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Scoundrelus
The Black Fleet
Pirate Coalition
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Posted - 2006.08.14 03:07:00 -
[1]
Ok this is a whine. I'm ****ed off and here I am whining. Now that those of you who hate whines know this go to a different thread.
What kind of whine is this? Its an ECM whine. You know how people call Burn Eden lamers for stabbing up their ships? Well it seems we have an ECM version of Burn Eden now. These AYDS corp guys are the most annoying thing to EVER hit EVE in my opinion. They'll fly around in a gang of like 8 people and each one has ECM on their ship. Our corporation are experienced PvPers yet we have lost Command Ships and Recons to their ECM fleets and these guys are all like 4 months old! You just cannot fight back. All you can do is sit there and wait to die with like 15 Multispectrals on you.
How can we overcome this? Simple answer. Grab another 8 man ECM fleet and hope to out-ECM them. Wheres the fun in that though? Why must we alter our tactics because of the actions of a few individuals who prefer the lamer side of PvP. ECM is getting ridiculous. It's unbelievable how retarded this one module is. I can lose 100 ships in combat and it won't bother me one bit, but losing one to ECM drives me crazy. I don't expect CCP to see this thread and nerf it. I don't expect anything good to come from this thread, however merely posting it makes me feel better that I've vented a bit. Also it helps to remember that any AYDS member you run into will have ECM.
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Kriva Fajriika
DOLT KREW
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Posted - 2006.08.14 03:10:00 -
[2]
Fit ECCM.
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Scoundrelus
The Black Fleet
Pirate Coalition
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Posted - 2006.08.14 03:12:00 -
[3]
 Originally by: Kriva Fajriika
Fit ECCM.
Yes, because ECCM will stop 15+ multispectrals. Been there, tried it, failed.
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Selfe
Caldari
UK Corp
Lotka Volterra
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Posted - 2006.08.14 03:15:00 -
[4]
Well jamm them before they jamm you
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Join The UK Corperation. Foundin Partners in Lokta Volterra |
Verone
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Posted - 2006.08.14 03:15:00 -
[5]
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
Dude, seriously... We've seen the same thing.
I've done some research and it's like this.
Highs = Guns
Mids = ECM
Lows = Stabs
People say "waaah waaah use backups".
Hold on... backups get a stacking penalty... ECM modules don't, their chance stacks... so fit a rack and you're guaranteed a perma jam, even moreso with a gang of ECM racked people.
In one way props to them, they're killing people and taking minimal losses.
In another way it shows just how messed up ECM is, and now there is no practical counter for it when the reality of how it's fitted is realised.
We've pretty much given up on actively engaging them, they only engage with at least 3:1 odds and masses of ECM.
We've seen ruptures with 5 points on them warp out of a fight.
Then again, when they do explode on the rare occasion, they drop lots of stabs, which refine ok to build Ammo, that we waste on shooting them. 
Vicious cycle mate...
BACKSTORY AND FAN FICTION
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Drayce
Caldari
Solitary Forsaken
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Posted - 2006.08.14 03:20:00 -
[6]
Have you tried full FoF missile attacks? Long Range? ECM them before they nab you? Sic drones on them before you get locked down?
ECM is obviously their strong point, try and think of a way around it.
ECM modules take mid slots, they're obviously sacrificing something else to equip those modules whether it be speed (Afterburners or MWD), tank (If they're Caldari or certain Minnie boats) or tackle gear (Webbers and Warp Disruptors).
Play to their weaknesses and to your strengths. 
always remember... Think before you post
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Scoundrelus
The Black Fleet
Pirate Coalition
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Posted - 2006.08.14 03:25:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Drayce
Have you tried full FoF missile attacks? Long Range? ECM them before they nab you? Sic drones on them before you get locked down?
ECM is obviously their strong point, try and think of a way around it.
ECM modules take mid slots, they're obviously sacrificing something else to equip those modules whether it be speed (Afterburners or MWD), tank (If they're Caldari or certain Minnie boats) or tackle gear (Webbers and Warp Disruptors).
Play to their weaknesses and to your strengths.
I appreciate your attempt bro but TRUST me, theres nothing we haven't tried. Out ECMing them is the only solution and we hate doing that. The corp doesn't agree with it. Long range works, but they just warp away then. Drones work, but they can't do ALL the work. Also not all ships are drone ships. FoF would be good but not everyone can use FoF. I have like 36k missile skills because im Amarr. We've gone against them with VASTLY superior ships and just been utterly wiped due to ECM. There was one successful incident where it was 7 vs 7 and they lost all 7 of their ships and we lost 3. They didn't have ECM at that time except for 1 Blackbird. I heard ECM will be nerfed in Kali. Is this true or are some cruel players raising my hopes for no reason?
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Leilani Solaris
Gallente
0utbreak
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Posted - 2006.08.14 03:27:00 -
[8]
AYDS are ghey, they blobbed my zealot 
On another note, NERF ECM!
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Aeaus
Tharsis Security
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Posted - 2006.08.14 03:29:00 -
[9]
Don't while, the most you could have lost was a cruiser.
Guess what happens when you load up on a lot of ECCM modules against an enemy that does nothing but ECM... Their ships are gimped.
I hate ECM too, and yes it's unbalanced, but even still you can and should adapt especially if you know your enemy this well.
My Guides |
Scoundrelus
The Black Fleet
Pirate Coalition
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Posted - 2006.08.14 03:31:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Aeaus
Don't while, the most you could have lost was a cruiser.
Guess what happens when you load up on a lot of ECCM modules against an enemy that does nothing but ECM... Their ships are gimped.
I hate ECM too, and yes it's unbalanced, but even still you can and should adapt especially if you know your enemy this well.
I don't see how all I could have lost was a Cruiser since I fly HACs, Recons, Battleships, etc.
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Zudari
eXin Alliance
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Posted - 2006.08.14 03:37:00 -
[11]
id try an uber tank and hope they run out of cap
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Dao 2
Generals Of Destruction Syndicate
Axiom Empire
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Posted - 2006.08.14 05:33:00 -
[12]
regardless of whatever else ppl are saying ;p i think a general consenssus is that ECM needs to be nerfed and is unbalanced ;p
least tahts how i see it :| and i do think it is way overpowered ;p the "ecm nerf" was nothing of the sort....
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NEWLY ADDED ON 1/19 (though applies to all posts before ;p)
the usual "I don't represent my corp or alliance" and stuffs like that
Also the gal |
Aram Gishno
Caldari
The Establishment
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Posted - 2006.08.14 05:42:00 -
[13]
Now you know what all those people you've ganked felt like :)
<carebear> Leave me alone! I want to play the game my way! And I want to fit lots and lots of expanders!
<pirate> Muahahahahha! Too bad for you, adapt and fit stabs, use a scout and instas or die you little fluffy carebear! Adapt!
<carebear> but.. but.. you killed my ship!
I'm sure you can see the irony :)
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Kuolematon
Caldari Provisions
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Posted - 2006.08.14 05:51:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Aram Gishno
Now you know what all those people you've ganked felt like :)
<carebear> Leave me alone! I want to play the game my way! And I want to fit lots and lots of expanders!
