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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 20 post(s) |

La Nariz
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2294
|
Posted - 2014.05.16 23:45:00 -
[1] - Quote
Not to long ago there was a post in general discussion discussing how to improve forum quality. Several ideas were brainstormed such as removing general discussion, giving ISD more tools, providing harsher punishments for forum rule breaking, etc. Those all have some merit but, I feel the best way to improve the quality of the forums is:
Restricting NPC corporation members to EVE New Citizen's Q&A, Features & Ideas Discussion, Character Bazaar and Alliance & Corporation Recruitment Center.
There has already been a precedent set for this idea by CAOD; in CAOD NPC alts cannot post and the quality of that forum is significantly better than other forums albeit slower.
Enacting this change would:
-Increase the quality of the forums because NPC corporation posters are notoriously know for being devoted to being troll alts,
-It is easily circumvented by players that wish to have a solo experience in EVE and wish to post via one man corporations,
-It provides consequences/content for actions by exposing posters to war declarations should their posts be deemed unpalatable by other players,
-Potentially decrease ISD/Community Manager workloads,
-Leave newbies unaffected as they can still post questions, ideas and look for corporations.
-Leave the character trading system unaffected.
-Decrease the amount of thread derailment and trolling.
--- An alternative of this is enacting some sort of CSPA fee for NPC corporation posters so they must pay per post but, it is less friendly to newbies. --- This post was loving crafted by a member of the Official GoonWaffe recruitment team. Proof Highsec reward needs to be nerfed: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AqC-BTui2uSGdDlxa2dWOG5ieHB0QXBVWW82bGN5TFE&usp=sharing |

Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6259
|
Posted - 2014.05.16 23:49:00 -
[2] - Quote
+1, the vast amount of trolling done on EVEO is notoriously heavy with NPC posters. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |

HiddenPorpoise
Under Dark
208
|
Posted - 2014.05.17 00:13:00 -
[3] - Quote
I too welcome our one member corp overlords. |

La Nariz
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2294
|
Posted - 2014.05.17 00:14:00 -
[4] - Quote
HiddenPorpoise wrote:I too welcome our one member corp overlords.
Its better than the current system because of the consequences it has the potential to create as I stated in the OP. This post was loving crafted by a member of the Official GoonWaffe recruitment team. Proof Highsec reward needs to be nerfed: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AqC-BTui2uSGdDlxa2dWOG5ieHB0QXBVWW82bGN5TFE&usp=sharing |

afkalt
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
50
|
Posted - 2014.05.17 00:30:00 -
[5] - Quote
HiddenPorpoise wrote:I too welcome our one member corp overlords.
No, no.
The universal forum alt corpGäó would pop up. |

La Nariz
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2295
|
Posted - 2014.05.17 00:32:00 -
[6] - Quote
afkalt wrote:HiddenPorpoise wrote:I too welcome our one member corp overlords. No, no. The universal forum alt corpGäó would pop up.
Which would still be an improvement its generating content that otherwise would not happen. This post was loving crafted by a member of the Official GoonWaffe recruitment team. Proof Highsec reward needs to be nerfed: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AqC-BTui2uSGdDlxa2dWOG5ieHB0QXBVWW82bGN5TFE&usp=sharing |

Rovinia
Exotic Dancers Union SONS of BANE
252
|
Posted - 2014.05.17 00:38:00 -
[7] - Quote
Why restrict the ability of players to discuss game related topics in the forum just because they have a different playstyle?
I understand what you try to achive, but i don't think it's the solution we need. Yes, i would prefer it if you had to post with your main, would defenitely make trolling harder here. But i don't think it's appropriated to punish all those casual players who want (for several reasons) to stay in their npc-corps just to get rid of some forum-trolls. |

