger than a Mackinaw by volume. Yes, I know you can outfit the orca for additional cargo, but why even bother having an ore hold at all if you don't have a specialize bay that will even support two mining ships? Either the mining bay should be larger to account for the mining barge changes, or done away with entirely and just added to regular cargo space. #2 - The Orca can only fit two mining barges inside unless you repackage and store them. It really needs an extra 50k of storage so it can carry an actual mining fleet. Everything else about the Orca I love and don't think it needs updating.
The Orca may be 68 times larger than a Mack, so logic says the ore bay should be larger.
But your forgetting the orca is not just a ore bay.
It is:
Ore Bay
Cargo Hold
Ship Hanger
Fleet Storage
All this requires space, so unless you want to decrease the size of any of these spaces you wont fit much else in the mass of a orca.
Considering the ore bay only holds unrefined ore, if you were to decrease the cargo bay to increase the ore bay. How do you propose you transport refined minerals, they sure as hell wont go back in that ore bay you just demanded an increase of.
I am happy with how it is, filling the fleet bay, ore bay and cargo bay is more than enough for me before I go unload top up my drink and head out again.
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Dave Stark
3683
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Posted - 2013.09.16 17:27:00 -
[12] - Quote
Gianath wrote:Dave Stark wrote:the orca is already better than the t1 industrials, what exactly do you want? I'll chime in. #1 - The Orca's ore bay is only 50k versus a Mackinaw's 35. And an Orca is 68 times larger than a Mackinaw by volume. Yes, I know you can outfit the orca for additional cargo, but why even bother having an ore hold at all if you don't have a specialize bay that will even support two mining ships? Either the mining bay should be larger to account for the mining barge changes, or done away with entirely and just added to regular cargo space. #2 - The Orca can only fit two mining barges inside unless you repackage and store them. It really needs an extra 50k of storage so it can carry an actual mining fleet. Everything else about the Orca I love and don't think it needs updating.
#1
the orca also has a 40k fleet hangar, an i can't remember how large cargo bay and 400 (four hundred)k ship bay.
for ore alone the orca can have roughly four times the ore capacity of the mackinaw. that's great. besides, if you have an orca why the **** are you in a mackinaw? this is what the hulk is for.
#2
depends on the barge, i can get 4 skiffs in an orca. |
Victoria Sin
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
463
|
Posted - 2013.09.16 18:49:00 -
[13] - Quote
If you're going to give love to an industrial, the Rorqual needs some work. The Fleet hanger is far too small. The ore hold should be open for fleet access (OK, if it is already I can't find the option). |
Dave Stark
3683
|
Posted - 2013.09.16 19:29:00 -
[14] - Quote
Victoria Sin wrote:If you're going to give love to an industrial, the Rorqual needs some work. The Fleet hanger is far too small. The ore hold should be open for fleet access (OK, if it is already I can't find the option).
ore bays aren't open to the fleet, afaik. generally it's up to the rorq pilot to drag it from the fleet hangar to the ore bay.
not like the rorq pilot has much else to do other than run compression jobs... |
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
Working Stiffs
2105
|
Posted - 2013.09.16 19:41:00 -
[15] - Quote
Victoria Sin wrote:If you're going to give love to an industrial, the Rorqual needs some work. The Fleet hanger is far too small. The ore hold should be open for fleet access (OK, if it is already I can't find the option).
Only the corp fleet hangar is accessible. Same for Orca and Rorqual (and any ship with a corp fleet hangar).
Corp Hangars on ships and You |
Victoria Sin
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
463
|
Posted - 2013.09.16 20:07:00 -
[16] - Quote
Dave Stark wrote:Victoria Sin wrote:If you're going to give love to an industrial, the Rorqual needs some work. The Fleet hanger is far too small. The ore hold should be open for fleet access (OK, if it is already I can't find the option). ore bays aren't open to the fleet, afaik. generally it's up to the rorq pilot to drag it from the fleet hangar to the ore bay. not like the rorq pilot has much else to do other than run compression jobs...
Except he can't fit a full Mackinaw worth into his bay. |
Cap James Tkirk
Soldiers of Farscape
The East India Co.
