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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 4 post(s) |
Lardarz B'stard
Amarr
Out Of Exile
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Posted - 2006.08.21 05:17:00 -
[211]
I would love to have had both the brains and the balls to pull this off.
Exiles Recruitment |
Kalexis DEV
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Posted - 2006.08.21 05:24:00 -
[212]
You cant get robbed in this game. Being robbed is a victim based crime that requires no effort on the part of the vic to happen.
Getting scammed requires an active amount of action on the part of the victim. To get beguiled or greedy.
If you're smart and realistic, you want get damaged in this game, save for a gank.
I, and the other people, am not defending this guy who popped alot of peoples dream bubbles. Im merely saying 'told ya so', to all those thousands that got greedy and dumb.
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Eschwen
Gas Giant Industries
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Posted - 2006.08.21 07:36:00 -
[213]
 Originally by: Dark Shikari
Perhaps you did not read my post.
I did not state that EMFI was protected through diversity.
Originally by: Dark Shikari
This means that even though EMFI had absolutely tons of them, it was a mere 8 billion ISK, which could be recouped with a single month of not paying dividends even if all EMFI's plans for recouping the money otherwise failed.
Oh, I read them just fine.
That said, I wish EMFI all the luck in the world in recovering the investors funds from the EIB. I hope that whatever feeling of generosity or responsibility that extends from the shattered remnants of the EIB towards EMFI also reaches out to the individual investors. After all, like you so wisely pointed out, EMFI can recover from this in a mere month's time. I am quite certain that there are other smaller investors out there who will be hurting for much longer than that.
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Jack Flack
Caldari
Technomic Industries Inc.
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Posted - 2006.08.21 08:09:00 -
[214]
Dark Shikari, I have read most of the posts during EIB auditing and afterwards. I have been following your posts and reactions to your posts as carefully as I can. Allow me to point out that you have a great responsibility in this.
You have openly challenged Currin, made people believe that his allegations against EIB are most likely groundless, his claims are originating from other motives and the clues he was offering were void. Your referrals led people to take CurrinÆs evidences very lightly (and yes, they were evidences!).
Maybe you tried to be unbiased in your statements, but you sorely failed to do so. Your remarks were not taken as ôunbiasedö by the public. Right before/during the auditing process, several people warned you directly that you are favoring EIB by creating a sense of trust in Cally. You were so convinced in your ôso to speakö unbias ôin your own eyesö that you didnÆt change your tone.
After CurrinÆs scam, many people were on the verge of withdrawing their support from EIB and break their investment with Cally. Some of them did not do so, because they trusted in your word and they lost fortunes! Even Cally openly admits this and he officially thanks you for your help in his public record! Yes, DS, you did help Cally and the public heard it from his own mouth!
You owe to the EVE community an official apology. But what do we see instead? The same old forum spamming with the usual ôcooler, wiser than thouö attitude and a poor caricature of self-defense. Sir Juri has been trying to point the fact out to you several times, canÆt you really see? Or is it too unbearable in your counscience and heavy on your pride. You have mumbled several words but they are nowhere near what can be called a heartfelt apology.
You have a great recognition and respect in the eyes of the public and you have misused it (deliberately or not). Great recognition brings great responsibility and now you are trying to evade that responsibility! There is only one thing which can restore it. A public apology in the right time and place is nothing but honor, my friend. That is what people have seen in you so far and would like to keep seeing in you from now on.
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Ricdics
Corporate Placement Holding
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Posted - 2006.08.21 09:10:00 -
[215]
I have a couple of quick questions for EMFi regarding all of this. I don't feel his is responsible or played a part in people's decisions in any way. People have always been told to make their own decisions, not rely on someone else to do it for them.
Questions:
1) Cally has advised that you knew his main "Dentara Rast". During the 1 month or so where Cally said he couldnt log onto eve, did you ever have Dentara in your P&P to confirm that his main wasn't logging onto eve?
2) If he was, why wouldnt this information be brought to light?
3) As someone who now has access (limited?) too EIB, what kind of access levels do you have, and based on your roles, what kinds of reimbursements can you provide?
