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SengH
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Posted - 2006.07.05 21:34:00 -
[1]
Edited by: SengH on 05/07/2006 21:36:13
Ok I currently have 23mil SP and fly exclusively minnie. I have only 280k in industry so im not a carebear. Today I redid my skill plan around getting a full t2 kit on the phoon and 2 side skills tossed in for random stuff.
Skill Plan for SengH
1: Scout Drone Operation V
2: Amarr Drone Specialization I
3: Gallente Drone Specialization I
4: Caldari Drone Specialization I
5: Minmatar Drone Specialization I
6: Gallente Drone Specialization II
7: Amarr Drone Specialization II
8: Minmatar Drone Specialization II
9: Caldari Drone Specialization II
10: Advanced Weapon Upgrades IV
11: Sharpshooter V
12: Rapid Firing V
13: Surgical Strike IV
14: Repair Systems IV
15: Repair Systems V
16: Energy Grid Upgrades V
17: Energy Management V
18: Energy Pulse Weapons III
19: Energy Pulse Weapons IV
20: Energy Systems Operation V
21: Shield Compensation IV
22: Shield Compensation V
23: Shield Management V
24: Shield Upgrades V
25: Large Artillery Specialization I
26: Large Artillery Specialization II
27: Large Artillery Specialization III
28: Large Artillery Specialization IV
29: Large Autocannon Specialization I
30: Large Autocannon Specialization II
31: Large Autocannon Specialization III
32: Large Autocannon Specialization IV
33: Guided Missile Precision III
34: Guided Missile Precision IV
35: Missile Bombardment IV
36: Missile Projection IV
37: Rapid Launch IV
38: Target Navigation Prediction III
39: Target Navigation Prediction IV
40: Warhead Upgrades III
41: Warhead Upgrades IV
42: Torpedoes IV
43: Torpedoes V
44: Navigation V
45: Evasive Maneuvering V
46: Minmatar Battleship V
47: Advanced Weapon Upgrades V
48: Drone Durability III
49: Drone Durability IV
50: Drone Interfacing III
51: Drone Interfacing IV
52: Drone Interfacing V
53: Amarr Drone Specialization III
54: Amarr Drone Specialization IV
55: Caldari Drone Specialization III
56: Caldari Drone Specialization IV
57: Combat Drone Operation III
58: Combat Drone Operation IV
59: Drone Navigation III
60: Drone Navigation IV
61: Drone Sharpshooting III
62: Drone Sharpshooting IV
63: Gallente Drone Specialization III
64: Gallente Drone Specialization IV
65: Heavy Drone Operation IV
66: Heavy Drone Operation V
67: Minmatar Drone Specialization III
68: Minmatar Drone Specialization IV
69: Cruise Missiles IV
70: Cruise Missiles V
71: Cruise Missile Specialization I
72: Cruise Missile Specialization II
73: Cruise Missile Specialization III
74: Cruise Missile Specialization IV
75: Torpedo Specialization I
76: Torpedo Specialization II
77: Torpedo Specialization III
78: Torpedo Specialization IV
79: Energy Emission Systems IV
80: High Speed Maneuvering IV
80 skills; Total time: 343 days, 18 hours, 59 minutes, 25 seconds
Heck i can be in a effective dreadnought with siege mode and supplementary skills in under half the time it'll take to get a T2 phoon.
For a Tier 1 BS... this is pretty fubared.
Edit: On the other hand I doubt my corp will let me fly any ship other than a battlecruiser till flagships are released.
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HippoKing
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Posted - 2006.07.05 21:37:00 -
[2]
Do you really need smartbombs? 
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SengH
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Posted - 2006.07.05 21:41:00 -
[3]
 Originally by: HippoKing
Do you really need smartbombs?
sadly every time ive thought about fitting them and then went naahh it'll be ok. I run into close range intys :P.
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Phelan Lore
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Posted - 2006.07.05 21:42:00 -
[4]
Originally by: SengH
Heck i can be in a effective dreadnought with siege mode and supplementary skills in under half the time it'll take to get a T2 phoon.
Not a Naglafar.
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fkingfurious
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Posted - 2006.07.05 21:42:00 -
[5]
You are quite clearly, whats the word im looking for here.
Ummmmmmmmmmm.
Oh yeah.
INSANE.
U seem to have listed evert engineerinf skill, drone spec, nav skill, in fact, pretty much ALL OF THEM.
To have a t2 loadout u need heavy drones 5, torps 5, whatever u need for t2 guns, and thats it.
U seem to have decided u need lvl5 in absolutely every skill that has any effect on ur ship.
No wonder u came up with a list that big.