La Nariz
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2295
|
Posted - 2014.05.17 00:44:00 -
[8] - Quote
Rovinia wrote:Why restrict the ability of players to discuss game related topics in the forum just because they have a different playstyle?
I understand what you try to achive, but i don't think it's the solution we need. Yes, i would prefer it if you had to post with your main, would defenitely make trolling harder here. But i don't think it's appropriated to punish all those casual players who want (for several reasons) to stay in their npc-corps just to get rid of some forum-trolls.
I stated it in the OP they are decreasing the quality of the forums and deliberately interfering with discussion. They are disposable so there is no cost to doing so hence why when you look at threads that have been locked due to multiple NPC alt posters initiated derails you'll see lots of people in doomheim. This change aims to add a cost to the behavior which will discourage it and add some form of content generation.
Being an NPC corp alt poster is not a play style its a violation of one of the core ideas of EVE in that actions have consequences, NPC corp alt posters suffer no consequences for their actions. This post was loving crafted by a member of the Official GoonWaffe recruitment team. Proof Highsec reward needs to be nerfed: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AqC-BTui2uSGdDlxa2dWOG5ieHB0QXBVWW82bGN5TFE&usp=sharing |

Rowells
Unknown Soldiers Fidelas Constans
610
|
Posted - 2014.05.17 00:45:00 -
[9] - Quote
Nothing will stop trolling.
NOTHING.
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La Nariz
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2295
|
Posted - 2014.05.17 00:47:00 -
[10] - Quote
Rowells wrote:Nothing will stop trolling.
NOTHING.
Of course but, plenty of things can decrease its frequency and increase the quality of the forum. This post was loving crafted by a member of the Official GoonWaffe recruitment team. Proof Highsec reward needs to be nerfed: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AqC-BTui2uSGdDlxa2dWOG5ieHB0QXBVWW82bGN5TFE&usp=sharing |

Samillian
Angry Mustellid
514
|
Posted - 2014.05.17 00:55:00 -
[11] - Quote
La Nariz wrote:There has already been a precedent set for this idea by CAOD; in CAOD NPC alts cannot post and the quality of that forum is significantly better than other forums albeit slower.
OP while I don't disagree with you in principle I cannot agree with the above statement, CAOD has a signal to noise ratio as bad as GD if not worse. I also have a problem with restricting the paying customers ability to post no matter how distasteful I personally consider posting with a forum alt to be.
I also find it hard to believe that your proposal would reduce the amount of trolling on the forums, fact is the only thing that would probably do that is shutting the forums down.
NBSI shall be the whole of the Law |
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ISD Ezwal
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
1327

|
Posted - 2014.05.17 00:56:00 -
[12] - Quote
I have taken the liberty of notifying CCP's Community Team and pointing them to this thread. If and/or when it will be replied to, is not for me to say.
But rest assured that in the meantime CCL will keep an eye on this thread. I would also like to urge everybody to keep this discussion civil and on topic. ISD Ezwal Captain Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs) Interstellar Services Department |
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La Nariz
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2295
|
Posted - 2014.05.17 00:59:00 -
[13] - Quote
ISD Ezwal wrote:I have taken the liberty of notifying CCP's Community Team and pointing them to this thread. If and/or when it will be replied to, is not for me to say.
But rest assured that in the meantime CCL will keep an eye on this thread. I would also like to urge everybody to keep this discussion civil and on topic.
Thank you, I hope the ISD is allowed to provide their input on the idea as well since you come from a different perspective than than the regular poster. This post was loving crafted by a member of the Official GoonWaffe recruitment team. Proof Highsec reward needs to be nerfed: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AqC-BTui2uSGdDlxa2dWOG5ieHB0QXBVWW82bGN5TFE&usp=sharing |