Questions for Kal:
1) In light of all the new information, how do you plan to act in regards to customer's with accounts
2) In light of Dentara advising that he has "doctored the work-books" how can you be sure that a person who has 10b in an account, isnt really a fake Dentara alt and will gain off this?
3) Is the EIBI share buyback process going to be upheld?
4) If the buyback goes ahead, how do you know that Dentara doesnt have thousands of his own EIBI shares, to add more billions to his scam?
5) Once accounts have been paid out and shares have been bought back (if this is planned) how do you then plan to proceed? Will you be leaving the bank open, or shutting it down due to the terrible rep it obviously now has?
Thanks guys in advance.
Insured Research and Production Services
Queues |
Tharrn
Amarr
1st Praetorian Guard
Vigilia Valeria
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Posted - 2006.08.21 09:29:00 -
[216]
Well, all I can say is that Istvaan will have to come up with something better now :P
Now recruiting!
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EMFI Auditor
Minmatar
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Posted - 2006.08.21 09:44:00 -
[217]
Quote:
1) Cally has advised that you knew his main "Dentara Rast". During the 1 month or so where Cally said he couldnt log onto eve, did you ever have Dentara in your P&P to confirm that his main wasn't logging onto eve?
I suspected this for a while (as did half of eve) I mean since may or so. Rast was the subject of our conversation before I put any isk in the bank a few months ago.
I only knew for sure since a few weeks, I also think that the increased presure (for him to come clean) might have triggered the chain of events as they unfolded.
I was under the impression that during the scandal for the last few weeks noone would be putting more isk into the bank and people were making withdrawals daily. Forcing the issue (going public with the info) would have risked people making withdrawals. Rast was playing with me as much as I was playing with him, giving him the impression I didn't know so people could get isk out while Rast thought he still had a shot at 1T.
I also found out that Rast found out that I knew *for sure* and I didn't just suspect him about a day or two before the movie. I accidentily leaked this information to someone close to Rast. I think this prompted him to come out becuase there wasn't a chance in his eyes the bank would be recoverable under him.
Quote:
2) If he was, why wouldnt this information be brought to light?
He didn't log in with Rast, at least not while I was looking.
Quote:
3) As someone who now has access (limited?) too EIB, what kind of access levels do you have, and based on your roles, what kinds of reimbursements can you provide?
At the moment there is nothing in the bank itself. All assets are on some Directors (wallets, personal hangars) spread through space in deliveries on EIBI, and in the wallets of people having loans with EIB.
I am working with some of the directors to get as much isk as possible. As of this moment no isk has been transferred yet and the Directors still could run with everything.
Quote:
1) In light of all the new information, how do you plan to act in regards to customer's with accounts
Kal has told me he is away till tuesday at least.
Quote:
2) In light of Dentara advising that he has "doctored the work-books" how can you be sure that a person who has 10b in an account, isnt really a fake Dentara alt and will gain off this?
Rast has mentioned he only doctored the satalite corps and the big alliance accounts. Reimbursement (if any) will probably be through non-alts. Kal and myself know a great number of Cally alts both by admission and research. Unfortunately I think we will have to avoid paying anyone having ties with Rast or being an alt.
Quote:
3) Is the EIBI share buyback process going to be upheld?
I immagine this depends on the ammount of recoverable funds, and if we can get hold of the EIBI shares that are in possession of Veleena. Otherwise share buyback will have to go on basis of papertrail.
Quote:
4) If the buyback goes ahead, how do you know that Dentara doesnt have thousands of his own EIBI shares, to add more billions to his scam?
See #3
Quote:
5) Once accounts have been paid out and shares have been bought back (if this is planned) how do you then plan to proceed? Will you be leaving the bank open, or shutting it down due to the terrible rep it obviously now has?
I have been talking with the active directors about this. At this moment it is unlikely the bank will be able to operate as is. We are hoping to be able to recover as many assets and loan repayments as possible over the next weeks/months.
Quote:
Thanks guys in advance
Please note that nothing has changed yet. Kal is AFK, I am in contact with a director but I haven't seen any funds yet.