I mean, uve listed energy pulse weapons in there. 4 siege 2's, 4 Auto 2's, thats ur high slots. Just where exactly are u planning to put those smart bombs?
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Sarmaul
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Posted - 2006.07.05 21:47:00 -
[6]
I can't remember who said it, but don't fly the Phoon until you can fly the Nalfgar :P
I've just got T2 torps and T2 drones to do - all the other skills are already trained. Fortunarly torps 5 is needed for the dread :).
TEAM MINMATAR FORUMS
- In Rust We Trust -
Suvetar, care to confirm these rumours about you being an unstoppable sex machine?
LOL -Suvetar |
SengH
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Posted - 2006.07.05 21:47:00 -
[7]
Edited by: SengH on 05/07/2006 21:47:42
Originally by: fkingfurious
You are quite clearly, whats the word im looking for here.
Ummmmmmmmmmm.
Oh yeah.
INSANE.
U seem to have listed evert engineerinf skill, drone spec, nav skill, in fact, pretty much ALL OF THEM.
To have a t2 loadout u need heavy drones 5, torps 5, whatever u need for t2 guns, and thats it.
U seem to have decided u need lvl5 in absolutely every skill that has any effect on ur ship.
No wonder u came up with a list that big.
I mean, uve listed energy pulse weapons in there. 4 siege 2's, 4 Auto 2's, thats ur high slots. Just where exactly are u planning to put those smart bombs?
theres the 2xnos 2xsmartie setup 4xAC that I use sometimes. Works decently well and the smarties make pods go a nice squish. Engineering skills are needed cus of the insanely ****ty cap on minnie ships. The shield skills are for my claymore as i need to top that out at some point.
Edit: Also cruise/torps are depending on situation. For anti-bs work you'd go with torps but otherwise you'd use precision cruise for everything else.
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MOOstradamus
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Posted - 2006.07.05 21:52:00 -
[8]
Most of the skills you list aren't Typhoon specific and even then many of them are certainly not necessary - so what exactly is your point
MOOCIFER Emerald/Alpha Oldtimer |
Sarmaul
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Posted - 2006.07.05 21:54:00 -
[9]
Originally by: MOOstradamus
Most of the skills you list aren't Typhoon specific and even then many of them are certainly not necessary - so what exactly is your point
The point is it's a hybrid ship that needs good skills in 3 combat trees to be effective.
TEAM MINMATAR FORUMS
- In Rust We Trust -
Suvetar, care to confirm these rumours about you being an unstoppable sex machine?
LOL -Suvetar |
HippoKing
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Posted - 2006.07.05 21:56:00 -
[10]
I still think shield compensation 5 is a bit above and beyond the call of duty 
Has anyone ever shield tanked a typhoon in its current state?
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Leandro Salazar
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Posted - 2006.07.05 21:58:00 -
[11]
Originally by: SengH
Edited by: SengH on 05/07/2006 21:36:13
Ok I currently have 23mil SP and fly exclusively minnie. I have only 280k in industry so im not a carebear. Today I redid my skill plan around getting a full t2 kit on the phoon and 2 side skills tossed in for random stuff.
Skill Plan for SengH
stuff
80 skills; Total time: 343 days, 18 hours, 59 minutes, 25 seconds
Heck i can be in a effective dreadnought with siege mode and supplementary skills in under half the time it'll take to get a T2 phoon.
For a Tier 1 BS... this is pretty fubared.
Edit: On the other hand I doubt my corp will let me fly any ship other than a battlecruiser till flagships are released.
You say you have 23M SP exclusively in minmatar, yet have all that stuff left to train? Whre the heck did you waste your SP? I have 10 mil SP spread out over all 4 races, yet I already have like half the stuff in that list...
Not to mention a lot of the lvl5 skills are NOT neccessary to effectively fly a T2 Typhoon.
---------
ZOMG my sig was concordokkened!
Link removed due to bad language on remote site. -wystler
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Kcel Chim
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Posted - 2006.07.05 21:58:00 -
[12]
Edited by: Kcel Chim on 05/07/2006 21:58:53
im happy that i have all the skills already trained apart from the dronespecs. You dont need amarr and caldari imo. T2 ogres + T2 explosive lights / meds do the trick well enough.
As sarmaul said fly the nag before you fly the phoon. The tempest is still king in many aspects and requires alot less skills.
Oh and you dont need the shieldstuff. Youll never shieldtank your phoon to justify all those lvl 5 skills, just go lvl 3-4 and save time.