La Nariz
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2295
|
Posted - 2014.05.17 01:06:00 -
[14] - Quote
Samillian wrote:La Nariz wrote:There has already been a precedent set for this idea by CAOD; in CAOD NPC alts cannot post and the quality of that forum is significantly better than other forums albeit slower. OP while I don't disagree with you in principle I cannot agree with the above statement, CAOD has a signal to noise ratio as bad as GD if not worse. I also have a problem with restricting the paying customers ability to post no matter how distasteful I personally consider posting with a forum alt to be. I also find it hard to believe that your proposal would reduce the amount of trolling on the forums, fact is the only thing that would probably do that is shutting the forums down.
True the noise is higher in CAOD but, I think that is a part of interalliance propaganda and politics. It also used to be much higher when NPC corporation posters were allowed to post in it. I don't expect this solution to be the silver bullet that cures the forum of trolling but, I do expect it to be one step in cleaning up the problem.
I understand your concern, paying customers are not completely restricted from posting they can join a corporation or create their own to post.
I missed this in my OP but, this add slight encouragement for social interaction because it encourages players to join player made corporations. I feel this part is a huge benefit as CCP has stated before that social interaction is one of the factors in people remaining in EVE. This post was loving crafted by a member of the Official GoonWaffe recruitment team. Proof Highsec reward needs to be nerfed: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AqC-BTui2uSGdDlxa2dWOG5ieHB0QXBVWW82bGN5TFE&usp=sharing |

Nariya Kentaya
Phoenix funds
1263
|
Posted - 2014.05.17 01:15:00 -
[15] - Quote
Rovinia wrote:Why restrict the ability of players to discuss game related topics in the forum just because they have a different playstyle?
I understand what you try to achive, but i don't think it's the solution we need. Yes, i would prefer it if you had to post with your main, would defenitely make trolling harder here. But i don't think it's appropriated to punish all those casual players who want (for several reasons) to stay in their npc-corps just to get rid of some forum-trolls. While im all for diversification in playstyles, "NPC corp" is not a playstyle, its trying to avoid playing. You want to post in the community? Join the community, get in a corp. |
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ISD LackOfFaith
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
1480

|
Posted - 2014.05.17 02:02:00 -
[16] - Quote
La Nariz wrote:[...] the quality of [CAOD] is significantly better than other forums albeit slower.
That's something I never thought I'd see.
I'm not sure how well this idea would work, but it's interesting nonetheless. Also, I feel that I should note that CAOD is not only restricted by only allowing people in player corps to post, but also that those corps have to have 10+ (or so) active accounts in them, or something of the sort. A simple player-corps-only restriction wouldn't do anything than make McTrollAlt in The Scope join the corp McTrollAltDOT and carry on.
Anyway, I'm looking forward to seeing the possible CT (CCP Falcon et al.) response on this. ISD LackOfFaith Commander Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs) Interstellar Services Department I do not respond to Eve Mail or anything other than the forums. |
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La Nariz
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2295
|
Posted - 2014.05.17 02:07:00 -
[17] - Quote
ISD LackOfFaith wrote:La Nariz wrote:[...] the quality of [CAOD] is significantly better than other forums albeit slower. That's something I never thought I'd see. I'm not sure how well this idea would work, but it's interesting nonetheless. Also, I feel that I should note that CAOD is not only restricted by only allowing people in player corps to post, but also that those corps have to have 10+ (or so) active accounts in them, or something of the sort. A simple player-corps-only restriction wouldn't do anything than make McTrollAlt in The Scope join the corp McTrollAltDOT and carry on. Anyway, I'm looking forward to seeing the possible CT (CCP Falcon et al.) response on this.
I did not know about the 10+ active accounts, perhaps that's a good idea as it further increases the social dynamic and consequences of the game. This post was loving crafted by a member of the Official GoonWaffe recruitment team. Proof Highsec reward needs to be nerfed: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AqC-BTui2uSGdDlxa2dWOG5ieHB0QXBVWW82bGN5TFE&usp=sharing |