<pirate> Muahahahahha! Too bad for you, adapt and fit stabs, use a scout and instas or die you little fluffy carebear! Adapt!
<carebear> but.. but.. you killed my ship!
I'm sure you can see the irony :)
Priceless!
Unnerf Amarr!
"Just because you can utterly ruin another player's game doesn't mean that you must."
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Rexthor Hammerfists
Black Nova Corp
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2006.08.14 06:13:00 -
[15]
more like clueless.
its pretty obvious that ecm needs a fix,
id b all for takin mulitspectrals out of the game til a new solution is on the way,
til fitting single racials on not special jamming ships isnt practiable.
-
Purple Conquered The World, We the Universe.
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Skraelingz
Gallente
Gallente Federal Bank
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Posted - 2006.08.14 07:40:00 -
[16]
Edited by: Skraelingz on 14/08/2006 07:41:25
Quote:
Out ECMing them is the only solution and we hate doing that. The corp doesn't agree with it.
If it works, it works though right? Its not HOW you win fights in this game, its who's the one flying thier ship and not thier pod back.
If you won't out eccm or ecm or whatever them, then enjoy continuing to get owned.
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IizzaBatch
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Posted - 2006.08.14 07:43:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Kriva Fajriika
Fit ECCM.
Fit eccm and get jammed anyway, it doesn't work, the best chance they have is to play them at their own game and fit jammers aswell. Jamming is not fit to be ingame in its current state.
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IizzaBatch
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Posted - 2006.08.14 07:46:00 -
[18]
Edited by: IizzaBatch on 14/08/2006 07:48:40
Originally by: Aeaus
Don't while, the most you could have lost was a cruiser.
Guess what happens when you load up on a lot of ECCM modules against an enemy that does nothing but ECM... Their ships are gimped.
I hate ECM too, and yes it's unbalanced, but even still you can and should adapt especially if you know your enemy this well.
No, more like, guess what happens when you load up on eccm vs ecm users, your ship is just as gimped as theres is, and they end up getting some jams of on you anyway, you lose. It doesn't help that eccm has a stacking penalty, but even if it didnt, jamming would still need to be nerfed.
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Mintless
AYDS
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Posted - 2006.08.14 08:03:00 -
[19]
I am not sure if I should be saying anything here, but what the hell.
I am new to this game (almost 1 month now) and joined up with all my friends in ayds (we're all from other games so we've played with eachother alot). I am amarr and I am still having trouble figuring out what role I want to fill (I like the color ships :( but ppl say they suck!). That's me. Now for ayds:
Multispec ECM spam? Please. Every encounter i've been in (so everything in the past month) we've spent plenty of time scouting, prepping, and talking over. That's most of the skill involved in the game anyways right? Unless pressing F1-F8 with a mix of CONTROL and ALT is considered mind bending skillz.
Thankfully the real issue of this thread isn't ayds (or is it?  ), but how blatently overpowered and broken ECMS actually are. Fortunately, we're allowed to spam them as much as we can to continue to show the EVE online universe how stupid their function vs ECCMs (which when stacked can be powerful, but you'll still get jammed) really is, and they'll get nerfed to something reasonable.
I am hoping that is what this thread is actually about, and not about a corp of 3-4 month old players (at most) winning due to coordination and planning vs year/2year/3year old ships & corps.
As for us spamming stabs? rofl, what? I think 2, maybe 3 of us, in the entire corp even have whatever skill it is you've gotta have to fit them. It's also pretty neat that veto says something about OUR stabs. If I recall correctly (and our logs as well) an ishkur of yours piloted by some newer member with phoenix in his name had 3 points of scram on him, and a web, and somehow warped out. (and then took a screenshot, in which he said he'd take a screenshot right 'now', yet the screenshot showed him a few systems out, an empty local, and some mismash junk lows).
Sorry for the smacktalk, I usally refrain from that, but I was delighted to find out how much veto frowns upon stabs only to encounter a veto stabber shortly thereafter.
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Please resize image to a maximum of 400 x 120, not exceeding 24000 bytes, ty - Cortes |
Jenny Spitfire
Caldari
LoneStar Industries
Veritas Immortalis
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Posted - 2006.08.14 08:03:00 -
[20]
Chateau EWAR?
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Cruelty is God's way of showing kindness.
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Dixon
Caldari
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Posted - 2006.08.14 08:07:00 -
[21]
ECM is getting a nerf, so you can rejoice over that fact... AIDS however is still overpowered.
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I have no strong feelings one way or the other... |
ZaKma
The Scope
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Posted - 2006.08.14 08:13:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Verone
Hold on... backups get a stacking penalty... ECM modules don't, their chance stacks... so fit a rack and you're guaranteed a perma jam, even moreso with a gang of ECM racked people.
Their chance doesn't stack. Each module has it's own chance to jam, regardless of how many you fit.
I'm a leaf on the wind. Watch how I soar. |
Gilbert0
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Posted - 2006.08.14 08:16:00 -
[23]
You guys can bring up the fact that ECM needs to be nerfed all you want- it really does need to be nerfed. However I'd ask that you at least get your facts straight. Verone is saying we're stabbed to the max or whatever- none of us fit stabs at all except our TWO (count em) jammers- which are in dedicated jamming ships (even they don't fit them unless they think they might get primaried). None of our DPS ships have ECM fitted.
Two jamming ships- not full racks on everyone. No stabs on any DPS ship whatsoever. A rupture warped off with 5 points on it? Right man :P. (as an aside, a Veto ishtar really DID warp off with 3 points on it the other day).
Let's tackle the 3:1 odds thing next. Usually you guys engage us, not the other way around. You'll see EXACTLY what we have and our numbers and engage us anyway. I'm not sure how you are in a position to complain. Nothing but respect for you guys, you're obviously making decent money pirating to be able to constantly lose battleships and hacs to us.
For the record Verone you've never even engaged us as far as I know. You're hearing a lot of excuses from your guys for dying to our 4 month old tech 1 cruisers I'd imagine, but try not to believe everything you hear.
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Mintless
AYDS
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Posted - 2006.08.14 08:18:00 -
[24]
Hm I wanted to keep secret the fact that we only have 2 ships at most (one who's working alot, and the other who's afk at random intervals :|), both of which are specialized ecm ships anyways, but oh well 
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Please resize image to a maximum of 400 x 120, not exceeding 24000 bytes, ty - Cortes |
Avon
Caldari
Black Nova Corp
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2006.08.14 08:21:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Scoundrelus
Originally by: Kriva Fajriika
Fit ECCM.
Yes, because ECCM will stop 15+ multispectrals. Been there, tried it, failed.
Have you tried it since ECCM got boosted?
It really makes a difference now.
The Battleships is not and should not be a solo pwnmobile - Oveur
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Alliaanna Dalaii
Gallente
Does Not Compute
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Posted - 2006.08.14 08:22:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Gilbert0
You guys can bring up the fact that ECM needs to be nerfed all you want- it really does need to be nerfed. However I'd ask that you at least get your facts straight. Verone is saying we're stabbed to the max or whatever- none of us fit stabs at all except our TWO (count em) jammers- which are in dedicated jamming ships (even they don't fit them unless they think they might get primaried). None of our DPS ships have ECM fitted.
