.. If they were taking over FW space by mining asteroids, you analogy would be closer to the mark, but that's not what's going on, now is it?

Stabbed mining ships (ventures) sitting still in a plex is basically that (except no minerals are extracted, just lp and control of the system).

Just to tell a little story myself relative to the matter, earlier today i opened up a medium plex in nenna,me beeing cal mil it was offensive plexing. For all the right reasons of fw i was hoping to get a good fight but if none came i was happy to get the lp. In the course of 15 out of the 20 minutes i was visited frequently by 3 other cal mil guys from the npc miltia corp in t1 frigs. Around 3 mins left on the plex they suddenly left , i was not looking at d-scan, only to see seconds later a gal mil punisher and fed navy comet came in(i was in a comet aswell) and because i wasnt watching d-scan i got tackled,somehow i managed to pull a win by fending of the comet and close orbit kiling the punisher after. And quickly after that my 3 " buddies" came back right before plex was done... Yey for pro cal mil ( leachers )...

Conclusion, because the curent plex mechanics is so bad it has given birth to these types of players ( whom i can easly assume they had stabs ). God knows if the standing hit was not affecting my corp from beeing booted and looking bad id be shooting npc miltia blues all day long because that is what they deserve!

You wanna join fw to make isk?,fine by me but go run missions damnit.
You wanna join fw to make isk BUT also care to defend your plex or help take systems? Great! Lemme throw out the red carpet you ar more then welcomed to share my plex!

We need a change!

Even so, as the rest of my post points out, occupying and utilizing land is a historically valid tactic for taking control of territory.

It's not how I want to spend my time in game, and I'll leave aside the argument of whether it is good or bad for the game state, but my point was about whether such tactics existed in history.

Hm you're right.

I think they should also disable warp drives inside of plexes, cuz targets might warp out, too. That is clearly OP and "depressing". Warp drives should be disabled within 100km of the button until the site is completed.

I could be wrong, but it appears the only ones against this minor suggestion of altering the timer roll back are those defending the incredibly low risk/reward of farming FW plexes provides and are either not in FW or are themselves taking advantage of this abuse.

If that is the case then acknowledging the imbalance this creates and altering it is of no use since it does not impact them except when they need to switch their farming alt to another faction when the tiers change.

Please correct me if I am wrong.

Yeah I noticed that too. Funny how current pilots in FW Corps from all factions want timer roll backs, the only people arguing to keep the status quo aren't even in FW.

Well i have not been much for FW till recently and have lead my corp into it. After roughly a week i can understand the farming aspect of things, i think TIMER rollbacks should be implented.

The only other thing i believe should be implented ust for FW plexes is the fact that ONLY FW militia should be able to enter them....no nuetral parties should be allowed.

Sure they can camp and blob the gates, or belts or what not......but every single outpost site and FW mission ite should be regulated to FW Milita pilots only. Then you can keep all the other stuff since only FW pilots will be fighting mostly over the things they should be fighting over.

Such implentation would prevent persons that are not militia from ganging groups that are focused in actually playing the FW aspect.....defending or attacking outposts so they can dontae LP to the hubs for system control. Not having to worry if high end alts or mains are going to jump them for no reason at all but to pad their KB's.

Then if you want in the damn outpost sites then you will have to join FW.

I disagree. Letting them into the plex makes for much better Pew. Just have the rats attack them as well and give em a suspect timer when they activate the gate.

Well i have not been much for FW till recently and have lead my corp into it. After roughly a week i can understand the farming aspect of things, i think TIMER rollbacks should be implented.

The only other thing i believe should be implented ust for FW plexes is the fact that ONLY FW militia should be able to enter them....no nuetral parties should be allowed.

Sure they can camp and blob the gates, or belts or what not......but every single outpost site and FW mission ite should be regulated to FW Milita pilots only. Then you can keep all the other stuff since only FW pilots will be fighting mostly over the things they should be fighting over.

Such implentation would prevent persons that are not militia from ganging groups that are focused in actually playing the FW aspect.....defending or attacking outposts so they can dontae LP to the hubs for system control. Not having to worry if high end alts or mains are going to jump them for no reason at all but to pad their KB's.

Then if you want in the damn outpost sites then you will have to join FW.

This is very common at the minute, I lost my standings for running fw missions over shooting at those guys, I know of at least 20 players and thats all they do. Stabs and cloaks are not the only way to do it, all you need is a safe spot and an atron, just warp in look at the timers warp out sit in safe spot while the other poor sap runs down the timer, then come back at the last few seconds for LP. I would rather see a neutral come into the plex than another caldari guy because if you awox your militia bro you lose standings and probably the guy will be able to warp off anyway. Even If you do manage to kill him he made more isk from the LP he stole off you than he lost in his ship. I really do hate that and there seems no way to stamp it out, not even these changes.

I've started moving outside the 30km area to stop the clock for a couple of minutes when I see someone try it, that way when he comes back you still have a few minutes to kill him before he can take your lp, no way around the standings loss though

Doesn't anyone think if the FW isk was made harder to get with FW alts, then the mains that these stabbed alts feed might PvP less as a side-effect. Or least pvp much more cheaply, and probably herd towards the blob for more safety.

Who knows if that deadspace fit Vindi you and your pals were so hyped up after taking down was paid by a FW alt? (Stabbed or not)

They will still be able to farm, Timer Rollbacks will just dent em a little bit, not put them out of business. Also, plenty of PVP is to be had grinding plexes, if mains had to do more of it there would be even more plex fighting in 1 v 1 or small gang.

Also, I assume your signature is because you are a farming alt?