111
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Posted - 2013.09.16 20:57:00 -
[17] - Quote
Victoria Sin wrote:Dave Stark wrote:Victoria Sin wrote:If you're going to give love to an industrial, the Rorqual needs some work. The Fleet hanger is far too small. The ore hold should be open for fleet access (OK, if it is already I can't find the option). ore bays aren't open to the fleet, afaik. generally it's up to the rorq pilot to drag it from the fleet hangar to the ore bay. not like the rorq pilot has much else to do other than run compression jobs... Except he can't fit a full Mackinaw worth into his bay.
but if your mining in a mack its easier to dock or go to POS and dump the ore you really dont need the orca for hauling since Macks are meant to do it themselves |
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
Working Stiffs
2105
|
Posted - 2013.09.16 22:50:00 -
[18] - Quote
Cap James Tkirk wrote:but if your mining in a mack its easier to dock or go to POS and dump the ore you really dont need the orca for hauling since Macks are meant to do it themselves
Or you drop a jetcan and let an Orca or Miasmos (or even Noctis + freighter) worry about it. |
Kelmurdoch
Di-Tron Heavy Industries
Insidious Empire
15
|
Posted - 2013.09.17 12:41:00 -
[19] - Quote
Outside of boosting in high sec the Orca was rendered useless with the new Industrials just released.
Increase its ore hold to comparable with the Rorqual and it becomes worth dealing with, again. And/or give it mineral and PI bays.
But the real red-headed stepchild of industrial ships are the Deep Space Transports. Those things are completely outclassed now. |
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
44728
|
Posted - 2013.09.17 12:46:00 -
[20] - Quote
Victoria Sin wrote:The ore hold should be open for fleet access (OK, if it is already I can't find the option).
Even before the change, Fleet members could only dump ore into the same place. It was called the Corp Hangar.
They just made it scannable and changed the name to Fleet Hangar.
Why would Fleet members need a 2nd place to put ore on the same ship ? |
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
44747
|
Posted - 2013.09.17 12:49:00 -
[21] - Quote
Kelmurdoch wrote:Outside of boosting in high sec the Orca was rendered useless with the new Industrials just released.
 U so fu-nny.
Which Industrial can carry 90,000+ m3 of product ? (ore excluded) |
Lors Dornick
Kallisti Industries
Solar Assault Fleet
662
|
Posted - 2013.09.17 13:35:00 -
[22] - Quote
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:Kelmurdoch wrote:Outside of boosting in high sec the Orca was rendered useless with the new Industrials just released.
U so fu-nny. Which Industrial can carry 90,000+ m3 of product ? (ore excluded)
Or 400.000m3 of assembled (and possibly rigged) ships.
CCP Eterne: Silly player, ALL devs are evil.
CCP Fozzie: When Veritas describes a programming challenge as "very hard" I tend to believe him.
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dreadshane
Hell or HiWater
0
|
Posted - 2013.09.17 15:06:00 -
[23] - Quote
Gianath wrote:Dave Stark wrote:the orca is already better than the t1 industrials, what exactly do you want? I'll chime in. #1 - The Orca's ore bay is only 50k versus a Mackinaw's 35. And an Orca is 68 times larger than a Mackinaw by volume. Yes, I know you can outfit the orca for additional cargo, but why even bother having an ore hold at all if you don't have a specialize bay that will even support two mining ships? Either the mining bay should be larger to account for the mining barge changes, or done away with entirely and just added to regular cargo space. #2 - The Orca can only fit two mining barges inside unless you repackage and store them. It really needs an extra 50k of storage so it can carry an actual mining fleet. Everything else about the Orca I love and don't think it needs updating.
my point exactly, it would be nice to hear from the Devs on this |
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
44772
|
Posted - 2013.09.17 15:13:00 -
[24] - Quote
Gianath wrote:Dave Stark wrote:the orca is already better than the t1 industrials, what exactly do you want? I'll chime in. #1 - but why even bother having an ore hold at all if you don't have a specialize bay that will even support two mining ships? #2 - The Orca can only fit two mining barges inside unless you repackage and store them. It really needs an extra 50k of storage so it can carry an actual mining fleet. Everything else about the Orca I love and don't think it needs updating.
