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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 15 post(s) |
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CCP FoxFour
C C P C C P Alliance
3395
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Posted - 2014.08.11 15:44:00 -
[1] - Quote
Hey guys,
Hope you are all having a wonderful summer. We have some small, iterative, changes for Incursions that we are hoping to release with Hyperion and would love your feedback on them.
- Assault systems for Incursions will now never be just NCNs. At most NCNs can only take up 50% of the sites.
- The re-spawn time between an incursion ending and it re-spawning has been lowered.
- Scout site rewards, and spawns, have been re-balanced.
The scout site changes are what we would really love some feedback on. We have attempted to up their reward (text changes in the client still to come) and up their difficulty.
The idea is that if you run these sites with 5 people they should be profitable to run, but not as profitable as Vanguards. While we have given them a balance pass, we think they probably need a bit more of a buff. Before we do that though we would love your feedback on how they are now.
When offering feedback on the scout sites if you could let us know what kind of fleet you ran it with and how long it was taking you to complete them broken down by which site you were running.
Hope you enjoy and thanks for the feedback guys. CCP SocksFour // Game Designer // @regnerba |
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CCP Bayesian
1143
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Posted - 2014.08.11 16:00:00 -
[2] - Quote
First! EVE Software Engineer Team Space Glitter |
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CCP FoxFour
C C P C C P Alliance
3395
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Posted - 2014.08.11 16:04:00 -
[3] - Quote
CCP Bayesian wrote:First!
And this here is a great example of how NOT to offer feedback. CCP FoxFour // Game Designer // @RegnerBA |
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Noriko Mai
1412
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Posted - 2014.08.11 16:07:00 -
[4] - Quote
CCP FoxFour wrote:CCP Bayesian wrote:First! And this here is a great example of how NOT to offer feedback.
Fight! |
WeaponsSt
3
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Posted - 2014.08.11 16:15:00 -
[5] - Quote
What are these new sites balanced for? The current meta of battleships and logi? Because if battleships can get into these sites that is what will be used.
Thanks for finally looking into these site btw. |
Harvey James
The Sengoku Legacy
874
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Posted - 2014.08.11 16:15:00 -
[6] - Quote
never done them .. after-all why would you ??
but that being said if they became a frigate only site that would be interesting ... without needing more than 1 logi aswell .. a little 5 on 5 frig action would be cool
Also who thought that incursions should be battleships trying too shoot frigates??? they should be shot .. also incursions are too profitable .. nerf the isk/LP rewards .. make it more casual and fun and varied Tech 3's need to be multi role ships not cruiser hulls with battleship tank and insane resists ABC's are clearly T2 in all but name.. remove drone assist mechanic. Nerf web strength ..... module tiercide FTW role based instead of tiers please. |
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CCP FoxFour
C C P C C P Alliance
3406
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Posted - 2014.08.11 16:18:00 -
[7] - Quote
WeaponsSt wrote:What are these new sites balanced for? The current meta of battleships and logi? Because if battleships can get into these sites that is what will be used.
Thanks for finally looking into these site btw.
There is no restriction on ships. CCP FoxFour // Game Designer // @RegnerBA |
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Harvey James
The Sengoku Legacy
874
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Posted - 2014.08.11 16:19:00 -
[8] - Quote
CCP FoxFour wrote:WeaponsSt wrote:What are these new sites balanced for? The current meta of battleships and logi? Because if battleships can get into these sites that is what will be used.
Thanks for finally looking into these site btw. There is no restriction on ships.
so nothing interesting here then ... pretty much the same as any other site then Tech 3's need to be multi role ships not cruiser hulls with battleship tank and insane resists ABC's are clearly T2 in all but name.. remove drone assist mechanic. Nerf web strength ..... module tiercide FTW role based instead of tiers please. |
Otuk Andven
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
16
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Posted - 2014.08.11 16:23:00 -
[9] - Quote
Harvey James wrote:CCP FoxFour wrote:WeaponsSt wrote:What are these new sites balanced for? The current meta of battleships and logi? Because if battleships can get into these sites that is what will be used.
Thanks for finally looking into these site btw. There is no restriction on ships. so nothing interesting here then ... pretty much the same as any other site then
given that Vanguard meta is focused around battle cruisers and a few solo logi I suspect they'll be designed as an slightly easier version of this and good thing too. One of the major problem with incursions is the high requirements mean that only a few big groups do it. By creating these small sites you can get corps and other group coming in and trying it out without competing with the major group.