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Sarmaul
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Posted - 2006.07.05 21:59:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Leandro Salazar
You say you have 23M SP exclusively in minmatar, yet have all that stuff left to train? Whre the heck did you waste your SP? I have 10 mil SP spread out over all 4 races, yet I already have like half the stuff in that list...
Not to mention a lot of the lvl5 skills are NOT neccessary to effectively fly a T2 Typhoon.
He's leadership specced.
TEAM MINMATAR FORUMS
- In Rust We Trust -
Suvetar, care to confirm these rumours about you being an unstoppable sex machine?
LOL -Suvetar |
SengH
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Posted - 2006.07.05 22:01:00 -
[14]
Edited by: SengH on 05/07/2006 22:02:03
Originally by: HippoKing
I still think shield compensation 5 is a bit above and beyond the call of duty
Has anyone ever shield tanked a typhoon in its current state?
As I said, thats for the claymore... I'm not gonna be flying any other ship for a long time during ops. At least until flagships come out. I figure a fully kitted t2 phoon will get me placed well for them. Then again given CCPs flip flopping on whether minnie cap ships should shield or armor tank I figure i'll train for both.
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Emno
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Posted - 2006.07.05 22:11:00 -
[15]
Originally by: SengH
2: Amarr Drone Specialization I
7: Amarr Drone Specialization II
53: Amarr Drone Specialization III
54: Amarr Drone Specialization IV
booo evil drones, they would take me like 5 days to use but i really cba some of those you could really do without heh some its a bit shocking that as a 23mil sp min pilot you don't have yet ;p
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dalman
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Posted - 2006.07.05 22:12:00 -
[16]
Edited by: dalman on 05/07/2006 22:14:05
Originally by: SengH
Ok I currently have 23mil SP and fly exclusively minnie. I have only 280k in industry so im not a carebear.
11: Sharpshooter V
12: Rapid Firing V
13: Surgical Strike IV
14: Repair Systems IV
17: Energy Management V
20: Energy Systems Operation V
21: Shield Compensation IV
23: Shield Management V
25: Large Artillery Specialization I
29: Large Autocannon Specialization I
42: Torpedoes IV
44: Navigation V
45: Evasive Maneuvering V
46: Minmatar Battleship V
50: Drone Interfacing III
65: Heavy Drone Operation IV
69: Cruise Missiles IV
80: High Speed Maneuvering IV
By ghad, 23mil SP PvP char and you don't have any of these 'basic' skills trained
And as said, there's a whole lot of totally unnecessary skills in your list.
/me reads thread, k, leadership... Yea, takes some time to sort that properly, but still..
Am I forced to have any regret?
I've become the lie, beautiful and free
In my righteous own mind
I adore and preach the insanity you gave to me |
SengH
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Posted - 2006.07.05 22:14:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Emno
Originally by: SengH
2: Amarr Drone Specialization I
7: Amarr Drone Specialization II
53: Amarr Drone Specialization III
54: Amarr Drone Specialization IV
booo evil drones, they would take me like 5 days to use but i really cba some of those you could really do without heh some its a bit shocking that as a 23mil sp min pilot you don't have yet ;p
You gain some you lose some Alot of the stuff I can do is pretty shocking too.
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Leandro Salazar
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Posted - 2006.07.05 22:24:00 -
[18]
Originally by: SengH
Edit: Ok if you want. Subtract off 1-2 months for assorted skills that arent really necessary. THATS STILL OVER 3/4 a year to get into a t2 fitted TIER 1 BS. If I was flying a geddon I'd be done already.
So it is really only that long for you because you trained an odd path and left out a ton of basic skills. Not really a property of the phoon but of the way you trained your character.
Realistically I would say the phoon needs some 30 days longer than the Arma for a full T2 fit, that is the 30 days I estimate it takes to train up Torp spec 3. All other skill reqs are kinda the same, guns, armor tank and T2 heavy drones.
---------
ZOMG my sig was concordokkened!
Link removed due to bad language on remote site. -wystler
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SengH
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Posted - 2006.07.05 22:27:00 -
[19]
Edited by: SengH on 05/07/2006 22:30:09
Originally by: Leandro Salazar
Originally by: SengH
Edit: Ok if you want. Subtract off 1-2 months for assorted skills that arent really necessary. THATS STILL OVER 3/4 a year to get into a t2 fitted TIER 1 BS. If I was flying a geddon I'd be done already.
So it is really only that long for you because you trained an odd path and left out a ton of basic skills. Not really a property of the phoon but of the way you trained your character.
Realistically I would say the phoon needs some 30 days longer than the Arma for a full T2 fit, that is the 30 days I estimate it takes to train up Torp spec 3. All other skill reqs are kinda the same, guns, armor tank and T2 heavy drones.
