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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 4 post(s) |

Sgt Ocker
Last Bastion of Freedom
127
|
Posted - 2014.03.02 13:49:00 -
[271] - Quote
Itago Gemulus wrote: No idea where you get 150% boost from, it already have 5 effective drones so its a 60% boost to drone dps, and 50% bonus to missile dps. Something that should work out to between 50% and 60% total dps bonus (to lazy to do the math atm)
I was sure "missile" bonus used to be on ships like raven/golem and most missile ships, but it looks like that have been changed :( The diffrence between rocket/torpedo and missile is still that a rocket/torpedo IS a for of missile (more spesific than just missile) where a missile would be rocket/torpedo, light/cruise missile and every other missile. Worm may have gotten a general bonus to all missiles since it cant realy fit anything larger than frigate launchers anyway, but not limiting it to rocket or light missile does still lean toward long+short range missile systems for Gila/RS.
Sorry your right.. It is about 60% increase but really is a frigate with 300DPS and drones with the EHP of a Frigate really the way to go?
The last balance changes saw a lot of missiles bonuses made specific. Some have no bonuses to RHML, RLML, some have 1 of 2 bonuses, Cruise, RHML, Torps, have been given specific bonuses. Look at the bonuses on the Raven and Typhoon, Snake has no bonus to heavy missiles. Gila currently has 50% velocity to lights, if it gets a 50% damage bonus to lights with the re-balance, giving it 6 effective launchers, there may be a role for RLML.
A hint from CCP as to when these "proposed" changes will be available on the test server would be nice. I hope it is not going to be another RLML, RHML release with no testing on sisi prior to release. Summer (release date) is getting close, so unless player feedback is totally irrelevant, getting them onto the test server should happen soon. |

Itago Gemulus
Station Spinners United
7
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Posted - 2014.03.02 13:54:00 -
[272] - Quote
I totaly agree thast the proposed changes should hit test server asap, and seeing as there are very few critics in that thread we should see them on test server sooner rather than later.
Worm beeing to good or not is irrelevant to this thread atm, changes are not yet on test server and most likely Gila will have its pass before we get to the RS (winter or next summer is my guess) |

Sgt Ocker
Last Bastion of Freedom
127
|
Posted - 2014.03.02 16:32:00 -
[273] - Quote
Itago Gemulus wrote:I totaly agree thast the proposed changes should hit test server asap, and seeing as there are very few critics in that thread we should see them on test server sooner rather than later.
Worm beeing to good or not is irrelevant to this thread atm, changes are not yet on test server and most likely Gila will have its pass before we get to the RS (winter or next summer is my guess) Agreed. I do think though that any changes to pirate faction battleships is going to have a huge impact on the already iffy place the Nestor will be trying to take in the lineup. Without something to make it stand out from others in class (which it currently does not have) the way in which it can be obtained is somewhat irrelevant
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Arthur Aihaken
Perkone Caldari State
2966
|
Posted - 2014.03.04 17:19:00 -
[274] - Quote
So when are these kicking in? The Nestor is still hovering around $1.5-billion... I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week. |

Brutor Trash
Republic University Minmatar Republic
0
|
Posted - 2014.03.05 06:05:00 -
[275] - Quote
SOMEONE NERF CCP RISE |

Hasikan Miallok
Republic University Minmatar Republic
392
|
Posted - 2014.03.05 23:10:00 -
[276] - Quote
Arthur Aihaken wrote:So when are these kicking in? The Nestor is still hovering around $1.5-billion...
Don't expect any rapid change in price. The announcement has probably effectively killed Nestor production from SOE BPCs (Astero and Stratios give same returns and turnover quickly so less risk of getting "caught" with those if the price drops).
The initial contract price for "found" Nestor BPC is likely to float just under the SOE cost for a while until supply of the cheaper ones puts a downward pressure on the market. Even if people sell the BPC relatively cheaply, experienced manufacturers are unlikely to massive undercut the current stable price.
Its a relatively "shallow" market though so price changes will occur, just not the first week. |

Arthur Aihaken
Perkone Caldari State
2981
|
Posted - 2014.03.06 03:06:00 -
[277] - Quote
Hasikan Miallok wrote:Don't expect any rapid change in price. The announcement has probably effectively killed Nestor production from SOE BPCs (Astero and Stratios give same returns and turnover quickly so less risk of getting "caught" with those if the price drops). I'm not even expecting any gradual change in price until the Nestor is revamped into something ultimately more useful. I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week. |