Two jamming ships- not full racks on everyone. No stabs on any DPS ship whatsoever. A rupture warped off with 5 points on it? Right man :P. (as an aside, a Veto ishtar really DID warp off with 3 points on it the other day).
Let's tackle the 3:1 odds thing next. Usually you guys engage us, not the other way around. You'll see EXACTLY what we have and our numbers and engage us anyway. I'm not sure how you are in a position to complain. Nothing but respect for you guys, you're obviously making decent money pirating to be able to constantly lose battleships and hacs to us.
For the record Verone you've never even engaged us as far as I know. You're hearing a lot of excuses from your guys for dying to our 4 month old tech 1 cruisers I'd imagine, but try not to believe everything you hear.
Some cleverly worded smack, 7/10
I agree with the Op, ECM brakes PvP and is a complete ******* joke. Bleh as to these noob ecm stabmonkeys.... Just do exactly what they will complain and whine about, blob them with snipers 
Alliaanna
DNC Treasure Hunt !!
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Mintless
AYDS
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Posted - 2006.08.14 08:23:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Alliaanna Dalaii
Originally by: Gilbert0
You guys can bring up the fact that ECM needs to be nerfed all you want- it really does need to be nerfed. However I'd ask that you at least get your facts straight. Verone is saying we're stabbed to the max or whatever- none of us fit stabs at all except our TWO (count em) jammers- which are in dedicated jamming ships (even they don't fit them unless they think they might get primaried). None of our DPS ships have ECM fitted.
Two jamming ships- not full racks on everyone. No stabs on any DPS ship whatsoever. A rupture warped off with 5 points on it? Right man :P. (as an aside, a Veto ishtar really DID warp off with 3 points on it the other day).
Let's tackle the 3:1 odds thing next. Usually you guys engage us, not the other way around. You'll see EXACTLY what we have and our numbers and engage us anyway. I'm not sure how you are in a position to complain. Nothing but respect for you guys, you're obviously making decent money pirating to be able to constantly lose battleships and hacs to us.
For the record Verone you've never even engaged us as far as I know. You're hearing a lot of excuses from your guys for dying to our 4 month old tech 1 cruisers I'd imagine, but try not to believe everything you hear.
Some cleverly worded smack, 7/10
I agree with the Op, ECM brakes PvP and is a complete ******* joke. Bleh as to these noob ecm stabmonkeys.... Just do exactly what they will complain and whine about, blob them with snipers
Alliaanna
I agree.
more people come out to our systems!!
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Please resize image to a maximum of 400 x 120, not exceeding 24000 bytes, ty - Cortes |
The Penitent
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Posted - 2006.08.14 08:26:00 -
[28]
if you really hate ecm that bad, save up for a mothership.
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Tanya Kovacs
SteelVipers
YouWhat
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Posted - 2006.08.14 08:35:00 -
[29]
Oh dear this sucks. I'm Caldari and I have quite alot sp in ecm-skills. Hearing stories like this really hurts me .
/emote fears the ubernerf which renders ecm-ships nearly useless
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All my postings reflects just my personal opinion and my lacking knowledge of proper english.
There is no lag in EVE \o/ |
eLLioTT wave
Art of War
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Posted - 2006.08.14 08:38:00 -
[30]
Edited by: eLLioTT wave on 14/08/2006 08:38:13
Originally by: The Penitent
if you really hate ecm that bad, save up for a mothership.
You lose the thread!
edit: that was so bad in fact, you lose the forums for today. |
Apochix
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Posted - 2006.08.14 08:44:00 -
[31]
This sounds more like one of those arguements where people who have been playing the game longer just can't believe they're being handily defeated by younger players. "Guys, it's not fair, we have 30 million skill points each, and fly in 200 million isk ships. That alone should cause their ships to explode into billions of particles of tritanium without us firing a shot."
Anyway, I also agree with everyone else that ECM needs a nerf. However it only needs one more update to make it right. It should only be allowed on ships built for ECM. This means blackbird, scorpion, rook and falcon. Oh, and that little caldari frig that nobody ever uses. Fitting a Domi with nos, jammers, a huge tank and heavy drones is a little overkill IMO. However, guess what guys?! This wouldn't affect us at all, SINCE WE USE ECM SPECIFIC SHIPS. Sorry we haven't been around the game long enough to have our egos self-inflated by the number of our skill points, otherwise we may use our deimos' and pilgrim's to pop thrashers and rookie ships too.
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Mirasta
Caldari
Enigma Enterprises
Veritas Immortalis
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Posted - 2006.08.14 08:50:00 -
[32]
Originally by: Aram Gishno
Now you know what all those people you've ganked felt like :)
<carebear> Leave me alone! I want to play the game my way! And I want to fit lots and lots of expanders!
<pirate> Muahahahahha! Too bad for you, adapt and fit stabs, use a scout and instas or die you little fluffy carebear! Adapt!
<carebear> but.. but.. you killed my ship!
I'm sure you can see the irony :)
I LOLed
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Wheya
Amarr
Bruderschaft des Wahrhaftigen
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Posted - 2006.08.14 09:08:00 -
[33]
I find the anti-multispectral comments rather amusing.
You think multispectrals are bad? Imagine you and your corp would restrict yourself to ships of one race only because of roleplay reasons (what a strange idea). Of course your enemies knows it and therefore fit adequate racial jammers. That's bad.
My utmost respect to PIE and 1PG who still fight under this conditions. I do not. I enjoy the industrial aspect of EVE instead. PvP is dead. It's only outblobbing and EW and... don't get me started talking about other issues.
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Sir Juri
Caldari
Caldari Provisions
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Posted - 2006.08.14 09:26:00 -
[34]
Edited by: Sir Juri on 14/08/2006 09:33:40
Its not just ECM beeing powerfull with no skills and using it on frigates/cruisers. Lets not forget the tech2 ECM fitted scorpion with both multi spec and racials failing to jam a tech1 cruiser with no eccm for 5-6cycles when its a jamming boat, and with good skills Actually I had more succesfull jamming with a ship thats not a scorpion.
edit; But I do think ecm/electronic warfare should be a big part of the game just as guns and a tank is. Just need to think of a new way to implement ecm so its not just about "luck", it shouldnt be a lottery. And I dont think ecm and other forms of electronic warfare should be limited to a few ships, every ship should be able to use it, offcourse not as good.
damn need to make a new sig... |
Jim McGregor
Caldari
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Posted - 2006.08.14 09:30:00 -
[35]
Edited by: Jim McGregor on 14/08/2006 09:31:54
ECM needs to be for EW ships only. If ccp feels that some normal ships needs ecm to have a fighting chance, they have not reached balance in my opinion.
I would like to compare this with the stunning effect in other games like WoW actually. Did you happen to see anyone stunned for 30 seconds in WoW, and then stunned again after 10 more seconds for another 30? And all it takes to do this is basicly one multispectral.