The thing is arma's drones arent really a primary weapons system. The phoon needs its drones having the 2nd largest BS dronebay and its split wpns system reduces the effects of dmg mods.
You need both torps and cruise for the phoon depending on how you fit it. Which is a big problem.
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Hllaxiu
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Posted - 2006.07.05 22:38:00 -
[20]
Look on the bright side, you'll be a month and a billion isk in skillbooks away from a dread after all that!
Oh, and why didn't you train Energy systems 5, drone interfacing 3, repair systems 4 and some other around 5mil skillpoints?
---
Our greatest glory is not in never failing, but in rising up every time we fail. - Emerson |
Leandro Salazar
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Posted - 2006.07.05 22:39:00 -
[21]
With Javelin Torps, I find no need for cruise anymore whatsoever. After the precision nerf, precision cruise do like 15% more damage to very small stuff than Javelin torps (disregarding exp velocity here) and really your drones are what should kill the small stuff. And other cruises are worse than Javelin Torps in every scenario.
And since the Armageddon can fit a full rack of T2 heavy drones as well, you might argue that it needs those too for proper functionality.
---------
ZOMG my sig was concordokkened!
Link removed due to bad language on remote site. -wystler
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Hllaxiu
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Posted - 2006.07.05 22:40:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Leandro Salazar
With Javelin Torps, I find no need for cruise anymore whatsoever. After the precision nerf, precision cruise do like 15% more damage to very small stuff than Javelin torps (disregarding exp velocity here) and really your drones are what should kill the small stuff. And other cruises are worse than Javelin Torps in every scenario.
Except for the scenario the typhoon is in where to get a real npc or mission setup (ie, tank) you need cruises.
---
Our greatest glory is not in never failing, but in rising up every time we fail. - Emerson |
KilROCK
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Posted - 2006.07.05 22:44:00 -
[23]
Geez, I'm ready then..
Whine whine whine, sigs |
Tiuwaz
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Posted - 2006.07.05 22:45:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Sarmaul
I can't remember who said it, but don't fly the Phoon until you can fly the Nalfgar :P
I've just got T2 torps and T2 drones to do - all the other skills are already trained. Fortunarly torps 5 is needed for the dread :).
that was me
and its so true its scary
i made myself a skillplan for both phoon and naglfar, and the one for naglfar needed about 2 weeks less if i remember right
(and no i didnt make an insanelist like SengH ^^)
Originally by: Oveur
This is not the conspiracy you are looking for.
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Montero
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Posted - 2006.07.05 23:10:00 -
[25]
Sengh how about you stay in the CBC and we don't have to hurt you 
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Hakera
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Posted - 2006.07.05 23:16:00 -
[26]
hehe i only need 2-9 (the racial drone skills) and that list would be done for me plus the extras like surgical strike v already in there etc on top of that list.
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Deja Thoris
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Posted - 2006.07.05 23:45:00 -
[27]
Um, your list is a bit overkill.
All 4 races drone specs to 4 etc etc etc
Youor list is a pretty much perfect list. You can have way less than that and be more than good enough.
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Blacklight
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Posted - 2006.07.06 01:02:00 -
[28]
Originally by: dalman
Edited by: dalman on 05/07/2006 22:14:05
Originally by: SengH
Ok I currently have 23mil SP and fly exclusively minnie. I have only 280k in industry so im not a carebear.
11: Sharpshooter V
12: Rapid Firing V
13: Surgical Strike IV
14: Repair Systems IV
17: Energy Management V
20: Energy Systems Operation V
21: Shield Compensation IV
23: Shield Management V
25: Large Artillery Specialization I
29: Large Autocannon Specialization I
42: Torpedoes IV
44: Navigation V
45: Evasive Maneuvering V
46: Minmatar Battleship V
50: Drone Interfacing III
65: Heavy Drone Operation IV
69: Cruise Missiles IV
80: High Speed Maneuvering IV
By ghad, 23mil SP PvP char and you don't have any of these 'basic' skills trained
And as said, there's a whole lot of totally unnecessary skills in your list.
/me reads thread, k, leadership... Yea, takes some time to sort that properly, but still..
What he said.
Eve Blacklight Style
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Kaylana Syi
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Posted - 2006.07.06 01:35:00 -
[29]
Its a good thing I spec'ed for the Typhoon like 2 years ago...
Team Minmatar |
mrg29
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Posted - 2006.07.06 01:53:00 -
[30]
your post is slightly misleading.
the time required to GET INTO a t2 fitted phoon is significantly less than what u have quoted.
the skilltree u have posted basically involves maxing out all relevants skills related to flying a phoon which is totally different.
i'll pick on 2 examples, BS 5 and drone interfacing 5, neither of these is required to be able to fly a t2 outfitted phoon and these 2 skills alone account for over 2 months or around 20% of the training time.