Ihold Foru
Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire
0
|
Posted - 2014.05.17 04:50:00 -
[18] - Quote
I'm sorry but what gives you guys the right to even think that just because I am a nobody who is in an NPC corp means I can't have access to the forums? I think you should rethink your strategy next time. Just because I don't want to be involved in wars and want to do whatever I feel like when I get on doesn't mean I should not have restricted access to PUBLIC forums. |

La Nariz
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2298
|
Posted - 2014.05.17 04:58:00 -
[19] - Quote
Ihold Foru wrote:I'm sorry but what gives you guys the right to even think that just because I am a nobody who is in an NPC corp means I can't have access to the forums? I think you should rethink your strategy next time. Just because I don't want to be involved in wars and want to do whatever I feel like when I get on doesn't mean I should not have restricted access to PUBLIC forums.
I'm pretty sure being able to string a thought together gives me the right to think but, that's some deep philosophy stuff that's uninvolved with this thread.
On topic one of the things the game is about is consequences and there should be consequences for your actions on the in-game forum. Why do you think you should be free of the consequences from your actions on one of the game's medium? You could find some like-minded players, such as friends you make in-game, and form a corporation with them. Then assuming the suggestion happens you'd have free reign on the forums.
As another reason for the suggestion, NPC corporation posting alts are causing the forum quality to go down. This change aims to be part of a solution to that. This post was loving crafted by a member of the Official GoonWaffe recruitment team. Proof Highsec reward needs to be nerfed: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AqC-BTui2uSGdDlxa2dWOG5ieHB0QXBVWW82bGN5TFE&usp=sharing |

Ihold Foru
Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire
0
|
Posted - 2014.05.17 05:11:00 -
[20] - Quote
I still don't believe that I should be restricted to participate in threads on the forums just because I don't want to be in a corporation. I've been there, done that, and it's not my thing. With that being said, I don't believe that my subscription fee should restrict me from accessing the same content that you access with your subscription fee, just because you are in a player corp. Just curious, did you think about that side of the conversation, or are you hellbent on defending your side of the conversation, just because a few people that wish to remain anonymous gave you a rough time? |

Ihold Foru
Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire
0
|
Posted - 2014.05.17 05:24:00 -
[21] - Quote
And for reference, I have thought on the side of the table where you are sitting, and my solution to this problem wouldn't be restricting people from access to parts of the forum, but to add something called an "approve comment" button. If the poster wants to keep trolls out of his thread, then he would have the ability to approve comments before public eyes could see them. This would, in turn, most likely create a delay in which people had the ability to get knowledge out there, but I think this would be a limited function of the actual Corp part of the forum. |

La Nariz
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2298
|
Posted - 2014.05.17 05:24:00 -
[22] - Quote
Ihold Foru wrote:I still don't believe that I should be restricted to participate in threads on the forums just because I don't want to be in a corporation. I've been there, done that, and it's not my thing. With that being said, I don't believe that my subscription fee should restrict me from accessing the same content that you access with your subscription fee, just because you are in a player corp. Just curious, did you think about that side of the conversation, or are you hellbent on defending your side of the conversation, just because a few people that wish to remain anonymous gave you a rough time?
I've thought about it quite a bit and I feel its a fair trade-off. You still get to vote in the CSM elections, be shielded from wardecs and immune to awoxing. Those are some huge benefits player corporations have to compete with. My suggestion has newbies in mind so they get new citizens, it has the character seller in mind so they get the bazaar, it allows all players to voice their opinion on the direction of EVE hence F&I. I don't feel you should be free to come derail, troll my thread or get it locked because you don't like my corp/alliance/me and hide behind npc corporation protection as well as anonymity. You literally have no consequence for your action and there is literally no downside to you biomassing your posting alt so you can continue to do the above ad infitum. We both paid the same subscription so why should you get the preferential treatment for being in an NPC corporation? This post was loving crafted by a member of the Official GoonWaffe recruitment team. Proof Highsec reward needs to be nerfed: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AqC-BTui2uSGdDlxa2dWOG5ieHB0QXBVWW82bGN5TFE&usp=sharing |