You dont gimp your ship in any significant way either, since all it takes is one slot. You throw it on there and usually it works a few times in a fight. Its overpowered as hell and ccp should feel ashamed for not hotfixing this fast. I dont know why they dont see this as a major problem with the game. I think it is.
Edit: Tuxford has said they are looking into it, but not when. Its probably not being fixed for Kali One... I dont even think Kali One will be on time with its current features.
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Eve Wiki | Eve Tribune | Eve Pirate |
Kinsy
Celestial Apocalypse
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Posted - 2006.08.14 09:36:00 -
[36]
Originally by: Leilani Solaris
AYDS are ghey, they blobbed my zealot
On another note, NERF ECM!
/me whistles...
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Sir Juri
Caldari
Caldari Provisions
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Posted - 2006.08.14 09:39:00 -
[37]
Originally by: Jim McGregor
Edited by: Jim McGregor on 14/08/2006 09:31:54
ECM needs to be for EW ships only. If ccp feels that some normal ships needs ecm to have a fighting chance, they have not reached balance in my opinion.
I would like to compare this with the stunning effect in other games like WoW actually. Did you happen to see anyone stunned for 30 seconds in WoW, and then stunned again after 10 more seconds for another 30? And all it takes to do this is basicly one multispectral.
You dont gimp your ship in any significant way either, since all it takes is one slot. You throw it on there and usually it works a few times in a fight. Its overpowered as hell and ccp should feel ashamed for not hotfixing this fast. I dont know why they dont see this as a major problem with the game. I think it is.
Edit: Tuxford has said they are looking into it, but not when. Its probably not being fixed for Kali One... I dont even think Kali One will be on time with its current features.
I believe electronic warfare including ecm should not be limited only to specific ships. I think that would be unfair and boring tbh. Guns/tank/ecm/nos and everything else, gives more depth and tactics in the game. Game would be boring if you pick up caracal for instance and said, okey lets fit missiles and a tank... hmm thats all folks!
But they need to change it from that stupid "lottery" system. Make it with something that has stats more tangeable like guns/tank/nos/trackin disruptor etc. Dampeners need to be changed some to. And fitting one ECM should be like fitting one gun, not more.
damn need to make a new sig... |
Mung Face
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Posted - 2006.08.14 09:47:00 -
[38]
It's true all of us in AYDS are quite terrible at EVE which is one of the main reasons why we use ECM. At the moment we currently have two ships dedicated to jamming targets while we discuss (over ventrilo for faster communication) the best way we should activate our modules on targets.
EVE is quite an intense game as far as reactions go, there is so much to do whilst fighting so we figured if targets are jammed we won't have to worry about getting hit by them, then can discuss the best way to hit the F1-F8 keys to eliminate targets. Some of us are still quite new to combat, I sometimes get to F3 and forget what to do next and have to start all over but Gilb is always friendly and helps me out, he is really a great leader. Sorry to all the people we have angered, from now on we will not be using ECM but instead flying our 2.5m combat SP Tech 1 cruisers straight into battleships etc to die and hopefully will one day become as good as you guys are (any helpful tips are also appreciated as we are indeed quite new to this game).
Love, Mung Face.
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Boonaki
Caldari
Suffoco Noctis
Atrocitas
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Posted - 2006.08.14 09:55:00 -
[39]
Bring 2 carriers, covert ops, and sensor boosted inties. Camp the gates (on top of the gates) as soon as they warp in (or your covert ops find their safes) the sensor boosted inties attack them with their fighters. With a stab/ecm setup the fighters will shred them rather quickly.
Fear the Ibis of doom! |
Jim McGregor
Caldari
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Posted - 2006.08.14 09:55:00 -
[40]
Originally by: Sir Juri
I believe electronic warfare including ecm should not be limited only to specific ships. I think that would be unfair and boring tbh. Guns/tank/ecm/nos and everything else, gives more depth and tactics in the game. Game would be boring if you pick up caracal for instance and said, okey lets fit missiles and a tank... hmm thats all folks!
But they need to change it from that stupid "lottery" system. Make it with something that has stats more tangeable like guns/tank/nos/trackin disruptor etc. Dampeners need to be changed some to. And fitting one ECM should be like fitting one gun, not more.
Nobody is suggesting removing nos, tracking disruptors, target painters, dampeners or any other form of electronic warfare from normal ships. The game would still have loads of tactical options open.
Its very frustrating. Also you can have lots of "fun" in a frigate gang where you use multispectrals and dampeners in combination. Even if a cycle fails, the dampeners will make sure the other ship doesnt regain the lock until its way too late.
Ravens with a full rack of ecm modules and wcs in the lows... dominix with nos and ecm... its not even funny anymore. People dont use the ships in the way they were originally designed because ecm is so powerful its always better than tanking.
You think its boring to not have ecm on normal ships? Well, its pretty boring to bring a battleship into a fight and dont get to fire a single gun too, before dying.
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Eve Wiki | Eve Tribune | Eve Pirate |
Radioactive Babe
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Posted - 2006.08.14 10:03:00 -
[41]
ECM is fecked at the moment and needs a good beating with a nerf bat. I liked the suggestion of a cooldown, using that coupled with a non chance based way of using them would be best imo.
As for the suggestion that ECM be a caldari only feature (people only ever mention BB, Scorp, Rook and Falcon) that would be extremely crappy ... they should get quite a large bonus to ECM modules but not be the only people who can fit it.
(and I loled as well to the carebear comparison  )
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Sir Juri
Caldari
Caldari Provisions
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Posted - 2006.08.14 10:07:00 -
[42]
Originally by: Jim McGregor
Edited by: Jim McGregor on 14/08/2006 09:56:12
Originally by: Sir Juri
I believe electronic warfare including ecm should not be limited only to specific ships. I think that would be unfair and boring tbh. Guns/tank/ecm/nos and everything else, gives more depth and tactics in the game. Game would be boring if you pick up caracal for instance and said, okey lets fit missiles and a tank... hmm thats all folks!
But they need to change it from that stupid "lottery" system. Make it with something that has stats more tangeable like guns/tank/nos/trackin disruptor etc. Dampeners need to be changed some to. And fitting one ECM should be like fitting one gun, not more.
Nobody is suggesting removing nos, tracking disruptors, target painters, dampeners or any other form of electronic warfare from normal ships. The game would still have loads of tactical options open.
ECM in its current form is very overpowered. Also you can have lots of "fun" in a frigate gang where you use multispectrals and dampeners in combination. Even if a cycle fails, the dampeners will make sure the other ship doesnt regain the lock until its way too late.
Ravens with a full rack of ecm modules and wcs in the lows... dominix with nos and ecm... its not even funny anymore. People dont use the ships in the way they were originally designed because ecm is so powerful its always better than tanking.
You think its boring to not have ecm on normal ships? Well, its pretty boring to bring a battleship into a fight and dont get to fire a single gun too, before dying.
I dont dissagree with that. But they should be able to create a new ECM system which will still allow non jamming boats to use it. One that works in a new way. Its not fun to not fire one shot it happens to me many times in ravens to, but we should be able to have both. Both ecm for everyone but not as good as now and making jamming boats better, no stupid lottery but then much more crap when used on normal ships.