-
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SengH
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Posted - 2006.07.06 01:59:00 -
[31]
Originally by: mrg29
your post is slightly misleading.
the time required to GET INTO a t2 fitted phoon is significantly less than what u have quoted.
the skilltree u have posted basically involves maxing out all relevants skills related to flying a phoon which is totally different.
i'll pick on 2 examples, BS 5 and drone interfacing 5, neither of these is required to be able to fly a t2 outfitted phoon and these 2 skills alone account for over 2 months or around 20% of the training time.
BS5 is to make up for your damage mods only affecting HALF your slots. The BS bonus affects both of them so its needed at 5 so as not to get screwed. Drone interfacing 5 is there so at the end of the VERY long road. The minmatar carrier might possibly be balanced. Or i'll go straight to wing command carriers. Even if you take off those 2. Its almost 280 days on top of 23mil SP to fly a Tier 1 BS. Does the domi/scorp/arma come anywhere near the same amount of SP to use fully fitted with T2? Even then, does the phoon perform better with the higher SP investment required? From preliminary calculations its hard to say that it does.
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mrg29
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Posted - 2006.07.06 02:02:00 -
[32]
not disagreeing that minmatar ships do require a wider spread of skills to be fully effective in that most other BS. i am predominantly a minnie pilot myself so i feel your pain.
i suppose i was just being pedantic pointing out that the skill tree u set out was to reach maxed skills which is a different prospect from just being able to use a t2 outfitted ship which was what your initial post suggested.
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SengH
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Posted - 2006.07.06 02:06:00 -
[33]
Originally by: mrg29
not disagreeing that minmatar ships do require a wider spread of skills to be fully effective in that most other BS. i am predominantly a minnie pilot myself so i feel your pain.
i suppose i was just being pedantic pointing out that the skill tree u set out was to reach maxed skills which is a different prospect from just being able to use a t2 outfitted ship which was what your initial post suggested.
To make t2 guns/missiles worth their extra expense you usually have to take the specialization to 4 which is what I did. The only things that are possibly "not needed" would be the shield tanking stuff, the smarties and drone interfacing 5. Thats about 2 months. Out of which the rest of the year is spend training solely for the t2 equipment. Furthermore I cut some corners by not training missile support skills to 5 which could arguably be needed since its a 50/50 weapon split. Missiles at least dont require the support skills to 5 to use the guns.
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mrg29
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Posted - 2006.07.06 02:12:00 -
[34]
all i was trying to say is that you will be able to use a fully outfitted t2 phoon in significantly less than a year.
what u have outlined here is using a phoon to MAXIMUM EFFICIENCY which is a completely different thing and could be misleading to newer players.
-
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Xtro 2
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Posted - 2006.07.06 04:43:00 -
[35]
Originally by: HippoKing
Do you really need smartbombs?
Or specialising in different drones, surely 1 types good enough to get started with.
Xtro 2 - Tactically Insane Tradesman.
Insanity, or madness, is a semi-permanent, severe mental disorder typically stemming from a form of mental illness. |
Eximius Josari
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Posted - 2006.07.06 04:55:00 -
[36]
Originally by: SengH
Edited by: SengH on 05/07/2006 22:30:09
Originally by: Leandro Salazar
Originally by: SengH
Edit: Ok if you want. Subtract off 1-2 months for assorted skills that arent really necessary. THATS STILL OVER 3/4 a year to get into a t2 fitted TIER 1 BS. If I was flying a geddon I'd be done already.
So it is really only that long for you because you trained an odd path and left out a ton of basic skills. Not really a property of the phoon but of the way you trained your character.
Realistically I would say the phoon needs some 30 days longer than the Arma for a full T2 fit, that is the 30 days I estimate it takes to train up Torp spec 3. All other skill reqs are kinda the same, guns, armor tank and T2 heavy drones.
The thing is arma's drones arent really a primary weapons system. The phoon needs its drones having the 2nd largest BS dronebay and its split wpns system reduces the effects of dmg mods.
You need both torps and cruise for the phoon depending on how you fit it. Which is a big problem.
The Armageddon's drones are its secondary weapon system. The Typhoon's drones are its tertiary weapon system, tho it can be argued now that with the bonus changes, missiles and guns are both primary weapons for the phoon. But I can say for a fact the Arma doesnt need its drones any less than the phoon does. If anything, it needs them more given that it cant load FOF Cruise.