Komi Toran
Perkone Caldari State
5
|
Posted - 2014.05.17 05:26:00 -
[23] - Quote
If the problem is not being allowed to link an active character with the poster, just have the forum lock profiles to the character with the most SP. Has the benefit of being less trivial to circumvent.
La Nariz wrote:On topic one of the things the game is about is consequences and there should be consequences for your actions on the in-game forum. Why do you think you should be free of the consequences from your actions on one of the game's medium? If you want consequences for actions on the in-game forum, then shouldn't those consequences be for actions on the in-game forum? |

La Nariz
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2299
|
Posted - 2014.05.17 05:28:00 -
[24] - Quote
Ihold Foru wrote:And for reference, I have thought on the side of the table where you are sitting, and my solution to this problem wouldn't be restricting people from access to parts of the forum, but to add something called an "approve comment" button. If the poster wants to keep trolls out of his thread, then he would have the ability to approve comments before public eyes could see them. This would, in turn, most likely create a delay in which people had the ability to get knowledge out there, but I think this would be a limited function of the actual Corp part of the forum.
That's an idea of merit but, it has some holes. It inhibits discussion because the OP can completely shut down discussion and create a horrible echo chamber by only approving posts that agree with them. My suggestion leaves plenty of room to express dissenting opinions.
Consider your suggestion in this thread, I could have pressed the "not approve" button for your posts and the other two posts against my idea and it would look like my thread only shows support for the idea.
An idea similar to yours that I had thought of before was a checkbox that could be selected that would treat your thread as if it was a CAOD thread only permitting people in corporations with 10+ members to post. This post was loving crafted by a member of the Official GoonWaffe recruitment team. Proof Highsec reward needs to be nerfed: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AqC-BTui2uSGdDlxa2dWOG5ieHB0QXBVWW82bGN5TFE&usp=sharing |

La Nariz
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2299
|
Posted - 2014.05.17 05:30:00 -
[25] - Quote
Komi Toran wrote:If the problem is not being allowed to link an active character with the poster, just have the forum lock profiles to the character with the most SP. Has the benefit of being less trivial to circumvent. La Nariz wrote:On topic one of the things the game is about is consequences and there should be consequences for your actions on the in-game forum. Why do you think you should be free of the consequences from your actions on one of the game's medium? If you want consequences for actions on the in-game forum, then shouldn't those consequences be for actions on the in-game forum?
I don't think that would solve the problem because that person could continue to hide in an npc corp and experience no consequences for their actions. If we could perform actions on the in-game forums that would affect other people's posting I would agree with your question. This post was loving crafted by a member of the Official GoonWaffe recruitment team. Proof Highsec reward needs to be nerfed: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AqC-BTui2uSGdDlxa2dWOG5ieHB0QXBVWW82bGN5TFE&usp=sharing |

Ihold Foru
Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire
4
|
Posted - 2014.05.17 05:31:00 -
[26] - Quote
La Nariz wrote:I've thought about it quite a bit and I feel its a fair trade-off. You still get to vote in the CSM elections, be shielded from wardecs and immune to awoxing. Those are some huge benefits player corporations have to compete with. My suggestion has newbies in mind so they get new citizens, it has the character seller in mind so they get the bazaar, it allows all players to voice their opinion on the direction of EVE hence F&I. I don't feel you should be free to come derail, troll my thread or get it locked because you don't like my corp/alliance/me and hide behind npc corporation protection as well as anonymity. You literally have no consequence for your action and there is literally no downside to you biomassing your posting alt so you can continue to do the above ad infitum. We both paid the same subscription so why should you get the preferential treatment for being in an NPC corporation?
For time's sake, I ask you the question as well, why should you get the preferential treatment for being in a PLAYER corporation? Not a forum alt. http://eveboard.com/pilot/Ihold_Foru |