Well I dont have a clue how to fix it really all I want is no stupid lottery. Fact is a jamming boat should be uber at jamming. And I dont want ECM to be as good on non jamming boats, but still a viable option. And I want ECM/dampeners to be a part of EVE as much as guns/tank, but again in a better system then the one that is existing now.
Oh and dont forget to whine about dampeners to.. if they fix ecm without fixing dampeners we will see a million threads about those the next day
damn need to make a new sig... |
eLLioTT wave
Art of War
|
Posted - 2006.08.14 10:13:00 -
[43]
Originally by: Sir Juri
I believe electronic warfare including ecm should not be limited only to specific ships. I think that would be unfair and boring tbh. Guns/tank/ecm/nos and everything else, gives more depth and tactics in the game. Game would be boring if you pick up caracal for instance and said, okey lets fit missiles and a tank... hmm thats all folks!
If ecm brings more "depth" why does every man and his drone (get it? :P) use it?
ecm en masse = win button.
Look at the tournament, wouldn't it be fun if everyone only fought with guns missiles for a change?
when you discourage blobbing you bring about fun for everyone. I want to go into fights knowing that i have a chance at winning. Not as it is now where ihave to weigh up their numbers and factor in each ship probably has ecm... therefore i need equal numbers or slightly less to engage with a chance of not being jammed the entire fight. |
Jim McGregor
Caldari
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Posted - 2006.08.14 10:15:00 -
[44]
Fine. Lets just make ecm modules have about 10% chance to jam when used against a battleship on a normal ship. But when used on EW ships, ship bonuses makes this 50% instead. That would be fine with me.
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Eve Wiki | Eve Tribune | Eve Pirate |
Larsson7
Minmatar
Sharks With Frickin' Laser Beams
Mercenary Coalition
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Posted - 2006.08.14 10:19:00 -
[45]
If we look at covert cloaking or strip miners as an example of how ECM should possibly work, this is a possible alternative.
Make ECM something silly like 1000 PG each with a 99% reduction for ECM specialised ships (Scorp, Rook, Falcon, Blackbird)
Warping into fights to be jammed by 25 ships all packing ecm is absurd.
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Sir Juri
Caldari
Caldari Provisions
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Posted - 2006.08.14 10:19:00 -
[46]
Originally by: eLLioTT wave
Originally by: Sir Juri
I believe electronic warfare including ecm should not be limited only to specific ships. I think that would be unfair and boring tbh. Guns/tank/ecm/nos and everything else, gives more depth and tactics in the game. Game would be boring if you pick up caracal for instance and said, okey lets fit missiles and a tank... hmm thats all folks!
If ecm brings more "depth" why does every man and his drone (get it? :P) use it?
ecm en masse = win button.
Look at the tournament, wouldn't it be fun if everyone only fought with guns missiles for a change?
when you discourage blobbing you bring about fun for everyone. I want to go into fights knowing that i have a chance at winning. Not as it is now where ihave to weigh up their numbers and factor in each ship probably has ecm... therefore i need equal numbers or slightly less to engage with a chance of not being jammed the entire fight.
Read my whole post plz. I dont like the way ECM is implemented now in its current form/system. But if balanced better perhaps a whole new way then yes I do think it brings more depth into the game. If you cant handle more factors then shoot/tank, well then im sorry, but you should have to.
guns och bara en massa tank=I CS:source 
damn need to make a new sig... |
Sir Juri
Caldari
Caldari Provisions
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Posted - 2006.08.14 10:20:00 -
[47]
Originally by: Larsson7
If we look at covert cloaking or strip miners as an example of how ECM should possibly work, this is a possible alternative.
Make ECM something silly like 1000 PG each with a 99% reduction for ECM specialised ships (Scorp, Rook, Falcon, Blackbird)
Warping into fights to be jammed by 25 ships all packing ecm is absurd.
Every ship I seen from your corp packs ECM, especially your megathrons
damn need to make a new sig... |
Radioactive Babe
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Posted - 2006.08.14 10:26:00 -
[48]
Originally by: Larsson7
If we look at covert cloaking or strip miners as an example of how ECM should possibly work, this is a possible alternative.
Make ECM something silly like 1000 PG each with a 99% reduction for ECM specialised ships (Scorp, Rook, Falcon, Blackbird)
no no no no no no no (and no)
That kind of scenario would lead to all new players selecting caldari as they would then be without a shadow of doubt be the 1 win button (eve on easy mode already)
(as for your first point, covert cloaks fit on two ships of all races and strip miners were a new training tree for all races)
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Jim McGregor
Caldari
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Posted - 2006.08.14 10:32:00 -
[49]
Originally by: Radioactive Babe
Originally by: Larsson7
If we look at covert cloaking or strip miners as an example of how ECM should possibly work, this is a possible alternative.
Make ECM something silly like 1000 PG each with a 99% reduction for ECM specialised ships (Scorp, Rook, Falcon, Blackbird)
no no no no no no no (and no)
That kind of scenario would lead to all new players selecting caldari as they would then be without a shadow of doubt be the 1 win button (eve on easy mode already)
(as for your first point, covert cloaks fit on two ships of all races and strip miners were a new training tree for all races)
No they wouldnt. The caldari EW ships were designed to have low firepower while being good at jamming. Thats why they are good in groups and not solo pwnmobiles. You get the solo pwnmobiles when you can use multispectrals on dominix and raven.
---
Eve Wiki | Eve Tribune | Eve Pirate |
Radioactive Babe
|
Posted - 2006.08.14 10:43:00 -
[50]
Originally by: Jim McGregor
Originally by: Radioactive Babe
Originally by: Larsson7
If we look at covert cloaking or strip miners as an example of how ECM should possibly work, this is a possible alternative.
Make ECM something silly like 1000 PG each with a 99% reduction for ECM specialised ships (Scorp, Rook, Falcon, Blackbird)
no no no no no no no (and no)
That kind of scenario would lead to all new players selecting caldari as they would then be without a shadow of doubt be the 1 win button (eve on easy mode already)
(as for your first point, covert cloaks fit on two ships of all races and strip miners were a new training tree for all races)
No they wouldnt. The caldari EW ships were designed to have low firepower while being good at jamming. Thats why they are good in groups and not solo pwnmobiles. You get the solo pwnmobiles when you can use multispectrals on dominix and raven.
My point is that the Caldari race would be overpowered, you would be insane to go against a mostly caldari fleet in any other races ships (when the new tier3 BS's come out Caldari will be overpowered as it is - wont show immediately as most caldari pilots have poorish hybrid gun skills)
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Jim McGregor
Caldari
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Posted - 2006.08.14 10:46:00 -
[51]
Originally by: Radioactive Babe
My point is that the Caldari race would be overpowered, you would be insane to go against a mostly caldari fleet in any other races ships (when the new tier3 BS's come out Caldari will be overpowered as it is - wont show immediately as most caldari pilots have poorish hybrid gun skills)
Caldari are designed to be the high tech race and have the only EW battleship in the game. Its very easy for anyone to train for a scorpion no matter what race you ship fly. Takes 1 week maybe? So your idea of racial fleets are pretty foreign in this game. Its never caldari vs gallente fleets etc.