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"The only thing I am gonna argue with alts is wether I should argue with alts."
-- Naphtalia 2006 |
Azulios
Incarnation of Evil
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Posted - 2006.08.21 09:53:00 -
[218]
0.0
Well dont Cally - you found the elusive "I Win" button.
Can I have some of your ISK? 
Nub Hazing / Rank 5 / SP: 7072 of 40000 |
Kirgisian Light
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Posted - 2006.08.21 10:54:00 -
[219]
790 Billion, with EIB? lol never, this is the scam of a scam
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taylor04
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Posted - 2006.08.21 11:33:00 -
[220]
Edited by: taylor04 on 21/08/2006 11:33:41
come on fraps us your wallet, show us your majour victims.
http://img133.imageshack.us/img133/5241/cheerbear7lv.jpg |
Crazy Bugger
Eve Intergalactic Bank
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Posted - 2006.08.21 11:37:00 -
[221]
Thanks for answering those questions EMFi. Good to know there is still work being done to repair the situation.
E-I-B Bank Teller
Insured Research and Production Services
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Bermag
Point-Zero
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Posted - 2006.08.21 12:15:00 -
[222]
There have been so many smoke screens around this whole affair that I suspect this confession does not tell the whole truth.
Emfi, how long did you know that Dentara was Cally's main? Didn't you get suspicious that a shady character like that was the person behind EIB?
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Dark Shikari
Caldari
Imperium Technologies
Firmus Ixion
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Posted - 2006.08.21 12:53:00 -
[223]
Originally by: Jack Flack
Dark Shikari, I have read most of the posts during EIB auditing and afterwards. I have been following your posts and reactions to your posts as carefully as I can. Allow me to point out that you have a great responsibility in this.
You have openly challenged Currin, made people believe that his allegations against EIB are most likely groundless, his claims are originating from other motives and the clues he was offering were void. Your referrals led people to take CurrinÆs evidences very lightly (and yes, they were evidences!).
Maybe you tried to be unbiased in your statements, but you sorely failed to do so. Your remarks were not taken as ôunbiasedö by the public. Right before/during the auditing process, several people warned you directly that you are favoring EIB by creating a sense of trust in Cally. You were so convinced in your ôso to speakö unbias ôin your own eyesö that you didnÆt change your tone.
After CurrinÆs scam, many people were on the verge of withdrawing their support from EIB and break their investment with Cally. Some of them did not do so, because they trusted in your word and they lost fortunes! Even Cally openly admits this and he officially thanks you for your help in his public record! Yes, DS, you did help Cally and the public heard it from his own mouth!
You owe to the EVE community an official apology. But what do we see instead? The same old forum spamming with the usual ôcooler, wiser than thouö attitude and a poor caricature of self-defense. Sir Juri has been trying to point the fact out to you several times, canÆt you really see? Or is it too unbearable in your counscience and heavy on your pride. You have mumbled several words but they are nowhere near what can be called a heartfelt apology.
You have a great recognition and respect in the eyes of the public and you have misused it (deliberately or not). Great recognition brings great responsibility and now you are trying to evade that responsibility! There is only one thing which can restore it. A public apology in the right time and place is nothing but honor, my friend. That is what people have seen in you so far and would like to keep seeing in you from now on.
What arrogance.
Perhaps you should read my posts, because I did "apologize."
Guess what? It was a crapshoot. I guessed wrong. If you are going to blame me for your own stupid decision to invest even when I stated over and over that I didn't trust the EIB enough to invest in it regardless of what I said, you are a total fool.
--[23] Member--
Originally by: DB Preacher
The only time BoB's backs are to the wall is when Backdoor Bandit is in local.
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Ariu Devine
EVE Empowerment League Logistical Operations
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Posted - 2006.08.21 12:55:00 -
[224]
Originally by: Bermag
There have been so many smoke screens around this whole affair that I suspect this confession does not tell the whole truth.
Emfi, how long did you know that Dentara was Cally's main? Didn't you get suspicious that a shady character like that was the person behind EIB?
Do you EVEN read?!