La Nariz
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2299
|
Posted - 2014.05.17 05:33:00 -
[27] - Quote
Ihold Foru wrote:La Nariz wrote:I've thought about it quite a bit and I feel its a fair trade-off. You still get to vote in the CSM elections, be shielded from wardecs and immune to awoxing. Those are some huge benefits player corporations have to compete with. My suggestion has newbies in mind so they get new citizens, it has the character seller in mind so they get the bazaar, it allows all players to voice their opinion on the direction of EVE hence F&I. I don't feel you should be free to come derail, troll my thread or get it locked because you don't like my corp/alliance/me and hide behind npc corporation protection as well as anonymity. You literally have no consequence for your action and there is literally no downside to you biomassing your posting alt so you can continue to do the above ad infitum. We both paid the same subscription so why should you get the preferential treatment for being in an NPC corporation? For time's sake, I ask you the question as well, why should you get the preferential treatment for being in a PLAYER corporation?
I risk more than you hence I should get a greater reward than you. Remember this suggestion completely allows necessary functions of the forum like providing input on upcoming announced features, selling characters, finding a corporation, and asking newbie questions. This post was loving crafted by a member of the Official GoonWaffe recruitment team. Proof Highsec reward needs to be nerfed: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AqC-BTui2uSGdDlxa2dWOG5ieHB0QXBVWW82bGN5TFE&usp=sharing |

Ihold Foru
Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire
4
|
Posted - 2014.05.17 05:38:00 -
[28] - Quote
Because you risk more than me? That's your only response. It's not good enough.
The only viable option I see to your argument, is ONLY restricting access in the forum section titled: EVE Corporations, Alliances and Organizations Center
Everything else should remain FREE ROAM for ALL players. Besides that, get your own forums? Oh yeah, I know Goons have their own forums. With 11.5k members, I am sure that the mass of you should be able to find some good solution. Not a forum alt. http://eveboard.com/pilot/Ihold_Foru |

Komi Toran
Perkone Caldari State
5
|
Posted - 2014.05.17 05:44:00 -
[29] - Quote
La Nariz wrote:I don't think that would solve the problem because that person could continue to hide in an npc corp and experience no consequences for their actions. For as long as they insist on remaining docked in station. Once they undock, you gank them if it's that important to you. That's more than you would be able to do with an inactive alt that's been a member of Troll Inc. for a year.
La Nariz wrote:If we could perform actions on the in-game forums that would affect other people's posting I would agree with your question. What you're proposing is to negatively impact a person's forum posting as a consequence of being in an NPC corp.
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La Nariz
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2299
|
Posted - 2014.05.17 05:45:00 -
[30] - Quote
Ihold Foru wrote:Because you risk more than me? That's your only response. It's not good enough.
The only viable option I see to your argument, is ONLY restricting access in the forum section titled: EVE Corporations, Alliances and Organizations Center
Everything else should remain FREE ROAM for ALL players. Besides that, get your own forums? Oh yeah, I know Goons have their own forums. With 11.5k members, I am sure that the mass of you should be able to find some good solution.
Qualify that for me why is that not good enough? What is the rubric for "good enough?" Why should everything be "FREE ROAM for ALL players?" Why should a certain subset of characters be allowed to continually troll, derail, and attack other posters completely risk free while also burdening the ISD?
I'll give you an example of the risk:
Person in EVE University insults some mercenaries in C&P; the action. The result is the mercenaries declare war on EVE University; the consequence of the action.
Person in NPC corporation member trolls a thread; the action. The result nothing, they are allowed to troll the thread ad infinitum until it gets to the point the ISD haven't many options other than to lock the thread. There is nothing I as a player can do to enact a consequence against that NPC corporation member. This post was loving crafted by a member of the Official GoonWaffe recruitment team. Proof Highsec reward needs to be nerfed: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AqC-BTui2uSGdDlxa2dWOG5ieHB0QXBVWW82bGN5TFE&usp=sharing |
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