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Eve Wiki | Eve Tribune | Eve Pirate |
Tas Devil
JUDGE DREAD Inc.
Forces of Freedom
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Posted - 2006.08.14 10:49:00 -
[52]
My god the OP is useless... I'd really like to see a 7 man gang all fitted with multi's kill and equal number of experienced PVPers even if they didn't fit EW...
perhaps your problem is you thought you'd pawn them straight up and are going to fight them alone and unprepared ?
The best Laugh ever ...
Credit goes to Killer8 for this !
Oh and apparently the mods tell me there is bad language on his site so beware kids :) |
Avon
Caldari
Black Nova Corp
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2006.08.14 10:52:00 -
[53]
Originally by: Jim McGregor
Edited by: Jim McGregor on 14/08/2006 10:21:17
Fine. Lets just make ecm multispectrals have about 10% chance to jam (when fully skilled in signal dispersion) when used against a battleship on a normal ship. But when used on EW ships, ship bonuses makes this 50% instead. That would be fine with me.
In fact, lets cut their strength in half and then give bonuses to EW ships.
That would make the math like this... hypnos multispectral has 2.4 strength and with signal dispersion 5 it becomes 3.0.
Chance to jam Raven (strength 22) becomes 3/22 = 13.6%.
Why go to all that effort?
Calculate the chance of a multispec jamming a raven which is using 1 midslot ECCM (racial).
Deciding that ECM is overpowered because people don't want to use the counters provided is pointless, imho.
The Battleships is not and should not be a solo pwnmobile - Oveur
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Radioactive Babe
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Posted - 2006.08.14 10:54:00 -
[54]
Originally by: Jim McGregor
Edited by: Jim McGregor on 14/08/2006 10:46:27
Originally by: Radioactive Babe
My point is that the Caldari race would be overpowered, you would be insane to go against a mostly caldari fleet in any other races ships (when the new tier3 BS's come out Caldari will be overpowered as it is - wont show immediately as most caldari pilots have poorish hybrid gun skills)
Caldari are designed to be the high tech race and have the only EW battleship in the game. Its very easy for anyone to train for a scorpion no matter what race you fly. Takes 1 week maybe? No gunskills needed. So your idea of racial fleets are pretty foreign in this game. Its never caldari vs gallente fleets etc.
As you pointed out, if i was a new Amarr/Gallente/Minnie player I would have to train up a different skill tree if i wanted to use ewar, people wont bother - they will just go with the i win race and no-one will create characters of any other race
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Jim McGregor
Caldari
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Posted - 2006.08.14 11:01:00 -
[55]
Originally by: Avon
Why go to all that effort?
Calculate the chance of a multispec jamming a raven which is using 1 midslot ECCM (racial).
Deciding that ECM is overpowered because people don't want to use the counters provided is pointless, imho.
Using 1 Hypnos multispectral from ship with no ecm bonuses: 4.8 base + 25% from maxed signal dispersion = 6.0 strength. Raven has 22 strength.
Chance to jam Raven without eccm = 6/22 = 27.2%.
Chance to jam Raven with 1 racial medium slot eccm = 27.2/2 = 13.6%.
Every 20 seconds you get a new chance. So in 1 minute, you get 3 tries.
Im not exacly sure how to calculate the chance to get a jam in 3 tries. Is it like this?
Chance to NOT jam = 100 - 27.2 = 72.8 = 0.728
0.728 * 0.728 * 0.728 = 0.385 = 38.5% chance to NOT jam with 3 tries = 61.5% to JAM in 3 tries?
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Eve Wiki | Eve Tribune | Eve Pirate |
Sir Juri
Caldari
Caldari Provisions
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Posted - 2006.08.14 11:02:00 -
[56]
Originally by: Radioactive Babe
Originally by: Jim McGregor
Edited by: Jim McGregor on 14/08/2006 10:46:27
Originally by: Radioactive Babe
My point is that the Caldari race would be overpowered, you would be insane to go against a mostly caldari fleet in any other races ships (when the new tier3 BS's come out Caldari will be overpowered as it is - wont show immediately as most caldari pilots have poorish hybrid gun skills)
Caldari are designed to be the high tech race and have the only EW battleship in the game. Its very easy for anyone to train for a scorpion no matter what race you fly. Takes 1 week maybe? No gunskills needed. So your idea of racial fleets are pretty foreign in this game. Its never caldari vs gallente fleets etc.
As you pointed out, if i was a new Amarr/Gallente/Minnie player I would have to train up a different skill tree if i wanted to use ewar, people wont bother - they will just go with the i win race and no-one will create characters of any other race
Yeah EWAR should be open to everyone, caldari might be better with it just as gallenet is with drones but everyone should be able to use it, just as youll see a raven packing drones.
damn need to make a new sig... |
Jim McGregor
Caldari
|
Posted - 2006.08.14 11:12:00 -
[57]
Originally by: Jenny Spitfire
Originally by: Jim McGregor
Im not exacly sure how to calculate the chance to get a jam in 3 tries. Is it like this?
43.25%
Jenny, I really hate your tendencies to just jump into threads with "conclusions" and not explaining how you reach them.
How did you calculate that? I want to learn it.
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Eve Wiki | Eve Tribune | Eve Pirate |
Larsson7
Minmatar
Sharks With Frickin' Laser Beams
Mercenary Coalition
|
Posted - 2006.08.14 11:13:00 -
[58]
Originally by: Radioactive Babe
Originally by: Jim McGregor
Originally by: Radioactive Babe
Originally by: Larsson7
If we look at covert cloaking or strip miners as an example of how ECM should possibly work, this is a possible alternative.
Make ECM something silly like 1000 PG each with a 99% reduction for ECM specialised ships (Scorp, Rook, Falcon, Blackbird)
no no no no no no no (and no)
That kind of scenario would lead to all new players selecting caldari as they would then be without a shadow of doubt be the 1 win button (eve on easy mode already)
(as for your first point, covert cloaks fit on two ships of all races and strip miners were a new training tree for all races)
No they wouldnt. The caldari EW ships were designed to have low firepower while being good at jamming. Thats why they are good in groups and not solo pwnmobiles. You get the solo pwnmobiles when you can use multispectrals on dominix and raven.
My point is that the Caldari race would be overpowered, you would be insane to go against a mostly caldari fleet in any other races ships (when the new tier3 BS's come out Caldari will be overpowered as it is - wont show immediately as most caldari pilots have poorish hybrid gun skills)
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Jenny Spitfire
Caldari
LoneStar Industries
Veritas Immortalis
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Posted - 2006.08.14 11:14:00 -
[59]
Edited by: Jenny Spitfire on 14/08/2006 11:16:57
Originally by: Jim McGregor
Originally by: Jenny Spitfire
Originally by: Jim McGregor
Im not exacly sure how to calculate the chance to get a jam in 3 tries. Is it like this?
43.25%
Jenny, I really hate your tendencies to just jump into threads with "conclusions" and not explaining how you reach them.