Sintiar Loffwagea
The Scope Gallente Federation
0
|
Posted - 2014.03.06 17:03:00 -
[278] - Quote
isn't it's will be bashing SOE Nestor industrials at this currently states ? . it's would be other way that make Nestor more isk/performance |

Harrissaran
Tactical Response And Protection
0
|
Posted - 2014.03.08 06:57:00 -
[279] - Quote
So the Grind for my Nestor... hrmm, just like a RL prestige car, it looses its market value the minute you drive it off the forecourt!!
oh well!
('least it will be more cheep to replace when I loose it in a drunken fumble of button mashing!) |

Onictus
Silver Snake Enterprise Fatal Ascension
870
|
Posted - 2014.03.08 07:44:00 -
[280] - Quote
Sgt Ocker wrote: I'm no math expert but I'm pretty sure 300% = 6 drones not 8.
You are right, you are no math expert
100% = x2, 200% = x3, 300% = x4
4x2=8
If there are any other pre-algebra level math questions I'm here all day.
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Sgt Ocker
Last Bastion of Freedom
128
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Posted - 2014.03.08 10:35:00 -
[281] - Quote
Onictus wrote:Sgt Ocker wrote: I'm no math expert but I'm pretty sure 300% = 6 drones not 8.
You are right, you are no math expert 100% = x2, 200% = x3, 300% = x4 4x2=8 If there are any other pre-algebra level math questions I'm here all day. Yeah I left school over 40 years ago so have probably forgotten more than you currently think you know. Just so your ego can get a further little boost, I was wrong.. Feel better now?
Regardless of whether it is 6 or 8, until the changes are available on sisi for player testing there is no way to know if we have another RLML, RHML situation being dumped on us.
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Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
1129
|
Posted - 2014.03.08 11:06:00 -
[282] - Quote
Mournful Conciousness wrote:You could give the rattlesnake 2000dps and its still not going to be as useful or popular as the pirate ships with asymmetric warfare bonuses. Machariel : speed + range Bhaalgorn: deadly neuts + unescapable webs Vindicator : web lockdown
rattlesnake needs something else.
Especially since the Vindi gets up around that DPS mark also. So even if the Snake gets the same treatment as the worm then it still won't be better than a Vindi. |

Catherine Laartii
Knights of Xibalba
100
|
Posted - 2014.03.11 17:13:00 -
[283] - Quote
Could you also try to put loot back into drones to make them useful again to rat? It would be nice if you changed drones in the drone regions to drop loot and bpc's like you have had with pirates, but add new 'rogue drone' pirate faction modules and things. It would be nice to see the Drone Regions become profitable again, and have t1 mission drones drop some added meta-level drone mods much in the same way normal mission npc's drop module loot. |

Silivar Karkun
Imperial Shipment Amarr Empire
194
|
Posted - 2014.03.12 15:13:00 -
[284] - Quote
may i remind you people that we have a thread for discussion about the (awful) propositions of CCP Rise for pirate faction ships in this subforum, this thread must be about the SoE ships...... |

Arthur Aihaken
Arsenite
3054
|
Posted - 2014.03.12 22:14:00 -
[285] - Quote
Silivar Karkun wrote:may i remind you people that we have a thread for discussion about the (awful) propositions of CCP Rise for pirate faction ships in this subforum, this thread must be about the SoE ships...... Nestor prices actually went up, so I see this is working as intended.  I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week. |

Hasikan Miallok
Republic University Minmatar Republic
422
|
Posted - 2014.03.12 23:08:00 -
[286] - Quote
Arthur Aihaken wrote:Silivar Karkun wrote:may i remind you people that we have a thread for discussion about the (awful) propositions of CCP Rise for pirate faction ships in this subforum, this thread must be about the SoE ships...... Nestor prices actually went up, so I see this is working as intended. 
Probably becasue they buffed the Nestor quite a bit in 1.3, more cap for RR and doubled the RR range.
Astero prices dropped about 20% as patch day approached. |

Arthur Aihaken
Arsenite
3054
|
Posted - 2014.03.12 23:45:00 -
[287] - Quote
Hasikan Miallok wrote:Probably becasue they buffed the Nestor quite a bit in 1.3, more cap for RR and doubled the RR range. So does this mean it's now useful? I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week. |

Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
1137
|
Posted - 2014.03.13 00:10:00 -
[288] - Quote
Arthur Aihaken wrote:Hasikan Miallok wrote:Probably becasue they buffed the Nestor quite a bit in 1.3, more cap for RR and doubled the RR range. So does this mean it's now useful? Not really no. But it means people might try it a little more. Than it's previous terrible state. |