Click Above |
xeom
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Posted - 2006.07.06 05:06:00 -
[37]
Ouch sengH so much for me flying the phoon.I still got till like november before i can get into a commandship =(
CCP where are our t2 shield power relays? | Join[..SIN] |
Kaylana Syi
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Posted - 2006.07.06 05:16:00 -
[38]
Edited by: Kaylana Syi on 06/07/2006 05:16:45
Originally by: Imhotep Khem
On the bright side, after I skill it up, it will come very close to beating a Tempest at which point it will need to be nerfed
It already does m8. Take ewar out of the picture and two equally skilled pilots flying... Typhoon can and should win every single time in 20km and under combat. Elaine Threepwood has already posted on the Team Minmatar forums a Typhoon that is able to best AC Tempets, Blasterthrons and torp ravens.
They year of the typhoon is here... its damn near perfect and I didn't believe it until it waxed me hardcore.
Team Minmatar |
Eximius Josari
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Posted - 2006.07.06 05:21:00 -
[39]
Originally by: Kaylana Syi
Edited by: Kaylana Syi on 06/07/2006 05:16:45
Originally by: Imhotep Khem
On the bright side, after I skill it up, it will come very close to beating a Tempest at which point it will need to be nerfed
It already does m8. Take ewar out of the picture and two equally skilled pilots flying... Typhoon can and should win every single time in 20km and under combat. Elaine Threepwood has already posted on the Team Minmatar forums a Typhoon that is able to best AC Tempets, Blasterthrons and torp ravens.
They year of the typhoon is here... its damn near perfect and I didn't believe it until it waxed me hardcore.
Between the new BS and the Typhoon, I'm very tempted to go back to Minnie ships.
Click Above |
Kaylana Syi
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Posted - 2006.07.06 05:52:00 -
[40]
Originally by: Eximius Josari
Originally by: Kaylana Syi
Edited by: Kaylana Syi on 06/07/2006 05:16:45
Originally by: Imhotep Khem
On the bright side, after I skill it up, it will come very close to beating a Tempest at which point it will need to be nerfed
It already does m8. Take ewar out of the picture and two equally skilled pilots flying... Typhoon can and should win every single time in 20km and under combat. Elaine Threepwood has already posted on the Team Minmatar forums a Typhoon that is able to best AC Tempets, Blasterthrons and torp ravens.
They year of the typhoon is here... its damn near perfect and I didn't believe it until it waxed me hardcore.
Between the new BS and the Typhoon, I'm very tempted to go back to Minnie ships.
Sobeseki Pawi is your old toon eh? Go to the phoon side again m8!
Team Minmatar |
Eximius Josari
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Posted - 2006.07.06 06:23:00 -
[41]
Originally by: Kaylana Syi
Originally by: Eximius Josari
Originally by: Kaylana Syi
Edited by: Kaylana Syi on 06/07/2006 05:16:45
Originally by: Imhotep Khem
On the bright side, after I skill it up, it will come very close to beating a Tempest at which point it will need to be nerfed
It already does m8. Take ewar out of the picture and two equally skilled pilots flying... Typhoon can and should win every single time in 20km and under combat. Elaine Threepwood has already posted on the Team Minmatar forums a Typhoon that is able to best AC Tempets, Blasterthrons and torp ravens.
They year of the typhoon is here... its damn near perfect and I didn't believe it until it waxed me hardcore.
Between the new BS and the Typhoon, I'm very tempted to go back to Minnie ships.
Sobeseki Pawi is your old toon eh? Go to the phoon side again m8!
I still have time yet before I need to make that decision, hoping some stats info on the new BSes comes out soon.
Click Above |
MrRookie
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Posted - 2006.07.06 09:46:00 -
[42]
Minmatar ships have always had split wepon systems, infact I don't think there is any minmatar ships without a launchers slot. Suddenly now it became a good idea training missiles skills?
I know Minnies rely on more skills but the op is exaggerating. It's not like those skills where more than usefull before the phon got a missile bonus.
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Aeaus
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Posted - 2006.07.06 10:53:00 -
[43]
That list is overkill. While you need about 50% more training time for a good setup on a Typhoon, it's a Tier I as effective as a Tier II, it's got incredible damage, and it's versitile as hell.
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Sarmaul
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Posted - 2006.07.06 10:57:00 -
[44]
Originally by: MrRookie
Minmatar ships have always had split wepon systems, infact I don't think there is any minmatar ships without a launchers slot. Suddenly now it became a good idea training missiles skills?
I know Minnies rely on more skills but the op is exaggerating. It's not like those skills where more than usefull before the phon got a missile bonus.