.....True that

Doesn't anyone think if the FW isk was made harder to get with FW alts, then the mains that these stabbed alts feed might PvP less as a side-effect. Or least pvp much more cheaply, and probably herd towards the blob for more safety.

Who knows if that deadspace fit Vindi you and your pals were so hyped up after taking down was paid by a FW alt? (Stabbed or not)

Interesting.

When Caldari had to deal with the Gallente stabbed/cloaked farmers earlier in the year we were told 'working as intended - HTFU'. You had no problem with it when these farmers were on your side.

We would have slightly less farmers at the moment than the Gals had during their wz push.
I do not see many Amarr in our region at teh moment.
However when the Gallente pushed they had every cloaky stabby Minmatar in eve helping them. Once again - they had no issue with FW mechanics during this time.


I am not saying there is no issue or HTFU.
I personally believe that plex gates should restrict all ships with cloaks and stabs just as they restrict oversized ships.
This is a true fix.

Timer roll backs will result in a stagnant warzone. It's a good idea in theory but in practice will result in the same amount of farming.
The difference is that dplexs will be the most farmed which will cause the stagnation.


Dplexing will be a matter of chase wt. Write down how long till the plex finishes rolling back. Dock. Go back when timer has rolled back and finish the plex.
Just another form of risk free farming that also makes home systems 100% safe by reducing the time investment (by up to 1/2) required to defend it.

There is also the issue of sec loss with regards to neutrals .. perhaps it is time to ask for plex grids to be treated as null space, complete with ability to bubble so that one can kill whomever one choses with no ill effects other than possible hatred

Interesting.

When Caldari had to deal with the Gallente stabbed/cloaked farmers earlier in the year we were told 'working as intended - HTFU'. You had no problem with it when these farmers were on your side.

We would have slightly less farmers at the moment than the Gals had during their wz push.
I do not see many Amarr in our region at teh moment.
However when the Gallente pushed they had every cloaky stabby Minmatar in eve helping them. Once again - they had no issue with FW mechanics during this time.


I am not saying there is no issue or HTFU.
I personally believe that plex gates should restrict all ships with cloaks and stabs just as they restrict oversized ships.
This is a true fix.

Timer roll backs will result in a stagnant warzone. It's a good idea in theory but in practice will result in the same amount of farming.
The difference is that dplexs will be the most farmed which will cause the stagnation.


Dplexing will be a matter of chase wt. Write down how long till the plex finishes rolling back. Dock. Go back when timer has rolled back and finish the plex.
Just another form of risk free farming that also makes home systems 100% safe by reducing the time investment (by up to 1/2) required to defend it.

I don't FW anymore, but I know if they nerfed it, then lowsec would become even more barren than it is.

Consider it the price to pay for you to have targets.

Well i have not been much for FW till recently and have lead my corp into it. After roughly a week i can understand the farming aspect of things, i think TIMER rollbacks should be implented.

The only other thing i believe should be implented ust for FW plexes is the fact that ONLY FW militia should be able to enter them....no nuetral parties should be allowed.

Sure they can camp and blob the gates, or belts or what not......but every single outpost site and FW mission ite should be regulated to FW Milita pilots only. Then you can keep all the other stuff since only FW pilots will be fighting mostly over the things they should be fighting over.

Such implentation would prevent persons that are not militia from ganging groups that are focused in actually playing the FW aspect.....defending or attacking outposts so they can dontae LP to the hubs for system control. Not having to worry if high end alts or mains are going to jump them for no reason at all but to pad their KB's.

Then if you want in the damn outpost sites then you will have to join FW.

Interesting.

When Caldari had to deal with the Gallente stabbed/cloaked farmers earlier in the year we were told 'working as intended - HTFU'. You had no problem with it when these farmers were on your side.

We would have slightly less farmers at the moment than the Gals had during their wz push.
I do not see many Amarr in our region at teh moment.
However when the Gallente pushed they had every cloaky stabby Minmatar in eve helping them. Once again - they had no issue with FW mechanics during this time.


I am not saying there is no issue or HTFU.
I personally believe that plex gates should restrict all ships with cloaks and stabs just as they restrict oversized ships.
This is a true fix.

Timer roll backs will result in a stagnant warzone. It's a good idea in theory but in practice will result in the same amount of farming.
The difference is that dplexs will be the most farmed which will cause the stagnation.


Dplexing will be a matter of chase wt. Write down how long till the plex finishes rolling back. Dock. Go back when timer has rolled back and finish the plex.
Just another form of risk free farming that also makes home systems 100% safe by reducing the time investment (by up to 1/2) required to defend it.

There is also the issue of sec loss with regards to neutrals .. perhaps it is time to ask for plex grids to be treated as null space, complete with ability to bubble so that one can kill whomever one choses with no ill effects other than possible hatred

PvP is not lacking in FW. No one ever said that, you have assumed that.

Why is this an issue: Because our ability to enjoy the game we like (or used to like in some cases) and the aspect that we as a group like most about it (FW) is directly affected by those who have no interest in that aspect other than abusing the risk/reward ratio to isk gain. We all want a healthy FW aspect of Eve and blowing up ships is just one part of it.

Back to the Root cause of our issue: The risk/reward for "farming" and the impact is has on WZ control is creating an imbalance between factions that if persists will be to the detriment of the FW aspect of Eve.

All we are asking for a relatively small adjustment in FW plex mechanics that begin to address the imbalanced risk vs. reward of farming FW solely for the purpose of making isk.

The only folks impacted by this are the pure isk farmers and even then it would at most be a minor inconvenience.