Arthur Aihaken
Arsenite
3054
|
Posted - 2014.03.13 00:33:00 -
[289] - Quote
Nevyn Auscent wrote:Not really no. But it means people might try it a little more. Than it's previous terrible state. So it's less bad? Not sure if that's a ringing endorsement, lol.  I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week. |

Eve's Supplier
Proxius corp
0
|
Posted - 2014.03.13 18:01:00 -
[290] - Quote
CCP Rise wrote: the long term value of Sisters LP won't be affected because of the reason stated above: the LP:ISK value is controlled by probe launchers and implants rather than Sisters ships. I'm calling bullshit. Value of ships goes down, making them even less desirable to put LP into. More LP into probe launchers and implants, increasing supply for a static demand. Value of launchers and implants goes down, driving down LP:ISK value. |

Lucine Delacourt
The Covenant of Blood
103
|
Posted - 2014.03.13 22:02:00 -
[291] - Quote
Eve's Supplier wrote:CCP Rise wrote: the long term value of Sisters LP won't be affected because of the reason stated above: the LP:ISK value is controlled by probe launchers and implants rather than Sisters ships. I'm calling bullshit. Value of ships goes down, making them even less desirable to put LP into. More LP into probe launchers and implants, increasing supply for a static demand. Value of launchers and implants goes down, driving down LP:ISK value.
SOE LP was worth a lot before the ships existed at all, stands to reason that you could give the ships away and the LP would still retain value. |

Sgt Ocker
Last Bastion of Freedom
129
|
Posted - 2014.03.13 23:04:00 -
[292] - Quote
Lucine Delacourt wrote:Eve's Supplier wrote:CCP Rise wrote: the long term value of Sisters LP won't be affected because of the reason stated above: the LP:ISK value is controlled by probe launchers and implants rather than Sisters ships. I'm calling bullshit. Value of ships goes down, making them even less desirable to put LP into. More LP into probe launchers and implants, increasing supply for a static demand. Value of launchers and implants goes down, driving down LP:ISK value. SOE LP was worth a lot before the ships existed at all, stands to reason that you could give the ships away and the LP would still retain value. CCP has ensured SOE LP retains its current high value. For the Nestor especially to stand a chance of acceptance and use, SOE LP needed to take a dive in value. This didn't happen, Nexus chips were brought into play to 'balance' things. These now take the pressure off SOE mission runners income, give drone region residents a reason to login and hopefully SOE ship prices (Nestor) will start to come down to acceptable levels.
Once the Nestor drops to around 1 bil less than it is currently selling for, it 'may' see some flying around and they will be more than a collectors item.
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EvEa Deva
Forum Alt Retort
467
|
Posted - 2014.03.13 23:22:00 -
[293] - Quote
Yes we would like to keep the Nester price insainly high so our friends in null *wink wink can make a butload of cash off it before people realize its crap, its not like they had any foresight on what we were doing and made a rush for taking the worst region in eve besides provi.
/tinfoil |

Mournful Conciousness
Embers Children TOHA Conglomerate
692
|
Posted - 2014.03.18 13:50:00 -
[294] - Quote
My first look at the Jita market data post-patch indicates:
Nestor: average 5 bargains (trades) per day Machariel: average 50 bargains per day Rattlesnake: average 50 bargains per day nightmare: average 30 bargains per day vindicator: average 40 bargains per day bhaalgorn: average 10 bargains per day paladin: average 30 bargains per day vargur: average 30+ bargains per day
These numbers don't seem out of line when correlated with the perceived utility (to me) of the hulls.
I can't say it's looking positive for the Nestor at the moment. It's early yet, but it seems to me that the Nestor needs a rethink sooner than later.
Here are the numbers again with my annotations indicating [my perception of] utility in various fields:
Machariel: average 50 bargains per day (pvp, pve) Rattlesnake: average 50 bargains per day (pvp, bait, pve, capless operations) nightmare: average 30 bargains per day (pvp, pve) vindicator: average 40 bargains per day (pvp, pve at a push) bhaalgorn: average 10 bargains per day (anti-capital pvp, always needs support hence reduced utility) paladin: average 30 bargains per day (pve, bait) vargur: average 30+ bargains per day (pve, bait) Nestor: average 5 bargains (trades) per day (struggling to think of a use...)
Embers Children is recruiting carefully selected pilots who like wormholes, green killboards and the sweet taste of tears. You can convo me in game or join the chat "TOHA Lounge".
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Arthur Aihaken
Arsenite
3086
|
Posted - 2014.03.18 18:26:00 -
[295] - Quote
Mournful Conciousness wrote:I can't say it's looking positive for the Nestor at the moment. It's early yet, but it seems to me that the Nestor needs a rethink sooner than later. I think those 5 daily trades are suspect, too. It's not a stretch to suggest some are to establish a selling price and give the impression these are actually being sought after. I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week. |