All that was answered up above!
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PeeWee Pee
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Posted - 2006.08.21 13:14:00 -
[225]
Originally by: Jack Flack
Dark Shikari, I have read most of the posts during EIB auditing and afterwards. I have been following your posts and reactions to your posts as carefully as I can. Allow me to point out that you have a great responsibility in this.
You have openly challenged Currin, made people believe that his allegations against EIB are most likely groundless, his claims are originating from other motives and the clues he was offering were void. Your referrals led people to take CurrinÆs evidences very lightly (and yes, they were evidences!).
Maybe you tried to be unbiased in your statements, but you sorely failed to do so. Your remarks were not taken as ôunbiasedö by the public. Right before/during the auditing process, several people warned you directly that you are favoring EIB by creating a sense of trust in Cally. You were so convinced in your ôso to speakö unbias ôin your own eyesö that you didnÆt change your tone.
After CurrinÆs scam, many people were on the verge of withdrawing their support from EIB and break their investment with Cally. Some of them did not do so, because they trusted in your word and they lost fortunes! Even Cally openly admits this and he officially thanks you for your help in his public record! Yes, DS, you did help Cally and the public heard it from his own mouth!
You owe to the EVE community an official apology. But what do we see instead? The same old forum spamming with the usual ôcooler, wiser than thouö attitude and a poor caricature of self-defense. Sir Juri has been trying to point the fact out to you several times, canÆt you really see? Or is it too unbearable in your counscience and heavy on your pride. You have mumbled several words but they are nowhere near what can be called a heartfelt apology.
You have a great recognition and respect in the eyes of the public and you have misused it (deliberately or not). Great recognition brings great responsibility and now you are trying to evade that responsibility! There is only one thing which can restore it. A public apology in the right time and place is nothing but honor, my friend. That is what people have seen in you so far and would like to keep seeing in you from now on.
dude, me no trust anyones that make more than five posts on da whorum per day on a daily basis everyday. yet another dark shikari hippo king damage kontrol job.
let da whorus commence singing. 
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PeeWee Pee
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Posted - 2006.08.21 13:21:00 -
[226]
Originally by: Mathias Black
This is hilarious. It's not the scam itself that I find most hilarious, but the fact that all the people who fell for it and yelled incessantly at Currin are now posting "Well of course I knew all along it was probably a scam. You're just misinterpereting my 7 billion posts where I defended Cally." Well, if one good thing comes out of this, I hope it's another nail in the coffin of the idea that people who post all day on the boards are somehow more trustworthy than all us exclamation points. (Today I hope I can be called an alt of Dentara rather than Currin.)
dude you invested in a "bank" .. who soz real banks are nos scams
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Jack Flack
Caldari
Technomic Industries Inc.
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Posted - 2006.08.21 13:27:00 -
[227]
Dark Shikari, mumblings of "it was a crapshoot. I guessed wrong" in the midst of your typical contemptous "stupids" and "dumbs" spammings is not an apology. It seems like your spelling is as bad as your guessing. Repeat after me: "I a-p-o-l-o-g-i-s-e. I-w-a-s w-r-o-n-g." I do not remember seeing this line in your posts. But, heh, I am dumb anyway and I read half the posts!
So, you took a crapshoot and guessed wrong, eh? Is that it? I can only hope you are not taking that crapshooting beyond gaming.
And no, despite your constant manipulation in that direction, I did not buy it and avoid investing in EIB. But so what? Other people have! I can not come out with a grinning simile and type "0 loss" selfishly... like you did! How can I? It could have been me!
You would have taken a completely different stance with EIB. But you know what happened? You were scammed only to be reimbursed, so it never hurt and you never learnt!
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Sir Juri
Caldari
Caldari Provisions
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Posted - 2006.08.21 13:46:00 -
[228]
Originally by: Jack Flack
Dark Shikari, mumblings of "it was a crapshoot. I guessed wrong" in the midst of your typical contemptous "stupids" and "dumbs" spammings is not an apology. It seems like your spelling is as bad as your guessing. Repeat after me: "I a-p-o-l-o-g-i-s-e. I-w-a-s w-r-o-n-g." I do not remember seeing this line in your posts. But, heh, I am dumb anyway and I read half the posts!