How did you calculate that? I want to learn it.
/me lub short and simple, optimised^^. CBA to explain on forums.
(3 choose 1) * success^1 * failure^2
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Cruelty is God's way of showing kindness.
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Jenny Spitfire
Caldari
LoneStar Industries
Veritas Immortalis
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Posted - 2006.08.14 11:24:00 -
[60]
Originally by: Kitty O'Shay
CCP's random number generator is broken.
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Cruelty is God's way of showing kindness.
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Kitty O'Shay
Tharsis Security
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Posted - 2006.08.14 11:24:00 -
[61]
Well, I'm starting to think that ECM *isn't* broken.
CCP's random number generator is broken.
There's 2 things in Eve that get the most complants, ECM and the T2 lottery. What's the one thing they have in common?
--
1 in 10 chance to win a battleship! |
Bull Slater
Minmatar
Tekumi
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Posted - 2006.08.14 12:17:00 -
[62]
Time for a stupid idea, how about a sacraficial smartbomb geddon warping in on top of them with the help of covert ops? You guys then jump in a few seconds afterwards when they're all targetting and trying to jam the geddon / other smartbomb loaded BS and then you get to take out at least one or two before they know what's happening. Stupid idea? I dunno, limited PvP experience but it sounds like it'd work to me.
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Verone
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Posted - 2006.08.14 14:35:00 -
[63]
Originally by: Gilbert0
Verone is saying we're stabbed to the max or whatever- none of us fit stabs at all except our TWO (count em) jammers- which are in dedicated jamming ships (even they don't fit them unless they think they might get primaried). None of our DPS ships have ECM fitted.
Yes i'm saying you stab out. It's your rupture which has warped away countless times with multiple points on it, one including 5 points.
Originally by: Gilbert0
A rupture warped off with 5 points on it? Right man :P. (as an aside, a Veto ishtar really DID warp off with 3 points on it the other day).
Oh really. After a lengthly talk with the pilot, and seeing exactly what happened, I was presented with this. I raise you one Screenshot, of him fitted specifically to counter you guys, that tells me you're lying. Plus my word, which has NEVER been broken in TWO YEARS. Next argument please?
Originally by: Gilbert0
Let's tackle the 3:1 odds thing next. Usually you guys engage us, not the other way around. You'll see EXACTLY what we have and our numbers and engage us anyway. I'm not sure how you are in a position to complain. Nothing but respect for you guys, you're obviously making decent money pirating to be able to constantly lose battleships and hacs to us. For the record Verone you've never even engaged us as far as I know.
The 3:1 odds are accurate, as for Veto we're fine and always will be. Sometimes we're bored and think of the off chance you might have read the ships and modules forum and decided to put a reasonable setup on your ship.
As for myself not engaging you? I warped into four of your pilots flying an Astarte a couple of weeks back. I promplty tackled the first target, a BB, which warped out after taking armor damage. Next I locked a rupture and engaged that.
I was jammed by the three remaining ships for almost two minutes. 2 ruptures and a Rax. I had two cap booster charges left when somehow the three, plus the BB who had warped back in failed to jam me. The BB became primary again, I locked fired, and all 4 of the ships vanished from my overview to a gate, 2 points were on one of the two ruptures at the time. I survived because your guys ran when their ECM failed.
I've also heard a few engagements between you guys, and our guys. All I hear is "I'm jammed"... "xxxx too" "xxxx as well"... "here's more of them coming in..." "Unjammed... Primary is xxx... xxx jammed again". "xxx still jammed".
Originally by: Gilbert0
You're hearing a lot of excuses from your guys for dying to our 4 month old tech 1 cruisers I'd imagine, but try not to believe everything you hear.
No I'm hearing more and more people saying "oh, there's those AYDS guys again, don't bother with them, they're racked with ECM and stabs, you're not gonna even get the remotest fight out of them unless they're guaranteed a gank."
What reason would I have to break a reputation I've spent two years building, by lying about a group of rookie players who have to ECM spam targets to survive and register kills?
I'm done with this thread. I've presented the FACTS I have, and came home from work expecting to see a few responses regarding ECM, and how people feel about it. A subject in Eve that needs SERIOUS review for balance. Sadly it comes down to you taking a cheap shot at our corp policy and our members.
Typical
BACKSTORY AND FAN FICTION
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Taikus
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Posted - 2006.08.14 15:07:00 -
[64]
Originally by: Verone
Originally by: Gilbert0
A rupture warped off with 5 points on it? Right man :P. (as an aside, a Veto ishtar really DID warp off with 3 points on it the other day).
Oh really. After a lengthly talk with the pilot, and seeing exactly what happened, I was presented with this. I raise you one Screenshot, of him fitted specifically to counter you guys, that tells me you're lying. Plus my word, which has NEVER been broken in TWO YEARS. Next argument please?
so question in the screen shot how come the other pilots aren't in local with him anymore?
how come hes got so many chats in scrollback after he said he took screen shot that he hadta scroll up to where he said taking ss.
did he maybe forget to take the ss when he said he would? or maybe he hadta refit real quick?
Clearly requires clarification :(
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Estelle Matsuko
Caldari
The Beiatch Corp Inc
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Posted - 2006.08.14 15:18:00 -
[65]
If it works, it works. No use crying over lost ships.
Noobs with ecm owning older players? Unlucky. Makes an interesting change. Adapt, overcome or move to a safer region.
IŠll not comment on ecm being overpowered or not as iŠm so new I canŠt even USE ecm yet.
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Father Weebles
Lost Dawn Technologies
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Posted - 2006.08.14 15:18:00 -
[66]
Originally by: Larsson7
If we look at covert cloaking or strip miners as an example of how ECM should possibly work, this is a possible alternative.
Make ECM something silly like 1000 PG each with a 99% reduction for ECM specialised ships (Scorp, Rook, Falcon, Blackbird)
Warping into fights to be jammed by 25 ships all packing ecm is absurd.
exactly....you took my idea
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McFizze
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Posted - 2006.08.14 15:19:00 -
[67]
Originally by: Verone
Oh really. After a lengthly talk with the pilot, and seeing exactly what happened, I was presented with this. I raise you one Screenshot, of him fitted specifically to counter you guys, that tells me you're lying. Plus my word, which has NEVER been broken in TWO YEARS. Next argument please?
Nice mids there.
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Verone
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Posted - 2006.08.14 15:31:00 -
[68]
Edited by: Verone on 14/08/2006 15:31:50
Originally by: McFizze
Originally by: Verone
Oh really. After a lengthly talk with the pilot, and seeing exactly what happened, I was presented with this. I raise you one Screenshot, of him fitted specifically to counter you guys, that tells me you're lying. Plus my word, which has NEVER been broken in TWO YEARS. Next argument please?
Nice mids there.
Originally by: Verone
of him fitted specifically to counter you guys,
Enough said.
BACKSTORY AND FAN FICTION
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Verone
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Posted - 2006.08.14 15:35:00 -
[69]
Originally by: Taikus
Stuff
This requires no more clarification than what I've given. People who deal with our corp know who we are, and whether we can be trusted.