Generally all minmatar ships only have 1 or 2 slots left over after fitting as many turrets as possible and they either fit missiles or nos in them.
The Typhoon and the recons are completely different. Exactly half of their weapon points are missiles, while the other have a turrets. Not only that, but the ships gets bonuses to both missiles and turrets. Finally, on these ships the missiles do more damage than the turrets. You would be better off flying them with good missile skills and crap gunnery than the other way around. Hence, if you want to fly a phoon properly you need damn good missile skills.
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Crange
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Posted - 2006.07.06 11:55:00 -
[45]
Typhoon looks like a faction ship bonus and slot layout wise just without the extra armor. As a low sp mim pilot it is kinda funny to know that I'll be in a t2 temp months before I step foot in a phoon. But then again bein a mim pilot bit used to it.
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MrRookie
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Posted - 2006.07.06 12:12:00 -
[46]
Originally by: Sarmaul
Originally by: MrRookie
Minmatar ships have always had split wepon systems, infact I don't think there is any minmatar ships without a launchers slot. Suddenly now it became a good idea training missiles skills?
I know Minnies rely on more skills but the op is exaggerating. It's not like those skills where more than usefull before the phon got a missile bonus.
Generally all minmatar ships only have 1 or 2 slots left over after fitting as many turrets as possible and they either fit missiles or nos in them.
The Typhoon and the recons are completely different. Exactly half of their weapon points are missiles, while the other have a turrets. Not only that, but the ships gets bonuses to both missiles and turrets. Finally, on these ships the missiles do more damage than the turrets. You would be better off flying them with good missile skills and crap gunnery than the other way around. Hence, if you want to fly a phoon properly you need damn good missile skills.
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Chakademus
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Posted - 2006.07.06 14:28:00 -
[47]
Well what can i say that hasnt been said,
Skills waisted other near essential skills not trained and unneeded ones in there too.
I will have my phoon entirely kitted in t2 with t2 drones and i only started training for it about 2months ago. If you do get all those skills there then u will only be able to t2 almost every BS with an ok setup and with a bit of extra work in gunnery and u will have them all in t2.
The phoon = BS you can do anything with and with the skills at that lvl you'll kill almost any other BS out there cause there wont be many with such a specialised ship that can stand up to that.
I <3 my phoon soon to buy 3 more to play with so i dont have to carry around so many mods around with me.
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Renowned
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Posted - 2006.07.06 14:32:00 -
[48]
Uhm, Forget the large autocannon 5's, and the BS 5, really.
Go NOS, a T2 Outfitted Phoon is not necessarily uber, or that much better then a properly outfitted pvphoon.
You lose damage, but I think atm, on the phoon, 4 nos/ 4 cruise/torps (depending on what you can fit) is the best choice.
And yeah, half your skills are ridiculous.
I'm a 6 month old character, and have no where near another 6 months of training for full t2, try.. more like 3-4 months, and thats purely due to bs 5, which, I want for my macharial, and the t3, phoon doesnt need all that crap to be effective, just half of it.
Fly it before you train it that way..
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Stamm
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Posted - 2006.07.06 14:40:00 -
[49]
You're an idiot posting misleading rubbish in order to try and make a point.
What your post should be is '2 years to max out everything possible, for every fitting I can think of for a Typhoon'
If you have 23mil SP, and all in Minmatar, then why can't you fire T2 large guns already? Where are your skillpoints?
You need repair systems to V and you need shield skills? Are you planning on dual tanking it?
You need spec level IV on your T2 drones, for all races?
You need to max out cruise and torpedoes to get in it? What are you planning to have some of each?
You have drone interfacing to level 2 and you have 23mil SP, again I have to ask what you have spent those skillpoints on.
Surgical strike level 3? Again, same question...
I'm sorry, you're attempting to deceive with this post, there are no two ways about it.
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Crellion
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Posted - 2006.07.06 16:25:00 -
[50]
Mattari whinage this whole thread...
Their ships are only the second most skill intensive anyway (after Caldari) and only marginally more intensive than Gallente. Ammar are last.
Nothing to see here move on.
(After the developements in this game in the last 15 months listing drone skills and ew skills and tanking skills as "needed to fly a particular ship" -non drone bonused or EW bonused - is moronic to say the least.
What you need is simple:
1) For Caldari: Missles and hybrids
2) For Gallente: Hybrids and drones (for the many dronebonus ships)
3) For Minmattar: Projectiles and missles.
4) For ammar: Lasers and drones (for the few dronebonused ships)
Thats it. Drone skills, ew skills and tanking skills (both armor and shield for all races) helps of course.