So, you took a crapshoot and guessed wrong, eh? Is that it? I can only hope you are not taking that crapshooting beyond gaming.
And no, despite your constant manipulation in that direction, I did not buy it and avoid investing in EIB. But so what? Other people have! I can not come out with a grinning simile and type "0 loss" selfishly... like you did! How can I? It could have been me!
You would have taken a completely different stance with EIB. But you know what happened? You were scammed only to be reimbursed, so it never hurt and you never learnt!
So true, it was funny when Dark didnt post one thing when he got reimbursed last time  Guess all that talk about EVE is harsh only fly what you can loose and dont trust anyone all went away when he got "free" ISK from a GM.
And now he says he allways suspected it to be a scam and that he was objective all along, ... whatever
damn need to make a new sig... |
Death Mate
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Posted - 2006.08.21 14:12:00 -
[229]
The issue here is that Dark: you KNEW information that would have revealed it to be a scam and did NOT alert the public, attempting to hide behind non-disclosure clauses.
Give *US* a break:
I witness a break-in to a house.
The criminal sees me on the way out and asks me to promise not to tell anyone.
I agree not to.
I then do NOT call the Police and report the *CRIME*.
I do NOT alert any of the people in the area that this occured.
I pat myself on the back for being "a man of my word."
It's despicable. Sorry, but it is.
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EMFI Auditor
Minmatar
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Posted - 2006.08.21 14:15:00 -
[230]
Originally by: Bermag
Like I said above I don't think the whole truth is out.
I think you are right.
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"The only thing I am gonna argue with alts is wether I should argue with alts."
-- Naphtalia 2006 |
Lord WarATron
Amarr
Out Siders
Ascendant Frontier
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Posted - 2006.08.21 14:18:00 -
[231]
Originally by: Tharrn
Well, all I can say is that Istvaan will have to come up with something better now :P
Well, I got advised 2 months ago that this was somehow related to the Scamming University. I made a corp mail asking people to pull any funds they had invested. Just as well.
---
Slot 10 Akemons Modified 'Noble'Zet 5000 implant +8% Armour
FREE |
Ricdic
Caldari
Corporate Research And Production Pty Ltd
Daikoku Trade Syndicate
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Posted - 2006.08.21 15:15:00 -
[232]
Originally by: Jack Flack
Dark Shikari, mumblings of "it was a crapshoot. I guessed wrong" in the midst of your typical contemptous "stupids" and "dumbs" spammings is not an apology. It seems like your spelling is as bad as your guessing. Repeat after me: "I a-p-o-l-o-g-i-s-e. I-w-a-s w-r-o-n-g." I do not remember seeing this line in your posts. But, heh, I am dumb anyway and I read half the posts!
So, you took a crapshoot and guessed wrong, eh? Is that it? I can only hope you are not taking that crapshooting beyond gaming.
And no, despite your constant manipulation in that direction, I did not buy it and avoid investing in EIB. But so what? Other people have! I can not come out with a grinning simile and type "0 loss" selfishly... like you did! How can I? It could have been me!
You would have taken a completely different stance with EIB. But you know what happened? You were scammed only to be reimbursed, so it never hurt and you never learnt!
Would you jump off a cliff if Dark Shikari told you too??? Same thing applies with IPO's FFS. Just because he had beliefs, and just because he is a forum whorrior doesnt mean that you be carving his words into the 11th commandment. He has zero need to apologise, and personally, I will be dissapointed if he caves in and does so.
Insured Research and Production Services |
Ricdic
Caldari
Corporate Research And Production Pty Ltd
Daikoku Trade Syndicate
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Posted - 2006.08.21 15:18:00 -
[233]
Edited by: Ricdic on 21/08/2006 15:18:32
Originally by: Death Mate
Edited by: Death Mate on 21/08/2006 14:32:38
The issue here is that Dark: you KNEW information that would have revealed it to be a scam and did NOT alert the public, attempting to hide behind non-disclosure clauses.