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Xercodo
Xovoni Astronautical Manufacturing and Engineering
3670
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Posted - 2014.08.11 16:25:00 -
[10] - Quote
If you were to restrict BSes from entering then you might get the older players to stick with their VGs and Assaults and HQs
But just making them profitable is an awesome step for me :D The Drake is a Lie |
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CCP FoxFour
C C P C C P Alliance
3409
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Posted - 2014.08.11 16:34:00 -
[11] - Quote
I will try and hang out on Sisi with CCP FoxFour when i remember, but if you need any help testing this stuff best to give me a ping on twitter (@regnerba) or on IRC (Coldfront - [CCP]FoxFour]). CCP FoxFour // Game Designer // @RegnerBA |
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PopplerRo
21
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Posted - 2014.08.11 16:38:00 -
[12] - Quote
CCP FoxFour wrote: ..The re-spawn time between an incursion ending and it re-spawning has been lowered.
What range of a respawn cycle should be expected? |
Rain6637
Team Evil
15605
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Posted - 2014.08.11 16:44:00 -
[13] - Quote
something to keep in mind about a 5-ship payout curve and difficulty: a two-logi comp has a single point of failure (jams), and incursions do that. going with three logi eats into DPS, and takes up 60% the 5-ship limit. you could go remote rep or high EHP, but both of those are simply not available in small T1 (and leaves T3 for EHP, or Battleships for deep wells of cap for RR).
It -can- be accomplished with logi T1 frigates or [logi T1] cruisers, but if you make the payout enticing, people will just roll them with the expensive stuff faster.
rather than increasing the payout, I think you should consider increasing the number of ships in the payout curve. President of the Commissar Kate Fanclub | Rainfleet on Twitch | Twitter | Rainfleet mk.III | Imgur |
Xeent Tsool
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
1
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Posted - 2014.08.11 17:04:00 -
[14] - Quote
I run lowsec incursions semi-regularly. All of these changes sound great.
EDIT: Rain6637, I've heard that scout sites are VERY easy and that the current payout is a joke. Any other change will be meaningless if the payout isn't increased. |
Max Kupaptakov
Prosperity Fighters CZECH Alliance
0
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Posted - 2014.08.11 17:08:00 -
[15] - Quote
CCP FoxFour wrote:
The re-spawn time between an incursion ending and it re-spawning has been lowered. .
Oh, thanks you guys. Now I will have to move 70jumps a day, in order to make ISK in two different incursion sites if "Comunity drama" strikes again. Now you gonna gave us only more MOMs to pop and more jump to make.
You are just encouraging ppl to rage popping more. Then ppl will spend more time on route then "enjoying the content". Better would be to extend time between grinding the influence and poping the mom. |
Rain6637
Team Evil
15605
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Posted - 2014.08.11 17:15:00 -
[16] - Quote
Xeent Tsool wrote:I run lowsec incursions semi-regularly. All of these changes sound great.
EDIT: Rain6637, I've heard that scout sites are VERY easy and that the current payout is a joke. Any other change will be meaningless if the payout isn't increased. I'm aware. I just wanted to make the point that a 5 ship limit runs into the logi chain problem, at any difficulty. if they're going to alter the payout as an incentive, they should consider the number of ships and not just the per-ship figure. it strikes me as one of those matters of tradition that go unquestioned. President of the Commissar Kate Fanclub | Rainfleet on Twitch | Twitter | Rainfleet mk.III | Imgur |
Kalen Tsero
EVE University Ivy League
0
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Posted - 2014.08.11 17:29:00 -
[17] - Quote
Rain6637 wrote: I'm aware. I just wanted to make the point that a 5 ship limit runs into the logi chain problem, at any difficulty. if they're going to alter the payout as an incentive, they should consider the number of ships and not just the per-ship figure. it strikes me as one of those matters of tradition that go unquestioned.
Well what I'm getting from it is why do logi at all if it's balanced for 5 ships. Local reps at best is the only thing you may need. This to me sounds like it'll be no worse than the "The Blockade" or "When Worlds Collide" L4 missions. Which people run those solo.