Caldaris cry cause they like Missles and Nos and dont want to have to train hybrids.
Gallente cry cause they are uber blaster specced and now boo-hoo my ship needs drones too (or vice verca they are the more undecided race)
Mattaris are a/c and Nos ****** and if you suggest training missle skills they whine.
Ammar are ALL lasers and NOTHING else (drone skills and missle skills are an insult to the Emperor).
Boo-f*****g-Hoo
PS: @OP I have a character maxed for a Hulk and Morphite mining I want to train for Caldari BSs but people say I have to do Hybrids and missles and EW and shield tank and armor tank (for EW set ups) and navigation skills cap management and engineering skills and mechanic skill... I am desperate and think of leaving the game... what should I do Deidre? 
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SengH
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Posted - 2006.07.06 16:35:00 -
[51]
Originally by: Stamm
Edited by: Stamm on 06/07/2006 14:49:02
You're an idiot posting misleading rubbish in order to try and make a point.
What your post should be is '2 years to max out everything possible, for every fitting I can think of for a Typhoon'
If you have 23mil SP, and all in Minmatar, then why can't you fire T2 large guns already? Where are your skillpoints?
You need repair systems to V and you need shield skills? Are you planning on dual tanking it?
You need spec level IV on your T2 drones, for all races?
You need to max out cruise and torpedoes to get in it? What are you planning to have some of each?
You have drone interfacing to level 2 and you have 23mil SP, again I have to ask what you have spent those skillpoints on.
Surgical strike level 3? Again, same question...
I'm sorry, you're attempting to deceive with this post, there are no two ways about it.
Edit : Yes I know you are leadership specced. But your original post claimed you were fully Minmatar specced, it's at least deceiving to say that without saying how many SP you've invested in leadership. But then again, your whole post was designed to mislead.
If you even read the thread I said I put the shield skills in there for my claymore. I am minnie specced as I can use the claymore how its meant to be used at 97% effectivenses. As I'm going to be flying that for the foreseeable future. I tossed that in there. Its far more useful than any single pvp pilot in almost any group situation.
Drone interfacing lvl 2 is back from the time when the bonus was +1 drones per level. The tempest had space for just 7 heavy drones and I saw little to any point in training it further at the time. I havent had the time since to deal with it. Surgical strike 3 is because I could not justify spending the 4 days for 3% more damage when it could better be spent on other skills that would allow me doing my job better. I fly command ships as how their supposed to be used, not like the superhac crowd.
I even said remove 1-2 months if that makes you happy for skills that you deem extraenous. That still puts it @ 270 days. Well over 3/4 a year, to fly a TIER 1 BS at tech 2 effectiveness.
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Stamm
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Posted - 2006.07.06 16:36:00 -
[52]
If we want to argue about it.
Amarr have to train shield tanking, armour tanking, missiles, lasers and drones.
Minmatar have to train the same, except substitute projectiles for lasers, and miss out controlled bursts.
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Renowned
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Posted - 2006.07.06 16:39:00 -
[53]
phoon is the most expensive tier 1 bs, and the most widely varied. If you think about it, it makes sense that it'd take longer to train for max effectiveness.
but its not about maxing everything out man, its about using it when you can with satisfactory output. That doesn't require everything t2, etc etc etc... or all lvl 5 skills, or you'll be waiting a while to use it.
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Kaylana Syi
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Posted - 2006.07.06 19:37:00 -
[54]
Originally by: Stamm
If we want to argue about it.
Amarr have to train shield tanking, armour tanking, missiles, lasers and drones.
Minmatar have to train the same, except substitute projectiles for lasers, and miss out controlled bursts.
What shield tanking amarr ship? Surely you don't mean the SAC? 4 mids is not a shield tanking ship especially in PvP.
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Stamm
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Posted - 2006.07.06 19:42:00 -
[55]
Originally by: Kaylana Syi
Originally by: Stamm
If we want to argue about it.
Amarr have to train shield tanking, armour tanking, missiles, lasers and drones.
Minmatar have to train the same, except substitute projectiles for lasers, and miss out controlled bursts.
What shield tanking amarr ship? Surely you don't mean the SAC? 4 mids is not a shield tanking ship especially in PvP.
I'm being pedantic. You can shield tank Amarr ships. Apoc has 4 midslots and a reasonable amount of shields. Damnation and sacrilege have 4 midslots. Vengeance has 3 midslots. Many of the Khanid ships specifically mention shields. It is not unreasonable to shield tank Amarr ships. It's certainly as reasonable as it is to completely max out both armour and shield tanking to fly one ship.
I'm simply trying to demonstrate how ludicrous the original post is.
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