Refresh my mind, which information did he KNOW??? As far as I remember reading, only EMFi knew anything, and his post makes a lot of sense, basically trying to stall Cally so people have enough time to withdraw as much of their funds of possible. I assume you have the two mixed up.
Insured Research and Production Services |
Death Mate
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Posted - 2006.08.21 16:59:00 -
[234]
Edited by: Death Mate on 21/08/2006 17:03:56
Originally by: Ricdic
Edited by: Ricdic on 21/08/2006 15:18:32
Refresh my mind, which information did he KNOW??? As far as I remember reading, only EMFi knew anything, and his post makes a lot of sense, basically trying to stall Cally so people have enough time to withdraw as much of their funds of possible. I assume you have the two mixed up.
Here you are. And by the way, I have nothing but respect for you Ricdic and your efforts to keep things afloat.
Originally by: Dark Shikari
Edited by: Dark Shikari on 20/08/2006 02:49:52
I don't think its fair to call "scam" unless the probability of a scam is 100%.
Until one calls "scam", it is important to look at every possibility.
Also, I had a GREAT deal of information about what was going on, however I could not tell anyone due to certain non-disclosure agreements with certain parties. If I suddenly called scam and said "OMG SEE LOOK AT THIS INFO ITS A SCAM" it would be violating those agreements.
So I continued beating down the alts and Currin, while continuing to avoid investing a cent in the EIB
Not much more to say as this says it all. Quite nauseating.
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Sir Juri
Caldari
Caldari Provisions
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Posted - 2006.08.21 17:22:00 -
[235]
who did you make that deal with dark? EMFI? a deal to protect a scammer? just curious you didnt explain that part
damn need to make a new sig... |
Ricdic
Caldari
Corporate Research And Production Pty Ltd
Daikoku Trade Syndicate
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Posted - 2006.08.21 17:35:00 -
[236]
Thanks Death, but professing to know more doesnt necessarily mean he does. He could have been just saying it to make his position look better in light of the scam. Just like a fair few people have.
While I didn't end up losing anything in the scam in a monetary value, I hate that I was used as a teller, and that I actually supported Cally, and vouched for him up to a point. I just wish he had found ie a known scammer to enter a deal with, and use that scammer's alt as a bank teller etc.
Anyway Could have, would have, should have, is all past tense and just one of those things we have to accept. We all make bad decisions from time to time. My only bad decision was trying to defend a person like him.
Insured Research and Production Services |
Pizi
Gallente
Federal Navy Academy
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Posted - 2006.08.21 18:06:00 -
[237]
Edited by: Pizi on 21/08/2006 18:06:34
love that quote
DS in post 236 :
Guess what? It was a crapshoot. I guessed wrong
-------
yet you yelled at everyone who said EIB was a scam
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Entrophos
Gallente
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Posted - 2006.08.21 18:17:00 -
[238]
Certain folks not directly involved in the scam have lost all credibility with me to the point where I don't even read anything they have to say. Garbage in, garbage out.
I wish there was a "block" function on these forums so I don't have to read their drivel again.
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Indomitus Rex
Amarr
Imperial Academy
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Posted - 2006.08.21 19:12:00 -
[239]
Man, I hate to say it. . .but I'm loving watching Dark getting raked over the coals. The whole time I was making logical arguments for why RSR and EIB were scams he was yelling about how arrogant and self-righteous I was and so on. Guess he was really just describing himself.
How does that saying go? Oh how the mighty have fallen?
Also, thanks Argenton for sending me 1,337 ISK. I appreciate it. Not as much as I appreciate the humiliation dumped on your head, but it works.
Deutschland. |
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Tirg
Forum Moderator
Interstellar Services Department
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Posted - 2006.08.21 19:40:00 -
[240]
Heavily scrubbed the thread again. I'm serious about stopping the personal attacks, the flaming, the trolling, and the profanity. Oh yeah, and some of the big sigs too!!
If you have any questions, feel free to email us at [email protected].
This is the last warning, before this thread gets locked.
Oh yeah,
Please.
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