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Sara Tosa
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
77
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Posted - 2014.08.11 17:36:00 -
[18] - Quote
Rain6637 wrote:Xeent Tsool wrote:I run lowsec incursions semi-regularly. All of these changes sound great.
EDIT: Rain6637, I've heard that scout sites are VERY easy and that the current payout is a joke. Any other change will be meaningless if the payout isn't increased. I'm aware. I just wanted to make the point that a 5 ship limit runs into the logi chain problem, at any difficulty. if they're going to alter the payout as an incentive, they should consider the number of ships and not just the per-ship figure. it strikes me as one of those matters of tradition that go unquestioned. first of all check if logis are really a requirement and if you can go by with just a spider group or even local repping ships. |
Tragot Gomndor
Rise of Cerberus Cerberus Unleashed
51
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Posted - 2014.08.11 18:13:00 -
[19] - Quote
currently running distress beacon... setup: 2x remote armor nestors, 1x shield nightmare, crap fits
too much ecm, too high hitpoints, we are doing it for like 30min already and only at the second spawn, i hope there comes not another, warped out twice... maybe works when counteracting the ecm somehow, we have no eccm :D 0.0 = GOONS = SAAAMMMMEEE!!!!1111222 |
BadAssMcKill
ElitistOps
834
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Posted - 2014.08.11 18:15:00 -
[20] - Quote
"Assault systems for Incursions will now never be just NCNs. At most NCNs can only take up 50% of the sites."
:yes: . |
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Mr Agathon
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
0
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Posted - 2014.08.11 18:17:00 -
[21] - Quote
CCP FoxFour wrote:WeaponsSt wrote:What are these new sites balanced for? The current meta of battleships and logi? Because if battleships can get into these sites that is what will be used.
Thanks for finally looking into these site btw. There is no restriction on ships. Why not restrict them to BC and under and have an introductory site that's profitable to run without billion isk battleships OR tens of millions of skillpoints. |
Tycho Naskingar
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
0
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Posted - 2014.08.11 18:30:00 -
[22] - Quote
Tragot Gomndor wrote:currently running distress beacon... setup: 2x remote armor nestors, 1x shield nightmare, crap fits
too much ecm, too high hitpoints, we are doing it for like 30min already and only got to the second spawn, i hope theres not another... maybe works when counteracting the ecm somehow, we have no eccm :D
edit: okay, we got a third spawn, so we ragequited
for everyone else, each spawn had 8 cruisers, some frigs, first spawn had 4-6 ecm cruiser, second spawn had a fleeing cruiser, moved to 150km...
Agreed, the amount of ECM in these sites is ridiculous and ECCM just doesn't seem to work. Haven't finished one yet running 2 to 4 domis. Maybe with a dedicated trigger and silly sensor strength but I haven't tried that yet.
As I see it now, all you could do would be marauders. |
Omia Ibruin
Centralised Censorship
0
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Posted - 2014.08.11 18:35:00 -
[23] - Quote
"The re-spawn time between an incursion ending and it re-spawning has been lowered."
Sing Hallelujah! Sing it Sing Hallelujah! Sing it, yeah Sing Hallelujah!
Sing Hallelujah! Sing it Sing Hallelujah! Sing it, yeah Sing Hallelujah! Sing Hallelujah!
Sing Hallelujah! Sing it Sing Hallelujah! Sing it
Dr-Alban |
James Baboli
Ferrous Infernum
62
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Posted - 2014.08.11 18:51:00 -
[24] - Quote
Tycho Naskingar wrote:Tragot Gomndor wrote:currently running distress beacon... setup: 2x remote armor nestors, 1x shield nightmare, crap fits
too much ecm, too high hitpoints, we are doing it for like 30min already and only got to the second spawn, i hope theres not another... maybe works when counteracting the ecm somehow, we have no eccm :D
edit: okay, we got a third spawn, so we ragequited
for everyone else, each spawn had 8 cruisers, some frigs, first spawn had 4-6 ecm cruiser, second spawn had a fleeing cruiser, moved to 150km... Agreed, the amount of ECM in these sites is ridiculous and ECCM just doesn't seem to work. Haven't finished one yet running 2 to 4 domis. Maybe with a dedicated trigger and silly sensor strength but I haven't tried that yet. As I see it now, all you could do would be marauders. The incursion rats use an ECM mechanic which is not dependent on sensor strength. It is a straight 100% chance to jam. That crazy bag FC with the silly things on the hull that shouldn't but just did. |
colera deldios
196
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Posted - 2014.08.11 18:58:00 -
[25] - Quote
@CCP FoxFour
You should be nerfing HS Incursions to the point where the avg. isk/hour is bellow that of 0.0 Instead of giving them even more ISK at no RISK. If you need me to list 30 reasons why HS Incursions should not make as much as 0.0 let me know. |
James Baboli
Ferrous Infernum
62
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Posted - 2014.08.11 19:06:00 -
[26] - Quote
Otuk Andven wrote: given that Vanguard meta is focused around battle cruisers and a few solo logi I suspect they'll be designed as an slightly easier version of this and good thing too. One of the major problem with incursions is the high requirements mean that only a few big groups do it. By creating these small sites you can get corps and other group coming in and trying it out without competing with the major group.