1) Each of my Macks dumps the contents from mining into the Orca exactly twice to fill it. It does indeed support a 2 person mining fleet, and quite nicely thank you.
2) 50K is not enough to carry another assembled mining ship. Sorry.
|
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
Working Stiffs
2105
|
Posted - 2013.09.17 15:20:00 -
[25] - Quote
dreadshane wrote:my point exactly, it would be nice to hear from the Devs on this
Devs don't post in this forum. Try F & I if you want a dev to see it. |
Kelmurdoch
Di-Tron Heavy Industries
Insidious Empire
15
|
Posted - 2013.09.17 17:41:00 -
[26] - Quote
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:Gianath wrote:Dave Stark wrote:the orca is already better than the t1 industrials, what exactly do you want? I'll chime in. #1 - but why even bother having an ore hold at all if you don't have a specialize bay that will even support two mining ships? #2 - The Orca can only fit two mining barges inside unless you repackage and store them. It really needs an extra 50k of storage so it can carry an actual mining fleet. Everything else about the Orca I love and don't think it needs updating. 1) Each of my Macks dumps the contents from mining into the Orca exactly twice to fill it. It does indeed support a 2 person mining fleet, and quite nicely thank you. 2) 50K is not enough to carry another assembled mining ship. Sorry.
A two person mining fleet supported by an Orca is a waste of a pilot. You'll mine more material with a third Mack instead. |
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
44833
|
Posted - 2013.09.17 18:22:00 -
[27] - Quote
Kelmurdoch wrote:Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:Gianath wrote:Dave Stark wrote:the orca is already better than the t1 industrials, what exactly do you want? I'll chime in. #1 - but why even bother having an ore hold at all if you don't have a specialize bay that will even support two mining ships? #2 - The Orca can only fit two mining barges inside unless you repackage and store them. It really needs an extra 50k of storage so it can carry an actual mining fleet. Everything else about the Orca I love and don't think it needs updating. 1) Each of my Macks dumps the contents from mining into the Orca exactly twice to fill it. It does indeed support a 2 person mining fleet, and quite nicely thank you. 2) 50K is not enough to carry another assembled mining ship. Sorry. A two person mining fleet supported by an Orca is a waste of a pilot. You'll mine more material with a third Mack instead.
Wrong. Dead wrong. Too slow without the Orca Boost. This has been beaten to death in GD as fact for years. Please, do keep up.
Believe what you want, but don't try to out-do my 3 1/2 years of almost all combos of mining fleets. |
Mac Munoz
Only One Corp
8
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Posted - 2013.09.17 19:05:00 -
[28] - Quote
Wait, you guys have your Orca's leave the POS? |
Dave Stark
3691
|
Posted - 2013.09.17 19:10:00 -
[29] - Quote
Victoria Sin wrote:Dave Stark wrote:Victoria Sin wrote:If you're going to give love to an industrial, the Rorqual needs some work. The Fleet hanger is far too small. The ore hold should be open for fleet access (OK, if it is already I can't find the option). ore bays aren't open to the fleet, afaik. generally it's up to the rorq pilot to drag it from the fleet hangar to the ore bay. not like the rorq pilot has much else to do other than run compression jobs... Except he can't fit a full Mackinaw worth into his bay.
except he can when the fleet hangar is 40k, and the ore bay is 50k.
40k and 50k are both greater than 35k.
edit: oh we're talking about the rorqual, and i see, it's curious that it has a smaller fleet hangar than the orca... shame this thread is about orcas not rorquals |
Dave Stark
3692
|
Posted - 2013.09.17 20:39:00 -
[30] - Quote
Derath Ellecon wrote:Dave Stark wrote:the orca is already better than the t1 industrials, what exactly do you want? Except that it's not when it comes to Ore bay size.. The Miasmos can get an ore capacity of 68,000m3.
and the orca can get a total capacity of around 92k from 1 bay alone. also, a bay that can hold anything.
next irrelevant argument? |
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