Jenn aSide
STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries
5088
|
Posted - 2014.03.19 12:20:00 -
[296] - Quote
Eve's Supplier wrote:CCP Rise wrote: the long term value of Sisters LP won't be affected because of the reason stated above: the LP:ISK value is controlled by probe launchers and implants rather than Sisters ships. I'm calling bullshit. Value of ships goes down, making them even less desirable to put LP into. More LP into probe launchers and implants, increasing supply for a static demand. Value of launchers and implants goes down, driving down LP:ISK value.
To bad that hasn't happened in the last 7 years. Ships with the probes and probe launchers and clones with the implants die every day keeping the demand high. It doesn't matter that the value of the ships went down some, they are STILL an LP sink that (along with perpetually high demand for exploration gear) insulate said gear from losing value. And then there is the factor that the astero and Startios are more accessible to newer player than tech2 exploration ships, which means that even though the price is reasonable demand will remain high as long as EVe gets any new players at all.
I've literally been selling Sisters probes for 7 years and I've never ever made as much is as i have since the intro of the SOE ships. Removing the ships completely form the LP store would be the only thing that would bring the value of the non-ship items back down to what they were, which would make those items still be more profitable than anything else you could get in high sec.
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MukkBarovian
Blackwater USA Inc. Pandemic Legion
16
|
Posted - 2014.03.19 18:23:00 -
[297] - Quote
The Nestor would be decent at Rattlesnake prices and workable at the 600-800mil isk range. I'm shocked that I haven't seen some kind of downward trend in the price since the expansion. I have held the public opinion in PL that the Nestor would be a decent ship if the price was right. It seems to have been a mistake. If the price drops to a reasonable level in the next several months or so I could be vindicated. But at the moment the Nestor is terrible.
I have flown the hull into combat and I have a handful of killmails in one. That was before 1.3. My main thought at the time was how incredibly stupid I was being. The ship had under 200K EHP and I figured that even if someone couldn't defeat our fleet, they might suicide all their stuff to kill me. I hotdropped a Black Legion Talos fleet at one point and was sure my death was imminent. The Talos would stick around, blap me, and all die. Isk war won, and that bullshit. Instead they ran away. At least the warp speed buff is nice. The ship can handily keep up with a roaming armor cruiser gang.
My Nestor experience could have (and has) been replicated by sticking warp speed rigs on a T1 BS such as the Domi. I would not recommend duplicating it. At its current price, the Nestor cannot be sensibly used in PVP. I don't know why someone might want to use one in PVE over better cheaper options. And I just can't see why anyone would value it at the current prices if SOE LP don't need to be involved in its creation.
Why isn't the price dropping? Who actually wants these things at 1.5bil buy? I sold the one I was using and bought another carrier with the extra isk. Are things working toward some market saturation point where all the collectors have picked one up and then the price will drop? Are there just not enough drops in 0.0 to provide for the 5 to 10 purchases there are daily? Has the SOE LP price created some kind of psychological barrier people are unwilling to cross?
My belief prior to 1.3 was that drops would dominate the market quickly. The stupid 1.5bil buy orders would be filled by dronelands ratters and then a slow but unstoppable crawl towards a reasonable price would begin. It might take months but it would eventually settle somewhere people agreed the ships abilities deserved. But today, a week after the patch, the stupid 1.5 bil buy orders remain, and people are still selling at 1.6 bil. Who are these people and what are you guys doing with these ships? |

Forlorn Wongraven
Habitual Euthanasia Pandemic Legion
126
|
Posted - 2014.03.24 10:00:00 -
[298] - Quote
The drop rates of the chips are way too low to actually show on the market. Follow me on twitter: @ForlornW Follow my blog: http://crossingzebras.com/author/forlorn-wongraven |

King Caldari III
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2014.03.24 23:59:00 -
[299] - Quote
I have killed 10 sentient battleships and received no chips, or any other loot of value. Though in theory this may have been a good change, I agree with the previous poster that the drop rate is too low. |

Sgt Ocker
Last Bastion of Freedom
136
|
Posted - 2014.03.25 02:42:00 -
[300] - Quote
King Caldari III wrote:I have killed 10 sentient battleships and received no chips, or any other loot of value. Though in theory this may have been a good change, I agree with the previous poster that the drop rate is too low. Maybe someone forgot to seed the chips 
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