Uhm.......
Vanguard meta is currently battleships and t2 logi. the lightest tanked shield channels want at least a t2 invuln and DC2 with a t1 em rig. Lightest armor channel I know of runs t2 fit t1-hull cruiser logi and single EANM fits. Combat battlecruisers are almost unused in mainland highsec (what most people think of when they hear incursions without any modifiers). Attack battlecruisers are used almost exclusively for NCNs. Corporate fleets happen occasionally, but are usually out-contested by the incursion channel-based communities in HS.This is the intended sort of meta, as CCP would long ago have changed contest mechanics given the number of tears if these mechanics were not as intended. That crazy bag FC with the silly things on the hull that shouldn't but just did. |
Saraki Ishikela
Deep Space Adventure Time
61
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Posted - 2014.08.11 19:07:00 -
[27] - Quote
I liked the ideas being tossed around to make a cruiser/BC sized spawn that can be run by 3-5 people so newer players can run these and participate in the content.
If the current feedback of 4-5 Battleships taking 30+ minutes to run these is correct then they will still most likely go ignored.
TLDR Everyone in Battleships will still run Vanguards, let newer players run these in smaller ships. One newbies quest to ExploreEVE: Youtube:www.youtube.com/exploreeve- Blogspot:http://exploreeve.blogspot.com Twitter:www.twitter.com/exploreeve - Facebook:www.facebook.com/exploreeve |
Yuri Semah
I don't even care anymore
0
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Posted - 2014.08.11 19:11:00 -
[28] - Quote
Tried a Distress Beacon... first wave had 3 Antems, 4(!!!) Arnons, 1 Jel, 1 Mara and 1 Orkashu. That's about 1200 paper dps - about half of what you get in VGs, still too much for a local rep on a T1 BS (unless you sacrifice everything for it). 5 ECM ships, in VGs you have a maximum of 3, and all of them are frigates which you can shoot off the field really quick. If those Arnons decide to go crazy you have 4 out of your 5 ships on grid doing nothing. Lastly there is 561k EHP on field - that is as much as the 1st wave of an NMC with 5 Romis.
Less ECM and less EHP to get through, please. |
JamDunc
Ekchuah's Shrine Comporium
191
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Posted - 2014.08.11 19:42:00 -
[29] - Quote
I am assuming there is a trick we are missing?
I remember when Incursions first launched and everyone thought they were CRAZY. Once we learned the tactics they were easy. I'm not smart enough to work out the tactics though. |
Sniper Smith
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
180
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Posted - 2014.08.11 19:45:00 -
[30] - Quote
CCP FoxFour wrote:Hey guys,
- The re-spawn time between an incursion ending and it re-spawning has been lowered.
I'd like a clarification.. Ending re-spawn time, and it re-spawning has been lowered, contradict eachother..
Either it has no re-spawn time, in which case as soon as one dies, a new one spawns.. OR you've just lowered the re-spawn time to less than the current 24-48hr window.
Which is it?
Also, I would like it if you adjusted incursion so that the mom doesn't spawn as soon as influence is 0.. I mean even it just making it not span till the next dt.. or earliest it'll spawn is 48hrs after the Incursion spawned.. something so we don't have to move every day.. or if as I read, the spawn's start to happen instantly, we might be looking at 5 or so incursions a day.. that's just insane for BS fleets to move..
Some degree of stability would be much appreciated. |
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