Again, Enough said.
That's all for me in this thread. If you'd like anything else cleared up, drop me an Eve-Mail.
BACKSTORY AND FAN FICTION
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Taikus
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Posted - 2006.08.14 16:04:00 -
[70]
Originally by: Verone
Originally by: Taikus
Stuff
This requires no more clarification than what I've given. People who deal with our corp know who we are, and whether we can be trusted.
Again, Enough said.
That's all for me in this thread. If you'd like anything else cleared up, drop me an Eve-Mail.
so then theres no real answer for why ss was taken so long after he said he would take it. and really you cant prove that he didn't refit ship, and basically everything you said COULD be bs but people should take your word for it anyway.
good argument
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Jim McGregor
Caldari
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Posted - 2006.08.14 16:05:00 -
[71]
Edited by: Jim McGregor on 14/08/2006 16:05:16
Originally by: Taikus
so then theres no real answer for why ss was taken so long after he said he would take it. and really you cant prove that he didn't refit ship, and basically everything you said COULD be bs but people should take your word for it anyway.
good argument
Lol @ you trying to smacktalk in the forums...
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Eve Wiki | Eve Tribune | Eve Pirate |
McFizze
|
Posted - 2006.08.14 16:19:00 -
[72]
And was this to counter us too?
http://kills.ayds.org/?mode=mail&mail=385&num=0
for reference there we ganked your guys while they were ganking a Tempest so you really couldn't be setup for us:
See me!
http://veto.get-no.de/killboard/?mode=mail&mail=13428&num=0
I suppose he was ready to fight us too:
http://veto.get-no.de/killboard/?mode=mail&mail=13377&num=0
Fighting the op corp none the less.
Or this:
http://veto.get-no.de/killboard/?mode=mail&mail=13074&num=0
Oh those jamming Tempest!
Is there a justification for any of that? Or are you a giant hypocrite who tells people to contact in game mail so you can ignore or show your true colors. (Don't wanna tarnish that valiant rep!)
Also in your EPIC Astarte battle I fail to see how 3 Tech one cruisers with 3 mids can jam your ship for 2 minutes while at the same time keeping you webbed and scrammed. That is 6 consecutive jams on an 18 strength(not the best, but still not weak) ship. If they were stacked with ECM, why not just mwd away. They couldn't have webs, scrams, propulsion, and ECM. It's pretty tough to fit 4 mid-slot mods on a ship with 3 mids(Read that on the Ships and Mods forums). So pretty much what you were saying is these god-like cruisers did this, and you sat there for 2 minutes waiting to die. I'm sorry, but I don't buy this. And furthermore we only have 2 Minmitar cruisers, me being one of them and I didn't fight you. I'll give you a hint what happened though, the BB came back in further away, and didn't take 2 minutes to warp! And how can you not instagib a T1 cruiser that is using as you say 3 slots for stabs and ECM in mids(NO TANK) in an Astarte when you had him locked and scrammed??? You are lying.
Also show me a killmail with one of our pilots using stabs.
I think the real problem here is:
http://veto.get-no.de/killboard/?mode=corp&id=2352&view=1&kn=0
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Taikus
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Posted - 2006.08.14 16:58:00 -
[73]
Originally by: Jim McGregor
Edited by: Jim McGregor on 14/08/2006 16:05:16
Originally by: Taikus
so then theres no real answer for why ss was taken so long after he said he would take it. and really you cant prove that he didn't refit ship, and basically everything you said COULD be bs but people should take your word for it anyway.
good argument
Lol @ you trying to smacktalk in the forums...
smacktalk? i just asking a question
but lol @ you for lolling at me
:D:D:D:D
LOLERTASTICNESSFANTASTICATIOn
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Soumk
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Posted - 2006.08.14 17:23:00 -
[74]
Originally by: Scoundrelus
Ok this is a whine. I'm ****ed off and here I am whining. Now that those of you who hate whines know this go to a different thread.
What kind of whine is this? Its an ECM whine. You know how people call Burn Eden lamers for stabbing up their ships? Well it seems we have an ECM version of Burn Eden now. These AYDS corp guys are the most annoying thing to EVER hit EVE in my opinion. They'll fly around in a gang of like 8 people and each one has ECM on their ship. Our corporation are experienced PvPers yet we have lost Command Ships and Recons to their ECM fleets and these guys are all like 4 months old! You just cannot fight back. All you can do is sit there and wait to die with like 15 Multispectrals on you.
How can we overcome this? Simple answer. Grab another 8 man ECM fleet and hope to out-ECM them. Wheres the fun in that though? Why must we alter our tactics because of the actions of a few individuals who prefer the lamer side of PvP. ECM is getting ridiculous. It's unbelievable how retarded this one module is. I can lose 100 ships in combat and it won't bother me one bit, but losing one to ECM drives me crazy. I don't expect CCP to see this thread and nerf it. I don't expect anything good to come from this thread, however merely posting it makes me feel better that I've vented a bit. Also it helps to remember that any AYDS member you run into will have ECM.
Sounds like you corp sucks at ECM warfare.
Ask CCP to nerf it so you can kill those AYDS guys.
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Locke DieDrake
Port Royal Independent Kontractors
Imperial Republic Of the North
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Posted - 2006.08.14 17:27:00 -
[75]
Originally by: Scoundrelus
Ok this is a whine. I'm ****ed off and here I am whining. Now that those of you who hate whines know this go to a different thread.
What kind of whine is this? Its an ECM whine. You know how people call Burn Eden lamers for stabbing up their ships? Well it seems we have an ECM version of Burn Eden now. These AYDS corp guys are the most annoying thing to EVER hit EVE in my opinion. They'll fly around in a gang of like 8 people and each one has ECM on their ship. Our corporation are experienced PvPers yet we have lost Command Ships and Recons to their ECM fleets and these guys are all like 4 months old! You just cannot fight back. All you can do is sit there and wait to die with like 15 Multispectrals on you.
How can we overcome this? Simple answer. Grab another 8 man ECM fleet and hope to out-ECM them. Wheres the fun in that though? Why must we alter our tactics because of the actions of a few individuals who prefer the lamer side of PvP. ECM is getting ridiculous. It's unbelievable how retarded this one module is. I can lose 100 ships in combat and it won't bother me one bit, but losing one to ECM drives me crazy. I don't expect CCP to see this thread and nerf it. I don't expect anything good to come from this thread, however merely posting it makes me feel better that I've vented a bit. Also it helps to remember that any AYDS member you run into will have ECM.
So you got owned, repeatedly by some nubs. And the best you could do was come on the forums whining for a ECM nerf?
/Me points and laughs.
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The deeper you stick it in your vein, the deeper the thoughts there's no more pain.
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Imaran
Forum Moderator
Interstellar Services Department
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Posted - 2006.08.14 17:38:00 -
[76]
This thread is going nowhere fast.
If you feel you have anything to add or comment on regarding game mechanics, please feel free to use the Game Development forum.
If you feel you are victim of a bug, please file a bug report.
Locked for ranting, trolling, and flaming as well as posting of killboard links and personal attacks.
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